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epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 12:30 PM
North Korea has lambasted their soccer team and demoted the coach to a "builder" after getting annihilated 7-0 to Portugal (and thus failing in an "ideological struggle") in the first live sporting match in their country's history.

"North Korea's football team has been shamed in a six-hour public inquisition and the team's coach has been accused of "betraying" the reclusive leader's heir apparent following their failure at the World Cup, according to reports."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/7918468/North-Korean-football-team-shamed-in-six-hour-public-inquiry-over-World-Cup.html

Kaylore
07-30-2010, 12:32 PM
He's not so socialist. He's more like totalitarian communist. But yes, Kim Jong Il does crazy things because he's so ronrey.

gyldenlove
07-30-2010, 12:38 PM
When I come to power failing will be banned and will be punished by up to 12 months in a forced labor camp (aka Walmart).

I bet you Andy Roddick would win more tournaments if he knew he had to work the cash at Walmart for 6 months if he lost.

Smiling Assassin27
07-30-2010, 12:39 PM
Saddam Hussein, via his son Uday, conducted public head shavings in public stadiums for players that were part of draws or losses. They were spat on by Uday's bodyguards. Bad passes resulted in standing at attention in the locker room as Uday or his henchmen punched or slapped players down. Those were the easy punishments.

Many others were whipped with electric cables in military prisons. Many athletes just disappeared--shot and discarded.

epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 12:40 PM
When I come to power failing will be banned and will be punished by up to 12 months in a forced labor camp (aka Walmart).

I bet you Andy Roddick would win more tournaments if he knew he had to work the cash at Walmart for 6 months if he lost.

An ideological betrayal is certainly worth at least that. Although, I would recommend something more along the lines of being Barney Frank's house boy for a guy like Andy Roddick. ;D

Tombstone RJ
07-30-2010, 12:43 PM
He's not so socialist. He's more like totalitarian communist. But yes, Kim Jong Il does crazy things because he's so ronrey.

Actually, he's a totalitarian socialist dictator. Communism does not exist and never has existed as a viable political structure.

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 01:45 PM
Actually, he's a totalitarian socialist dictator. Communism does not exist and never has existed as a viable political structure.

Actually he's just maniacal a-hole who runs something that might slightly resemble bastardized "communism" Seriously, read the communist manifesto and tell me if any of these "communist" nations are all that communist. China has communist aspects, but its wholly very uncommunist. Communist theory is not meant to oppress people, humans **** it up. But its just another government that cannot exist in a pure form. Just like America couldnt exist as a complete capitalist nation.

That said, i find Kim Jong entertaining in a very sad way.

epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
Actually he's just maniacal a-hole who runs something that might slightly resemble bastardized "communism" Seriously, read the communist manifesto and tell me if any of these "communist" nations are all that communist. China has communist aspects, but its wholly very uncommunist. Communist theory is not meant to oppress people, humans **** it up. But its just another government that cannot exist in a pure form. Just like America couldnt exist as a complete capitalist nation.

That said, i find Kim Jong entertaining in a very sad way.

Communism and socialism both are prisons. The death toll at the hands of the dictators of those nations is mind boggling.

Thank goodness neither of them are in place here, and hopefully never will be.

jhns
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
That is a good idea. Maybe Bowlen should make the coach be a janitor for a week the next time we lose big to a crap division team.

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 01:54 PM
Communism and socialism both are prisons. The death toll at the hands of the dictators of those nations is mind boggling.

Thank goodness neither of them are in place here, and hopefully never will be.

DICTATORS and bastardizaton are the problems, dont generalize. As gylden, who lives in a socialist demo country, how horrible his life is.

epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 01:58 PM
DICTATORS and bastardizaton are the problems, dont generalize. As gylden, who lives in a socialist demo country, how horrible his life is.

If those countries werent industrialized into modern economies on the backs of capitalist nations, they would be Germans by now.

See...the problem with communism and socialism is that humans always screw it up, and that will always be the case. By nature it encourages these human saviors that rise to power with nationalistic fervor, and then those despots crush their own people because its within their power.

Communism and socialism are political philosophies for political elites, not for the people within the country. Thank God we have a country where the people can fight back against the political elite class through our constitution.

If you're into communism, do us all a favor dont go to the polls. Follow through with your beliefs, because you wont have a say in a communist nation.

Meck77
07-30-2010, 02:04 PM
On the flip side Al Davis will pay you a ton of money for sucking.

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 02:05 PM
If those countries werent industrialized into modern economies on the backs of capitalist nations, they would be Germans by now.

