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lostknight
11-09-2010, 03:05 PM
I think the last two weeks of ritual beatings after the Oakland and London debacles have been good for the head coach. Last year at the break, Josh decided that he wanted more control of the defensive scheme and play calling. I hold out hope that this year, he looked at what has and has not worked for his team, and come to a more rational conclusion.

Josh mentioned that they were looking to get back to the 3-4 look as much as possible, but that it was going to have to be a mix. He also mentioned that it was time to abandon somethings that were not working, which I interpreted as confirmation that the team would go pass-heavy by design rather then being forced to do so. Not sure I agree with that, given the second half of last weeks game, but getting back up to the earlier offensive production would be key. I wouldn't be completely surprised to start seeing some five DL in the box packages - those have become in vogue this year in the NFL. These make a lot of sense with KC in particular - they have a suspect QB, a less-talented but still just as whiney wide receiver in Bowe, who has the same attitude and even worse drops then the previous number 15.

Other things that I wonder if will also be included in his "too much work, for not enough return" include DT, who still doesn't seem polished enough for the big game, and I even wonder about Tebow and the "Swamp Package"

Said that Orton is still sore, sounded like Vickerson and Ayers won't be returning immediately. Worried about Orton - he has a history of nagging injuries that have resulted in markedly decreased second half production. Orton jogged as fast as he could back on the field and waived off the trainers to make sure Tebow didn't get the reps. We invested a number one pick, Peyton Hillis and a sixth round pick to make sure we had someone more competant then Simms backing Orton up. Outside of injury, don't put Tebow on the field unless you are willing to commit to him as being a true quarterback.

Just hearing Ayers name makes me happy though.

The question in my mind is still can the defense improve with them being as a old - the oldest average age in the NFL - and prone to wearing down the second half. Cox and Vaughn are looking promising, but our depth at safety is looking questionable, and Goodman didn't look great.

I'm not in the crowd that wants McDaniels fired now. I really honestly think that McDaniels will be great. The only question is if he needs the humiliation of being fired to learn the things that he has lacked - humility, willingness to compromise and accept good advice. Let's hope the last two weeks woke him up. If he did, this team as a chance to be respectable again.

crush17
11-09-2010, 03:24 PM
Why the hell was he sniffing an sniffling so damn much?

rbackfactory80
11-09-2010, 03:25 PM
I am in the same camp. I don't want him fired but I have problems with many of his decisions. He seems to need to be better as a communicator and not always rule with such an iron fist. Respect is earned not inherited. Belichick gets away with that but it helps he has 3 superbowl rings.

I also notice he really likes to take time to get things to work. If they aren't working he doesn't easily give up but instead sticks with what he is doing. He really believes in his vision and that is a commendable quality. That quality though probably is the ultimate double edged sword especially in the NFL and right now it has clearly been working against him.

Quoydogs
11-09-2010, 04:57 PM
Why the hell was he sniffing an sniffling so damn much?

He has a case of the Whitney Huston's

NYBronco
11-09-2010, 05:00 PM
I don't like all the negatives in McD's football world these days but I think he will learn from them and make adjustments to become a much better coach. He is after all 10 and 14 since becoming the Broncos new young coach, not all that bad considering some of the players lost through attitude, trade and injury.

Quoydogs
11-09-2010, 05:03 PM
I don't like all the negatives in McD's football world these days but I think he will learn from them and make adjustments to become a much better coach. He is after all 10 and 14 since becoming the Broncos new young coach, not all that bad considering some of the players lost through attitude, trade and injury.

Really? You were trying to hit your sarcasm button but missed right ?

orinjkrush
11-09-2010, 06:35 PM
if he can learn that its a collective endeavor and not just his mastermind, he will be well on his growth trajectory.

broncosteven
11-09-2010, 07:32 PM
mCd needs to prove down the stretch that this team is tougher, smarter, and more physical even if they lose.

Losing without showing some improvement would make it hard for Bowlen to justify another year.

