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View Full Version : Josh McDaniels apparently said on ESPN first take Tebow will compete to be a starter


KevinJames
04-26-2010, 10:13 AM
I woke up this morning and my Dad called me and asked me if I had seen first take I said "nope why? He explained to me that they had McDaniels on and later in first take Skip and some dude were debating this question " Josh McDaniels says Tebow will compete for the starting QB job and will ONLY play QB. What do you think of this pick NOW??

" Skip Bayless than said he talked to McDaniels and he thinks Tebow will end up winning the starting job and skip thinks he can definitely beat out Orton and Quinn:spit:

now I could be wrong cause I didn't see it but did anyone else see it? I looked up it all I found was that it was a question on first and ten. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=4209473

Br0nc0Buster
04-26-2010, 10:15 AM
Sure he will be given a chance
but i doubt he beats out orton

theAPAOps5
04-26-2010, 10:15 AM
Of course he will "compete". I wouldn't want it any other way. If he can give the team a better chance then by all means play him. That said I don't think he will win it this year.

jhns
04-26-2010, 10:16 AM
It would make sense. They just spent a first on him and Orton is horrible.

Smilin Assassin
04-26-2010, 10:17 AM
From another post:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft1...ory?id=5134382

McDaniels has narrow vision for Tebow

By Bill Williamson
ESPN.com
Archive

ENGLEWOOD, Colo. -- Many people have many ideas for Tim Tebow in the NFL.

Some believe he'll be a fine H-back because of his sturdy stature and hard running style. Others think he'd be a terrific special teams player because of his desire for the game.

Broncos coach Josh McDaniels doesn't envision any of those roles for Tebow, the player he traded three picks to Baltimore for and for whom he staked his reputation as a coach on.

"He's a quarterback," McDaniels said Saturday afternoon after wrapping up his second draft as Denver's coach. "He's a quarterback. That's all he's going to do."

McDaniels and Tebow will begin the process of making the Gators legend an NFL-quality quarterback next week in a rookie-only minicamp.

McDaniels reiterated again Saturday that Tebow will be competing for the job that is currently owned by Kyle Orton.

"Like everybody, he will be competing for a job," McDaniels said."I don't care if a guy is a rookie. If he's earned the job, he'll play. That goes for any position. But I'll say this, he has a long way to go to get there. But he is starting the process."

McDaniels said Tebow could potentially play in "wildcat" packages as a rookie if he isn't playing otherwise. But he made it clear that Tebow's primary goal is to become a starting quarterback, no gimmicks attached.

"He's a quarterback," said McDaniels for a third time in a five-minute conversation.

Bill Williamson covers the AFC West for ESPN.com.

skunk
04-26-2010, 10:17 AM
no thanks. mods please flush thread.

bowtown
04-26-2010, 10:19 AM
There has never been a more worthelss human than Skip Bayless.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-26-2010, 10:19 AM
Why is this a surprise?

oubronco
04-26-2010, 10:20 AM
TeBlow to the rescue.............WOOHOO

HAT
04-26-2010, 10:23 AM
Why is this a surprise?

I was thinking the same thing.....

Meh...Orton will be a very motivated starter (contract year) in 2010.

bronco militia
04-26-2010, 10:25 AM
what?!? you mean we're not sending him down to AAA or AA ball for a few years?!?!?

azbroncfan
04-26-2010, 10:28 AM
And your surprised by this? Any player on the roster is going to try and land a starter job. The thread title is kind of like if I jump in the water I might get wet. Tebow wasn't drafted to be vocal water boy.

WolfpackGuy
04-26-2010, 10:33 AM
Competing to start in 2010? Crazy talk.

A majority of the "normal" reps better go to Orton and Quinn.

I expect to see Tebow in goalline and short yardage though.

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 10:37 AM
He may not win it by the opener, but he'll definitely be the starter by the end of the season. He's a "project" that's going to work against the "timeline" of development so-called experts assign him.

Not to mention he's not up against Brady, Brees and Manning...

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 10:38 AM
Despite the party line coming out of Dove Valley the Broncos ARE definitely rebuilding. Having said this it is in the Broncos' best interests if Tebow starts sooner rather then later. If he is the QB of the future he needs to take his lumps now so that in 2 years he will be blossoming instead of just starting the process.

I honestly think that Orton will be the starter on opening day but Tebow will take over sometime in the final quarter of the season. The maturation process needs to start as soon as possible. The sooner the better.

And for all the Broncos' fans that see everything through orange colored glasses the team is not going to be competing for a title in the next two years. This team is being rebuilt from the ground up and the actions of the coaches will support that. The mantra around here should be Superbowl or bust in 2012 because that's as soon as it's going to happen.

I'm excited about watching a "gamer" QB regardless of the obvious growing pains he will experience. Hell, if Sanchez can be somewhat successful his first season out then Tebow has the ability to match that success. It's going to be fun which is exactly what Orton won't be.

Go Timbow!

Dukes
04-26-2010, 10:39 AM
Brandstater will compete to be the starter as well.

PRBronco
04-26-2010, 10:42 AM
Brandstater will compete to be the starter as well.

