PDA

View Full Version : Now that McD is gone and much is being insinuated do you think....


baja
01-15-2011, 07:55 PM
Josh McDaniels was much more involved in Spygate II than is being let on?

Poll.

footstepsfrom#27
01-15-2011, 07:57 PM
Josh McDaniels was much more involved than is being let on?

Poll.
I like the title signifying "the end".
.

Says it all huh? ;D

DivineBronco
01-15-2011, 07:59 PM
eh?

footstepsfrom#27
01-15-2011, 08:20 PM
Josh McDaniels was much more involved in Spygate II than is being let on?

Poll.
I think literally everything at Dove Valley involves much more than is being let on. It's a culture of secrecy that starts at the top with Bowlen. Was he involved more than we know? It's hard to imagine that anything happened on that team without him being directly involved. I think he checked to see how much soap went in the laundry with the jersies.

HAT
01-15-2011, 08:23 PM
I'd say no but it gave Bowlen/Ellis an easy out....Locker room, media, etc.

BroncoMatt
01-15-2011, 08:25 PM
I blame it on SOB

HAT
01-15-2011, 08:26 PM
I blame it on SOB

Always.

strafen
01-15-2011, 08:27 PM
McDaniels first hire was the video photographer guy from New England.
That's a huge indictment on McDaniels...

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 08:54 PM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS

frerottenextelway
01-15-2011, 08:58 PM
IMO, SpyGate was just icing on the cake.

His real downfall was trading away our talent and being a bad gameday coach. That, and being a bipolar douche.

McDman
01-15-2011, 09:02 PM
I think he absolutely knew. Like Schlereth said on the fan, the film guys work like 70-80 hours a week doing ridiculous amounts of detailed work, one of the guys would not randomly decide to go film a walk through without the consent of McD.

I've always stood up for McD but I have no doubt in my mind that he told the guy to do it.

baja
01-15-2011, 09:06 PM
IMO, SpyGate was just icing on the cake.

His real downfall was trading away our talent and being a bad gameday coach. That, and being a bipolar douche.


So I guess we can say McDaniels and Cutler could not co exist because they are too much alike.

That would explain why we as a group could never agree on who's fault it was.

Moral of the story?

frerottenextelway
01-15-2011, 09:09 PM
So I guess we can say McDaniels and Cutler could not co exist because they are too much alike.

That would explain why we as a group could never agree on who's fault it was.

Moral of the story?

The moral of the story is a lot of 20 year old star athletes are punks, you learn to live with that. Not so much the guy controlling the franchise in every way.

Steve Sewell
01-15-2011, 09:12 PM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS

Hilarious!Hilarious!Hilarious!

So the reason the Broncos beat Todd Failey and the Chumps at Mile High was because they were taping their signals?

It couldn't be that your team was a fraud or anything. Nahhhh...couldn't be.

spdirty
01-15-2011, 09:16 PM
stupid question.

baja
01-15-2011, 09:19 PM
stupid question.

Why

footstepsfrom#27
01-15-2011, 09:19 PM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS
I hate it when a Chiefs fan makes sense.

baja
01-15-2011, 09:22 PM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale".<b> At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans. </b>

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS

If that's the case isn't it strange that he is being considered for a few OC positions?

spdirty
01-15-2011, 09:23 PM
Why

there is so much circumstantial evidence that points to him being very involved in spygate that any belief that what was reported is what happened requires a person to really make an effort to be stupid.

footstepsfrom#27
01-15-2011, 09:24 PM
McDaniels first hire was the video photographer guy from New England.
That's a huge indictment on McDaniels...
I didn't know that...if that's true it's just bizarre. Why is a head coach even involved in hiring a guy to run the video department...unless of course he has some special reason for wanting this particular guy?

Bowlen...wake the **** up. How does the owner not sit up and take notice to ask a few questions when he finds out the coach is interviewing the video guy...especially in this situation. It boggles the mind how dumb that was.

spdirty
01-15-2011, 09:29 PM
I didn't know that...if that's true it's just bizarre. Why is a head coach even involved in hiring a guy to run the video department...unless of course he has some special reason for wanting this particular guy?

Bowlen...wake the **** up. How does the owner not sit up and take notice to ask a few questions when he finds out the coach is interviewing the video guy...especially in this situation. It boggles the mind how dumb that was.

I bet if Elway were executive vp of football operations immediately following the Shanahan firing McDip**** never would have been hired.

baja
01-15-2011, 09:29 PM
there is so much circumstantial evidence that points to him being very involved in spygate that any belief that what was reported is what happened requires a person to really make an effort to be stupid.

Than it should be very easy for you to make your case barrister.


So let's hear it.

spdirty
01-15-2011, 09:38 PM
Than it should be very easy for you to make your case barrister.


So let's hear it.

No, I don't think I will, except to say the only way you could believe their story is if you actively put your head in the sand and paid absolutely no attention to the way the organization was being run the last 2 years.

baja
01-15-2011, 09:39 PM
No, I don't think I will, except to say the only way you could believe their story is if you actively put your head in the sand and paid absolutely no attention to the way the organization was being run the last 2 years.

That's what I thought.