Dispite all the drama and failure of late the division title is not yet out of reach with a healthy OL maybe we can get more than 50 yards on the ground per game and take some pressure off the OL and Orton.

I think mCd still has a lot of upside, the problem is will he lose the team before he can hit his stride and start winning games?

Popps
11-09-2010, 07:36 PM
mCd needs to prove down the stretch that this team is tougher, smarter, and more physical even if they lose.


Agree. We can close to doing that in a loss against SF, but Moss' ****ing cliip on the punt return killed the "smart" part... and gore gashed us pretty good, so the physical part wasn't great, either.

Getting some of these guys back should help.

I'm in the same boat. I think we all have sort of mostly written off the playoffs, but I still think there are a lot of positives we can salvage from this season.

Hope we do.

Popps
11-09-2010, 07:38 PM
I think mCd still has a lot of upside, the problem is will he lose the team before he can hit his stride and start winning games?

Also agree with that.

Mangini is a good comparison.

Started off hot... then became public enemy #1, and now he's taken a crappy team looks to be doing a great job.

So, these things can take time.

I hope we can evaluate our coordinators and position coaches in the offseason, though. I know it's tough to do your job with so many players missing... but Martindale has to figure out how many guys are supposed to be on the football field, for example.

spdirty
11-09-2010, 07:51 PM
I'm in the same boat. I think we all have sort of mostly written off the playoffs, but I still think there are a lot of positives we can salvage from this season.

Hope we do.

I think the biggest positive we can get from the rest of this season is to treat the second half like mlb teams that are out of playoff contention treat September. Develop every youngster we have by giving them actual in game experience, bench the old farts, get a top 3 draft pick, assuming Goodell fixes the rookie salaries and creates a scale similar to the NBA, and we have someone who can actually evaluate talent and who can pick the players who will fill our needs run our drafts starting next April.

Broncoman13
11-09-2010, 07:53 PM
mCd needs to prove down the stretch that this team is tougher, smarter, and more physical even if they lose.

Losing without showing some improvement would make it hard for Bowlen to justify another year.

Dispite all the drama and failure of late the division title is not yet out of reach with a healthy OL maybe we can get more than 50 yards on the ground per game and take some pressure off the OL and Orton.

I think mCd still has a lot of upside, the problem is will he lose the team before he can hit his stride and start winning games?

If there is no CBA signed McD isn't going anywhere. There isn't anybody on the team's staff that could take over which means you fire McD, then you end up with a coach that can't coach his players until the CBA is signed. The only reason it worked for the Cowboys is b/c they had a coach in house that could take over, one that was being groomed as the heir apparent. We lost that when we got rid of Nolan. You gonna trust this tean to Wink Martindale or McCoy? If a CBA is worked out then I could see a buyout... but at this point you let McD make his bed now let the MFer sleep in it!

That One Guy
11-09-2010, 08:04 PM
I think the last two weeks of ritual beatings after the Oakland and London debacles have been good for the head coach. Last year at the break, Josh decided that he wanted more control of the defensive scheme and play calling. I hold out hope that this year, he looked at what has and has not worked for his team, and come to a more rational conclusion.

Josh mentioned that they were looking to get back to the 3-4 look as much as possible, but that it was going to have to be a mix. He also mentioned that it was time to abandon somethings that were not working, which I interpreted as confirmation that the team would go pass-heavy by design rather then being forced to do so. Not sure I agree with that, given the second half of last weeks game, but getting back up to the earlier offensive production would be key. I wouldn't be completely surprised to start seeing some five DL in the box packages - those have become in vogue this year in the NFL. These make a lot of sense with KC in particular - they have a suspect QB, a less-talented but still just as whiney wide receiver in Bowe, who has the same attitude and even worse drops then the previous number 15.

