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montrose
08-14-2010, 08:44 AM
Broncos' Orton looks like real deal
By Lindsay H. Jones
The Denver Post

Walk into the Broncos' merchandise store at the team's Dove Valley headquarters, and it is easy to get confused.

The store screams "quarterback controversy," what with rack after rack of No. 15 Tim Tebow jerseys, in every size, color and style. You can find a No. 8, but you'll have to search for it.

Even in his own team's home store, Kyle Orton is the forgotten man.

There is a different message, though, coming from the other building at Dove Valley — the main building where the coaches' offices and the player locker room are located. Inside that facility, no one is forgetting Orton, who is having perhaps the most impressive camp of any Broncos player.

Through two weeks of camp, this much is clear:

Orton is the starting quarterback and unquestioned leader of the Broncos' offense.

"I'm feeling great," Orton said. "This is still the best that I've felt, and I'm throwing the ball better than I ever have and mentally just playing at a high level right now."

In Orton's head, things are clearer. In the huddle, his voice is louder and more confident. And when the ball is snapped, it's almost as if he's a different player.

"The other day, he zipped one in in the red zone, and I think everyone turned around and was like, 'Is that Kyle's ball?' because it had so much zip on it," cornerback Andre Goodman said. "You can tell he's been working."

Consider it a combination of experience in coach Josh McDaniels' offense, improved health and maybe a good old-fashioned case of a flame — in the form of Tebow and Brady Quinn — lit under his derrière.

"I'm sure he's thinking, this is my job and I'm going out to prove to myself, to everyone, to my teammates what they have in me," veteran safety Brian Dawkins said. "I know he's proved it to us guys on the other side. He's putting the ball in some tight spaces, making the checks that need to be made, and that builds confidence from the other guys."

Orton never will have the mobility of Tebow — "His wheels don't take him very far," McDaniels joked about Orton this week. He won't throw as pure and pretty a deep spiral as Quinn, but Orton has shown through the first two weeks of camp an increased mastery of McDaniels' playbook. Orton, along with most of the veteran starters, expects to play between 20 and 25 plays in Sunday's preseason opener at Cincinnati.

In 2009, Orton's critics said he wouldn't throw the ball deep, that he locked on to Brandon Marshall too much and ran a conservative, bubble-screen-based offense. Still, he threw for 3,802 yards and 21 touchdowns, both career highs.

Through this camp, Orton has hardly held back. His mistakes are down — despite working without his top three running backs and behind a mostly new offensive line — and he has particularly excelled in the two-minute drill.

It also helps that for the first time in nearly two years, Orton is playing on two healthy ankles.

"He's made a lot of big throws down the field. We've changed, certainly, a lot of things that we're doing and being a little bit more aggressive in some areas, and he's really done that well," McDaniels said. "There are a lot of good things that he's feeling, and I think that's why he has so much confidence right now."

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_15775208

Cito Pelon
08-14-2010, 09:26 AM
The vets are solidly behind Orton, as I expected would be the case. Why? Because Orton gives them a great chance to make the playoffs as long as the rest of the team does their jobs well also.

And that's true for every team in the NFL - everybody has to play well to make the playoffs, not just the QB.

montrose
08-14-2010, 09:42 AM
Having seen Orton in camp, while he does look much more comfortable in the offense and his throws have noticably more zip, I do think the media's going a bit overboard as to how well he's playing in camp. From the practice's I've seen he looks like the solid starter we saw last year against New England and San Diego - not much better and not much worse. Now you could say that if he we're to play at that level all season the team could have a nice record - but I'm worried how he'll hold up behind this patchwork OL.

Tombstone RJ
08-14-2010, 09:50 AM
If Orton is to play well, the oline has to protect him, there's just no getting around that. While I'm excited about the big young guys coming in, I think it could be disasterous for Orton.

I still don't understand why Orton isn't a gym freak. He should have been in the weight room bulking up for the season. If I was Tuten I'd have really worked on his leg strength and his overall upper body strength. Orton should have packed on 5-10lbs of muscle this offseason...

