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View Full Version : New Context on the Ireland-Bryant Controversy


meangene
05-01-2010, 05:33 AM
Ireland's logical follow-up question to Bryant not worthy of outrage

Story Highlights
Sources said Jeff Ireland's 'prostitute' question to Dez Bryant was logical follow-up
Bryant painted story in different light to Yahoo! and should apologize to Ireland
Bill Parcells, known for pushing players buttons, likely had input in questioning

AP

Even in the no-holds-barred world of the NFL, where a head coach can get a free pass after using the female pronoun 'she' to describe a male player, Dolphins GM Jeff Ireland took a moon leap out of bounds when he asked Oklahoma State wide receiver Dez Bryant during a pre-draft interview if the player's mother used to be a prostitute.

Or did he?

Two sources familiar with the situation contend that Ireland's question was nothing more than the logical follow-up to comments Bryant had made about his family. According to the sources, Ireland began the meeting by asking Bryant, 21, about his upbringing and his relationship with his siblings. Then he asked what Bryant's father did for a living when Bryant was growing up. The following exchange allegedly ensued:

"My dad was a pimp."

"What did your mom do [for a living]?"

"She worked for my dad."

"Your mom was a prostitute?"

"No, she wasn't a prostitute."

Ireland apologized Tuesday for asking what has been described as a classless, offensive and potentially illegal question. But if the incident went down as described by two members of the Dolphins organization, Bryant should be the next to repent because there was no need for this story to go from a controlled burn to a raging wildfire.

Ireland simply connected the dots given to him by Bryant. Could he have been more tactful with his question? Absolutely. He could have gotten around the controversy by asking: What type of work did your mother do for your father? But Bryant also could have been clearer with his message. The anger and outrage he expressed to Yahoo! Sports over the incident has as much to do with the word picture he painted as it does with Ireland's conclusion.

Bryant could not be reached for comment, and his agent, Eugene Parker, did not return a phone message. As for the Dolphins, majority owner Stephen Ross said he will investigate the 40-year-old Ireland's handling of the interview process. But you can best believe that if it had gone down the way Bryant has led some to believe, get-tough commissioner Roger Goodell would be out front protecting the integrity of the shield. Instead, his office has said the Dolphins are handling the matter.

"Jeff Ireland is a classy, classy kid," said one GM, speaking on the condition his name not be used. "Do I think he made a mistake asking that question? Yeah. Even if I knew it was true, I could never ask a kid that. But I have to tell you that the story going hard around the Combine -- and everybody heard it whether it was true or not -- was that his mother was a prostitute and his father was her pimp. That doesn't make it right, but that stuff was out there."

Teams spend hundreds of thousands of dollars each year on background checks on prospective draft choices, particularly those who could go high in the first round. Bryant was red-flagged by multiple teams because of what they described as a "shaky" family situation -- his mother, Angela, served 18 months for selling crack cocaine -- his anger issues as a youngster and his habitual tardiness. He also was suspended by the NCAA for all but three games last season for lying about his relationship with former NFL great Deion Sanders.

Did Ireland know about Bryant's background before he asked the question about Bryant's mother? He should have. If he didn't, he or the team's private investigators and college scouts should be dismissed immediately. So why even go there? Some believe he may have wanted to see whether Bryant would answer honestly. Or perhaps he wanted to gauge the player's reaction to an incendiary question. Only Ireland and the Dolphins know, and the GM couldn't be reached for comment.

One thing that cannot be disputed, however, is that Ireland was hired by Bill Parcells, a man who was notorious for pushing players' buttons during his 19-year head-coaching career. While with the Patriots, he went so far to refer to wideout Terry Glenn as "she" during a media session. It would be foolish to think that Parcells had no input in the line of questioning. As another GM pointed out, teams generally go over their questions before bringing in a prospect to make sure they're on the same page.

"This kid may have led the league in [pre-draft] visits," one GM said of Bryant. "He was pounded by clubs. But I haven't heard about anybody else asking the type of question about the mother that the Dolphins did, so that tells you that no one else felt comfortable about going that road. You hear about all types of crazy questions being asked, but this is really the first time where there was something as insensitive as this. I'm sure Jeff wasn't the only one in the room. I wish somebody else had said, 'You know what? We don't need to go there.'"

