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boppool
10-04-2010, 03:27 PM
Alright, I must admit. I wasn't exactly excited when we got Orton as part of Cutler deal. I wanted a guy with a little more upside (say, talent). When we traded for Brady Quinn, I really wanted Quinn to win the job, so we could trade Orton for a D lineman.

Now, fast forward to week 4...

I really think it would take Tebow at least 3 years to be ready and Quinn proves to be a suitable back-up at best. You could argue that any willing QB could succeed in McDaniels' system (say, Matt Cassel), but Orton is really thriving in this system. Despite inconsistent protection and lack of running game, he's limiting his mistakes, putting this team on his back and kept the team in the game.

Orton is anti-Cutler. Not very exciting, he doesn't thread the needle between defenders or hit WRs in strides 40 yards down. But that's not our offense. I've accepted the fact that zone-blocking system is long gone and we'll rather try to hit underneath receiver for 6 yards gain, 5 plays in a row.

And most of all, he stays out of spotlight. Unlike Cutler or Marshall, he welcomes challenges (drafting Tebow), puts his head down and competes, while demonstrating his leadership skills.

By the time Tebow's ready to carry this offense, Orton should stay as the starting quarterback for the Broncos.

Go Broncos!

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 03:28 PM
no

PRBronco
10-04-2010, 03:31 PM
:-O http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-broncos-ortonextension

boppool
10-04-2010, 03:31 PM
no

So, who would you rather have, Tebow or Quinn?

boppool
10-04-2010, 03:32 PM
:-O http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-broncos-ortonextension

I wasn't talking about one year extension he just received, but for 2 or 3 years.

PRBronco
10-04-2010, 03:34 PM
I wasn't talking about one year extension he just received, but for 2 or 3 years.

Couldn't help myself :yayaya:

Popps
10-04-2010, 03:35 PM
I'm down. Bird in the hand.

If Tebow develops... great! We'll have the "problem" of two QBs who can run our system well.

Until then, it's apparent that Orton is our best option behind center. He's also still fairly young. Lock him up now, and you get (likely) his best 4-5 years of his career.

Los Broncos
10-04-2010, 03:35 PM
Yes, extend now.

boppool
10-04-2010, 03:37 PM
I'm down. Bird in the hand.

If Tebow develops... great! We'll have the "problem" of two QBs who can run our system well.

Until then, it's apparent that Orton is our best option behind center. He's also still fairly young. Lock him up now, and you get (likely) his best 4-5 years of his career.

Exactly. I'm really hoping for Tebow to develop, which would be awesome for this franchise. In case he doesn't, Orton can still carry this team.

Dedhed
10-04-2010, 03:38 PM
Um, we just did.

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 03:38 PM
So, who would you rather have, Tebow or Quinn?

Let's see how Orton plays the ENTIRE year before we even think about extending him. Now peeps here are acting like he's Tom Terrific and he's not. Sorry, he's just NOT. He's doing very, very well right now but he's got to prove he can consistently win the big games and help get the Broncos to the playoffs before he gets an extension.

As for Tebow, we don't really know how good he's gonna be. With Orton, we know what we've got and while he's much improved, I wouldn't dump a boat load of cash on him until he proves he can win in crunch time...

Fusionfrontman
10-04-2010, 03:40 PM
Totally down. I agree, he is old enough to grasp a system well and perform and young enough to have 4-5 years of his prime left. Do it. If Tebow develops in the meantime we can Aaron Rodgers him.

Orton has become one of my top 5 favorite Broncos on the team now.

Popps
10-04-2010, 03:42 PM
Let's see how Orton plays the ENTIRE year before we even think about extending him. Now peeps here are acting like he's Tom Terrific and he's not. Sorry, he's just NOT. He's doing very, very well right now but he's got to prove he can consistently win the big games and help get the Broncos to the playoffs before he gets an extension.

As for Tebow, we don't really know how good he's gonna be. With Orton, we know what we've got and while he's much improved, I wouldn't dump a boat load of cash on him until he proves his meddle in crunch time...

But, I think we saw enough last year and this year to know he's definitely capable of winning when guys are playing well around him. That sounds simple, but MOST QBs are not.

He's carrying the team, offensively right now. He also seems to have some nice qualities of leadership and a winning touch.

