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View Full Version : OT - Need Relationship Advice... Just Kidding... Financial planning question.


That One Guy
04-29-2010, 03:18 PM
In relation to your monthly paycheck, how much money does everyone put in savings before you start to think it's just going to waste? I currently have about 5 months invested but about 14 months in savings. I jumped into the market when everything bottomed out so I'm hesitant to get in any more as I wont get the same kind of returns as I have on the rest. I definitely don't want to keep putting things into savings though and enjoying the wonderful 1% or whatever that ING is giving me.

How do you break it up? Do you ever get to the point where you just figure you don't want to save anymore? I've kinda loosened up on being cheap and oftentimes just spend money, take more vacations, etc. Just curious how others manage theirs.

Chris
04-29-2010, 03:20 PM
Whatever happens in the coming pages... do not show this thread to ING.

Archer81
04-29-2010, 03:20 PM
I try to save a quarter of whatever I made when I was working. It did not always work out that way, but it was a good habit to get into.

:Broncos:

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 03:22 PM
I try to save a quarter of whatever I made when I was working. It did not always work out that way, but it was a good habit to get into.

:Broncos:

Just stash it away in a bottomless savings account? Despite poor interest rates?

Archer81
04-29-2010, 03:25 PM
Just stash it away in a bottomless savings account? Despite poor interest rates?


The interest rates were not that important to me. It was more getting into a budget and knowing x amount is going to the account...which helped me alot after I got laid off last year. Of course school is ending for the summer...and the money with it. So now I need to go find work to kill the boredom and pay bills.

Adulthood blows.

:Broncos:

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 03:25 PM
Whatever happens in the coming pages... do not show this thread to ING.

:rofl:

Yeah, I'm actually just asking as a courtesy and don't really care as I already know what I'm gonna do. Me and ING for life... I don't care how miserable it will eventually make me.

bronclvr
04-29-2010, 03:27 PM
I try to save a quarter of whatever I made

Me too, I've been saving for about 35 Years (have a pretty good chunk now) and if you are as conservative like I am, I have two words for you-Edward Jones, although I have some other investments (10-15%) in other places.



Go ahead, flame away, but they have done very well by me-

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 03:28 PM
Me too, I've been saving for about 35 Years (have a pretty good chunk now) and if you are as conservative like I am, I have two words for you-Edward Jones, although I have some other investments (10-15%) in other places.



Go ahead, flame away, but they have done very well by me-

So you saved with investments or just cash savings?

bronclvr
04-29-2010, 03:34 PM
So you saved with investments or just cash savings?

I have a reasonable chunk of Cash (yes, it's not making much interest, but I want quick access to Cash) in a few different Banks, and some Real Estate/Rentals, but 90-97% is with Edward Jones (Mutuals, Bonds, etc.)-

edit: I said 10-15% in one Post then 3-10% in another ROFL!-it's about 10%-

Mr.Meanie
04-29-2010, 04:39 PM
Savings is good.... I believe in having a 1 year of expenses cash cushion in the bank at all times.

Beyond that, in my opinion piling up cash the way you are doing is smart. Jump into the market when it's low with the cash you have piled up, and you will be on a fast track to wealth. And not just the stock market, look around for real estate deals, especially now with the market at an extremely low point. I don't know where you live, but certain parts of the country you can get a good return just in rental rates from bottomed out housing.

I know the general mindset of most people is to put as much money in the stock market (typically mutual funds) as possible, but the problem with that is when the market nosedives those people aren't liquid enough to capitalize on it.

In my opinion the formula should be:

1. Stash every dollar
2. Live far below your means
3. Use that cash to buy into real estate or stocks when they go on sale... specifically cash flow real estate like rental property or self-storage units.
4. Or, if you're entrepreneurial, use the cash to start up your own business.

My personal formula with my income is 10% charity, 10% investing, 10% pay off debt, and then live off the rest. Then I budget for and allocate every single dollar I bring in each month, and place the surplus in an investment account. That may be a bit OCD, but since I started doing that it completely changed my finances.

Broncosfreak_56
04-29-2010, 04:42 PM
Spend it all. 2012 is nigh.

