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View Full Version : Why are you so hard on Kyle Orton, Woody?


Bronco Rob
09-23-2010, 03:03 PM
Broncos have fallen off national radar


Jason from Massachusetts asks Woody how the Broncos are perceived throughout the country.
By Woody Paige
The Denver Post

Posted: 09/23/2010 01:00:00 AM MDT



I am a Broncos fan who lives near Boston. I listen to a lot of sports radio on my commute to work. This morning there was talk about the Laurence Maroney trade. The morning crew referred to the Broncos organization as a joke. They claim that Josh McDaniels likes anything that Bill Belichick ever got his hands on. They picked on Josh for wearing the hoodie, for signing Jarvis Green to guaranteed money and then cutting him, for moving up and drafting Tim Tebow and for (the Maroney) trade. They even went so far as to blast the organization for picking up Chad Jackson in 2008 at one point (although I don't believe that McDaniels was there yet). It made me sick to my stomach to listen to, as does most Patriots talk. But it got me thinking. Is this the perception of the Broncos organization across the country, and are those thoughts starting to creep into Denver? I like the direction that Josh is taking the team, but I think he just needs some time, which is often a luxury teams can't afford in the win-now NFL. What are your thoughts? — Jason, Haverhill, Mass



Jason: Doing the ESPN show "Around The Horn" every day, several other shows on ESPN and other networks regularly, and a dozen or so radio shows in various markets throughout the country every week, I think I get a sense of the national pulse. Few (almost none) of the commentators and NFL fans care about the Broncos.

Except for the signing of Tim Tebow, there's no interest in the Broncos beyond the Colorado border (and among those few scattered Broncos loyalists elsewhere). The Broncos rarely come up in the shows (or the preshow discussions). The Broncos are irrelevant. Most people who do bring up Josh McDaniels put him a class with the other failed Bill Belichick-schooled assistants.

People outside Florida laughed when McDaniels traded up to get Tebow. People scoffed when he traded away the Broncos' two most noteworthy players. But the worst thing in life is apathy, and the world is apathetic when it comes to the Broncos. They really haven't been on the national radar since the Super Bowl championships. Even the year the Broncos were in the AFC championship game again (2005), there weren't considered a threat to win the Super Bowl.

It's understandable. They're a .500 team and franchise since 2006. They don't often appear on national games. Kyle Orton is not considered much of a quarterback, and the only players really known are Champ Bailey, Brian Dawkins and Elvis Dumervil (because of his name and his sacks). You've got to win more than one division championship every 10 years. You've got to win at least an occasional playoff game to be in the discussion.

I actually had a dream recently that HBO couldn't get any team to do "Hard Knocks" next year, and the Jets said bring it on again. I know this: Josh McDaniels would never do "Hard Knocks," no matter how much attention the show brought to the Broncos. He's not that kind of guy or coach. The Broncos are not wide-open about what goes on inside the building.

Josh McDaniels will be a very good NFL head coach. It may take awhile — and will depend on the heads of the Broncos' state and their patience. I don't think owner Pat Bowlen and CEO Joe Ellis would ever act quickly to fire Josh. He'll likely get another two years, at the very minimum, especially with the presence of Tebow, and I would guess McDaniels will be here for years and ultimately will be successful.

They'll give the coach time to develop the quarterback, and they're willing to wait, unless, suddenly, all the season-ticket holders vanished, and that won't happen. People will say, well, Bowlen fired Wade Phillips after two years. Wade was holding the chair until Mike Shanahan wanted the job. (He had turned it down before it was given to Wade.)

Bowlen bought the team in 1984. He had Dan Reeves as coach through 1992. Shanahan was head coach here from 1995 to 2008. Those thinking McDaniels is going away are totally wrong. He'll be here after they are gone.



Why are you so hard on Kyle Orton, Woody? What you said in the last mailbag made you look like a lost high school kid. Orton did lead the NFL in Week 1 in completions over 20 yards. What does Orton have to do to start to win you over? — Andrew, Houston


Andrew: One of Orton's best friends recently asked me the same thing. Actually, he ordered me to. Pleasant fellow. I told him what I'll tell you. Orton needs to prove it over 16 games, not one, not two, not eight. He hasn't as a pro yet.

When he gets into a playoff game or a Pro Bowl as an NFL quarterback, then we'll talk. Let's see what he does in this four-game stretch before you and his friends declare Orton the No. 1 quarterback in the league. I wish I were a lost high school kid again. But I will never wish I lived in Houston.



As analysts try to evaluate the Broncos' 2009 draft class, I continue to see Knowshon Moreno lauded as a good pick. He's a starting back who last season rushed for fewer than 1,000 yards — and even more shameful, under 4 yards a carry. He's too slow to break long runs and too weak to run through linebackers or safeties. Can you tell me the last great back to carry for less than 4 yards through a season? Am I the only one that feels this way about Moreno? — Chris, Raleigh, N.C.


Chris: You are not alone in the wilderness. A lot of people who aren't in North Carolina agree with you. Knowshon continues to be a tentative runner who waits for a hole to open rather than getting into and through the hole. He hasn't had a long run yet (as a running back). He did have a 45-yard pass play on Sunday against the Seahawks. Oddly, enough, he just ran after catching the screen; he didn't stand around and think about running.