Haha exactly. This is Josina caliber reporting right here.

Except she's not going to break this amazing story for another week or so.

KevinJames
04-26-2010, 10:42 AM
Why is this a surprise?

I thought there would be 0 chance of Tebow starting the 2010 season, so its a huge surprise to me.

I thought maybe Orton would start since thats who was named the starter, and Quinn and Brandstater compete for backup while Tebow, learns.

bowtown
04-26-2010, 10:43 AM
Unless Orton and Quinn go down with injuries, Tebow will be running trick plays until at least next season... assuming there is one.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 10:45 AM
Unless Orton and Quinn go down with injuries, Tebow will be running trick plays until at least next season... assuming there is one.

No way no how. This team and coach are on a timeline for success. If Tebow is the QB of the future he has to start sometime this season. The kid needs to take his lumps sooner rather then later.

Go Tebow! It's gonna be fun to watch!

HAT
04-26-2010, 10:46 AM
I thought there would be 0 chance of Tebow starting the 2010 season, so its a huge surprise to me.

.

There IS 0 chance of Tebow starting the 2010 season.

The surprise is people are surprised that a coach said all positions are subject to competition.

Chris
04-26-2010, 10:48 AM
I think Josh is just trying to incentivise Tebow to work hard. The kid needs a clear goal. He doesn't want him to be thinking "What is my role on this team? Will I ever start?" The opportunity is there from day one, as it should be.

Que
04-26-2010, 10:49 AM
Dude, of course he will compete to be a starter. That's what first round draft picks do. In fact, I will go out on a limb and proclaim that on opening day he IS the STARTER.... Starting Wildcat QB that is.

Hey, it is a QB position right?

Unless Orton chokes hard this year, Tebow won't start the you know, regular QB position until 2011.

Drek
04-26-2010, 10:51 AM
Of course Tebow will compete to be the starter.

Thats McDaniels whole mantra. Everyone competes for everything they get.

We've got Orton and Quinn so that Tebow will be shielded even in the event of injury from having to start unless he's truly advanced to that point. But if he does? Well, it is what it is.

I'm expecting him to play a good chunk of preseason, and then come the start of the regular season he'll get a series or two a game where he gets to go out and run the wildcat/wild horses formation. If that is successful he'll see more and more touches. If his passing out of that formation is surprisingly advanced then before long we'll start having him run some base offensive formations mixed in on the series he gets the ball. If even after that he's still tearing it up then he takes the starting job.

He could really surprise some people here though. Thomas and Decker are both great blockers. Royal is a good blocker for his size. Moreno is a versatile blocker as well. Quinn and Graham are both noted for their blocking. We now have a young OL with a lot of depth and size to it.

Add that our new #1 WR and our #2 WR have both played in option style offenses, so the wildcat isn't totally new concepts to them. Moreno already was running the wild horses formation last season and is supposed to be a high football IQ guy.

Teams better be ready for what this collection of players can offer out of the packages McDaniels is going to put together for them. They're primed for early success within it, maybe even more than out of the base offense.

If by week 9 or so we see that Tebow is scoring touchdowns on most of his series while Orton/Quinn are not I'm sure McDaniels will do the logical thing.

A modified spread option might be hitting the NFL a lot sooner than some people realize.

bronco militia
04-26-2010, 10:52 AM
There IS 0 chance of Tebow starting the 2010 season.

The surprise is people are surprised that a coach said all positions are subject to competition.

you probably haven't been watching football very long..


never say never

Traveler
04-26-2010, 10:54 AM
Have we ever had more depth at the QB position?

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 10:54 AM
Unless Orton chokes hard this year, Tebow won't start the you know, regular QB position until 2011.

I disagree. Orton WILL NOT lead this team to the Superbowl this year, next year or the year after. Since that is the case then what's the point of keeping him in there? All that essentially does is prevent the QB of the future from maturing as soon as possible.

Orton will be replaced by Tebow sometime during the 2010 season and it won't be for some stupid ass "Wild Whatever" offense. It will be for the whole enchilada.

Just like Shanny replaced Plummer with Cutler, McDingleberry will replace Orton with Tebow. You can take that to the bank.

WolfpackGuy
04-26-2010, 10:54 AM
Hell, put all three of them in the game.

They'll just call it the WTF formation.

Rohirrim
04-26-2010, 10:54 AM
Last I heard, Josh said everybody has to compete to become a starter. Same as it ever was.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 10:58 AM
Last I heard, Josh said everybody has to compete to become a starter. Same as it ever was.

And the last I heard, Cutler was slated to be the Broncos QB and Marshall was going to remain a Bronco. Don't believe everything you hear.

Teams DO NOT pick a QB in the first round so they can sit on the bench. There's too much money involved and too much at stake. A QB picked in the first round WILL start at some point in the upcoming season.

HAT
04-26-2010, 10:59 AM
never say never

Okay, barring injury....there is 0 chance that Tebow is the opening day starting QB.

