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View Full Version : Intresting read, I hope we are not in for another rebuild.


Quoydogs
10-27-2010, 12:46 PM
Found this on the other board. Thought some of you might want to read it.





Speaking of center stage, in the case of both Singletary and McDaniels, this week's trip to London for the NFL's annual international series game at Wembley Stadium is probably a welcomed chance to leave the continent for a while. The 49ers and Broncos have been disaster stories thus far this season, and Denver's 59-14 home-field loss to division rival Oakland on Sunday prompted McDaniels to apologize to team owner Pat Bowlen, the organization and its fans. The Raiders' point total was the highest in the 51-season history of the franchise.

McDaniels is now 4-13 as the Broncos head coach since starting last year with that mirage-like 6-0 getaway, and Bowlen was said to be livid with the team's embarrassment before its home crowd. Bowlen took a sizable risk in firing Mike Shanahan and hiring the 32-year-old McDaniels in early 2009, and the former Patriots offensive coordinator has done nothing lately to disprove the notion that he wasn't near ready for the job he was given.

McDaniels' fate was thought to be tied to the development of 2010 first-round pick Tim Tebow, but now it's an open question as to whether the coach will even be around in Denver when a verdict is rendered on Tebow's viability as an NFL quarterback. The most intriguing question remaining for the Broncos this season is whether McDaniels will try to save his job and the team's season by inserting Tebow into the lineup ahead of starter Kyle Orton, who has cooled off but hardly been the primary problem in Denver thus far. Unless Tebow can play defense, or single-handedly rescue the team's woeful running game, the Broncos looked doomed to a rock-bottom experience this season.
If the Broncos do turn things over to a new head coach in 2011 or sooner, he'll inherit a roster that McDaniels has vastly transformed in his two years on the job. From trading off Jay Cutler and Brandon Marshall, to acquiring the personnel to install a 3-4 defense, McDaniels has the team he chose to build. That means Denver's next head coach would likely face starting over from scratch, and another rebuilding of the roster.

But even the prospect of another extensive overhaul doesn't offer job security these days for an NFL head coach. As one NFL source put it to me: "That doesn't buy you time as a head coach any more. It's too much of a win-now league for that. Owners will still blow it up and start over if things get bad enough.''



http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...#ixzz13aG9trz5

tsiguy96
10-27-2010, 12:50 PM
who writes this ****? tebow is not the answer to any issue this team is having right now, why would putting in a QB whos likely going to struggle save mcdaniels job ahead of a guy whos playing pretty damn good?

Rohirrim
10-27-2010, 12:51 PM
The Raiders' point total was the highest in the 51-season history of the franchise.

Yeah, just another loss. :pity:



Well, if things don't get better at least we'll be in a position to go after Luck.

Quoydogs
10-27-2010, 12:51 PM
who writes this ****? tebow is not the answer to any issue this team is having right now, why would putting in a QB whos likely going to struggle save mcdaniels job ahead of a guy whos playing pretty damn good?

They said it there. They said unless he plays defense it won't help us.

Br0nc0Buster
10-27-2010, 12:57 PM
The Raiders' point total was the highest in the 51-season history of the franchise.

Yeah, just another loss. :pity:



Well, if things don't get better at least we'll be in a position to go after Luck.

why would we draft Luck?
I think you meant this puts in a better position to go after Dareus

tsiguy96
10-27-2010, 12:58 PM
They said it there. They said unless he plays defense it won't help us.

they also mentioned it as a possibility that mcdaniels would bench orton for tebow to save his job. that would almost assuredly cost him his job, we prolly wouldnt win 3 more games.

go_broncos
10-27-2010, 01:03 PM
Fire the Clown now..

Archer81
10-27-2010, 01:06 PM
Fire the Clown now..


You and grammar have never been on friendly terms, huh?

Nor you and logic, or you and common sense, or you and knowing what the f you are talking about.


:Broncos:

Rulon Velvet Jones
10-27-2010, 01:08 PM
Fire the Clown now..

Have you answered with your list of possible replacements yet?

strafen
10-27-2010, 01:10 PM
Mcdaniels is tearing this team apart.

Oh, wait!
He's already has...