SureShot
04-29-2010, 04:44 PM
I have a well diversified portfolio consisting of gambling, hookers and blow.

bowtown
04-29-2010, 04:56 PM
Depends on how old you are. If you are young, you should be investing almost all of it... open a ROTH IRA and contribute the maximum amount every year if you can. Keep a small emergency stash in cash, and at the very least get the rest into a Vangaurd fund.

Seriously, keeping it in a 1% savings account or as cash is doing nothing but losing you money.

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 05:13 PM
Depends on how old you are. If you are young, you should be investing almost all of it... open a ROTH IRA and contribute the maximum amount every year if you can. Keep a small emergency stash in cash, and at the very least get the rest into a Vangaurd fund.

Seriously, keeping it in a 1% savings account or as cash is doing nothing but losing you money.

My thoughts as well. Being still affiliated with the military, I'm not able to buy property at this point but a house was my preferred use for excess money.

I may consider going with an actual broker. I've avoided it so far but I don't want to risk much more on my whims as they wont all be as easy as the last year was.

Thanks for confirming my suspicions everyone. I'll be sure to keep plenty in cash but I'll try to find something better to do with the rest.

ColoradoDarin
04-29-2010, 05:57 PM
If you are going to use the money in the next 5 years (say as a down payment on a house), keep it in cash.

With anything else, I would just set up some index funds at Vanguard ($3000 to open I think) and just put a set amount to them every month.

broncosteven
04-29-2010, 06:20 PM
Read the book the Wealthy Barber. It is really just commonsense. If you have the cash to invest or want to play the market right away then it may not be for you but I like the concept of always paying yourself 1st and staying in your means.

BTW anyone watch NOVA this week, they had a pro-Rational Econ vs Irrational-Economics findings from some studies about the Market bubble(s) and why people were willing to take out the stupid loans being offered.

Ratboy
04-29-2010, 07:44 PM
Who gives a **** about saving? What's money when it's locked away in some horrible investment?

Keep a small amount for emergency and spend that **** like there is no tomorrow.

Meck77
04-29-2010, 07:48 PM
Depending on how much cash savings you are talking about some physical gold is a nice diversification tool that will work inversely with your dollars. If you could find some American Eagles 1 oz coins for instance. Universal cash around the world.

gunns
04-29-2010, 07:59 PM
I'm not financial good at all but have gotten good advice. I've got direct deposits going to a Vanguard, a personal savings, a ROTH IRA. More is starting to go to the retirement funds. It's getting where I can seriously consider it and I love having this money there. I spend more than I ever have and I put away more than ever. LOVE IT!

Broncojef
04-29-2010, 09:05 PM
The economy right now is a shell game being propped up to give folks a sense of calm. The reality is we have huge, huge debt and the only way to compensate for that is for the government to make money worthless. With the out of control spending and rising debt we will have no choice but to raise interest rates. When rates rise and the dollar becomes more worthless the only smart investment right now is to buy gold or silver. Silver is right now near $18.50 an ounce and I'm betting it hits $200 an ounce within the next two years. Likewise the market is poised to crash hard soon...I'll say to 3000 or just under the price of an ounce of gold. My two cents...get out of the market NOW!!! buy Silver.

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 09:10 PM
Thanks for the responses, everyone. For my situation, I'm hesitant to put anything into a program where I can't touch it until a certain date. I know times are changing but in my family, the males don't make it to 60 usually. I'd like to keep it in something where the money can be tapped when the time comes, not when they say your time has come. I don't know all the details but the way I'm tracking it, the penalties and whatnot for an IRA would leave you with less than simply investing in the same avenues outside an IRA.

Am I tracking that correctly? And while I'm open to suggestions, can we assume hypothetically this scenario is accurate. I could live to 60 with no problems at all but for now I want to plan for what I think fits me best and leaves my nerves most assured.

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 09:13 PM
The economy right now is a shell game being propped up to give folks a sense of calm. The reality is we have huge, huge debt and the only way to compensate for that is for the government to make money worthless. With the out of control spending and rising debt we will have no choice but to raise interest rates. When rates rise and the dollar becomes more worthless the only smart investment right now is to buy gold or silver. Silver is right now near $18.50 an ounce and I'm betting it hits $200 an ounce within the next two years. Likewise the market is poised to crash hard soon...I'll say to 3000 or just under the price of an ounce of gold. My two cents...get out of the market NOW!!! buy Silver.

