PDA

View Full Version : Analysis: Broncos not what McDaniels preaches


Kaylore
10-25-2010, 03:00 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16429356

Broncos coach Josh McDaniels repeatedly has said he wants a tough, smart, physical football team.

The numbers say the Broncos are not that team.

The Broncos are last in the league running the football, sitting at only 68.4 yards per game. That's an eye-opening 10.6 yards per game behind the Detroit Lions, who are 31st.

That's a team unable to move the line of scrimmage and unable to keep itself in games long enough to run the ball from a down-and-distance position of strength.

The Broncos are also 30th in the league in run defense, allowing 156.3 yards per game. Toss in the fact the Colts rushed for only 40 yards against the Broncos last month and that average is even more alarming.

In the Broncos' past 13 losses, they have surrendered at least 173 yards rushing seven times and opponents have topped 200 yards five times.

With either of those problems a team would have difficulty winning consistently over the long haul in the NFL without a Hall-of-Fame worthy quarterback. A team can't consistently surrender field position, time on the game clock and take that much punishment, yet still expect success.


Read more: Analysis: Broncos not what McDaniels preaches - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16429356#ixzz13PUu5ik2

Jeff sums up my views perfectly. I would take it a step further and begin to question if those attributes, "tough, smart, physical", are even the most critical thing you need to a build a team around. And does having them necessarily even make you a better team, or at least better enough to warrant building an entire team around them? Maybe and maybe not, but even if they are, McDaniels has been unable to assemble that here.

oubronco
10-25-2010, 03:07 PM
The front seven suck plain and simple we need to invest heavily in some young talented defensive players until then it doesn't matter what the secondary looks like they will fail like they have. I will say that he has beafed up the lines but we need talented beafed up players with nasty mean streaks on both sides of the ball

Kaylore
10-25-2010, 03:08 PM
The O-line coaching is terrible.

orinjkrush
10-25-2010, 03:09 PM
how 'bout he understands conceptually what tough, smart, physical means, but cannot realize it when it smacks him in the butt. HILLIS???? (sorry, had to go there) OOPS...smart....maybe

oubronco
10-25-2010, 03:09 PM
The O-line coaching is terrible.

Don't forget about the D-line coaching we need help in a big way

Rulon Velvet Jones
10-25-2010, 03:13 PM
I think this team needs to focus on a single identity and milk the crap out of that before moving on. Their identity is all over the place. I want people to look at Denver and say "they can play some defense" or "they're the best passing team in the league", "they run the ball better than anyone right now", etc. and use that identity as a starting point moving forward. As it stands, they're largely mediocre at a number of facets of the game and don't strike fear into their opponents. How do teams go from bad to good? They focus on one thing, become the best at it and build from there.

Mile High Shack
10-25-2010, 03:19 PM
...How to teams go from bad to good? They focus on one thing, become the best at it and build from there.

You nailed it with that quote right there.

broncosteven
10-25-2010, 03:21 PM
I would rather have a team of athletes who can Execute a base set of plays and pound it out and allow them to use their athletic prowess rather than making them think about who is lined up where, how far back, is his foot turned out or in, is an extra blitzer coming, what is the hot call, where is my baby mama in the stands, all before the snap.

Build on execution then start adding stuff. Making rookies or 1st year guys define their blocks or run based on where the OLB is standing pre and post snap is tough to do.

BTW you can be physical running the ZBS just as well as the power run game. If he wanted to be physical he would have beefed up the OL and DL rather than waste picks on QB's and CB's high.

fontaine
10-25-2010, 03:23 PM
I'll add in this smarter football team is averaging more than 8 penalties per game.

The O-line coaching is terrible.

Dennison is in Houston and in one offseason has transformed one of the worst running games in the league to one of the best.

But what the hell does he know compared to the wealth of experience Josh has in the run game.

Running Game/OL/Defense gone.

Apart from the passing game, McD has pretty much dismantled the rest of the team.

orinjkrush
10-25-2010, 03:23 PM
if you live by the "scheme", you die by the "scheme". throw the scheme out and pound the muther******ng ball. sacrifice a game or two. make them prove themselves.

fontaine
10-25-2010, 03:26 PM
how 'bout he understands conceptually what tough, smart, physical means, but cannot realize it when it smacks him in the butt. HILLIS???? (sorry, had to go there) OOPS...smart....maybe

Apparently, trading a 4th for Maroney qualifies what Josh means by tough, smart and physical football players.

Popps
10-25-2010, 03:26 PM
Tough and smart? Absolutely. Football-smart, of course.

Again, my second reference to Ray Lewis today.... he's a POS, but they don't make football players any better than he is. He's tough, and football-smart. He's a respected leader on that defense.

We need more players like Lewis, minus the part about killing dudes.

Goobzilla
10-25-2010, 03:27 PM
The O-line coaching is terrible.

definitely something up this year. Someone posted in another thread Clady, Harris, and Kuper have all regressed this year. Clady was all-world last year and he's barely passable this season. What gives?

extralife
10-25-2010, 03:35 PM
Clady was all-world last year and he's barely passable this season. What gives?

Well, his knee, for one.

Kaylore
10-25-2010, 03:36 PM
Tough and smart? Absolutely. Football-smart, of course.

Again, my second reference to Ray Lewis today.... he's a POS, but they don't make football players any better than he is. He's tough, and football-smart. He's a respected leader on that defense.

We need more players like Lewis, minus the part about killing dudes.

Gotta love any recommendation that ends with "minus the part about killing dudes." ROFL!

definitely something up this year. Someone posted in another thread Clady, Harris, and Kuper have all regressed this year. Clady was all-world last year and he's barely passable this season. What gives?

Clady's injury set him back, however that doesn't change how much the entire line has regressed. In fact they're getting worse every game and we aren't necessarily facing better opponents.

CEH
10-25-2010, 03:39 PM
The O-line coaching is terrible.

Alfred says someone needs to tell Josh they need a new Oline scheme and a new Oline coach or a new HC if he refuses to change.

Once again meet the new boss same as the old boss (Slovik)

fontaine
10-25-2010, 03:40 PM
How many times have we lined up with less than 11 players?

Richard Quinn getting chewed out because he was lining up wrong.

Giving up on average 8 penalties a game.

Blown coverages, the amount of times players fumbled the ball this year.

Completely missing blocks/assignments on special teams every game that result in the kind of hits Demarius Thomas took on his blind side.

The coaches have changed the return man virtually every game along with the starting OL.

There are a few players in this team that fit the description, but on the whole there is nothing tough or smart about this football team.

This is about the most finesse offense I've seen in Denver in a long long time.