But what if Bryant took them there? I would have connected the dots in the same way that Ireland did based on what Bryant allegedly said. Bottom line: There's a major difference between asking a logical follow-up and knowingly wrapping an insensitive and incendiary accusation in the form of a question. Ireland, I believe, asked a logical follow-up question that was coated with neither malice nor prejudice.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/jim_trotter/04/30/dez.bryant.jeff.ireland/index.html#ixzz0mfykKS7l
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Really changes the perspective for me. And raises more questions on Bryant's character:
1. Why would he put this story out there in the first place without making the context clear?
2. When the story went national and Ireland was getting blasted, why not clear it up?
3. Now he allegedly says Ireland was lying. Who would you believe? The league has reportedly confirmed Ireland's version per ESPN. I would bet it was recorded.
4. When questioned yesterday if there was a context preceding the quetion, Bryant (looking like a deer in headlights) said, "No..... I don't know."

BroncsRule
05-01-2010, 06:46 AM
"Ireland apologized Tuesday for asking what has been described as a classless, offensive and potentially illegal question."



No, it is not illegal for a potential employer to ask Dez if his momma was a ho.

Stupid, but not illegal.

OTOH, the questions about race directed towards Toby Gerhart were clearly illegal.

theAPAOps5
05-01-2010, 06:49 AM
The way Train Wreck Dez painted the picture Ireland just opened the questioning with so Dez is your momma a prostitute, oh and nice to meet you.

31 teams in the NFL are probably thinking phew glad we didn't go near that guy.

Drek
05-01-2010, 06:59 AM
The way Train Wreck Dez painted the picture Ireland just opened the questioning with so Dez is your momma a prostitute, oh and nice to meet you.

31 teams in the NFL are probably thinking phew glad we didn't go near that guy.

I think Dez got exactly what he wanted, to slide down to his favorite team.

His suspension had already knocked him out of the top 10, so at that point whats a few million to live his fantasy of being the next Cowboys great?

I still think Thomas is going to be a better WR than him though.

Rabb
05-01-2010, 07:42 AM
Whoever was wrong here, I am so glad we avoided Bryant. Drama to start things off is just a sign of things to come, I give Dez until preseason game #1 before something else happens.

theAPAOps5
05-01-2010, 07:55 AM
I think Dez got exactly what he wanted, to slide down to his favorite team.

His suspension had already knocked him out of the top 10, so at that point whats a few million to live his fantasy of being the next Cowboys great?

I still think Thomas is going to be a better WR than him though.

Dez has talent thats for sure and the Cowboys have had success with troubled but talented WR's. Just look at coke head Irving so maybe it works out.

Just glad the Broncos didn't risk it on him.

_Oro_
05-01-2010, 08:31 AM
It will be interesting to follow Thomas and Bryant. Both had a hard upbringing and both drafted around the same spot.

gunns
05-01-2010, 08:59 AM
They reported on the news last night that Bryant has said this exchange is a lie. There was an article a couple of days ago that painted Ireland as an all around asshole even outside of this issue. You can pick who you want to believe, personally I doubt that Bryant would have said that about his mom.

tsiguy96
05-01-2010, 09:13 AM
They reported on the news last night that Bryant has said this exchange is a lie. There was an article a couple of days ago that painted Ireland as an all around a-hole even outside of this issue. You can pick who you want to believe, personally I doubt that Bryant would have said that about his mom.

the dolphins anonymously let this slip so they dont look as bad as they do, dez bryant comes out and says its a lie. if the dolphins believe so badly this is true why do they have to be anonymous about it?

this whole thing is BS. ireland went out of his way to apologize from the start, he is clearly in the wrong about this.

meangene
05-01-2010, 09:41 AM
They reported on the news last night that Bryant has said this exchange is a lie. There was an article a couple of days ago that painted Ireland as an all around a-hole even outside of this issue. You can pick who you want to believe, personally I doubt that Bryant would have said that about his mom.