See...the problem with communism and socialism is that humans always screw it up, and that will always be the case. By nature it encourages these human saviors that rise to power with nationalistic fervor, and then those despots crush their own people because its within their power.

Communism and socialism are political philosophies for political elites, not for the people within the country. Thank God we have a country where the people can fight back against the political elite class through our constitution.

If you're into communism, do us all a favor dont go to the polls. Follow through with your beliefs, because you wont have a say in a communist nation.


HUMANS SCREW UP EVERYTHING. I identify myself as a pinko (i sympathize with the movement, but know it wont work), but will be a long fighter for the welfare state because it, at least, provides everyone a foundation. i'm a strong believer in community and that none of us, not one of us, can exist without it so it makes sense to take care of the community as much as possible. You do realize the ideals of socialism and communism is to support the middle class right? The proletariat. It gets bastardized because humans are awful, but its not like humans are not awful in a capitalist society. What we have in america and europe is a hybrid of the two...though in america its more capitalist and europe has more of a socialist leaning (though hardly socialist).

Hogan11
07-30-2010, 02:05 PM
Saddam Hussein, via his son Uday, conducted public head shavings in public stadiums for players that were part of draws or losses. They were spat on by Uday's bodyguards. Bad passes resulted in standing at attention in the locker room as Uday or his henchmen punched or slapped players down. Those were the easy punishments.

Many others were whipped with electric cables in military prisons. Many athletes just disappeared--shot and discarded.

That's why being the goalie on the Iraqi soccer team was the worst job in the world before the war.

Meck77
07-30-2010, 02:06 PM
[QUOTE=SonOfLe-loLang;2888775]HUMANS SCREW UP EVERYTHING. I identify myself as a pinko (i sympathize with the movement, but know it wont work), but will be a long fighter for the welfare state because it, at least, provides everyone a foundation

A foundation where people do not need to work as hard. That is what's happening in America now. I know a ton of people collecting pay checks from uncle sam right now and working on the side for cash. It's becoming the new American dream. I have nothing wrong with the safety net of unemployment but it's being abused and we all know it.

DomCasual
07-30-2010, 02:08 PM
Don't hate him for being beautiful.

http://rummage.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/kim-jong-il-twn.jpg

http://south-korea-esl-blog.eflblogs.com/images/North-Korean-leader-Kim-Jong-Il.jpg

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 02:10 PM
[QUOTE=SonOfLe-loLang;2888775]HUMANS SCREW UP EVERYTHING. I identify myself as a pinko (i sympathize with the movement, but know it wont work), but will be a long fighter for the welfare state because it, at least, provides everyone a foundation

A foundation where people do not need to work as hard. That is what's happening in America now. I know a ton of people collecting pay checks from uncle sam right now and working on the side for cash. It's becoming the new American dream. I have nothing wrong with the safety net of unemployment but it's being abused and we all know it.

That is beyond not true. While i agree SOME people might take advantage of the safety net, majority do not. I have plenty of friends out of work who send out hundreds of resumes and can't even get a call back. And i can't blame people for even doing what you mention above because, once upon a time, you could live comfortably in america on a lower salary. But unfortunately, as inflation has increased, the median income of the middle class has not. The american dream of a house, yard, on one income is loooooooooong gone. And that sucks. The system isnt perfect, but its not a throw the baby out with the bathwater solution. i think we can all agree on that

epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 02:12 PM
That's why being the goalie on the Iraqi soccer team was the worst job in the world before the war.

No doubt!

Requiem
07-30-2010, 02:22 PM
OK, lets get a few things straight since a few people seem to be left in the dark here. North Korea is one of five communist nations in the world. The others would be China, Laos, Cuba and Vietnam. This is something that no international political scholar would even attempt to argue. The ideology of North Korea is the Juche, which was Kim Il-sung's personal variation of Marxism-Leninism. Kaylore was correct in the reference to it being a totalitarian regime. The socialism aspect of North Korea comes from their highly nationalized economy. A state with an ideological background with its roots in communism, with its economic enterprise being the equivalent to a socialist system due to it's highly nationalized nature.

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 02:25 PM
OK, lets get a few things straight since a few people seem to be left in the dark here. North Korea is one of five communist nations in the world. The others would be China, Laos, Cuba and Vietnam. This is something that no international political scholar would even attempt to argue. The ideology of North Korea is the Juche, which was Kim Il-sung's personal variation of Marxism-Leninism. Kaylore was correct in the reference to it being a totalitarian regime. The socialism aspect of North Korea comes from their highly nationalized economy. A state with an ideological background with its roots in communism, with its economic enterprise being the equivalent to a socialist system due to it's highly nationalized nature.

