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View Full Version : Who Will Emerge The Dominant Powerhouse Of The AFC West?


oubronco
07-13-2010, 02:47 PM
"This year is the Raiders' year," the fans write on boards, articles and web sites. They talk about it at work and debate everyday with fellow AFC West fans over the Raiders' chances.

The Chargers' fans have had the crown for years and have been able to lay it down without much to say from any of the other teams in the division. Of course, year in and year out Denver looks like a contender and seems to flounder in the second half.

KC, out of the AFCW, seems to be the team people should watch. Although they are often written off and disrespected by betting firms and NFL sites.

Eric Berry and Tim Tebow had some great battles in college. Now they will get to battle for years—twice at minimum—and entertain the fans of the Broncos and Chiefs. Tim Tebow will also get to face Rolando McClain, who at Alabama laid a hurting on the former Gator.

The Chiefs have gathered what appears to be the No. 1 running duo in Charles and Jones. Looking to relieve stress from Cassel, the Chiefs appear to have installed a serious contender for the top running team in the NFL.

The only problem is the offensive line. With the addition of Cassel and the progress of Bowe, you would figure the Chiefs would give Cassel time to look downfield. Next year, the Chiefs draft a LT with their first pick, no doubt in my mind.

They had the worst defense in the AFC West, but they had a better offense than Oakland.

Maybe Campbell changes that. Jason Campbell will at least have to be comparable to Kyle Orton, Matt Cassel and Philip Rivers for the Raiders to really compete. I would say he is serviceable like Orton. Cassel still needs to justify his paycheck, and Rivers is a top QB—period.

In fact, Rivers is the best player in the AFC West. His pieces may (or may not) change, but he is a difference maker as a player. He is knocking on the door and sooner or later someone is going to answer.

The Raiders had the 26th ranked defense and upgraded both the offensive and defensive lines. Heyward-Bey may produce this year. Should Campbell and Bey produce, the Raiders are looking at minimum two more wins. Rolando will help to make the rankings more respectable for Oakland.

The Chargers have no reason not to produce. Mathews looks like a very good back.

The AFC West will be the best division in football for running backs: Moreno, Buckhalter, Mathews, Sproles, Charles, Jones, Bush, Mcfadden and Arrington.

The Denver Broncos are my pick. Not just that, though, I honestly see Denver as having the most underrated receiver corps in the AFC West. Don't forget that Denver drafted what many experts seen as two of the top five receivers in this years draft. Add to that Royal, Gaffney, Stokely, Lloyd and Mckinney. Denver has some serious high performers.

They had the best defense in the division last year and only solidified it with a bigger and better line, veterans in the nickel and Parrish Cox who may be the steal of the draft.

Add into the mix the master mind that is Josh McDaniels offensively, and you get some real interesting things going on in Denver.

Tebow this and that wont matter much this year. He will have to see the field no matter what. Denver would feel the heat from the league if the rookie never touched green this season.

Should he work out, Denver will be the AFC West powerhouse by 2013 and may be the NFL's best team period. Tebow can change everything if he works.

If not, Denver at this point has two very serviceable QBs left.

San Diego has been the dominant team for six years.

Denver can't get over the hump.

Raider and Chiefs can't win.

That's all old.

This year is different. Teams in the AFC West are different in more ways now than in the last decade.

The NFL is ever-changing.

This year, I think San Diego finishes 3rd.

The Raiders fourth barely by one game.

The Chiefs second.

Denver will come in first. They will win the AFC West in 2010 and maybe for years to come.

http://app.bronto.com/public/?q=ulink&fn=Link&ssid=10573&id=iagvu3um7v75372odsdantfd5kgem&id2=ay863xqikel2j1bdcejws5kjd6zdo&subscriber_id=bxjxvysfpjynctexhjvxdpwyxibubae&delivery_id=axrwpklprgxsfthtizasecizwbuxbeh&tid=1.85p.C8ID6w~B8am.18kiv..C8ID7g~JHkw.C7oD6~FmH lB.l.C7oD7~puA.5Ip1Tw


:strong:

Taco John
07-13-2010, 02:49 PM
link?

oubronco
07-13-2010, 02:50 PM
there you go

Tombstone RJ
07-13-2010, 03:12 PM
I agree, Denver should win the AFCW. Denver has the best defense and if the running game comes around then I think scoring wont be as much of a problem. Some think Orton is the weak link but I think he's ready to take it to another level.

If the Bronco win the AFCW, McD should absolutely be named coach of the year.

vancejohnson82
07-13-2010, 03:16 PM
wow....i think this is the time of year when expectations start to get a little too high

Cool Breeze
07-13-2010, 03:25 PM
wow....i think this is the time of year when expectations start to get a little too high

For everybody!
It's called being a fan.
GO BRONCOS!

Tombstone RJ
07-13-2010, 03:33 PM
If the chargers slide then the Broncos have as good of a chance as oakland and kc to win the division, if not better. All three teams have serious questions to answer but I like the Bronco's defense and I like that McD is fixing the offensive line. I also like the fact this is year 2 for Orton and company...

crowebomber
07-13-2010, 03:55 PM
Despite Marshall's absence, I think the Broncos are a better team going into this season and I think they will improve on 8-8. With San Diego taking a step back (didn't really add anyone, lost Tomlinson and probably V. Jackson and Jamall Williams), I think 10 wins could grab the division. So, I don't think it's a stretch at all that Denver wins the AFC West.

broncogary
07-13-2010, 04:01 PM
They had the best defense in the division last year and only solidified it with a bigger and better line, veterans in the nickel and Parrish Cox who may be the steal of the draft.

:strong:[/QUOTE]

Where does he come up with that? I think we might have the best defense in the division this year, with the new defensive linemen, but the last half of last year we were pretty weak.

Naggle Nole
07-13-2010, 04:10 PM
The Chiefs have gathered what appears to be the No. 1 running duo in Charles and Jones. Looking to relieve stress from Cassel, the Chiefs appear to have installed a serious contender for the top running team in the NFL.

The only problem is the offensive line. With the addition of Cassel and the progress of Bowe, you would figure the Chiefs would give Cassel time to look downfield. Next year, the Chiefs draft a LT with their first pick, no doubt in my mind.

Is it just me, or do these two statements seem to be completely contradictory?
Hell, the Chefs are one of the most poignant recent examples with the exploits of Larry Johnson minus Roaf and Shields
While I agree that Jones and Charles are a formidable pair, I love how everyone is ready to crown them while ignoring arguably the most important component of a rushing attack

DomCasual
07-13-2010, 04:17 PM
This is the smartest writer I've read in years. He hits the nail on the head in every respect.

It's sad when media people don't like the Broncos.

Pro Broncos Media = Good
Anti-Broncos Media = Bad (and likely pedophiles)

Jason7730
07-13-2010, 04:45 PM
This is the smartest writer I've read in years. He hits the nail on the head in every respect.

It's sad when media people don't like the Broncos.

Pro Broncos Media = Good
Anti-Broncos Media = Bad (and likely pedophiles)

I concur!!

Ugly Duck
07-13-2010, 07:10 PM
I look at how teams finished the previous year to gauge whether they trending up or trending down. Sandy Eggo swept all games in the second half of the season. Denver had the worst record in the division in the 2nd half (worse than KC, worse than Oakland). No way would I pick Denver over SD.

Rabb
07-13-2010, 07:19 PM
Where does he come up with that? I think we might have the best defense in the division this year, with the new defensive linemen, but the last half of last year we were pretty weak.

yeah, but I doubt he looked at it that way...same as everyone else

we finished overall with good stats

Lev Vyvanse
07-13-2010, 09:12 PM
Notice how the closer you get to the bottom, the more it reads like a bizarro-world mock post?

boltaneer
07-13-2010, 10:08 PM
This is the time of the year for optimism...

watermock
07-13-2010, 10:26 PM
Notice how the closer you get to the bottom, the more it reads like a bizarro-world mock post?



<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Gh76oepKFc8&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Gh76oepKFc8&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

How Amusing.

watermock
07-13-2010, 10:31 PM
For God's sake, look at those pictures around his frameset.

Durango
07-13-2010, 11:15 PM
The Broncos won't sniff the division title. Tell me, oh optimistic ones, who, among the murderers row of Indy, at Tennessee, at Baltimore and home with the Jets do you think the Broncos will beat in late September and early to mid October? The Broncos will also lose at San Diego on a Monday night in November, at Arizona, although that one is up for grabs, to Houston at home the day after Christmas and probably to San Diego in Denver January 2nd, unless the Chargers already have the division wrapped up and they rest key starters. We have an ok QB, a bunch of talented rookies, a banged up LT and a crew of oldies but goodies on defense. 8 & 8 at best.

JJJ
07-13-2010, 11:41 PM
Defense-wise it could well be argued that SD had a better D than Denver. We gave up less points. There was no question in the second half of the season who had the better defense.

Still I think Denver is improving and SD may be slipping a bit so that last game of the season between the two will likely be relevant this year.

After two epic collapses in two straight seasons the Broncos may have enough to see the finish line, but without Marshall I doubt they have enough to get over it.

Archer81
07-14-2010, 06:56 AM
We will see. Crazier things have happened then the Broncos winning the AFC West.