Except Bryant already has a history of being a liar and, when questioned directly by reporters, he stumbled and stammered and didn't want to talk about it. It's not that he said it about his mom it's that he complained and took great offense to the question but left out the context.

tsiguy96
05-01-2010, 09:41 AM
Except Bryant already has a history of being a liar and, when questioned directly by reporters, he stumbled and stammered and didn't want to talk about it. It's not that he said it about his mom it's that he complained and took great offense to the question but left out the context.

you truly honestly believe this is the real context of the story, that was anonymously submitted to someone at some point?

meangene
05-01-2010, 09:45 AM
Whoever was wrong here, I am so glad we avoided Bryant. Drama to start things off is just a sign of things to come, I give Dez until preseason game #1 before something else happens.

This exactly. There are so many red flags with this kid. Yet, all we hear is what a great pick the Cowboys made and what a great situation it is for him. Really? A non-authoritative coach, a team that lacks locker room leadership, and P.T Barnum as an owner. Oh, but, he has Dion and Irvin to mentor him! What a joke! It is just a matter of time.

meangene
05-01-2010, 09:48 AM
you truly honestly believe this is the real context of the story, that was anonymously submitted to someone at some point?

Yep, I do. And according to ESPN this was confirmed by NFL sources. Why do you think there is no league investigation? Do you really believe Ireland just out of the blue said, "Hey, Dez, is your mother a prostitute?"

Tombstone RJ
05-01-2010, 09:55 AM
Thanks to Dez, I bet teams will now be forced to tape all interviews (or at least have a witness present) so that things like this don't happen again.

Thanks Dez, you the man!

Beantown Bronco
05-01-2010, 09:58 AM
Shanny needs to hook both sides up to his lie detector machine and get it over with.

gunns
05-01-2010, 10:34 AM
Except Bryant already has a history of being a liar and, when questioned directly by reporters, he stumbled and stammered and didn't want to talk about it. It's not that he said it about his mom it's that he complained and took great offense to the question but left out the context.

Well, judging from the article I read on Ireland, him and Dez have the same history then. Regardless, funny how long it took Ireland to come out with that "exchange". I've also only heard that she was into dealing drugs when he was younger, spent some time in jail when he was younger, and came out as a lesbian. She dealt the drugs to support her kids, so I suspect she probably did do some prostitution. I also suspect the question was asked to see if they could a rise out of the kid, check his temper. Makes it all the more inappropriate. It shouldn't have been asked and I don't believe for a second that the exchange went the way Ireland says it did.

meangene
05-01-2010, 10:47 AM
Well, judging from the article I read on Ireland, him and Dez have the same history then. Regardless, funny how long it took Ireland to come out with that "exchange". I've also only heard that she was into dealing drugs when he was younger, spent some time in jail when he was younger, and came out as a lesbian. She dealt the drugs to support her kids, so I suspect she probably did do some prostitution. I also suspect the question was asked to see if they could a rise out of the kid, check his temper. Makes it all the more inappropriate. It shouldn't have been asked and I don't believe for a second that the exchange went the way Ireland says it did.

Actually Ireland never came out publicly with the exchange and never spoke publicly about it to my knowledge. I know the Dolphins looked into it and that is where the version was leaked to the press. Doubt it took him long to come out with his "version". Dez is the one who went public with the matter.
Subsequently, according to ESPN, league sources confirmed Ireland's version. I guess we can all believe who we want to.

tsiguy96
05-01-2010, 10:59 AM
Actually Ireland never came out publicly with the exchange and never spoke publicly about it to my knowledge. I know the Dolphins looked into it and that is where the version was leaked to the press. Doubt it took him long to come out with his "version". Dez is the one who went public with the matter.
Subsequently, according to ESPN, league sources confirmed Ireland's version. I guess we can all believe who we want to.

ireland admitted to apologizing to dez and using bad judgment. 2 days later, it miraculously comes out that its all dez's fault after all. BS.

bronco610
05-01-2010, 11:15 AM
I personally don't think the whole thing is any big deal!

outdoor_miner
05-01-2010, 11:36 AM
ireland admitted to apologizing to dez and using bad judgment. 2 days later, it miraculously comes out that its all dez's fault after all. BS.

Dude - it's no different than the Cutler situation last year... Cutler's side went to the media first, and therefore got his story out in front (that McDaniels was actively shopping Jay). McD/Bowlen and the Broncos never commented at first, and then started damage control later.

This is a similar situation... Anyway, I'm not saying who's right or wrong. Simply that we don't know the truth. Ireland's story does make a certain amount of sense.

DBroncos4life
05-01-2010, 11:39 AM
lol his mom was a prostitute and you guys think we dodged a bullet because of it. Even if the story is true how the **** does this reflect badly on him? You guys need help. I think some of you guys used to be witch burners in a previous life.

DBroncos4life
05-01-2010, 11:42 AM
This exactly. There are so many red flags with this kid. Yet, all we hear is what a great pick the Cowboys made and what a great situation it is for him. Really? A non-authoritative coach, a team that lacks locker room leadership, and P.T Barnum as an owner. Oh, but, he has Dion and Irvin to mentor him! What a joke! It is just a matter of time.

Till what his mom starters hooking again? I can't believe people are judging him off of what his parents did.

Tombstone RJ
05-01-2010, 11:52 AM
Till what his mom starters hooking again? I can't believe people are judging him off of what his parents did.

eh, ok. so, what planet are you from again?

meangene
05-01-2010, 11:52 AM
lol his mom was a prostitute and you guys think we dodged a bullet because of it. Even if the story is true how the **** does this reflect badly on him? You guys need help. I think some of you guys used to be witch burners in a previous life.

You are missing the point. It's now whether his mother was a prostitute which reflects badly on him. He came out publicly expressing his outrage over the question and, if the version in the article is true, was, at best, misleading about the context. When called on it, he first claimed it was a lie and then said, "No... I don't know". If this is all true, he basically lied three times about the whole incident. Coupled with the known fact that he lied to NCAA investigators about his contact with Dion, there is a pattern of lying and poor judgment. Add to that, he was suspended by his team for being late to meetings and/ or practices, showed up out of shape and unprepared for his pro day, and has chosen to associate with Pacman Jones outside of their joint workout program and, yes, we dodged a bullet. Watch and see how long it it before he becomes a distraction for his team.

DBroncos4life
05-01-2010, 12:02 PM
He's a witch burn him!!!.

.

DBroncos4life
05-01-2010, 12:08 PM
And...Bryant got screwed by the media again because they didn't investigate. Here's the scoop on he and Pac-Man.

They've both been training with renowed trainer Duke Rousse, a partner of Deion Sanders' "Prime U". They've formed a commraderie since they compete against each other every day. So, Bryant's moral support comment was simply the truth. Pac Man will probably be at Bryant's Pro Day for the same reason.


Article on Rousse, his clientele, etc...



Edited with hopefully functioning link:

http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/2010/03/local_athletic_trainer_duke_ro.html
__________________

Here it is for a third time. Maybe you can get the Pac man Jones thing right for once.

_Oro_
05-01-2010, 12:13 PM
I guess the point is that it doesn't matter whether Bryant did anything wrong or right. Some guys are drama queens and the circus just follows them around.

meangene
05-01-2010, 12:18 PM
One last time, I will draw a picture for you. I understand, and have understood the Pacman story from the jump. The point being, at a time where his character was in question approaching the most important day of his life, Bryant chose to show up in front of NFL teams and the press in support of Pacman Jones. This shows poor judgment. Get it? And your excuses for him for lying to the NCAA, or getting suspended (twice), or not being prepared for his pro day, or quitting during drills, or telling NFL teams he really doesn't like to run slants, etc., etc.? I don't have to burn him, he is doing a good job of it himself. :wave:

azbroncfan
05-01-2010, 07:52 PM
The my dad is a pimp story makes much more sense. Why is Dez bringing it up now awhile after the fact instead of right away? I highly doubt Ireland was like you had this many TD's, this many catches, Why do you want to play for Miami, Oh is your mom a hooker?

DarkHorse30
05-01-2010, 08:16 PM
I guess the point is that it doesn't matter whether Bryant did anything wrong or right. Some guys are drama queens and the circus just follows them around.

