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View Full Version : What Pats fans are saying about the trade


baja
09-14-2010, 10:57 PM
...and it ain't pretty

http://www.patriotsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=57836&page=2

BlaK-Argentina
09-14-2010, 11:02 PM
At least we don't have to scream at our TVs anymore..."Run STRAIGHT, dumb ass!!!! Stop dancing!!! JESUS F*CKIN CHRIST, RUNNNNN!

LOL...

baja
09-14-2010, 11:04 PM
"Yeah, I was about to say even if the Pats only got back an old Elway jockstrap in the trade, they ended up the winners here."

The MVPlaya
09-14-2010, 11:05 PM
It's nice to see "fans" who support "their" team.

theAPAOps5
09-14-2010, 11:05 PM
Oh great now we have to RB's who think they are on dancing with the stars!

strafen
09-14-2010, 11:07 PM
Wow, they don't think highly of our team, do they.
We fleeced Denver, they're saying! Ha!

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-14-2010, 11:07 PM
Seems like a lot of people are worried about the newfound lack of depth at RB. But /shrug

I guess it's easier to point out the people that dislike Maroney, and not the guy who, on the same post in which he criticizes Maroney, defends Adalius Thomas.

That, to me, is laughable. Thomas, who was cut. Who really WASN'T worth anything to anyone.

Humor.

strafen
09-14-2010, 11:08 PM
"Yeah, I was about to say even if the Pats only got back an old Elway jockstrap in the trade, they ended up the winners here."

That was hilarious. :D

baja
09-14-2010, 11:09 PM
"Does he need a ride to the airport?"

This was the kindest post I found and it took 43 posts to get to it.

Archer81
09-14-2010, 11:09 PM
Wow, they don't think highly of our team, do they.
We fleeced Denver, they're saying! Ha!


We'll see. Fate being what it is, we wind up in the playoffs against NE and Maroney just goes off.

Fate can be funny that way.

:Broncos:

theAPAOps5
09-14-2010, 11:10 PM
"Does he need a ride to the airport?"

This was the kindest post I found and it took 43 posts to get to it.

Then you missed about 3 posts because there was some decent ones before that.

Broncos_OTM
09-14-2010, 11:13 PM
this is another fail move. Maroney is J.U.N.K. And the new scenery is not gonna help.

baja
09-14-2010, 11:15 PM
and there is this...

"We got some bonehead team to take his contract off our hands. The rest is gravy."

Popps
09-14-2010, 11:16 PM
Do you blame Pats fans for being upset? They spend a 1st round pick on him.

We spent a 4th. If he provides depth and shares some carries... we win.

If he has some kind of career turnaround a la Cedric Benson.... we win.

If he washes out and doesn't pan out to much for us, it's a 4th round pick. Not uncommon for fourth round picks.


New England took the risk already and lost. Our risk/reward ratio here is just fine.

Archer81
09-14-2010, 11:16 PM
this is another fail move. Maroney is J.U.N.K. And the new scenery is not gonna help.


Yeah...no history at all of players leaving one city only to have solid careers somewhere else.

Total fail on McD's part. I mean getting a back who already knows the offense, terminology and what is expected of him to be a backup.

Horrible trade...

:Broncos:

baja
09-14-2010, 11:20 PM
Let's just hope their posters are as uninformed as some of ours...

"Kept him long enough to rob Denver of a 4th rounder."

theAPAOps5
09-14-2010, 11:20 PM
Do you blame Pats fans for being upset? They spend a 1st round pick on him.

We spent a 4th. If he provides depth and shares some carries... we win.

If he has some kind of career turnaround a la Cedric Benson.... we win.

If he washes out and doesn't pan out to much for us, it's a 4th round pick. Not uncommon for fourth round picks.


New England took the risk already and lost. Our risk/reward ratio here is just fine.

Don't you know that 4th round picks are better than 1st round picks here on the Mane. I mean people really value those more than 1st rounders for some asinine reason!

baja
09-14-2010, 11:22 PM
Hillis got more love than maroney

Pony Boy
09-14-2010, 11:24 PM
Anyway you slice it it's an upgrade to our roster, take a look at the total production of Moreno and Buckhalter against the jags ......a whopping 75 yards combined.

baja
09-14-2010, 11:27 PM
I'm not meaning to imply I don't like the trade. I am trusting that Josh knows more than a bunch of BB fans.

We will see what we got in the coming weeks

Broncos_OTM
09-14-2010, 11:37 PM
Yeah...no history at all of players leaving one city only to have solid careers somewhere else.

Total fail on McD's part. I mean getting a back who already knows the offense, terminology and what is expected of him to be a backup.

Horrible trade...

:Broncos:

Yeah i also have a shot at winning the lottery...

Archer81
09-14-2010, 11:39 PM
Yeah i also have a shot at winning the lottery...


You do.

But the analogy you propose does not fit the scenario.

:Broncos:

broncocalijohn
09-14-2010, 11:39 PM
They are happy they got a 4th rounder and gave us the 6th rounder. We got a back on a draft pick that could possibly do nothing. It is far from the Alphonso pick and he hasnt sucked for us (yet). In McD's eyes, something had to be done in the backfield.

baja
09-14-2010, 11:43 PM
This one is pretty funny..

"If Denver's stadium is aligned East to West he'll be a hell of a bargain. "

Dr. Broncenstein
09-14-2010, 11:44 PM
At least we don't look completely desperate on this move. Quasi-desperate maybe... unlike the last few waiver wire transactions.

Broncos_OTM
09-14-2010, 11:47 PM
You do.

But the analogy you propose does not fit the scenario.

:Broncos:

Its a fricking horrible trade. Im sorry my reaction doesnt fit yours. ill try harder in the future

Broncos_OTM
09-14-2010, 11:48 PM
This one is pretty funny..

"If Denver's stadium is aligned East to West he'll be a hell of a bargain. "

much to my dismay it isnt

baja
09-14-2010, 11:48 PM
Gotta love this...

http://www.patriotsplanet.com/BB/image.php?u=6806&type=sigpic&dateline=1283612495

R8R H8R
09-14-2010, 11:52 PM
Let's just hope their posters are as uninformed as some of ours...

"Kept him long enough to rob Denver of a 4th rounder."

Don't worry, they are. Fans are the same there as they are here and everywhere else. Knee-jerk, emotional, and uninformed with the details.

Anybody who gives a **** what fans from another team has to say needs to find another hobby.

Who fleeced who won't be known until at the least the end of the year. If he only provides good depth and makes a play or two each game, then he provides good value for the compensation. If he rides the bench most of the year(not likely. but possible), then you can say they won the trade.

Case in point: what did Skins fans say immediately after the Champ/Portis trade? My recollection was that they thought they fleeced us. Anybody here agree with them? Didn't think so.

I even remember most of the media saying that Washington got the better of the trade because they get a guy that produces TD's and Denver got a good CB that was already nearing the age of being close to the downside of his career. Really?

Dr. Broncenstein
09-14-2010, 11:55 PM
What's the over/under on the number of days before we trade a second rounder for Mankins?

baja
09-14-2010, 11:58 PM
Now for some good news...

"He's scheduled to earn 825k for the season and the Patriots had to pay him for week 1, so they saved less than 780k."

broncocalijohn
09-14-2010, 11:58 PM
What's the over/under on the number of days before we trade a second rounder for Mankins?

I would love it!

loborugger
09-15-2010, 12:04 AM
"Does he need a ride to the airport?"

This was the kindest post I found and it took 43 posts to get to it.

Whhhhhat? Boston fans running down an athlete as he leaves town? This is unprecedented, I tell ya!

Archer81
09-15-2010, 12:06 AM
Its a fricking horrible trade. Im sorry my reaction doesnt fit yours. ill try harder in the future


...We get running back depth, gave up a 4th rounder and get a 6th rounder WITH Maroney. What exactly is the downside here?


:Broncos:

baja
09-15-2010, 12:07 AM
...We get running back depth, gave up a 4th rounder and get a 6th rounder WITH Maroney. What exactly is the downside here?