:Broncos:

Rabb
07-14-2010, 07:07 AM
The Broncos won't sniff the division title. Tell me, oh optimistic ones, who, among the murderers row of Indy, at Tennessee, at Baltimore and home with the Jets do you think the Broncos will beat in late September and early to mid October? The Broncos will also lose at San Diego on a Monday night in November, at Arizona, although that one is up for grabs, to Houston at home the day after Christmas and probably to San Diego in Denver January 2nd, unless the Chargers already have the division wrapped up and they rest key starters. We have an ok QB, a bunch of talented rookies, a banged up LT and a crew of oldies but goodies on defense. 8 & 8 at best.

that's the spirit!

McDman
07-14-2010, 08:30 AM
We could win it but more than likely it'll be the chargers again. I think were 1 or 2 seasons away from becoming a really good team. Of course I won't be upset if I'm wrong and it happens this year.

baja
07-14-2010, 08:54 AM
that's the spirit!

Ya don't ya love it when fans start out the season expecting to be losers. Especally when it looks like we have the makings of a good team.

jhns
07-14-2010, 09:15 AM
Ya don't ya love it when fans start out the season expecting to be losers. Especally when it looks like we have the makings of a good team.

That is what happens when McDaniels is your coach and you replace pro bowlers with rookies/Orton.

I will say that I don't get how anyone has any expectations at this point. We have way to many factors that no one can possible know if they will work out or not. We will likely have rookies starting at multiple offensive positions. We have multiple guys with injuries already. We have a defense that was pretty horrible by the end of last season, and we have a full new d-line that we haven't seen play together. We probably will be starting Orton until McDaniels feels Tebow is ready and there is a chance Tebow sees the field this year.

I really don't get how you can expect them to be good or bad with so much change and so many unknowns.

jhns
07-14-2010, 09:23 AM
Also, there is another thing I need to add to the list of unknowns. We continued the revolving door at d-coordinator and went to an inexperienced one.

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 09:39 AM
That is what happens when McDaniels is your coach and you replace pro bowlers with rookies/Orton.

I will say that I don't get how anyone has any expectations at this point. We have way to many factors that no one can possible know if they will work out or not. We will likely have rookies starting at multiple offensive positions. We have multiple guys with injuries already. We have a defense that was pretty horrible by the end of last season, and we have a full new d-line that we haven't seen play together. We probably will be starting Orton until McDaniels feels Tebow is ready and there is a chance Tebow sees the field this year.

I really don't get how you can expect them to be good or bad with so much change and so many unknowns.

hi, my name is jhns and I am a broken record. hear me repeat. hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.

oubronco
07-14-2010, 09:40 AM
hi, my name is jhns and I am a broken record. hear me repeat. hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.

What was it you said?

jhns
07-14-2010, 09:46 AM
hi, my name is jhns and I am a broken record. hear me repeat. hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.

Have I told you recently that McDaniels is a dumbass and Orton is a backup QB at best?

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 09:49 AM
Have I told you recently that McDaniels is a dumbass and Orton is a backup QB at best?

yep, you've covered that angle ad nausium.

jhns
07-14-2010, 09:52 AM
hi, my name is jhns and I am a broken record. hear me repeat. hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.hear me repeat.

Have I told you recently that McDaniels is a dumbass and Orton is a backup QB at best?

oubronco
07-14-2010, 09:59 AM
Why The 2010 Broncos Will Be Better Than The 2009 Broncos

By Alex Sergejev (Correspondent) on July 01, 2010


Much of the media has seemingly determined that the Denver Broncos will do worse in 2010 than 2009.

The primary reason for this seems to be that most "experts" believe that the Brandon Marshall trade will result in a substantial drop in offensive production.

Additionally, the loss of Mike Nolan as a coach makes many feel their defense will be less effective.

Finally, it seems people believe that by drafting Tim Tebow, they somehow shot themselves in the foot.

However, a closer look at what is happening in Dove Valley shows that the Broncos have most likely improved a little since last season. They will almost certainly win nine or 10 games.

To demonstrate this, let's look at each of the major parts of the team, how they have changed since last season, and what that likely means for the season.

Offensive Line

Injuries have depleted their O-line. While that is never good, it is only May. Their guys will be 100 percent by September.

Every Broncos fan spent at least one day this offseason hating basketball.

Ryan Clady, their standout left tackle—the most reliable guy on their whole team along with Champ Bailey and Brian Dawkins—is down.

He might be back by Week 1, but even so, he will likely be rusty for the first several games.

Ryan Harris, their standout right tackle, has yet to fully recover from toe surgery to repair injuries sustained during the 2009 season. Russ Hochstein, possibly their starting center, is also currently hobbling.

They drafted three promising and physically imposing offensive linemen, who may be starting faster than initially expected if their veterans don't heal fast.

If their guys heal in time to be ready for Week 1, then their line should be among the best in the NFL with respectable depth.

If so, expect excellent pass protection and a healthy run game. If not, they get to see how good their rookies are in their first year.

If the unit is healthy, expect noticeable improvement this year.

Quarterback

Kyle Orton had a career year last year. He has returned and has had an entire extra offseason to process everything he learned in 2009.

Presumably, Broncos fans can rest assured that barring injury, our QB play will at a minimum, and be competent with some improvement over last year.
The QB position has improved in other ways as well.

Brady Quinn has replaced Simms as Orton's immediate backup (at least for now). Simms was so bad in back-up duty last year that when he had to come in for an injured Orton against the Redskins his play was bad enough to get him quickly benched in favor of the injured starter.

Many feel that Simms alone lost that game.

There is some controversy as to just how much better Quinn can be in Denver than he was in Cleveland—however, it is safe to say he is a substantial upgrade to Simms.
Finally, consider Tebow. Who knows what the more distant future holds, but this season the addition of Tebow will probably make possible some new gadget plays.

He will probably see some time on the field for short yardage scripted QB runs or wildcat type plays.

This position should be greatly improved this year.

Running

Last year, Buckhalter and Moreno were a very respectable duo.

Buckhalter, one of the more underrated backs in the league, can be expected to do exactly what he has done his entire career—quietly average about five yards per carry.

Moreno led all rookie rushers and was only half a field short of a 1,000 yard rushing season (note: he was over 1,000 total yards).
He should be much improved this year.

It has been reported that he has been working hard this offseason to add muscle and lower body strength. With the added strength and experience, expect him to break the 1,000 yard mark this year.

J.J. Arrington has been brought back. (Though whether it is for the season or just to be an extra body in the preseason is yet to be seen.) If he is kept, he will likely serve as a third and short yardage style bruiser.

Additionally, if Westbrook lands in Denver, he will be a nice addition to help bring Moreno up and to be a receiving threat out of the backfield.

Expect to see improvement this year in this unit.

Receiving

Much has been made of the loss of Tony Scheffler and Brandon Marshall.

Too much.

Scheffler is a very talented receiving tight end, and in Shanahan's offense he was a highly effective tool. But he was oft-injured, a problem in the locker room, and didn't fit their new power scheme (i.e. he couldn't block well).

Daniel Graham is a much better fit for their system as a starter, and Marquez Branson is a powerful guy with a lot of potential to shine in two tight end formations.

Marshall is unarguably among the top WRs in the NFL today. However, he was a distraction to the team and just wasn't a team-first, win-first guy.

Consider the black and white glove he was going to pull out a few years back after a TD reception—it was a touching gesture—but, at the time, it was a self-centered act that could have resulted in a costly penalty in a close, crucial game.

Even without Marshall, they are still left with a formidable WR corps.

Eddie Royal had a remarkable rookie year, yet for some reason had a terrible sophomore slump. Much of this is due to the fact that he was also the kick returner (where he played very well).

The head coach and the starting QB have stated that they felt they needed to figure out how to get Royal more involved. Expect to see someone else returning kicks and Royal to be catching a lot more balls.

Brandon Stokely remains one of the best slot receivers in the NFL and never fails to be among the most reliable guys on the field. A true heads-up, team-first player. Jabbar Gaffney also had a very respectable season (54 receptions for 732 yards).

Damarius Thomas looks like a true number one receiver who will probably have a respectable rookie season. He is struck from the same mold as BM. A huge guy with elite speed. He may end up being a top five receiver himself in a few seasons.

Eric Decker is probably going to have the most immediate impact of any rookie this season. He is another big guy. He is tough, has a huge receiving radius, and fights for the ball in the air.

One last note—in the final game of last season, in which BM and TS were both benched, the Broncos had their best passing game of the season as far as yards go.

All in all, their receiving corps looks to be about the same as last year. Some addition, one major subtraction.

Overall, it looks to be quite adequate.

Overall

McD should be well on his way to fully implementing his system. The Shanahan holdovers now have had time to absorb the new system and either buy in or get out.

Last year's acquisitions have had an extra year in the system. Those that are still here have proven themselves. Those that couldn't cut it have been traded or cut. This offseason's acquisitions by the Broncos should have a positive impact immediately.

Expect the offense to improve from 20th in points scored at 20.4 to game to about 15th or so.

An elite offense would be shocking, but a solid improvement should be expected.

Defensive Line

The Broncos added a lot of beef to the D-line this year.

In their 3-4 system, it is crucial that the front three be nasty enough to eat up a lot of blockers and clog the gaps at the line of scrimmage.

At 6'3", 348 lbs, Jamal Williams can do that.

Broncos fans know him as the dominating NT for the Chargers the last 10 or so years. While he is getting on in years and has battled injuries lately, he remains among the elite at his position when healthy.