To me, you extend him... and your worst case scenario at QB over the next 5 years is that you have a pretty good QB. That's a nice insurance policy for a franchise.

boppool
10-04-2010, 03:45 PM
Let's see how Orton plays the ENTIRE year before we even think about extending him. Now peeps here are acting like he's Tom Terrific and he's not. Sorry, he's just NOT. He's doing very, very well right now but he's got to prove he can consistently win the big games and help get the Broncos to the playoffs before he gets an extension.

As for Tebow, we don't really know how good he's gonna be. With Orton, we know what we've got and while he's much improved, I wouldn't dump a boat load of cash on him until he proves his meddle in crunch time...

Well, Orton did play entire season last year. This year, he looks a lot more comfortable this offense and it shows. This is a young team with a bright future. Right now, I rather have stability over potential.

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 03:46 PM
But, I think we saw enough last year and this year to know he's definitely capable of winning when guys are playing well around him. That sounds simple, but MOST QBs are not.

He's carrying the team, offensively right now. He also seems to have some nice qualities of leadership and a winning touch.

To me, you extend him... and your worst case scenario at QB over the next 5 years is that you have a pretty good QB. That's a nice insurance policy for a franchise.

I disagree. He's still inconsistent on his throws. He threw one INT and he could have easily thrown another but the DB dropped the pass, it was an easy pick six. Sorry, those types of throws are gonna kill the team on down the road.

The WRs are playing FANTASTIC and they are catching Orton's crappy throws, so give them props.

People here just need to chill out and let the season ride...

Dedhed
10-04-2010, 03:46 PM
But, I think we saw enough last year and this year to know he's definitely capable of winning when guys are playing well around him. That sounds simple, but MOST QBs are not.

He's carrying the team, offensively right now. He also seems to have some nice qualities of leadership and a winning touch.

To me, you extend him... and your worst case scenario at QB over the next 5 years is that you have a pretty good QB. That's a nice insurance policy for a franchise.

He hasn't proven he can stay healthy. Makes no sense to resign him now.

The actual worse case scenario is that you extend him now, he gets injured again, Tebow beats him out, the salary cap is reinstated, and you're stuck paying out a 5 year starting QB's contract to your backup.

Dedhed
10-04-2010, 03:47 PM
The WRs are playing FANTASTIC and they are catching Orton's crappy throws, so give them props.
....and this is moronic.

WolfpackGuy
10-04-2010, 03:48 PM
Let it ride.

No sense in signing him to a potentially albatross of a contract now.

I'm sure the Faid will come knocking with Javon Walker money soon.

Rock Chalk
10-04-2010, 03:50 PM
I disagree. He's still inconsistent on his throws. He threw one INT and he could have easily thrown another but the DB dropped the pass, it was an easy pick six. Sorry, those types of throws are gonna kill the team on down the road.

The WRs are playing FANTASTIC and they are catching Orton's crappy throws, so give them props.

People here just need to chill out and let the season ride...

Man you are a complete ****ing douche.

Orton has crappy throws, same as every other QB in the league, but he has more great throws than crappy ones and WRs are not "bailing" him out anymore than any other teams WRs.

****ing dumb ****.

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 03:52 PM
....and this is moronic.

Are you watching the games? How come Lloyd looks so fuggin great? It's because he has to be a freak to pull in some of Orton's inaccurate throws.

How's the redzone scoring again? Not good...

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 03:54 PM
Man you are a complete ****ing douche.

Orton has crappy throws, same as every other QB in the league, but he has more great throws than crappy ones and WRs are not "bailing" him out anymore than any other teams WRs.

****ing dumb ****.

He's not worth a big extension, not now. I'll wait until the season is over before I say he's worth a multi million dollar extension. What is so unreasonable about that?

I was a big on Orton when many here wanted to throw him under the bus. I still love the guy but he still makes head scratching throws. Much of the blame for this falls on the bad running game but still...

Rock Chalk
10-04-2010, 03:55 PM
Are you watching the games? How come Lloyd looks so fuggin great? It's because he has to be a freak to pull in some of Orton's inaccurate throws.

How's the redzone scoring again? Not good...

Hows that running game again? Oh yeah non-****ing-existant. Thats the red zone issue you dumb ****.

Im so sick of you panty waste pussies on this board. Its ****ing ridiculous this year. Anything you can say to bash the QB who is breaking NFL ****ing records, its old, tired and disgraceful.

Its like you want the team to ****ing fail and its disgusting.

Get the **** out of here and go root for the Foreskins or Cubs.

SouthStndJunkie
10-04-2010, 03:55 PM
No need to extend his deal....he is locked up this year and next.