But something that cannot be dismissed about North Korea is the fact that they are poor as **** and have alienated the world with the totalitarian regime and their bluster.

epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 02:27 PM
Don't hate him for being beautiful.

http://rummage.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/kim-jong-il-twn.jpg

http://south-korea-esl-blog.eflblogs.com/images/North-Korean-leader-Kim-Jong-Il.jpg

Supreme Nipple Hair

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 02:32 PM
Supreme Nipple Hair

Dont make fun of him too much. Dont you know that he doesnt take ****s, and the first time he ever golfed he had 11 holes in one? TRUE STORY! Just ask the north korean media :)

epicSocialism4tw
07-30-2010, 02:34 PM
Dont make fun of him too much. Dont you know that he doesnt take ****s, and the first time he ever golfed he had 11 holes in one? TRUE STORY! Just ask the north korean media :)

I dont know what all that stuff on the table is, but it looks like a rudimentary crack or meth pipe and a few Korean versions of Natty light. Ha!

SonOfLe-loLang
07-30-2010, 02:36 PM
I dont know what all that stuff on the table is, but it looks like a rudimentary crack or meth pipe and a few Korean versions of Natty light. Ha!

ha! i didnt even notice that...that pic should be someones avatar

Requiem
07-30-2010, 02:39 PM
But something that cannot be dismissed about North Korea is the fact that they are poor as **** and have alienated the world with the totalitarian regime and their bluster.

Agreed. I wasn't attempting to ignore that, I thought it was pretty much self-evident, I was just helping Tombstone and others find the right direction regarding the proper classification of their political system, which you alluded to, has negatively impacted their population and ability to interact on the world stage.

That One Guy
07-30-2010, 04:48 PM
That is beyond not true. While i agree SOME people might take advantage of the safety net, majority do not. I have plenty of friends out of work who send out hundreds of resumes and can't even get a call back. And i can't blame people for even doing what you mention above because, once upon a time, you could live comfortably in america on a lower salary. But unfortunately, as inflation has increased, the median income of the middle class has not. The american dream of a house, yard, on one income is loooooooooong gone. And that sucks. The system isnt perfect, but its not a throw the baby out with the bathwater solution. i think we can all agree on that

The idea of living on a single income seems impossible because the standards we're setting for ourselves is comparing to a dual income family. If you're content with living in a house that meets the standards for a habitable abode and you're OK with just one family car, you'll be fine. If you want a car for each adult, one for any kids over 16, cell phones for every member of your family, 18 gazillion channels on tv, etc then you better have two incomes to do it.

If someone wanted to live in an old trailer and drive a 1988 Mercury Topaz as the family car, they could exist on just about any single income. Nobody wants to though. Also, running up credit makes the situation even more difficult...

Tombstone RJ
07-30-2010, 05:08 PM
Agreed. I wasn't attempting to ignore that, I thought it was pretty much self-evident, I was just helping Tombstone and others find the right direction regarding the proper classification of their political system, which you alluded to, has negatively impacted their population and ability to interact on the world stage.

A truly communist state has never existed. Communism only exists in theory. Many nations have tried, but every one that has tried has failed and remains a socialistic state where the government owns everything. N. Korea is a socialistic state ruled by one leader.

Paladin
07-30-2010, 05:15 PM
Well, he ought to be cashing in his alien passport fairly soon. He can have a brewski with Greasy Al....

ZachKC
07-30-2010, 11:31 PM
A truly communist state has never existed. Communism only exists in theory. Many nations have tried, but every one that has tried has failed and remains a socialistic state where the government owns everything. N. Korea is a socialistic state ruled by one leader.

CIA World Fact book disagrees.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/kn.html

"Government type:

Communist state one-man dictatorship"

Tombstone RJ
07-30-2010, 11:40 PM
CIA World Fact book disagrees.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/kn.html

"Government type:

Communist state one-man dictatorship"


https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/flags/flagtemplate_kn.html

Funny, their flag symbolizes socialism. Read the description.

Requiem
07-31-2010, 12:01 AM
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/flags/flagtemplate_kn.html

Funny, their flag symbolizes socialism. Read the description.

Yeah, because their economic system is nationalized and socialist by nature. Would make sense, right?

You've tried arguing this point time and time again, but you continuously make an ass of yourself by doing so.

The five communist states that exist have their own variants in ideology because of the people who began rule decided to pick and choose pieces of Communist doctrine and attempt to make it uniquely their own. China, Vietnam, Cuba and Laos all profess themselves as Communist states. The entire international community does as well.

What is your evidence to suggest otherwise?