:Broncos:

another good thing is his contract under 600K by some reports on that site

Dr. Broncenstein
09-15-2010, 12:11 AM
...We get running back depth, gave up a 4th rounder and get a 6th rounder WITH Maroney. What exactly is the downside here?


:Broncos:

The hollow feeling that comes with the aquisition of yet another player from the Belichick scrap heap.

Al Wilson
09-15-2010, 12:13 AM
I still think it's a horrible trade. I miss how Shanahan used to bring in some unknowns at RB and they'd flourish when they'd get a chance. Now McDaniels brings in some reject that dances instead of running.

baja
09-15-2010, 12:25 AM
I still think it's a horrible trade. I miss how Shanahan used to bring in some unknowns at RB and they'd flourish when they'd get a chance. Now McDaniels brings in some reject that dances instead of running.

Zanders - ""On the plus side, they point to a roster turnover from when McDaniels inherited the head coaching job in January 2009.
"We let go of 32 players from 2008 (roster and practice squad) who were here who never played in the NFL again,""
"

baja
09-15-2010, 12:27 AM
The hollow feeling that comes with the aquisition of yet another player from the Belichick scrap heap.

You must have great twitch reflexes because you can jump to conclusions quicker that anyone I know. ;D

extralife
09-15-2010, 12:49 AM
Do you blame Pats fans for being upset? They spend a 1st round pick on him.

We spent a 4th. If he provides depth and shares some carries... we win.

If he has some kind of career turnaround a la Cedric Benson.... we win.

If he washes out and doesn't pan out to much for us, it's a 4th round pick. Not uncommon for fourth round picks.


New England took the risk already and lost. Our risk/reward ratio here is just fine.

but I thought we won on Fonze even though we turned a first into a seventh. After all, the draft is a crap shoot.

footstepsfrom#27
09-15-2010, 12:56 AM
Wasn't Maroney considered a guy who fit the Shanny stretch zone system when he came out of Minnesota? I seem to remember that was a big selling point, so now that we're running a power running game, does he still fit? I like the guy's talent and the risk is low if he doesn't pan out so I see no downside. How tough is it to scrounge up another 4th rounder by the 2011 draft anyway? Not very...let's see what he brings. Add in the NC State kid they picked up and maybe one of them cam step forward now. Maroney at least can do something these other guys we have seemingly can't...turn the corner. He's got some speed and we do need more of that don't we?

worm
09-15-2010, 01:06 AM
What page on the Powerpoint presentation was this on?

Hulamau
09-15-2010, 02:54 AM
Let's just hope their posters are as uninformed as some of ours...

"Kept him long enough to rob Denver of a 4th rounder."

They didnt get a 4th rounder straight up we get their 6th rounder so we just drop two rounds back but maintain the pick in next years draft. a two point move isnt much of a risk. If he pops for 9 TDS hitting last years numbers that is a win - win for us hands down.

FireFly
09-15-2010, 03:45 AM
I'm all for this.

Even if he does nothing, we really didn't give up all that much to find out.
:thumbsup:

Plus, just like I was with quinn I'm quitely confident that he's going to be our best player at his position !Booya!

:P

The MVPlaya
09-15-2010, 03:47 AM
good competition at RB now

Moreno - Maroney - Ball - Brown - White

Punisher
09-15-2010, 04:44 AM
Wow, they don't think highly of our team, do they.
We fleeced Denver, they're saying! Ha!

I wouldn't think highly about the 2nd worst team in the League neither.

55CrushEm
09-15-2010, 04:49 AM
I wouldn't think highly about the 2nd worst team in the League neither.

Thought you permanently left the board, you attention-whoring drama queen......

I guess that was too much to hope for.

The MVPlaya
09-15-2010, 04:51 AM
I wouldn't think highly about the 2nd worst team in the League neither.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/996754/idiot-o.gif

Garcia Bronco
09-15-2010, 05:58 AM
He here to block in pass protection.

rbackfactory80
09-15-2010, 06:05 AM
Not an impressive runner to me. He lacks power and speed. He will fair alright in a pass happy offense but will not take over or impose his will on a game.

The MVPlaya
09-15-2010, 06:07 AM
Not an impressive runner to me. He lacks power and speed. He will fair alright in a pass happy offense but will not take over or impose his will on a game.

There's only about 3-4 RBs in the game that can do that.

Really only 2 if you're being realistic.

rbackfactory80
09-15-2010, 06:30 AM
There's only about 3-4 RBs in the game that can do that.

Really only 2 if you're being realistic.

I agree but I would like one who could take over a quarter. I wish it was a change of pace guy, he just seems a little too much like what we already have. Our team lacks speed, there has to be a healthy balance.

Beantown Bronco
09-15-2010, 06:34 AM
Now for some good news...

"He's scheduled to earn 825k for the season and the Patriots had to pay him for week 1, so they saved less than 780k."

And considering they're now going to have to sign someone new to fill that spot, they really didn't save anything. It's not like they're going to play for free.

jhns
09-15-2010, 06:38 AM
I like the trade. He could be a pretty good back for us. Shanahan wanted to draft him. I trust that Shanahan knows RBs. He just needs put in the right situation. That is my one worry though. It doesn't seem that this Pats offense is RB friendly.

55CrushEm
09-15-2010, 06:47 AM
I like the trade. He could be a pretty good back for us. Shanahan wanted to draft him. I trust that Shanahan knows RBs. He just needs put in the right situation. That is my one worry though. It doesn't seem that this Pats offense is RB friendly.

Surprise, surprise......

jhns
09-15-2010, 06:53 AM
Surprise, surprise......

You are right. That is unreasonable. Shanahan doesn't know a thing about RBs. He has proven this time and time again. I am just being a hater.

Rulon Velvet Jones
09-15-2010, 06:57 AM
I've found the guys on patsfans.com to be a little more level-headed.

TonyR
09-15-2010, 07:16 AM
The hollow feeling that comes with the aquisition of yet another player from the Belichick scrap heap.

I think this is a little extreme. He was by far their leading rusher last year. For whatever reason Belichick doesn't like him and we didn't give up much to get him.

SoDak Bronco
09-15-2010, 07:18 AM
...We get running back depth, gave up a 4th rounder and get a 6th rounder WITH Maroney. What exactly is the downside here?


:Broncos:

Well, the obvious downside is giving up a 4th round pick. We could grab any number of players that will have a much better of a career than LM. I hate trading future picks for a guy that has proven to be mediocre in the NFL, and isn't even going to be a starter. Plus he is gone after this season. To me this is just another NOW move instead of an organization that has a plan in place and isn't going to panic. Granted we get a 6th rounder back, but you have much better odds of hitting impact players in the 4th then the 6th.

Steve Sewell
09-15-2010, 07:20 AM
Josh knows more than a bunch of BB fans.



http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/41/uZiF9.jpg

55CrushEm
09-15-2010, 07:23 AM
You are right. That is unreasonable. Shanahan doesn't know a thing about RBs. He has proven this time and time again. I am just being a hater.

Never said that. I was just mocking the fact that you said you liked the trade (in part, at least) because Shanahan wanted to draft the guy.....as if Shanny makes no drafting mistakes....at least in the RB area.

Maurice Clarett? Tatum Bell? Ryan Torain? Brandon Miree? Quentin Griffin?
Any of these guys ring a bell? Home runs, huh?

To me, your comment is just another example of "blind homerism" of Shanny.....when you're so quick to label supporters of McD (who hasn't even had enough time to prove himself) as "homers".

Kind of ironic..... Hypocrite. Bearer of double-standards. Name your cliche.

jhns
09-15-2010, 07:29 AM
Never said that. I was just mocking the fact that you said you liked the trade (in part, at least) because Shanahan wanted to draft the guy.....as if Shanny makes no drafting mistakes....at least in the RB area.

Maurice Clarett? Tatum Bell? Ryan Torain? Brandon Miree? Quentin Griffin?
Any of these guys ring a bell? Home runs, huh?