Let's see how things play out for the next year or two.

It's not like he is going to walk if Denver wants to keep him.

Champagne Powder
10-04-2010, 03:59 PM
Broncos should offer:

8 years, $120 million, $70 million guaranteed

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 04:00 PM
Hows that running game again? Oh yeah non-****ing-existant. Thats the red zone issue you dumb ****.

Im so sick of you panty waste pussies on this board. Its ****ing ridiculous this year. Anything you can say to bash the QB who is breaking NFL ****ing records, its old, tired and disgraceful.

Its like you want the team to ****ing fail and its disgusting.

Get the **** out of here and go root for the Foreskins or Cubs.

LOL

Yah, saying that Orton does not deserve a multi-million dollar/multi year contract is unreasonable because we are 4 games into his second season, whatever...

boppool
10-04-2010, 04:00 PM
The actual worse case scenario is that you extend him now, he gets injured again, Tebow beats him out, the salary cap is reinstated, and you're stuck paying out a 5 year starting QB's contract to your backup.

Tebow hasn't beat out Quinn, yet. Not gonna happen this year, especially when he doesn't even play. McD's message is clear, Tebow is a long-term project as a passer, not as a dual threat.

UberBroncoMan
10-04-2010, 04:00 PM
I'm down. Bird in the hand.

If Tebow develops... great! We'll have the "problem" of two QBs who can run our system well.

Until then, it's apparent that Orton is our best option behind center. He's also still fairly young. Lock him up now, and you get (likely) his best 4-5 years of his career.

If Tebow can be as accurate as Orton and run the offense to its fullest then Orton is gone.

Simple reason. Tebow has a mobility Orton will never come close to. It's not like we'd be replacing Orton with someone who has no leadership skills either.

Luckily Tebow is only 23 this season. That means he could be starting at 26, and still have all the athleticism he has now. On top of that, due to lack of hits, and ware (which he had been getting in college) he should be in the best shape of his athletic life both physically and mentally.

Tebow being our QBOTF all comes down to if he can mentally run the offense as good as Orton...and let's face it. Orton is only in his second year, so he'll be getting better.

We may be trading Orton for two 1st round picks. I'm curious what will become of Tebow if McDaniels see's Orton develop into a Franchise Brady/Manning/Brees type QB for us.

Do we pull a San Diego?

bombay
10-04-2010, 04:03 PM
Orton's numbers: 5,221 yards, 27 TDs, 15 interceptions, 7.29 yards per attempt, 89.1 passer rating.

Cutler's numbers: 4,578 yards, 33 TDs, 29 interceptions, 6.97 yards per attempt, 80.7 passer rating.


http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/10/cutler-vs-orton-which-team-got-the-better-qb-in-deal.html

Archer81
10-04-2010, 04:08 PM
Orton's numbers: 5,221 yards, 27 TDs, 15 interceptions, 7.29 yards per attempt, 89.1 passer rating.

Cutler's numbers: 4,578 yards, 33 TDs, 29 interceptions, 6.97 yards per attempt, 80.7 passer rating.


http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/10/cutler-vs-orton-which-team-got-the-better-qb-in-deal.html


So your sayin...that Orton is like a 9 or something, and Cutler like a 6?


:Broncos:

Archer81
10-04-2010, 04:09 PM
Tebow hasn't beat out Quinn, yet. Not gonna happen this year, especially when he doesn't even play. McD's message is clear, Tebow is a long-term project as a passer, not as a dual threat.


He was number 2 vs Tennesee. I dont think the 2nd QB thing is set in stone.


:Broncos:

boppool
10-04-2010, 04:11 PM
Do we pull a San Diego?

As crazy as it might sound, San Diego made the right choice. They already had Rivers ready to go. (I'm not suggesting Rivers is better than Brees, because Brees>>>>Rivers) They had to play Rivers and Brees would not even
start for Chuggers.

Interestingly enough, Orton replaced Brees at Purdue...

BroncosSR
10-04-2010, 04:13 PM
Not sure I agree. While I agree that Orton is definitely thriving, what's to say Tebow or Quinn (less likely, but you never know) couldn't thrive too and also be mobile! Also, let's face it, Orton isn't exactly accurate. You have to give it to our receivers who often times have to haul some passes that are behind or short. He sure doesn't make it easy sometimes. I'd like to think someone can thrive while being more accurate and can move when needed... But I still give my hat off to Orton for what he's done so far...