We couldn't even run the ball on Oakland even when they were sitting on a 38 point lead. It was only when they started sitting out their starters that we had any positive yardage in the run game.

Anyone who thinks a football team that simply cannot run the ball is tough needs to look up the word in the dictionary.

Taco John
10-25-2010, 03:46 PM
You have to actually put a focus on the offensive line and defensive line to be a physically tough football team. Just talking about it doesn't appear to be enough to get it done.

Chris
10-25-2010, 03:48 PM
The line play did improve in the Jets game. Honestly everything was so bad this week that I couldn't focus on any area in particular.

Taco John
10-25-2010, 03:51 PM
When Cox bent over for that fumble yesterday instead of just falling on the ball, I just about bit through my tongue.

Chris
10-25-2010, 03:52 PM
When Cox bent over for that fumble yesterday instead of just falling on the ball, I just about bit through my tongue.

Thought that was Nate Jones.

HAT
10-25-2010, 03:54 PM
Thought that was Nate Jones.

It was.

TheReverend
10-25-2010, 03:54 PM
More sprints.

Lol, where's TheDave or SureShot when you need em?

Cito Pelon
10-25-2010, 03:56 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16429356

Broncos coach Josh McDaniels repeatedly has said he wants a tough, smart, physical football team.

The numbers say the Broncos are not that team.

The Broncos are last in the league running the football, sitting at only 68.4 yards per game. That's an eye-opening 10.6 yards per game behind the Detroit Lions, who are 31st.

That's a team unable to move the line of scrimmage and unable to keep itself in games long enough to run the ball from a down-and-distance position of strength.

The Broncos are also 30th in the league in run defense, allowing 156.3 yards per game. Toss in the fact the Colts rushed for only 40 yards against the Broncos last month and that average is even more alarming.

In the Broncos' past 13 losses, they have surrendered at least 173 yards rushing seven times and opponents have topped 200 yards five times.

With either of those problems a team would have difficulty winning consistently over the long haul in the NFL without a Hall-of-Fame worthy quarterback. A team can't consistently surrender field position, time on the game clock and take that much punishment, yet still expect success.


Read more: Analysis: Broncos not what McDaniels preaches - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16429356#ixzz13PUu5ik2

Jeff sums up my views perfectly. I would take it a step further and begin to question if those attributes, "tough, smart, physical", are even the most critical thing you need to a build a team around. And does having them necessarily even make you a better team, or at least better enough to warrant building an entire team around them? Maybe and maybe not, but even if they are, McDaniels has been unable to assemble that here.

You're questioning that?

Cito Pelon
10-25-2010, 04:02 PM
I think this team needs to focus on a single identity and milk the crap out of that before moving on. Their identity is all over the place. I want people to look at Denver and say "they can play some defense" or "they're the best passing team in the league", "they run the ball better than anyone right now", etc. and use that identity as a starting point moving forward. As it stands, they're largely mediocre at a number of facets of the game and don't strike fear into their opponents. How do teams go from bad to good? They focus on one thing, become the best at it and build from there.

That's a good point.

Taco John
10-25-2010, 04:08 PM
Thought that was Nate Jones.

I don't think so. He might have been one of them, but Cox was directly above the ball bending over it trying to recover it while running.

fontaine
10-25-2010, 04:14 PM
It's not just the players though.

There's nothing smart about coaches who throw in a rookie like Walton into the starting lineup hoping he'll be allright.

Or how about when we couldn't use Weigmann because apparently the guy isn't smart enough or tough enough to play for us.

All Weigmann has done this season is start for KC on their way to being one of the best rushing teams in the league. And for close to veteran minimum. How smart do you have to be to have a little foresight and keep a veteran in to at least provide insurance in case the rookie sucks adjusting to the NFL?

Also, apparently Stanley Daniels was smart enough and tough enough to be the starter for the first four weeks after being undrafted and cut by the Packers.

Only to no longer be tough enough and smart enough because he's been benched in favor of an aging Hochstein coming off an acl.

What McDaniels and the coaches have done to the running game is nothing short of criminal and it was of their own making.

tsiguy96
10-25-2010, 04:24 PM
I don't think so. He might have been one of them, but Cox was directly above the ball bending over it trying to recover it while running.

it was nate jones

Taco John
10-25-2010, 04:27 PM
Was Nate Jones wearing a #32 jersey yesterday?

fontaine
10-25-2010, 04:33 PM
For me the most embarressing part of the game was in the first half when our base defense started off 10/12 plays in a 3-4 until the raiders make shift OL zone blocked their way gaining chunks of yardage on the ground until the defense was forced to go 4-3 and we still couldn't stop the run.

That's the kind of pain we used to inflict on other teams on the ground. Being on the receiving end of that pretty much drove home what a crippled team we are with no running game.

oubronco
10-25-2010, 04:46 PM
I think they need to quit preaching tough and smart and go out and prove how tough and smart they are and if they aren't any better than this shytcan them and get some who are

Steve Prefontaine
10-25-2010, 04:49 PM
Tough and smart? Absolutely. Football-smart, of course.

Again, my second reference to Ray Lewis today.... he's a POS, but they don't make football players any better than he is. He's tough, and football-smart. He's a respected leader on that defense.

We need more players like Lewis, minus the part about killing dudes.

I don't know man. At this point, can we be picky?

Steve Prefontaine
10-25-2010, 04:50 PM
I think they need to quit preaching tough and smart and go out and prove how tough and smart they are and if they aren't any better than this shytcan them and get some who are

Exactly. I've been hearing McD say the right things for the past year plus. I'm tired of talk. Let's see something translate to the field.

Cito Pelon
10-25-2010, 04:51 PM
It's not just the players though.

There's nothing smart about coaches who throw in a rookie like Walton into the starting lineup hoping he'll be allright.

Or how about when we couldn't use Weigmann because apparently the guy isn't smart enough or tough enough to play for us.

All Weigmann has done this season is start for KC on their way to being one of the best rushing teams in the league. And for close to veteran minimum. How smart do you have to be to have a little foresight and keep a veteran in to at least provide insurance in case the rookie sucks adjusting to the NFL?

Also, apparently Stanley Daniels was smart enough and tough enough to be the starter for the first four weeks after being undrafted and cut by the Packers.

Only to no longer be tough enough and smart enough because he's been benched in favor of an aging Hochstein coming off an acl.

What McDaniels and the coaches have done to the running game is nothing short of criminal and it was of their own making.