Unfortunately, that's an all or nothing bet. I happen to agree but don't want to imagine the tragedies that could come with a total market collapse. If I went all in on something that equates to betting against our economic health, it would kill me inside.

Broncojef
04-29-2010, 09:26 PM
Unfortunately, that's an all or nothing bet. I happen to agree but don't want to imagine the tragedies that could come with a total market collapse. If I went all in on something that equates to betting against our economic health, it would kill me inside.

Thats cool, you have to do whats comfortable for you. We have a Congress and a president setting us up for failure IMO and while I don't like thinking about it I can't change it. good luck with your investing, hope you make a ton. :thumbs:

That One Guy
04-29-2010, 09:30 PM
Thats cool, you have to do whats comfortable for you. We have a Congress and a president setting us up for failure IMO and while I don't like thinking about it I can't change it. good luck with your investing, hope you make a ton. :thumbs:

Again, I totally agree. If I could make a decision on logic alone, I'd be right there with ya. Emotionally though, just can't. Scary times we're living in.

RubberDuckie24
04-29-2010, 09:51 PM
Look into ETF's in the S&P500. They are basically diversified portfolio's of your liking - you can even have an extremely well diversified portfolio that replicates the returns of the whole S&P500. Or if you think a certain sector as a whole is going to go up (say, Technology) you can get an ETF that focuses on just that sector. They are very liquid, cost relatively little, are well diversified and can provide solid returns.

Just a suggestion.

Unless you're willing to research the markets and your different investment opportunities, I'd go to a place like Edward Jones... they already have the know-how and can figure out a financial plan that is tailored to your needs.

Cito Pelon
05-02-2010, 08:50 AM
Thanks for the responses, everyone. For my situation, I'm hesitant to put anything into a program where I can't touch it until a certain date. I know times are changing but in my family, the males don't make it to 60 usually. I'd like to keep it in something where the money can be tapped when the time comes, not when they say your time has come. I don't know all the details but the way I'm tracking it, the penalties and whatnot for an IRA would leave you with less than simply investing in the same avenues outside an IRA.

Am I tracking that correctly? And while I'm open to suggestions, can we assume hypothetically this scenario is accurate. I could live to 60 with no problems at all but for now I want to plan for what I think fits me best and leaves my nerves most assured.

Hedging your bets with an IRA is fine, you can always cash out for a 10% penalty, take a loan against it. The money into the IRA is before-tax, so you're saving that percentage hit right off the bat and compounding your initial pre-tax investment, correct?

But, yes, you don't want to put all your eggs in that IRA basket.

Diversity, diversity, diversity. Play all your options.

TheReverend
05-02-2010, 09:08 AM
I'd keep a few weeks of survival money in a savings account and about two months of extra wiggle in your investing account. If **** hits the fan, you can transfer some cash out of there to your bank account to ease whatever transition you're undergoing.

Requiem
05-02-2010, 09:29 AM
When I was young my elders always told me to put a quarter in the ceiling, they meant a quarter million, ya'll need to stop thinkin' like children.

theAPAOps5
05-02-2010, 09:35 AM
I'd keep a few weeks of survival money in a savings account and about two months of extra wiggle in your investing account. If **** hits the fan, you can transfer some cash out of there to your bank account to ease whatever transition you're undergoing.

I have my emergency account in the bank of google. I figured with the recession a lot of people would be at home using google to find jobs. Sure enough google revenue was solid and for a while my investment was hovering at about a 40% return.

Yeah its risky but so far its done well and I have since transferred a bit of it to a secure traditional savings account.

bronco610
05-02-2010, 09:43 AM
Just send all surplus revenue to: bronco610
Keller, Texas
76248
Thank you in advance. :giggle:

CSU Husker
05-02-2010, 10:03 AM
Since we are on the topic, I have been debating something. Recently laid off, have about 5k on a credit card, thinking about pulling money from 401k to pay it off. Know I will get nailed by taxes and penalties, but would be nice to get rid of that CC balance and monthly payment. Plus improve my credit score a little. Thoughts?

ColoradoDarin
05-02-2010, 11:34 AM
Since we are on the topic, I have been debating something. Recently laid off, have about 5k on a credit card, thinking about pulling money from 401k to pay it off. Know I will get nailed by taxes and penalties, but would be nice to get rid of that CC balance and monthly payment. Plus improve my credit score a little. Thoughts?