Dedhed
10-04-2010, 04:13 PM
Tebow hasn't beat out Quinn, yet. Not gonna happen this year, especially when he doesn't even play. McD's message is clear, Tebow is a long-term project as a passer, not as a dual threat.
That means nothing in terms of the argument, and has nothing to do with what I said.

Tebow's a rookie. I think we'll know a great deal more about him by the end of 2011, and we can talk about extending Orton then

TheElusiveKyleOrton
10-04-2010, 04:29 PM
Let's see how Orton plays the ENTIRE year before we even think about extending him. Now peeps here are acting like he's Tom Terrific and he's not. Sorry, he's just NOT. He's doing very, very well right now but he's got to prove he can consistently win the big games and help get the Broncos to the playoffs before he gets an extension.

As for Tebow, we don't really know how good he's gonna be. With Orton, we know what we've got and while he's much improved, I wouldn't dump a boat load of cash on him until he proves he can win in crunch time...

We also don't know how BAD he's going to be.

We know what we've got with Orton... which is a quarterback who doesn't have a turnover problem and can put the team on his back and win a game when his team needs him to do it.

He won in crunch time this weekend. But you're fine with dumping a boatload of cash on an unproven Tebow who hasn't done ANYTHING because "we know what we've got" in Orton.

What the **** ever, man.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
10-04-2010, 04:30 PM
That means nothing in terms of the argument, and has nothing to do with what I said.

Tebow's a rookie. I think we'll know a great deal more about him by the end of 2011, and we can talk about extending Orton then

And if Orton continues to develop? If he continues to put up monster numbers? Think he'll be LESS expensive?

WolfpackGuy
10-04-2010, 04:33 PM
Classic case of "Is it the system or is it the player?"

TheElusiveKyleOrton
10-04-2010, 04:36 PM
Classic case of "Is it the system or is it the player?"

If the player is remaining in the system, does it matter?

Popps
10-04-2010, 04:39 PM
If Tebow can be as accurate as Orton and run the offense to its fullest then Orton is gone.

But, that's to be seen. It sure isn't going to happen this year.


We may be trading Orton for two 1st round picks. I'm curious what will become of Tebow if McDaniels see's Orton develop into a Franchise Brady/Manning/Brees type QB for us.

Do we pull a San Diego?

McDaniels can't possibly be thinking anything else, at this point. (Orton is a franchise QB.)

We'll see how the season plays out, but it's clear that Kyle is in the driver's seat for as long as he keeps playing like this.

Dedhed
10-04-2010, 04:41 PM
And if Orton continues to develop? If he continues to put up monster numbers? Think he'll be LESS expensive?

No, but it won't make much difference in the value of his contract, and I would much rather pay him a few extra million by waiting until 2012 than paying a backup a starter's salary.

Plus we have no idea about the collective bargaining, for all we know, it is possible that there will be constraints put in place that would make him less expensive.

WolfpackGuy
10-04-2010, 04:51 PM
If the player is remaining in the system, does it matter?

Not at all if he stays at a reasonable price.

If at contract time he wants a boatload of cash, I think the Broncos let him walk.

WABronco
10-04-2010, 04:52 PM
He's not underpaid, and he's under contract after this year. It's not necessary, sorry. They'll have no trouble putting together a bigger deal later if it's needed.

I remember some good prior EXTEND HIM threads. Darrell Jackson, after week 1 against Oakland a few years ago, was epic. Javon Walker, etc. I'm sure there's more.

ColoradoDarin
10-04-2010, 05:01 PM
I'll wait until the off season for it, we already worked out a one year extension. I'd rather focus on Champ right now, he's on the last year of his deal.

extralife
10-04-2010, 05:20 PM
I don't want to **** on the parade, but Orton's third down and red zone numbers aren't great. That tells me his other stats will come back down to earth at some point. It also tells me that even if they don't he's not winning more than eight games for us this year. I've been impressed with Orton, but this place is going overboard.

Pony Boy
10-04-2010, 05:26 PM
No......Extend = season ending injury....... been there done that

Rigs11
10-04-2010, 05:28 PM
Gotta love the tired arguments. Last year he was good because of Marshall, when Marshall left he was supposed to suck. Now it's the new receivers bailing him out. He couldn't throw more than 5 yards and now that he does it's yac. Last year he couldn't scramble, this year he scrambles but not like Vick.Orton could win a sb, and not get credit from the clowns around here.