Good luck to our next headcoach in trying to figure out how to build a winning team that is already made up of 2nd string and cast-off players from other teams, like the Lions!

strafen
10-27-2010, 01:13 PM
they also mentioned it as a possibility that mcdaniels would bench orton for tebow to save his job. that would almost assuredly cost him his job, we prolly wouldnt win 3 more games.We wouldn't win 3 games with Orton either.
Orton has only won 4 games dating back from last mid-season.
What makes you think he will win 3 more this year?

Put Tebow in there, and we will win!
Of course, mister McStubborn won't do that. And that's why the bastard deserves to be fired....

McDman
10-27-2010, 01:13 PM
What scares me if we fire Josh, that may severely stunt the growth of Tebow. People may hate McD but no one can deny his ability to maximize a QB's potential.

TheChamp24
10-27-2010, 01:15 PM
I'm telling you we will be in good position to draft a good 3-4 DE for this team. Dareus, Clayborn, Heyward IMO would all be good fits for the team.

Chris
10-27-2010, 01:17 PM
God I hate sports journalism. These are the people that couldn't write real news.

ColoradoDarin
10-27-2010, 01:18 PM
When did SI start hiring Denver Post commenters?

Popps
10-27-2010, 01:19 PM
who writes this ****? tebow is not the answer to any issue this team is having right now, why would putting in a QB whos likely going to struggle save mcdaniels job ahead of a guy whos playing pretty damn good?

Yea, pretty rough article.

McDaniels has a lot of work to do, and things need to be fixed. But when an article makes statements like, "his future is hinged on Tim Tebow," it's just laughable.

Man-Goblin
10-27-2010, 01:21 PM
So did I miss it or did this "Bowlen is livid!" info just hit today?

First of all, there's really only one source that info could come from, and I'm not so sure Pat is leaking stories right now.

Are they just assuming he's livid (which is probably a safe assumption if Pat does indeed still have his faculties) or is Pat really puting it out there that he's not happy?

strafen
10-27-2010, 01:22 PM
God I hate sports journalism. These are the people that couldn't write real news.Those freakin bastards are all liars when it comes to the Broncos.
How do they dare?!!!!!

bendog
10-27-2010, 01:24 PM
Those freakin bastards are all liars when it comes to the Broncos.
How do they dare?!!!!!

Exactly. Saying McDaniels has acquired the personnel to install the 3-4. Effing LIARS

broncofan2438
10-27-2010, 01:31 PM
who writes this ****? tebow is not the answer to any issue this team is having right now, why would putting in a QB whos likely going to struggle save mcdaniels job ahead of a guy whos playing pretty damn good?

I absolutely agree here. Even the people that I see every day, "Pull Orton", No you dumb **** people, Tebow is not the answer. How about get a ****ing defense?

Quoydogs
10-27-2010, 01:38 PM
I absolutely agree here. Even the people that I see every day, "Pull Orton", No you dumb **** people, Tebow is not the answer. How about get a ****ing defense?

I will agree with this to a point.

Orton does not seem to get it done in the red zone. He has been money between the the 20 but that does not win games.

He seems to treat the red zone the same as he dose when he is playing between the 20's and you can't do that. There is no reason that we can have that many trips to the red zone and not get TD's from it. Yes I know out running game is part of it but not all of it.

If we could find away to score half of the times when we were in the red zone our D could continue to be this ****ty and we would still win games.

Archer81
10-27-2010, 01:40 PM
I will agree with this to a point.

Orton does not seem to get it done in the red zone. He has been money between the the 20 but that does not win games.

He seems to treat the red zone the same as he dose when he is playing between the 20's and you can't do that. There is no reason that we can have that many trips to the red zone and not get TD's from it. Yes I know out running game is part of it but not all of it.

If we could find away to score half of the times when we were in the red zone out D could continue to be this ****ty and we would still win games.


Better play creativity could help here. Move the pocket. Even Orton is capable of rollouts. Stretch the defense and see what happens. It could also make room for the running game if defenses have to think that Orton could roll out on them.

Seems to be a mixture of things, but 30 some odd trips into the redzone through 7 games and have only a handful of TDs?

:Broncos:

Rabb
10-27-2010, 01:40 PM
I don't know if I blame the red zone woes on Orton, he isn't calling the plays

Archer81
10-27-2010, 01:45 PM
I don't know if I blame the red zone woes on Orton, he isn't calling the plays


I thought I heard that Orton is given a run or pass option on every play?