Don't.

Doggcow
05-02-2010, 11:38 AM
10% Short Term Savings, which I turn 10% of it into long Term every month
15% In long term savings

I can't afford much more than that, going to college and working part time.

Broncojef
05-02-2010, 04:41 PM
Since we are on the topic, I have been debating something. Recently laid off, have about 5k on a credit card, thinking about pulling money from 401k to pay it off. Know I will get nailed by taxes and penalties, but would be nice to get rid of that CC balance and monthly payment. Plus improve my credit score a little. Thoughts?

Depends on your view of the market and credit cards. I tend to think the stock market will head towards 3000 very shortly and you'll therefore be losing any money you put or have in the market (401K) anyway. At a minimum I'd encourage you to look at taking enough out to pay taxes and squash the credit card while you can. I really wouldn't worry about the credit score though, the days of getting credit will be over when the real crash hit in 12-18 months.

broncosteven
05-02-2010, 05:18 PM
Since we are on the topic, I have been debating something. Recently laid off, have about 5k on a credit card, thinking about pulling money from 401k to pay it off. Know I will get nailed by taxes and penalties, but would be nice to get rid of that CC balance and monthly payment. Plus improve my credit score a little. Thoughts?

Don't do it. Take a part time job somewhere to cover what Unemployment doesn't but don't ever touch that money.

When you do get a job sacrifice and limit spending until it hurts really really bad to pay that down. In time it will be gone but at least you will still have something to retire on down the line.

**** your credit score you want to be able to retire and credit can be fixed.

Read the Wealthy Barber and other financial books with your new free time.

theAPAOps5
05-02-2010, 05:23 PM
Since we are on the topic, I have been debating something. Recently laid off, have about 5k on a credit card, thinking about pulling money from 401k to pay it off. Know I will get nailed by taxes and penalties, but would be nice to get rid of that CC balance and monthly payment. Plus improve my credit score a little. Thoughts?

5,000 grand won't effect your score enough to take that 401k hit. The tax hit is nasty come tax time so I say just pay the monthly payment and if worse comes to worse when you can't even afford Ramen Noodles then pull that money out.

But I think things are starting to get better at least in the short term. Just from what I have seen in traffic and schedules for the airlines and what is going on with my wives family commercial printing shop.

That and I visited a recycling center for a project I am working on. The manager said that the market for recycled corrugated cardboard, the stuff that boxes are made of, is nearly back to pre-recession levels. It bottomed out about 2-3 months before the economy hit rock bottom.

Of course I am no expert but there seems to be some positive signs I am seeing. So things may be looking up!

Broncoman13
05-02-2010, 05:47 PM
Hmmm, this thread really has me thinking about some options now.

I have a nice little nest egg in my TSP (similar to a 401k). Thinking about taking out a loan for about $20k. That will pay off all CCs, Car Loans, etc. The loan is against my money and will require that I pay back 3.25%. Right now I pay about $800 a month in car loans, CCs, and that sort of thing. The loan (from myself) would cost me $159 per pay check... 60 months. The Auto loan will be complete in 2011. The CCs (Best Buy, Lowes, Home Depot included) are moderate to high interest... they're going down, but for every $200 I pay only $150 or so goes toward the balance. So, the 3.25% interest rate that I would be repaying to myself is attractive.

What really has me considering this now, I've gain a good amount on my TSP in the past year or so. Probably up by 20% or so with the market rebound. But I also know that a plummet is looming. If I take a 20% hit then the money is simply lost and doesn't go toward anything. If the market really tanks, I am not losing the money... Plus, I'll be putting in the same $900 per month in the account (my money plus the 5% my work puts in). The only thing that is holding me back is the fact that any money taken out in a loan is not making any interest and, if I take out a loan now I won't be able to in the future (until repaid in full) if something were to come up.

Broncojef, do you really think Silver is going to do that well? That is certainly worth investing in if it manages half of what you're predicting. Have any good sites for acquiring Silver?

Bronco_Beerslug
05-02-2010, 06:01 PM
When rates rise and the dollar becomes more worthless the only smart investment right now is to buy gold or silver. Uh huh. Go ahead buy all the metal you can right now and tell me in 10 years how that paid off for you.

Silver is right now near $18.50 an ounce and I'm betting it hits $200 an ounce within the next two years. I'll wager any amount of money you have on that prediction.

Likewise the market is poised to crash hard soon...I'll say to 3000 or just under the price of an ounce of gold. My two cents...get out of the market NOW!!! buy Silver.Again, I'll take all the money you have on that prediction also. Want any of it?

bowtown
05-02-2010, 06:12 PM
Depends on your view of the market and credit cards. I tend to think the stock market will head towards 3000 very shortly and you'll therefore be losing any money you put or have in the market (401K) anyway. At a minimum I'd encourage you to look at taking enough out to pay taxes and squash the credit card while you can. I really wouldn't worry about the credit score though, the days of getting credit will be over when the real crash hit in 12-18 months.

Right, so there's that view, and then there's the not paranoid crazy view. Like he said, it depends on which view you have.

theAPAOps5
05-02-2010, 06:12 PM
Hey slug curious why you are against metal? I know you have had this stance for a while. It seems like buying gold at least is a sound choice because often it is used to guarantee other forms of monetization.

Just curious is because I know you know your stuff on this one.

Bronco_Beerslug
05-02-2010, 06:22 PM
Hey slug curious why you are against metal? I know you have had this stance for a while. It seems like buying gold at least is a sound choice because often it is used to guarantee other forms of monetization.

Just curious is because I know you know your stuff on this one.Nothing against metal, but I'm not buying Gold at these prices and Silver, for decades, has never paid off compared to the markets and real estate.

Requiem
05-02-2010, 06:23 PM
I'm 23 and graduate in 13 days. Need advice on where you can get the best prostitutes in America for my party. THANKS!

That One Guy
05-02-2010, 06:24 PM
Nothing against metal, but I'm not buying Gold at these prices and Silver, for decades, has never paid off compared to the markets and real estate.

Weren't you the person screaming in favor of C a while back?

Don't remember who that was but I had money laying around in my account that I couldn't figure out what to do with so I got in. Lets see if it'll ever go up now...

theAPAOps5
05-02-2010, 06:31 PM
Weren't you the person screaming in favor of C a while back?

Don't remember who that was but I had money laying around in my account that I couldn't figure out what to do with so I got in. Lets see if it'll ever go up now...

I am not sure what C is but I know he has never touted Silver and in the past he mentioned Gold but I think he thought the price was too inflated to enter the market on.

I think the one touting Gold was Baja but can't be sure.

EDIT: Ok, yeah I have no clue what C is after reading slugs response!

Bronco_Beerslug
05-02-2010, 06:32 PM
Weren't you the person screaming in favor of C a while back?
Don't remember who that was but I had money laying around in my account that I couldn't figure out what to do with so I got in. Lets see if it'll ever go up now...:) Not screaming but at $4 and under I knew it was going up (went up to $5). I've bought and sold it numerous times since then (I day trade) but there is a lot of potential upside on the banks (WF, BAC, C, etc...). C is offloading most of it's peripheral business and concentrating on making money like they used to. Gambling on securities is always risky, never throw in any more than you are comfortable with losing.

broncosteven
05-02-2010, 06:58 PM
Hmmm, this thread really has me thinking about some options now.

I have a nice little nest egg in my TSP (similar to a 401k). Thinking about taking out a loan for about $20k. That will pay off all CCs, Car Loans, etc. The loan is against my money and will require that I pay back 3.25%. Right now I pay about $800 a month in car loans, CCs, and that sort of thing. The loan (from myself) would cost me $159 per pay check... 60 months. The Auto loan will be complete in 2011. The CCs (Best Buy, Lowes, Home Depot included) are moderate to high interest... they're going down, but for every $200 I pay only $150 or so goes toward the balance. So, the 3.25% interest rate that I would be repaying to myself is attractive.

What really has me considering this now, I've gain a good amount on my TSP in the past year or so. Probably up by 20% or so with the market rebound. But I also know that a plummet is looming. If I take a 20% hit then the money is simply lost and doesn't go toward anything. If the market really tanks, I am not losing the money... Plus, I'll be putting in the same $900 per month in the account (my money plus the 5% my work puts in). The only thing that is holding me back is the fact that any money taken out in a loan is not making any interest and, if I take out a loan now I won't be able to in the future (until repaid in full) if something were to come up.

Broncojef, do you really think Silver is going to do that well? That is certainly worth investing in if it manages half of what you're predicting. Have any good sites for acquiring Silver?

To me 20K is a lot to take out against my retirement. At that much I would consider either a Home Equity. Depending on your current mortgage you could end up with a better rate, your savings would be intact and there for a real emergency.

If you have no equity or have not been in the house long enough the best thing to do would be to cut your spending until it hurts real bad and pay down the highest CC 1st, then the next followed by the next then go after your cars. Once you get used to paying these down by reducing your spending you are more likely to actually SAVE money rather than respend after you pay off your current debt. Actually this is really your best option.

The Wealthy Barber book has a lot of flaws and won't make anyone rich over night but you will learn how to get and stay out of debt, the above paragraph is one of the keys to the book. READ THE ****ING BOOK!

BTW once you do pay it all off how ever you go don't reaccumulate debt. Learn how to save for things and pay cash for them rather than buy now pay (pay alot more) later.

Broncoman13
05-02-2010, 07:16 PM
To me 20K is a lot to take out against my retirement. At that much I would consider either a Home Equity. Depending on your current mortgage you could end up with a better rate, your savings would be intact and there for a real emergency.

If you have no equity or have not been in the house long enough the best thing to do would be to cut your spending until it hurts real bad and pay down the highest CC 1st, then the next followed by the next then go after your cars. Once you get used to paying these down by reducing your spending you are more likely to actually SAVE money rather than respend after you pay off your current debt. Actually this is really your best option.

The Wealthy Barber book has a lot of flaws and won't make anyone rich over night but you will learn how to get and stay out of debt, the above paragraph is one of the keys to the book. READ THE ****ING BOOK!

BTW once you do pay it all off how ever you go don't reaccumulate debt. Learn how to save for things and pay cash for them rather than buy now pay (pay alot more) later.


That's pretty much the path I am on right now... Kind of common sense though some preach that you go after your highest interest rates first (as opposed to highest balances). I'm just not real patient. Waiting a year to payoff what I know I can pay off now... And like I said, if I take a 10-20% hit I just lose the $ with nothing to show for it. Typically what I do with the market is go aggressive while the market is at it's 12 month low and then very conservative when it hits the 12 month high... it' s been high for a little while now, so it's probably time to bail.

Here is the other thing to consider BS, I have 25 years before retirement. I can take the hit now and recover easily. The reason they make you pay the 3.25% to yourself is so that you gain at least some interest (the 3.25% is the same interest rate currently for our Gov't secured fund).

Just weighing my options. The biggest issue I have is not having the ability to take out a loan in the next 5 years if I needed it. That by itself will probably dissuade me from taking out the loan... but that is the main reason. Like I said, I have at least 25 years left to work... putting in close to $10k a year (for now, as pay goes up my contributions go up) plus whatever interest it gains over the next 25-30 years. The retirement should be good to go. I was fortunate to start my TSP at 23 years old. If I would have listened to my AF Financial Advisor when I was 19 I would've been 4 years ahead of that even... young and dumb I guess.

That One Guy
05-02-2010, 07:17 PM
:) Not screaming but at $4 and under I knew it was going up (went up to $5). I've bought and sold it numerous times since then (I day trade) but there is a lot of potential upside on the banks (WF, BAC, C, etc...). C is offloading most of it's peripheral business and concentrating on making money like they used to. Gambling on securities is always risky, never throw in any more than you are comfortable with losing.

OK, thought it was you but wasn't positive.

Even with everything happening with the banks, stay in? Don't have any profits yet, I got in at 4.50 I believe and some days I'm up, some I'm down. Just know there's been a lot of shakeup and I usually just buy and forget.

Broncojef
05-02-2010, 07:56 PM
Uh huh. Go ahead buy all the metal you can right now and tell me in 10 years how that paid off for you.
I'll wager any amount of money you have on that prediction.
Again, I'll take all the money you have on that prediction also. Want any of it?

Its not rocket science. How in the world do any of you expect a rally or an upturn in this economy? What leads you to believe with our current job market, the handcuffs being put on investment and business, the outlandish debt that grows every day, the devaluation of the dollar, the bad loans that still exist and are getting worse...the list goes on and on. We can act like cheerleaders hoping the economy will recover but inside everyone you know the worst hasn't hit. If you think the housing market is bad now what will it be when interest rates top 20, 30, 40%...its coming. I'll take a gentlemans wager that within 3-5 years one ounce of gold will be worth more than the stock markets valuation. We have been fortunate for enough years to have outside countries invest in America, we were the innovators and the leaders of the world. Unfortunately those days are coming to a close, I don't like it anymore than anyone else but its where we are at.

Broncojef
05-02-2010, 08:49 PM
Broncojef, do you really think Silver is going to do that well? That is certainly worth investing in if it manages half of what you're predicting. Have any good sites for acquiring Silver?

http://goldprice.org/silver-and-gold-prices/2010_04_01_archive.html

http://www.bullionbullscanada.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=11299:the-silver-price-spiral-part-i-today&catid=49:silver-commentary&Itemid=130

If you want a good read, read AFTERSHOCK by David Wiedemer...he predicted the subprime credit meltdown 2 years before it happened, saved me a ton of money. He is now predicting a Global Financial Meltdown.

To buy gold or silver these are my sites..

http://www.apmex.com/

https://www.bulliondirect.com/index.jsp

That One Guy
05-02-2010, 09:38 PM
http://goldprice.org/silver-and-gold-prices/2010_04_01_archive.html

http://www.bullionbullscanada.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=11299:the-silver-price-spiral-part-i-today&catid=49:silver-commentary&Itemid=130

If you want a good read, read AFTERSHOCK by David Wiedemer...he predicted the subprime credit meltdown 2 years before it happened, saved me a ton of money. He is now predicting a Global Financial Meltdown.

To buy gold or silver these are my sites..

http://www.apmex.com/

https://www.bulliondirect.com/index.jsp

Now after the other recent issues with buying metals, are you buying coins and taking positive control or buying the promise and notion of metal?

Xenos
05-02-2010, 10:00 PM
I am not sure what C is but I know he has never touted Silver and in the past he mentioned Gold but I think he thought the price was too inflated to enter the market on.

I think the one touting Gold was Baja but can't be sure.

EDIT: Ok, yeah I have no clue what C is after reading slugs response!
After reading his response, I believe it's Citigroup (citibank). C is the stock name for it.

bronco610
05-03-2010, 01:10 AM
Still waiting for the surplus money???

Bronco_Beerslug
05-03-2010, 05:38 AM
Its not rocket science. Correct, it's global economics not Ron Paul economics. If there is a complete crash as some Internet "experts" predict, your gold will be worth as much as paper money only you can't wipe your arse with it.

Rulon Velvet Jones
05-03-2010, 06:28 AM
Buy shares in a stable, well-run company that pay dividends and sell covered calls each month. If the price doesn't budge, you keep the premium. Easy peesy. Kinda.

Bronco_Beerslug
05-03-2010, 06:29 AM
OK, thought it was you but wasn't positive.
Even with everything happening with the banks, stay in? Don't have any profits yet, I got in at 4.50 I believe and some days I'm up, some I'm down. Just know there's been a lot of shakeup and I usually just buy and forget.
Banks will start loaning again as the economy moves forward. If you are looking for something long term, GE would be one that I'd buy (it's cheap right now). BA another.

Broncojef
05-03-2010, 06:34 AM
Correct, it's global economics not Ron Paul economics. If there is a complete crash as some Internet "experts" predict, your gold will be worth as much as paper money only you can't wipe your arse with it.

We shall see Beerslug. Gold retains value, especially when currencies fail...its the one mechanism you can use to protect the value of your current dollar. Even if you make a good return on a mutual fund or stock (which I think will be near impossible the next few years) will it keep up with the rapid price of inflation going forward? Not only will Gold and Silver maintain a good return it also protects against inflation around the globe. And Yes TOG I would take physical ownership of the product. Whatever you guys do I hope you make a ton of money.

Rulon Velvet Jones
05-03-2010, 07:07 AM
Cheaper than gold, why not invest in a company that mines and resources the minerals? Such as Yamana Gold (AUY) or Taseko (TGB). I've made a nice little stash buying and holding both.

That One Guy
05-03-2010, 07:14 AM
Banks will start loaning again as the economy moves forward. If you are looking for something long term, GE would be one that I'd buy (it's cheap right now). BA another.

GE I grabbed up last year when things were stinking and has actually been one of my worst performers. That's one I've really been hoping would take off as they continue to fix their financial side. Don't know much more about it all than that their financial side sunk em hard.

That One Guy
05-03-2010, 07:15 AM
We shall see Beerslug. Gold retains value, especially when currencies fail...its the one mechanism you can use to protect the value of your current dollar. Even if you make a good return on a mutual fund or stock (which I think will be near impossible the next few years) will it keep up with the rapid price of inflation going forward? Not only will Gold and Silver maintain a good return it also protects against inflation around the globe. And Yes TOG I would take physical ownership of the product. Whatever you guys do I hope you make a ton of money.

But gold only has value when there's a surplus of something. If we're all starving, a loaf of bread has more value than a few ounces of gold.

Cito Pelon
05-03-2010, 07:29 AM
Since we are on the topic, I have been debating something. Recently laid off, have about 5k on a credit card, thinking about pulling money from 401k to pay it off. Know I will get nailed by taxes and penalties, but would be nice to get rid of that CC balance and monthly payment. Plus improve my credit score a little. Thoughts?

Take a loan out against the 401k.

Broncojef
05-03-2010, 07:32 AM
But gold only has value when there's a surplus of something. If we're all starving, a loaf of bread has more value than a few ounces of gold.

With the spending and debt we've accumulated now it may take a wheelbarrow full of money to buy groceries. I'm not saying the world will end only that the dollar will undergo severe pressure and everything will cost more. I like the mining plays McRulon talks about as well. However if the economy tanks as I suspect it will companies in any form will have issues...but no doubt those mining companies will be better than most. In your scenario if you owned the loaf of bread would you sell it to a man with cash that continually is losing value or siver coins that hold value? I was stationed in Turkey in the late 80's and the Turkish monetary system was so horrid the taxi drivers and restaurants would sell their goods/services for half price relative to the US conversion rate if we paid in American dollars. They'd keep the US currency and within a few weeks come out way ahead as the inflation rate made their currency more worthless and the US value increased. If a Turk saw Americans they'd do anything even kick other Turks out of their cab to get an American fare..it was crazy just walking around the streets watching these guys fight just to perhaps gain our business. I hope inflation never hits us this bad but the decisions being made lead me to believe we are in trouble.

Cito Pelon
05-03-2010, 07:35 AM
Hmmm, this thread really has me thinking about some options now.

I have a nice little nest egg in my TSP (similar to a 401k). Thinking about taking out a loan for about $20k. That will pay off all CCs, Car Loans, etc. The loan is against my money and will require that I pay back 3.25%. Right now I pay about $800 a month in car loans, CCs, and that sort of thing. The loan (from myself) would cost me $159 per pay check... 60 months. The Auto loan will be complete in 2011. The CCs (Best Buy, Lowes, Home Depot included) are moderate to high interest... they're going down, but for every $200 I pay only $150 or so goes toward the balance. So, the 3.25% interest rate that I would be repaying to myself is attractive.

What really has me considering this now, I've gain a good amount on my TSP in the past year or so. Probably up by 20% or so with the market rebound. But I also know that a plummet is looming. If I take a 20% hit then the money is simply lost and doesn't go toward anything. If the market really tanks, I am not losing the money... Plus, I'll be putting in the same $900 per month in the account (my money plus the 5% my work puts in). The only thing that is holding me back is the fact that any money taken out in a loan is not making any interest and, if I take out a loan now I won't be able to in the future (until repaid in full) if something were to come up.

Broncojef, do you really think Silver is going to do that well? That is certainly worth investing in if it manages half of what you're predicting. Have any good sites for acquiring Silver?

Well, if your TSP is invested in mutual funds you should be able to move your money around into safer/riskier funds as you see fit with no commission paid.

You can buy silver, gold, any precious metal at a coin dealer. American Eagles, Canadian Maple Leafs, Krugerrands, etc. Go in and talk to them, they're honest, their business depends on honesty and trust.

Bronco_Beerslug
05-03-2010, 04:02 PM
GE I grabbed up last year when things were stinking and has actually been one of my worst performers. That's one I've really been hoping would take off as they continue to fix their financial side. Don't know much more about it all than that their financial side sunk em hard.The key is long term with GE. They are into so many things, power plant turbines, all kinds of green energies, media, medical, etc.. they are going to do very well, IMO for years to come.