DivineBronco
01-15-2011, 09:41 PM
I do find it fascinating how some people here are just craaaaaaaaaaaazy over pats spygate and hate the Pats because of it but just ignore the fun cap math we did during our SB teams

spdirty
01-15-2011, 09:45 PM
I do find it fascinating how some people here are just craaaaaaaaaaaazy over pats spygate and hate the Pats because of it but just ignore the fun cap math we did during our SB teams

Why is that facsinating? The fun cap math actually helped us win Super Bowls. McSpygate did nothing more than make us that much more of a national joke.

baja
01-15-2011, 09:46 PM
I do find it fascinating how some people here are just craaaaaaaaaaaazy over pats spygate and hate the Pats because of it but just ignore the fun cap math we did during our SB teams

It's a matter of degree.

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 09:50 PM
Hilarious!Hilarious!Hilarious!

So the reason the Broncos beat Todd Failey and the Chumps at Mile High was because they were taping their signals?

It couldn't be that your team was a fraud or anything. Nahhhh...couldn't be.

Our team was what they were. No one I know claimed the Chiefs were a great team. To be a fraud, 1st you have to make unrealistic claims. In fact, most Chiefs fans would have been happy to go 8-8 his season. That would have been great improvement over last season. As it was, we did even better. We probably had the best draft in the 2010 season. And we actually did well enough to make a playoff appearance. But never did I think they were ready for prime time. I was glad to be headed in the right direction. What is fraudulent about that? Nothing.

No a fraud to could be described as a team that says they are fair and like to go toe to toe and compete. When in reality, they dont want competitiopn, but to steal wins though unfair means. A fraud can be desribed as a man who looks you in the eye and shakes your hand, then cheats like a coward. A fraud is Josh McDaniels.

But the Chiefs? No way. They are what they said they were. They played fair. They worked hard. They drafted well. They improved on the field. and made the playoffs in year 2 of a ground up rebuild from the GM on down. Just because they had an easy schedule dont mean they didnt play well in many of those games. You had an easy schedule, and coulnt win. In fact, Ill go one further. You had an easy schedule, cheated, and still couldn't beat anybody. I mean, who's the fraud here?

Besides, even if you knew what the word fraud meant and were right in your assessment, I can tell you that regardless what the Chiefs are, it doesn't mean McD didnt inhale.

The post I laid out explains it well enough. If you want to take KC out of it all together. You still know the Broncos were cheaters. And you know McD was aware of it and participating in it. He hid it, he's guilty. Simple as that.

After they had to stop cheating, did they win another game? Im not sure. Sure didnt beat KC again. Did you even score a TD? Yeah...........you weren't cheating in that 1st game. That's why you were able to do it again a few weeks later.

In the end, its good he's gone. He was a black eye on the Broncos organization. A black eye on the NFL. The fact he's may be interviewing for another job in tghe NFL just proves that cheating is rewarded in te NFL. It was rewarded when the Broncos did it in thier SB years. It was rewarded when NE did it. And now it being rewarded by giving him another opportunity to coach in the NFL.

What else is new?

I knew it wouldnt be popular me responding to this thread. But what I said is reasonable, and likely. You might call it trolling, but it's my opinion, and the opinion of many people. If you dont want a rival answering the question, dont post it. Because I laid it out how I see it.

I will be the 1st to admit I am wrong as soon as you can show me any proof or facts that would indicate otherwise.

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 09:53 PM
If that's the case isn't it strange that he is being considered for a few OC positions?

Cheating has always been rewarded in the NFL.

LRtagger
01-15-2011, 10:00 PM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS

OR it could have just been because we gained such a huge lead so early, our defense was able to coast in prevent mode the remainder of the game.

How many plays of game two were scripted? We must have known every offensive play you were going to run for the entire game. It's probably also safe to assume that since we put up 49 in the first game and only 6 in the second, your defense must have known all of our plays in game 2 before we ran them.

PS, no you didnt put up over 30 points. You outscored us 29 to 28 after the first quarter. Hardly evidence of any sort of tampering.

I find it unusual that we were able to score 21 points in the first quarter we played you, but only 34 in the final 7 quarters. Hailey and Romeo must have stolen our signals after that first quarter.

http://cmacivor.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/tin-foil-hat2.jpg?w=400&h=300

baja
01-15-2011, 10:00 PM
Our team was what they were. No one I know claimed the Chiefs were a great team. To be a fraud, 1st you have to make unrealistic claims. In fact, most Chiefs fans would have been happy to go 8-8 his season. That would have been great improvement over last season. As it was, we did even better. We probably had the best draft in the 2010 season. And we actually did well enough to make a playoff appearance. But never did I think they were ready for prime time. I was glad to be headed in the right direction. What is fraudulent about that? Nothing.

No a fraud to could be described as a team that says they are fair and like to go toe to toe and compete. When in reality, they dont want competitiopn, but to steal wins though unfair means. A fraud can be desribed as a man who looks you in the eye and shakes your hand, then cheats like a coward. A fraud is Josh McDaniels.

But the Chiefs? No way. They are what they said they were. They played fair. They worked hard. They drafted well. They improved on the field. and made the playoffs in year 2 of a ground up rebuild from the GM on down. Just because they had an easy schedule dont mean they didnt play well in many of those games. You had an easy schedule, and coulnt win. In fact, Ill go one further. You had an easy schedule, cheated, and still couldn't beat anybody. I mean, who's the fraud here?

Besides, even if you knew what the word fraud meant and were right in your assessment, I can tell you that regardless what the Chiefs are, it doesn't mean McD didnt inhale.

The post I laid out explains it well enough. If you want to take KC out of it all together. You still know the Broncos were cheaters. And you know McD was aware of it and participating in it. He hid it, he's guilty. Simple as that.