Ray Finkle
08-14-2010, 10:02 AM
If Orton is to play well, the oline has to protect him, there's just no getting around that. While I'm excited about the big young guys coming in, I think it could be disasterous for Orton.

I still don't understand why Orton isn't a gym freak. He should have been in the weight room bulking up for the season. If I was Tuten I'd have really worked on his leg strength and his overall upper body strength. Orton should have packed on 5-10lbs of muscle this offseason...

he is...just depends on your body type whether you can add more mass on not.

lostknight
08-14-2010, 10:04 AM
I know the Broncos have been hocking the story of "Orton is doing great" all off-season, and there is some legitimacy to it - he looks better then he did last year at this point. But they are also ignoring a few worrying trends - he is throwing more interceptions at camp this year then he did last. The front office desperately need to avoid a quarterback controversy, and Orton desperately needs a solid season - he wants a 40-50 million dollar contract next year with any team not named the Broncos.

My own observations going to three camps three camps a week ago, the Invesco practice, plus two camps this week is that Orton's regressing right now. He looked extremely slopping on thursday, throwing three picks.

Orton is the starter, no doubt about it, but I would not be completly surprised if we see another Jake Plummer situation - great in camp, not so great in the regular season.

We find out for sure tomorrow.

lostknight
08-14-2010, 10:06 AM
he is...just depends on your body type whether you can add more mass on not.

Watching him in camp, I think it's feasable that he has put on some extra muscle. He is certainly in far better shape then last year, but let's also be honest - he's playing for 50 million dollars this year (assuming the Broncos don't franchise him).

Orton is very injury prone, but it's injuries that reduce his ability, not that knock him out of the season that's a problem. He has had serious damage to both his ankles. The ankle injuries tend to affect his ability to plant, and with his body, he doesn't really have any spare capacity in his upper body. His technique needs to be perfect to throw down the field.

WolfpackGuy
08-14-2010, 10:07 AM
Getting rid of that stumbling problem would be huge.

2KBack
08-14-2010, 10:12 AM
As expected on the Mane...

The incumbent can do no right. How dare they have positive pieces abut the starting QB.

vancejohnson82
08-14-2010, 10:16 AM
We find out for sure tomorrow.

I agree with almost everything you said up there except this (except I havent read anything about him regressing, and I havent seen him in person)...

he's not going to have any of the three backs we expect to see on the field with him and its the first preseason game of the year, and he's only going to play a quarter, at most.

Let's not read into tomorrow TOO much

broncosteven
08-14-2010, 10:17 AM
Having seen Orton in camp, while he does look much more comfortable in the offense and his throws have noticably more zip, I do think the media's going a bit overboard as to how well he's playing in camp. From the practice's I've seen he looks like the solid starter we saw last year against New England and San Diego - not much better and not much worse. Now you could say that if he we're to play at that level all season the team could have a nice record - but I'm worried how he'll hold up behind this patchwork OL.

So he is no Tom Brady?

LOL





I am KIDDING.

lostknight
08-14-2010, 10:19 AM
I agree with almost everything you said up there except this (except I havent read anything about him regressing, and I havent seen him in person)...

he's not going to have any of the three backs we expect to see on the field with him and its the first preseason game of the year, and he's only going to play a quarter, at most.

Let's not read into tomorrow TOO much

True, and everyone needs to anticipate that with the OL issues we have right now, that all three quarterbacks are going to have off days.

vancejohnson82
08-14-2010, 10:23 AM
True, and everyone needs to anticipate that with the OL issues we have right now, that all three quarterbacks are going to have off days.

Exactly....I sort of expect the game to be a mess tomorrow....I'm not expecting much from the offense but I am excited to see how J-Will holds up in the middle and looking for Ayers to take a step forward. That would be nice to see.

Also looking forward to seeing D. Thomas for the first time..

Jay3
08-14-2010, 10:34 AM
I don't have my own eyes to tell me anything, but I think Orton is being overhyped based just on practice.

He's a sixth-year pro, second year in the system. What kind of walking disaster would he have to be not to look steady in practice?

Practice? We talkin' bout practice, man . . . .

There's been a lot of effort put into observing how good he looks running plays in practice. And maybe he does. But it's not a great indicator at this point. The other two quarterbacks are new to the system. Tebow is new to the NFL and the speed of the game.

It seems to me like some people seem almost relieved that Kyle looked better on day one. That's odd -- could it possibly have been any other way? The tough stretch run will be the test, when opposing defenses are loading up on whatever weaknesses they think they've found from watching him on film.

steeledude
08-14-2010, 10:37 AM
Darius Watts makes Ashley Lelie expendable.

Corey Jackson is going to tear it up this year.

Jarvis Moss is the most natural, easiest coached of the rookies.

New fire exists in (endless wide receiver picks and free agents)

Marcus Thomas can do a back flip


Orton is amazing.

Jay3
08-14-2010, 10:38 AM
I've even noticed some people laying a foundation for the idea that Orton was "force fed" the whole offense last year, and that's why he looked shaky in the preseason. It's as if they've worried that Quinn and Tebow won't look as shaky (and they might) in the preseason, so they've already come up with a reason why Orton might have looked worse last year than those two do this year.

Which may have something to it, but it seems like a lot of effort that has no purpose. Kyle's getting the start and it will be much easier to judge if he's the answer or not.

The more interesting focus right now for me is whether Tebow can become the true #2.

Cito Pelon
08-14-2010, 10:40 AM
Having seen Orton in camp, while he does look much more comfortable in the offense and his throws have noticably more zip, I do think the media's going a bit overboard as to how well he's playing in camp. From the practice's I've seen he looks like the solid starter we saw last year against New England and San Diego - not much better and not much worse. Now you could say that if he we're to play at that level all season the team could have a nice record - but I'm worried how he'll hold up behind this patchwork OL.

I think Orton has mobility when he puts his mind to it. I'd like to see him apply himself to the mobility factor since that would be an improvement to his game. He's not totally incapable of moving around and running, far from it, he actually has decent speed.

Orton must have some mental block about running, because he has good foot speed. He's no Bledsoe or Marino, that's for sure.

Cito Pelon
08-14-2010, 10:45 AM
If Orton is to play well, the oline has to protect him, there's just no getting around that. While I'm excited about the big young guys coming in, I think it could be disasterous for Orton.

I still don't understand why Orton isn't a gym freak. He should have been in the weight room bulking up for the season. If I was Tuten I'd have really worked on his leg strength and his overall upper body strength. Orton should have packed on 5-10lbs of muscle this offseason...

Interesting point. I agree. Dude is only 27, he can pack on muscle at that age easily, and it seems like he probably should do so.

bap454
08-14-2010, 10:48 AM
If Orton is to play well, the oline has to protect him, there's just no getting around that. While I'm excited about the big young guys coming in, I think it could be disasterous for Orton.

I still don't understand why Orton isn't a gym freak. He should have been in the weight room bulking up for the season. If I was Tuten I'd have really worked on his leg strength and his overall upper body strength. Orton should have packed on 5-10lbs of muscle this offseason...

I just cant think of any exercises to build ankle muscle...let alone 5-10lbs. That would be some serious kankles to go with his neck beard. :~ohyah!:

oubronco
08-14-2010, 10:55 AM
Darius Watts makes Ashley Lelie expendable.

Corey Jackson is going to tear it up this year.

Jarvis Moss is the most natural, easiest coached of the rookies.

New fire exists in (endless wide receiver picks and free agents)

Marcus Thomas can do a back flip


Orton is amazing.

Well you could add Tebow is all world to that crap

RhymesayersDU
08-14-2010, 10:56 AM
Orton looks like a real deal piece of crap!


