Other things that I wonder if will also be included in his "too much work, for not enough return" include DT, who still doesn't seem polished enough for the big game, and I even wonder about Tebow and the "Swamp Package"

Said that Orton is still sore, sounded like Vickerson and Ayers won't be returning immediately. Worried about Orton - he has a history of nagging injuries that have resulted in markedly decreased second half production. Orton jogged as fast as he could back on the field and waived off the trainers to make sure Tebow didn't get the reps. We invested a number one pick, Peyton Hillis and a sixth round pick to make sure we had someone more competant then Simms backing Orton up. Outside of injury, don't put Tebow on the field unless you are willing to commit to him as being a true quarterback.

Just hearing Ayers name makes me happy though.

The question in my mind is still can the defense improve with them being as a old - the oldest average age in the NFL - and prone to wearing down the second half. Cox and Vaughn are looking promising, but our depth at safety is looking questionable, and Goodman didn't look great.

I'm not in the crowd that wants McDaniels fired now. I really honestly think that McDaniels will be great. The only question is if he needs the humiliation of being fired to learn the things that he has lacked - humility, willingness to compromise and accept good advice. Let's hope the last two weeks woke him up. If he did, this team as a chance to be respectable again.

Did McD say the bolded or was it just commentary along with it?

theAPAOps5
11-09-2010, 08:36 PM
Why the hell was he sniffing an sniffling so damn much?

To avoid from coughing, people think its a sign of lying! That or he just did a line off of Xanders butt crack.

lostknight
11-09-2010, 09:11 PM
Also agree with that.

Mangini is a good comparison.

Started off hot... then became public enemy #1, and now he's taken a crappy team looks to be doing a great job.



You missed getting fired in there as well. That firing seems to be critical in the NFL head coaching.


I hope we can evaluate our coordinators and position coaches in the offseason, though. I know it's tough to do your job with so many players missing... but Martindale has to figure out how many guys are supposed to be on the football field, for example.

lostknight
11-09-2010, 09:12 PM
Did McD say the bolded or was it just commentary along with it?

The sentence before is my commentary. Should have made more of a demarcation.

broncosteven
11-10-2010, 08:29 AM
If there is no CBA signed McD isn't going anywhere. There isn't anybody on the team's staff that could take over which means you fire McD, then you end up with a coach that can't coach his players until the CBA is signed. The only reason it worked for the Cowboys is b/c they had a coach in house that could take over, one that was being groomed as the heir apparent. We lost that when we got rid of Nolan. You gonna trust this tean to Wink Martindale or McCoy? If a CBA is worked out then I could see a buyout... but at this point you let McD make his bed now let the MFer sleep in it!

I didn't mean to imply firing him this year. I think he plays out the remaining 8 games. If he totally loses his players then I think Bowlen has to look at replacing him for the next year, 2011 or 2012 if lockout.

supermanhr9
11-10-2010, 09:14 AM
This weekend will be interesting..... If we get embarrassed again by another divisional opponent, at home, this place is gonna go nuts.

I personally am gonna start calling for the destruction of Invesco Field, and start campaigning for an exact replica of Mile High be resurrected, except with more beer stands and urinals.

baja
11-10-2010, 09:21 AM
This weekend will be interesting..... If we get embarrassed again by another divisional opponent, at home, this place is gonna go nuts.

I personally am gonna start calling for the destruction of Invesco Field, and start campaigning for an exact replica of Mile High be resurrected, except with more beer stands and urinals.

I always thought a state of the art stadium should have two hoses attached to every seat, one hooked on the left armrest and the other on the right armrest. The white hose on the right delivers metered beer that you pay for by the ounce and it is ducted from your credit card. The black hose on the left has a funnel on the end to pee in. Course women would have to wear skirts. :D

Quoydogs
11-10-2010, 09:31 AM
I always thought a state of the art stadium should have two hoses attached to every seat, one hooked on the left armrest and the other on the right armrest. The white hose on the right delivers metered beer that you pay for by the ounce and it is ducted from your credit card. The black hose on the left has a funnel on the end to pee in. Course women would have to wear skirts. :D

"Course women would have to wear skirts. :D[/QUOTE]"


