firing catalyst?

[tsiguy96]

lot of tension in a team that doesnt win...

@VicLombardi
NEW INFORMATION: A Broncos player tells me there was a confrontation on the practice field today btwn Josh and Champ/DJ Williams.
Not exactly a mutiny. But the player described it as very heated and contentious. Something about wind sprints.

[Dr. Broncenstein]

http://item.slide.com/r/1/114/i/rqNkWnTl2D_ey48Qzj8PW-EXzeeAKDn8/

[Steve Prefontaine]

i thought i read on the OM that the OM was responsible for the firing.

[Rock Chalk]

ESPN reported that the organization has been looking into legal justification "for cause" to fire McDaniels due to the video taping incident.

the record didn't help but the video taping thing was the straw that broke the camel's back.

[WolfpackGuy]

Losing.

A lot.

[jsco70]

ESPN reported that the organization has been looking into legal justification "for cause" to fire McDaniels due to the video taping incident.

the record didn't help but the video taping thing was the straw that broke the camel's back.

As well it should have. I can't believe anyone would be so foolish as to even allow the possibility of a videotape scandal after the original spygate.

[HILife]

lot of tension in a team that doesnt win...

@VicLombardi
NEW INFORMATION: A Broncos player tells me there was a confrontation on the practice field today btwn Josh and Champ/DJ Williams.
Not exactly a mutiny. But the player described it as very heated and contentious. Something about wind sprints.

Happens all the time

[gunns]

ESPN reported that the organization has been looking into legal justification "for cause" to fire McDaniels due to the video taping incident.

the record didn't help but the video taping thing was the straw that broke the camel's back.

I agree. I really didn't think Bowlen would do it and have to pay 3 coaches, but when the video taping happened, $50,000 plus the no shows would do it. I figured they were looking at the "cause" but they are worried about Ellis's statements after it happened that he didn't think this was a situation that would have McD fired for cause. Must have found a legal out.

[lostknight]

It could be this, it could be refusing to play Tebow, it could be a players mutiny, it has something to do with loosing the coaching staff (anyone want to bet that the new interim head coach was the mole?). Attendences huge drop off also mattered.Or he simply might have had a "break even or else" mentality.

But when you get Champ and DJ revolting, that's never good.

[CEH]

I agree. I really didn't think Bowlen would do it and have to pay 3 coaches, but when the video taping happened, $50,000 plus the no shows would do it. I figured they were looking at the "cause" but they are worried about Ellis's statements after it happened that he didn't think this was a situation that would have McD fired for cause. Must have found a legal out.


Finally found out. In the STL game there were 15K no shows. Last time we had a turnout that low was in the Wade Phillips era


This became a simple bean counter exercise. Fan base + loss revenue + direction of team > salary plus I too believe McD will be terminated with cause

I heard from Vic and Gary who talked to a Broncos offical that the common perception in league circles this that this was not just a a rogue videographer

Could get ugly for Josh. Having a scarlett "C" is not good for the resume.

[supermanhr9]

WOW is all I can say. I suddenly don't feel the need to defend him anymore. I swear if we hire Calhoun or Kyle Shanahan, it will be hilarious how nuts this place will get.

[tsiguy96]

WOW is all I can say. I suddenly don't feel the need to defend him anymore. I swear if we hire Calhoun or Kyle Shanahan, it will be hilarious how nuts this place will get.

i think every mcdaniels fan here will not act like we DONT know why he got fired. theres a certain level of rationality that comes with being a levelheaded fan, its not a huge surprise either given the performance of the team and the trend of not being able to get along with others for hwatever reason.

either way, hope he does well in the future.

[Beantown Bronco]

ESPN reported that the organization has been looking into legal justification "for cause" to fire McDaniels due to the video taping incident.

the record didn't help but the video taping thing was the straw that broke the camel's back.

The incident was 6 weeks ago. Bowlen personally and the NFL institutionally have some insanely skilled, high priced lawyers at their disposal. It doesn't take them 6 weeks to conduct a simple investigation into a "for cause" firing. My firm is literally in the top 5 firms that specializes in employment law in the country and we'd have an answer in one day if they needed it.