I kid, I kid. I hope he does well.

diehardbroncosfan
08-14-2010, 11:28 AM
Here's hoping that Tebow has the opposite effect on Orton that Cutler had on Plummer. I'll be very interested to see what Orton looks like tomorrow and have no reason to doubt that this (with improved health) may be a much better season for Orton (and he was already pretty decent last year).

Tombstone RJ
08-14-2010, 11:30 AM
I just cant think of any exercises to build ankle muscle...let alone 5-10lbs. That would be some serious kankles to go with his neck beard. :~ohyah!:

Ankles aside, he should have worked on his legs period. He's gonna have to scramble and legs are everything when it comes to mobility and not being knocked down on the first arm tackle.

I'm telling you, Orton should have been a weight room regular bulked the **** UP.

This is the year he makes or breaks his bank account. He should have packed on some some muscle. He's not exactly known for his ability to take a hit and any muscle mass he has will help him withstand a rigorous season.

Hogan11
08-14-2010, 11:45 AM
As expected on the Mane...

The incumbent can do no right. How dare they have positive pieces abut the starting QB.

Just wait till Jax, when Quinn starts the season as the #2, people will flip out.

mr007
08-14-2010, 11:57 AM
I think Orton has mobility when he puts his mind to it. I'd like to see him apply himself to the mobility factor since that would be an improvement to his game. He's not totally incapable of moving around and running, far from it, he actually has decent speed.

Orton must have some mental block about running, because he has good foot speed. He's no Bledsoe or Marino, that's for sure.

Dude you're kidding right? He runs about the same 40 times as Kuper.... Orton is one of the slowest quarterbacks in the game, about the same as both Bledsoe and Marino.

mr007
08-14-2010, 12:04 PM
I'm not trying to bag on Orton btw. I sincerely hope he kicks ass this year... he just isn't remotely quick or even average.

KipCorrington25
08-14-2010, 12:45 PM
Here's the deal with Orton, he will always look fine in a controled environment with no rush but once he has to improvise, has to make a play happen, has to stretch the field it all goes to ****.

Beantown Bronco
08-14-2010, 12:54 PM
Dude you're kidding right? He runs about the same 40 times as Kuper.... Orton is one of the slowest quarterbacks in the game, about the same as both Bledsoe and Marino.

Orton had more rushing yards than half of the consensus top 15 qbs in the game last year. Straight line speed does not equal mobility when you're talking about QBs.

Beantown Bronco
08-14-2010, 12:55 PM
I'm not trying to bag on Orton btw. I sincerely hope he kicks ass this year... he just isn't remotely quick or even average.

You're judging him solely based off of what you thought you saw from a guy who had two flat tires last year. He is clearly AT LEAST average as far as QB speed goes when he is healthy.

mr007
08-14-2010, 01:28 PM
You're judging him solely based off of what you thought you saw from a guy who had two flat tires last year. He is clearly AT LEAST average as far as QB speed goes when he is healthy.

I'm judging him based on watching him in Chicago as well.... he is one of the slowest and least mobile QBs in the league. You tell me 15 QBs he's on par with and I'll agree. I can't name 5.

Pseudofool
08-14-2010, 01:34 PM
I know the Broncos have been hocking the story of "Orton is doing great" all off-season, and there is some legitimacy to it - he looks better then he did last year at this point. But they are also ignoring a few worrying trends - he is throwing more interceptions at camp this year then he did last. The front office desperately need to avoid a quarterback controversy, and Orton desperately needs a solid season - he wants a 40-50 million dollar contract next year with any team not named the Broncos.
To what other trends--beyond throwing some picks--are you referring? Because I don't buy the implication that the team is somehow generating press-praise to avoid a controversy or that Orton's desperations for a new contract somehow obscures his good play.

NYBronco
08-14-2010, 02:05 PM
You're judging him solely based off of what you thought you saw from a guy who had two flat tires last year. He is clearly AT LEAST average as far as QB speed goes when he is healthy.

Get him a decent and consistent Oline and running game and he is an above average QB. The way he played through his injuries last year is admirable even more so when you take into consideration other players that would whine with a questionable hamstring issue.

I'm all for Orton having an exceptional year in his second year in this system.

Beantown Bronco
08-14-2010, 02:23 PM
I'm judging him based on watching him in Chicago as well.... he is one of the slowest and least mobile QBs in the league. You tell me 15 QBs he's on par with and I'll agree. I can't name 5.

Eli Manning
Matt Schaub
Joe Flacco
Philip Rivers
Matt Ryan
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Chad Henne

These are just SOME of the QBs praised here that Orton out-rushed last year on two flat tires.

broncosteven
08-14-2010, 02:39 PM
Get him a decent and consistent Oline and running game and he is an above average QB. The way he played through his injuries last year is admirable even more so when you take into consideration other players that would whine with a questionable hamstring issue.

I'm all for Orton having an exceptional year in his second year in this system.

Sad thing is last year was normal for Orton, he has had to gut through every season he dressed for in his career. I hope he can over come the injuries, personal and on the OL, and give us the best chance to win.

WolfpackGuy
08-14-2010, 02:43 PM
Here's the deal with Orton, he will always look fine in a controled environment with no rush but once he has to improvise, has to make a play happen, has to stretch the field it all goes to ****.

Sounds like the Griese era/error.

lostknight
08-14-2010, 03:48 PM
To what other trends--beyond throwing some picks--are you referring? Because I don't buy the implication that the team is somehow generating press-praise to avoid a controversy or that Orton's desperations for a new contract somehow obscures his good play.

Orton did very well last year in the same manner that Jake Plummer did in 2005. They reigned in the quarterback, restricted plays and basically did things that were focused on short yardage completions. This led to a situation where we really were not able to sustain drives, because it took three successful plays every 10 yards to continue.

Put it another way - the reason we did so many bubble screens and passes behind the line of scrimmage is because they are damn near impossible to intercept.

To get around that this year, we are asking Orton to throw into the slot more, and on more go routes. These are the routes that the safeties are jumping, resulting in interceptions. That to me is worrying. Orton has, by far, the most interceptions of any QB in camp. (to be fair, Quinn would have more, but his balls are so inaccurate, it's not just the WRs who don't have a shot).

PR is important to teams. Last year, the message from the Broncos PR machine was that Orton's arm was strong enough, to deflect criticism for the Cutler trade. PR tells writers what and when to write - go look at the first field manual, and you can pick the paragraphs that the author wrote and regurgitated. The writers good enough to not do this, are the ones that are syndicated nationally, and even they fall into the official line.

Talking point memos. That's all they are.

Pseudofool
08-14-2010, 04:11 PM
Orton did very well last year in the same manner that Jake Plummer did in 2005. They reigned in the quarterback, restricted plays and basically did things that were focused on short yardage completions. This led to a situation where we really were not able to sustain drives, because it took three successful plays every 10 yards to continue.
I'm not sure Plummer is a valid comparison beyond the uniform and having a first-round backup.
Put it another way - the reason we did so many bubble screens and passes behind the line of scrimmage is because they are damn near impossible to intercept.

To get around that this year, we are asking Orton to throw into the slot more, and on more go routes. These are the routes that the safeties are jumping, resulting in interceptions. That to me is worrying. Orton has, by far, the most interceptions of any QB in camp. (to be fair, Quinn would have more, but his balls are so inaccurate, it's not just the WRs who don't have a shot). That's fair, but it's pretty speculative. What are the nature of Orton's interceptions? And are they indicative of his play, another player's play, or collateral damage from the system that we run? From the above paragraph it seems like your problem is more with the system than the QB.

PR is important to teams. Last year, the message from the Broncos PR machine was that Orton's arm was strong enough, to deflect criticism for the Cutler trade. PR tells writers what and when to write - go look at the first field manual, and you can pick the paragraphs that the author wrote and regurgitated. The writers good enough to not do this, are the ones that are syndicated nationally, and even they fall into the official line. I know how PR operates, and you might have point, if there wasn't ubiquitous praise of Orton. There were plenty of journalist last camp that were all too willing to buck the PR line and lay into Orton's play.