I charted every run Knowshon had last year, and, based on that, I'll tell you something you already knew with no research. A vast majority of his carries were for 0, 1 or 2 yards. I called him NoShow Moreno, NoGain Moreno. He has been hurt again but still hasn't shown a burst a speed, can't turn the corner and can't find the hole soon enough.

He won't be a bust, but he won't be a Pro Bowl back, which might, after all, make him a bust, since he was the No. 1 running back taken in the 2009 draft. However, frankly speaking, at the end of the day (as my former ESPN partner on "Dream Job," Stephen A. Smith would say), Moreno still has a chance.

Emmitt Smith, you may have heard of. He has the NFL record for all-time rushing yardage. In his rookie season, 1990, Emmitt rushed for 937 yards and had a 3.9-yard-per-carry average. He picked it up dramatically his second season. Moreno must, too.



http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_16148413



:afro:

Dagmar
09-23-2010, 03:07 PM
Woody is a moron. If I wasn't on my phone I'd quote any one of his long articles that he was paid a handsome wage to write that turned out to be completely wrong.

Rulon Velvet Jones
09-23-2010, 03:10 PM
Ahahahaha...The Pro Bowl, Woody? He needs to make the Pro Bowl to prove anything to you? Quite the measuring stick.

jhns
09-23-2010, 03:14 PM
I agree with you Woody and have said the same thing. Orton has always had a few good games. Consistency is his problem. Don't tell that to the people here though. He had a good game so now he is a top 5 QB! He led our offense to the bottom half of the league last year and proved that he is the future! Bronco fans don't care about winning anymore. Orton is a nice guy so you better just say he is the best QB ever and move on.

Steve Prefontaine
09-23-2010, 03:15 PM
Ahahahaha...The Pro Bowl, Woody? He needs to make the Pro Bowl to prove anything to you? Quite the measuring stick.

beat me to it. what fking moron.

Dagmar
09-23-2010, 03:18 PM
Guys, jhns ha made this his next 10 page project, think before acting!

BlaK-Argentina
09-23-2010, 03:19 PM
Ooh nooo the Broncos don't get air time on ESPN! That's soooo bad for us!

Yeah who the **** cares moron!

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-23-2010, 03:24 PM
Meh. Whatever.

Woody knows irrelevance, though. He hasn't been relevant since '96, when he pissed off the Jagwads enough to beat us in the playoffs.

jhns
09-23-2010, 03:25 PM
Guys, jhns ha made this his next 10 page project, think before acting!

I know you are looking forward to it but it won't happen unless the thread is still active tomorrow. I will only be here for another 30 minutes or so. Sorry to disappoint.

DarkHorse30
09-23-2010, 03:29 PM
Woody is a moron.

This.

Rasizer is the only Denver reporter worth paying attention to http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/rapid-reports/team/DEN
(since Schefter moved up)

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-23-2010, 03:34 PM
This.

Rasizer is the only Denver reporter worth paying attention to http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/rapid-reports/team/DEN
(since Schefter moved up)

Nice, didn't know about that guy, but those are some solid takes.

NOTE TO JOSINA: THIS IS HOW YOU TWEET EFFECTIVELY.

baja
09-23-2010, 03:37 PM
I think Woody doesn't even write the stuff he puts his mane to anymore. His style has changed.

broncocalijohn
09-23-2010, 03:43 PM
Some of the things Woody stated is completely correct and others are an opinion. We arent on the radar screen anymore and are losing the national tv more and more as we become irrelevant. I dont agree on him and Orton. If that is his measuring stick, he better feel the same way on Cutler because he has no winning record, no playoff games and a pro bowl based on Rivers getting screwed.

SoonerBronco
09-23-2010, 03:53 PM
Sorry but any thread with "hard on" and "woody" in the title that gets past profanity filters is alright with me!

jhns
09-23-2010, 03:55 PM
Some of the things Woody stated is completely correct and others are an opinion. We arent on the radar screen anymore and are losing the national tv more and more as we become irrelevant. I dont agree on him and Orton. If that is his measuring stick, he better feel the same way on Cutler because he has no winning record, no playoff games and a pro bowl based on Rivers getting screwed.

Why would it matter what his measuring stick for Cutler is? Also, why show that you don't know football? It is pretty clear that if someone didn't belong in that pro bowl, it was Favre.

Tombstone RJ
09-23-2010, 03:59 PM
Woody is just saying what I've been saying for years here on the OMane. Shanny lead the team into mediocrity which breads apathy in the fan base.

Anyhow, didn't someone post a link here that showed the Broncos national popularity, weren't the Broncos in the top 10?

Hogan11
09-23-2010, 04:04 PM
Ooh nooo the Broncos don't get air time on ESPN! That's soooo bad for us!

Yeah who the **** cares moron!

You'd be surprised at how many fans actually care about this and it's totally sad that they do.