I'll take up to $250 on that action if anyone's game.

gyldenlove
04-26-2010, 11:00 AM
Orton will be very good this year unless he gets injured, 4000+ yards and 30+ TDs.

bronco militia
04-26-2010, 11:01 AM
Okay, barring injury....there is 0 chance that Tebow is the opening day starting QB.

I'll take up to $250 on that action if anyone's game.

$250? I've got $5 :D

Rohirrim
04-26-2010, 11:02 AM
And the last I heard, Cutler was slated to be the Broncos QB.

That will be tough, since his dad turned in his playbook.

Que
04-26-2010, 11:11 AM
Hell, put all three of them in the game.

They'll just call it the WTF formation.

Actually, putting Orton in as QB and lining Tebow up wide as a WR could cause some problems. Essentially, the guy could just step back or two and take a WR screen/lateral. If the corner is playing off of him they'd have to bite on him running it and adjust (including the safety) thus perhaps opening up a down field TE or WR for a touch pass. Or if they don't adjust he could run it as a usual screen WR screen.

Could be effective in short yardage/red zone situations. Gimicky sure and I am not sure we want a first round QB getting decked on a WR screen.

Anyone remember if they did that with Slash way back when? I know the WR screen wasn't in vogue back in the gold old days.

underrated29
04-26-2010, 11:13 AM
Tebow will play this year... he will not start. Kyle will be the starter. And If kyle were to go down for injury. Then Brady Quinn will take over for him..... Tebow will eventually be the starter, but not his year


He needs to get to learning how to read defenses better. Until that is done he will not be the starter. Kyle,quinn,tebow....In that order.

However, tebow will be listed 2nd on depth chart for some games so he can come in and run wild horse, 3rd and short etc. Tebow will see more game time than quinn this year. but Kyle is the starter and if not quinn will be next in line.

bowtown
04-26-2010, 11:14 AM
Teams DO NOT pick a QB in the first round so they can sit on the bench. There's too much money involved and too much at stake.

Actually, teams do it all the time.

TheDave
04-26-2010, 11:16 AM
I'll bet the "Start Tebow" chants are going to be deafening by the time preseason rolls around.

and this place will be leading the charge...

bowtown
04-26-2010, 11:17 AM
I'll bet the "Start Tebow" chants are going to be deafening by the time preseason rolls around.

Yep, and just wait until Orton throws an interception.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 11:20 AM
That will be tough, since his dad turned in his playbook.

Hilarious!

TheDave
04-26-2010, 11:23 AM
Yep, and just wait until Orton throws an interception.

God help the guy if he throws a pick in this weeks mini camp... :spit:

baja
04-26-2010, 11:25 AM
We got four good young QB's on our roster and one or two of them are going to net us some picks back before it's all over.

Peoples Champ
04-26-2010, 11:29 AM
where is that funny picture with mcdaniels and tebow in heaven? They are angels or somethin, im gonna send it to a freind.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 11:29 AM
Actually, teams do it all the time.

Okay, I'll concede to your statement with an addendum. Those teams usually have some sort of chance of not only making it to the playoffs but doing something when they're there. The Broncos are a team in transition and there's no way they are going to put up a fight in the playoffs much less a division title.

The rebuilding process has begun and the sooner the QB of the future takes his lumps the better. What we saw in Orton last year is exactly what we'll see out of him this year. I have no illusions that Orton will lead this team back to the promised land and I would much rather the process of grooming the QB of the future start as soon as possible.

In the press conference following the Tebow pick McDingle specifically praised Rapistberger and McNabb for their ability to make plays and be creative while doing so. He was making that statement in a veiled comparison of Tebow and his ability to make plays regardless of how the X's and O's are drawn up on the white board. Why would McD say this if he didn't believe that Orton couldn't deliver this off the cuff style of improvisation? Orton is a stop gap player intended to make the offensive production serviceable while Tebow waits in the wings. Tebow will start in the 2010 season at some point.

Additionally, Quinn is now a non factor in the QB race for the 2010 season. He was brought here in the off chance Tebow was drafted by another team. I wouldn't be surprised to see Quinn traded during training camp for future picks.

bronco militia
04-26-2010, 11:33 AM
where is that funny picture with mcdaniels and tebow in heaven? They are angels or somethin, im gonna send it to a freind.

http://www.dlisted.com/files/marcjacobsbrokeupmaybe.jpg

baja
04-26-2010, 11:33 AM
I'll bet the "Start Tebow" chants are going to be deafening by the time preseason rolls around.

and this place will be leading the charge...


I think that Orton will make the pro bowl this season.

TheDave
04-26-2010, 11:34 AM
I think that Orton will make the pro bowl this season.

Hilarious!Hilarious!Hilarious!

Rohirrim
04-26-2010, 11:41 AM
I think that Orton will make the pro bowl this season.

I think you're right. He's going to get better protection, have a better running game, and have better receivers.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 11:43 AM
God help the guy if he throws a pick in this weeks mini camp... :spit:

It's a rookies only mini camp.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 11:46 AM
There IS 0 chance of Tebow starting the 2010 season.


When was the last time Orton made it through a full 16 game season? Never.
But you're saying there's a 100% chance of it happening this season?