WolfpackGuy
10-04-2010, 05:35 PM
The true test will come this week against the Ravens.

The lack of running game and them pinning their ears back just gives me a bad feeling.

Que
10-04-2010, 05:37 PM
Right now I'm cool with a 3-4 year apprenticeship for Tebow... a la Rogers.

Tombstone RJ
10-04-2010, 06:38 PM
I love Orton, I think he's exactly what the Broncos need at QB right now. That being said, Broncos front office is much better off waiting until after this season has come to an end. Enjoy Orton now, look and see how he does over an entire season, and then come back at the end of the year and make a decision as to what direction this team is gonna take.

broncosteven
10-04-2010, 06:46 PM
You guys should listen to mCd's Monday presser.

mCd covered why they brought Tebow in.

I am begining to doubt we see Tebow again this year. I am still confused why they waste a pick that high on him just to improve depth but in some weird way I get what he is trying to do.

SoCalBronco
10-04-2010, 06:55 PM
I appreciate his contributions and his growth as a QB under McDaniels. But Tebow wasn't drafted for no reason and he possesses tremendous physical gifts that Kyle doesn't have. He also has a killer work ethic. What excites me the most is that McDaniels has obviously proven he is an ELITE QB guru. Orton and Cassel were below average guys before they worked with Josh and Cassel looked real decent afterwards and Orton is looking even better than "real decent", so it would naturally follow that if you give Josh a guy with big time skill (and a big time work ethic), the potential is out of this world. We've already given Orton a one year extension. I'd rather not get into a situation where we have a youngster who actually turns into a monster, but we're in a difficult spot because we already gave the starter a large extension. There's no need to take unnecessary actions at this point. Let's wait and see what he can do with Tebow. If he's not where Josh thinks he should be a year to a year and a half from now, nothing would prevent the team from giving Orton an extension at that time (and barring an agreement, we could probably franchise him for another year).

We need to just stay put on this.

elsid13
10-04-2010, 06:58 PM
I appreciate his contributions and his growth as a QB under McDaniels. But Tebow wasn't drafted for no reason and he possesses tremendous physical gifts that Kyle doesn't have. He also has a killer work ethic. What excites me the most is that McDaniels has obviously proven he is an ELITE QB guru. Orton and Cassel were below average guys before they worked with Josh and Cassel looked real decent afterwards and Orton is looking even better than "real decent", so it would naturally follow that if you give Josh a guy with big time skill (and a big time work ethic), the potential is out of this world. We've already given Orton a one year extension. I'd rather not get into a situation where we have a youngster who actually turns into a monster, but we're in a difficult spot because we already gave the starter a large extension. There's no need to take unnecessary actions at this point. Let's wait and see what he can do with Tebow. If he's not where Josh thinks he should be a year to a year and a half from now, nothing would prevent the team from giving Orton an extension at that time (and barring an agreement, we could probably franchise him for another year).

We need to just stay put on this.


Come on Socal, this is the mane. We gave theDave a three year extension and all he did was steal Spider's naked Bea Arthur photos.

Drek
10-04-2010, 07:12 PM
You guys should listen to mCd's Monday presser.

mCd covered why they brought Tebow in.

I am begining to doubt we see Tebow again this year. I am still confused why they waste a pick that high on him just to improve depth but in some weird way I get what he is trying to do.

The NFL is all about competitive depth.

What are our strongest units?

QB - Orton with Quinn and Tebow as competitive depth.

WR - A position everyone thought would suck this year now looks great thanks to depth and competition.

OLB - Ayers and Hunter are stepping up after losing Doom because we rolled a good bit of competition in for 'em.

Its all about making guys rise to the occasion. It isn't pushing starters or anything inane like that, its putting layers of talent at every spot and letting the hardest workers win the starting jobs.

broncosteven
10-04-2010, 07:34 PM
The NFL is all about competitive depth.

What are our strongest units?

QB - Orton with Quinn and Tebow as competitive depth.

WR - A position everyone thought would suck this year now looks great thanks to depth and competition.

OLB - Ayers and Hunter are stepping up after losing Doom because we rolled a good bit of competition in for 'em.

Its all about making guys rise to the occasion. It isn't pushing starters or anything inane like that, its putting layers of talent at every spot and letting the hardest workers win the starting jobs.