Garcia Bronco
09-23-2010, 04:05 PM
They are on the news here all week. Get out of the ****hole that is the east coast and move to Wyoming. :)

Tombstone RJ
09-23-2010, 04:08 PM
Does anyone else notice the irony of this woodrow article? He claims the Broncos are not relevent outside of Colorado then answers questions from idiots in Boston and North Carolina and Houston... oh the humanity!

Bronco Rob
09-23-2010, 04:13 PM
Does anyone else notice the irony of this woodrow article? He claims the Broncos are not relevent outside of Colorado then answers questions from idiots in Boston and North Carolina and Houston... oh the humanity!


;)

Kaylore
09-23-2010, 04:17 PM
He's right about why we get no coverage. Yes, it's partly being in fly-over country, and yes, it's a lack of star power on the roster. Ultimately it's about winning and winning consistently. The teams that are in the hunt perennially are the ones that get the national coverage no matter what markets they are in. Whether it's big cities like New York or the small markets like Green Bay. If you win you get attention.

Hopefully we'll turn things around and begin to become a continued contender.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-23-2010, 04:21 PM
He's right about why we get no coverage. Yes, it's partly being in fly-over country, and yes, it's a lack of star power on the roster. Ultimately it's about winning and winning consistently. The teams that are in the hunt perennially are the ones that get the national coverage no matter what markets they are in. Whether it's big cities like New York or the small markets like Green Bay. If you win you get attention.

Hopefully we'll turn things around and begin to become a continued contender.

Exactly. Indianapolis ain't on the coast folks.

baja
09-23-2010, 04:27 PM
does anyone else notice the irony of this woodrow article? He claims the broncos are not relevent outside of colorado then answers questions from idiots in boston and north carolina and houston... Oh the humanity!


. Lol

rbackfactory80
09-23-2010, 04:33 PM
The point is its hard to be patient for Denver fans when we have waited a long time for some true action. Playing in games on Sundays that aren't considered important, and realistically having no chance at the beginning of the year to win the Lombardi for quite a while is hard. Yes this weeks game will be important but can you honestly say we have any chance to win the Superbowl. Is Orton capable of leading this team to a title?

Right now you have to scratch this year and if Tebow takes over next you cant expect him to be ready to win it all. If Orton stays in an we upgrade some key spots we could be a solid playoff team next year. If all goes well (IF) this team will be ready for prime-time around 2013.

colonelbeef
09-23-2010, 05:41 PM
Ooh nooo the Broncos don't get air time on ESPN! That's soooo bad for us!

Yeah who the **** cares moron!

Actually it matters a lot, the NFL is a business, and more time on air means larger revenues.

colonelbeef
09-23-2010, 05:43 PM
Denver was on nationally televised games a hell of a lot more when Shanahan was running the show, there is no arguing this fact.

Rulon Velvet Jones
09-23-2010, 05:47 PM
Actually it matters a lot, the NFL is a business, and more time on air means larger revenues.

TV time = revenues? Really? The Redskins have been putting out mediocre teams for years now and make more than most.

listopencil
09-23-2010, 06:01 PM
Woody, why does the Denver area media suck so much ass? Is it the altitude or do you guys just get high on the magic markers and White Out when you write?
listopencil, California

Chris
09-23-2010, 06:01 PM
Who wants to make WoodyPageSucksDicks.com

Tombstone RJ
09-23-2010, 06:37 PM
Who wants to make WoodyPageSucks*****.com

Or how about denversportswriterseat****.com...

McDman
09-23-2010, 08:06 PM
You'd be surprised at how many fans actually care about this and it's totally sad that they do.

Well, to be fair, not everyone here lives in or around Colorado. I know ESPN isn't the absolute best thing but it'd be nice for us east coast fans to get a little bit of news or film on tv. Everytime they analyze game film its the vikings, cowboys, jets, etc... it'd just be nice to get a little bit.

Rock Chalk
09-23-2010, 09:20 PM
The point is its hard to be patient for Denver fans when we have waited a long time for some true action. Playing in games on Sundays that aren't considered important, and realistically having no chance at the beginning of the year to win the Lombardi for quite a while is hard. Yes this weeks game will be important but can you honestly say we have any chance to win the Superbowl. Is Orton capable of leading this team to a title?

Right now you have to scratch this year and if Tebow takes over next you cant expect him to be ready to win it all. If Orton stays in an we upgrade some key spots we could be a solid playoff team next year. If all goes well (IF) this team will be ready for prime-time around 2013.

No, not this team. Look, our defense and special teams will prevent THIS team from winning the superbowl. It's not because Orton isn't good enough to win a superbowl, it's just that NO ONE is good enough to win a superbowl with the current team in Denver. Elway couldn't have done it either and it is a ridiculous notion to put the teams success solely on Orton when he can really only control one part of a 22 part team.

He can however, do his part to make this team successful and thus far has done so. It hasn't always been perfect, it usually isn't for even the legends (and let me clarify, I am not saying Orton is or will become a legend). IF Denver had a defense that could at least field something resembling a quality NFL defense and IF they had at least a moderate special teams, I DO think we have the guns on offense RIGHT NOW to make a serious run. The problem is that we DONT have the even an above average defense and our special teams are going to cost us at LEAST 2 games this year.

For all his greatness, Manning has only won one superbowl and in large part to the pure awesomeness that was Bob Sanders in that playoff run. Manning's stats that year were no where near his top 5 statistical years, but they managed to win it all with sound defense, a great offense, and above average special teams (oh and a little help from the refs). Point is, no matter how great the QB is, it takes a FULL TEAM to win it all.

Rock Chalk
09-23-2010, 09:40 PM
Actually it matters a lot, the NFL is a business, and more time on air means larger revenues.

Try again douche nozzle. http://football.calsci.com/SalaryCap.html NFL TV Revenue is split equally between all teams. More air time for Team A does not mean larger revenues. Contracts are negotiated for years in advance so it doesnt matter who is on TV. Its why the networks fought to get flex scheduling because they wanted better ratings at the end of the year when "playoff hunt" teams were playing each other instead of watching playoff clinched teams backups play some scrub team that is fighting for the #1 spot in next years draft.

DivineLegion
09-23-2010, 10:06 PM
Try again douche nozzle. http://football.calsci.com/SalaryCap.html NFL TV Revenue is split equally between all teams. More air time for Team A does not mean larger revenues. Contracts are negotiated for years in advance so it doesnt matter who is on TV. Its why the networks fought to get flex scheduling because they wanted better ratings at the end of the year when "playoff hunt" teams were playing each other instead of watching playoff clinched teams backups play some scrub team that is fighting for the #1 spot in next years draft.

I have a feeling he's thinking more along the lines of more exposure equals more merchendise sales.

Popps
09-23-2010, 10:06 PM
Don't worry. When we start winning again, Woody will be all over it... acting as if he knew it all along.

Rock Chalk
09-23-2010, 10:10 PM
I have a feeling he's thinking more along the lines of more exposure equals more merchendise sales.

Again, shared revenue. Those Tebow jerseys everyone bought? 1/32nd of that went to the Denver Broncos. That's NFL licensed merchandise.

Bronco licensed merchandise makes far less money than NFL merchandise. And generally speaking that merchandise is almost exclusively bought by local fans in all markets. Dallas locals buy that Dallas Cowboy licensed merchandise and this is a FAR FAR smaller portion of revenue that a team makes. I'd guess that it is about 10% of "gate" sales for any given team in any given year. At roughly 2.5 million dollars per game per team, times 16 is 40 million, I'd be willing to bet that Team licensed merchandise accounts for about 4-6 million in annual sales.

Durango
09-23-2010, 11:21 PM
Jason: Doing the ESPN show "Around The Horn" every day, several other shows on ESPN and other networks regularly, and a dozen or so radio shows in various markets throughout the country every week, I think I get a sense of the national pulse. Few (almost none) of the commentators and NFL fans care about the Broncos.

Except for the signing of Tim Tebow, there's no interest in the Broncos beyond the Colorado border (and among those few scattered Broncos loyalists elsewhere).




Boy, I don't know about this. I talk with people all the time in Wyoming, Montana, Utah, even New Mexico, and a little surprisingly, Arizona, who talk about the Broncos all the time and want to know anything they can find about them. Granted, these aren't the most populated states in the country, but there is considerable interest in the inter-mountain region and some of the southwest. Maybe Woody is listening to his east coast buddies a little too much.

snowspot66
09-23-2010, 11:37 PM
Boy, I don't know about this. I talk with people all the time in Wyoming, Montana, Utah, even New Mexico, and a little surprisingly, Arizona, who talk about the Broncos all the time and want to know anything they can find about them. Granted, these aren't the most populated states in the country, but there is considerable interest in the inter-mountain region and some of the southwest. Maybe Woody is listening to his east coast buddies a little too much.

Add Idaho and the Dakotas to that list. The Broncos have the largest home market area in the league. It's not a lot of people but it's a hell of a lot of space.

extralife
09-23-2010, 11:49 PM
Don't worry. When we start winning again, Woody will be all over it... acting as if he knew it all along.

He said in the article that he thinks we will win. I guess you probably don't read, though. I guess none of you do, since Woody didn't say any of the things you guys think he said.

broncocalijohn
09-24-2010, 12:37 AM
Why would it matter what his measuring stick for Cutler is? Also, why show that you don't know football? It is pretty clear that if someone didn't belong in that pro bowl, it was Favre.

oh i agree with that but after there was an alternate pick, it should have gone to Rivers but the players didnt like him personally to give him the nod over cutler. Stop getting all sadden with the mention of someone ripping your cutler boy down.

listopencil
09-24-2010, 12:38 AM
He said in the article that he thinks we will win. I guess you probably don't read, though. I guess none of you do, since Woody didn't say any of the things you guys think he said.


When he gets into a playoff game or a Pro Bowl as an NFL quarterback, then we'll talk

Woody's a lame-ass hack. Unfortunately, that doesn't make him stand out in the Denver media.

Blart
09-24-2010, 12:43 AM
Start Chris Simms

extralife
09-24-2010, 01:02 AM
Woody's a lame-ass hack. Unfortunately, that doesn't make him stand out in the Denver media.

This was the conclusion of the part where he said Orton must prove he can play as he currently is over the course of an entire season. If you don't agree with that sentiment, you're probably a bit of an idiot. Or should we think Cutler is one of the best QBs in the league, again? After all, he's been one of the best over the last two weeks!

But I guess we all need things to pop out at us so we can get mad. Rawr!

listopencil
09-24-2010, 01:23 AM
This was the conclusion of the part where he said Orton must prove he can play as he currently is over the course of an entire season. If you don't agree with that sentiment, you're probably a bit of an idiot. Or should we think Cutler is one of the best QBs in the league, again? After all, he's been one of the best over the last two weeks!

But I guess we all need things to pop out at us so we can get mad. Rawr!

Nah, that was an example of you talking out of your ass and me calling you on it, you condescending douche bag. That's why I used quotes. But don't let reality get in the way of having a good time.

extralife
09-24-2010, 03:06 AM
You may have missed the part where I said words directly applicable to your statement. I may have to ask you for official proof of baseline reading comprehension skills before engaging you again. Nothing personal.

yerner
09-24-2010, 05:26 AM
Nothing wrong with that article.

go_broncos
09-24-2010, 05:34 AM
I agree with the article.
Only in mane, i see a blind support for Mcd.
Some Posters here think that he is a hall of fame coach based on what he did in NE.
He is just an below average coach.
We will have great difficulty in reaching playoffs during his tenure.

tsiguy96
09-24-2010, 05:39 AM
I agree with the article.
Only in mane, i see a blind support for Mcd.
Some Posters here think that he is a hall of fame coach based on what he did in NE.
He is just an below average coach.
We will have great difficulty in reaching playoffs during his tenure.

you agree with the article, then in your very next 2 sentences you completely contradict what it said.

jhns
09-24-2010, 07:02 AM
oh i agree with that but after there was an alternate pick, it should have gone to Rivers but the players didnt like him personally to give him the nod over cutler. Stop getting all sadden with the mention of someone ripping your cutler boy down.

An alternate pick? Cutler was voted in as the second QB. I don't get what you are saying. Why would he get the nod as an alternate to go in over someone actually voted in? Alternates go in for those that can't play. If anyone shouldn't have been voted in originally, it would be Favre. Period. Cutler got a pro bowl that he deserved for having a good year on this team. Why are you such a Bronco hater? You can't even give credit to players that play well here?

Denver fans have gone full retard. "Orton is the greatest ever! I hope he is always our QB!"

LOL

Do you even listen to yourselves? It's Kyle Orton... The rest of the world gets it. It would be nice to get a coach that likes talent.

Rulon Velvet Jones
09-24-2010, 07:53 AM
An alternate pick? Cutler was voted in as the second QB. I don't get what you are saying. Why would he get the nod as an alternate to go in over someone actually voted in? Alternates go in for those that can't play. If anyone shouldn't have been voted in originally, it would be Favre. Period. Cutler got a pro bowl that he deserved for having a good year on this team. Why are you such a Bronco hater? You can't even give credit to players that play well here?

Denver fans have gone full retard. "Orton is the greatest ever! I hope he is always our QB!"

LOL

Do you even listen to yourselves? It's Kyle Orton... The rest of the world gets it. It would be nice to get a coach that likes talent.

Perhaps you should read more than just the Orangemane. Orton is getting plenty of national love.

jhns
09-24-2010, 08:09 AM
Perhaps you should read more than just the Orangemane. Orton is getting plenty of national love.

Sure, he had a great game. Lots of players are stars for a week or two at a time.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-24-2010, 08:11 AM
Sure, he had a great game. Lots of players are stars for a week or two at a time.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20090403/fbn-bears-cutler/images/7a413120-945c-46e9-b15a-8c4536d05c4e.jpg

Dagmar
09-24-2010, 08:16 AM
You guys managed to ignore him for a day. Jhns wins again.

jhns
09-24-2010, 08:24 AM
You guys managed to ignore him for a day. Jhns wins again.

Do you ever stop whining? Every single post.... Can you at least try making a football related post on this board once? The closest you get is: "Wahhhhh I thought he was blah blah blah according to the mane."

Actually I don't care if you post about football. It is just funny how much you cry and I wanted to laugh at it.

baja
09-24-2010, 08:41 AM
I agree with the article.
Only in mane, i see a blind support for Mcd.
Some Posters here think that he is a hall of fame coach based on what he did in NE.
<b>He is just an below average coach.
We will have great difficulty in reaching playoffs during his tenure.

Except that's not what he said

Hogan11
09-24-2010, 09:00 AM
Well, to be fair, not everyone here lives in or around Colorado. I know ESPN isn't the absolute best thing but it'd be nice for us east coast fans to get a little bit of news or film on tv. Everytime they analyze game film its the vikings, cowboys, jets, etc... it'd just be nice to get a little bit.

The internet makes Broncos coverage easily accessable and also makes the Entertainment Sports Network's usual starcleaning coverage largely irrelevent.

fontaine
09-24-2010, 09:01 AM
Just win again.

During our 6-0 run everyone was paying attention to Orton, McD and this team.

tsiguy96
09-24-2010, 09:13 AM
Just win again.

During our 6-0 run everyone was paying attention to Orton, McD and this team.

they were looking and waiting for the team to fail. regardless that they did, the media was just waiting to rip mcd when they could, and stilll do.

jhns
09-24-2010, 09:17 AM
they were looking and waiting for the team to fail.

Were they wrong?

worm
09-24-2010, 09:33 AM
they were looking and waiting for the team to fail. regardless that they did, the media was just waiting to rip mcd when they could, and stilll do.

Your persecution complex is unhealthy.

footstepsfrom#27
09-24-2010, 10:19 AM
I agree with the article.
Only in mane, i see a blind support for Mcd.
Some Posters here think that he is a hall of fame coach based on what he did in NE.
He is just an below average coach.
We will have great difficulty in reaching playoffs during his tenure.
Two logical falacies are in view here, the first you noted in referencing the foolishness of overrating McDaniels based on his Patriot days. The second I submit is your hasty analysis of his ability based on 18 games. How can anyone know at this point what he is? Jimmy Johnson started 1-15...

Flex Gunmetal
09-24-2010, 10:37 AM
Were they wrong?

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e369/Stefangs/2-63.gif

listopencil
09-24-2010, 02:36 PM
You may have missed the part where I said words directly applicable to your statement. I may have to ask you for official proof of baseline reading comprehension skills before engaging you again. Nothing personal.

I'll assume that this is in response to my post. You claimed in an earlier post that "none of us" read, in regards to this article. I quoted a section of Woody Paige's article that is directly relevant to a remark that a previous poster had made. Proving that you are "talking out of your ass". Put simply you are prone to making hysterical generalities and illogical expressions of falsehood designed specifically for dramatic effect. You either have no worthwhile concepts that you wish to communicate, or you lack the will/ability to do so. If you are having comprehension problems because you are not familiar with colloquialisms, then I can express this concept in a more simplified manner, using a standard limited vocabulary as befits your apparent lack of experience, intelligence and/or education. As I said, you are a condescending douche bag. Now feel free to go **** yourself.

Rock Chalk
09-24-2010, 02:49 PM
I'll assume that this is in response to my post. You claimed in an earlier post that "none of us" read, in regards to this article. I quoted a section of Woody Paige's article that is directly relevant to a remark that a previous poster had made. Proving that you are "talking out of your ass". Put simply you are prone to making hysterical generalities and illogical expressions of falsehood designed specifically for dramatic effect. You either have no worthwhile concepts that you wish to communicate, or you lack the will/ability to do so. If you are having comprehension problems because you are not familiar with colloquialisms, then I can express this concept in a more simplified manner, using a standard limited vocabulary as befits your apparent lack of experience, intelligence and/or education. As I said, you are a condescending douche bag. Now feel free to go **** yourself.

Brilliant!

Rock Chalk
09-24-2010, 02:50 PM
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e369/Stefangs/2-63.gif

Doubly Brilliant!

extralife
09-24-2010, 06:17 PM
I'll assume that this is in response to my post. You claimed in an earlier post that "none of us" read, in regards to this article. I quoted a section of Woody Paige's article that is directly relevant to a remark that a previous poster had made. Proving that you are "talking out of your ass". Put simply you are prone to making hysterical generalities and illogical expressions of falsehood designed specifically for dramatic effect. You either have no worthwhile concepts that you wish to communicate, or you lack the will/ability to do so. If you are having comprehension problems because you are not familiar with colloquialisms, then I can express this concept in a more simplified manner, using a standard limited vocabulary as befits your apparent lack of experience, intelligence and/or education. As I said, you are a condescending douche bag. Now feel free to go **** yourself.

I'm still pretty sure you can't read.

Woody wrote an article that is 90% measured praise of the Broncos. Within this article, he said he'd temper his enthusiasm for Kyle Orton until he managed to perform consistently for a season. OMane flips out and calls Woody a hack. OMane thinks Woody said he hated McD, despite saying he thinks McD is a great coach and will not be fired any time soon. OMane jumps on Woody's pro bowl comment, which came right after his statement that Kyle would have to play well for a season. OMane sets up a strawman regarding the irrelevance of the pro bowl. Hilariously, OMane brings up Jay Cutler as an example of a bad QB making it to the pro bowl (terrible example, anyway). OMane is sold on Orton after two games, but not sold on Cutler after two games!

All in all, OMane does not know how to read, how to argue, or how to not act like children.

I am quite amused by your attempts to sound intelligent, however. As if the complete misuse of a standard term like colloquialisms coupled with a massive redundancy such as "illogical expressions of falsehood" (what illogical expression is not a falsehood, Wittgenstein?) is going to impress me.

footstepsfrom#27
09-24-2010, 06:24 PM
All this BS is getting old...no?

listopencil
09-24-2010, 07:37 PM
I'm still pretty sure you can't read.

I'm still pretty sure you can't think.



Woody wrote an article that is 90% measured praise of the Broncos. Within this article, he said he'd temper his enthusiasm for Kyle Orton until he managed to perform consistently for a season.

Somewhat truthful, although this does not convey the tone present in Woody's article.

OMane flips out and calls Woody a hack.

That's your opinion. A vague generality, dramatically expressed.