There's prudence, and then there's cynicism.

Popps
08-14-2010, 06:07 PM
Orton did pretty well last year. It won't surprise me to see him improve even more this year.

lostknight
08-14-2010, 08:43 PM
I'm not sure Plummer is a valid comparison beyond the uniform and having a first-round backup.
It's not fair in that Plummer just plain old didn't give a **** after they brought in Jay Cutler. It is fair that the Broncos hocked the "Jake Plummer had a unbelievable camp" line over and over and over, only to get exposed when the season started.

[quote]
That's fair, but it's pretty speculative. What are the nature of Orton's interceptions? And are they indicative of his play, another player's play, or collateral damage from the system that we run? From the above paragraph it seems like your problem is more with the system than the QB.


Mainly B-Dawk in the middle of the field - areas that Kyle Orton stayed away from last year. The system ends up being tailored to the players. Marshall has always had problem over the middle and on top, so we didn't do it much last year.

SoCalBronco
08-14-2010, 08:46 PM
Kyle has limited ability, but I appreciate his work ethic and efficiency. Hopefully he can do some good things this year and hold down the fort until Tebow is ready next year. Worst case scenario, we can franchise him for a year if Tebow needs a bit more seasoning.

lostknight
08-14-2010, 08:57 PM
Honestly, I think what we are going to see is that McDaniel's system is oriented around the passing game the same way the Shanny systems were oriented around QBs. Looking at Cassell in KC and what he was able to do in NE, and what Orton did last year, as long as you have a decent QB, you will get great production from him. Of course, our running game was destroyed completely last year.

I don't think there is any way Orton resigns here - too many other teams will be interested in his services, and he is going to want a 5 year contract. Denver would rather offer that money to Clady, and I suspect go with Tebow.

It's a business at the end of the day. They sell entertainment.

Pseudofool
08-14-2010, 08:58 PM
Kyle has limited ability, but I appreciate his work ethic and efficiency. Hopefully he can do some good things this year and hold down the fort until Tebow is ready next year. Worst case scenario, we can franchise him for a year if Tebow needs a bit more seasoning.
So you don't think Quinn will ever be a factor? In hindsight, the Brady Quinn pick up looks like a safe guard against a starting QB with an expiring contract and a rookie QB who might take more than a year to develop.

SoCalBronco
08-14-2010, 09:18 PM
So you don't think Quinn will ever be a factor? In hindsight, the Brady Quinn pick up looks like a safe guard against a starting QB with an expiring contract and a rookie QB who might take more than a year to develop.

Well that was the theory going in....if Tebow wasn't ready and/or the Broncos were unwilling to extend significant money to Orton, then Quinn was supposed to be the competent, veteran presence providing insurance and/or stopgap capabilities for at least a year or two, but from what we've read in camp, Brady Quinn has been struggling, sometimes quite significantly. It's been reported on several occasions that he's not even on the same general plane as Orton, which is troubling given the limited nature of Kyle's game.

Perhaps if he had a better showing so far, I'd feel better about that option....but its still early I suppose. Maybe he'll flash some good things in the preseason. The backs should help the QB's out in any case....I like the stable we've got now...between Moreno, Buckhalter, Black Hillis and Fargas, they'll take pressure off whoever is in there.

Mogulseeker
08-14-2010, 09:41 PM
What's up with all these new posters popping up on the mane giving their two cents, but not really contributing?

Must be the Tebow factor... we can only hope he becomes the next darling of the NFL and we get the Brady/Manning ref treatment.

Hogan11
08-14-2010, 10:34 PM
Well that was the theory going in....if Tebow wasn't ready and/or the Broncos were unwilling to extend significant money to Orton, then Quinn was supposed to be the competent, veteran presence providing insurance and/or stopgap capabilities for at least a year or two, but from what we've read in camp, Brady Quinn has been struggling, sometimes quite significantly. It's been reported on several occasions that he's not even on the same general plane as Orton, which is troubling given the limited nature of Kyle's game.

Perhaps if he had a better showing so far, I'd feel better about that option....but its still early I suppose. Maybe he'll flash some good things in the preseason.

It must be noted here in all fairness that our guys have been much more harsh in grading Quinn's performance than what we've seen in the general press. When it comes to Quinn, you're probably better off splitting the difference between the reports at this time.

KipCorrington25
08-14-2010, 11:13 PM
Orton did pretty well last year. It won't surprise me to see him improve even more this year.

Wow, low standards, all I have to say is "KC game," any Bronco fan that accepts that performance, ever, should give up...

Drek
08-15-2010, 03:41 AM
I know the Broncos have been hocking the story of "Orton is doing great" all off-season, and there is some legitimacy to it - he looks better then he did last year at this point. But they are also ignoring a few worrying trends - he is throwing more interceptions at camp this year then he did last. The front office desperately need to avoid a quarterback controversy, and Orton desperately needs a solid season - he wants a 40-50 million dollar contract next year with any team not named the Broncos.

My own observations going to three camps three camps a week ago, the Invesco practice, plus two camps this week is that Orton's regressing right now. He looked extremely slopping on thursday, throwing three picks.

Orton is the starter, no doubt about it, but I would not be completly surprised if we see another Jake Plummer situation - great in camp, not so great in the regular season.

We find out for sure tomorrow.
The starters always throw a ton of picks in McDaniels' camp and pre-season.

Just like last year he stresses having the QBs work outside their comfort zone and testing their limits. Orton threw an absurd number of picks in camp and preseason last year, then went over a quarter of the season without a legitimate pick in the regular season.

Orton is what he is though. He's a good, solid starter. In the right system (ours) with the right talent around him (maybe not ours) he could look like a fringe pro bowler every few years. But generally he's going to go out, make the right reads, take the safe passes, and not shoot you in the foot. If your defense and running game can pick him up he'll win you a lot of games. If they can't you'll loose a bunch.

That is what we saw last year. Our D stepped up and the ground game was ok early in the year, even then Orton needed some big plays late that where products of luck or receivers making something happen to deliver us to 6-0. When the D stopped playing great and the running game started to flounder to did Orton and we stopped winning games.

The solid starter doesn't win you playoff games though, and that is why Orton is unlikely to be in Denver for 2011. Short of him completely breaking his career mold he will not suddenly become an elite QB, just more consistently solid and reliable.

Beantown Bronco
08-15-2010, 06:57 AM
Wow, low standards, all I have to say is "KC game," any Bronco fan that accepts that performance, ever, should give up...

He threw for 430 yards with no Marshall, Royal and Scheffler, a patchwork OLine and a completely ineffective run game. If you're going to make an argument against his play last season, that's certainly not the game you should look to first.

lostknight
08-15-2010, 07:00 AM
It must be noted here in all fairness that our guys have been much more harsh in grading Quinn's performance than what we've seen in the general press. When it comes to Quinn, you're probably better off splitting the difference between the reports at this time.

Riiiight. Because fans at the game who all generally are saying the same thing much know less then the standard Broncos P.R machine.

lostknight
08-15-2010, 07:01 AM
So you don't think Quinn will ever be a factor? In hindsight, the Brady Quinn pick up looks like a safe guard against a starting QB with an expiring contract and a rookie QB who might take more than a year to develop.

If Tonights game goes the way practices this last week went, Tebow will be the number two on monday.

Cito Pelon
08-15-2010, 07:02 AM
Dude you're kidding right? He runs about the same 40 times as Kuper.... Orton is one of the slowest quarterbacks in the game, about the same as both Bledsoe and Marino.

Please. Did you see Orton sprinting downfield to congratulate Marshall in Washington last year after he completed those two long TD passes? Dude was zipping along very well. Even on the bum ankle late last season he actually ran about 12 yds for a first down and people commented how they were surprised he had that much speed.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
08-15-2010, 07:06 AM
Wow, low standards, all I have to say is "KC game," any Bronco fan that accepts that performance, ever, should give up...

Good point. Solid players never have bad games. Ever.

footstepsfrom#27
08-15-2010, 07:15 AM
Eli Manning
Matt Schaub
Joe Flacco
Philip Rivers
Matt Ryan
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Chad Henne

These are just SOME of the QBs praised here that Orton out-rushed last year on two flat tires.
71 yards sure generates a lot of interest.

Forget rushing yards...only a handfull of these guys look to run because they actually can impact the game that way. Mobility for MOST QB's is more about avoiding sacks and INT's by sidestepping the rush and buying time to throw. Orton is easily on of the least mobile guys out there as a runner. Anyone watching him can see he's no Vick or McNabb, and he's certainly no Tebow as a runner. With Peyton Manning's line that's not an issue. With ours, it is.

Orton needs to start IMO if for no other reason than Tebow doesn't need to be in there behind a patchwork OL that might get him hurt.

Hogan11
08-15-2010, 07:22 AM
Riiiight. Because fans at the game who all generally are saying the same thing much know less then the standard Broncos P.R machine.

Are you trying to tell me there's no bias in these things? C'mon, while I love the reports, over the years I've also realized that one has to take into account the leanings of the authors and read between the lines. Some make it sound like it's a minor miracle for Quinn to even dress himself and walk out on the practice field without screwing it up. He may not be the best QB in camp, but there's no way he's as bad as some make it sound.

Beantown Bronco
08-15-2010, 07:30 AM
Orton is easily on of the least mobile guys out there as a runner. Anyone watching him can see he's no Vick or McNabb, and he's certainly no Tebow as a runner.

Well that's pretty weak. You can replace Orton's name with literally any and every other QB's name in the entire league.

Rock Chalk
08-15-2010, 09:34 AM
Wow, low standards, all I have to say is "KC game," any Bronco fan that accepts that performance, ever, should give up...

I agree, the defenses performance in giving up 300 yards rushing was abhorable.

Broncos4tw
08-15-2010, 10:52 AM
I'll jump all over his bandwagon if he steps his game up. I don't care who our QB is, if we are winning PLAYOFF games. Not just racking up regular season wins. I always felt Orton was so.. average.. that as soon as the games against seasoned opponents were played, we'd go down the tubes. I don't want a QB that throws 4k yards and 30 TDs. I want a QB that wins playoff games.

He is looking great so far this year. I just want to see how he handles pressure, and if he simply dumps stuff off, or tries to make some plays. Honestly, Marshall being gone is a plus for Orton - he will be forced to play better.

Rigs11
08-15-2010, 01:44 PM
Gotta love all the people ragging on orton. Heaven forbid he has a good camp.he gets ragged on if he has a good camp, if he hadn't then all the Internet coaches around here would have their Internet egos validated.

errand
08-15-2010, 02:17 PM
Wow, low standards, all I have to say is "KC game," any Bronco fan that accepts that performance, ever, should give up...

Yeah cuz no other Broncos QB played poorly against the Chiefs....

HAT
08-15-2010, 02:31 PM
Honestly, Marshall being gone is a plus for Orton - he will be forced to play better.

Agree fully with this. I will never rip BM for what he brings to the field but I'd rather see a more balanced passing attack.

broncosteven
08-15-2010, 03:21 PM
Good point. Solid players never have bad games. Ever.

Elway had plenty of bad games. His worst came to KFC at Mile High in the snow. He couldn't make anything happen dispite a 7-14 score.

Everyone has down day's, we are all human.

The 2 games the team should have won over the last 2 years were the Buffalo game and Oakland at home. They came out tried then let it all slip away. Hopefully this year reverses the fade trend.