That's kinda what mCd said in the presser.

baja
10-04-2010, 07:44 PM
I appreciate his contributions and his growth as a QB under McDaniels. But Tebow wasn't drafted for no reason and he possesses tremendous physical gifts that Kyle doesn't have. He also has a killer work ethic. What excites me the most is that McDaniels has obviously proven he is an ELITE QB guru. Orton and Cassel were below average guys before they worked with Josh and Cassel looked real decent afterwards and Orton is looking even better than "real decent", so it would naturally follow that if you give Josh a guy with big time skill (and a big time work ethic), the potential is out of this world. We've already given Orton a one year extension. I'd rather not get into a situation where we have a youngster who actually turns into a monster, but we're in a difficult spot because we already gave the starter a large extension. There's no need to take unnecessary actions at this point. Let's wait and see what he can do with Tebow. If he's not where Josh thinks he should be a year to a year and a half from now, nothing would prevent the team from giving Orton an extension at that time (and barring an agreement, we could probably franchise him for another year).

We need to just stay put on this.

Did you read about your boy Jay hiding out in the girls locker room last night?

SoCalBronco
10-04-2010, 07:48 PM
Did you read about your boy Jay hiding out in the girls locker room last night?

No. I believe he had a concussion. I haven't heard anything from anyone credible to suggest otherwise. How is that relevant to this thread, anyway?

Durango
10-04-2010, 07:54 PM
....and this is moronic.

Not really. The WR's have made some unbelievable grabs this year and even played defensive back at times to knock down errant Orton passes. That being said, Orton is still playing far above his original billing.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
10-04-2010, 07:56 PM
I don't want to **** on the parade, but Orton's third down and red zone numbers aren't great. That tells me his other stats will come back down to earth at some point. It also tells me that even if they don't he's not winning more than eight games for us this year. I've been impressed with Orton, but this place is going overboard.

it tells you his other numbers will come back down to earth, but it doesn't hint that those might improve, huh?

Nah, you don't have an agenda.

baja
10-04-2010, 07:56 PM
No. I believe he had a concussion. I haven't heard anything from anyone credible to suggest otherwise. How is that relevant to this thread, anyway?

Well you won't post in the relevant one.

Lev Vyvanse
10-04-2010, 07:57 PM
The WRs are playing FANTASTIC and they are catching Orton's crappy throws, so give them props.

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SoCalBronco
10-04-2010, 08:00 PM
Well you won't post in the relevant one.

How can I comment on something I didn't see?

From what you guys told me, he had a bad night irrespective of the protection issues...well, that happens sometimes, especially to gunslingers. Even if true, so what? He finally had a bad game...so what? He's having a very good year and his team is 3-1. It's unfortunate that he apparently played poorly yesterday and its even more unfortunate that his OL hung him out to dry. That sucks, but next week is another game and overall, he's doing swell, so I'm glad to see that.

WABronco
10-04-2010, 08:02 PM
Hahahaha Lev pretty much.

I've seen some pretty retarded **** recently. From "Royal not being the player I'd hoped he'd be" to "Orton is being bailed out by WR's with his ****ty throws." Good times.

extralife
10-04-2010, 08:03 PM
it tells you his other numbers will come back down to earth, but it doesn't hint that those might improve, huh?

Nah, you don't have an agenda.

Third down and red zone are the difficult places to gain yards and be successful. That makes them better barometers of a QB's performance than just about anything else. I'm sure we have plenty of people that can tell you all about that, as they latched on to those in regards to Cutler in '08. Right now, Orton isn't that great in those situations. That tells me he, I dunno, <i>probably</i> isn't the kind of QB that is going to throw for 5500 yards. I'm also pretty sure it's just about impossible to hit those numbers and throw for 25 TDs, which is the pace Orton is on right now. Something has to give--if you think Orton is going to break every NFL record known to man, you can go ahead and do that. I'll use my brain and figure we're in for a correction. If we can't run, and if we can't get the ball in the end zone when the field is short, the results of that correction could well sink our season.

baja
10-04-2010, 08:07 PM
How can I comment on something I didn't see?

From what you guys told me, he had a bad night irrespective of the protection issues...well, that happens sometimes, especially to gunslingers. Even if true, so what? He finally had a bad game...so what? He's having a very good year and his team is 3-1. It's unfortunate that he apparently played poorly yesterday and its even more unfortunate that his OL hung him out to dry. That sucks, but next week is another game and overall, he's doing swell, so I'm glad to see that.

Dude you are just no fun to tease.

Here have a turkey sandwich;


http://blogs.delawareonline.com/secondhelpings/files/2009/11/turkey-sandwich.jpg

Drek
10-04-2010, 08:12 PM
Third down and red zone are the difficult places to gain yards and be successful. That makes them better barometers of a QB's performance than just about anything else. I'm sure we have plenty of people that can tell you all about that, as they latched on to those in regards to Cutler in '08. Right now, Orton isn't that great in those situations. That tells me he, I dunno, <i>probably</i> isn't the kind of QB that is going to throw for 5500 yards. I'm also pretty sure it's just about impossible to hit those numbers and throw for 25 TDs, which is the pace Orton is on right now. Something has to give--if you think Orton is going to break every NFL record known to man, you can go ahead and do that. I'll use my brain and figure we're in for a correction. If we can't run, and if we can't get the ball in the end zone when the field is short, the results of that correction could well sink our season.

I personally see a balance of each side of the spectrum. Orton will not continue to throw for 400 yards a game, but he also will not continue to struggle so mightily on 3rd downs and in the red zone. Both will balance out. The key is that when the passing game balances out the running game needs to step up and help pick up some yardage production.

SoCalBronco
10-04-2010, 08:13 PM
Dude you are just no fun to tease.

Here have a turkey sandwich;


http://blogs.delawareonline.com/secondhelpings/files/2009/11/turkey-sandwich.jpg

I'm hoping one of these days Taco can get us a turkey sandwich smilie.....and also a light rail smilie, too.

baja
10-04-2010, 08:19 PM
That would be good ;D

KipCorrington25
10-04-2010, 08:27 PM
It's four games in and he's signed through next year, sure let's give him a Todd Helton or Kenyon Martin contract, brilliant.

SoCalBronco
10-04-2010, 08:29 PM
Come on Socal, this is the mane. We gave theDave a three year extension and all he did was steal Spider's naked Bea Arthur photos.

I'm still kinda miffed that TheDave left us for that gay teen forum.

KevinJames
10-04-2010, 08:35 PM
No need to extend him, if he gets us into the playoffs and proves he can win playoff games within the next year or two than yes extend him but if his contract is up and we haven't been to the playoffs go with Tebow.

ZONA
10-04-2010, 08:41 PM
You don't extend him for 1 year and then 4 weeks later extend him 4 more years. Dumbest thing ever. Let him play out the year. You got him playing well, he's not going anywhere, and you got Tebow learning. This should not even be a disucssion right now. A few guys here are getting a boner because Orton has played a good 4 game stretch. Nothing wrong with just letting him play the entire year and then looking at all of this next off season. So shut it and just enjoy watching for now. Quit trying to play GM after week 4.

baja
10-04-2010, 08:48 PM
Orton is playing great and he is smart, smart enough to know his success has a lot to do with the system he is in and the coaching he receives. He will be good to Denver even if he leaves we will get first for him and maybe more.

elsid13
10-05-2010, 01:50 AM
I'm still kinda miffed that TheDave left us for that gay teen forum.

Well you need to allow Spider to post more pics of himself in the golden thong....

footstepsfrom#27
10-05-2010, 02:43 AM
It isn't going to take Tebow 3 years, and he's not going to want to sit longer than he needs to. I'm betting Tebow is the starter in 2012 at the latest. Orton is playing great in this system but he's not capable of making plays on his own like Tebow when things break down, and ultimately that's what will put Tebow on the field in 2012.

The Joker
10-05-2010, 03:19 AM
It's pretty simple stuff.

In Orton we have a good QB. He'll never be an elite QB, but he's the kind of guy who won't lose you games on his own and he'll give you a chance in most games.

Tebow could be one of the all time greats or a complete flame out. It's hard to say at this point, but with a QB coach like McD he's got as good a chance as he could ask for.

In two years time, we'll know what we have in Tebow. If he puts it together and McD thinks he can thrive in this system, we tag and trade Orton to the highest bidder and move forward with TT and use the picks to improve the rest of the team. If he doesn't make the adjustments necessary to succeed in the pros, we sign Orton to an extension and we move forward with him still as our more than competent QB.