The team missed its window for a "for cause" firing. If they wanted to go that route, they shouldn't have let him coach the last 4 games. They would've needed to act much, much quicker.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

lot of tension in a team that doesnt win...

@VicLombardi
NEW INFORMATION: A Broncos player tells me there was a confrontation on the practice field today btwn Josh and Champ/DJ Williams.
Not exactly a mutiny. But the player described it as very heated and contentious. Something about wind sprints.

Uh, there's no practice on Mondays.

[bowtown]

The incident was 6 weeks ago. Bowlen personally and the NFL institutionally have some insanely skilled, high priced lawyers at their disposal. It doesn't take them 6 weeks to conduct a simple investigation into a "for cause" firing. My firm is literally in the top 5 firms that specializes in employment law in the country and we'd have an answer in one day if they needed it.

The team missed its window for a "for cause" firing. If they wanted to go that route, they shouldn't have let him coach the last 4 games. They would've needed to act much, much quicker.

To be fair though, you guys probably don't do shots and beer funnels through your work meetings.

[bronco militia]

Uh, there's no practice on Mondays.

yeah...did this happen last week?

[chawknz]

Even 87.7 is talking about how something happened yesterday. Maybe they meant Sunday?

[BigPlayShay]

Uh, there's no practice on Mondays.

Tuesdays are the days off. Mondays are for film review and treatment.

[Ray Finkle]

Even 87.7 is talking about how something happened yesterday. Maybe they meant Sunday?

what else is local radio saying?

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Tuesdays are the days off. Mondays are for film review and treatment.

Right. But there's no practice on Mondays.

Certainly no wind sprints.

[BigPlayShay]

Right. But there's no practice on Mondays.

Certainly no wind sprints.

Unless it is part of "treatment"

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Unless it is part of "treatment"

Yeah, I suppose... can't imagine that wind sprints on the practice field would be considered treatment, but...

I suppose it's plausible that it actually happened. I'm just really tired of all the rumor and conjecture that's chased this team since Shanahan exited stage left. Leaks, rumors, "sources close to the situation" and the rest should all take a ****ing hike.

And the media is the biggest problem. The fact that Les Shapiro was claiming the Broncos were in ****ing negotiations with Calhoun, only to find out that Calhoun hasn't even talked to the Broncos, was absolute ridiculous.

[bendog]

McD mentioned "conditioning run" in his presser before the axe. I thought at the time WTF, week 13 and he's running these guys?

But look, and here's the beef with baja and popps, regardless of what one thinks of McD's personnel moves (and they are the laugh around the league like Millen's used to be) after spygateii at least one of McD's assts or admin personnel outed him to Bowlen and in effect the Leauge, and then McD threatended termination of anyone who went to the press, and at least two people immediately leaked to the press. People at Dove Valley wanted this guy gone. Bowlen in one of his votes of confidence said McD had control over coaches, and he could remove anyone he wanted. But in the wake of Nolan, there don't seem to be a lot of people who want to work for him who also have opportunities at the same level with better run outfits. Practically speaking, McD just ran out of time.

[misturanderson]

McD mentioned "conditioning run" in his presser before the axe. I thought at the time WTF, week 13 and he's running these guys?

But look, and here's the beef with baja and popps, regardless of what one thinks of McD's personnel moves (and they are the laugh around the league like Millen's used to be) after spygateii at least one of McD's assts or admin personnel outed him to Bowlen and in effect the Leauge, and then McD threatended termination of anyone who went to the press, and at least two people immediately leaked to the press. People at Dove Valley wanted this guy gone. Bowlen in one of his votes of confidence said McD had control over coaches, and he could remove anyone he wanted. But in the wake of Nolan, there don't seem to be a lot of people who want to work for him who also have opportunities at the same level with better run outfits. Practically speaking, McD just ran out of time.

That's a nice piece of pure conjecture that has only partial bearing in anything that was even reported, let alone proven. There hasn't even been an anonymous source to back up the bolded claim.

[bendog]

That's a nice piece of pure conjecture that has only partial bearing in anything that was even reported, let alone proven.

read a paper or watch tv.

[misturanderson]

read a paper or watch tv.

Sweet, so Mike Shanahan is the HC of the chiefs? Just because it was reported through an anonymous source, which not everything you wrote even had that much to back it up, doesn't make it fact.

[bendog]

So, you don't know that at least two people employed by Den, who are not players, outed McD over spygate to Bowlen/Ellis, and that at least two similar people outed McD to the media before the Lambs game? Or you don't know McD led a "conditioning run" on Mon? Or do you think an anaymous souce said shanny was HC of the chorfs.

Look go help "josh" pack.

[BigPlayShay]

Vic Lombardi works for Channel 4, which has a contract with the Denver Broncos to be the "Home of the Broncos". This gives them exclusivity in terms of tv shows with players, coaches, draft and training camp specials. Vic is not making this up, in fact he is probably often told by the team what he can and cannot say.

[Jetmeck]

The incident was 6 weeks ago. Bowlen personally and the NFL institutionally have some insanely skilled, high priced lawyers at their disposal. It doesn't take them 6 weeks to conduct a simple investigation into a "for cause" firing. My firm is literally in the top 5 firms that specializes in employment law in the country and we'd have an answer in one day if they needed it.

The team missed its window for a "for cause" firing. If they wanted to go that route, they shouldn't have let him coach the last 4 games. They would've needed to act much, much quicker.

They have not missed their window, ever heard of arbitration ????

[misturanderson]

So, you don't know that at least two people employed by Den, who are not players, outed McD over spygate to Bowlen/Ellis, and that at least two similar people outed McD to the media before the Lambs game? Or you don't know McD led a "conditioning run" on Mon? Or do you think an anaymous souce said shanny was HC of the chorfs.

Look go help "josh" pack.

No, there is absolutely nothing to evidence that "McD threatended termination of anyone who went to the press" yet you put it out there like it is fact. That was the main point I was referring to.

The "2 people" theory you have is also pure conjecture on your part with no significant evidence to back it up except that 2 reporters each had an anonymous source, no proof whatsoever that there were 2 people.

If you want to say that there was obviously some sort of undermining of McD, that's obvious, but taking the media's word as gospel (yes an anonymous source told Mortenson 2 years ago that Shanny would be KC's new head coach after he was fired here) and even reading into it and making up your own parts of the story is stupid and makes you look stupid.

[uplink]

It started over drinks and black jack in Bowlen's office as they do every Sunday after the game. Josh was making a killing, Champ and DJ were having off nights. Bowlen got pis**ed and said something to the effect of : 'why can't you win like this on the football field'. Then it spiraled into a heated argument as everyone was tipsy. Bowlen said 'I'm going to call Elway', Josh said 'why don't you do that old man'. Champ and DJ had to pull them apart.

[coachmastermind]

Running (sprints) and lifting are part of conditioning that the teams do on Mondays. They also watch game film and get graded on Monday. Tuesday is an offday for players, and the day the coaches use to set their game plan for the next game.

[Beantown Bronco]

They have not missed their window, ever heard of arbitration ????

Yes, and that's a different animal entirely. I doubt that it would even be applicable to an NFL coach. It would obviously depend on how the original contract was written up, but it still doesn't change the following facts that would kill their argument:

1. The COO said it wasn't a fireable offense.
2. The owner said he had no intention of making a change AFTER the Spygate II case was closed.
3. They let him continue coaching for over a month after it happened.
4. Both the team and league's investigations cleared him of wrongdoing.

[Dendave]

Finally found out. In the STL game there were 15K no shows. Last time we had a turnout that low was in the Wade Phillips era


This became a simple bean counter exercise. Fan base + loss revenue + direction of team > salary plus I too believe McD will be terminated with cause




Great point, they needed to do it now, if you know you are going to fire him at the end of the season, there is no better time then the present, 2 road games and then 2 home games. What if we win the next two on the road? coming back home after a win against Oakland might "fill" more seats, also Houston is in town and as we all know some want Kubiack as the next head coach, the fans there would shower him with love even as the opposing coach, again "fill" the seats watching the "next" coach in action. I actually think the time was perfect.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Vic Lombardi works for Channel 4, which has a contract with the Denver Broncos to be the "Home of the Broncos". This gives them exclusivity in terms of tv shows with players, coaches, draft and training camp specials. Vic is not making this up, in fact he is probably often told by the team what he can and cannot say.

Les Shapiro works for CBS4 as well, and he reported that the Broncos were in discussions with Calhoun yesterday. Only Calhoun hadn't talked to the Broncos.

So... making **** up DOES happen, especially when you can name "a player" or "a source close to the situation/team."

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Running (sprints) and lifting are part of conditioning that the teams do on Mondays. They also watch game film and get graded on Monday. Tuesday is an offday for players, and the day the coaches use to set their game plan for the next game.

Thanks. I did not know that.

[BigPlayShay]

Les Shapiro works for CBS4 as well, and he reported that the Broncos were in discussions with Calhoun yesterday. Only Calhoun hadn't talked to the Broncos.

So... making **** up DOES happen, especially when you can name "a player" or "a source close to the situation/team."

Les Shapiro use to work for cbs 4, like maybe 15 years ago. He now works for a radio station, and that's it.

[bowtown]

Yes, and that's a different animal entirely. I doubt that it would even be applicable to an NFL coach. It would obviously depend on how the original contract was written up, but it still doesn't change the following facts that would kill their argument:

1. The COO said it wasn't a fireable offense.
2. The owner said he had no intention of making a change AFTER the Spygate II case was closed.
3. They let him continue coaching for over a month after it happened.
4. Both the team and league's investigations cleared him of wrongdoing.

But how about arbitrary law term?

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Les Shapiro use to work for cbs 4, like maybe 15 years ago. He now works for a radio station, and that's it.

Didn't realize he'd left CBS4. Still, he's a radio personality and responsible for claims he makes on the air. And he works for a station with obvious ties to the team (with their player shows on almost every day of the week), so it's not like this is completely out there.

[bendog]

I'd like to know more about exactly what "conditioning" running they were doing. Guys like champ and dj don't get into it with a coach without some reason. I don't know if the two were connected, but there's conditioning and there's running to help work out soreness. By week 13 NFL players are in condition or injured and in the training room or IR.

[BigPlayShay]

Didn't realize he'd left CBS4. Still, he's a radio personality and responsible for claims he makes on the air. And he works for a station with obvious ties to the team (with their player shows on almost every day of the week), so it's not like this is completely out there.

Right, but he is on a radio station that doesn't have any contract with the the Denver Broncos, 850 KOA has that contract. He can be more free in making claims on the air then someone employed by the tv station that has a contract with the Broncos.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Right, but he is on a radio station that doesn't have any contract with the the Denver Broncos, 850 KOA has that contract. He can be more free in making claims on the air then someone employed by the tv station that has a contract with the Broncos.

Fair enough. he still has a responsibility to his listeners.

The longer we don't call these guys out on their bull****, the worse it will get.

[Beantown Bronco]

But how about arbitrary law term?

I'm not familiar with the NFL's arbitration rules. It is not what I was referring to when I was discussing the timing of the firing. Clearly, sports organizations are different animals from independent public and private US corporations.

[pdaddy]

Yes, and that's a different animal entirely. I doubt that it would even be applicable to an NFL coach. It would obviously depend on how the original contract was written up, but it still doesn't change the following facts that would kill their argument:

1. The COO said it wasn't a fireable offense.
2. The owner said he had no intention of making a change AFTER the Spygate II case was closed.
3. They let him continue coaching for over a month after it happened.
4. Both the team and league's investigations cleared him of wrongdoing.

Agreed. All bad facts. Only caveat would be if new evidence/facts came to light in the past week regarding McDaniels behavior. So far no indication of that, but who knows.