Similarly, Justin Bannan and Jarvis Green add quality experience and depth. Notable returning players include promising young player Chris Baker, Ronald Fields (who had a respectable '09 season), and Ryan McBean.

If their FA acquisitions stay healthy and their younger returning players show the expected improvement that should come with an extra year in the system and in the NFL, then they can expect to see their D-line playing substantially better football this year.

Expect them to be pretty good.

Linebackers

Very little has changed as far as players in this group over the offseason. Marrio Haggan, Robert Ayers, D.J. Williams, and Elvis Dumervil will likely be the starting crew this season.

For the most part, last year's LB play was very good for the Broncos.

Dumervil led the league in sacks (the first time that has been done by a Bronco). Longtime veteran journeyman, Akin Ayodele, was added in the offseason.

Andra Davis was primarily brought in to stuff the run last year, but with the poor performance vs. the run down the stretch last year; Davis was cut.

Expect to see similar output this year against the pass and improved performance against the run. Dumervil should continue to be an elite pass rusher and Ayers should show huge improvement this year.

However, if the front three show as much improvement as there seems to be on paper, the LBs should look elite as a unit.

Corner Backs

This unit should be solid. Champ Bailey should continue to be among the best shutdown corners in the league.

Andre Goodman had a good year last year and should once again fill out one of the better CB tandems in the league. "Goody" had a respectable 44 tackles, one sack, and five interceptions to go along with his 17 passes defended.

Alphonso Smith had a somewhat quiet rookie year but, as he promised, he played like his hair was on fire and made a few spectacular game changing plays last season. He should continue to progress nicely.

Ty Law, who will most likely return in 2010, has had a brilliant career and ought to have enough left in the tank to be an effective player now that he has been with the team long enough to be familiar with his role.

The Broncos drafted two CB's this year. Their fifth round selection, Perish Cox, is thought to be among the top CB prospects in this year's draft.

The CB unit ought to be very solid yet again this year, anchored by one of the best in the league.

Safety

Brian Dawkins and Renaldo Hill were fantastic last year. Expect more of the same from these long-time, crafty veterans.

Promising young guys David Bruton and Darcel McBath ought to continue to progress nicely under the skillful tutelage of our vets.

Expect another solid year of out of their safeties.

Overall

The defense should see marked improvement this year. On paper at least, the D-line is much improved, which frees up their solid LB unit to wreak havoc.

Having such a strong front seven allows their secondary, which is one of the best in the league, to look even better.

If their team (particularly such important pieces as Jamal Williams) stays healthy, their defense will be a top 10 unit.

Special Teams

Matt Prater was among the best special teams players in the league last year. He was among the league leaders in touchbacks on kickoffs and he had a good year kicking field goals.

Last year their punter changed a little. However, Britton Colquitt is back and he shows a lot of promise.

In 2009, their special teams play was a strong point. This should remain true in 2010.

Coaches

In McD's first year, he changed half the players on the team and radically changed the system in all three phases.

In McD's second year as HC, he should be able to fine tune his system and his personnel to achieve improved results.

He has had one year to implement his system, review it, and tweak it based on results and player changes. Expect to see a more refined playbook this year, more schemes and play calling.

The most notable coaching change was the departure of Mike Nolan.

This was reported to be a mutually agreed upon split due to a difference in football philosophy. Don "Wink" Martindale is the new DC. It is not good to have five DCs in five years. Many credit Nolan alone for the defensive improvement from 2008 to 2009.

Time will tell if 'Wink" can cut it as a 3-4 DC but, if the players know anything, he should be good. The players are apparently universally confident that Martindale will be an excellent DC.

Side Note on Tebow Controversy

Many have stated that with the selection of Tebow, McD gambled his entire career.

What an exaggeration! Lets review the 25th overall picks of the past decade.

Chris Hovan (five years, decent), Freddie Mitchel (bust), Charles Grant (three good years, four bad ones), William Joseph (mediocre career, mostly a backup), Ahmad Carrol (basically a bust), Jason Campbell (Oakland's new QB, has had mediocre career so far, let's hope it stays that way), Santonio Holmes (great WR) , Jon Beason (Pro Bowl LB), Mike Jenkins (Pro Bowl CB), Vontae Davis (had great rookie season).

So over the past 10 years only about 40 percent of players taken at the 25th spot panned out.

Anything out of the top 10 really is not a must hit selection. Top 10 choices are huge investments.

First, they get the enormous contracts. A number one overall bust like JaMarcus Russell can devastate a franchise for years.

Second, with so many choices, a bad selection means you missed out on some other franchise type player that a smarter team will pick right after you.

At No. 25, there is not that much pressure really, especially considering the draft day trades that essentially resulted in the Broncos picking up Tebow for a fourth round pick.

The only pick they gave up to get Tebow that they had going into the first round was a fourth rounder. The other two picks they traded, they obtained that day by trading down from the 11th spot.

The media just has to make a big deal of the selection to save face because they were all wrong and Tebow is so high profile.

Conclusion

If you have managed to stick with me up to this point, then you hopefully see that virtually every position for the Broncos is improved this year, except for those that were all ready elite (such as safety).

Only WR is arguably worse than it was last year, but it is still among the better units in the league.

With the improvements in personnel, an extra year of fine tuning the system, and an easier schedule than they had last year, you can expect the Broncos to win nine or 10 games this year.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/4...e-2009-broncos (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/413919-why-the-2010-broncos-will-be-better-than-the-2009-broncos)

Couldn't get this to post in it's own thread so I just added it here, enjoy

Durango
07-14-2010, 09:59 AM
Ya don't ya love it when fans start out the season expecting to be losers. Especally when it looks like we have the makings of a good team.

OK, but please explain why there is room for optimism this year beyond the obvious fact that the season has yet to be played? I understand everyone is 0-0 at this stage. We have some serious issues going into training camp, much less the regular season, including the condition of Ryan Clady, the re-hab of Ryan Harris, rookies likely at key O-line positions, talented, but still rookie WR's, a middle-of-the-pack QB, although I personally do like Orton.

It looks as though the defense has been shored up some and I think that's great, but you can't win if you don't score and the offense looks worse, not better, barring a surprise Eddie Royal-like debut of Thomas or Decker. Moreno looks like Sammy Winder to me. I'm sorry, he just does, and Sammy was a good RB, don't get me wrong. Just not the franchise-type guy you might hope for with that high of a pick.

jhns
07-14-2010, 10:20 AM
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/4...e-2009-broncos (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/413919-why-the-2010-broncos-will-be-better-than-the-2009-broncos)

Couldn't get this to post in it's own thread so I just added it here, enjoy

This has to be the dumbest blogger I have ever seen. The entire blog is, IF this happens, we will be better at that position. IF these injuries heal all the way and IF these rookies turn out to be great, we are better at these positions. IF that happens, we are better at that position. IF this coordinator change doesn't have any impact, we are just as good there. So in conclusion, you can see that we are better at every position.

Yeah Mr. Blogger Guy, we can see that we are better everywhere IF all of those IFs go our way..... How can you write that article and have a definitive conclusion like that after all of those ifs? It doesn't make sense.

Rabb
07-14-2010, 10:20 AM
Ya don't ya love it when fans start out the season expecting to be losers. Especally when it looks like we have the makings of a good team.

yes, it's awesome...I cannot imagine how full of joy their day to day lives are

yerner
07-14-2010, 10:49 AM
I think alot of this season depends on Clady's health. Losing your best player who also happens to be a left tackle rarely works out well. I'm mean, can you imagine Orton with not blindside protection?

baja
07-14-2010, 10:55 AM
OK, but please explain why there is room for optimism this year beyond the obvious fact that the season has yet to be played? I understand everyone is 0-0 at this stage. We have some serious issues going into training camp, much less the regular season, including the condition of Ryan Clady, the re-hab of Ryan Harris, rookies likely at key O-line positions, talented, but still rookie WR's, a middle-of-the-pack QB, although I personally do like Orton.

It looks as though the defense has been shored up some and I think that's great, but you can't win if you don't score and the offense looks worse, not better, barring a surprise Eddie Royal-like debut of Thomas or Decker. Moreno looks like Sammy Winder to me. I'm sorry, he just does, and Sammy was a good RB, don't get me wrong. Just not the franchise-type guy you might hope for with that high of a pick.

Truth is no one knows how we will do but ask yourself would you rather be the fan in post #32 or the fan that expects a poor season. I just hope the players are more like post 32 than like you.

baja
07-14-2010, 10:58 AM
This has to be the dumbest blogger I have ever seen. The entire blog is, IF this happens, we will be better at that position. IF these injuries heal all the way and IF these rookies turn out to be great, we are better at these positions. IF that happens, we are better at that position. IF this coordinator change doesn't have any impact, we are just as good there. So in conclusion, you can see that we are better at every position.

Yeah Mr. Blogger Guy, we can see that we are better everywhere IF all of those IFs go our way..... How can you write that article and have a definitive conclusion like that after all of those ifs? It doesn't make sense.

It's called being positive try it you might like it. It is just as likely we have a season like the bloger paints or a season like you predict. Me, I find more joy in being a hopefully positive fan.