To me, your comment is just another example of "blind homerism" of Shanny.....when you're so quick to label supporters of McD (who hasn't even had enough time to prove himself) as "homers".

Kind of ironic..... Hypocrite. Bearer of double-standards. Name your cliche.

Really? So now Shanahan really doesn't know RBs? LOL

I would love for you to point out this homerism thing though. When exactly did I say this? I'm pretty sure you are just a whiney douche.

Anyways, yes, I am a Shanahan homer. He won this team 2 SBs and made us top 3 in wins over his time here. I respect him as much as I respect Elway. I don't get why this offends people. I don't get why Bronco fans wouldn't love the guy that did so much for this franchise.

Beantown Bronco
09-15-2010, 07:31 AM
Well, the obvious downside is giving up a 4th round pick. We could grab any number of players that will have a much better of a career than LM. I hate trading future picks for a guy that has proven to be mediocre in the NFL, and isn't even going to be a starter. Plus he is gone after this season. To me this is just another NOW move instead of an organization that has a plan in place and isn't going to panic. Granted we get a 6th rounder back, but you have much better odds of hitting impact players in the 4th then the 6th.

What good is a future 4th rounder that, if the lockout happens, can't be signed anyway? May as well get a solid back that can play today over a guy that may never see the field in a normal year, much less a lockout year.

bowtown
09-15-2010, 07:41 AM
Never said that. I was just mocking the fact that you said you liked the trade (in part, at least) because Shanahan wanted to draft the guy.....as if Shanny makes no drafting mistakes....at least in the RB area.

Maurice Clarett? Tatum Bell? Ryan Torain? Brandon Miree? Quentin Griffin?
Any of these guys ring a bell? Home runs, huh?

To me, your comment is just another example of "blind homerism" of Shanny.....when you're so quick to label supporters of McD (who hasn't even had enough time to prove himself) as "homers".

Kind of ironic..... Hypocrite. Bearer of double-standards. Name your cliche.

What's really funny is that Denver's success wasn't nearly as much about Shanahan knowing RBs as much as it was about Turner knowing RBs. And guess who Turner loved last year coming out and touted as being "a complete package" at running back? That's right, it's the pick jhns loves to hate, the bulldog with the mostest; ladies and gentelmen, I give you Knowshon Moreno.

SoDak Bronco
09-15-2010, 07:44 AM
What good is a future 4th rounder that, if the lockout happens, can't be signed anyway? May as well get a solid back that can play today over a guy that may never see the field in a normal year, much less a lockout year.

What good is a guy that doesn't run hard? I'd rather have Lance Ball or whoever was the RB in preseason that would bust a few plays. As for the lockout, you can't predict the future CBA stuff but I'd be shocked if both sides didn't get something done, it is in there best interest to keep playing. Even so, at some point we are going to have a draft and we won't have the 4throunder bc of a guy that is an avg. RB.

jhns
09-15-2010, 07:46 AM
What's really funny is that Denver's success wasn't nearly as much about Shanahan knowing RBs as much as it was about Turner knowing RBs. And guess who Turner loved last year coming out and touted as being "a complete package" at running back? That's right, it's the pick jhns loves to hate, the bulldog with the mostest; ladies and gentelmen, I give you Knowshon Moreno.

Where do you guys come up with this stuff? Go look up some old Moreno threads. I have nothing but good things to say about him. I like him more than most.

Hercules Rockefeller
09-15-2010, 07:47 AM
I have yet to see anyone mention that Shanny flat out admitted after they drafted Cutler in '06 that they tried to move back into the 1st to draft Maroney.

Steve Sewell
09-15-2010, 07:48 AM
...and it ain't pretty

http://www.patriotsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=57836&page=2

LOL I loved this sig from one of their posters:

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/fan_shot_images/135510/955e6800-81d0-4a58-8cff-49f978df7eba.jpg

bowtown
09-15-2010, 07:49 AM
Where do you guys come up with this stuff? Go look up some old Moreno threads. I have nothing but good things to say about him. I like him more than most.

Fair enough, the ear-bleeding drone from you and the Noise Makers tends to blend together.

Beantown Bronco
09-15-2010, 07:50 AM
What good is a guy that doesn't run hard?

Maroney, in less than 200 carries last year, had as many rushing TDs as the entire Broncos team had last year. And averaged 4 yds per carry. He's not nearly as soft a runner as some bitter Pats fans would have you believe.

55CrushEm
09-15-2010, 07:54 AM
Really? So now Shanahan really doesn't know RBs?
You really have trouble hearing what people are saying....I'm being serious. In my post I said "I never said" that Shanny doesn't know RB's.....my point (which you can't seem to understand) was that even a guy who knows RB's MAKES MISTAKES IN DRAFTING THEM! I know that's a shock for you to get, since you ADMITTEDLY are a Shanny homer. And you know what.....that's fine. It's ok to be a homer. I just don't get why the Shanny homers must ALSO BE MCD HATERS.

I would love for you to point out this homerism thing though. When exactly did I say this?
Ummmm.....in the next sentence, you did. Read below.

Anyways, yes, I am a Shanahan homer.
See, you said it. :dummy:

jhns
09-15-2010, 07:56 AM
I have yet to see anyone mention that Shanny flat out admitted after they drafted Cutler in '06 that they tried to move back into the 1st to draft Maroney.

We have already established that this is a dumb point. Shanahan and Turner don't know how to judge RB talent.

Rohirrim
09-15-2010, 07:56 AM
Wasn't Maroney considered a guy who fit the Shanny stretch zone system when he came out of Minnesota? I seem to remember that was a big selling point, so now that we're running a power running game, does he still fit? I like the guy's talent and the risk is low if he doesn't pan out so I see no downside. How tough is it to scrounge up another 4th rounder by the 2011 draft anyway? Not very...let's see what he brings. Add in the NC State kid they picked up and maybe one of them cam step forward now. Maroney at least can do something these other guys we have seemingly can't...turn the corner. He's got some speed and we do need more of that don't we?

I'm guessing that's why this deal was made: Bucky couldn't get outside against J'Ville.

Steve Sewell
09-15-2010, 08:00 AM
Also, one of the biggest haters in that thread has tributes to Adalius Thomas all over his sig.

Just sayin'

jhns
09-15-2010, 08:02 AM
You really have trouble hearing what people are saying....I'm being serious. In my post I said "I never said" that Shanny doesn't know RB's.....my point (which you can't seem to understand) was that even a guy who knows RB's MAKES MISTAKES IN DRAFTING THEM! I know that's a shock for you to get, since you ADMITTEDLY are a Shanny homer. And you know what.....that's fine. It's ok to be a homer. I just don't get why the Shanny homers must ALSO BE MCD HATERS.


Ummmm.....in the next sentence, you did. Read below.


See, you said it. :dummy:

You just came with "proof" that Shanahan doesn't know RBs. Either I had a good point or I didn't. It doesn't really matter if I am a homer or not. Why are you arguing with my point if it is correct? Oh, right, you are just a whiney douche.

Sure, I said I am a homer. I was asking where the other part of that came from. The part where you claim I just call all of you homers. You know, the typical douche crying that I have come to expect from you. The crying about something that isn't there.

Anyways, me being a Shanahan homer has nothing to do with my hate of McDaniels. I supported the firing of Shanahan and the hiring of McDaniels. It was only after some really dumb moves that I stopped liking McDaniels.

bendog
09-15-2010, 08:46 AM
From the Boston Herald

http://bostonherald.com/sports/football/patriots/view.bg?articleid=1281550&format=&page=2&listingType=pats#articleFull

1. I don't think NE really needed him.

"Now, Fred Taylor [stats] becomes the unquestioned Patriots starter, with Sammy Morris and BenJarvus Green-Ellis providing support. Kevin Faulk [stats] remains the third-down back." I was pissed denver didn't bring in Green-Ellis as an undrafted free agent.

2. The end of the article speculates that Billicheat was not only going to not resign Maroney, but is chomping at the bit to use Oakland's no 1 pick for Ingram.

Jetmeck
09-15-2010, 08:56 AM
Yeah well we should of kept Hillis and etc and etc and etc..............

Drek
09-15-2010, 08:56 AM
I think this is a little extreme. He was by far their leading rusher last year. For whatever reason Belichick doesn't like him and we didn't give up much to get him.

He's at best a mediocre receiver. In the Pats offense that doesn't work, as they've become even more pass happy with the departure of McDaniels.

Granted we get a 6th rounder back, but you have much better odds of hitting impact players in the 4th then the 6th.

No you really don't. Both are lottery tickets where most teams would be more than happy to take someone who has had Maroney's career to date in either round.

Getting a proven solid RB who already knows the system out of that swap is a very good value move for us.

DenverBrit
09-15-2010, 09:05 AM
Trading a first rounder and a 6th for a 4th?

Damn Pats FO is setting their franchise back a decade. Ha!

Bronco Yoda
09-15-2010, 09:18 AM
This one is pretty funny..

"If Denver's stadium is aligned East to West he'll be a hell of a bargain. "

:spit: ... er.... wait a min. I'm not laughing anymore for some reason.

Spider
09-15-2010, 09:50 AM
meh , dont expect Maroney to light it up in Denver , not a bad trade hell , give the Ballerina a chance with Bobby Turner , we still get a draft pic , besides if our dancing RB doesnt make it , we can always offer the raiders him for a draft pick ........

Mediator12
09-15-2010, 09:55 AM
meh , dont expect Maroney to light it up in Denver , not a bad trade hell , give the Ballerina a chance with Bobby Turner , we still get a draft pic , besides if our dancing RB doesnt make it , we can always offer the raiders him for a draft pick ........

You been on the road too long Spider ;D

Bobby Turner is in WAS with Shanny, Eric Studesville is the new RB's coach :welcome:

Spider
09-15-2010, 09:56 AM
You been on the road too long Spider ;D

Bobby Turner is in WAS with Shanny, Eric Studesville is the new RB's coach :welcome:

well there goes that plan ............ ;D ....anyone got a plan b ? :wiggle:

~Crash~
09-15-2010, 09:58 AM
Don't you know that 4th round picks are better than 1st round picks here on the Mane. I mean people really value those more than 1st rounders for some asinine reason!

Listen up ass hat we are starting to get thin with draft picks .

DawnBTVS
09-15-2010, 10:03 AM
Here's a quick rundown of Maroney... both the positives he brings and the negatives.

Positives
- Runs with authority and power. Very willing to take on defenders, lower his shoulder, and run dead on into them to bowl them over.
- Very good in space and has enough speed to generate 30-50+ yard runs consistently.
- A little underrated in the passing game. Capable screen receiver who, if in open space, can produce big gains. Can also get downfield for longer mid range passes and has the speed to beat a linebacker in coverage.

Negatives
- Tends to jitterbug in the backfield far too much. Very inconsistent as some games he'll hit the hole quickly and other games he'll seem to revert and dance, waiting for a hole to open rather than just taking the 2-3 yard gain that's there. Doesn't seem to have good "vision" in terms of hitting the hole immediately.
- Prone to fumbling the ball and this more so is what has kept him in Belichick's doghouse. He made several costly fumbles last year, in playoff games in years' past, and I can recall at least two fumbles he's made at the goal line that cost the team touchdowns.
- Wasn't used much in the passing game in part because he has suspect hands. His blitz pickup can also be inconsistent game to game. Some games he'll pick up the blitzers very well, others he'll make a couple whiffs that lead to sacks or hurried pressures.

~Crash~
09-15-2010, 10:06 AM
this was good for the Broncos but make no mistake at some point Xanders needs to man up !

PRBronco
09-15-2010, 10:10 AM
this was good for the Broncos but make no mistake at some point Xanders needs to man up !

And...do what? Run it himself?

~Crash~
09-15-2010, 10:11 AM
Positives

He is a Screen running SOB we broncos fans can attest to this:P

~Crash~
09-15-2010, 10:14 AM
And...do what? Run it himself?

Xander might ought to think about more than(this) one year . that is his ****ing job . A GM is not a yes boy.

Spider
09-15-2010, 10:19 AM
And...do what? Run it himself?

at least get his ass out from behind his desk and block for Maroney ...... dayum that isnt to much to ask is it ? ;D

Rulon Velvet Jones
09-15-2010, 10:22 AM
Xander might ought to think about more than(this) one year . that is his ****ing job . A GM is not a yes boy.

Didn't he do that with the way the recent big signings were structured?

broncocalijohn
09-15-2010, 11:35 AM
well there goes that plan ............ ;D ....anyone got a plan b ? :wiggle:

yeah, get back on the road so you can be another 8 months behind! It is like a time machine going backwards for ya.

55CrushEm
09-15-2010, 11:42 AM
You just came with "proof" that Shanahan doesn't know RBs.
I'll say this one last time, since you've clearly gone full retard. I implied that Shanny DID know RB's....just that even "experts" in their fields STILL MAKE MISTAKES, and never hit 100% (namely Clarett, Bell, etc.) This was in direct response to your comment that you liked the trade for Maroney BECAUSE SHANNY WANTED HIM. When you put that all together, what I'm saying is....just because Shanny wanted him, and despite Shanny "knowing" RB's.....doesn't necessarily mean Maroney would be good (see Clarett, Bell, etc.). Got it now, you ****ing dimwit?!?

Anyways, me being a Shanahan homer has nothing to do with my hate of McDaniels. I supported the firing of Shanahan and the hiring of McDaniels. It was only after some really dumb moves that I stopped liking McDaniels.
So "after some really dumb moves...you stopped liking McDaniels". I got it. So, I ask you then......why after MORE dumb moves did you not stop liking Shanny, as well? Because he won 2 SB's? Fine. Just give McD some ****ing TIME to do the same.

Again, going round and round with you is pointless. I'm starting to see why people call you Mr. Worthless Jizzbag.

rbackfactory80
09-15-2010, 11:42 AM
xanders - инструмент

WABronco
09-15-2010, 11:42 AM
It's nice to see "fans" who support "their" team.

You should go show them how it's done.

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 11:45 AM
Maroney's roots are with a ZBS... just sayin

bowtown
09-15-2010, 11:53 AM
Maroney's roots are with a ZBS... just sayin

Right, and that's why Shanahan liked him. But he was drafted into a system that didn't suit that and may actually have hurt him. I think he could have been great if drafted by Denver. At this point though, I'm not sure he's worth much, especailly if you are just going to continue to run him in a system that he has already proven to be mediocre in. Doesn't much matter, I think he's here mostly for blocking assignments, and the occasional change of pace. And by "change of pace" I mean "remarkably similar pace to what we already have, just with a different name on his jersey."

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 11:58 AM
Right, and that's why Shanahan liked him. But he was drafted into a system that didn't suit that and may actually have hurt him. I think he could have been great if drafted by Denver. At this point though, I'm not sure he's worth much, especailly if you are just going to continue to run him in a system that he has already proven to be mediocre in. Doesn't much matter, I think he's here mostly for blocking assignments, and the occasional change of pace. And by "change of pace" I mean "remarkably similar pace to what we already have, just with a different name on his jersey."

Completely agree

Drek
09-15-2010, 12:07 PM
well there goes that plan ............ ;D ....anyone got a plan b ? :wiggle:

Eric Studesville.

He coached Tiki Barber from '01 to '03 with '02 and '03 being the back to back breakout years that began the peak of Barber's career.

He then went to the Bills and coached McGahee, Lynch, and Fred Jackson. Say what you will about Buffalo but they've generally had a bad OL and no passing game yet with Studesville they always had a running attack.

He doesn't have quite the track record of Bobby Turner, but Studesville is a very accomplished RB coach himself.

jhns
09-15-2010, 12:07 PM
I'll say this one last time, since you've clearly gone full retard. I implied that Shanny DID know RB's....just that even "experts" in their fields STILL MAKE MISTAKES, and never hit 100% (namely Clarett, Bell, etc.) This was in direct response to your comment that you liked the trade for Maroney BECAUSE SHANNY WANTED HIM. When you put that all together, what I'm saying is....just because Shanny wanted him, and despite Shanny "knowing" RB's.....doesn't necessarily mean Maroney would be good (see Clarett, Bell, etc.). Got it now, you ****ing dimwit?!?


So "after some really dumb moves...you stopped liking McDaniels". I got it. So, I ask you then......why after MORE dumb moves did you not stop liking Shanny, as well? Because he won 2 SB's? Fine. Just give McD some ****ing TIME to do the same.

Again, going round and round with you is pointless. I'm starting to see why people call you Mr. Worthless Jizzbag.

I said I liked him because Shanahan wanted him? I don't think that is true at all. I used it as supporting evidence on why I think he has potential. You are just a douche that goes off on stuff that isn't there.

You are still arguing that it isn't a valid point. How are you going to claim you aren't saying something as you argue it?

What is this crap about me giving McDaniels time? I supported one of his moves and you go all crybaby. I never said one bad thing about McDaniels or his moves in this thread. You are just acting like a douche. It is you that wants to make this about me not liking McDaniels as I support a move he makes. How dumb can you get?

Irish Stout
09-15-2010, 12:10 PM
I miss Mike Bell.

DBroncos4life
09-15-2010, 12:33 PM
...We get running back depth, gave up a 4th rounder and get a 6th rounder WITH Maroney. What exactly is the downside here?


:Broncos:
Not much really but if you stop and think that he wasn't good enough for the Pats whose system we are coping then what good is he going to be for us.

bowtown
09-15-2010, 12:42 PM
Not much really but if you stop and think that he wasn't good enough for the Pats whose system we are coping then what good is he going to be for us.

BB already has three backups that are already adept at the blocking assignments in this system. We don't have one.

baja
09-15-2010, 12:48 PM
Fair enough, the ear-bleeding drone from you and the Noise Makers tends to blend together.


Best one liner I read all in a long time.

Gotta rep that ;D

DBroncos4life
09-15-2010, 12:49 PM
BB already has three backups that are already adept at the blocking assignments in this system. We don't have one.

Two of BB's RBs are 100 years old in RB years. That's how much he cares for LM. I'm sorry man I don't hate this move at all. I liked him coming out of college but I just don't think he is going to help us out that much in the long run.

Has any player we traded for from the Pats really did that much for us? Hutch is the only on I can think of and he was far from great. We didn't give up that much for him so it's win there, I just really wish our HC and GM would look at other teams sometimes when it comes to trades.

bowtown
09-15-2010, 12:59 PM
Two of BB's RBs are 100 years old in RB years. That's how much he cares for LM. I'm sorry man I don't hate this move at all. I liked him coming out of college but I just don't think he is going to help us out that much in the long run.

Has any player we traded for from the Pats really did that much for us? Hutch is the only on I can think of and he was far from great. We didn't give up that much for him so it's win there, I just really wish our HC and GM would look at other teams sometimes when it comes to trades.

Agian, they might be 100 years old but they know their blocking assignments. He's not here to break off 1000 yards, and people are going to be disappointed if they think he's suddenly going to ressurect his career here. But let's be honest, theams aren't exactly lining up to trade away their hot RB talent right now. Maroney however can fill a role for us immediately, and that's why he's here. I'm not a big fan of it either, but sometimes you got to take what you can get.

Champagne Powder
09-15-2010, 01:05 PM
I hate Patriots fans. One of these days I am going to stab one of their fans repeatedly in the neck with an ice pick.

I don't mind going to the hole for 30+ years just to give one of their fans a dirt nap.

bendog
09-15-2010, 01:05 PM
Agian, they might be 100 years old but they know their blocking assignments. He's not here to break off 1000 yards, and people are going to be disappointed if they think he's suddenly going to ressurect his career here. But let's be honest, theams aren't exactly lining up to trade away their hot RB talent right now. Maroney however can fill a role for us immediately, and that's why he's here. I'm not a big fan of it either, but sometimes you got to take what you can get.

well, by that analogy, say you're sitting in a bar having a few drinks on Friday night, and there's this fairly skank looking girl there, but you figure, 'what the hey,' and before you know it, you're spending a weekend with her, but on Saturday night, as you're sitting in the bar getting bombed enough to be interested in seeing how many times you can ... well you know ... and in walks Erin Andrews saying she's doing a special on bronco fans ....

baja
09-15-2010, 01:05 PM
Here's a quick rundown of Maroney... both the positives he brings and the negatives.

Positives
- Runs with authority and power. Very willing to take on defenders, lower his shoulder, and run dead on into them to bowl them over.
- Very good in space and has enough speed to generate 30-50+ yard runs consistently.
- A little underrated in the passing game. Capable screen receiver who, if in open space, can produce big gains. Can also get downfield for longer mid range passes and has the speed to beat a linebacker in coverage.

Negatives
- Tends to jitterbug in the backfield far too much. Very inconsistent as some games he'll hit the hole quickly and other games he'll seem to revert and dance, waiting for a hole to open rather than just taking the 2-3 yard gain that's there. Doesn't seem to have good "vision" in terms of hitting the hole immediately.
- Prone to fumbling the ball and this more so is what has kept him in Belichick's doghouse. He made several costly fumbles last year, in playoff games in years' past, and I can recall at least two fumbles he's made at the goal line that cost the team touchdowns.
- Wasn't used much in the passing game in part because he has suspect hands. His blitz pickup can also be inconsistent game to game. Some games he'll pick up the blitzers very well, others he'll make a couple whiffs that lead to sacks or hurried pressures.

In the vids someone provided I thought he showed great vision and great cut back ability. I can see why Shanny loved him and josh probably got him for his ability to turn the corner. He could be sweet in the screens McD loves to run. My biggest concern is his rep. with his teammates as being lazy but it is this one negative that a change of scenery can help the most this coupled with a locker room full of quality leaders could turn Maroney into the back everyone thought he would be.

bowtown
09-15-2010, 01:11 PM
In the vids someone provided I thought he showed great vision and great cut back ability. I can see why Shanny loved him and josh probably got him for his ability to turn the corner. He could be sweet in the screens McD loves to run. My biggest concern is his rep. with his teammates as being lazy but it is this one negative that a change of scenery can help the most this coupled with a locker room full of quality leaders could turn Maroney into the back everyone thought he would be.

Where are you hearing the lazy comments? Everything I have heard about him is that he is a great team player and does everything asked of him, but he just has never seemed to put it all together.

Br0nc0Buster
09-15-2010, 01:25 PM
I think he can do well in a situation where he splits carries and isnt relied on to be a workhorse

a talented player who dissapointed in New England, I think he is a younger Buckhalter myself
but regardless his talent exceeds that of a mid round pick which is what we most likely would of used on a RB in the upcoming draft anyways

baja
09-15-2010, 01:33 PM
Where are you hearing the lazy comments? Everything I have heard about him is that he is a great team player and does everything asked of him, but he just has never seemed to put it all together.

It's all over the Pats BBs It's the biggest complaint they have about him, that and his dancing. it is mentioned over and over his teammates have come out publicly about his work ethic. Brewski slammed him in the press a while back. This is why I have hopes he can turn his career around. Billickeck stuck with him this long for a reason, he likes his skills but I believe he let him go because he was going to play the same roll as a younger back they have. If our locker room can get him righted and if he realizes this is his last chance at any kind of decent contract he has a great chance to resurrect his career here. His problem is not his skill set just look at his 2007 year. My guess he was a distraction in the locker room and they have a guy that can do what he was asked to do in NE without the tude. so Billicheck dumped him for the 4th rounder with the plan to trade up for a player next season they like. We all know BB thinks ahead for years so this makes sense.

Drek
09-15-2010, 01:45 PM
Not much really but if you stop and think that he wasn't good enough for the Pats whose system we are coping then what good is he going to be for us.

He was good enough. In fact he's been their #1 back much of his career when healthy.

But the distance between him, Fred Taylor, Kevin Faulk, and Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis when healthy isn't that big and he's always been on the outs with Belichick for some reason (likely his mediocre hands and the fact that he was a 1st rounder who isn't all world).

We don't need a primary back. We have a good one. We need someone who lets that primary back stop having to act like a junkyard dog picking up all the short yardage work and actually start using some of his impressive athleticism to make plays. Maroney works for that.

bendog
09-15-2010, 01:48 PM
I miss Mike Bell.

The Saints very easily could have imploded early last year without Bell. Pierre Thomas went down for the first two games, and Bell stepped right up and avg 5 yds a tote. Reggie Bush's knee was coming off surgery and he tweaked it again in preseason. Bell went down, but he'd played so well in those two, and been a good lockerroom guy, Sean Payton found him carries when he came back. The Saints are really thin at rb this year.

I was surprised that Denver showed no interest. Even if they assumed Buckhalter had something left, Bell's got enough to make the roster. Hell, Bell would have been an upgrade over Buckhalter last year.

Popps
09-15-2010, 01:51 PM
The Saints very easily could have imploded early last year without Bell. Pierre Thomas went down for the first two games, and Bell stepped right up and avg 5 yds a tote. Reggie Bush's knee was coming off surgery and he tweaked it again in preseason. Bell went down, but he'd played so well in those two, and been a good lockerroom guy, Sean Payton found him carries when he came back. The Saints are really thin at rb this year.

I was surprised that Denver showed no interest. Even if they assumed Buckhalter had something left, Bell's got enough to make the roster. Hell, Bell would have been an upgrade over Buckhalter last year.

Hasn't Bell struggled with his own injuries probs?

Buck ran for 5+ a carry last year. He did everything we asked of him. This year, I'm not so sure yet.

bendog
09-15-2010, 02:12 PM
Hasn't Bell struggled with his own injuries probs?

Buck ran for 5+ a carry last year. He did everything we asked of him. This year, I'm not so sure yet.

Bell missed three games last year. He was out of football for most of 08. hou cut him, and the saints signed him for the final two games when they had injuries. You're right that he's been hurt this year with hammy, and I think now a toe. Ironically, he signed with Philly for a pretty similar amt that Buckhalter got from Den. And ironically he and Buckhalter had pretty similar stats last year. Honestly, I was shocked he did as well as he did last year. He about doubled what he'd run for in each of the previous 3 years.

Moral: beware of paying backs with more than a year or two. I think Maroney is pretty low risk. But giving him a new contract .....

Beantown Bronco
09-15-2010, 02:13 PM
I hate Patriots fans. One of these days I am going to stab one of their fans repeatedly in the neck with an ice pick.

I don't mind going to the hole for 30+ years just to give one of their fans a dirt nap.

Welcome back BroncoLB52....

DBroncos4life
09-15-2010, 03:32 PM
He was good enough. In fact he's been their #1 back much of his career when healthy.

But the distance between him, Fred Taylor, Kevin Faulk, and Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis when healthy isn't that big and he's always been on the outs with Belichick for some reason (likely his mediocre hands and the fact that he was a 1st rounder who isn't all world).

We don't need a primary back. We have a good one. We need someone who lets that primary back stop having to act like a junkyard dog picking up all the short yardage work and actually start using some of his impressive athleticism to make plays. Maroney works for that.

Yet they traded him.

Drek
09-15-2010, 04:10 PM
Yet they traded him.

They traded Richard Seymour and then started Jarvis Green the entire season. Your point?

Belichick never took to Maroney. Despite production he wasn't a Belichick guy. This is his last year on contract and there is no way they'll look to resign him.

Also, just because he is of marginal value to the Pats doesn't mean he is of marginal value to us. He is a rich man's version of Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis. His production is very comparable to what Fred Taylor gives you. There is no 3rd down back role available because Kevin Faulk is an ideal 3rd down RB.

They go three deep with similar talent and got some small amount of long term value out of him. We get a back who fills a legitimate need, short yardage power back, again for small value. We started camp looking for that kind of guy in Ball or Hall. Neither really took the short yardage role. We then brought in White and Fargas. The former is on IR and the later was never really healthy.

Maroney has more value to us than the Pats, and even for the Pats he was a solid contributor. For what little we gave he is a valuable pickup.

It is key that we reduce the physical workload on Moreno. He has a diverse skill set. Burning him up between the tackles grinding short yardage takes away form that. The Giants found that out with Tiki Barber, he never really broke out until they gave him a solid backup to carry some of the load. With Maroney on a one year deal and White on IR (under contract for 2011) we have options to try out as Moreno's short yardage backup.

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 04:15 PM
They traded Richard Seymour and then started Jarvis Green the entire season. Your point?

Belichick never took to Maroney. Despite production he wasn't a Belichick guy. This is his last year on contract and there is no way they'll look to resign him.

Also, just because he is of marginal value to the Pats doesn't mean he is of marginal value to us. He is a rich man's version of Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis. His production is very comparable to what Fred Taylor gives you. There is no 3rd down back role available because Kevin Faulk is an ideal 3rd down RB.

They go three deep with similar talent and got some small amount of long term value out of him. We get a back who fills a legitimate need, short yardage power back, again for small value. We started camp looking for that kind of guy in Ball or Hall. Neither really took the short yardage role. We then brought in White and Fargas. The former is on IR and the later was never really healthy.

Maroney has more value to us than the Pats, and even for the Pats he was a solid contributor. For what little we gave he is a valuable pickup.

It is key that we reduce the physical workload on Moreno. He has a diverse skill set. Burning him up between the tackles grinding short yardage takes away form that. The Giants found that out with Tiki Barber, he never really broke out until they gave him a solid backup to carry some of the load. With Maroney on a one year deal and White on IR (under contract for 2011) we have options to try out as Moreno's short yardage backup.

I'm lukewarm on the trade, but also not against it, so don't take this wrong, but if he's a "rich man's Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis", why was Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis on the field Sunday and Maroney a healthy scratch?

baja
09-15-2010, 04:15 PM
They traded Richard Seymour and then started Jarvis Green the entire season. Your point?

Belichick never took to Maroney. Despite production he wasn't a Belichick guy. This is his last year on contract and there is no way they'll look to resign him.

Also, just because he is of marginal value to the Pats doesn't mean he is of marginal value to us. He is a rich man's version of Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis. His production is very comparable to what Fred Taylor gives you. There is no 3rd down back role available because Kevin Faulk is an ideal 3rd down RB.

They go three deep with similar talent and got some small amount of long term value out of him. We get a back who fills a legitimate need, short yardage power back, again for small value. We started camp looking for that kind of guy in Ball or Hall. Neither really took the short yardage role. We then brought in White and Fargas. The former is on IR and the later was never really healthy.

Maroney has more value to us than the Pats, and even for the Pats he was a solid contributor. For what little we gave he is a valuable pickup.

It is key that we reduce the physical workload on Moreno. He has a diverse skill set. Burning him up between the tackles grinding short yardage takes away form that. The Giants found that out with Tiki Barber, he never really broke out until they gave him a solid backup to carry some of the load. With Maroney on a one year deal and White on IR (under contract for 2011) we have options to try out as Moreno's short yardage backup.

My only concern is he was the valedictorian of a class of two with Hillis being the other classmate.

broncocalijohn
09-15-2010, 04:22 PM
I hate Patriots fans. One of these days I am going to stab one of their fans repeatedly in the neck with an ice pick.

I don't mind going to the hole for 30+ years just to give one of their fans a dirt nap.

Hey Raider fan, i think your 98>79 thread was much better than this garbage.

bowtown
09-15-2010, 04:23 PM
I'm lukewarm on the trade, but also not against it, so don't take this wrong, but if he's a "rich man's Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis", why was Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis on the field Sunday and Maroney a healthy scratch?

Has anyone seen the whole healthy scratch thing come from anywhere other than a Patriots message board?

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 04:30 PM
Has anyone seen the whole healthy scratch thing come from anywhere other than a Patriots message board?

Beantown was throwing it around earlier and I've never seen him make anything up in years so that's good enough for me.

baja
09-15-2010, 04:30 PM
Has anyone seen the whole healthy scratch thing come from anywhere other than a Patriots message board?

My guess is the trade was already in the works and Belichick did not want to expose him to injury and had no intention of playing him so scratched him.

DBroncos4life
09-15-2010, 06:14 PM
They traded Richard Seymour and then started Jarvis Green the entire season. Your point?

Belichick never took to Maroney. Despite production he wasn't a Belichick guy. This is his last year on contract and there is no way they'll look to resign him.

Also, just because he is of marginal value to the Pats doesn't mean he is of marginal value to us. He is a rich man's version of Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis. His production is very comparable to what Fred Taylor gives you. There is no 3rd down back role available because Kevin Faulk is an ideal 3rd down RB.

They go three deep with similar talent and got some small amount of long term value out of him. We get a back who fills a legitimate need, short yardage power back, again for small value. We started camp looking for that kind of guy in Ball or Hall. Neither really took the short yardage role. We then brought in White and Fargas. The former is on IR and the later was never really healthy.

Maroney has more value to us than the Pats, and even for the Pats he was a solid contributor. For what little we gave he is a valuable pickup.

It is key that we reduce the physical workload on Moreno. He has a diverse skill set. Burning him up between the tackles grinding short yardage takes away form that. The Giants found that out with Tiki Barber, he never really broke out until they gave him a solid backup to carry some of the load. With Maroney on a one year deal and White on IR (under contract for 2011) we have options to try out as Moreno's short yardage backup.
Yeah and not only did they get a first round pick for trading Seymour odds are we gave the Pats a high comp pick for signing Green for WAY too much money only to cut his ass later. I think it worked out damn well for the Pats to trade RS. BB knows what he is doing and his track record shows just that.

DBroncos4life
09-15-2010, 06:36 PM
I'm sorry Derk you defend everything McD does way too much. You even defend the Smith trade which is trash. I doubt you will find very many teams in the last 10 years that drafted a RB in the top 15 trading for another RB during the next season. I like the move because we need the help, but we need the help because our number 12 over pick isn't playing at the level he should be.

Hamrob
09-15-2010, 06:43 PM
Don't you know that 4th round picks are better than 1st round picks here on the Mane. I mean people really value those more than 1st rounders for some asinine reason!Which round did Doom & Marshall come from?

elsid13
09-15-2010, 06:52 PM
My guess is the trade was already in the works and Belichick did not want to expose him to injury and had no intention of playing him so scratched him.

Or more likely Belichick and his OC didn't think that he could help the team win. He been on the outs all preseason and wasn't part of the PATS plans, they were just looking on finding a way to get value out of him.

elsid13
09-15-2010, 06:56 PM
Don't you know that 4th round picks are better than 1st round picks here on the Mane. I mean people really value those more than 1st rounders for some asinine reason!

Because in today NFL, the 4th round is where team have been find excellent value in the draft. It the round were you find players with high potential that either are a little to raw or have issue that driven them down draft boards (a little to small like Doom). There is reason teams like NE, Indy, Mia and Pitt try to get large selection of choice in the middle rounds. At best you might get a star like Doom or Marshall at worse you get solid depth to boost your team.

LRtagger
09-15-2010, 06:57 PM
I'm sorry Derk you defend everything McD does way too much. You even defend the Smith trade which is trash. I doubt you will find very many teams in the last 10 years that drafted a RB in the top 15 trading for another RB during the next season. I like the move because we need the help, but we need the help because our number 12 over pick isn't playing at the level he should be.

In 2006 the Panthers used a first round pick on DeWill and in 2008 they used a first round pick on JStew. I would say that has worked out pretty well for them. (Then in 2009 they used an early 4th on a RB).

The Cowboys drafted Julius Jones with the 11th pick and then used a high 4th the next year to get Barber. Then 3 years later used another first on Felix Jones....and in that same draft used a 4th on Tashard Choice.

In 2002 the Redskins used a mid second to select Betts, then two years later traded Champ Bailey for Sheriff Gonna Getcha.

We used a first round pick on Moreno and essentially a 5th round pick on Maroney. What am I missing here that seems to be the huge problem? I mean, aside from the fact it was a McDaniels move.

Drek
09-15-2010, 06:57 PM
I'm lukewarm on the trade, but also not against it, so don't take this wrong, but if he's a "rich man's Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis", why was Ben-Jarvis Green Ellis on the field Sunday and Maroney a healthy scratch?

Why has Maroney consistently been their leading carrier even last year when Green Ellis was on the team?

You're trying to judge his value to the Patriots based on one week, not the last four years where he's been their #1 back when healthy.

Yeah and not only did they get a first round pick for trading Seymour odds are we gave the Pats a high comp pick for signing Green for WAY too much money only to cut his ass later. I think it worked out damn well for the Pats to trade RS. BB knows what he is doing and his track record shows just that.

1. You obviously do not understand the compensatory pick structure. Green's deal was rather modest for most DEs and will likely yield them a late round pick if anything at all.

2. They actually diminished the quality of their team, significantly, for draft pick compensation in 2009. Now when the talent level between Maroney and his replacements is much closer than Seymour and his you question Belichick's willingness to do that again?

I'm sorry Derk you defend everything McD does way too much. You even defend the Smith trade which is trash. I doubt you will find very many teams in the last 10 years that drafted a RB in the top 15 trading for another RB during the next season. I like the move because we need the help, but we need the help because our number 12 over pick isn't playing at the level he should be.

Great, prove it then. If you think I'm schilling for McDaniels back it up.

I have never defended the Smith trade. I just look at it objectively. Smith was a well thought out selection in the late 2nd. I hate the idea of trading a future 1st for a current 2nd and have said it many times on this forum over the several years I've posted here. But McDaniels had a desire to do so and make a move that made sense based on the point chart. Going strictly by the point chart rules of trading he actually won the deal, as ridiculous as that sounds, as future picks are discounted one full round of value. We got the 37th pick but traded next year's 14th. It technically was only worth the 46th pick. Am I fan of the move? Hell no, but it technically is a sound football move. This is why I get such a kick out of people throwing a fit over us giving up value to secure Tebow. Straight trade chart moves do not work because there is no proven rubric to team building.

And I tell you what, you prove in some way that this move is due to Moreno under-performing and maybe you'll have a leg to stand on in the debate. Because selling this as replacing the leading rookie rusher of a year ago who looked good in his first bit of game action in several months shows a pretty slanted agenda.

LRtagger
09-15-2010, 07:05 PM
Which round did Doom & Marshall come from?

Which round did Tom Brady and Terrell Davis come from?

Archer81
09-15-2010, 07:06 PM
Which round did Tom Brady and Terrell Davis come from?


Ooh, snap.


:Broncos:

DBroncos4life
09-15-2010, 08:48 PM
In 2006 the Panthers used a first round pick on DeWill and in 2008 they used a first round pick on JStew. I would say that has worked out pretty well for them. (Then in 2009 they used an early 4th on a RB).

The Cowboys drafted Julius Jones with the 11th pick and then used a high 4th the next year to get Barber. Then 3 years later used another first on Felix Jones....and in that same draft used a 4th on Tashard Choice.

In 2002 the Redskins used a mid second to select Betts, then two years later traded Champ Bailey for Sheriff Gonna Getcha.

We used a first round pick on Moreno and essentially a 5th round pick on Maroney. What am I missing here that seems to be the huge problem? I mean, aside from the fact it was a McDaniels move.

Outside of the Panthers move which was two years after DWill was pretty much wrote off as a bust the rest of those people are trash. Is Jones still in the NFL? Barber is over-rated as they come and Felix has he done anything? You are pointing out teams making moves two or three years later not ONE NFL season. We tried all off season to find help and we couldn't do it now we have to go knocking on the door of the Pats to find a player to fill that void.

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 09:53 PM
Why has Maroney consistently been their leading carrier even last year when Green Ellis was on the team?

You're trying to judge his value to the Patriots based on one week, not the last four years where he's been their #1 back when healthy.

You're absolutely right. I am not trying to judge his value based on one week. I'm letting his coaches (HoF'er) judge his value of the course of his career and the most CURRENT and intimate knowledge of his ability/work ethic/health.

Once again, that being said, hopefully Knowshon steps it up and Maroney only needs to be a rare change of pace back and can succeed in that role.

baja
09-15-2010, 10:41 PM
You're absolutely right. I am not trying to judge his value based on one week. I'm letting his coaches (HoF'er) judge his value of the course of his career and the most CURRENT and intimate knowledge of his ability/work ethic/health.

Once again, that being said, hopefully Knowshon steps it up and Maroney only needs to be a rare change of pace back and can succeed in that role.

I guess you didn't get the memo.

Belichick is has turned! He is tearing apart the Patriots by sending all talent, one by one to his prodigy Josh whom is also his lover. This is just the second. The long snapper being the first. There are more coming.

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 10:43 PM
I guess you didn't get the memo.

Belichick is has turned! He is tearing apart the Patriots by sending all talent, one by one to his prodigy Josh whom is also his lover. This is just the second. The long snapper being the first. There are more coming.

Don't forget Lekevin Smith or whatever his name was. Spent a draft pick on him and cut him before any real playing time.

baja
09-15-2010, 10:53 PM
Don't forget Lekevin Smith or whatever his name was. Spent a draft pick on him and cut him before any real playing time.

Clearly that was a diversion.

Never underestimate the deviousness of Belichick, just ask Blue.

TheReverend
09-15-2010, 11:02 PM
Clearly that was a diversion.

Never underestimate the deviousness of Belichick, just ask Blue.

We made out pretty well in that sweet Jarvis Green deal too.

baja
09-15-2010, 11:04 PM
He's in on it.

baja
09-15-2010, 11:05 PM
They'll split up the 8 mil later.

Archer81
09-15-2010, 11:07 PM
Pats fan A: Maroney totally sucks, I was drivin in the cah and saw him on the tuhnpahk and he totally took the exit. He was afraid of me man, wicked hahd.

Pats fan B: Oh, oh, I saw him at the mall...buying SHOES...total douche. Like hey pahl, do that **** online!

Pats fan C: I dont know, he seemed to get the offense and did whatever was asked of him. He seemed to dance around a bit but he was productive. Denver got a good back.

Pats fan B: What?

Pats fan C: Uhh...go BRADY!

Pats fan A: ****in A, best qwataback evah.

Pats fan B: Tom Brady is the **** my friend, the ****. Nobody can stop him man, nobody.

Pats fan C: Uhh...Denver does. Brady has only beat the Broncos one time, and his first loss in the playoffs was against Denver.

Pats fan A: Bro...you serious? Refs jewed us in that game man, totally sided with the donkeys.

Pats fan B: ****in A. You know what I love about Brady? His composure, quick release. Smart QB...you know what else? His eyes...so...blue, ya know? I mean you can get lost in them...sometimes I get jealous of Giselle. I always told myself I'd never hook up with a man again after I got out of jail...but that Brady...mmm...

Pats fan A & C:...****in A...wait...what?


:Broncos:

Drek
09-16-2010, 03:51 AM
You're absolutely right. I am not trying to judge his value based on one week. I'm letting his coaches (HoF'er) judge his value of the course of his career and the most CURRENT and intimate knowledge of his ability/work ethic/health.

Once again, that being said, hopefully Knowshon steps it up and Maroney only needs to be a rare change of pace back and can succeed in that role.

I completely get why Belichick traded him. He's one of four RBs of similar productivity, and he's got the least diverse skill set of the four (can't catch as well). Belichick won't resign him so just like he did with Seymour he'll take a roster downgrade now to increase draft stock in the future.

But he's a solid runner, especially between the tackles and in short yardage situations. He fits a need on this team we spent all of camp looking to fill. Ball and Hall didn't show the power running to take that job. White did showed a flash of it and then got hurt. Fargas never got healthy. McDaniels has been looking for a short yardage compliment to Moreno for several months now. He likely thinks he just found it with Moreno.

Don't forget Lekevin Smith or whatever his name was. Spent a draft pick on him and cut him before any real playing time.

Again to be fair we traded a single 5th for both LeKevin Smith and Russ Hochstein. Hochstein alone contributed more last season than most 5th round picks ever do. Smith didn't stay healthy and this off-season we further invested in the DL. Hochstein is still a backup.

We trade with New England because their guys know our system and they are a team that has a solid, deep roster yet keeps drafting a dozen guys every year. In order to keep those picks they've let some solid guys go. I see no problem with using it as an early pipeline to put layers of depth on this roster, which we sorely lack. Sometimes the Pats are right and their young guys step up to outperform the vet they dumped. Sometimes they're wrong.

Hell, they let Tully Banta-Cain go a couple years ago thinking Shawn Crable was going to be the man. The 49ers never fully utilized Banta-Cain in that time frame but then when Crable didn't pan out the Pats brought him [Banta-Cain] back and he put up 10 sacks last year to lead their team. Belichick has made his share of roster mistakes, he's just smart enough to realize that simply because another team didn't like a guy doesn't mean you can't make something happen with him yourself.

fontaine
09-16-2010, 04:02 AM
Whatever about the trade, I like that McDaniels is making a statement about improving the running game.

We could have just kept the status quo with our backs but it was clear after week 1 that our running game needs to do better and trading for a decent RB shows that McDaniels is serious about getting more production here.

Whether he can bring out the best of the talent here remains to be seen but make no mistake, the ability is very much there across our RBs, OL, TEs.

Yeah it may look desperate and if Maroney is just a one year hire then it's a wasted trade but I can't fault him for trying to do right by the offense.

LRtagger
09-16-2010, 06:19 AM
Outside of the Panthers move which was two years after DWill was pretty much wrote off as a bust the rest of those people are trash. Is Jones still in the NFL? Barber is over-rated as they come and Felix has he done anything? You are pointing out teams making moves two or three years later not ONE NFL season. We tried all off season to find help and we couldn't do it now we have to go knocking on the door of the Pats to find a player to fill that void.

Two years after DeAngelo Williams was written off as a bust? What are you talking about?

He averaged 4.1 ypc his rookie year and 5 ypc his second year. He played behind DeShaun Foster both of those years. His first start of his rookie year he went 20 for 114.

When they drafted JStew, Williams ran for 1500 yards that season.

You are off base on the other players. Besides, they drafted a 1st round back and a 4th round back IN THE SAME DRAFT. We used a 2009 1st and a 2011 essentially 5th.

This is a 2-back league now and Buckhalter looks like he's not going to cut it this year. We found an answer in White, but he's on IR unfortunately.

Who cares if we had to knock on someone else's door to get a player? We got him on the cheap. I know every year 30 players come out of the 4th round with 1st round talent, but I think our risk/reward here was favorable.

55CrushEm
09-16-2010, 06:44 AM
Objectivity around here means pointing out all of McD's mistakes, and ignoring Shanahan's. ::)

Whining about trading a 5th for LeKevin Smith? Fine....

Shanahan loved going after former 1st round busts......didn't he trade a 4th or 5th to the Rams for Jimmy Kennedy, who we then cut before the season started?

Meh.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-16-2010, 06:48 AM
I'm sorry Derk you defend everything McD does way too much. You even defend the Smith trade which is trash. I doubt you will find very many teams in the last 10 years that drafted a RB in the top 15 trading for another RB during the next season. I like the move because we need the help, but we need the help because our number 12 over pick isn't playing at the level he should be.

We need the help for several reasons, the biggest of which is depth at RB. We have none, and we need some.

Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken, and simply saying "we traded for Maroney because Moreno isn't getting it done!" does not make it true.