This is what will happen, any other discussion on the matter is superfluous.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
10-05-2010, 05:47 AM
Third down and red zone are the difficult places to gain yards and be successful. That makes them better barometers of a QB's performance than just about anything else. I'm sure we have plenty of people that can tell you all about that, as they latched on to those in regards to Cutler in '08. Right now, Orton isn't that great in those situations. That tells me he, I dunno, <i>probably</i> isn't the kind of QB that is going to throw for 5500 yards. I'm also pretty sure it's just about impossible to hit those numbers and throw for 25 TDs, which is the pace Orton is on right now. Something has to give--if you think Orton is going to break every NFL record known to man, you can go ahead and do that. I'll use my brain and figure we're in for a correction. If we can't run, and if we can't get the ball in the end zone when the field is short, the results of that correction could well sink our season.

Fair enough. Using my brain -- that's the mushy thing between my ears, right? -- I think the numbers will begin to normalize. I just think that while his yards per game will probably decrease, as we try new things and as we get our running game going (which I still think will happen once we have a healthy line and a healthy Moreno), that red zone efficiency will improve.

I'm one of those guys that thinks you're never as good as your best game, never as bad as your worst. Orton was downright dynamic on third down against Seattle. He was awful on third against the Colts. The truth lies somewhere in the middle.

Dedhed
10-05-2010, 07:33 PM
Not really. The WR's have made some unbelievable grabs this year and even played defensive back at times to knock down errant Orton passes.
Yeah, that doesn't happen anywhere else in the league, and judging by the number of WR highlights you see of Broncos on ESPN, it would seem highlight reel catches happen far more often in other places.

The WRs are playing great, but to say they're covering up for Orton being lousy is absolutely moronic.

Rigs11
10-05-2010, 08:11 PM
Yeah, that doesn't happen anywhere else in the league, and judging by the number of WR highlights you see of Broncos on ESPN, it would seem highlight reel catches happen far more often in other places.

The WRs are playing great, but to say they're covering up for Orton being lousy is absolutely moronic.

It's gettin so silly around here. The best one was the post last year where someone said that orton should not get any credit for a pass because the opposing teams cornerback failed to cover the wide receiver he threw to, hence it was easy for orton.

Durango
10-05-2010, 09:48 PM
Yeah, that doesn't happen anywhere else in the league, and judging by the number of WR highlights you see of Broncos on ESPN, it would seem highlight reel catches happen far more often in other places.

The WRs are playing great, but to say they're covering up for Orton being lousy is absolutely moronic.

He's easily playing at the highest level of his career, but some people are making him out to be some kind of second coming, and he isn't. I've been a fan of this guy since the day he showed up amid the Cutler maelstrom and told a reporter he just wants to get familiar with the system and start winning games.

fontaine
10-06-2010, 02:59 AM
Orton started off pretty well last year and then played average down the stretch.

Let's wait to see how he does for the entire season before we start annointing him the chosen one.

broncosteven
10-06-2010, 08:36 AM
Orton started off pretty well last year and then played average down the stretch.

Let's wait to see how he does for the entire season before we start annointing him the chosen one.

He wasn't able to stay healthy either year.

Maybe he can go a full season this year without getting hurt bad enough that it affects him.

elsid13
10-06-2010, 01:56 PM
He wasn't able to stay healthy either year.

Maybe he can go a full season this year without getting hurt bad enough that it affects him.

Taking 6 sacks a game should ensure that he remains healthy this season. :approve:

BroncoMan4ever
10-06-2010, 02:22 PM
Alright, I must admit. I wasn't exactly excited when we got Orton as part of Cutler deal. I wanted a guy with a little more upside (say, talent). When we traded for Brady Quinn, I really wanted Quinn to win the job, so we could trade Orton for a D lineman.

Now, fast forward to week 4...

I really think it would take Tebow at least 3 years to be ready and Quinn proves to be a suitable back-up at best. You could argue that any willing QB could succeed in McDaniels' system (say, Matt Cassel), but Orton is really thriving in this system. Despite inconsistent protection and lack of running game, he's limiting his mistakes, putting this team on his back and kept the team in the game.

Orton is anti-Cutler. Not very exciting, he doesn't thread the needle between defenders or hit WRs in strides 40 yards down. But that's not our offense. I've accepted the fact that zone-blocking system is long gone and we'll rather try to hit underneath receiver for 6 yards gain, 5 plays in a row.



i understand what you are saying about limited skills with the guy. but he is really proving wrong the weak arm, poor accuracy, and not being able to fit the ball into tight windows thoughts that have followed him.

look at the 48 yard bomb that hit Lloyd in stride in the end zone against Indy.

he throws a nice deep ball, with plenty of zip and a lot of accuracy when he has the protection.

all in all i am with you and like i have said since the end of last season i would be happy with Orton here long term.