Do you realize how stupid of an argument you are attempting to make, right?

I hope you understand that you are at odds with the entire political science community and people who deal with international relations and political ideologies and make their living doing so.

Zach offers a designation from the CIA World Factbook, which states North Korea being a Communist nation. You use the same website and look at a graphic of a flag and see the word "socialism" and attempt to use it to fit your backwards logic.

I feel sorry that you'd actually lie to yourself in order to perceive yourself as right.

Tombstone RJ
07-31-2010, 12:10 AM
Yeah, because their economic system is nationalized and socialist by nature. Would make sense, right?

You've tried arguing this point time and time again, but you continuously make an ass of yourself by doing so.

The five communist states that exist have their own variants in ideology because of the people who began rule decided to pick and choose pieces of Communist doctrine and attempt to make it uniquely their own. China, Vietnam, Cuba and Laos all profess themselves as Communist states. The entire international community does as well.

What is your evidence to suggest otherwise?

Do you realize how stupid of an argument you are attempting to make, right?

I hope you understand that you are at odds with the entire political science community and people who deal with international relations and political ideologies and make their living doing so.

Zach offers a designation from the CIA World Factbook, which states North Korea being a Communist nation. You use the same website and look at a graphic of a flag and see the word "socialism" and attempt to use it to fit your backwards logic.

I feel sorry that you'd actually lie to yourself in order to perceive yourself as right.

N. Korea also describes itself as being a democratic state:

Country name:
conventional long form: Democratic People's Republic of Korea
conventional short form: North Korea
local long form: Choson-minjujuui-inmin-konghwaguk
local short form: Choson
abbreviation: DPRK

Just because N. Korea describes itself as a "Democracy" doesn't make them a democracy either.

N. Korea in reality is a socialistic state with one person at the top.

Requiem
07-31-2010, 12:20 AM
Their own designation has no bearing in this argument. I guess you are too stupid to realize that. Congratulations on presenting us all with a red herring though, I'm sure you are proud to be representative of a common logical fallacy.

And once again, no it is not. Are you really going to argue against the United States Department of State which designates it as a communist nation? The whole international community? One party dominates their politics, and it is the communist party. Please tell me how you have a country that is dominated by a communist party, yet isn't communist?

Wait, don't bother. Just do everyone here a favor and drink a bottle of Nyquil and pass out.

So far your evidence is the word "democratic" and that they have a star in their flag. I don't know if you were born with a mental disorder or are just plain retarded, but you aren't fooling anybody.

Requiem
07-31-2010, 12:31 AM
Government Type: Highly centralized communist state.

Political party: Korean Workers' Party (communist).

North Korea has a centralized government under the rigid control of the communist Korean Workers' Party (KWP), to which all government officials belong. A few minor political parties are allowed to exist in name only.

Of the five remaining Communist states in the world, North Korea is one of only two (along with Cuba) with an almost entirely government-planned, state-owned economy.

The list goes on. . .

Requiem
07-31-2010, 12:32 AM
If North Korea isn't communist, why is their trade only limited to like-minded, ideological, communist nations?

Tombstone RJ
07-31-2010, 10:10 AM
If North Korea isn't communist, why is their trade only limited to like-minded, ideological, communist nations?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism


In the schema of historical materialism, communism is the idea of a free society with no division or alienation, where mankind is free from oppression and scarcity. A communist society would have no governments, countries, or class divisions


Hmmm, that doesn't sound like N. Korea, does it. In fact, that sounds like the exact opposite of N. Korea.

El Jué
07-31-2010, 10:20 AM
...dont generalize...

Good advice.

HUMANS SCREW UP EVERYTHING...

Feel free to ignore it.

Natedogg
07-31-2010, 10:45 AM
Some stuff I wrote on Kim and his Father...

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2010/07/09/document-friday-kim-jong-il-the-%E2%80%9Cgreat-successor%E2%80%9D/

And some posts on how the 1978 World Cup in Argentina helped to prop of one of Kissinger's favorite dictators...

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/1978-world-cup-in-argentina-1/

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/1978-world-cup-in-argentina-2/

Some stuff on the most recent World Cup and political leaders

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2010/06/18/document-friday-world-cup-wagers/

And my favorite... "The Football War"

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2010/06/25/document-friday-the-football-war/

Jeez, I'm just now realizing how addicted to sports i am.... I pick documents about it --all the time-- lol.

Archer81
07-31-2010, 10:57 AM
North Korea is a communist state with dynastic tendencies and a governent owned and directed economy. Calling themselves Democratic is the same as the USSR being a collection of semi-independent "republics".


:Broncos: