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montrose
06-06-2010, 07:40 AM
Highlights:

- "I will say this is the first time he's beaten me several times in one-on-one tackle drills, I think he's more comfortable with himself. He's playing faster. It's a big difference with him." - Wesley Woodyard

"I'm definitely more comfortable. Last year, everything was moving so fast. You had to stay on top of that, remember this, do this. Now it all comes back to you. You just get into a flow, and you can start to flow now instead of thinking." - Knowshon Moreno

"He's been impressive in terms of his pass protection, which as a rookie he could do it, but it wasn't always consistent. Now it's been pretty consistent. He gets open and he catches the ball in the passing game on a regular basis, daily, and should be an impact player in the passing game for us. He's in his second year, and he knows more what to do. We're expecting a good year from him in a lot of different ways." - Josh McDaniels

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2010/0605/20100605_080822_FooterBroncos060610.jpg

http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_15236372

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 08:01 AM
I think the people that know a few things realized last year Moreno is a pretty good tailback.

There was just an amazingly large cadre of posters in 2009 that figured it was cool to jump on the "ridicule anything Bowlen/McStupidhead/Xantax do" bandwagon.

CEH
06-06-2010, 08:23 AM
Highlights:

- "I will say this is the first time he's beaten me several times in one-on-one tackle drills, I think he's more comfortable with himself. He's playing faster. It's a big difference with him." - Wesley Woodyard

"I'm definitely more comfortable. Last year, everything was moving so fast. You had to stay on top of that, remember this, do this. Now it all comes back to you. You just get into a flow, and you can start to flow now instead of thinking." - Knowshon Moreno

"He's been impressive in terms of his pass protection, which as a rookie he could do it, but it wasn't always consistent. Now it's been pretty consistent. He gets open and he catches the ball in the passing game on a regular basis, daily, and should be an impact player in the passing game for us. He's in his second year, and he knows more what to do. We're expecting a good year from him in a lot of different ways." - Josh McDaniels

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2010/0605/20100605_080822_FooterBroncos060610.jpg

http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_15236372

I think you saw a different KO when he started fumbling and lost elusiveness with two hands on the ball all the time. Hopefully he can play faster and more elusive this year without the fumblitis in the back of his mind. Plus the rookie wall didn't help

As for the chart, 2nd year Emmit/LT and Walter averaged 100 yards per game and 10 TDs. I see KO closer to TJ than the other 3.
I hope not becuase TJ was a vagabound for serveral years before making a name for himself with a couple very good years in CHI/NY

Hamrob
06-06-2010, 08:28 AM
I'd like to think that the 2009 Broncos team was better than the 1990 Cowboys and 1975 Bears.

Moreno looked slow and out of control. He needs to speed it up and hit the hole quicker. If he does that, he'll have a much better season this year. I think we all expect that he's going to be better. The question is:

Will Moreno ever be an elite RB in the NFL...a player that was worth the #12 pick?

Dr. Broncenstein
06-06-2010, 08:29 AM
I have a theory. Moreno may be more productive if the defense is not allowed to have routine contact with him 3 yards behind the LOS.

broncogary
06-06-2010, 08:47 AM
I have a theory. Moreno may be more productive if the defense is not allowed to have routine contact with him 3 yards behind the LOS.

That's a crazy idea. How else can he prove he's a great runner if they don't make contact behind the LOS?

It's all part of the plan. :wiggle:

OABB
06-06-2010, 09:08 AM
I have a theory. Moreno may be more productive if the defense is not allowed to have routine contact with him 3 yards behind the LOS.

I think knowshon isn't good enough to dodge 11 tacklers all by himself. A 12th pick should be able to score a touchdown every play while playing beethovens fifth overture on a clarinet.

Knowshon is only good if he gets a couple of blocks and a whole. Any rb can perform when they get that for Christ sakes. We wasted a pick IMO.Buy a vowel.

elsid13
06-06-2010, 09:28 AM
A 2nd year player in the same system picked in 1st round better look good in OTA, or we have a problem. It is OTAs and no one is hitting each other or going all out, it to early to determine anything right now.

Drek
06-06-2010, 10:14 AM
A 2nd year player in the same system picked in 1st round better look good in OTA, or we have a problem. It is OTAs and no one is hitting each other or going all out, it to early to determine anything right now.

Whole lot of guys from the previous regime that was never true of though. Sometimes first rounders just miss.

Moreno had a solid rookie campaign despite numerous hindrances. He isn't going to shoot himself in the foot this year with a holdout so with a little luck (avoiding injuries) and a little help (better blocking) he could become a standout talent.

elsid13
06-06-2010, 10:22 AM
Whole lot of guys from the previous regime that was never true of tough.

Moreno had a solid rookie campaign despite numerous hindrances. He isn't going to shoot himself in the foot this year with a holdout so with a little luck (avoiding injuries) and a little help (better blocking) he could become a standout talent.

We read the fluff pieces before too like this one. Hopefully things click for Moreno, but we are not going to have good idea how he going to be this season, until we seen the first couple of games of the season.

But right now I not going to go overboard either way.

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 10:22 AM
A 2nd year player in the same system picked in 1st round better look good in OTA, or we have a problem. It is OTAs and no one is hitting each other or going all out, it to early to determine anything right now.

I thought after a year you'd come to your senses and stop sniveling.

SoCalBronco
06-06-2010, 10:24 AM
Glad to hear he is getting better. Any rookie must be given a reasonable amount of time to adjust to the league. I'm excited to see what he can do this year. Props to him for working hard on his game.

elsid13
06-06-2010, 10:26 AM
I thought after a year you'd come to your senses and stop sniveling.

I am sorry, guess you will have to drop me down on the superfan list again for point out that 2nd year pro should look better then a rookie.

Crushisback
06-06-2010, 10:32 AM
I think the people that know a few things realized last year Moreno is a pretty good tailback.

There was just an amazingly large cadre of posters in 2009 that figured it was cool to jump on the "ridicule anything Bowlen/McStupidhead/Xantax do" bandwagon.

For some reason some people need to see 80 yard runs to consider a tailback good.

Popps
06-06-2010, 10:32 AM
I have a theory. Moreno may be more productive if the defense is not allowed to have routine contact with him 3 yards behind the LOS.

http://thdonline.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/interesting.jpg

Drek
06-06-2010, 10:36 AM
We read the fluff pieces before too like this one. Hopefully things click for Moreno, but we are not going to have good idea how he going to be this season, until we seen the first couple of games of the season.

But right now I not going to go overboard either way.

He rushed for nearly 1K yards on less than 250 carries last year as a rookie. That after holding out in camp followed by screwing up his MCL in his first pre-season game. He also fought through a ton of early contact thanks to a massive decline in OL play that anyone could see. You really think there is no substance to having faith in Moreno taking the next step?

Fluff piece or no, he's a leading candidate for breakout player of the year in 2010.

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 10:37 AM
I am sorry, guess you will have to drop me down on the superfan list again for point out that 2nd year pro should look better then a rookie.

Elsid, you were Mr. Superfan when Shanny was in charge, Shanny could do no wrong. Any criticism of the Broncos, you got all torqued up about. Now you have a snide comment to make about everything in Broncoland.

It's not a stretch for people to say you were more a Shanny fan than you are a Bronco fan. Please.

Kaylore
06-06-2010, 10:47 AM
I have a theory. Moreno may be more productive if the defense is not allowed to have routine contact with him 3 yards behind the LOS.

STFU! We should of drafted Suh.

broncosteven
06-06-2010, 10:49 AM
Elsid, you were Mr. Superfan when Shanny was in charge, Shanny could do no wrong. Any criticism of the Broncos, you got all torqued up about. Now you have a snide comment to make about everything in Broncoland.

It's not a stretch for people to say you were more a Shanny fan than you are a Bronco fan. Please.

Isn't TSI the one in charge of gauging SUPERFANDOM here?

elsid13
06-06-2010, 10:57 AM
Elsid, you were Mr. Superfan when Shanny was in charge, Shanny could do no wrong. Any criticism of the Broncos, you got all torqued up about. Now you have a snide comment to make about everything in Broncoland.

It's not a stretch for people to say you were more a Shanny fan than you are a Bronco fan. Please.

Please, I think Shanahan was dam good coach, that earned little more time to straighten the ship, but I favor the team over any one player or coach. I have been pretty constant on everything when comes to the broncos and how I view them from today backwards, include my problems with Plummer, drafts, Shanahan and way the team failed to stick with defense coordinator or system. Fluff piece like this are just fluff pieces, no matter who is the head coach or the player they are talking about.

elsid13
06-06-2010, 11:03 AM
He rushed for nearly 1K yards on less than 250 carries last year as a rookie. That after holding out in camp followed by screwing up his MCL in his first pre-season game. He also fought through a ton of early contact thanks to a massive decline in OL play that anyone could see. You really think there is no substance to having faith in Moreno taking the next step?

Fluff piece or no, he's a leading candidate for breakout player of the year in 2010.

Drek

There are lot of players that show promise in their first season in the NFL, but the proof is can they built on it and adjust to what the defenses do to them when there is game film on them. Right now Moreno appears on the right track to be a productive back, but the things that worried me about him coming out of UGA still worry me, until I see how he performs in live games in upcoming season.

Dr. Broncenstein
06-06-2010, 11:07 AM
STFU! We should of drafted Suh.

Lease a tip.

Beavis rolls a honda.

Baked beans on the ground.

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 11:13 AM
Please, I think Shanahan was dam good coach, that earned little more time to straighten the ship, but I favor the team over any one player or coach. I have been pretty constant on everything when comes to the broncos and how I view them from today backwards, include my problems with Plummer, drafts, Shanahan and way the team failed to stick with defense coordinator or system. Fluff piece like this are just fluff pieces, no matter who is the head coach or the player they are talking about.

No, you gave the reasonable doubt much more favorably to Shanny than you've given to McDaniels. In fact, you've gone onto the side of doubt much more with McDaniels.

It's a matter of being fair, and you haven't been fair with McDaniels. You've picked on him way too much, you and many others. You haven't given him the fair chance you gave Shanny.

Tombstone RJ
06-06-2010, 11:21 AM
I'd like to think that the 2009 Broncos team was better than the 1990 Cowboys and 1975 Bears.

Moreno looked slow and out of control. He needs to speed it up and hit the hole quicker. If he does that, he'll have a much better season this year. I think we all expect that he's going to be better. The question is:

Will Moreno ever be an elite RB in the NFL...a player that was worth the #12 pick?

You really have no clue. Moreno had no patience and his problems stemmed more from this lack of patience than any lack of speed.

elsid13
06-06-2010, 11:28 AM
No, you gave the reasonable doubt much more favorably to Shanny than you've given to McDaniels. In fact, you've gone onto the side of doubt much more with McDaniels.

It's a matter of being fair, and you haven't been fair with McDaniels. You've picked on him way too much, you and many others. You haven't given him the fair chance you gave Shanny.

I am pretty sure that if the mane had existed when Shanahan first came in you would have seen the same "prove it" posts that you seen now with Mcdaniels. Shanahan due to his success earn more of grace period then any new coach walking into Dove Valley. Like I posted when Shanahan was fired, whoever the new coach was he was going to live in Shanahan's shadow, until he won in playoffs and Superbowl.

listopencil
06-06-2010, 12:13 PM
STFU! We should of drafted Suh.

Pass on Suh proves Beavis is illigit.

Suh or Koreno? Mortgagage a gerund!

A hamster ate my left eye.

listopencil
06-06-2010, 12:14 PM
I'll reserve my opinion of Moreno until I actually see guys block for him.

fdf
06-06-2010, 01:00 PM
Will Moreno ever be an elite RB in the NFL...a player that was worth the #12 pick?

Well, it's about 50/50 that a pick that high ends up a good player. He got thru his first season without serious injury. So his odds are a little better.

Here's to him tearing up the league.

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 01:23 PM
I am pretty sure that if the mane had existed when Shanahan first came in you would have seen the same "prove it" posts that you seen now with Mcdaniels. Shanahan due to his success earn more of grace period then any new coach walking into Dove Valley. Like I posted when Shanahan was fired, whoever the new coach was he was going to live in Shanahan's shadow, until he won in playoffs and Superbowl.