Who the f knew Weigmann still had a year left in him? You? The OL had to be addressed heavily no matter what because there was no depth there and the starters were not kicking ass despite this myth that the zone blocking scheme was kicking ass. You gotta be kidding me - you think the zone blocking scheme was kicking ass with Weigman and Hamilton? BBBBBBBBBaaaaaaaaaaaaahahaaaaaaaaaaaahahahhhhaaaha hahaha!

Josh had to start from scratch, so relax.

colonelbeef
10-25-2010, 04:59 PM
Who the f knew Weigmann still had a year left in him? You? The OL had to be addressed heavily no matter what because there was no depth there and the starters were not kicking ass despite this myth that the zone blocking scheme was kicking ass. You gotta be kidding me - you think the zone blocking scheme was kicking ass with Weigman and Hamilton? BBBBBBBBBaaaaaaaaaaaaahahaaaaaaaaaaaahahahhhhaaaha hahaha!

Josh had to start from scratch, so relax.

From scratch, with 3 solid young OL, 2 of which were pro bowl material, and one of which was the best young LT in the league bar none.

You don't know what the word 'scratch' means do you

The MVPlaya
10-25-2010, 05:02 PM
From scratch, with 3 solid young OL, 2 of which were pro bowl material, and one of which was the best young LT in the league bar none.

You don't know what the word 'scratch' means do you

Bar none? Are you retarded? I guess you don't follow very many other teams. Jake Long and Joe Thomas are great.

Which 2 were pro bowl material?

Cito Pelon
10-25-2010, 05:09 PM
Well, not scratch, I got a little carried away there. We had Clady and Kuper.

Atwater 27
10-25-2010, 05:12 PM
McDaniels sucks. He is a young punk with no people skills and a tyrant management style. The day we can his ass is the day we move in a positive direction again.

broncogary
10-25-2010, 05:28 PM
When Cox bent over for that fumble yesterday instead of just falling on the ball, I just about bit through my tongue.

There were several incidences of this yesterday, but I thought it was a matter of each of the Bronco's trying to hard to make a big play to turn it around.

WABronco
10-25-2010, 05:29 PM
You have to actually put a focus on the offensive line and defensive line to be a physically tough football team. Just talking about it doesn't appear to be enough to get it done.

Ya.

I didn't mind the Tebow pick at the time, but in retrospect the best decision would've been to probably look more along the defensive side. I mean, when was the last time we've drafted a DL worth ****? TREVOR PRYCE...LIKE 15 YEARS AGO. ****.

Oh and when your rookie OL look like garbage it's not a great sign for the future. You can only progress so much from "worst in the league." Coaching, personnel, whatever...they're ****ing awful.

Popps
10-25-2010, 05:40 PM
Clady was supposed to be good: He's hurt.
Harris was supposed to be good: He's hurt.
Kuper was supposed to be good: Is he?
Beadles: Rookie - Shown promise.
Walton: Rookie - Struggling mightily.


One of the things we need to do this off-season is to go out and get a proven OL and a proven DL. I really liked the Williams signing, but he's just not having the impact I had hoped.

broncosteven
10-25-2010, 06:07 PM
Clady was supposed to be good: He's hurt.
Harris was supposed to be good: He's hurt.
Kuper was supposed to be good: Is he?
Beadles: Rookie - Shown promise.
Walton: Rookie - Struggling mightily.


One of the things we need to do this off-season is to go out and get a proven OL and a proven DL. I really liked the Williams signing, but he's just not having the impact I had hoped.

I think Kuper's play is effected by the rooks/career backup/2nd year pro alternating around him.

I agree that this team needs to draft DL/OL/DL...finally something we can agree on!

No more skill players, build from the trenches out and be jsut as patient with them that we have to be with Tebow and in 2-3 years we might be back on top.

ZONA
10-25-2010, 06:52 PM
I'm not quite sure what the heck is going on. The week prior against the Jets (who are a good football team) we looked improved. The Broncos were physical, and probably should have won that game. Then the following week they get spanked. It's really hard to say just what wrong and therefor had to say how to fix it. That's mostly for the offense though. The defense, the amount of injuries forcing backups on the field is starting to show. Backups are in the NFL for a reason. They show flashes of something special. But what makes them backups, their either young and inexperienced or they're just too incosistant. The will make a nice play here but over there they miss on several plays. I think that's what we're seeing on the defense. Just too many young or average players on the field and they will make a few good plays but they give up more then they create. And it only compounds as you continue to lose more good players. A good defense can make do with a back up here or there, they design the defense around that. But when you start knocking out 4, 5 and 6 starters, there's no way to hold ground. Just too many holes.

gyldenlove
10-25-2010, 07:35 PM
Don't forget about the D-line coaching we need help in a big way

The D-line is more about lack of talent than coaching in my view, it is the same problem we have had for a long time now and no coach has been able to fix it with more than stopgap measures, at the end of the day you need talent to succeed.

gyldenlove
10-25-2010, 07:36 PM
Clady was supposed to be good: He's hurt.
Harris was supposed to be good: He's hurt.
Kuper was supposed to be good: Is he?
Beadles: Rookie - Shown promise.
Walton: Rookie - Struggling mightily.


One of the things we need to do this off-season is to go out and get a proven OL and a proven DL. I really liked the Williams signing, but he's just not having the impact I had hoped.

That doesn't explain why the OL is getting steadily worse as the season goes on. Clady is getting healthier, Harris presumably is getting healthier as well, the rookies should be improving game by game and yet the unit is getting worse. Coaching is very much a problem here.

gyldenlove
10-25-2010, 07:37 PM
Was Nate Jones wearing a #32 jersey yesterday?

No, it was number 33 and it was Jones.

mhgaffney
10-25-2010, 07:39 PM
I saw McFadden blowing right past Haggen. Where was Moss? Invisible. Was he even on the field?

It was too painful to watch. I left after 3 quarters.

*WARHORSE*
10-25-2010, 07:41 PM
Imo, the loss was about mental toughness.

We have a young team in many areas of the game.


When you get blindsided by 21 pts in 6 minutes, young teams fall apart.


Thats what happened across the board.



Oh............that includes our young HC.




Its called 'On any given sunday'.

This can happen.


Let it go, and move on.


The team was absolutely fantastic against the JEST, and that wasnt an accident.

Focus on the Niners.

baja
10-25-2010, 08:16 PM
Apparently, trading a 4th for Maroney qualifies what Josh means by tough, smart and physical football players.

Finally I get a laugh from a post today.

Good one!

Cito Pelon
10-25-2010, 08:24 PM
The D-line is more about lack of talent than coaching in my view, it is the same problem we have had for a long time now and no coach has been able to fix it with more than stopgap measures, at the end of the day you need talent to succeed.

True.

outdoor_miner
10-25-2010, 09:11 PM
How many times have we lined up with less than 11 players?

Richard Quinn getting chewed out because he was lining up wrong.

Giving up on average 8 penalties a game.

Blown coverages, the amount of times players fumbled the ball this year.

Completely missing blocks/assignments on special teams every game that result in the kind of hits Demarius Thomas took on his blind side.

The coaches have changed the return man virtually every game along with the starting OL.

There are a few players in this team that fit the description, but on the whole there is nothing tough or smart about this football team.

This is the stuff that has been driving me crazy since the end of last year, and is what is making my support for McD wane. We are the ones who take the stupid penalties (mind you - not even overly-aggressive intimidation/"make a point" penalties; just stupid). We are the ones who commit the bad turnovers at the wrong times. We are the ones making the same mistakes over and over and over again (not enough men on the field). This smart team sure plays idiotic most of the time. That is the part that seems like should have been fixed this year (with McD getting to weed out the dumbasses), but it continues to plague us. It makes me think that playing smart football is all about coaching and leadership, and McD is failing at that.

baja
10-25-2010, 09:13 PM
This is the stuff that has been driving me crazy since the end of last year, and is what is making my support for McD wane. We are the ones who take the stupid penalties (mind you - not even overly-aggressive intimidation/"make a point" penalties; just stupid). We are the ones who commit the bad turnovers at the wrong times. We are the ones making the same mistakes over and over and over again (not enough men on the field). This smart team sure plays idiotic most of the time. That is the part that seems like should have been fixed this year (with McD getting to weed out the dumbasses), but it continues to plague us. It makes me think that playing smart football is all about coaching and leadership, and McD is failing at that.

Well clearly we are luling teams asleep so we can skin um in the playoffs

Hulamau
10-26-2010, 01:07 AM
The O-line coaching is terrible.

Beside Barone he has Wilford Brimley coaching the line and that whole deal looks like an after thought... Need a overhaul in the Oline coaching for sure!

Rock Chalk
10-26-2010, 04:25 AM
I'll add in this smarter football team is averaging more than 8 penalties per game.



Dennison is in Houston and in one offseason has transformed one of the worst running games in the league to one of the best.

But what the hell does he know compared to the wealth of experience Josh has in the run game.

Running Game/OL/Defense gone.

Apart from the passing game, McD has pretty much dismantled the rest of the team.

Im not defending Josh here but Dennison left, Josh didn't get rid of him. He took a promotion and the chance to reunite with a friend. You really cant put that on Josh.

What you can put on Josh is not finding a suitable replacement.

fontaine
10-26-2010, 05:36 AM
Im not defending Josh here but Dennison left, Josh didn't get rid of him. He took a promotion and the chance to reunite with a friend. You really cant put that on Josh.

What you can put on Josh is not finding a suitable replacement.


Fair enough. But I do feel that he should have done more to keep those guys in the fold.

I understand that in a lot of ways Josh has had it pretty tough and he does seem like a bright young guy.

But he's put himself in this situation. The team was loaded with 10 draft picks in the first three rounds, a decent core of players to work with and a very supporting owner.

This is his team, that he's put together from the bottom up.

I don't mind losses as long as we're showing some improvement (ie the Jets game) but if there's a repeat of what we saw against Oakland the rest of the season then it pretty much leaves Pat no choice.

Head Coaches make mistakes all the time. It's how you correct and rectify those mistakes that seperate the successful coaches from the pretenders.

Let's see how Josh reacts.

baja
10-26-2010, 05:40 AM
Fair enough. But I do feel that he should have done more to keep those guys in the fold.

I understand that in a lot of ways Josh has had it pretty tough and he does seem like a bright young guy.

But he's put himself in this situation. The team was loaded with 10 draft picks in the first three rounds, a decent core of players to work with and a very supporting owner.

This is his team, that he's put together from the bottom up.

I don't mind losses as long as we're showing some improvement (ie the Jets game) but if there's a repeat of what we saw against Oakland the rest of the season then it pretty much leaves Pat no choice.

<b>Head Coaches make mistakes all the time. It's how you correct and rectify those mistakes that seperate the successful coaches from the pretenders.

Let's see how Josh reacts.

I wish more of us here could see this

dbfan21
10-26-2010, 05:47 AM
I think that if our starters weren't injured like they have been (Doom, Ayers, Dawkins, Goodman, Harris, Moreno, Kuper) and our backups weren't injured too (Buck, McBath, White, etc), the team would have had better continuity and chemistry heading into the season.

You cannot compete in this league with the type of injuries we have dealt with over the first 7 weeks of the season. I don't care who your coach is and who you're playing. This team has been DECIMATED by injuries and are asking a lot of the rookies and back-ups to play at a very high level.

I know that every team has to deal with injuries, but I would like someone to show me another team that has handled the same amount of injuries to KEY players like we have.

Just my .02

strafen
10-26-2010, 05:54 AM
Im not defending Josh here but Dennison left, Josh didn't get rid of him. He took a promotion and the chance to reunite with a friend. You really cant put that on Josh.

What you can put on Josh is not finding a suitable replacement.Come on man!
Dennison left for a reason. Bobby Turner left for a reason, and Mike Nolan left for a reason.
All indications point at McDaniels, as the reason...

Rabb
10-26-2010, 06:02 AM
I think that if our starters weren't injured like they have been (Doom, Ayers, Dawkins, Goodman, Harris, Moreno, Kuper) and our backups weren't injured too (Buck, McBath, White, etc), the team would have had better continuity and chemistry heading into the season.

You cannot compete in this league with the type of injuries we have dealt with over the first 7 weeks of the season. I don't care who your coach is and who you're playing. This team has been DECIMATED by injuries and are asking a lot of the rookies and back-ups to play at a very high level.

I know that every team has to deal with injuries, but I would like someone to show me another team that has handled the same amount of injuries to KEY players like we have.

Just my .02

The Baltimore Ravens.

Their secondary was decimated in the off season and their WR situation was fairly bleak. They are now working with Rice injured and playing off and on, just got Ed Reed back and have been shuffling offensive and defensive linemen. They seem to be doing ok.

The fact is, they dealt with it because they have backups that could start on any other team, and they have an organization that goes out and gets the available players needed to fill gaps.

I do agree we would be a different team potentially with the injured guys playing all of the time, but it's not a crutch for us and not an excuse I will accept. It certainly doesn't explain the mental errors, not getting enough guys on the field in many plays so far this year and the lack of discipline.

fontaine
10-26-2010, 06:06 AM
I wish more of us here could see this

Well, my expectations of Josh remain unchanged. From his very first press conference he placed a priority on fixing the trenches.

After two offseasons, 23 games and 10 picks in the first three rounds our DL looks as bad as ever and the OL has taken several giant leaps backwards.

We have no new young/promising DL, and apart from Beadles it's the same for the OL.

Until Josh fixes that, this team is doomed to repeat the same kind of failure.

jhns
10-26-2010, 06:06 AM
I think that if our starters weren't injured like they have been (Doom, Ayers, Dawkins, Goodman, Harris, Moreno, Kuper) and our backups weren't injured too (Buck, McBath, White, etc), the team would have had better continuity and chemistry heading into the season.

You cannot compete in this league with the type of injuries we have dealt with over the first 7 weeks of the season. I don't care who your coach is and who you're playing. This team has been DECIMATED by injuries and are asking a lot of the rookies and back-ups to play at a very high level.

I know that every team has to deal with injuries, but I would like someone to show me another team that has handled the same amount of injuries to KEY players like we have.

Just my .02

We had more injuries in Shanahans last year here. You may think they are an excuse but Bowlen sure doesn't. Anyways, a full team of backups shouldn't lose 59-14 to the raiders.

fontaine
10-26-2010, 06:09 AM
I think that if our starters weren't injured like they have been (Doom, Ayers, Dawkins, Goodman, Harris, Moreno, Kuper) and our backups weren't injured too (Buck, McBath, White, etc), the team would have had better continuity and chemistry heading into the season.

You cannot compete in this league with the type of injuries we have dealt with over the first 7 weeks of the season. I don't care who your coach is and who you're playing. This team has been DECIMATED by injuries and are asking a lot of the rookies and back-ups to play at a very high level.

I know that every team has to deal with injuries, but I would like someone to show me another team that has handled the same amount of injuries to KEY players like we have.

Just my .02

Colts, Packers off the top of my head.

Jesterhole
10-26-2010, 06:23 AM
Im not defending Josh here but Dennison left, Josh didn't get rid of him. He took a promotion and the chance to reunite with a friend. You really cant put that on Josh.

What you can put on Josh is not finding a suitable replacement.

What are you basing that off of? I was under the impression that Josh got rid of those guys, or at least forced them out in some manner.

Where did you get your info?

Jesterhole
10-26-2010, 06:25 AM
I wish more of us here could see this

He's had blowouts from rivals at home before to respond to. We were trying to see how we responded from last week's heartbreaker, remember?

Kool-aid, it's for breakfast!

Rohirrim
10-26-2010, 07:58 AM
Watching the Giants Oline last night made me miss the days when the Broncos had a dominating Oline, from Zimmerman to Jones. The Giants were able to just move the 'Boys out of the gaps at will. When you can do that, you win. It all starts right there.

Ray Finkle
10-26-2010, 08:14 AM
What are you basing that off of? I was under the impression that Josh got rid of those guys, or at least forced them out in some manner.

Where did you get your info?

He left to be an offensive coordinator.....Josh had him as the OLine coach. Turner took a promotion as well.....

colonelbeef
10-26-2010, 08:17 AM
Im not defending Josh here but Dennison left, Josh didn't get rid of him. He took a promotion and the chance to reunite with a friend. You really cant put that on Josh.

What you can put on Josh is not finding a suitable replacement.

Isn't it amazing how many talented people have left for one reason or another over the past 1.5 years, while Josh has been unable to replace them?

Well at least the team has improved, so his vision has been borne out... oh wait, the Broncos are the worst team in the league, forgot about that

Ray Finkle
10-26-2010, 08:37 AM
Isn't it amazing how many talented people have left for one reason or another over the past 1.5 years, while Josh has been unable to replace them?

Well at least the team has improved, so his vision has been borne out... oh wait, the Broncos are the worst team in the league, forgot about that

you can say that on many teams. The number issue in coaching is not the day to day crap, it is identifying and replacing coaches when you need to. Gibbs, Dennison, Turner do not grow on trees.

Rock Chalk
10-26-2010, 08:41 AM
What are you basing that off of? I was under the impression that Josh got rid of those guys, or at least forced them out in some manner.

Where did you get your info?

Dennison is the offensive coordinator/assistant head coach with Kubiak. It was a promotion and he left to go work with a long time friend.

Turner too took a promotion and left to go with Shanahan, and we all KNEW he would (and if you didnt you had your head up your ass).

Josh didn't get rid of either of them. He retained those two from the old Shanahan staff because they were absolutely the best in the business at their jobs.

There was NO mention anywhere that Josh got rid of either of them. That's something that people that hate all things McDaniels just assumed.

Rock Chalk
10-26-2010, 08:42 AM
Isn't it amazing how many talented people have left for one reason or another over the past 1.5 years, while Josh has been unable to replace them?

Well at least the team has improved, so his vision has been borne out... oh wait, the Broncos are the worst team in the league, forgot about that

Dennison took a ****ing promotion and to leave and work with a long time friend.

WTF is wrong with you?

colonelbeef
10-26-2010, 08:45 AM
you can say that on many teams. The number issue in coaching is not the day to day crap, it is identifying and replacing coaches when you need to. Gibbs, Dennison, Turner do not grow on trees.

which is exactly why you do everything in your power to keep them.

This team has hemorrhaged talent from the front office, coaching lines, and football team since McDaniels has been here. You can blame anyone you want; blame Cutler, blame Marshall, blame Nolan, blame the Goodmans, blame Sheffler, blame Hillis .

The logical person to blame is McDaniels.

There have been 2 constants during this debacle- Pat Bowlen and Josh McDaniels.

Bowlen was here before this trouble started and is hands off. Therefore, the blame lies at McDaniels' feet.

These are his players, his schemes, his coaches, his gameplans. The best players on this team are still mostly Shanahan players.

Everybody outside of Denver sees McDaniels as being incompetent, and 4/5 Broncos fans now do as well- the few remaining supporters remind me of Lions diehards who made excuses for Matt Millen right up until he was fired. Same fanboys, same blinders, same stupidity.

dbfan21
10-26-2010, 08:49 AM
The Baltimore Ravens.

Their secondary was decimated in the off season and their WR situation was fairly bleak. They are now working with Rice injured and playing off and on, just got Ed Reed back and have been shuffling offensive and defensive linemen. They seem to be doing ok.

The fact is, they dealt with it because they have backups that could start on any other team, and they have an organization that goes out and gets the available players needed to fill gaps.

I do agree we would be a different team potentially with the injured guys playing all of the time, but it's not a crutch for us and not an excuse I will accept. It certainly doesn't explain the mental errors, not getting enough guys on the field in many plays so far this year and the lack of discipline.

As far as the Ravens WR situation, I disagree. The Ravens have had Boldin & Housh this year. They were missing Reed. Rice hasn't been injured they way Moreno has been. If we had a couple players missing, that would be one thing. Our list is extensive.

dbfan21
10-26-2010, 08:51 AM
Colts, Packers off the top of my head.

The Colts just lost Clark, but who are the other starters that have been gone for most (or all of the season). The Pack have had some injuries with Grant and Barnett, but still not to the degree that we have.

strafen
10-26-2010, 08:51 AM
He left to be an offensive coordinator.....Josh had him as the OLine coach. Turner took a promotion as well.....Are you just dumb, or are just playing one?
Promotion, huh?
Yes, the "promotion" thing is a loophole that allows coaches to leave to another team. A team can't come to the Broncos or any team for that matter and say they want our defensive coordinator coach and just take him to offer him the same job (lateral move) there have to be a promotion or a "title" change for that to be allowed.
Thought this was common knowledge. I guess not...

Mediator12
10-26-2010, 08:58 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16429356

Broncos coach Josh McDaniels repeatedly has said he wants a tough, smart, physical football team.

The numbers say the Broncos are not that team.

The Broncos are last in the league running the football, sitting at only 68.4 yards per game. That's an eye-opening 10.6 yards per game behind the Detroit Lions, who are 31st.

That's a team unable to move the line of scrimmage and unable to keep itself in games long enough to run the ball from a down-and-distance position of strength.

The Broncos are also 30th in the league in run defense, allowing 156.3 yards per game. Toss in the fact the Colts rushed for only 40 yards against the Broncos last month and that average is even more alarming.

In the Broncos' past 13 losses, they have surrendered at least 173 yards rushing seven times and opponents have topped 200 yards five times.

With either of those problems a team would have difficulty winning consistently over the long haul in the NFL without a Hall-of-Fame worthy quarterback. A team can't consistently surrender field position, time on the game clock and take that much punishment, yet still expect success.


Read more: Analysis: Broncos not what McDaniels preaches - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16429356#ixzz13PUu5ik2

Jeff sums up my views perfectly. I would take it a step further and begin to question if those attributes, "tough, smart, physical", are even the most critical thing you need to a build a team around. And does having them necessarily even make you a better team, or at least better enough to warrant building an entire team around them? Maybe and maybe not, but even if they are, McDaniels has been unable to assemble that here.

The Broncos are not what McDaniels wants them to be. Yesterday was just the proof that for all he wants them to be, they are still a wildly inconsistent, soft team. This is not a finesse style team on either side of the ball, but having a power scheme getting executed by soft players makes them look absolutely incompetent.

Let me ask you all this? Why does DEN struggle to beat OAK @ home?

2007 20-34 OAK
2008 10-31 OAK
2009 19-20 OAK
2010 14-509 OAK, well 14-59 OAK

This team has played 4 of its worst games over the last 4 seasons against OAK at home. Every single one of those losses contributed to missing the playoffs in a big way.

This used to be a team DEN beat with regularity and the rivalry was intense. Now, they have become the bane of this franchise who struggles to win a Division home game? I mean WTF ???

I hate OAK. Period. And, to not take advantage of their inconsistency over the last 4 years is a tragedy of epic proportions. I just want to see a team with some heart execute and destroy a bitter rival. Instead, we have to watch the rival drive a stake into our hearts the last four years. I do not care who the coach is, I want the players to get up to beat OAK for goodness sake! I can not stand a team with no heart or killer instinct. And right now, they are far from it. Josh has a lot of work to do and he better get their hearts in it.

Popps
10-26-2010, 09:02 AM
Watching the Giants Oline last night made me miss the days when the Broncos had a dominating Oline, from Zimmerman to Jones. The Giants were able to just move the 'Boys out of the gaps at will. When you can do that, you win. It all starts right there.

Agree. That was the offseason priority. The staff certainly went after guys in attempts to improve it, but it clearly hasn't shown to this point.

Clady/Harris' injuries really set this thing off on the wrong foot, though.

Personally, I think we need to make a big-time acquisition on the OL this off-season. I still think Beadles and Walton may be able to contribute, but we need another interior linemen to build around.

Mediator12
10-26-2010, 09:07 AM
The Colts just lost Clark, but who are the other starters that have been gone for most (or all of the season). The Pack have had some injuries with Grant and Barnett, but still not to the degree that we have.

Garcon, Gonzalez, Clark, Collie have all missed games or will miss more in the Receiving corp. Along the OL Charlie Johnson OLT, Mike Pollak, And Jamie Richard have all missed starts. Saturday missed the entire TC and was real shaky to start the season. Addai, Donald Brown, and Mike Hart are all hurt and have missed starts or games at RB. That's the Offense.

On defense, Gary Brackett and Clint Session have missed Starts at LB. At DT, Both Muir and Johnson have missed starts. In the secondary, the Colts have lost Sanders (shocker) and Bullitt for the year. At CB, they have not had Jacob Lacey pretty much all season and Powers and Hayden have missed time.

It is pretty comparable. However, everyone still expects them to be perfect because 18 is still under center....ROFL!

baja
10-26-2010, 09:17 AM
Are you just dumb, or are just playing one?
Promotion, huh?
Yes, the "promotion" thing is a loophole that allows coaches to leave to another team. A team can't come to the Broncos or any team for that matter and say they want our defensive coordinator coach and just take him to offer him the same job (lateral move) there have to be a promotion or a "title" change for that to be allowed.
Thought this was common knowledge. I guess not...

I remember when there were like 3 of us defending Dennison when he took over for Gibbs. Now he's a saint to all those that are ready to fire Josh. I wonder what you will be saying if (still a very possible scenario) he makes the Broncos perennial winners. I feel quite certain Josh McDaniels will be a top flight head coach for someone and I sure hope it's us.

Dr. Broncenstein
10-26-2010, 09:19 AM
Agree. That was the offseason priority. The staff certainly went after guys in attempts to improve it, but it clearly hasn't shown to this point.

Clady/Harris' injuries really set this thing off on the wrong foot, though.

Personally, I think we need to make a big-time acquisition on the OL this off-season. I still think Beadles and Walton may be able to contribute, but we need another interior linemen to build around.

I don't think Clady is even remotely healthy. Similar with Harris, and possibly Kuper. We had to rush Clady back because we were in full crisis mode when Harris was inevitably injured in the preseason.

baja
10-26-2010, 09:20 AM
Agree. That was the offseason priority. The staff certainly went after guys in attempts to improve it, but it clearly hasn't shown to this point.

Clady/Harris' injuries really set this thing off on the wrong foot, though.

Personally, I think we need to make a big-time acquisition on the OL this off-season. I still think Beadles and Walton may be able to contribute, but we need another interior linemen to build around.

I suspect the line coach. I miss Dennison.

azbroncfan
10-26-2010, 09:21 AM
Let me ask you all this? Why does DEN struggle to beat OAK @ home?

2007 20-34 OAK
2008 10-31 OAK
2009 19-20 OAK
2010 14-509 OAK, well 14-59 OAK

My buddy is a Raider fan and we always joke about how Oakland can't lose in Denver and Denver wins in Oakland. Side note I was at the 2006 game which was the famous shanny timeout game that Denver got lucky on and could of easily been another home loss.

Rabb
10-26-2010, 09:22 AM
As far as the Ravens WR situation, I disagree. The Ravens have had Boldin & Housh this year. They were missing Reed. Rice hasn't been injured they way Moreno has been. If we had a couple players missing, that would be one thing. Our list is extensive.

that would be why I said

they have an organization that goes out and gets the available players needed to fill gaps.

WR was not a strength, it was a major area of concern and the organization fixed it

Rice may not have been injured the same, but his impact is pretty damn great wouldn't you say?

dbfan21
10-26-2010, 09:27 AM
that would be why I said



WR was not a strength, it was a major area of concern and the organization fixed it

Rice may not have been injured the same, but his impact is pretty damn great wouldn't you say?

yes. agreed. :sunshine:

dbfan21
10-26-2010, 09:28 AM
Garcon, Gonzalez, Clark, Collie have all missed games or will miss more in the Receiving corp. Along the OL Charlie Johnson OLT, Mike Pollak, And Jamie Richard have all missed starts. Saturday missed the entire TC and was real shaky to start the season. Addai, Donald Brown, and Mike Hart are all hurt and have missed starts or games at RB. That's the Offense.

On defense, Gary Brackett and Clint Session have missed Starts at LB. At DT, Both Muir and Johnson have missed starts. In the secondary, the Colts have lost Sanders (shocker) and Bullitt for the year. At CB, they have not had Jacob Lacey pretty much all season and Powers and Hayden have missed time.

It is pretty comparable. However, everyone still expects them to be perfect because 18 is still under center....ROFL!

OK. The Colts have had some major injuries. And yes, 18 does make everone's expectations rise.

Old Dude
10-26-2010, 09:29 AM
That doesn't explain why the OL is getting steadily worse as the season goes on. Clady is getting healthier, Harris presumably is getting healthier as well, the rookies should be improving game by game and yet the unit is getting worse. Coaching is very much a problem here.

A couple things to keep in mind.

Clady missed all of camp and almost all of the preseason. Kuper missed a lot of time as well. Beadles started off as a LG, then got moved around all over the place. Daniels was suddenly in, looked good for a game or two, then flushed out. Harris was the only vet to make it through camp and the preseason, and then immediately got hurt. The only guy who has really taken one spot and stayed there is Walton, but he's constantly surrounded by a different supporting cast.

A big part of O-Line play is timing and cohesion - and knowing which team mate is going to do what and when and how and what their strengths and weaknesses and responsibilities are. If you look at the most effective lines in the NFL they have great players, but they also have a lot of time melding as a unit and playing together.

Denver's O-Line was constantly in flux through the preseason, due largely to injuries. They never did get it together as a unit.

Having two rookies on the line (including center) almost guarantees that opposing teams are going to try to confuse them. We all knew this was going to be a rough start, and the hope was that things would improve as the year went on.

What I don't know is whether the unit is just behind schedule or whether there really are some serious talent and injury issues.

What on earth is up with Harris? What's the deal with Beadles? How could Daniels look so good one week, then so bloody awful the next?

Rabb
10-26-2010, 09:29 AM
it's frustrating man, no question

I mean seriously, name any one of the DB's on Baltimore's defense other than Reed (without cheating)

we just don't have the organization setup to succeed from what I see

Mediator12
10-26-2010, 09:34 AM
I don't think Clady is even remotely healthy. Similar with Harris, and possibly Kuper. We had to rush Clady back because we were in full crisis mode when Harris was inevitably injured in the preseason.

I totally agree. Matt Bowen of NFP said he thought his knee bend was awful this year and it was affecting his play. The OL has been a source of major concern this year and now the DL is doing its best to resemble the terrible DL's DEN has rolled out since 2004.

The OL are hurt, they are playing well below the optimum of their potential. This is WHY I said the OL Coach has to earn his money. He still has to get players in the right places and doing the right things even though they are less than 100%.

The DL, well, what can you say but they have not played well.

Rohirrim
10-26-2010, 09:34 AM
The Broncos are not what McDaniels wants them to be. Yesterday was just the proof that for all he wants them to be, they are still a wildly inconsistent, soft team. This is not a finesse style team on either side of the ball, but having a power scheme getting executed by soft players makes them look absolutely incompetent.

Let me ask you all this? Why does DEN struggle to beat OAK @ home?

2007 20-34 OAK
2008 10-31 OAK
2009 19-20 OAK
2010 14-509 OAK, well 14-59 OAK

This team has played 4 of its worst games over the last 4 seasons against OAK at home. Every single one of those losses contributed to missing the playoffs in a big way.

This used to be a team DEN beat with regularity and the rivalry was intense. Now, they have become the bane of this franchise who struggles to win a Division home game? I mean WTF ???

I hate OAK. Period. And, to not take advantage of their inconsistency over the last 4 years is a tragedy of epic proportions. I just want to see a team with some heart execute and destroy a bitter rival. Instead, we have to watch the rival drive a stake into our hearts the last four years. I do not care who the coach is, I want the players to get up to beat OAK for goodness sake! I can not stand a team with no heart or killer instinct. And right now, they are far from it. Josh has a lot of work to do and he better get their hearts in it.

Abso****inglutely! This is my feeling as well. If you can't take down the Raiders in our own house, get the **** out of Dodge.

azbroncfan
10-26-2010, 09:35 AM
OK. The Colts have had some major injuries. And yes, 18 does make everone's expectations rise.

A HOF QB and one of the best ever does wonder's for all the players around him. Manning is a good as anyone who ever played for making average to below average players produce at a good level especially on the OL.

broncocalijohn
10-26-2010, 10:05 AM
if you live by the "scheme", you die by the "scheme". throw the scheme out and pound the muther******ng ball. sacrifice a game or two. make them prove themselves.

Josh has tried this (not the whole game) even when we were averaging .7 yards a carry. It is obvious that we are having trouble running the ball and I dont think just keep doing it to prove a point will work. Our best assets right now is throwing the ball to our wideouts.

worm
10-26-2010, 10:12 AM
Abso****inglutely! This is my feeling as well. If you can't take down the Raiders in our own house, get the **** out of Dodge.

This should always be bullet number one for any head coach of the Denver Broncos.

bendog
10-26-2010, 10:19 AM
Elway lost at home to the faide, but that game was .... historically bad.

~Crash~
10-26-2010, 10:25 AM
Well, his knee, for one.

so when this coach tinkers with the and team gets worse it really is injuries ...Ha!

fontaine
10-26-2010, 01:33 PM
Agree. That was the offseason priority. The staff certainly went after guys in attempts to improve it, but it clearly hasn't shown to this point.


1. D'Anthony Batiste - career backup who started 4 games in 5 years.

2. Stanley Daniels - career practice squad player who had what 0 starts?

3. A rookie Center

That's the attempt to go after guys to improve the red zone issues, power blocking, short yardage problems?

Hilarious!

What's next? Bring back John Engelberger and draft Nick Eason?

bendog
10-26-2010, 01:36 PM
1. D'Anthony Batiste - career backup who started 4 games in 5 years.

2. Stanley Daniels - career practice squad player who had what 0 starts?

3. A rookie Center

That's the attempt to go after guys to improve the red zone issues, power blocking, short yardage problems?

Hilarious!

What's next? Bring back John Engelberger and draft Nick Eason?

What's unbelievable is that it REALLY IS unbelievable.

broncocalijohn
10-26-2010, 02:51 PM
Come on man!
Dennison left for a reason. Bobby Turner left for a reason, and Mike Nolan left for a reason.
All indications point at McDaniels, as the reason...

and two of them went back to coach for their former employee or friend. Nice try and unless you have those facts, dont get hi on your horse there knowing and guessing facts.

Hamrob
10-26-2010, 06:21 PM
I'll go back to when we hired Mcdaniels. Many of us on this board were in favor of McDaniels because we thought he was the perfect fit for our offense and Jay Cutler. And, because our team was built around offense, we thought that McD would be the best candidate to hire because of that reason.

The other top candidate you'll remember happened to be Steve Spagnuolo...a defensive guru who many of us wanted to be hired to turn a poor defense around.

Well, McD dismantles an already very good offense and spends two years rebuilding....that's right, the offense. Here we are 2yrs later and our defense is still amongst the worst in the NFL and our team is still average at best.

I don't know about you, but I'd take a Rob Ryan tomorrow if we could get him. Or I'm fine with hiring "The Chin" to run this team.

cutthemdown
10-26-2010, 07:01 PM
1. D'Anthony Batiste - career backup who started 4 games in 5 years.

2. Stanley Daniels - career practice squad player who had what 0 starts?

3. A rookie Center

That's the attempt to go after guys to improve the red zone issues, power blocking, short yardage problems?

Hilarious!

What's next? Bring back John Engelberger and draft Nick Eason?

Exactly.

broncswin
10-26-2010, 07:36 PM
god, I hate this shiat...reading all the stats and really looking into our team, I have realized that we need alot of work...wasn't long ago I thought we were close. After that lose and just seeing how unorganized we are has frustrated me to no end. I love this damn team and want this shiat to turn around now!!

cutthemdown
10-26-2010, 07:59 PM
I can remember in the offseason saying this oline would be crap. When you have 1 player coming off a really bad injury, 2 rookies, some journeyman to plug in here and there etc etc you can pretty much predict that without being a genius.

The scary thought is what if Clady never is the same again? What if Kuper wasn't worth an extension? What if Harris isn't someone who can be counted on? None of those certainties but also not out of the realm of possibility watching them play.

Atwater His Ass
10-26-2010, 08:03 PM
I'll go back to when we hired Mcdaniels. Many of us on this board were in favor of McDaniels because we thought he was the perfect fit for our offense and Jay Cutler. And, because our team was built around offense, we thought that McD would be the best candidate to hire because of that reason.

The other top candidate you'll remember happened to be Steve Spagnuolo...a defensive guru who many of us wanted to be hired to turn a poor defense around.

Well, McD dismantles an already very good offense and spends two years rebuilding....that's right, the offense. Here we are 2yrs later and our defense is still amongst the worst in the NFL and our team is still average at best.

I don't know about you, but I'd take a Rob Ryan tomorrow if we could get him. Or I'm fine with hiring "The Chin" to run this team.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

I cannot stand what McD has done to this franchise. I'm sure he's laughing all the way to the bank though.

Tombstone RJ
10-26-2010, 08:07 PM
I'll go back to when we hired Mcdaniels. Many of us on this board were in favor of McDaniels because we thought he was the perfect fit for our offense and Jay Cutler. And, because our team was built around offense, we thought that McD would be the best candidate to hire because of that reason.

The other top candidate you'll remember happened to be Steve Spagnuolo...a defensive guru who many of us wanted to be hired to turn a poor defense around.

Well, McD dismantles an already very good offense and spends two years rebuilding....that's right, the offense. Here we are 2yrs later and our defense is still amongst the worst in the NFL and our team is still average at best.

I don't know about you, but I'd take a Rob Ryan tomorrow if we could get him. Or I'm fine with hiring "The Chin" to run this team.

I agree with a lot of this post. The thing about McD that dazzled Ellis (pure speculation on my part) is his brains. Bowlen doesn't hire true GMs, he hires a HC who hires or works in conjunction with the GM. He probably thought McD could handle the entire package.

If you hire the chin, you better by god hire a real GM. I'd be all in favor of bringing in a guy like Parcells (as others have said) with the combo. of hiring Cowher.

However, before I hired Cowher, I'd be more apt. to hire Parcells and then tell McD he now answers to Parcells and Parcells has final say on all football operations. Give McD the opportunity to grow as a HC.

Old No. 7
10-26-2010, 08:18 PM
After 20 years of Carl ****ing Peterson I see now that the adage is true:

"It ALL starts at the TOP".

Good luck with that. Heh.

Merlin
10-26-2010, 08:25 PM
However, before I hired Cowher, I'd be more apt. to hire Parcells and then tell McD he now answers to Parcells and Parcells has final say on all football operations. Give McD the opportunity to grow as a HC.
Now that sounds like a great idea if Parcells were willing to do it. McD has some talent as OC, but his arrogance kills him as a HC. Parcells would quickly kick his ass and force him to do what he is good at. Coordinating the O. Parcells could then do a better job with personnel and coaches. Sadly, too logical for it to happen.