OMane thinks Woody said he hated McD, despite saying he thinks McD is a great coach and will not be fired any time soon. OMane jumps on Woody's pro bowl comment, which game right after his statement that Kyle would have to play well for a season. OMane sets up a strawman regarding the irrelevance of the pro bowl. Hilariously, OMane brings up Jay Cutler as an example of a bad QB making it to the pro bowl (terrible example, anyway). OMane is sold on Orton after two games, but not sold on Cutler after two games!

All in all, OMane does not know how to read, how to argue, or how to not act like children.

Once again you lack the ability to express yourself in anything other than generalities, here you create a persona of the message board itself. Pathetic and telling.


I am quite amused by your attempts to sound intelligent, however. As if the complete misuse of a standard term like colloquialisms...

Unfortunately you can't seem to comprehend the written word. It's sad but I trust that your skills will improve with time. I would suggest that you use an online library or a similar source. I'll give you one example now to help you in your long journey ahead:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/colloquial

col·lo·qui·al
adj \kə-ˈlō-kwē-əl\
Definition of COLLOQUIAL
1
: of or relating to conversation : conversational
2
a : used in or characteristic of familiar and informal conversation; also : unacceptably informal b : using conversational style


...coupled a massive redundancy such as "illogical expressions of falsehood" (what illogical expression is not a falsehood, Wittgenstein?) is going to impress me.

I originally thought this must be a joke on your part. Truly no one could be this obtuse? In retrospect I'm going to correct you here as well, because you have certainly shown yourself to be fairly ignorant or at least incapable of lucid thought. A falsehood, logically expressed, can be easily forgiven as a mistake. In your case? I'm afraid there really is no hope for you. You are mired in an adolescent fascination with perceptions, both yours and those you come in contact with.

extralife
09-24-2010, 10:18 PM
I am so glad you have corrected me "in retrospect." For the life of me, I can't figure out what this might possibly mean. I suppose you'll come at me with "the library" in order to...well, prove nothing. Let's look at the term, yes? Retro: a Latin prefix essentially meaning "backwards;" Spect: a vision, or to look. Looking backwards, then. So you shall, in looking backwards, correct me? Apropos of what? This is literally nonsense. Linguistic detritus. You seem to have a knack for it!

Moving on.

A falsehood may be logically expressed. An illogical expression, however, is <i>always</i> false. Thus, redundancy. A redundancy buried in a sentence about logic, at that! A bit of <i>retrologica</i>, one might even say! Oh, the humor! For all this talk of logical propositions, one might even make the mistake of thinking I had even attempted a logical argument, which is clearly not the case! I understand it may be asking too much of you to understand the nature of the words you use, but it certainly wouldn't hurt to try.

Let's look at your usage of the term "colloquialism," while we're at it:

<i>"If you are having comprehension problems because you are not familiar with colloquialisms, then I can express this concept in a more simplified manner, using a standard limited vocabulary as befits your apparent lack of experience, intelligence and/or education. As I said, you are a condescending douche bag. Now feel free to go **** yourself."</i>

If I am "having problems" with your colloquial language--a language that up to this point is a quite painful affectation of high brow, and thus the <i>opposite</i> of colloquial--you will be so gracious as to present it in a "simplified manner" by calling me a "condescending douche bag." Thus, if I am unable to follow your muffled jargon, which you seem quite proud of, you will be willing to dumb it down to my "common" level.

A colloquialism, as you so helpfully pointed out with your online "library," is informal, local, or familiar, with a pejorative sense of amusingly inferior. Does this describe the tone you are hoping to present, or does it describe the opposite, and thus the terminology you ended your post with? Do you make a habit of using words as incorrectly as possible?

If, as I am and was assuming, you attempted to relate this term to your earlier use of "douchebag" or "talking out of your ass," then you might want to learn a thing or two about grammar.

<i>"You are mired in an adolescent fascination with perceptions"</i>

And what is the world if not a series of perceptions, my darling?

baja
09-25-2010, 12:25 AM
You both need to use bigger words and if it is a tie we will measure your dicks to determine the winner . ;D

extralife
09-25-2010, 12:27 AM
why are you so hardon, woody?

Rock Chalk
09-25-2010, 07:17 AM
I'm still pretty sure you can't read.

Woody wrote an article that is 90% measured praise of the Broncos. Within this article, he said he'd temper his enthusiasm for Kyle Orton until he managed to perform consistently for a season. OMane flips out and calls Woody a hack. OMane thinks Woody said he hated McD, despite saying he thinks McD is a great coach and will not be fired any time soon. OMane jumps on Woody's pro bowl comment, which came right after his statement that Kyle would have to play well for a season. OMane sets up a strawman regarding the irrelevance of the pro bowl. Hilariously, OMane brings up Jay Cutler as an example of a bad QB making it to the pro bowl (terrible example, anyway). OMane is sold on Orton after two games, but not sold on Cutler after two games!

No, the Pro-Bowl is not a measure of a good QB, just a popular one. Orton is never going to have the national appeal of Manning and Brady who happen to be in the same conference. He is unlikely to pass Rivers for national appeal either so even if Orton has a Pro-Bowl Season, he is unlikely to get the nod. Afterall he had a better year statistically than David Garrard last year but Garrard STILL made it over Orton after everyone else declined. And Cutler example as a QB going to the Pro Bowl was not a bad example because Cutler got in OVER Rivers in a year Rivers had a MUCH better year AND got his team to the playoffs.

All in all, OMane does not know how to read, how to argue, or how to not act like children.

No I think you are just an idiot that reads what YOU want to. But whatever.

I am quite amused by your attempts to sound intelligent, however. As if the complete misuse of a standard term like colloquialisms coupled with a massive redundancy such as "illogical expressions of falsehood" (what illogical expression is not a falsehood, Wittgenstein?) is going to impress me.
Illogical expressions are not necessarily falsehoods tard. Most things that come out of women's mouths are illogical expressions as they are incapable of using logic yet it may not be false. They (illogical expressions) do not have to be true or false statements, merely expressions that lack logic.

Gort
09-25-2010, 07:41 AM
Woody, why does the Denver area media suck so much ass? Is it the altitude or do you guys just get high on the magic markers and White Out when you write?
listopencil, California

Woody writes his columns in crayon and then an intern enters them into the computer for him.

true story.

Miss I.
09-25-2010, 08:20 AM
No, the Pro-Bowl is not a measure of a good QB, just a popular one. Orton is never going to have the national appeal of Manning and Brady who happen to be in the same conference. He is unlikely to pass Rivers for national appeal either so even if Orton has a Pro-Bowl Season, he is unlikely to get the nod. Afterall he had a better year statistically than David Garrard last year but Garrard STILL made it over Orton after everyone else declined. And Cutler example as a QB going to the Pro Bowl was not a bad example because Cutler got in OVER Rivers in a year Rivers had a MUCH better year AND got his team to the playoffs.

No I think you are just an idiot that reads what YOU want to. But whatever.

Illogical expressions are not necessarily falsehoods tard. Most things that come out of women's mouths are illogical expressions as they are incapable of using logic yet it may not be false. They (illogical expressions) do not have to be true or false statements, merely expressions that lack logic.

you know I was totally with you until that last part. asshat. ;D

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-25-2010, 08:42 AM
I'm still pretty sure you can't read.

Woody wrote an article that is 90% measured praise of the Broncos. Within this article, he said he'd temper his enthusiasm for Kyle Orton until he managed to perform consistently for a season. OMane flips out and calls Woody a hack. OMane thinks Woody said he hated McD, despite saying he thinks McD is a great coach and will not be fired any time soon. OMane jumps on Woody's pro bowl comment, which came right after his statement that Kyle would have to play well for a season. OMane sets up a strawman regarding the irrelevance of the pro bowl. Hilariously, OMane brings up Jay Cutler as an example of a bad QB making it to the pro bowl (terrible example, anyway). OMane is sold on Orton after two games, but not sold on Cutler after two games!

All in all, OMane does not know how to read, how to argue, or how to not act like children.

I am quite amused by your attempts to sound intelligent, however. As if the complete misuse of a standard term like colloquialisms coupled with a massive redundancy such as "illogical expressions of falsehood" (what illogical expression is not a falsehood, Wittgenstein?) is going to impress me.

Do you know where the door is?

Dedhed
09-25-2010, 09:00 AM
Denver was on nationally televised games a hell of a lot more when Shanahan was running the show, there is no arguing this fact.
Shananhan has far more to do with the current irrelevance of the Broncos than anyone else.

baja
09-25-2010, 10:22 AM
shananhan has far more to do with the current irrelevance of the broncos than anyone else.

to be fair he also had much to do with their years of national recognition.

Rock Chalk
09-25-2010, 10:40 AM
you know I was totally with you until that last part. asshat. ;D

I wrote it while my wife was standing behind me. She punched me and called me an asshole.

Good times.

Miss I.
09-25-2010, 10:43 AM
I wrote it while my wife was standing behind me. She punched me and called me an a-hole.

Good times.

other than poor choices in spouses, she sounds pretty awesome. Did she lose a bet? ;D

Tombstone RJ
09-25-2010, 11:36 AM
I'm still pretty sure you can't read.

Woody wrote an article that is 90% measured praise of the Broncos. Within this article, he said he'd temper his enthusiasm for Kyle Orton until he managed to perform consistently for a season. OMane flips out and calls Woody a hack. OMane thinks Woody said he hated McD, despite saying he thinks McD is a great coach and will not be fired any time soon. OMane jumps on Woody's pro bowl comment, which came right after his statement that Kyle would have to play well for a season. OMane sets up a strawman regarding the irrelevance of the pro bowl. Hilariously, OMane brings up Jay Cutler as an example of a bad QB making it to the pro bowl (terrible example, anyway). OMane is sold on Orton after two games, but not sold on Cutler after two games!

All in all, OMane does not know how to read, how to argue, or how to not act like children.

I am quite amused by your attempts to sound intelligent, however. As if the complete misuse of a standard term like colloquialisms coupled with a massive redundancy such as "illogical expressions of falsehood" (what illogical expression is not a falsehood, Wittgenstein?) is going to impress me.

:rofl:

too funny!