Bingo. Bryant is/was a NUMBSKULL

question: is it wrong for a d-back to say something about his momma being a WHORE? If I were a db in the NFL I would specifically PRO-NOUNCE THE WORD WWWWWHHHHHOOOORE, instead of just "ho". I think you'll see a TO-blowup by Bryant and it will be laughable.

Dedhed
05-01-2010, 08:16 PM
He came out publicly expressing his outrage over the question and, if the version in the article is true, was, at best, misleading about the context. There is NO WAY it went down like that. If it did, there would be no reason to even consider an apology.

meangene
05-02-2010, 03:59 AM
There is NO WAY it went down like that. If it did, there would be no reason to even consider an apology.

Sure there was. As the article specifically points out, he could have asked him what his mother did in a more tactful way - i.e. "What work did your mother do for your father?".

azbroncfan
05-02-2010, 07:19 AM
Sure there was. As the article specifically points out, he could have asked him what his mother did in a more tactful way - i.e. "What work did your mother do for your father?".

Not really if a guy claims his Dad is a pimp and his mom works for him what do you expect the next question to be. If a guy is going to say something stupid like that he is going to get a stupid answer. Dez is just making an excuse for being a troublemaker. He acts like he is the only guy who has ever had rough upbringing.

meangene
05-02-2010, 09:41 AM
Not really if a guy claims his Dad is a pimp and his mom works for him what do you expect the next question to be. If a guy is going to say something stupid like that he is going to get a stupid answer. Dez is just making an excuse for being a troublemaker. He acts like he is the only guy who has ever had rough upbringing.

I agree with you. When you say my dad was a pimp and my mom worked for him that would be a logical conclusion. I guess she could have been his bookkeeper or scheduled appts. ;D I was just explaining why Ireland might have apologized if Bryant took offense to the question.

azbroncfan
05-02-2010, 03:21 PM
I agree with you. When you say my dad was a pimp and my mom worked for him that would be a logical conclusion. I guess she could have been his bookkeeper or scheduled appts. ;D I was just explaining why Ireland might have apologized if Bryant took offense to the question.

Maybe she only sold crack for him?

meangene
05-02-2010, 06:37 PM
Maybe she only sold crack for him?

A crack prostitute? Would that be politically correct for crack whore?

azbroncfan
05-02-2010, 07:04 PM
A crack prostitute? Would that be politically correct for crack whore?

No that was the problem she wasn't a whore she only sold crack.

meangene
05-02-2010, 07:44 PM
No that was the problem she wasn't a whore she only sold crack.

Don't whores sell crack? ;D

meangene
05-03-2010, 05:30 PM
So, now Dez and his mother reportedly think she deserves an apology as well. Here is his mom's take:

Dez Bryant's mother is "angry" about the latest controversy swirling around her son and is waiting for Dolphins GM Jeff Ireland to call and offer an apology to her too.

"Yes, I am upset about it. I am not pleased with it. I've heard how the question was supposed to have come about -- that Dez supposedly said his father was a pimp -- but I don't believe that. I think the Dolphins have put that out there as their excuse. And I know if they keep after it like that, they will sound like a broken record. He was caught off guard by it. To ask that of any kid, that hurts.

"When they couldn't find enough dirt on him, they went to that. It was almost like a scheme. They should never have put that kind of thing or question on him. Whatever reason they chose to do that, they are talking about my charges of 12 years ago and running with it. I'm not OK with it. But we are both going to be OK.''

A couple other notes. ESPN has obtained information that she had additional drug convictions as recently as 2009. Oh, and Dez sprained his ankle in minicamp and struggled with his conditioning throughout the three days.

http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/news/story?id=5159981

TheElusiveKyleOrton
05-03-2010, 09:09 PM
you truly honestly believe this is the real context of the story, that was anonymously submitted to someone at some point?

I don't think Ireland is dumb enough to ask a question like that without that sort of context behind it.

At no point, Tsi, did you ask "Now why the hell would he ask that question?"?

enjolras
05-03-2010, 10:07 PM
The only thing Dez has managed to do is make everyone aware that his mom might have been a prostitute. Not a smart man that one.