Not any more.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/attachment.php?attachmentid=27468&stc=1&d=1289410307

supermanhr9
11-10-2010, 10:50 AM
"Course women would have to wear skirts. :D"


Not any more.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/attachment.php?attachmentid=27468&stc=1&d=1289410307[/QUOTE]

That is disturbing,,,, yet I am contemplating on whether or not to purchase one for my wife?

supermanhr9
11-10-2010, 10:51 AM
I always thought a state of the art stadium should have two hoses attached to every seat, one hooked on the left armrest and the other on the right armrest. The white hose on the right delivers metered beer that you pay for by the ounce and it is ducted from your credit card. The black hose on the left has a funnel on the end to pee in. Course women would have to wear skirts. :D


Brilliant!!!!

Quoydogs
11-10-2010, 10:59 AM
"


Not any more.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/attachment.php?attachmentid=27468&stc=1&d=1289410307

That is disturbing,,,, yet I am contemplating on whether or not to purchase one for my wife?[/QUOTE]

I got one for my wife, no more boating back to the bathrooms when were fishing. She uses it camping also. Some of the best money I have ever spent.

Swedish Extrovert
11-10-2010, 11:53 AM
I always thought a state of the art stadium should have two hoses attached to every seat, one hooked on the left armrest and the other on the right armrest. The white hose on the right delivers metered beer that you pay for by the ounce and it is ducted from your credit card. The black hose on the left has a funnel on the end to pee in. Course women would have to wear skirts. :D

77,000 people. All it takes is one of them to mix up which hose is which and ruin it for everyone.

NYBronco
11-10-2010, 03:16 PM
Really? You were trying to hit your sarcasm button but missed right ?

To be clear, no sarcasm intended. Young coaches (and experienced) make plenty of mistakes. McD has more then earned his negative rep but has plenty of room to improve. The experienced ones tend to be stubborn, comfortable, stale and go against the owners wishes.

baja
11-10-2010, 03:20 PM
77,000 people. All it takes is one of them to mix up which hose is which and ruin it for everyone.

One is white and has a valve on it the other in black and has a funnel on it, if someone mixes that up they deserve to drink piss.

Hulamau
11-10-2010, 03:38 PM
77,000 people. All it takes is one of them to mix up which hose is which and ruin it for everyone.

Amen to that .. and at Ajax stadium the drunk voetbal crowd would be peeing and drinking from the wrong tubes all day!

baja
11-10-2010, 06:12 PM
Amen to that .. and at Ajax stadium the drunk voetbal crowd would be peeing and drinking from the wrong tubes all day!

By half time it wouldn't matter the alcohol content of both tubes would be the same. ;D

CEH
11-10-2010, 06:57 PM
Amen to that .. and at Ajax stadium the drunk voetbal crowd would be peeing and drinking from the wrong tubes all day!

How about this guy

http://fragg.me/video/man-washes-hands-urinal

broncosteven
11-10-2010, 07:33 PM
Near the end of the Presser where mCd talks about going back to 3-4, things they practiced in TC all summer long, seems like they may have panicked when the injuries started and got away from what they had worked on.

Very concerning that him and his staff wouldn't be patient and stay with what the players worked on in TC. Injuries are a big part of that but the players behind the starters worked on the same things and should be expected to be ready to go if a guy ahead of them goes down. Throwing a backup in to a package that they didn't work on much if all in TC is asking for disaster.

Beantown Bronco
11-11-2010, 06:22 AM
Very concerning that him and his staff wouldn't be patient and stay with what the players worked on in TC. Injuries are a big part of that but the players behind the starters worked on the same things and should be expected to be ready to go if a guy ahead of them goes down. Throwing a backup in to a package that they didn't work on much if all in TC is asking for disaster.

There's a big difference between losing one guy at a position and losing 2-3 guys at the same position. That was what prompted the change. A simple loss of one player here and there won't do it. They were losing LBs left and right and you can only cover up so many losses at the same position....I don't care how deep you are.