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 11:03 AM
This has to be the dumbest blogger I have ever seen. The entire blog is, IF this happens, we will be better at that position. IF these injuries heal all the way and IF these rookies turn out to be great, we are better at these positions. IF that happens, we are better at that position. IF this coordinator change doesn't have any impact, we are just as good there. So in conclusion, you can see that we are better at every position.

Yeah Mr. Blogger Guy, we can see that we are better everywhere IF all of those IFs go our way..... How can you write that article and have a definitive conclusion like that after all of those ifs? It doesn't make sense.

It's not a blog, it's an article written by a correspondent for the bleacher report. It's fine if you disagree with it but I'm pretty sure the writer gets paid to do his job and isn't some blogger.

jhns
07-14-2010, 11:10 AM
It's called being positive try it you might like it. It is just as likely we have a season like the bloger paints or a season like you predict. Me, I find more joy in being a hopefully positive fan.

I haven't predicted anything...

It isn't being positive that is the problem. It is the way he wrote the article. If you are going to say we are better everywhere, explain why we are better. If you are going to say we have a ton of unknowns, you don't finish it by saying we are definately better because of all of the unknowns. Again, it doesn't make sense.

I would say everything up until the conclusion is exactly what I was saying. We have a bunch of ifs that can go either way. I don't get why people would expect us to be good or expect is to be bad before even training camp...

Durango
07-14-2010, 11:14 AM
Truth is no one knows how we will do but ask yourself would you rather be the fan in post #32 or the fan that expects a poor season. I just hope the players are more like post 32 than like you.

I'm a season ticket holder. A lot of fans would like to be in my position. I've been to games for 30+ years and, only rarely have I had such a cynical view of the prospects of a particular team.

This team has some serious issues that cannot be solved simply through the process of practice and a great training camp. It's right there in front of us if you choose to look; Clady, Harris, rookies, early schedule. They won't go away. The personnel might get a better to some degree, but realistically, how much better? And I don't foresee disaster as you imply. I could see the season traveling the 8-8, kiss your sister route again. But 10 & 6? Super Bowl? Division champions? Great Scott man, get a grip.

DomCasual
07-14-2010, 11:16 AM
What a shocker. I hadn't looked at this thread since yesterday. In that time, jhns has pooped all over it.

jhns
07-14-2010, 11:27 AM
It's not a blog, it's an article written by a correspondent for the bleacher report. It's fine if you disagree with it but I'm pretty sure the writer gets paid to do his job and isn't some blogger.

The bleacher report is a blog site. Go to the main page and there is even a button you can press to get your own article posted on there. They just say it has to be original and not already posted on some other blog. Maybe they have changed it and some do get paid but the reason there are 9000 different writters is because anyone can put articles on there. They are bloggers.

baja
07-14-2010, 11:30 AM
I'm a season ticket holder. A lot of fans would like to be in my position. I've been to games for 30+ years and, only rarely have I had such a cynical view of the prospects of a particular team.

This team has some serious issues that cannot be solved simply through the process of practice and a great training camp. It's right there in front of us if you choose to look; Clady, Harris, rookies, early schedule. They won't go away. The personnel might get a better to some degree, but realistically, how much better? And I don't foresee disaster as you imply. I could see the season traveling the 8-8, kiss your sister route again. But 10 & 6? Super Bowl? Division champions? Great Scott man, get a grip.

I think 10 & 6 is a very real possibilty. Who said anything about a SB although I would not rule that out for the simple fact that we o not know and it is a possibility.

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 11:30 AM
I'm a season ticket holder. A lot of fans would like to be in my position. I've been to games for 30+ years and, only rarely have I had such a cynical view of the prospects of a particular team.

This team has some serious issues that cannot be solved simply through the process of practice and a great training camp. It's right there in front of us if you choose to look; Clady, Harris, rookies, early schedule. They won't go away. The personnel might get a better to some degree, but realistically, how much better? And I don't foresee disaster as you imply. I could see the season traveling the 8-8, kiss your sister route again. But 10 & 6? Super Bowl? Division champions? Great Scott man, get a grip.

Please tell me the last time you were this "cynical" about a Broncos team. I just think your shanahan blanky has been removed and you are panicing.

I've been a fan as long as you have (grew up in Colorado) and I see this team as finally heading in the right direction after 10 years of Shanahan mediocrity based on his ego rather than his skill as a coach.

jhns
07-14-2010, 11:32 AM
What a shocker. I hadn't looked at this thread since yesterday. In that time, jhns has pooped all over it.

You guys sure do cry a lot. Are you sure you are football fans? Maybe you meant to hit up the soccer forums and got lost?

baja
07-14-2010, 11:33 AM
It's not a blog, it's an article written by a correspondent for the bleacher report. It's fine if you disagree with it but I'm pretty sure the writer gets paid to do his job and isn't some blogger.

Although I like the article it is poorly written, I doubt he got paid for that.

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 11:34 AM
The bleacher report is a blog site. Go to the main page and there is even a button you can press to get your own article posted on there. They just say it has to be original and not already posted on some other blog. Maybe they have changed it and some do get paid but the reason there are 9000 different writters is because anyone can put articles on there. They are bloggers.

Why don't you try and post an article? Seriously, go ahead and try. You certainly think you know what you are talking about.

And, if your article does get posted no one here has to know it was you who wrote it. By the time it gets published on bleacher report you can simply post a link to the article saying "thought this was a good break down of the Broncos" and no one will be the wiser.

DomCasual
07-14-2010, 11:40 AM
You guys sure do cry a lot. Are you sure you are football fans? Maybe you meant to hit up the soccer forums and got lost?

Ironic Post of the Day (IPoD) Award!

jhns
07-14-2010, 11:44 AM
Why don't you try and post an article? Seriously, go ahead and try. You certainly think you know what you are talking about.

And, if your article does get posted no one here has to know it was you who wrote it. By the time it gets published on bleacher report you can simply post a link to the article saying "thought this was a good break down of the Broncos" and no one will be the wiser.

Why would I hide behind a blog piece? I give my opinions here without a middle man. I am also a pretty bad writer. How about I just start quoting my posts and tell you all I think they are good breakdowns?

Lev Vyvanse
07-14-2010, 11:48 AM
Why don't you try and post an article? Seriously, go ahead and try. You certainly think you know what you are talking about.

And, if your article does get posted no one here has to know it was you who wrote it. By the time it gets published on bleacher report you can simply post a link to the article saying "thought this was a good break down of the Broncos" and no one will be the wiser.

It's not hard to get published on the bleacher report.

Exhibit A:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/366740-broncos-commentary-the-broncos-dream-team

jhns
07-14-2010, 11:53 AM
Ironic Post of the Day (IPoD) Award!

It is funny that you guys are crying about my posts when the only thing I have said is I don't understand how you can have good or bad expectations with so many unknowns. What is so bad about that? You guys just are looking to get offended over nothing.

Anyways, a football fan can cry about what is going on in football. Football is important stuff. Crying about anything else just makes you a bitch.

Durango
07-14-2010, 11:54 AM
Please tell me the last time you were this "cynical" about a Broncos team. I just think your shanahan blanky has been removed and you are panicing.

I've been a fan as long as you have (grew up in Colorado) and I see this team as finally heading in the right direction after 10 years of Shanahan mediocrity based on his ego rather than his skill as a coach.

Alright, and you are right, I thought firing Shanahan was a terrible mistake. I would share some optimism if I saw any direction at all.

What direction? Younger yes men, as in former high school assistant coach, and coincidentally, the coaches brother now coaching the QB's? A new defensive coordinator every year? Nickel and diming your star players on contract talks? Ignoring the most crucial needs in the draft to serve your whims, gamble the teams future and toss around draft picks, even high draft picks like so much pocket change? That direction?

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 12:19 PM
Alright, and you are right, I thought firing Shanahan was a terrible mistake. I would share some optimism if I saw any direction at all.

What direction? Younger yes men, as in former high school assistant coach, and coincidentally, the coaches brother now coaching the QB's? A new defensive coordinator every year? Nickel and diming your star players on contract talks? Ignoring the most crucial needs in the draft to serve your whims, gamble the teams future and toss around draft picks, even high draft picks like so much pocket change? That direction?

Seriously?

I know that Shanny blanket helped you sleep at night but now you are really being unreasonably critical of McD. Shanny had nepotism too and it's rampant in the NFL. Shanny was the one who had a new defensive coordinator every year and why that's ok yet McD changing the d-coordinator once so far is beyond me. Again, this is a double standard by you. And, just because Shanahan paid huge contracts to many a bad FA doesn't mean that McX shouldn't be wise in how they structure contracts. Shanahan is the one who let good players walk (Trevor Pryce, Shannon Sharpe). For McD it's called due diligence and the good teams know how to negotiate. Just because McD hasn't drafted defensive line players does not mean he is ignoring the situation, he's adding depth to a pretty good defensive line and he's spending draft picks on other areas and it's far too early to know the results. Shanahan has the lousy drafting record, NOT McD.

So in reality, I see the things you are complaining about are many of the things Shanny failed at. It looks to me like you are projecting Shanny's failures onto McD rather than being the LEAST little bit patient with McD to see how it all pans out. JMHO.

HAT
07-14-2010, 12:33 PM
I haven't predicted anything...



Of course not. People like you seldom do.

Play2win
07-14-2010, 12:35 PM
Shanny was starting to let the inmates run the asylum. McD Definitely is NOT. (to me) Its a refreshing change.

Play2win
07-14-2010, 12:39 PM
Of course not. People like you seldom do.

I think you are giving him too much credit.

Durango
07-14-2010, 12:52 PM
Seriously?

I know that Shanny blanket helped you sleep at night but now you are really being unreasonably critical of McD. Shanny had nepotism too and it's rampant in the NFL. Shanny was the one who had a new defensive coordinator every year and why that's ok yet McD changing the d-coordinator once so far is beyond me. Again, this is a double standard by you. And, just because Shanahan paid huge contracts to many a bad FA doesn't mean that McX shouldn't be wise in how they structure contracts. Shanahan is the one who let good players walk (Trevor Pryce, Shannon Sharpe). For McD it's called due diligence and the good teams know how to negotiate. Just because McD hasn't drafted defensive line players does not mean he is ignoring the situation, he's adding depth to a pretty good defensive line and he's spending draft picks on other areas and it's far too early to know the results. Shanahan has the lousy drafting record, NOT McD.

So in reality, I see the things you are complaining about are many of the things Shanny failed at. It looks to me like you are projecting Shanny's failures onto McD rather than being the LEAST little bit patient with McD to see how it all pans out. JMHO.

Well, besides the personal insults, or baiting, not really sure which, explain to me the Shanahan nepotism besides the fact he had his son hold a headphone cord along the sidelines for a couple seasons. Explain.

Shanahan didn't have a new D-coordinator every season. He seemed to change up after each of his last three season, but dating back to 1995, certainly not every season as you stated. And McDaniels dismissed one of the best coordinators this team has had since Larry Coyer. Why? Don't know for certain, but probably something to do with his Napoleon complex and NOTHING to do with that which would better serve the franchise.

Due diligence on the free agents Dumerville and Bailey? Really? You keep your stars. You pay your stars. Yes, both floated out contract demands that were somewhere beyond Pluto, but that's what agents do. The next phase is called negotiating. It doesn't seem the Broncos are making an honest effort and both could walk. Due diligence my ass. On the cheap sounds more like it and before you claim it's the front offices' doing, remember McDaniels could easily influence the pace of the contract talks, but hasn't bothered. Due diligence. Ha!

Yes, Shanahan let some players go he should never had let walk. Pryce wasn't one of them. He looked like crap the final year he was here. Anyone could see the guy was picking up a check. He had to go. It was ridiculous to pay the guy the check he was getting for the performance he turned out his final season here.

Sharpe is another matter and Shanahan admitted he made a mistake there.

Projecting Shanahans' mistakes on McDaniels?? I don't think so. McDaniels owns every single one and if Dumervile and Bailey walk, the franchise will pay dearly. Terrible front office management. Absolutely criminal.

jhns
07-14-2010, 12:53 PM
Of course not. People like you seldom do.

People like me? This racist crap is allowed here now?

You are right though. I don't claim to be the second coming of Miss Cleo like some of you.

DomCasual
07-14-2010, 01:00 PM
Racist crap? What racist crap? Are we to infer something about your race from the letters jhns?

crush17
07-14-2010, 01:03 PM
Well, besides the personal insults, or baiting, not really sure which, explain to me the Shanahan nepotism besides the fact he had his son hold a headphone cord along the sidelines for a couple seasons. Explain.

Shanahan didn't have a new D-coordinator every season. He seemed to change up after each of his last three season, but dating back to 1995, certainly not every season as you stated. And McDaniels dismissed one of the best coordinators this team has had since Larry Coyer. Why? Don't know for certain, but probably something to do with his Napoleon complex and NOTHING to do with that which would better serve the franchise.

Due diligence on the free agents Dumerville and Bailey? Really? You keep your stars. You pay your stars. Yes, both floated out contract demands that were somewhere beyond Pluto, but that's what agents do. The next phase is called negotiating. It doesn't seem the Broncos are making an honest effort and both could walk. Due diligence my ass. On the cheap sounds more like it and before you claim it's the front offices' doing, remember McDaniels could easily influence the pace of the contract talks, but hasn't bothered. Due diligence. Ha!

Yes, Shanahan let some players go he should never had let walk. Pryce wasn't one of them. He looked like crap the final year he was here. Anyone could see the guy was picking up a check. He had to go. It was ridiculous to pay the guy the check he was getting for the performance he turned out his final season here.

Sharpe is another matter and Shanahan admitted he made a mistake there.

Projecting Shanahans' mistakes on McDaniels?? I don't think so. McDaniels owns every single one and if Dumervile and Bailey walk, the franchise will pay dearly. Terrible front office management. Absolutely criminal.


This post is so much fail I don't even know where to begin... wow.

Irish Stout
07-14-2010, 01:13 PM
Well, besides the personal insults, or baiting, not really sure which, explain to me the Shanahan nepotism besides the fact he had his son hold a headphone cord along the sidelines for a couple seasons. Explain.

Shanahan didn't have a new D-coordinator every season. He seemed to change up after each of his last three season, but dating back to 1995, certainly not every season as you stated. And McDaniels dismissed one of the best coordinators this team has had since Larry Coyer. Why? Don't know for certain, but probably something to do with his Napoleon complex and NOTHING to do with that which would better serve the franchise.

Due diligence on the free agents Dumerville and Bailey? Really? You keep your stars. You pay your stars. Yes, both floated out contract demands that were somewhere beyond Pluto, but that's what agents do. The next phase is called negotiating. It doesn't seem the Broncos are making an honest effort and both could walk. Due diligence my ass. On the cheap sounds more like it and before you claim it's the front offices' doing, remember McDaniels could easily influence the pace of the contract talks, but hasn't bothered. Due diligence. Ha!

Yes, Shanahan let some players go he should never had let walk. Pryce wasn't one of them. He looked like crap the final year he was here. Anyone could see the guy was picking up a check. He had to go. It was ridiculous to pay the guy the check he was getting for the performance he turned out his final season here.

Sharpe is another matter and Shanahan admitted he made a mistake there.

Projecting Shanahans' mistakes on McDaniels?? I don't think so. McDaniels owns every single one and if Dumervile and Bailey walk, the franchise will pay dearly. Terrible front office management. Absolutely criminal.

3 things.
1 - Regardless of why you think he was let go, Pryce has shown hes not a player who should've been let go so easily. In 2004 he was out all but two games due to injury, in 2005 coming off that injury, he still had 33 tackles and 4 sacks.

2 - McD has publicly announced he wants to keep Doom and will do everythin in his power to keep Doom. Its really more up to Xanders and what the front office can handle, not McD. To claim McD has done nothing means you're not paying attention... hes done almost everything short of calling out his employer for being a cheap arse.

3- Nolan and McD clearly weren't seeing eye to eye and they both make it sound like they mutually agreed to part ways. You think if Shanny weren't seeing eye to eye with a D coordinator, even a good one, that they'd stick around? Lets see Larry Coyer was dismissed after a defensive meltdown in the second half of the 2006 season, after proving in the first half to have one of the best defenses in the NFL.... Nope, Shanny would never have dismissed someone like Nolan.

DBroncos4life
07-14-2010, 01:19 PM
Please tell me the last time you were this "cynical" about a Broncos team. I just think your shanahan blanky has been removed and you are panicing.

I've been a fan as long as you have (grew up in Colorado) and I see this team as finally heading in the right direction after 10 years of Shanahan mediocrity based on his ego rather than his skill as a coach.

I don't think he was being "cynical" at all. The Clady and Harris injuries are very valid points when we all know that Orton isn't that mobile and has had a history of playing very poor when he is hurt. At this point in time the O-line has not been upgraded per se. I love the guys we drafted, but they are huge question marks on the O-line even if you don't agree with it. Personally I think the upgrade to not only the O-line but the WR's will take place more in year two then year one which is fine by me.

He also pointed out the early part of the schedule as part of a problem for our team. I can see that because our O-line won't have that much time to gel.

Even if the team struggles early on we need to finish strong. The flopping at the end of the season HAS to end.

jhns
07-14-2010, 01:28 PM
Racist crap? What racist crap? Are we to infer something about your race from the letters jhns?

Stop taking everything so seriously.

Race baiting is fun.

Everyone is trying to keep the middle class white man down.

Each of these responses work so I just posted them all.

baja
07-14-2010, 01:42 PM
This post is so much fail I don't even know where to begin... wow.


Begin at the begining

Play2win
07-14-2010, 02:46 PM
Begin at the begining

Huh??

I would have thought you would say something like, "Begin at the end, and once you get to the beginning you know you are done".

;D

Tombstone RJ
07-14-2010, 05:59 PM
Well, besides the personal insults, or baiting, not really sure which, explain to me the Shanahan nepotism besides the fact he had his son hold a headphone cord along the sidelines for a couple seasons. Explain.

Shanahan didn't have a new D-coordinator every season. He seemed to change up after each of his last three season, but dating back to 1995, certainly not every season as you stated. And McDaniels dismissed one of the best coordinators this team has had since Larry Coyer. Why? Don't know for certain, but probably something to do with his Napoleon complex and NOTHING to do with that which would better serve the franchise.

Due diligence on the free agents Dumerville and Bailey? Really? You keep your stars. You pay your stars. Yes, both floated out contract demands that were somewhere beyond Pluto, but that's what agents do. The next phase is called negotiating. It doesn't seem the Broncos are making an honest effort and both could walk. Due diligence my ass. On the cheap sounds more like it and before you claim it's the front offices' doing, remember McDaniels could easily influence the pace of the contract talks, but hasn't bothered. Due diligence. Ha!

Yes, Shanahan let some players go he should never had let walk. Pryce wasn't one of them. He looked like crap the final year he was here. Anyone could see the guy was picking up a check. He had to go. It was ridiculous to pay the guy the check he was getting for the performance he turned out his final season here.

Sharpe is another matter and Shanahan admitted he made a mistake there.

Projecting Shanahans' mistakes on McDaniels?? I don't think so. McDaniels owns every single one and if Dumervile and Bailey walk, the franchise will pay dearly. Terrible front office management. Absolutely criminal.

We'll just agree to disagree. I'm pretty certain that if Shanny was still the coach, you'd be a happy camper even if the team sucked. We are in year 2 of the McD era and instead of acknowledging that the team McD inherited had major problems, you probably want to instead reminisce about the 1998 Broncos team and how Shanahan was the mastermind of that team. Go right ahead, those were great years to be a Broncos fan.

These are exciting times. McD has shaken up a stale and boring Broncos franchise that was entrenched in Shanahan's misguided ways. I like Shanny, he's a great coach, but he was not a good GM. It's time to move on...

gunns
07-14-2010, 09:12 PM
It is funny that you guys are crying about my posts when the only thing I have said is I don't understand how you can have good or bad expectations with so many unknowns. What is so bad about that? You guys just are looking to get offended over nothing.

Anyways, a football fan can cry about what is going on in football. Football is important stuff. Crying about anything else just makes you a b****.

I don't hear anyone crying, until this post. I think what it is is hope and the fact there are as many unknowns among the other 3 teams as Denvers. Hope isn't a given, it's what you'd like to see happen with some players that seem to have the ability to make it happen. Once the unknowns become known, it's called reality and our hope is no more a reality than your cynical expectations. It's choosing a positive over a negative.

Homer Simpson
07-14-2010, 09:21 PM
Race baiting is fun.



Uhh
is this par for the course?

baja
07-14-2010, 09:22 PM
Uhh
is this par for the course?

no not really

400HZ
07-14-2010, 09:25 PM
I don't see any of the AFC-W teams emerging as a "powerhouse" at all. I think it will come down to Oakland and San Diego at the end.

jhns
07-14-2010, 09:42 PM
I don't hear anyone crying, until this post. I think what it is is hope and the fact there are as many unknowns among the other 3 teams as Denvers. Hope isn't a given, it's what you'd like to see happen with some players that seem to have the ability to make it happen. Once the unknowns become known, it's called reality and our hope is no more a reality than your cynical expectations. It's choosing a positive over a negative.

Not having expectations is cynical now? What happens when we don't reach your "positive" expectations? Are you going to call for people to be fired? How is that positive? I question a lot of what you are saying. You are putting a lot of pressure on the coach, the rookies starting in key areas, a new d-line, and a new d-coordinator.

I guess I will agree with you guys. I expect them to win the West. If we don't, I will join you all in saying we have failed. I still doubt McDaniels is fired for at least another year. I know, that makes me sad as well.

jhns
07-14-2010, 09:43 PM
no not really

Don't lie.

OABB
07-14-2010, 10:04 PM
That is what happens when McDaniels is your coach and you replace pro bowlers with rookies/Orton.

I will say that I don't get how anyone has any expectations at this point. We have way to many factors that no one can possible know if they will work out or not. We will likely have rookies starting at multiple offensive positions. We have multiple guys with injuries already. We have a defense that was pretty horrible by the end of last season, and we have a full new d-line that we haven't seen play together. We probably will be starting Orton until McDaniels feels Tebow is ready and there is a chance Tebow sees the field this year.

I really don't get how you can expect them to be good or bad with so much change and so many unknowns.


....because we understand football?

azbroncfan
07-14-2010, 10:36 PM
San Diego until they lose the division. They have a big advantage at QB over everyone else and that will go a long, long way in covering other weaknesses.

Florida_Bronco
07-14-2010, 10:58 PM
What direction? Younger yes men, as in former high school assistant coach, and coincidentally, the coaches brother now assisting the HC and OC in coaching the QB's?

Fixed.

KCStud
07-15-2010, 12:32 AM
SD will win it again. Rivers is the difference. The other teams don't have enough pieces. The Faiders don't have coaching or enough leadership, the Chiefs don't have the pieces and a lot of young talent hasn't proven much yet, and the Broncos lost their best weapon and have question marks in that area.

jhns
07-15-2010, 06:54 AM
....because we understand football?

Now that is good comedy.

oubronco
07-15-2010, 10:30 AM
jhns is this your facebook page?

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=255122697437&ref=search

jhns
07-15-2010, 10:59 AM
jhns is this your facebook page?

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=255122697437&ref=search

I don't have a facebook or myspace account. I may have to get one to show my support for that page though.

OABB
07-15-2010, 11:32 AM
Now that is good comedy.

Look jhiz, the only people who agree with your takes are dragsters/strafen, jesterdouche, a few other irrelevent and douchey posters and watermock. Do you see a pattern here?

Tombstone RJ
07-15-2010, 11:37 AM
I don't see any of the AFC-W teams emerging as a "powerhouse" at all. I think it will come down to Oakland and San Diego at the end.

Certainly, SD is the team to beat in the AFCW and if there is a powerhouse team in the AFCW, it's SD.

The favorite teams for the AFC are pretty much the same as the last few years with one or two exceptions. Indy, NE, Balt, Pitt (with big ben). The talking heads want to put NYJ is this category now too. Lombardi like Miami. If there is a powerhouse division in the AFC its the East.

Rabb
07-15-2010, 11:39 AM
SD will win it again. Rivers is the difference. The other teams don't have enough pieces. The Faiders don't have coaching or enough leadership, the Chiefs don't have the pieces and a lot of young talent hasn't proven much yet, and the Broncos lost their best weapon and have question marks in that area.

can't really argue with this, good take

jhns
07-15-2010, 11:45 AM
Look jhiz, the only people who agree with your takes are dragsters/strafen, jesterdouche, a few other irrelevent and douchey posters and watermock. Do you see a pattern here?

You forgot to include that little group called the rest of the world. The only ones that don't agree with my takes are extreme homers that have no interest in discussing the team rationally.

You are the one siding with this "we are better at every position and will win the west" crap. We haven't even made it to training camp. We were 8-8 and we have changed about a third of the starting lineup already. We have multiple starters coming off of injuries. The second most important position to the offense already has taken a major injury. We have rookies expected to start in multiple spots. There is a chance we even have a rookie QB starting. The defensive coordinator has changed again(doesn't really matter why). It is like you guys think play calling has nothing to do with player performance/team performance. Maybe it's that you think you know how good of an NFL coordinator Martindale is.... Again, we aren't even to training camp yet to see even a hint of what the team is looking like.

I would say I am being the rationale one here.

OABB
07-15-2010, 11:54 AM
You forgot to include that little group called the rest of the world. The only ones that don't agree with my takes are extreme homers that have no interest in discussing the team rationally.

You are the one siding with this "we are better at every position and will win the west" crap. We haven't even made it to training camp. We were 8-8 and we have changed about a third of the starting lineup already. We have multiple starters coming off of injuries. The second most important position to the offense already has taken a major injury. We have rookies expected to start in multiple spots. There is a chance we even have a rookie QB starting. The defensive coordinator has changed again(doesn't really matter why). It is like you guys think play calling has nothing to do with player performance/team performance. Maybe it's that you think you know how good of an NFL coordinator Martindale is.... Again, we aren't even to training camp yet to see even a hint of what the team is looking like.

I would say I am being the rationale one here.


rationale would be "It's too early to tell right now, so I will withhold my judgement."

douchey is "the rest of the world sees how right I am about mcdaniels being a bad coach before his second season"

do you see the difference jhiz?

I am not a homer, I am waiting to see. so, I am the rationale one here. you are a whiney crybaby like usual.

jhns
07-15-2010, 11:57 AM
rationale would be "It's too early to tell right now, so I will withhold my judgement."

douchey is "the rest of the world sees how right I am about mcdaniels being a bad coach before his second season"

do you see the difference jhiz?

I am not a homer, I am waiting to see. so, I am the rationale one here. you are a whiney crybaby like usual.

No douchey is not reading the thread and making false claims. That and calling names like a 12 year old. I would consider both of those far more douchey than anything I type.

OABB
07-15-2010, 12:58 PM
No douchey is not reading the thread and making false claims. That and calling names like a 12 year old. I would consider both of those far more douchey than anything I type.

what false claims did I make?

oh, and you are a douchey douchechowder.

jhns
07-15-2010, 01:09 PM
what false claims did I make?

oh, and you are a douchey douchechowder.

That whole thing about McDaniels being a bad coach has nothing to do with anything in this thread. In fact, everything you are saying makes no sense in this thread. You are claiming you have the nuetral view when you are arguing on the side that we should expect this team to win the west and that we are better at every position. This is somehow more neutral than saying I don't have good or bad expectations at this point because there are so many unknowns.

It's all good though. I get that you can't be rationale as I have hurt your feelings too many times.

OABB
07-15-2010, 01:15 PM
That whole thing about McDaniels being a bad coach has nothing to do with anything in this thread. In fact, everything you are saying makes no sense in this thread. You are claiming you have the nuetral view when you are arguing on the side that we should expect this team to win the west and that we are better at every position. This is somehow more neutral than saying I don't have good or bad expectations at this point because there are so many unknowns.

It's all good though. I get that you can't be rationale as I have hurt your feelings too many times.

my point(if you read it) was that you always end up in the same camp as our loser posters. and as far as understanding football, I think that getting bigger on the lines is an upgrade and adding a multiple probowler in the most important spot on d is an upgrade. our weaknesses on this team are interior lines on both sides, and Mcdaniels sees this.

are they going to be better? only time will tell, but there is nothing mcd has done to show that he doesn't understand football.

now you on the other hand always choose the negative which is why you are as respected here as mock.

jhns
07-15-2010, 01:23 PM
my point(if you read it) was that you always end up in the same camp as our loser posters. and as far as understanding football, I think that getting bigger on the lines is an upgrade and adding a multiple probowler in the most important spot on d is an upgrade. our weaknesses on this team are interior lines on both sides, and Mcdaniels sees this.

are they going to be better? only time will tell, but there is nothing mcd has done to show that he doesn't understand football.

now you on the other hand always choose the negative which is why you are as respected here as mock.

That's what I just said. I have hurt your feelings so much that you just randomly pop up going on about stuff that has nothing to do with the thread topic. You are even changing your stance now from what you just argued with a few posts ago. Suddenly we need time to tell if they will be better? You just argued with a post in which I said the exact same thing...

The whole thing about being in the same camp as other posters is again, your hurt feelings getting the better of you. I don't agree with them on about as many topics as I don't agree with you on. You just make up what I think about a lot of stuff because you act like a child.

Anyways, I have not even implied anything bad about McDaniels in this thread. I have not once claimed in any thread that he doesn't understrand football. These are all things that you are making up as you let your hurt feelings get the better of you.

I personally enjoy Mocks posts. I am honored to be as respected as him.

Tombstone RJ
07-15-2010, 01:55 PM
I'll stick with my posts that say the Broncos have a ligit shot at winning the AFCW. Arguments can be made one way or the other about how good this team is going to be but the reality of the situation is that both lines are bigger (and younger for the oline) and have way more depth. Orton is in his second year as is Moreno. Aside from the defense losing Nolan it is arguable just as good if not better than last year's unit and again, this is the second year for many of these guys. Martindale has never been a defensive coordinator but he has a good history of being a very solid LBer coach for Sandy Eggo and the players respect him.

The only real unknown for me is injuries (every team deals with injuries so that ain't no excuse) and special teams.

For all the crap McD took last year he and the team managed to win 8 games (while yes, fading down the stretch) and there is simply no reason (IMHO) to expect this team to be worse than last year's team. Coaches come and go so Nolan leaving is no big deal. It's not like the defense is gonna all of a sudden suck because Nolan isn't there...

baja
07-15-2010, 02:03 PM
I'll stick with my posts that say the Broncos have a ligit shot at winning the AFCW. Arguments can be made one way or the other about how good this team is going to be but the reality of the situation is that both lines are bigger (and younger for the oline) and have way more depth. Orton is in his second year as is Moreno. Aside from the defense losing Nolan it is arguable just as good if not better than last year's unit and again, this is the second year for many of these guys. Martindale has never been a defensive coordinator but he has a good history of being a very solid LBer coach for Sandy Eggo and the players respect him.

The only real unknown for me is injuries (every team deals with injuries so that ain't no excuse) and special teams.

For all the crap McD took last year he and the team managed to win 8 games (while yes, fading down the stretch) and there is simply no reason (IMHO) to expect this team to be worse than last year's team. Coaches come and go so Nolan leaving is no big deal. It's not like the defense is gonna all of a sudden suck because Nolan isn't there...

Larry Coyer was also a well respected lifer LB coach who got his first shot at DC for the Broncos and he did very well with the talent level he was given unfourtinately Shanahan fired him and he went on to do a steller job as the DC for the Colts, his current employer

OABB
07-15-2010, 02:07 PM
That's what I just said. I have hurt your feelings so much that you just randomly pop up going on about stuff that has nothing to do with the thread topic. You are even changing your stance now from what you just argued with a few posts ago. Suddenly we need time to tell if they will be better? You just argued with a post in which I said the exact same thing...

The whole thing about being in the same camp as other posters is again, your hurt feelings getting the better of you. I don't agree with them on about as many topics as I don't agree with you on. You just make up what I think about a lot of stuff because you act like a child.

Anyways, I have not even implied anything bad about McDaniels in this thread. I have not once claimed in any thread that he doesn't understrand football. These are all things that you are making up as you let your hurt feelings get the better of you.

I personally enjoy Mocks posts. I am honored to be as respected as him.


wow. just. wow.


you have said more about yourself here than I could ever say.

baja
07-15-2010, 02:10 PM
wow. just. wow.


you have said more about yourself here than I could ever say.

I also enjoy the personality know as Mock.

jhns
07-15-2010, 02:11 PM
wow. just. wow.


you have said more about yourself here than I could ever say.

Thank you.

oubronco
07-15-2010, 02:17 PM
I'll stick with my posts that say the Broncos have a ligit shot at winning the AFCW. Arguments can be made one way or the other about how good this team is going to be but the reality of the situation is that both lines are bigger (and younger for the oline) and have way more depth. Orton is in his second year as is Moreno. Aside from the defense losing Nolan it is arguable just as good if not better than last year's unit and again, this is the second year for many of these guys. Martindale has never been a defensive coordinator but he has a good history of being a very solid LBer coach for Sandy Eggo and the players respect him.

The only real unknown for me is injuries (every team deals with injuries so that ain't no excuse) and special teams.

For all the crap McD took last year he and the team managed to win 8 games (while yes, fading down the stretch) and there is simply no reason (IMHO) to expect this team to be worse than last year's team. Coaches come and go so Nolan leaving is no big deal. It's not like the defense is gonna all of a sudden suck because Nolan isn't there...

I agree who knows what will happen the question is will they be more like the first 6 games or the last 6 games of last year

NFLBRONCO
07-15-2010, 02:55 PM
The O is full of inexperience though depends on health and how quickly we grow as an offense. I have no idea what will happen this year. We still have lots of holes to fill. 2010 is just another step in the process.

DarkHorse
07-15-2010, 04:44 PM
SD will win it again. Rivers is the difference. The other teams don't have enough pieces. The Faiders don't have coaching or enough leadership, the Chiefs don't have the pieces and a lot of young talent hasn't proven much yet, and the Broncos lost their best weapon and have question marks in that area.

Agree

2KBack
07-15-2010, 05:40 PM
I've seen the statement that Denver has a lot of holes to fill. I don't really think that is the case. There are questions about many positions, but it is typically the same question repeated: Will the young guys that have been selected to fill these holes pan out. I don't think there are any weaknesses that have not been addressed, we are just waiting and hoping that they pan out.

Cito Pelon
07-16-2010, 09:47 AM
OK, but please explain why there is room for optimism this year beyond the obvious fact that the season has yet to be played? I understand everyone is 0-0 at this stage. We have some serious issues going into training camp, much less the regular season, including the condition of Ryan Clady, the re-hab of Ryan Harris, rookies likely at key O-line positions, talented, but still rookie WR's, a middle-of-the-pack QB, although I personally do like Orton.

It looks as though the defense has been shored up some and I think that's great, but you can't win if you don't score and the offense looks worse, not better, barring a surprise Eddie Royal-like debut of Thomas or Decker. Moreno looks like Sammy Winder to me. I'm sorry, he just does, and Sammy was a good RB, don't get me wrong. Just not the franchise-type guy you might hope for with that high of a pick.

Some people are natural optimists, some are natural pessimists.

Drek
07-16-2010, 11:31 AM
I agree who knows what will happen the question is will they be more like the first 6 games or the last 6 games of last year

I'd personally say that no portion of last season will be at all indicative of the 2010 season.

In 2009 McDaniels' offense was just beginning to be installed and he had a star WR who could not play either of the two primary roles he had established in New England for Moss and Welker (Marshall doesn't have elite deep speed and he's not a slot WR). So the entire offense was simplified and streamlined to let Orton work through Marshall. It lead to the misuse of Eddie Royal and a more vanilla passing game than McDaniels' norm.

In 2010 we will have three WRs who fit the three starting jobs within McDaniels' offense quite well. Gaffney has played his role before while in New England. Royal is now going to be in the slot where he would've been last year if there was another deep threat to put on the wing opposite Marshall, and Lloyd's best seasons have all come when used as a deep threat. To further that we have two young and talented WRs who will push the first and third veterans I mentioned.

To further overhaul the passing game, Orton will now go into his first full season after McDaniels, after making massive strides with short work the off-season before, and will also see the first training camp of his career where he is the defacto #1. He is poised to take the next step forward. That might not be a huge step, but even marginal improvement and we're looking at an entirely new passing game.

The lines are cause for concern because of Clady's and Harris' health issues. But the medical staff say they'll be ready so that is the best we can go with. In the meantime we've overhauled the interior and depth with new young talent. While some see this as cause for concern I only see optimism here. Hamilton and Weigmann played horribly in 2009, outplaying them is not asking a lot in 2010. The young blood we brought in are all experienced and highly productive leaders in college. There is no better template to transfer into the pro game than multi-year starting, smart, high motor interior OLs.

At running back I can't see how optimism is anything but the rule. Moreno was solid last year despite missing much of the off-season due to contract issues, then sprained his MCL in his first pre-season game, then played all year with said MCL lingering and with shoddy line work in front of him. If the young guys are any sort of improvement at all Moreno is poised to break out in a big way. Meanwhile Buckhalter is still going to offer an excellent change of pace behind him and we have a stable of young guys to battle it out and give us solid depth. While we did lose the excellent Bobby Turner we replaced him with a younger but also highly productive position coach in Studesville. He had a lot of success in a power man scheme like we're now looking to implement.

On defense its hard not to be optimistic. The DL now has three new guys you could easily argue are better than any three DL we had last year. Our star pass rusher is going into year two as an OLB, so further progression is to be expected. We replaced an aging vet at ILB (Davis) with two similar but healthier players. Either one can likely match Davis' productivity and we now have the depth behind the starter should we see another late season collapse. The front seven now largely hinges on Ayers which is cause for legitimate concern but it is far better than just about the last decade where the front seven had more holes than answers.

The secondary is where we really shine though. Our veterans might lose a step, but they're all good enough to where a full collapse is highly unlikely. Meanwhile the wave of young depth we brought in last year is now going into year two and likely to be much more helpful, especially McBath who likely could see time at either safety position and maybe even nickel back.

On special teams? Well, its hard to imagine our punting being worse than last year and last year we found what appears to be another good kicker.

And that is not even mentioning the offensive X factor that we have now in Tebow. He could produce a full reversal of our red zone woes if he is used as a situational wild cat guy in those situations.

Naggle Nole
07-16-2010, 12:44 PM
Incredible post Drek
This is the gold standard post for an optimistic realist's take on the upcoming season

BroncoBuff
07-22-2010, 08:13 AM
Incredible post Drek
This is the gold standard post for an optimistic realist's take on the upcoming season

Yup ... hammer, nail, head.

I'm actually more optimistic on the defense than his post, the only potential weak link imo is Martindale.

With the possible exception of Robert Ayers, all the players are there.

Durango
07-22-2010, 08:32 AM
Losing Bobby Turner is a bigger loss than a lot of people think, although your analysis has an awful lot of truth, Drek. I simply cannot see this offensive line coming together early given the health concerns of Clady and Harris you already mentioned. Everyone here marveled at the near-perfection of Ryan Clady his first year at LT, and for good reason. Rookies offensive linemen almost always have sharp learning curves, with the second year play usually much, much better than the first. I think most people would agree that LT and Center are the most critical positions along the O-line, with the possible exception being those plays where leftie Tim Tebow comes in for special packages. At Center, you're essentially the QB of the O-line, making all the line calls, and this year it will likely be manned by a rookie; JD Walton. That's not good news for either Orton or Moreno. So, I disagree this line is only a little concern. Rather it's the most crucial question mark looming over the entire season prospects.

dbfan21
07-22-2010, 09:05 AM
I am so ready for training camp to start. ;D

cmhargrove
07-22-2010, 09:08 AM
Losing Bobby Turner is a bigger loss than a lot of people think, although your analysis has an awful lot of truth, Drek. I simply cannot see this offensive line coming together early given the health concerns of Clady and Harris you already mentioned. Everyone here marveled at the near-perfection of Ryan Clady his first year at LT, and for good reason. Rookies offensive linemen almost always have sharp learning curves, with the second year play usually much, much better than the first. I think most people would agree that LT and Center are the most critical positions along the O-line, with the possible exception being those plays where leftie Tim Tebow comes in for special packages. At Center, you're essentially the QB of the O-line, making all the line calls, and this year it will likely be manned by a rookie; JD Walton. That's not good news for either Orton or Moreno. So, I disagree this line is only a little concern. Rather it's the most crucial question mark looming over the entire season prospects.

I love me some Bobby Turner - one of my favorite assistant coaches in Broncos history. However, the story of Bobbby Turner has walked hand in hand with the Gibbs/Dennison zone blocking scheme. Average players became good (Reuben Droughns, Mike Bell, Tatum Bell), and the good players became great (Terrell Davis, Clinton Portis). He has some good RB talent in Washington, so we'll see how that works out for him under Shanny again.

You have a good point about the ability of the new kids to gel in the system - that will be the focus of the offense. But, I got really tired last year of Moreno getting hit two yards behind the LOS on critical third down plays. Hopefully our new line gets a little more push.

Tombstone RJ
07-22-2010, 09:16 AM
I love me some Bobby Turner - one of my favorite assistant coaches in Broncos history. However, the story of Bobbby Turner has walked hand in hand with the Gibbs/Dennison zone blocking scheme. Average players became good (Reuben Droughns, Mike Bell, Tatum Bell), and the good players became great (Terrell Davis, Clinton Portis). He has some good RB talent in Washington, so we'll see how that works out for him under Shanny again.

You have a good point about the ability of the new kids to gel in the system - that will be the focus of the offense. But, I got really tired last year of Moreno getting hit two yards behind the LOS on critical third down plays. Hopefully our new line gets a little more push.

If Moreno can become the RB he is projected to be then the running game will be elite. I agree that the oline was not good, especially the interior oline guys, but they weren't horrible either. I think Moreno's timing was poor as well. He was not patient and he had some very bad footwork (probably due to his lack of understanding and nerves). So, the running game suffered from three major problems: 1. transitioning from a ZBS to a PBS 2. lack of push in the middle of the oline 3. rookie RB unfamiliar with the system.

broncofan2438
07-22-2010, 09:24 AM
Has anyone taken a glance at SD schedule. I think the league feels so bad they dont have a SB, they gave them the easiest schedule out there. The first 6 games are against below .500 teams from last year. Lame

Drek
07-22-2010, 10:12 AM
Losing Bobby Turner is a bigger loss than a lot of people think, although your analysis has an awful lot of truth, Drek. I simply cannot see this offensive line coming together early given the health concerns of Clady and Harris you already mentioned. Everyone here marveled at the near-perfection of Ryan Clady his first year at LT, and for good reason. Rookies offensive linemen almost always have sharp learning curves, with the second year play usually much, much better than the first. I think most people would agree that LT and Center are the most critical positions along the O-line, with the possible exception being those plays where leftie Tim Tebow comes in for special packages. At Center, you're essentially the QB of the O-line, making all the line calls, and this year it will likely be manned by a rookie; JD Walton. That's not good news for either Orton or Moreno. So, I disagree this line is only a little concern. Rather it's the most crucial question mark looming over the entire season prospects.
I think it is impossible to overstate what Bobby Turner did for this organization. No positional coach except maybe Alex Gibbs gave as much. But for this offense he just wouldn't be a good fit. I'm sure he'd still do a great job, but Studdesville gives us a younger RB coach with more gas left in the tank, an impressive record of his own, and significantly more familiarity with the concepts of a power man scheme.

Clady's success was a rookie was amazing, because rarely to rookie OTs perform from day one. But rookie interior linemen? Much higher rate of production. Many 2nd and 3rd round OGs and OCs have stepped onto the field as rookies and performed from day one. Walton has as much of a proven track record as you'll find and the right physical makeup for what we need. Do I expect him to be amazing? No, but an upgrade over Weigmann? Almost definitely.

baja
07-22-2010, 10:42 AM
I love me some Bobby Turner - one of my favorite assistant coaches in Broncos history. However, the story of Bobbby Turner has walked hand in hand with the Gibbs/Dennison zone blocking scheme. Average players became good (Reuben Droughns, Mike Bell, Tatum Bell), and the good players became great (Terrell Davis, Clinton Portis). He has some good RB talent in Washington, so we'll see how that works out for him under Shanny again.

You have a good point about the ability of the new kids to gel in the system - that will be the focus of the offense. But, <b>I got really tired last year of Moreno getting hit two yards behind the LOS on critical third down plays. Hopefully our new line gets a little more push.


This fact is why I can not understand the Moreno haters calling him a bust. The kid often did not have a hole to run through. He ws tackled before he could even make his first move that is how bad the line became after Harris went down. I am going to love bumping some of those old Moreno post in a few months.

azbroncfan
07-22-2010, 10:44 AM
Has anyone taken a glance at SD schedule. I think the league feels so bad they dont have a SB, they gave them the easiest schedule out there. The first 6 games are against below .500 teams from last year. Lame

Same games as us except 2 games which would of been division winners last year.

SouthStndJunkie
07-22-2010, 10:51 AM
I think San Diego wins the division this year and then start to tail off in 2011.

I think Kansas City is a team headed in the right direction.

I have no idea in regards to Denver and the direction of the franchise. I think we finish 8-8 this year and then kick ass or **** the bed in 2011....it will be one extreme or the other. I hope Josh is able to put it all together.

I think Oakland will be a better team with Jason Campbell, but still not a real threat any time soon.

Eldorado
07-22-2010, 11:06 AM
The Broncos will have the division wrapped up by week 12. It's going to be a ****ing massacre.

Br0nc0Buster
07-22-2010, 12:24 PM
I think all teams except SD will improve record wise this year
I still think SD will take the division though, but their gap should be closing

tebowisdabomb
07-22-2010, 03:33 PM
http://www.dynintel.com/pics/drooling-homer.gif