After they had to stop cheating, did they win another game? Im not sure. Sure didnt beat KC again. Did you even score a TD? Yeah...........you weren't cheating in that 1st game. That's why you were able to do it again a few weeks later.

In the end, its good he's gone. He was a black eye on the Broncos organization. A black eye on the NFL. The fact he's may be interviewing for another job in tghe NFL just proves that cheating is rewarded in te NFL. It was rewarded when the Broncos did it in thier SB years. It was rewarded when NE did it. And now it being rewarded by giving him another opportunity to coach in the NFL.

What else is new?

I knew it wouldnt be popular me responding to this thread. But what I said is reasonable, and likely. You might call it trolling, but it's my opinion, and the opinion of many people. If you dont want a rival answering the question, dont post it. Because I laid it out how I see it.

I will be the 1st to admit I am wrong as soon as you can show me any proof or facts that would indicate otherwise.

So are you saying the whole non hand shaking thing was really about Haley suspecting McD filmed Haley's scripted plays and his comment "There is talk around the league about you" is about this video taping thing?

HAT
01-15-2011, 10:06 PM
Cheating has always been rewarded in the NFL.

If you ain't cheatin', you ain't trying.

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 10:07 PM
So are you saying the whole non hand shaking thing was really about Haley suspecting McD filmed Haley's scripted plays and his comment "There is talk around the league about you" is about this video taping thing?

Are there other reasons that he might have reacted that way, that you are aware of?

In a word, yes.

I feel there is a strong possibility. I also feel like it was the warning McD needed to get his story together. In the end, it wasnt enough. In the end no one believed him. Not even his own employer.

colonelbeef
01-15-2011, 10:11 PM
IMO, SpyGate was just icing on the cake.

His real downfall was trading away our talent and being a bad gameday coach. That, and being a bipolar douche.

this

DivineBronco
01-15-2011, 10:14 PM
Why is that facsinating? The fun cap math actually helped us win Super Bowls. McSpygate did nothing more than make us that much more of a national joke.

I was speaking specifically about the pats rams first one it was a bit off topic I know but it has always been interesting to me that so many people here hate any and everything to do with NE and it was around even before McD. and it always seems to come from spygate and the cheating while completely ignoring any cheating done by almost every other team

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 10:15 PM
OR it could have just been because we gained such a huge lead so early, our defense was able to coast in prevent mode the remainder of the game.

How many plays of game two were scripted? We must have known every offensive play you were going to run for the entire game. It's probably also safe to assume that since we put up 49 in the first game and only 6 in the second, your defense must have known all of our plays in game 2 before we ran them.

PS, no you didnt put up over 30 points. You outscored us 29 to 28 after the first quarter. Hardly evidence of any sort of tampering.

I find it unusual that we were able to score 21 points in the first quarter we played you, but only 34 in the final 7 quarters. Hailey and Romeo must have stolen our signals after that first quarter.

http://cmacivor.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/tin-foil-hat2.jpg?w=400&h=300

I find it unusual that you were able to score 21 points in the 1st quarter as well. thats my point.

Defenses in prevent mode dont blitz. You had 35 points I think after the 1st 20 minutes. The point is, the Broncos scored more points in the 1st 15 or 20 plays of the game than the rest of the game combined. 2 diferent games. Watch it, you'll see what Im saying.

As for us cheating, well, we dont go out and hire known cheaters to work for us. And we havent been caught cheating. Like the Broncos. So Im not sure why your acting like it couldn't happen.

Yeah, in reality the Broncos were a great team in 2010. They were a powerhouse on offense and defense. Thier record reflects it. the 1st 20 minutes of that game was the best 20 minutes the Broncos played all season. But you act like it was expected. Well if it was expected, then you should have done it for 60 minutes.

baja
01-15-2011, 10:15 PM
Are there other reasons that he might have reacted that way, that you are aware of?

In a word, yes.

I feel there is a strong possibility. I also feel like it was the warning McD needed to get his story together. In the end, it wasnt enough. In the end no one believed him. Not even his own employer.

It does explain the dialogue.

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 10:19 PM
I was speaking specifically about the pats rams first one it was a bit off topic I know but it has always been interesting to me that so many people here hate any and everything to do with NE and it was around even before McD. and it always seems to come from spygate and the cheating while completely ignoring any cheating done by almost every other team

Completely ignore cheating by every other team?

You mean the Broncos. Thats who you listed in your previous post.

Steve Sewell
01-15-2011, 10:28 PM
Are there other reasons that he might have reacted that way, that you are aware of?



Perhaps because Haley is a crybaby who got his **** pushed in by a bad Broncos team? If anything, Haley has proven to be a complete little bitch when things don't go his way, have you not noticed this?

spdirty
01-15-2011, 10:28 PM
I was speaking specifically about the pats rams first one it was a bit off topic I know but it has always been interesting to me that so many people here hate any and everything to do with NE and it was around even before McD. and it always seems to come from spygate and the cheating while completely ignoring any cheating done by almost every other team

well when you say spygate I instantly think mcD.

Anyway, to address your original point, the fun cap math was simply bending the rules to put together the best team possible. Spygate was in effect stealing the opponents gameplan to give yourself a big advantage for the game, even bigger than the talent you have, I think that that sounds/looks/maybe even is a lot worse.

Example i really don't feel all that bad about the cheating of the salary cap, because I loved the players we had, and whatever it took to keep those players would be OK. But if it were to come out that we figured out the gameplan and used it to beat the Packers in SB 32, I would have felt kind of dirty about that win. It would seem to be much more tainted.

Just put in your mind that we stole Green Bays signals and used that to win the game. Doesn't that give you a kind of a sick feeling in the pit of your gut?

I mean both scenarios are cheating, I get that. But I think 1 form of cheating is worse than another. Our cheating is more along the lines of, well, Auburn this year, assuming they ponied up for Newton. Those fans don't feel bad about that. Why should we feel bad about ours?

Steve Sewell
01-15-2011, 10:31 PM
I find it unusual that you were able to score 21 points in the 1st quarter as well. thats my point.

Defenses in prevent mode dont blitz. You had 35 points I think after the 1st 20 minutes. The point is, the Broncos scored more points in the 1st 15 or 20 plays of the game than the rest of the game combined. 2 diferent games. Watch it, you'll see what Im saying.

As for us cheating, well, we dont go out and hire known cheaters to work for us. And we havent been caught cheating. Like the Broncos. So Im not sure why your acting like it couldn't happen.

Yeah, in reality the Broncos were a great team in 2010. They were a powerhouse on offense and defense. Thier record reflects it. the 1st 20 minutes of that game was the best 20 minutes the Broncos played all season. But you act like it was expected. Well if it was expected, then you should have done it for 60 minutes.

I'm going to go head over to the Raiders board and accuse them of cheating because of all those points they threw up in the 1st quarter at Mile High this year. It couldn't have been that they outplayed us. Something else must have been afoot.

Taco John
01-15-2011, 10:39 PM
I do find it fascinating how some people here are just craaaaaaaaaaaazy over pats spygate and hate the Pats because of it but just ignore the fun cap math we did during our SB teams


We didn't cheat the cap during our Superbowl teams. This is a misunderstanding of what happened. We never once violated the salary cap. What we did was defer salary because a significant amount of Broncos money was tied up in the new stadium deal. At the time that this happened, there was no rule saying that you couldn't defer salary. We counted all of that salary against the cap. But the NFL wanted to nip that loophole in the bud and send a message so they fined us despite there being no rule at the time preventing this practice.

I don't ignore this occurance. I applaud the fact that we did it. There was no rule at the time, and it was a loop hole that allowed us to spend up to the top of the cap and still pursue a stadium deal. Bowlen was absolutely correct for doing it and if we were back in time and knew the consequences, I'd encourage Bowlen to do it again. Not because it gave us a competitive advantage on those seasons - the NFL made a statement that it didn't, and they're correct - but because of what it meant for the stadium deal.

spdirty
01-15-2011, 10:48 PM
We didn't cheat the cap during our Superbowl teams. This is a misunderstanding of what happened. We never once violated the salary cap. What we did was defer salary because a significant amount of Broncos money was tied up in the new stadium deal. At the time that this happened, there was no rule saying that you couldn't defer salary. We counted all of that salary against the cap. But the NFL wanted to nip that loophole in the bud and send a message so they fined us despite there being no rule at the time preventing this practice.

I don't ignore this occurance. I applaud the fact that we did it. There was no rule at the time, and it was a loop hole that allowed us to spend up to the top of the cap and still pursue a stadium deal. Bowlen was absolutely correct for doing it and if we were back in time and knew the consequences, I'd encourage Bowlen to do it again. Not because it gave us a competitive advantage on those seasons - the NFL made a statement that it didn't, and they're correct - but because of what it meant for the stadium deal.

Thank you for clarifying.

HEAV
01-15-2011, 10:50 PM
McDanieals lost me with spygate 2.0

What pissed me off even more is even after cheating (seeing video of 49ers) we still lost!

But yes Spygate 2.0 was deeper than we thought and it was the final nail.

footstepsfrom#27
01-15-2011, 10:52 PM
Why is that facsinating? The fun cap math actually helped us win Super Bowls. McSpygate did nothing more than make us that much more of a national joke.
What?

schaaf
01-15-2011, 11:04 PM
Okay on a serious note...

Do any of you guys go into chiefs or chargers forums and talk ****?

Kinda new, but I've known about Bob for years and I just don't understand why if they are fans of another team they spend a vast majority of their time in a Broncos forum.

This makes absolutely no sense, CrazyHorse or Bob do you care to explain because I have no reason.

footstepsfrom#27
01-15-2011, 11:07 PM
IMO, SpyGate was just icing on the cake.

His real downfall was trading away our talent and being a bad gameday coach. That, and being a bipolar douche.
I think it was most of the cake. Bowlen obviously signed off on every personnel move McD made and shares equally in those decisions. He might be gutless, he might even be a drunk, he might be losing his marbles even, but I don't think Bowlen wanted any part of having his future legacy jeopardized by a sleezy scandal like that. Look how long he endured the many questionable decisions McD made in the draft and on the field, and compare it to how long it took him to can him once this video thing got out. It's obvious what drove McD out, and it was spygate II IMO.

strafen
01-15-2011, 11:21 PM
Than it should be very easy for you to make your case barrister.


So let's hear it.Just connect the dots and it will start to come into view for you...
Too much strong circumstancial evidences for you to want to skip over...

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 11:29 PM
Perhaps because Haley is a crybaby who got his **** pushed in by a bad Broncos team? If anything, Haley has proven to be a complete little b**** when things don't go his way, have you not noticed this?

Hmmm.....no.....that aint it.

crazyhorse
01-15-2011, 11:32 PM
Okay on a serious note...

Do any of you guys go into chiefs or chargers forums and talk ****?

Kinda new, but I've known about Bob for years and I just don't understand why if they are fans of another team they spend a vast majority of their time in a Broncos forum.

This makes absolutely no sense, CrazyHorse or Bob do you care to explain because I have no reason.

I like the people. That and Im very dynamic.

Besides, who's talking ****? Im dead serious.

The MVPlaya
01-15-2011, 11:35 PM
I do find it fascinating how some people here are just craaaaaaaaaaaazy over pats spygate and hate the Pats because of it but just ignore the fun cap math we did during our SB teams

yup. Broncos fans just aren't very smart, get used to it.

With that being said, what information points to him being guilty?

baja
01-15-2011, 11:38 PM
Just connect the dots and it will start to come into view for you...
Too much strong circumstancial evidences for you to want to skip over...

I'm thinking about it.

I'd like you to lay it out for me. What do your connected dots look like?

strafen
01-15-2011, 11:43 PM
I'm thinking about it.

I'd like you to lay it out for me. What do your connected dots look like?What kind of answer is that?
Does it really need to be explained to you, or you just want to play dumb?
Good grief!

baja
01-15-2011, 11:47 PM
What kind of answer is that?
Does it really need to be explained to you, or you just want to play dumb?
Good grief!

Yes build your case. You say it's so easy so lets hear it.

I mean it's obvious right?

strafen
01-15-2011, 11:53 PM
Yes build your case. You say it's so easy so lets hear it.

I mean it's obvious right?You bring memories of 3rd grade...

Have you followed the whole thing at all?
Have you heard of what spygate is all about?

Now, go ahead and do some thinking on your own...

Bronco Yoda
01-15-2011, 11:54 PM
McD's fingerprints were all over Spygate2. Made the choice really easy for Bowlen.

KipCorrington25
01-15-2011, 11:56 PM
He was a liar pretty much across the board so yeah I assume the worst with that beady eyed little cheater.

baja
01-16-2011, 12:03 AM
You bring memories of 3rd grade...

Have you followed the whole thing at all?
Have you heard of what spygate is all about?

Now, go ahead and do some thinking on your own...

I'm beginning to think you can't lay it out.

It's so obvious you should be able to explain it in a paragraph of two.

WolfpackGuy
01-16-2011, 12:05 AM
He definitely bumped someone out of the "10 worst coaching hires" list.

strafen
01-16-2011, 12:06 AM
I'm beginning to think you can't lay it out.

It's so obvious you should be able to explain it in a paragraph of two.

If you read this whole thread from the beginning you'll find lots of useable, easy to understand info...
I'll bet you get it...

schaaf
01-16-2011, 12:10 AM
I like the people. That and Im very dynamic.

Besides, who's talking ****? Im dead serious.

If I recall correctly Bob was the one who came in and talked about how the Chiefs were coming to town and were gonna run all over us. In all actuality it ended up the exact opposite.

baja
01-16-2011, 12:22 AM
If you read this whole thread from the beginning you'll find lots of useable, easy to understand info...
I'll bet you get it...

You can't do can you. You can't give the the bullet points of the overwhelming body of evidence.

You said one would have to be a special kind of stupid to not see the circumstantial (your word) evidence that shows McDaniels was guilty of cheating in the SpyGate II saga.

strafen
01-16-2011, 12:34 AM
You can't do can you. You can't give the the bullet points of the overwhelming body of evidence.

You said one would have to be a special kind of stupid to not see the circumstantial (your word) evidence that shows McDaniels was guilty of cheating in the SpyGate II saga.I know you're a McDaniels lover, but this is getting ridiculous.
The fact that McDaniels first hire was the videophotographer guy as reported by the media, isn't enough proof that something was up?
Why that guy specifically?
Was it because they've done this crap before, perhaps?
The guy got caught, Mcdaniels failed to report the incident. Why did he?
The guy wasn't working on his own.
He wasn't taping the 49ers walk-trhu for his own entertainment pleasure, was he?

baja
01-16-2011, 01:00 AM
I know you're a McDaniels lover, but this is getting ridiculous.
The fact that McDaniels first hire was the videophotographer guy as reported by the media, isn't enough proof that something was up?
Why that guy specifically?
Was it because they've done this crap before, perhaps?
The guy got caught, Mcdaniels failed to report the incident. Why did he?
The guy wasn't working on his own.
He wasn't taping the 49ers walk-trhu for his own entertainment pleasure, was he?

You got that "first hire" claim right here on this thread, that's not proof and even if it is true that is no inditement.

McD was cleared by the NFL of any first hand knowledge of the taping and the photographer confirmed he was alone.

I would say there are questions but certainly not the clear and obvious proof that he is guilty of cheating that you claim.

footstepsfrom#27
01-16-2011, 01:26 AM
You got that "first hire" claim right here on this thread, that's not proof and even if it is true that is no inditement.

McD was cleared by the NFL of any first hand knowledge of the taping and the photographer confirmed he was alone.

I would say there are questions but certainly not the clear and obvious proof that he is guilty of cheating that you claim.
The videographer had no fear of showing McD the tape did he?

McD didn't fire him or turn him in did he?

Use your head for something besides a hat rack there baja. :sunshine:

Blueflame
01-16-2011, 01:34 AM
Like it or not... "videotaping something that it's against NFL rules to be videotaping" is now linked to McDaniels' name with two separate franchises. We could argue semantics or "proof that he knew"... but ultimately it doesn't matter. The taint of scandal will stick to him either way. And given that Spygate I did happen while McDaniels was with the Pats... allowing himself to be put in a position where another... similar... scandal could even possibly occur... was... in my humble opinion... "not-the-wisest" career move.

Play2win
01-16-2011, 01:43 AM
Like it or not... "videotaping something that it's against NFL rules to be videotaping" is now linked to McDaniels' name with two separate franchises. We could argue semantics or "proof that he knew"... but ultimately it doesn't matter. The taint of scandal will stick to him either way. And given that Spygate I did happen while McDaniels was with the Pats... allowing himself to be put in a position where another... similar... scandal could even possibly occur... was... in my humble opinion... "not-the-wisest" career move.

And thank God it is McD that it is linked to and not the Broncos. Bowlen had to safe keep and secure the class and the integrity of the Denver Broncos. This might be a lot of what Elway was saying when he was talking about protecting the Denver Broncos.

Blueflame
01-16-2011, 02:30 AM
And thank God it is McD that it is linked to and not the Broncos. Bowlen had to safe keep and secure the class and the integrity of the Denver Broncos. This might be a lot of what Elway was saying when he was talking about protecting the Denver Broncos.

I agree... but think it would have been a wiser course of action for McDaniels if he had "distanced" himself as much as possible from Spygate I.... and had Spygate II not happened, then Spygate I would have been associated (in the minds of your average football-watcher) more with Belichick than with McDaniels. But that isn't so now that Spygate II did happen. "General perceptions" like that can be formed without the prerequisite of "overwhelming evidence that the perception is true" and McDaniels... IMHO... would have been better served if he had strictly avoided any and all whispers of the possibility of any kind of rule-breaking, especially rule-breaking involving videotape.

TomServo
01-16-2011, 02:36 AM
McD is one of the worst head coaches EVER. Notice, the only ONLY people that defend him in the entire league are posters on this board.
How many fans on other teams are clamoring for Mcd?

TomServo
01-16-2011, 02:56 AM
how many fans or teams are saying " McD YES" hes a genuis that McD?

Garcia Bronco
01-16-2011, 02:58 AM
Why is that facsinating? The fun cap math actually helped us win Super Bowls. McSpygate did nothing more than make us that much more of a national joke.

we did not break a written rule. We did not do anything that resulted in an advantage on the field. The pats were told to stop recording the signals and they kept doing it.

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 05:24 AM
If I recall correctly Bob was the one who came in and talked about how the Chiefs were coming to town and were gonna run all over us. In all actuality it ended up the exact opposite.

If you're not talking to me, why mention my name. To list bob and I in the same sentence shows you're not paying attention.

If you look at the date I became a member of this board, then look at when you became a member, what gives you the right to question why Im here? If I bother you so much you cant come to terms with my membership here, its probably time for you to find a new forum.

This is my board.

Otherwise....welcome aboard.

Miss I.
01-16-2011, 05:34 AM
If you're not talking to me, why mention my name. To list bob and I in the same sentence shows you're not paying attention.

If you look at the date I became a member of this board, then look at when you became a member, what gives you the right to question why Im here? If I bother you so much you cant come to terms with my membership here, its probably time for you to find a new forum.

This is my board.
Otherwise....welcome aboard.

Crazy, you know I love your car, but really I don't think this is your board. First, it's TJ's board, but more importantly it's a Broncos bulletin board and you are Chief's fan, therefore it is incongruent for it to be your board. Just saying. I enjoy smacktalking with ya and all, but that's just silly what you posted. ;D

Drek
01-16-2011, 06:11 AM
The notion that McDaniels was actually involved is absurd.

Why?

Because that carries the implication that a person who game planned wins against good Cowboys and Patriots teams this year, and would have done the same to Indy and the Jets this year if execution and his own in-game play calling didn't trip him up, was somehow incapable of beating the San Francisco 49ers at the height of their ineptitude this season despite watching their entire walk through.

The 49ers opened up strong, which is the very segment of the game McDaniels, had we watched the tape, would have been most informed on and prepared to shut down.

McDaniels did a horrible job as a head coach in the NFL, but to assume the 49ers of all teams could tell us what they were going to run and we still couldn't stop it is laughable.

But hey, witch hunt on. I bet McDaniels doesn't float either.

Broncos_OTM
01-16-2011, 07:01 AM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS
except you script your first fifteen in your week before the game. Denver got busted when we were in london and both teams had to practice on that field... hey keep grasping at straws ... what is your explination for the second game when the score was extremely close. im calling bs on your conspiracy crap

Broncos_OTM
01-16-2011, 07:03 AM
The notion that McDaniels was actually involved is absurd.

Why?

Because that carries the implication that a person who game planned wins against good Cowboys and Patriots teams this year, and would have done the same to Indy and the Jets this year if execution and his own in-game play calling didn't trip him up, was somehow incapable of beating the San Francisco 49ers at the height of their ineptitude this season despite watching their entire walk through.

The 49ers opened up strong, which is the very segment of the game McDaniels, had we watched the tape, would have been most informed on and prepared to shut down.

McDaniels did a horrible job as a head coach in the NFL, but to assume the 49ers of all teams could tell us what they were going to run and we still couldn't stop it is laughable.

But hey, witch hunt on. I bet McDaniels doesn't float either.did you forget that the 49s thought there was foul play and came out and ran differant plays then they showd in there walk through

AmericanBroncFan
01-16-2011, 07:44 AM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS

HAHAHA maybe it was because Denver started playing PREVENT with 2 min left in the 1st quarter. STUPID IDIOTIC quief fan!!!!!!!