:Broncos:

rbackfactory80
10-27-2010, 01:50 PM
Actually I think we should start a thread to fire the next coach after McDaniels now. From the looks of it the D-line will suck, he will inherit an aging secondary, a 2 yard and a cloud of perfume running game, and a qb controversy from day 1. The deficit will be too large.

Rabb
10-27-2010, 01:54 PM
I thought I heard that Orton is given a run or pass option on every play?



:Broncos:

you may be right, I don't know really

Rohirrim
10-27-2010, 01:55 PM
why would we draft Luck?
I think you meant this puts in a better position to go after Dareus

Well, of course trading Tebow would be part of the deal. ;D

extralife
10-27-2010, 02:01 PM
they also mentioned it as a possibility that mcdaniels would bench orton for tebow to save his job. that would almost assuredly cost him his job, we prolly wouldnt win 3 more games.

the thinking is starting a rookie at QB gives you an excuse to lose

tsiguy96
10-27-2010, 02:02 PM
the thinking is starting a rookie at QB gives you an excuse to lose

when you have a very solid, well above average veteran on the bench, there is no thinking that excuses starting a rookie, barring injury.

Chris
10-27-2010, 02:07 PM
Those freakin bastards are all liars when it comes to the Broncos.
How do they dare?!!!!!

My issue is that 90% of articles are created through speculation. There is no point in reading any of these ****ake.

missingnumber7
10-27-2010, 02:13 PM
The retarded thing is that the solution will be to fire the DC, which was shanny's solution those last 3 years, and that is the last thing we need right now.

colonelbeef
10-27-2010, 03:36 PM
Yea, pretty rough article.

McDaniels has a lot of work to do, and things need to be fixed. But when an article makes statements like, "his future is hinged on Tim Tebow," it's just laughable.

His future is in fact hinged on Tebow.

If you consider games like the Raiders game to be nails in the coffin, Tebow being a flop is the equivalent of blowing the coffin up.

Is there not 1 thing you understand about McDaniels' predicament or the current state of the Broncos?

baja
10-27-2010, 03:40 PM
Actually I think we should start a thread to fire the next coach after McDaniels now. From the looks of it the D-line will suck, he will inherit an aging secondary, a 2 yard and a cloud of perfume running game, and a qb controversy from day 1. The deficit will be too large.

lol now thats funny

broncosteven
10-27-2010, 05:42 PM
These type of articles are piling up.

Mr. Elway
10-27-2010, 06:01 PM
I think the idea that "if McDaniels is fired, we have to rebuild again" is a fallacy. Why would we need to rebuild again? The young players we have are good, and the areas where we need work (both lines) need to be addressed regardless. I don't see our players as "system" players, and so there would be no need to clean house if we brought in a new coach next year.

Anyone think I'm way off base?

Bob's your Information Minister
10-27-2010, 06:09 PM
I'm telling you we will be in good position to draft a good 3-4 DE for this team. Dareus, Clayborn, Heyward IMO would all be good fits for the team.

With your first pick? ROFL!

gunns
10-27-2010, 06:32 PM
Yea, pretty rough article.

McDaniels has a lot of work to do, and things need to be fixed. But when an article makes statements like, "his future is hinged on Tim Tebow," it's just laughable.

Agreed. His future is hinged on the defense, just like Shanahan's was. Somebody get a friggin clue about the defense! Please. As far as QB's, except for Bradford who the hell was there to take a chance on? Except I doubt giving up the picks and making him a first rounder was necessary. But that's just my opinion. Yeah, yeah I know someone wanted him. Please, in the first round?

WolfpackGuy
10-27-2010, 06:41 PM
acquiring the personnel to install a 3-4 defense


Not meant for the original poster...

What personnel?

Jay3
10-27-2010, 07:00 PM
Actually I think we should start a thread to fire the next coach after McDaniels now. From the looks of it the D-line will suck, he will inherit an aging secondary, a 2 yard and a cloud of perfume running game, and a qb controversy from day 1. The deficit will be too large.

I think the next guy is going to look like a genius just for going "Well . . . . I guess I'll put this guy Tebow in . . . "

Instant rebuild!

TDmvp
10-27-2010, 07:08 PM
What scares me if we fire Josh, that may severely stunt the growth of Tebow. People may hate McD but no one can deny his ability to maximize a QB's potential.



I think it is easy to deny his ability to maximize Qb's ...

He didn't have di@k to do with Tom Brady being good ...

In 2001 he was a friggen New England Patriots Personnel Assistant.

In 2002 through 2003 HE WAS A Defensive Coaching Assistant...

and didn't become QB's coach till 2004 , and a Offensive Coordinator in 2006...

Brady has Super Bowls before Josh has crap to do with it...


And Sorry but saying OOoooo look what he did with Cassel is stupid , many average quarterbacks would have looked like Cassel did with a team that almost ran the table the year before...



To say Josh is some kinda Qb guru is just Bs after watching Shanny take Jake Plummer who most people thought BLEW and turn him into a guy who flirted with the longest streak of passes without throwing a pick ....



I know shanny aint walking thru that door , AND I DON'T WANT JOSH FIRED AT THIS POINT ...


But saying he turns people who might not be INTO great QBs is totally BS ...

ColoradoDarin
10-27-2010, 07:29 PM
I think it is easy to deny his ability to maximize Qb's ...

He didn't have di@k to do with Tom Brady being good ...

In 2001 he was a friggen New England Patriots Personnel Assistant.

In 2002 through 2003 HE WAS A Defensive Coaching Assistant...

and didn't become QB's coach till 2004 , and a Offensive Coordinator in 2006...

Brady has Super Bowls before Josh has crap to do with it...


And Sorry but saying OOoooo look what he did with Cassel is stupid , many average quarterbacks would have looked like Cassel did with a team that almost ran the table the year before...



To say Josh is some kinda Qb guru is just Bs after watching Shanny take Jake Plummer who most people thought BLEW and turn him into a guy who flirted with the longest streak of passes without throwing a pick ....



I know shanny aint walking thru that door , AND I DON'T WANT JOSH FIRED AT THIS POINT ...


But saying he turns people who might not be INTO great QBs is totally BS ...

Just to take the other side :)

The argument for McDaniels - He took Brady from game manager to elite QB. He took Cassell from nothing to starter. He has so far taken Orton from game manager to top 10.

Jake Plummer did take Arizona to their first playoff win in eleventy-billion years prior to Shanahan.

Jay3
10-27-2010, 07:31 PM
He has a "QB Guru" resume (sort of) even apart from his results at NE. His dad is some sort of QB guru legend in Ohio. Does instruction and consulting.

I think it's why he hired Ben. To smear that family QB- goo on Tebow.

TDmvp
10-27-2010, 07:31 PM
Just to take the other side :)





Stop that Darin LOL ...


Edit , and now Hell must have froze over because Baja positive repped my previous post heheh

ColoradoDarin
10-27-2010, 07:41 PM
Stop that Darin LOL ...


Edit , and now Hell must have froze over because Baja positive repped my previous post heheh

Ha! It's just part of my charm Hilarious!

strafen
10-27-2010, 07:42 PM
He has a "QB Guru" resume (sort of) even apart from his results at NE. His dad is some sort of QB guru legend in Ohio. Does instruction and consulting.

I think it's why he hired Ben. To smear that family QB- goo on Tebow.If he (McDaniels) would've appreciated the value of a top NFL DC like Mike Nolan is, things could be a little better.

Nolan was bashed out here unfairly. Under Mike Nolan last year, we've had no more in talent on defense than what we have this year. He made the best of what he got available to work with; but at the end, lack of talent and our sputtering offense towards the end of the season, did us in...

Bob's your Information Minister
10-27-2010, 07:44 PM
When you have no defensive or offensive line and no quarterback...welcome to *another* rebuild.

mhgaffney
10-27-2010, 08:02 PM
Great QBs make plays in tough situations.

Does Orton deliver in the clutch?

You get three choices.

strafen
10-27-2010, 08:11 PM
Great QBs make plays in tough situations.

Does Orton deliver in the clutch?

You get three choices.That in a nutshell, is what I've been saying of Orton...

driver
10-27-2010, 08:13 PM
I absolutely agree here. Even the people that I see every day, "Pull Orton", No you dumb **** people, Tebow is not the answer. How about get a ****ing defense?



There you go!! :sunshine:

driver
10-27-2010, 08:17 PM
I don't know if I blame the red zone woes on Orton, he isn't calling the plays


FACT!:sunshine:

gtown
10-27-2010, 09:37 PM
How about we "rebuild" by just getting back our injured players? How many teams that have lost the equivalent of Dumervil, Ayers, Dawkins, Goodman, Moreno, Harris, McBath, et al for any stretch of a season be serious contenders as if nothing had happened? How many teams starting two rookies on the OL, and having the other three starters on the OL come back from pretty serious injuries, have lit up the league offensively?

McD has made his share of errors in my mind personnel-wise (Hillis for Queen, Fonz for Gronkowski) and scheme-wise (getting rid of ZBS), but the guy can coach up the most important position in the league (QB) and has an offense that is cutting edge in the pass happy NFL. His other problems (penalties and personnel package confusion) can be remedied in time IMO.

Bowlen may be "livid" (what owner wouldn't be) but he has lived through high profile losses (see the Elway Superbowls prior to '97) and has shown a penchant for patience. Articles like this are pure BS.

Popps
10-27-2010, 09:39 PM
Great QBs make plays in tough situations.

Does Orton deliver in the clutch?

You get three choices.

He did against the Jets. Gave us the lead with very little time left. Our defense had to make ONE stop. A 54 yard PI penalty put an end to that.

Orton gave us the lead in the Raiders game last year at home. Our defense had to make ONE stop. Couldn't do it.

I believe we had the lead late against Indy, as well... no? I'm probably forgetting other examples.

Point being, tough situations aren't just the ones in closing seconds of games. It takes a team effort. It's not Kyle's fault if we don't have the ball last every game. The guy has given us many late game leads that we couldn't hold onto.

baja
10-27-2010, 09:40 PM
How about we "rebuild" by just getting back our injured players? How many teams that have lost the equivalent of Dumervil, Ayers, Dawkins, Goodman, Moreno, Harris, McBath, et al for any stretch of a season be serious contenders as if nothing had happened? How many teams starting two rookies on the OL, and having the other three starters on the OL come back from pretty serious injuries, have lit up the league offensively?

McD has made his share of errors in my mind personnel-wise (Hillis for Queen, Fonz for Gronkowski) and scheme-wise (getting rid of ZBS), but the guy can coach up the most important position in the league (QB) and has an offense that is cutting edge in the pass happy NFL. His other problems (penalties and personnel package confusion) can be remedied in time IMO.

Bowlen may be "livid" (what owner wouldn't be) but he has lived through high profile losses (see the Elway Superbowls prior to '97) and has shown a penchant for patience. Articles like this are pure BS.

Mostly agree. I think the Quinn trade will be a huge win for us.

strafen
10-27-2010, 10:22 PM
Mostly agree. I think the Quinn trade will be a huge win for us.Care to elaborate a little there?

baja
10-27-2010, 10:52 PM
Care to elaborate a little there?


I'm talking Quinn the QB of course. McD is to QBs what Shanny or more correctly Turner is to running backs. Quinn will be coached up into what Orton is today or likely better because he is more gifted and has greater up side. I envision the Broncos becoming a QB factory of sorts, kind of wishful thinking.


You can start calling me names now...

ZONA
10-27-2010, 10:52 PM
So did I miss it or did this "Bowlen is livid!" info just hit today?

First of all, there's really only one source that info could come from, and I'm not so sure Pat is leaking stories right now.

Are they just assuming he's livid (which is probably a safe assumption if Pat does indeed still have his faculties) or is Pat really puting it out there that he's not happy?

I don't think anybody who cheers for Orange and Blue was anything but livid over the last game, that includes the owner. Doesn't have to be said, anybody who doesn't have an ant sized brain knows he wasn't too happy about getting anihilated by the Raider Aholes.

colonelbeef
10-28-2010, 09:07 AM
I'm talking Quinn the QB of course. McD is to QBs what Shanny or more correctly Turner is to running backs. Quinn will be coached up into what Orton is today or likely better because he is more gifted and has greater up side. I envision the Broncos becoming a QB factory of sorts, kind of wishful thinking.


You can start calling me names now...

Do you believe in the Easter Bunny too?

baja
10-28-2010, 01:37 PM
Do you believe in the Easter Bunny too?

What are you implying?