Well, that's no reason to attack him, that's the point I'm making.

I think it was no-class for people to jump all over McDaniels because he was the new kid.

Some of us thought that showed no class as Bronco fans. And justifiably so, IMO. So we told you that you stink as Bronco fans. I don't see the problem.

You tanked as Bronco fans, people pointed that out, what's the problem?

elsid13
06-06-2010, 01:54 PM
Well, that's no reason to attack him, that's the point I'm making.

I think it was no-class for people to jump all over McDaniels because he was the new kid.

Some of us thought that showed no class as Bronco fans. And justifiably so, IMO. So we told you that you stink as Bronco fans. I don't see the problem.

You tanked as Bronco fans, people pointed that out, what's the problem?


No class??? Come on, yes I have been critical of some moves, but that is the nature of being a fan on internet message board. Have you never expressed displeasure with moves of the team??? How do I "tank" being a fan, because of that???

All I pointed out, on this thread that it is OTAs and very hard for anyone not to look good at this time of the year.

Drek
06-06-2010, 02:08 PM
Drek

There are lot of players that show promise in their first season in the NFL, but the proof is can they built on it and adjust to what the defenses do to them when there is game film on them. Right now Moreno appears on the right track to be a productive back, but the things that worried me about him coming out of UGA still worry me, until I see how he performs in live games in upcoming season.

Of course you always have to wait and see how he turns out. I didn't see anyone trying to crown him league MVP in this thread.

Instead you where busy trying to downplay a young, talented player talking about how he was fixing the very flaws pretty much everyone regardless of football IQ could see him having last year.

Everyone needs to prove it. Fluff pieces like "the D is going to be aggressive this year!" are useless. A young player that anyone could see ran tentative and unsure last season saying "I ran tentative and unsure last season, but the offense is starting to click for me and I'm getting over that" is word of mouth evidence that he is making the necessary strides.

Does it mean he's a lock for the pro-bowl next year? Of course not. But it shows that he gets it and is making the right strides. After years of seeing these fluff pieces written about guys like Moss, Lelie, etc. where it was always "the system is going to fit me better, I'm going to work harder, etc." bull**** that wasn't real its refreshing to see a young player say "I wasn't up to speed and I am getting up to speed".

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 03:21 PM
No class??? Come on, yes I have been critical of some moves, but that is the nature of being a fan on internet message board. Have you never expressed displeasure with moves of the team??? How do I "tank" being a fan, because of that???

All I pointed out, on this thread that it is OTAs and very hard for anyone not to look good at this time of the year.

Well, it's kind of a cumulative kind of thing with you - and quite a few other posters. I can't discount all the times you piled on last season, piling on McD. You do remenber all the times you piled on McD in 2009, right?

Don't pretend like that's all passe, like we're so stupid we don't remember, elsid.

Doggcow
06-06-2010, 03:45 PM
Moreno will end the season as a top 7 RB in Fantasy.

Just sayin.

brncs_fan
06-06-2010, 03:49 PM
Moreno would finish with 3,500 yars and 48 Td's if Tebow was handing him the ball and parting the defense like the Red Sea!

:tebow:

elsid13
06-06-2010, 04:28 PM
Well, it's kind of a cumulative kind of thing with you - and quite a few other posters. I can't discount all the times you piled on last season, piling on McD. You do remenber all the times you piled on McD in 2009, right?

Don't pretend like that's all passe, like we're so stupid we don't remember, elsid.

Piled on? You never spent time in East Coast sporting radio market have you? You should see how those area teams coach get piled on.

I understand that see some moves in different light then me, but that doesn't mean either of us isn't entitled to own opinions. Or that either isn't right.

Also I am pretty sure that I have treated most of the posters (minus Bobo and Gaffey for stupid 9-11 theory) with respect to their opinion, even I don't agree with them.

Cito Pelon
06-06-2010, 04:46 PM
Piled on? You never spent time in East Coast sporting radio market have you? You should see how those area teams coach get piled on.

I understand that see some moves in different light then me, but that doesn't mean either of us isn't entitled to own opinions. Or that either isn't right.

Also I am pretty sure that I have treated most of the posters (minus Bobo and Gaffey for stupid 9-11 theory) with respect to their opinion, even I don't agree with them.

Sheesh, you haven't listened to these mutts here either. Everybody is due to blow off some steam. Been going on for years.

MVP-06
06-07-2010, 09:01 AM
What was wrong with 950 yards as a rookie who was splitting time. Damn people are impatient. What do you want 1800 yards his rookie season?

Ray Finkle
06-07-2010, 09:13 AM
No class??? Come on, yes I have been critical of some moves, but that is the nature of being a fan on internet message board. Have you never expressed displeasure with moves of the team??? How do I "tank" being a fan, because of that???

All I pointed out, on this thread that it is OTAs and very hard for anyone not to look good at this time of the year.

White, Lendall

bronco militia
06-07-2010, 09:14 AM
I never thought Thomas Jones was a great back

Soul-Bronco
06-07-2010, 09:45 AM
The addition of coach studs probably doesn't hurt

Irish Stout
06-07-2010, 09:56 AM
I think you saw a different KO when he started fumbling and lost elusiveness with two hands on the ball all the time. Hopefully he can play faster and more elusive this year without the fumblitis in the back of his mind. Plus the rookie wall didn't help

As for the chart, 2nd year Emmit/LT and Walter averaged 100 yards per game and 10 TDs. I see KO closer to TJ than the other 3.
I hope not becuase TJ was a vagabound for serveral years before making a name for himself with a couple very good years in CHI/NY

I'm sorry, I missed the memo, but why are we calling Knowsh "KO"? His initials are KM and KO makes me think of Orton. Are we saying he's a Knock Out (power back or a hottie, take your pick) or are we just combining the first letter of his first name with the last letter of his last name to give him a two syllable nickname?

I'm not trying to be an ass, just need to keep on top of what we're calling the guys these days.

Kaylore
06-07-2010, 10:48 AM
Here's to him tearing up the league.

I don't ever see him "tearing up the league" as you say. I think he'll be another Curtis Martin where he'll quietly put together a string of really good, but not totally awesome, seasons.

Zoobie
06-07-2010, 10:56 AM
People are so obsessed with the draft it is borderline sickening. Does it really matter what pick he was taken? Does he have to live up to #12 "standards"? (Whatever those are) If he comes in, performs well, and become a part of a team that is a playoff contender that is all that concerns me.

Drek
06-07-2010, 11:35 AM
I don't ever see him "tearing up the league" as you say. I think he'll be another Curtis Martin where he'll quietly put together a string of really good, but not totally awesome, seasons.

Martin had a borderline HOF career, so I'd gladly take that.

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 11:42 AM
Sheesh, you haven't listened to these mutts here either. Everybody is due to blow off some steam. Been going on for years.

I agree that Elsid's the wrong target.

Come at me, bro.

Baba Booey
06-07-2010, 11:46 AM
What was wrong with 950 yards as a rookie who was splitting time. Damn people are impatient. What do you want 1800 yards his rookie season?

We were spoiled by Portis.

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 11:52 AM
We were spoiled by Shanahan.

Fixed. Don't forget Mike Anderson's success and every other first year player that got plugged into the system.

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 11:53 AM
Fixed. Don't forget Mike Anderson's success and every other first year player that got plugged into the system.

And Orlandis Gary

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 11:53 AM
And Orlandis Gary

And Terrell Davis, of course.

BlaK-Argentina
06-07-2010, 11:54 AM
Fixed. Don't forget Mike Anderson's success and every other first year player that got plugged into the system.

Yeah but that was with a system that was well in place before they came in and we had an awesome offensive line at the time. Hardly the same.

I think Moreno was fine last year and should be a lot better this season.

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 12:01 PM
Yeah but that was with a system that was well in place before they came in and we had an awesome offensive line at the time. Hardly the same.

I think Moreno was fine last year and should be a lot better this season.