LRtagger
01-16-2011, 08:03 AM
I find it unusual that you were able to score 21 points in the 1st quarter as well. thats my point.

Defenses in prevent mode dont blitz. You had 35 points I think after the 1st 20 minutes. The point is, the Broncos scored more points in the 1st 15 or 20 plays of the game than the rest of the game combined. 2 diferent games. Watch it, you'll see what Im saying.

As for us cheating, well, we dont go out and hire known cheaters to work for us. And we havent been caught cheating. Like the Broncos. So Im not sure why your acting like it couldn't happen.

Yeah, in reality the Broncos were a great team in 2010. They were a powerhouse on offense and defense. Thier record reflects it. the 1st 20 minutes of that game was the best 20 minutes the Broncos played all season. But you act like it was expected. Well if it was expected, then you should have done it for 60 minutes.

Yea, you're probably right. Now that you mention it, I can't think of any other time in the history of the league that the better team got handled by the worse team.

strafen
01-16-2011, 08:08 AM
The notion that McDaniels was actually involved is absurd.

Why?

Because that carries the implication that a person who game planned wins against good Cowboys and Patriots teams this year, and would have done the same to Indy and the Jets this year if execution and his own in-game play calling didn't trip him up, was somehow incapable of beating the San Francisco 49ers at the height of their ineptitude this season despite watching their entire walk through.

The 49ers opened up strong, which is the very segment of the game McDaniels, had we watched the tape, would have been most informed on and prepared to shut down.

McDaniels did a horrible job as a head coach in the NFL, but to assume the 49ers of all teams could tell us what they were going to run and we still couldn't stop it is laughable.

But hey, witch hunt on. I bet McDaniels doesn't float either.witch hunt?
Absurd?
Damn, these Mcdaniels fans are hardcore, aren't they?
Facts are facts.
Just hiring the guy alone in the first place was flat out wrong. Don't you get that?
On top of that, he gets caught. McDaniels doesn't turn him in. McDaniels KNEW it was wrong having been involved in Spygate I himself, and you don't want to acknowledge that?
Please!

PS: McDaniels screwed the Broncos up big time, but keep on loving the guy for that...

Dr. Broncenstein
01-16-2011, 08:14 AM
I'm just glad he's out the door in record time.

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 08:18 AM
Crazy, you know I love your car, but really I don't think this is your board. First, it's TJ's board, but more importantly it's a Broncos bulletin board and you are Chief's fan, therefore it is incongruent for it to be your board. Just saying. I enjoy smacktalking with ya and all, but that's just silly what you posted. ;D

Who's smack talking?

So you say I shouldnt be here as well? Im surprized by that.

I believe after 7000 posts and 7 years I can say this is my board. Nothing silly about that at all.

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 08:19 AM
HAHAHA maybe it was because Denver started playing PREVENT with 2 min left in the 1st quarter. STUPID IDIOTIC quief fan!!!!!!!

Denver was still blitzing in the 4th quarter. There goes your "prevent" theory.

baja
01-16-2011, 08:23 AM
Who's smack talking?

So you say I shouldnt be here as well? Im surprized by that.

I believe after 7000 posts and 7 years I can say this is my board. Nothing silly about that at all.

Of course you can people are just hung up on the fact you are a Chiefs fan on a Broncos board. Personally I'm glad you are here. But I say that about Bob too.

J/K Crazy

mwill07
01-16-2011, 08:23 AM
I can tell you that KC scripts its 1st 15 plays. When we played you the 1st time you guys were in the huddle. You knew what was coming before we called it. After about the 20 minutes until the end of the game you were out played and out scored by KC. Once the 1st 15 were over we suddenly were able to move the ball with great success, and put up over 30 points I think.

Do I have proof of it? No. But Haley sure thought something was up. Not long after that the secret came out and McDs answer was the equivalent of "I didn't inhale". At the time the only people thaht believed him were the NFL brass (because it was in thier best interest) and Bronco fans.

No one I knew or talked to about it thought for one second that McD didn't know what his guy was doing. In fact, after getting busted in NE, there is no way this wouldn't have been addressed. The videographer new before he left NE, whether he could approach McD with the video. After the fines and penalties in NE, no one in thier right mind would risk going to thier next head coach with such film without feeling pretty comfortable he wouldn't get reported. And he wasn't reported until the **** was hitting the fan.

McDs reply? ......I didn't inhale.

BS

This makes no sense. Denver's O dominated KC's D early on - I really doubt KC scripts their first 15 defensive plays.

Even if Denver had advanced knowledge of KC's O, the only turnover they had during that 35-0 stretch was at the end of KC's first long drive.

WolfpackGuy
01-16-2011, 08:25 AM
You guys have to admit.

Offensively, the early part of that Cheaps bloodbath was unbelievable.

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 08:28 AM
except you script your first fifteen in your week before the game. Denver got busted when we were in london and both teams had to practice on that field... hey keep grasping at straws ... what is your explination for the second game when the score was extremely close. im calling bs on your conspiracy crap

We run through the plays in warm ups. Before the game. Like all teams.

Listen, Im not saying you cant be right. Im just saying you could be wrong. And listing the things that would support it.

It might just be that Denver got extremely lucky that day.

baja
01-16-2011, 08:28 AM
But how did we film their walk threw when it was held in their practice facility located in Kansas City

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 08:34 AM
This makes no sense. Denver's O dominated KC's D early on - I really doubt KC scripts their first 15 defensive plays.

Even if Denver had advanced knowledge of KC's O, the only turnover they had during that 35-0 stretch was at the end of KC's first long drive.

I agree that we dont script defense. But if KCs offense is on the field longer that 35-0 stretch never happens. Not saying you woulnt have scored points. But it would have slowed the game down.

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 08:39 AM
But how did we film their walk threw when it was held in their practice facility located in Kansas City

KC does thier walk through before the game. So does Denver. When you guys come to Arrowhead you come out on the field and do walk throughs. After that, KC comes out and does thiers.

Its been that way ever since I can remember.

Premier-Ace55
01-16-2011, 08:45 AM
Denver was still blitzing in the 4th quarter. There goes your "prevent" theory.

Not playing prevent !? Champ was 8 yds off Bowe the entire game the 2nd game Bowe didn't even have a catch. Really!?

Miss I.
01-16-2011, 08:51 AM
Who's smack talking?

So you say I shouldnt be here as well? Im surprized by that.

I believe after 7000 posts and 7 years I can say this is my board. Nothing silly about that at all.

I did not mean you should not be here silly. I just think it's kind of funny for a chiefs fan to call a bronco board his board. seems like there should be a name for other team's fans on the board. I mean some of them are trolls, some are closeted Broncos fans, but there must be something for others who genuinely contribute to real football discussion, but aren't Broncos fans. Hmm...must have a think on this. ;D

Austin Bronco Fan
01-16-2011, 09:04 AM
I agree... but think it would have been a wiser course of action for McDaniels if he had "distanced" himself as much as possible from Spygate I.... and had Spygate II not happened, then Spygate I would have been associated (in the minds of your average football-watcher) more with Belichick than with McDaniels. But that isn't so now that Spygate II did happen. "General perceptions" like that can be formed without the prerequisite of "overwhelming evidence that the perception is true" and McDaniels... IMHO... would have been better served if he had strictly avoided any and all whispers of the possibility of any kind of rule-breaking, especially rule-breaking involving videotape.

Very well put! In my mind McD knew what was going on with his videographer. The NFL's "investigation" wasn't exactly thorough either. If McD truly didn't know, he didn't do himself any favors by the way he handled himself. And it makes me suspect a lot more.

And it looks like he'll move on and land an OC gig with another team. (Latest I heard was Rams). Come to think of it, he and Spags might deserve each other Ha!

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 09:07 AM
Not playing prevent !? Champ was 8 yds off Bowe the entire game the 2nd game Bowe didn't even have a catch. Really!?

Yes. You weren't playing prevent.

Football 101: If you are blitzing, that is not a prevent defense.

Just because you read it dont make it so. Watch the game. Im not making it up.

The second game was a different game. We really didn't target Bowe like we had to in the 1st game.

OABB
01-16-2011, 09:10 AM
Yes. You weren't playing prevent.

Football 101: If you are blitzing, that is not a prevent defense.

Just because you read it dont make it so. Watch the game. Im not making it up.

The second game was a different game. We really didn't target Bowe like we had to in the 1st game.

I wonder if it had anything to do with being shut down by Champ? Football 101?

The MVPlaya
01-16-2011, 09:12 AM
did you forget that the 49s thought there was foul play and came out and ran differant plays then they showd in there walk through

link.

crazyhorse
01-16-2011, 09:28 AM
I wonder if it had anything to do with being shut down by Champ? Football 101?

Maybe.

Ill admit I wasn't focused on Bowe.

The football 101 comment was due to the fact you guys were blitzing. It really had nothing to do with Bowe.

Blueflame
01-16-2011, 11:11 AM
The notion that McDaniels was actually involved is absurd.

Why?

Because that carries the implication that a person who game planned wins against good Cowboys and Patriots teams this year, and would have done the same to Indy and the Jets this year if execution and his own in-game play calling didn't trip him up, was somehow incapable of beating the San Francisco 49ers at the height of their ineptitude this season despite watching their entire walk through.

The 49ers opened up strong, which is the very segment of the game McDaniels, had we watched the tape, would have been most informed on and prepared to shut down.

McDaniels did a horrible job as a head coach in the NFL, but to assume the 49ers of all teams could tell us what they were going to run and we still couldn't stop it is laughable.

But hey, witch hunt on. I bet McDaniels doesn't float either.

Point is, Drek.... it doesn't matter if McDaniels knew (or was involved) or not. Regardless, his name is now associated with videotaping-in-violation-of-league-rules with two different franchises... and fair or not, he's viewed as "condoning cheating".

footstepsfrom#27
01-16-2011, 11:41 AM
The notion that McDaniels was actually involved is absurd.

Why?

Because that carries the implication that a person who game planned wins against good Cowboys and Patriots teams this year, and would have done the same to Indy and the Jets this year if execution and his own in-game play calling didn't trip him up, was somehow incapable of beating the San Francisco 49ers at the height of their ineptitude this season despite watching their entire walk through.
Oh please, are you serious? That's the weakest argument I've heard yet. McD didn't cheat because he didn't need to? Cripes, this dude would dig the fillings out of his grandma's teeth if he thought it would help him win a game by gaining some kind of advantage. You can't take anybody in the NFL for granted...nobody. What's absurd is thinking that the video guy, who obviously wasn't afraid to show the tape to McD...wasn't fired or turned in by McD and yet you think he had nothing to do with it.