And you're saying that there's a 0% chance that Quinn could come in and pull a Chris Simms? I wouldn't bet my life on that.

long beach bronco
04-26-2010, 11:47 AM
Orton bless his heart is a good guy, but we didn't trade for Quinn and draft Tebow in the first round, MCD did, that's saying a whole lot about the confidence he has in Orton. When Shanahan drafted Cutler in the first round, that was saying a whole lot about his confidence in Plummer and couldn't wait to pull him and put in Cutler, the same is going on here now with Tebow. The guy is a fast learner and hard worker, he will start sooner rather than later.

mizzoutigers
04-26-2010, 11:48 AM
tebow may turn into big ben after wearing that tarnished number 15 (marshall)

TheDave
04-26-2010, 11:50 AM
It's a rookies only mini camp.

Good for Orton... 'cause the first sign of him struggleing the "Start Tebow" chants are going to be unstopable.

long beach bronco
04-26-2010, 11:50 AM
It all depends on Tebow, the faster he learns and graps this offense, the faster he leads this team, trust me that's what MCD wants, actions speak louder than words.

SureShot
04-26-2010, 11:52 AM
I predict Orton ****s the bed ala Plummer in 2006.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 11:57 AM
I predict Orton ****s the bed ala Plummer in 2006.

Nah. Plummer already had issues with motivation during any day that wasn't called Sunday before the trade even happened. He definitely had other interests outside of football before the trade happened. Once it did, though, he had more than enough money (and plenty of other things to keep him busy) to just walk away.

Orton, judging by the way he came in last year from day one and all the extra time he put in with McD.....continuing this year by signing his tender and reporting every day long before he had to......and combine that with the fact that he has yet to get that big payday....all leads me to believe he'll be in the right frame of mind to get the job done this year to the best of his abilities. I just can't see him imploding the way Plummer did.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 12:04 PM
Nah. Plummer already had issues with motivation during any day that wasn't called Sunday before the trade even happened. He definitely had other interests outside of football before the trade happened. Once it did, though, he had more than enough money (and plenty of other things to keep him busy) to just walk away.

Orton, judging by the way he came in last year from day one and all the extra time he put in with McD.....continuing this year by signing his tender and reporting every day long before he had to......and combine that with the fact that he has yet to get that big payday....all leads me to believe he'll be in the right frame of mind to get the job done this year to the best of his abilities. I just can't see him imploding the way Plummer did.

He won't implode but what's the point of keeping him as the starting QB? He is obviously going to be allowed to leave via free agency so again, what's the point? I could see if the Broncos were on the verge of a Superbowl championship but that isn't the case.

In fact, the offense may be worse off this year then it was last year. The "O" line needs interior help and the biggest most proven play maker is gone. It's going to be a rough season this year on the offensive side of the ball. That sad fact points to Tebow getting a bona fide shot at some point in the 2010 season.

The Broncos are not going to the playoffs so the only feasible choice is to start the maturation process of the future QB.

baja
04-26-2010, 12:05 PM
Nah. Plummer already had issues with motivation during any day that wasn't called Sunday before the trade even happened. He definitely had other interests outside of football before the trade happened. Once it did, though, he had more than enough money (and plenty of other things to keep him busy) to just walk away.

Orton, judging by the way he came in last year from day one and all the extra time he put in with McD.....continuing this year by signing his tender and reporting every day long before he had to......and combine that with the fact that he has yet to get that big payday....all leads me to believe he'll be in the right frame of mind to get the job done this year to the best of his abilities. I just can't see him imploding the way Plummer did.

Also Orton is playing for a contract here or somewhere else..

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 12:05 PM
He won't implode but what's the point of keeping him as the starting QB? He is obviously going to be allowed to leave via free agency so again, what's the point?

1. He gives us the best chance to win now.
2. If you throw a rookie in from day one, more often than not it ruins them for their entire NFL life.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 12:07 PM
Also Orton is playing for a contract here or somewhere else..

Yup. It's hardly a coincidence that if you look at the career numbers for the majority of the guys out there, they seem to have their best seasons in contract years.

theAPAOps5
04-26-2010, 12:08 PM
I predict Orton ****s the bed ala Plummer in 2006.

Wrong thread, the bed ****ting is in the Ambien thread!

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 12:17 PM
I think that Orton will make the pro bowl more interesting by not being there this season.

I completely agree.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 12:21 PM
1. He gives us the best chance to win now.
2. If you throw a rookie in from day one, more often than not it ruins them for their entire NFL life.

1. Win now for what? A chance to NOT make the playoffs? Orton is not the answer and he never was. Your opinion is based upon the belief that the Broncos are on the verge of getting to the Superbowl which they aren't. They are rebuilding for the future and the only feasible option is to get their young talent bona fide game experience. The sooner the better.

2. I have never bought into the whole "it destroys a rookie if you start them too soon" philosophy. I think it's a crock of ****. Either a rookie player has the mental capacity to take their lumps or they don't. I believe that Tebow has the drive, determination and talent to deal with the rigors and stresses an NFL season presents. He will not be tarnished for life. Rookies that falter under the pressure of the NFL never had what it took to begin with, a la Vince Young, who is a mental midget. That guy would have cracked whether he sat his first year or not.