Oh please. If you account for limited duty (which you shouldn't, but it does provide a marginal view for comparison's sake) we were significantly more successful with Mike Bell and Selvin Young in their inaugural years running behind Erik Pears, Chris Myers and Montrae Holland.

oubronco
06-07-2010, 12:04 PM
What was wrong with 950 yards as a rookie who was splitting time. Damn people are impatient. What do you want 1800 yards his rookie season?

He wouldn't of even got that if Buck didn't get hurt

Rugby7
06-07-2010, 12:15 PM
Yeah but that was with a system that was well in place before they came in and we had an awesome offensive line at the time. Hardly the same.

I think Moreno was fine last year and should be a lot better this season.

Now the system is outa place.

You say Moreno I say Morano.

Go refinance your clue.

Almost 100, can't wait to start a thread.

DarkHorse30
06-07-2010, 12:18 PM
And Terrell Davis, of course.

you're not implying that TD = Olandis Gary and Mike Anderson, right?

Kaylore, Martin seems much more utilitarian than Knowshon. Maybe I'm undervaluing CM because he was always compared to TD....which I thought was ridiculous. Maybe this is the homer in me, but TD is the best RB of the last 20 years, maybe a tie with Emmitt Smith.

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 12:32 PM
you're not implying that TD = Olandis Gary and Mike Anderson, right?

lol no, absolutely not.

Kaylore, Martin seems much more utilitarian than Knowshon. Maybe I'm undervaluing CM because he was always compared to TD....which I thought was ridiculous. Maybe this is the homer in me, but TD is the best RB of the last 20 years, maybe a tie with Emmitt Smith.

Agree. One thing always over-looked with TD, the holes weren't always there, and when they weren't he could get lower than any player I've ever seen, square up with the LOS, and do one last burst for 3-4 yards a clip. NEVER have I seen that before. Not LT, not Jim Brown, not Payton, not Sanders, not anyone.

Granted, they all do have their own unique skill sets that TD didn't have, but that ability of his was remarkable. It's why I refused to eat any soup that didn't have him on the can for years.

snowspot66
06-07-2010, 12:42 PM
lol no, absolutely not.



Agree. One thing always over-looked with TD, the holes weren't always there, and when they weren't he could get lower than any player I've ever seen, square up with the LOS, and do one last burst for 3-4 yards a clip. NEVER have I seen that before. Not LT, not Jim Brown, not Payton, not Sanders, not anyone.

Granted, they all do have their own unique skill sets that TD didn't have, but that ability of his was remarkable. It's why I refused to eat any soup that didn't have him on the can for years.

Run out of soup yet?

TheReverend
06-07-2010, 12:47 PM
Run out of soup yet?

Not with a color printer handy.

ozomulsion
06-07-2010, 01:55 PM
Glad to hear he is getting better. Any rookie must be given a reasonable amount of time to adjust to the league. I'm excited to see what he can do this year. Props to him for working hard on his game.

Always the voice of reason you are. :)

He's going to surprise these naysayers this season.

broncosteven
06-07-2010, 02:12 PM
I don't ever see him "tearing up the league" as you say. I think he'll be another Curtis Martin where he'll quietly put together a string of really good, but not totally awesome, seasons.

I will take CM from Moreno this year.

CM was a tough back that ran out of Parcell's power run game. I don't remember a lot of 50/60/70 (though I am sure he broke a few off) yard runs out of him but I do remember seeing a lot of 10-20-25 yarders.

listopencil
06-08-2010, 06:15 PM
I will take CM from Moreno this year.

CM was a tough back that ran out of Parcell's power run game. I don't remember a lot of 50/60/70 (though I am sure he broke a few off) yard runs out of him but I do remember seeing a lot of 10-20-25 yarders.

Yeah, Martin and Davis were compared because of their attitude and work ethic. AS I recall the thinking was that Martin was really the only RB in the league that was comparable to Davis. I'd take another Curtis Martin and be happy with it.

Soul-Bronco
06-08-2010, 06:36 PM
What was wrong with 950 yards as a rookie who was splitting time. Damn people are impatient. What do you want 1800 yards his rookie season?


I guess reception yards dont matter much these days. . . . . moreno had 213 with a 7.6 ypc and a TOTAL of 1150 give or take a yard.

Funny how that stuff slips down the cracks