3. Everyone here is assuming the Broncos are contenders. They're not. They're a team in transition that's in the process of rebuilding. McD is focusing on the offense while trying to plug leaks in the defense with stop gap, aging veterans (which was Shanny's plan during the Cutler years). Make no mistake about it, as soon as the coach feels the offense is primed for success he will focus on the defense as intensely as he has the offense. At least he better because Dawkins and other defensive free agents are definitely on their last legs. As soon as the fans get it through our thick heads that the Broncos are a good two years away from being contenders the easier it is to see the plan McDingle is implementing.

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 12:23 PM
Nah. Plummer already had issues with motivation during any day that wasn't called Sunday before the trade even happened. He definitely had other interests outside of football before the trade happened. Once it did, though, he had more than enough money (and plenty of other things to keep him busy) to just walk away.

Orton, judging by the way he came in last year from day one and all the extra time he put in with McD.....continuing this year by signing his tender and reporting every day long before he had to after we traded for Brady Quinn......and combine that with the fact that he has yet to get that big payday with good reason....all leads me to believe he'll be in the right frame of mind to get the job done this year to the best of his abilities. I just can't see him imploding the way Plummer did.

Fixed, and I can... I see him imploding for other reasons more than pressure though. I see him imploding because unless Thomas comes on strong out of the gate, he's going to have issues throwing players open, and he sure can't make LBs hesitate with his feet. Remember what happened when he went from staring down Marshall to staring down Gaffney? 3 picks, 2 of which were TDs to the Chiefs.

It's not unlikely at all that Orton will **** the bed in epic fashion.

ScottXray
04-26-2010, 12:23 PM
I think you're right. He's going to get better protection, have a better running game, and have better receivers.

Could Make the pro Bowl , I agree. For all of the above.

However, we might have two rookie O-linemen , one at Center, a rookie starting WR. There are going to be some growing pains, before this gels.

If it does early then +1.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 12:28 PM
However, we might have two rookie O-linemen , one at Center, a rookie starting WR. There are going to be some growing pains, before this gels.

I agree which begs the question, "if there's going to be growing pains then why not let those pains include the growth of the future QB?".

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 12:28 PM
1. Win now for what? A chance to NOT make the playoffs? Orton is not the answer and he never was. Your opinion is based upon the belief that the Broncos are on the verge of getting to the Superbowl which they aren't. They are rebuilding for the future and the only feasible option is to get their young talent bona fide game experience. The sooner the better.


Newsflash everyone: you should bench your starters and insert rookies at every position unless you personally believe those starters are likely good enough to carry you to a SB.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 12:34 PM
Newsflash everyone: you should bench your starters and insert rookies at every position unless you personally believe those starters are likely good enough to carry you to a SB.

Absolutely! Why wouldn't you do that? The NFL is not in business to play veterans just because they're veterans. If that veteran has no upside then every opportunity will be given to the young talent that management believes will get them to the promised land.

Orton is and never was the answer at the QB position for the Broncos. He's a stop gap veteran whose job is to make the Broncos somewhat competitive until something better comes along. That's the truth. The era of Timbow is here and the promised land will only be closer if he get's on the field and matures.

Timbow in, Orton out. Take it to the bank. Additionally, Quinn was only brought here in the off chance that Timbow was drafted by another team.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 12:35 PM
Remember what happened when he went from staring down Marshall to staring down Gaffney? 3 picks, 2 of which were TDs to the Chiefs.

There were a lot more variables in that particular game. Royal was out. Receiving TE was out. OLine was in shambles. Running game sucked. The loss of Marshall was the least of their problems....evidenced perfectly by Gaffney's ridiculous stats.

Throwing the ball 56 times in a game that was neck and neck at the end of 3 quarters of play is pretty much never a good idea.

ScottXray
04-26-2010, 12:38 PM
I agree which begs the question, "if there's going to be growing pains then why not let those pains include the growth of the future QB?".

Because you don't want your Rookie QB behind a ROOKIE O-LINE. Get him concussed enough and his career ends before it starts. Once the line is
solidified THEN you can get him some game reps.

You have to learn to walk before you run.

HAT
04-26-2010, 12:39 PM
When was the last time Orton made it through a full 16 game season? Never.
But you're saying there's a 100% chance of it happening this season?

And you're saying that there's a 0% chance that Quinn could come in and pull a Chris Simms? I wouldn't bet my life on that.

Starting THE season...As in game 1.

colonelbeef
04-26-2010, 12:41 PM
I was thinking the same thing.....

Meh...Orton will be a very motivated starter (contract year) in 2010.

Makes no difference. Orton will still be a statue with a below average arm and no escapability.

HAT
04-26-2010, 12:42 PM
I think that Orton will make the pro bowl this season.

I said this the other day as well. With the SB participant not being able to play and an injury keeping out another....You really only need to be the 5th best in your conference.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 12:43 PM
He's a stop gap veteran whose job is to make the Broncos somewhat competitive until something better comes along. That's the truth.

Is anyone denying that? There's a difference between denying that and saying that, while the future may be on the roster now, the future may not be ready to take over in the present.

Maybe Orton gives us the best chance to win weeks 1-6, but then management believes Tebow gives us the best chance to win after that, so they make the change then (ala Cutler/Plummer). That is all I'm saying. There CAN be a benefit to giving Tebow at least a little time to learn before throwing him in there....both for him personally AND the team.

Now of course this all hinges on Orton looking decent in the preseason and Tebow not looking as crisp or ready...whatever. If Orton absolutely looks like garbage and Tebow actually looks good and does well against first team defenses, then by all means, make the move. This however, is not what you appear to be saying. You are advocating throwing Tebow in their from day one regardless of how they look in preseason. I just don't believe that.

Rohirrim
04-26-2010, 12:45 PM
Because you don't want your Rookie QB behind a ROOKIE O-LINE. Get him concussed enough and his career ends before it starts.

Yeah. That's what we have Brady Quinn for. ;D

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 12:47 PM
Starting THE season...As in game 1.

That still wouldn't make your statement accurate. 0% still means there is no chance:

1. Tebow beats out Orton and Quinn in the preseason or
2. Orton and/or Quinn suffers any injury in the next 4+ months.

Sorry, but technically there is at least a 1% chance at least one of the above could happen.

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 12:52 PM
There were a lot more variables in that particular game. Royal was out. Receiving TE was out. OLine was in shambles. Running game sucked. The loss of Marshall was the least of their problems....evidenced perfectly by Gaffney's ridiculous stats.

Throwing the ball 56 times in a game that was neck and neck at the end of 3 quarters of play is pretty much never a good idea.

Oh please, the only reason that game was "neck and neck" through 3 quarters is because of Kyle crapping down his leg.

Also, the O-line was already in shambles, Eddie missed previous games, and with Brandon in against a significantly better defense, omg, guess what? Kyle played really well against the Eagles with less effective running game AND on the road vs being at home for KC

fdf
04-26-2010, 12:55 PM
It's a rookies only mini camp.

That's why he said "God help him . . . " :)

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 01:00 PM
Also, the O-line was already in shambles, Eddie missed previous games, and with Brandon in against a significantly better defense, omg, guess what? Kyle played really well against the Eagles with less effective running game AND on the road vs being at home for KC

thanks to gaffney's 2 TDs.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 01:03 PM
Oh please, the only reason that game was "neck and neck" through 3 quarters is because of Kyle crapping down his leg.

WRONG.

Kyle's stats through 3 quarters: 350 yds passing, 1 TD, 1 INT.

The 4th quarter, when they completely abandoned the run (29 pass plays called against 2 runs - in a 3 pt game), is where the real trouble was and he threw 2 picks.

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 01:10 PM
thanks to gaffney's 2 TDs.

Definitely had a good game. What does that have to do with the conversation?

WRONG.

Kyle's stats through 3 quarters: 350 yds passing, 1 TD, 1 INT FOR A TOUCHDOWN

The 4th quarter, when they completely abandoned the run (29 pass plays called against 2 runs - in a 3 pt game), is where the real trouble was and he threw 2 picks.

Fixed.

Also, it was 30-24 by Denver's 1st possession in the 4th.

The first possession: 3 runs, 3 passes, pick 6 again.

Now it's 37-24.

Imagine that... we went pass heavy when down by 2 touchdowns in the fourth?

Orton **** the bed. Period.

I liked the "WRONG" in all caps though. Very disingenuous fact twisting, and I can't for the life of me fathom why.

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 01:12 PM
Off to the pool. Gator girls in bikinis. Look forward to lol'ing at how you'll try to reply to that previous post (#81) later.

MaloCS
04-26-2010, 01:20 PM
Maybe Orton gives us the best chance to win weeks 1-6, but then management believes Tebow gives us the best chance to win after that, so they make the change then (ala Cutler/Plummer). That is all I'm saying. There CAN be a benefit to giving Tebow at least a little time to learn before throwing him in there....both for him personally AND the team.

The above quote is exactly what I have been writing in this entire thread.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 01:24 PM
Definitely had a good game. What does that have to do with the conversation?

Goes back to the "Marshall" factor. He didn't lock on to Marshall this game either (for a few reasons) and he did pretty well...you implied that KC was the only time he didn't lock on to him.



Also, it was 30-24 by Denver's 1st possession in the 4th.

The first possession: 3 runs, 3 passes, pick 6 again.

Now it's 37-24.

Imagine that... we went pass heavy when down by 2 touchdowns in the fourth?

Orton **** the bed. Period.

I liked the "WRONG" in all caps though. Very disingenuous fact twisting, and I can't for the life of me fathom why.

Again, none of this supports your argument that "the only reason that game was "neck and neck" through 3 quarters is because of Kyle crapping down his leg." He had 350 yds, a TD and a pick through 3 quarters.

Which brings me to a pet peeve:

Why does a QB get more crap for a pick 6 (in which a guy has to weave through essentially all 11 offensive players) than a regular INT? I can understand it if it's a walk-in/gimme TD for the guy....but when everyone on the field has a shot at tackling the returner and he makes an incredible run after the pick, that's hardly all on the QB.

Beantown Bronco
04-26-2010, 01:26 PM
The above quote is exactly what I have been writing in this entire thread.

My mistake then. I've been reading your "Orton is not the future, so we should start Tebow right away" posts as advocating starting Tebow in week one.

TheReverend
04-26-2010, 03:01 PM
Goes back to the "Marshall" factor. He didn't lock on to Marshall this game either (for a few reasons) and he did pretty well...you implied that KC was the only time he didn't lock on to him.

Oh please, you know full well that point blank Orton had his worst game of the season (and possibly his career) without Marshall. Also, for all his gaudy numbers getting stared down vs KC, Gaffney didn't score. Meanwhile, Philly rolled plenty of attention Brandon's way opening Gaffney for 7 catches and 2 scores.

Again, none of this supports your argument that "the only reason that game was "neck and neck" through 3 quarters is because of Kyle crapping down his leg." He had 350 yds, a TD and a pick through 3 quarters.

Which brings me to a pet peeve:

Why does a QB get more crap for a pick 6 (in which a guy has to weave through essentially all 11 offensive players) than a regular INT? I can understand it if it's a walk-in/gimme TD for the guy....but when everyone on the field has a shot at tackling the returner and he makes an incredible run after the pick, that's hardly all on the QB.

First of all, in your "through 3 quarters" scenario, Orton threw as many TDs to KC as he did to his own team. So yes, it was neck and neck because he crapped down his leg.

I can't envision how you've possibly convinced yourself Orton played on any acceptable level @home vs KC... I'll say this again about your "through 3 quarters" skewed facts post. Read it until the reality sinks in... nothing is skewed about this:

Also, it was 30-24 by Denver's 1st possession in the 4th.

The first possession: 3 runs, 3 passes, pick 6 again.

Now it's 37-24.

Imagine that... we went pass heavy when down by 2 touchdowns in the fourth?

Orton **** the bed. Period.

As for your pet peeve... the person at fault for the turnover gets the extra fault. Whether its a RB fumbling, a WR quitting a route, etc. If it goes for 6 the other way, they get extra blame... and deservedly so.

Circle Orange
04-26-2010, 06:43 PM
Somewhere out there, Brady and Kyle are throwing temper tantrums. Hilarious!

Steve Sewell
04-26-2010, 07:44 PM
Absolutely! Why wouldn't you do that? The NFL is not in business to play veterans just because they're veterans. If that veteran has no upside then every opportunity will be given to the young talent that management believes will get them to the promised land.

Orton is and never was the answer at the QB position for the Broncos. He's a stop gap veteran whose job is to make the Broncos somewhat competitive until something better comes along. That's the truth. The era of Timbow is here and the promised land will only be closer if he get's on the field and matures.

Timbow in, Orton out. Take it to the bank. Additionally, Quinn was only brought here in the off chance that Timbow was drafted by another team.

I'm pretty sure that McDaniels plans for the Broncos to go to the playoffs next season. Your argument would make sense in fantasy GM-land, though.

Beantown Bronco
04-27-2010, 06:21 AM
Oh please, you know full well that point blank Orton had his worst game of the season (and possibly his career) without Marshall.

It's obvious you missed the Pittsburgh game.

jhns
04-27-2010, 06:27 AM
It's obvious you missed the Pittsburgh game.

I hope you realize your constant defense of Orton is pretty worthless at this point. If he was playing good, we wouldn't have traded for one QB and then drafted a first rounder. It isn't like this is a Cutler situation and we made those moves because of character issues. We made those moves because he isn't good. Josh McDaniels doesn't agree with anything you have said about Orton in the past year.

Beantown Bronco
04-27-2010, 06:31 AM
I hope you realize your constant defense of Orton is pretty worthless at this point.

Defense? Can you read? I literally just did the opposite. I just went out of my way to point out what I thought was the worst game for Orton after Rev claimed it was another.

Josh McDaniels doesn't agree with anything you have said about Orton in the past year.

Anything? That's flat out wrong. Go read McD's post game interview after the Pats game in particular.....you know, the one where he really leaned on Orton and explicitly said he didn't miss a single read all game.

jhns
04-27-2010, 06:37 AM
Defense? Can you read? I literally just did the opposite. I just went out of my way to point out what I thought was the worst game for Orton after Rev claimed it was another.



Anything? That's flat out wrong. Go read McD's post game interview after the Pats game in particular.....you know, the one where he really leaned on Orton and explicitly said he didn't miss a single read all game.

You have been trying to say he is good for a year now. Maybe I picked the wrong post to quote but it isn't like you aren't defending him through this entire thread. His play was horrible last season and the McDaniels agrees with me.

Like it matters what McDaniels said. This may be new to you but it is an old quote: "Actions speak louder than words." McDaniels actions say we have a QB problem that he is trying to fix. It really doesn't matter how much he complements him when he is trying to replace him.

OABB
04-27-2010, 06:40 AM
You have been trying to say he is good for a year now. Maybe I picked the wrong post to quote but it isn't like you aren't defending him through this entire thread. His play was horrible last season and the McDaniels agrees with me.

Like it matters what McDaniels said. This may be new to you but it is an old quote: "Actions speak louder than words." McDaniels actions say we have a QB problem that he is trying to fix. It really doesn't matter how much he complements him when he is trying to replace him.

Perhaps you are confused by the definition of horrible. If you want to see horrible watch the qb over in Chicago last year. Orton is average and has a ceilng. But to say he is horrible is a s stupid as saying two first in a trade are less than a first round pick. And really who is that stupid?

jhns
04-27-2010, 06:46 AM
Perhaps you are confused by the definition of horrible. If you want to see horrible watch the qb over in Chicago last year. Orton is average and has a ceilng. But to say he is horrible is a s stupid as saying two first in a trade are less than a first round pick. And really who is that stupid?

Who said it was less? Maybe you mean it is as stupid as saying two firsts, a third, and a starting QB is equal to a single first? You mean stupid like that?

Orton is getting replaced on a second team now and for the third time. He hasn't even been in the league very long. I think all of his coaches agree with me. He isn't a good QB.

OABB
04-27-2010, 06:50 AM
Who said it was less? Maybe you mean it is as stupid as saying two firsts, a third, and a starting QB is equal to a single first? You mean stupid like that?

Orton is getting replaced on a second team now and for the third time. He hasn't even been in the league very long. I think all of his coaches agree with me. He isn't a good QB.

Um you did say that. I thought you were just stupid, but maybe you are actually insane?

Orton being replaced means that he can only go so far. I am not a huge Orton supporter by the way. I'm just saying he isn't horrible. Of course this point will hit you square on the head and you will ignore it as usual. By now that I know you are insane I feel better about the conversations we have had.

jhns
04-27-2010, 06:56 AM
Um you did say that. I thought you were just stupid, but maybe you are actually insane?

Orton being replaced means that he can only go so far. I am not a huge Orton supporter by the way. I'm just saying he isn't horrible. Of course this point will hit you square on the head and you will ignore it as usual. By now that I know you are insane I feel better about the conversations we have had.

Why don't you point out where I said it was less. I will even bump the thread for you if needed.

As for the rest. "He isn't a bad QB even though he isn't good enough to start!"

Sure.

TheReverend
04-27-2010, 07:00 AM
It's obvious you missed the Pittsburgh game.

I can stomach 3 (none for TDs) picks to Pitts defense a lot easier than I can 3 (2 for TDs) to KC's

TheReverend
04-27-2010, 07:03 AM
Anything? That's flat out wrong. Go read McD's post game interview after the Pats game in particular.....you know, the one where he really leaned on Orton and explicitly said he didn't miss a single read all game.

Orton played amazingly well in the NE game. I'd also say he played at a pro-bowl level in the @SD game, and to a lesser extent the Dallas game. Unfortunately, that was it, and the rest of the year ranged from piss-poor to mediocre, imo.

OABB
04-27-2010, 07:05 AM
Why don't you point out where I said it was less. I will even bump the thread for you if needed.

As for the rest. "He isn't a bad QB even though he isn't good enough to start!"

Sure.

Sure bump it. I would love to see the part where you said the first was for Knox and the third was for cutler. You didn't even mention he second first. Than I'll post my rep where people told me not to bother with you because yu were an idiot.

Actually nevemind. I'm not arguing wig a crazy person. It's bullying and I'm trying to mature.

jhns
04-27-2010, 07:09 AM
Sure bump it. I would love to see the part where you said the first was for Knox and the third was for cutler. You didn't even mention he second first.

LOL

Now trying to change it huh? By the way, I said two firsts for Knox. You can't even get the spin right. That wasn't a response to you though. That was a response to someone that finally pointed out where you were wrong. Not once did I claim two firsts are less than one.

OABB
04-27-2010, 07:18 AM
LOL

Now trying to change it huh? By the way, I said two firsts for Knox. You can't even get the spin right. That wasn't a response to you though. That was a response to someone that finally pointed out where you were wrong. Not once did I claim two firsts are less than one.


When didnsomeone point out I was wrong? I missed that.

jhns
04-27-2010, 07:22 AM
When didnsomeone point out I was wrong? I missed that.

They pointed out Chicago didn't give up a first for Cutler. A means one. I guess you still haven't figured that out.

OABB
04-27-2010, 07:25 AM
They pointed out Chicago didn't give up a first for Cutler. A means one. I guess you still haven't figured that out.

Who did? Where? If saying two first isn't one than it
proves my point dummy.

jhns
04-27-2010, 07:30 AM
Who did? Where? If saying two first isn't one than it
proves my point dummy.


We should really keep arguing about this in two threads. I'm sure the forum loves it.

They aren't proving your point when they show you are wrong.

HAT
04-27-2010, 07:37 AM
Off to the pool. lobsters in bikinis....

:~ohyah!: