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View Full Version : Do you like what we received for Brandon Marshall? (Two 2nd round picks)


The MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 05:32 AM
Discuss...

2nd round 2010 and 2011

tsiguy96
04-14-2010, 05:32 AM
better than a lot of us expected. now we need miami to tank next year to get a high pick.

orange&blue87
04-14-2010, 05:34 AM
Good value at for the position for a guy who was overvalued. Pretty happy with the deal. Many "experts" have stated that they think there are 50 guys in this draft with 1st round grades. Denver now has three picks in the top 45.

Dedhed
04-14-2010, 05:49 AM
Discuss...

2nd round 2010 and 2011
Is this a done deal, and is it confirmed that it's 2 2nds?

scttgrd
04-14-2010, 05:54 AM
Why does it matter what kind of draft picks they get for him as long as McD is running the draft.

The MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 05:54 AM
Is this a done deal, and is it confirmed that it's 2 2nds?

The 2nd pick isn't confirmed - but Schefter and ESPN pretty much has put it in stone with a pencil.

The MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 05:55 AM
Why does it matter what kind of draft picks they get for him as long as McD is running the draft.

:rofl::rofl::spit::spit:

chex
04-14-2010, 05:57 AM
I voted yes based on the fact of what other players got traded for. We definitely got the best out of all the offseason trades. I mean, a star QB went for only a second rounder, and we got two of them for a WR. All things considered, this was a good haul.

SoDak Bronco
04-14-2010, 06:02 AM
Broncos got fair deal for Marshall (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/04/14/broncos-got-fair-deal-for-marshall/)

Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on April 14, 2010 8:44 AM ET
The Broncos weren't going to pay Brandon Marshall.

Once you start from that point and accept he wasn't a long-term part of Josh McDaniels' plan, then it's fair to say the Broncos did well in their trade with the Dolphins.

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Dolphins will send Denver a second-round pick in 2010 (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/04/14/broncos-trade-brandon-marshall-to-miami/) and another pick, believed to be their second-rounder in 2011. With money factored in, second-round picks are gold.

The Ravens gave up a third and fourth-round pick for Anquan Boldin, and got a fifth-rounder back along with the receiver. Marshall is essentially a younger, healthier, superior version of Boldin, but with far bigger risks off the field.

Santonio Holmes is Marshall's age and has the off-field risks, but doesn't match Marshall's ability. The Steelers got a fifth-round pick for him. In light of those deals, the Broncos did well.

Make no mistake; this is a good deal for the Dolphins too. The Seahawks got caught not being aggressive enough and Miami just handed Chad Henne a true number one receiver.

On pure football ability, there aren't more than five young receivers in football we'd rather have then Marshall. Bill Parcells loves physical wideouts and Marshall is a rich man's Keyshawn Johnson.

Soon enough, Marshall will just be a rich man.

SoDak Bronco
04-14-2010, 06:03 AM
I think both sides should be happy with this deal. Dolphins get a top wr, denver gets two 2nd rounders for a guy that essentially didn't want to be in a broncos uniform, and if it was for this being the last year of the CBA would've walked and the broncos would've gotten jack ****.

SoDak Bronco
04-14-2010, 06:05 AM
I think Seattle will be kicking themselves for not giving up the 14th pick for Marshall. he would've been worth it.

Gcver2ver3
04-14-2010, 06:05 AM
no...

Broncoman13
04-14-2010, 06:05 AM
The 2nd pick isn't confirmed - but Schefter and ESPN pretty much has put it in stone with a pencil.

I think it is confirmed at this point. Just received a text from CBS 4. Says two 2nds.

Gcver2ver3
04-14-2010, 06:06 AM
I think Seattle will be kicking themselves for not giving up the 14th pick for Marshall. he would've been worth it.

thats the only part of this i like...

had we given in to Seattle AGAIN, i would've choked someone...

tsiguy96
04-14-2010, 06:20 AM
TheScore1510 (http://twitter.com/TheScore1510)
Miami Herald's Armando Salguero says Brandon Marshall will be getting $10 million per year with $30 million guaranteed

MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 06:20 AM
I think Seattle will be kicking themselves for not giving up the 14th pick for Marshall. he would've been worth it.

Trade talks probably get pretty intense... Dolphins could have been pushing Broncos to take the deal before they could call someone else (Seahawks) to see if they'd match (since they have a higher 2nd, and they suck more, arguably)...

Hercules Rockefeller
04-14-2010, 06:23 AM
I'll live with the return, not great but not terrible either.

SoDak Bronco
04-14-2010, 06:23 AM
Trade talks probably get pretty intense... Dolphins could have been pushing Broncos to take the deal before they could call someone else (Seahawks) to see if they'd match (since they have a higher 2nd, and they suck more, arguably)...

Dolphins swapped 2nd rounders with the chargers in the Charlie Whitehurst trade, so they had the 60th pick in the 2nd round, the phins had the 43rd. But yeah, I think the 2nd round is going to have plenty of starters hopefully we don't waste it on Tebow

SoDak Bronco
04-14-2010, 06:24 AM
TheScore1510 (http://twitter.com/TheScore1510)
Miami Herald's Armando Salguero says Brandon Marshall will be getting $10 million per year with $30 million guaranteed

wow ...this makes the trade even crazier for me, I wouldn't be totally comfortable giving brandon that kind of money.

TailgateNut
04-14-2010, 06:32 AM
TheScore1510 (http://twitter.com/TheScore1510)
Miami Herald's Armando Salguero says Brandon Marshall will be getting $10 million per year with $30 million guaranteed

That ought to make his head swell enough to insure another "bitch slapping session" and a suspension by the league.;D

Play2win
04-14-2010, 06:32 AM
So what would have been better, in the long run, 2 2nd rounders (if true), or the #14 pick this year (only)?

WolfpackGuy
04-14-2010, 06:35 AM
So what would have been better, in the long run, 2 2nd rounders (if true), or the #14 pick this year (only)?

2010 #14 pick this year, and extra 2010 second rounder from Marshall trade.

I think the team will definitely trade down from 11 now.

Drek
04-14-2010, 07:12 AM
I like two seconds more than one first personally, so yes, I like the compensation.

Ideally I wanted us to keep Marshall, but he's completely unwilling to acknowledge the massive risk his behavior has made him. I guess he didn't have to since he's found a team willing to give him the stupid guaranteed money he felt entitled to, but I'm real happy it wasn't Denver.

barryr
04-14-2010, 07:14 AM
2010 #14 pick this year, and extra 2010 second rounder from Marshall trade.

I think the team will definitely trade down from 11 now.

I hope they can trade down as well.

gunns
04-14-2010, 07:21 AM
The trade isn't horrible. Yes a QB got traded for a 2nd but I feel Marshall has more talent and a longer shelf life than that QB. And that 2nd next year probably won't be as good as the one this year. Miami should do better. I think they should have included Ginn in the trade. Not a real fan but a return man none the less.

The MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 07:24 AM
The trade isn't horrible. Yes a QB got traded for a 2nd but I feel Marshall has more talent and a longer shelf life than that QB. And that 2nd next year probably won't be as good as the one this year. Miami should do better. I think they should have included Ginn in the trade. Not a real fan but a return man none the less.

a star QB is the leader of your team... if they get 4-5 years out of McNabb that will be worth a lot more than what a WR can do in the same amount of time...

WR is not the leader of your team...unless you're Rod Smith.

Broncofan_H
04-14-2010, 07:24 AM
wow ...this makes the trade even crazier for me, I wouldn't be totally comfortable giving brandon that kind of money.

No doubt. Good luck with that, Miami.

Hilarious!

enjolras
04-14-2010, 07:28 AM
a star QB is the leader of your team... if they get 4-5 years out of McNabb that will be worth a lot more than what a WR can do in the same amount of time...

WR is not the leader of your team...unless you're Rod Smith.

And even then it was a position that Rod found it difficult to lead from.

gunns
04-14-2010, 07:31 AM
a star QB is the leader of your team... if they get 4-5 years out of McNabb that will be worth a lot more than what a WR can do in the same amount of time...

WR is not the leader of your team...unless you're Rod Smith.

I definitely agree with that, WR's are a dime a dozen, but not with Marshall's talent. Your statement about the QB being the leader of the team was depressing to me considering someone on the Broncos who is supposed to be a leader, and I didn't see it plus the fact that WR did more than that QB, in fact saving his ass a couple of times.
I also sincerely doubt McNabb has 4-5 more years in him. He's injured often.

The MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 07:35 AM
I definitely agree with that, WR's are a dime a dozen, but not with Marshall's talent. Your statement about the QB being the leader of the team was depressing to me considering someone on the Broncos who is supposed to be a leader, and I didn't see it plus the fact that WR did more than that QB, in fact saving his ass a couple of times.
I also sincerely doubt McNabb has 4-5 more years in him. He's injured often.



Isn't that what they said about Elway?


HA HA , seriously though... we got not 1 but two 2nds for a WR where a team got 1 2nd for a star QB... and they got a star QB within the division!

orangemonkey
04-14-2010, 07:38 AM
This boils down to the $10M/$30M guaranteed for me. No way this franchise pays that type of contract based on recent history. If it's true, then doesn't sound like Denver had much choice.

BMF Bronco
04-14-2010, 07:44 AM
Anyone else see the time bomb set with Marshall being in Miami? He couldn't keep his nose clean in Colorado, now he's going to a place known for partying. tick...tick...tick...

Requiem
04-14-2010, 07:49 AM
Considering Denver was never going to pay him that kind of money, absolutely.

Considering if he left via FA next season, we wouldn't have got this compensatory in value.

I will miss him as a player and the great things he did.

I will not miss his off the field antics and stupidity.

Lets hope these picks stay, aren't traded value wise, and can become legit players.

A wide receiver is a given within the top #45, and with two picks in the second round very close to eachother, it gives us MANY options.

MrPeepers
04-14-2010, 08:44 AM
the guy went to school in orlando, home is in orlando, now he'll be back with all the original friends from florida. as an owner, i'd pleading with him to find new friends and start fresh.

maybe miami can just buy him a home out on the last key to keep him out of trouble.

HorseHead
04-14-2010, 08:49 AM
An Amish Barn builder would get in trouble in Miami, now you put Marsh there..he'll be in trouble in 4 months...

SportinOne
04-14-2010, 09:11 AM
We got decent value. That value goes down if we draft like idiots again.

tsiguy96
04-14-2010, 09:12 AM
We got decent value. That value goes down if we draft like idiots again.

as peter king said:

@SI_PeterKing: Heck of a job by McDaniels, GM Xanders getting second 2 from Miami. People thought getting one high 2 was all they'd get.

Tombstone RJ
04-14-2010, 09:16 AM
Broncos got fair deal for Marshall (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/04/14/broncos-got-fair-deal-for-marshall/)

Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on April 14, 2010 8:44 AM ET
The Broncos weren't going to pay Brandon Marshall.

Once you start from that point and accept he wasn't a long-term part of Josh McDaniels' plan, then it's fair to say the Broncos did well in their trade with the Dolphins.

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Dolphins will send Denver a second-round pick in 2010 (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/04/14/broncos-trade-brandon-marshall-to-miami/) and another pick, believed to be their second-rounder in 2011. With money factored in, second-round picks are gold.

The Ravens gave up a third and fourth-round pick for Anquan Boldin, and got a fifth-rounder back along with the receiver. Marshall is essentially a younger, healthier, superior version of Boldin, but with far bigger risks off the field.

Santonio Holmes is Marshall's age and has the off-field risks, but doesn't match Marshall's ability. The Steelers got a fifth-round pick for him. In light of those deals, the Broncos did well.

Make no mistake; this is a good deal for the Dolphins too. The Seahawks got caught not being aggressive enough and Miami just handed Chad Henne a true number one receiver.

On pure football ability, there aren't more than five young receivers in football we'd rather have then Marshall. Bill Parcells loves physical wideouts and Marshall is a rich man's Keyshawn Johnson.

Soon enough, Marshall will just be a rich man.

Anyone here besides me think that the Broncos perhaps won't get a second in the 2011 draft?

If Miami has a decent year then it's going to be, at best, a low second round pick.

tsiguy96
04-14-2010, 09:17 AM
fs3142 (http://twitter.com/fs3142)
Anyone blaming the agent, McD or anyone else is completely, totally ignoring Marshall's actions in 2009. 100 percent head in the sand.

Bronco Yoda
04-14-2010, 09:17 AM
Yah!!!!!!

We got draft picks!

Two in the bush is worth more than a bird in hand. Isn't that how it goes........No?

tsiguy96
04-14-2010, 09:17 AM
Anyone here besides me think that the Broncos perhaps won't get a second in the 2011 draft?

If Miami has a decent year then it's going to be, at best, a low second round pick.

already been announced by miami and denver

Bronco Yoda
04-14-2010, 09:18 AM
I say we trade Clady next.

Wonder what we could get?

lex
04-14-2010, 09:18 AM
This thread is basically a "Do you support Josh McDonalds" poll in disguise.

TailgateNut
04-14-2010, 09:22 AM
An Amish Barn builder would get in trouble in Miami, now you put Marsh there..he'll be in trouble in 4 months...

:spit:

Bronco Yoda
04-14-2010, 09:26 AM
The NFL is full of over ego filled spoiled brats. At some point you need to learn to coach them. Josh better learn this lesson soon.

gtown
04-14-2010, 09:26 AM
We had no choice. Their was no way the FO would offer that much guaranteed cash. We get two great picks. The second round is where its at. Production/dollar amount is highest there.

Thank God we didn't get 14 back from the Seahawks. Can you imagine the amount of needless threads comparing BMarsh to Alphonso?

baja
04-14-2010, 09:28 AM
I think Seattle will be kicking themselves for not giving up the 14th pick for Marshall. he would've been worth it.

Truthfully with this draft class and our needs I'd rather have the two 2nd's than the 14 this year.

NFLBRONCO
04-14-2010, 09:28 AM
The bigger question is do we like what FO DID with the picks. I hope FO doesn't package them to move up into lower round 1.

Bronco Yoda
04-14-2010, 09:35 AM
I want beef with these picks. Big, Nasty, ill-tempered lineman and maybe one LB who's on parole.

baja
04-14-2010, 09:36 AM
This thread is basically a "Do you support Josh McDonalds" poll in disguise.

Lex!!!!

we all thought you became a fan of another team but I see by your avatar you are content to just bash the Broncos. How cute.

gyldenlove
04-14-2010, 09:36 AM
as peter king said:

@SI_PeterKing: Heck of a job by McDaniels, GM Xanders getting second 2 from Miami. People thought getting one high 2 was all they'd get.

It was a good thing we held out for that 1st round pick, isn't it remarkable that Brandon Marshall a two time pro bowler could not even be traded for the equivalent of Al Smith.

Rohirrim
04-14-2010, 09:37 AM
Lex!!!!

we all thought you became a fan of another team but I see by your avatar you are content to just bash the Broncos. How cute.

Yeah. Isn't this great? Now we get to watch him turn every thread on the board into another "I hate Josh McDaniels" tantrum.

lex
04-14-2010, 09:39 AM
Lex!!!!

we all thought you became a fan of another team but I see by your avatar you are content to just bash the Broncos. How cute.

Its more like "how sexy" than it is "how cute".

ScottXray
04-14-2010, 09:46 AM
Didn't LIKE the 2 2nds, but I guess it is better than a 3rd and 4th , or a 5th.
And apparently that's about as good an offer as there was going to be.

We will miss some of Marshalls ability, But won't miss his off field antics.
Guy is a hell of a talent....but just got 50 million more possible chances to screw up, in a place where he is well practiced at doing just that.
Anyone know when we play Miami next, cause that may be the next time he
shows up as a game changer?
Just kidding. May Miami tank next year (draft choice) and I hope BM actually gets his stuff together after that. Somehow I don't think the odds on that are good.

Durango
04-14-2010, 09:56 AM
Two seconds isn't horrible, but it's not a great deal either. I still think the Broncos could've waited until the week of, or even the day of the draft and gotten more. Listening to ESPN radio this morning, all their 'analysts' are harping on the idea that Bowlen has no money and Marshalls' agent, Rosenhaus, started the salary negotiations with a demand for 25 mil guaranteed. I doubt that somehow, but judging by the contract Miami just inked for Marshall, there's SOME truth in the money numbers, and it looks like Denver closed the book on re-signing Marshall pretty quickly. Oh well, Pittsburgh has established a great legacy with a cash poor ownership. Maybe that's the best model for the Bowlen Broncos in the near future.

broncocalijohn
04-14-2010, 09:59 AM
I know we couldnt get more but I was really hoping on a first at least. Two 2nd rounders is nice but would anyone would have taken this year's 2nd round and Ted Ginn? They are shopping him and we would have a young wr to play now. I voted NO, but I understand it is the best we could get and it wasnt just one 2nd rounder, but two. His talent is worth more than two 2nd rounders but his attitude was only worth a 5th round.

lex
04-14-2010, 10:00 AM
Two seconds isn't horrible, but it's not a great deal either. I still think the Broncos could've waited until the week of, or even the day of the draft and gotten more. Listening to ESPN radio this morning, all their 'analysts' are harping on the idea that Bowlen has no money and Marshalls' agent, Rosenhaus, started the salary negotiations with a demand for 25 mil guaranteed. I doubt that somehow, but judging by the contract Miami just inked for Marshall, there's SOME truth in the money numbers, and it looks like Denver closed the book on re-signing Marshall pretty quickly. Oh well, Pittsburgh has established a great legacy with a cash poor ownership. Maybe that's the best model for the Bowlen Broncos in the near future.

A pick the following year loses value. So a 2nd next year is really more like a 3rd.

broncocalijohn
04-14-2010, 10:01 AM
Looks like we go from a BEars hater to a Dolphins hater. Let us hope Miami goes 0-16 and we get a nice "late 1st round" pick.

Rohirrim
04-14-2010, 10:02 AM
Two seconds isn't horrible, but it's not a great deal either. I still think the Broncos could've waited until the week of, or even the day of the draft and gotten more. Listening to ESPN radio this morning, all their 'analysts' are harping on the idea that Bowlen has no money and Marshalls' agent, Rosenhaus, started the salary negotiations with a demand for 25 mil guaranteed. I doubt that somehow, but judging by the contract Miami just inked for Marshall, there's SOME truth in the money numbers, and it looks like Denver closed the book on re-signing Marshall pretty quickly. Oh well, Pittsburgh has established a great legacy with a cash poor ownership. Maybe that's the best model for the Bowlen Broncos in the near future.

I'm guessing it's more likely that the Broncos looked at the risk/reward ratio and decided not to invest almost $50 million over the next four years in a bad investment.

RaiderH8r
04-14-2010, 10:13 AM
I say we trade Clady next.

Wonder what we could get?

This needs to be considered. His productivity slumped last year over his rookie campaign and he's clearly on the downslide. We should bail now and get value. More picks=better club.

go_broncos
04-14-2010, 10:15 AM
Waiting for the day when Mcd gets fired.
I never thought a coach could be this horrible.
To me, he prefers good guys though they suck in playing football.
He can't coach NFL players.he is better suited to coach college players.

I am so upset now..Now there are no good player's on offense.
On top of that, he sucks in drafting player's.

The only good thing he did till now is trading cutler.
Unfortunately, he did many bad things.

MCD..YOU SUCK..I HATE YOU

broncocalijohn
04-14-2010, 10:17 AM
Waiting for the day when Mcd gets fired.
I never thought a coach could be this horrible.
To me, he prefers good guys though they suck in playing football.
He can't coach NFL players.he is better suited to coach college players.

I am so upset now..Now there are no good player's on offense.
On top of that, he sucks in drafting player's.

The only good thing he did till now is trading cutler.
Unfortunately, he did many bad things.

MCD..YOU SUCK..I HATE YOU

Amazing some of you look at this as if Bowlen had nothing to do with it. He would need to invest $50 million (and wasnt it $25 mil guaranteed?) on a headcase. He wasnt willing to put that type of money on him and his attitude. He got what he was worth to the other teams. Maybe some blame is on Marshall even though he got his greed money.

WolfpackGuy
04-14-2010, 10:20 AM
This needs to be considered. His productivity slumped last year over his rookie campaign and he's clearly on the downslide. We should bail now and get value. More picks=better club.

Plus, Clady can't run after the catch for ****.

I say trade him.

Better yet, cut him!

go_broncos
04-14-2010, 10:24 AM
Amazing some of you look at this as if Bowlen had nothing to do with it. He would need to invest $50 million (and wasnt it $25 mil guaranteed?) on a headcase. He wasnt willing to put that type of money on him and his attitude. He got what he was worth to the other teams. Maybe some blame is on Marshall even though he got his greed money.

As a NFL coach, you should be capable of handling them.
I don't have issues with Mcd's coaching(as it is his first year).
I am worried with the way he handles player's. He expects player's attitude to be like Royal, Orton and Bailey.
I can clearly see that he can't coach player's like marshall.

If you see shanny, he was able to handle player's of different attitudes.

As a bronco fan, every one should be concerned.

RaiderH8r
04-14-2010, 10:31 AM
As a NFL coach, you should be capable of handling them.
I don't have issues with Mcd's coaching(as it is his first year).
I am worried with the way he handles player's. He expects player's attitude to be like Royal, Orton and Bailey.
I can clearly see that he can't coach player's like marshall.

If you see shanny, he was able to handle player's of different attitudes.

As a bronco fan, every one should be concerned.

I keep saying I'm a good guy. I'll toe McKid's team first line all day every day for the league minimum and $5 M guaranteed. I say it's an easy day at the office for McKid and Xanders when a team first kinda guy like me comes along. I present tremendous value because I can play interior OL or DL, maybe a little FB. Hell, I'll return kicks if I have to because that's the kind team first kind of guy I am. Hell, people love me. I'm great in the locker room.

TheDave
04-14-2010, 10:35 AM
This place is great...

When this offseason began 2/3rds of this board said the compensation began at Roy Williams and went up from there.

Now that we have gotten significantly less for him suddenly 2/3rds of the board is happy with it.

Beantown Bronco
04-14-2010, 10:41 AM
This place is great...

When this offseason began 2/3rds of this board said the compensation began at Roy Williams and went up from there.

Now that we have gotten significantly less for him suddenly 2/3rds of the board is happy with it.

The market has changed a lot in the last few months.

It's like trying to sell your home nowadays. Had you put it on the market a few years ago, you would've made a lot more money than you'd make today. And just because that's what you said would've made you happy before you had a realtor run a competitive market analysis, it doesn't mean you can't now be happy with receiving less today, once you realize that's where the market is at.

Had Marshall been on the trading block at the same time Roy Williams was, I think it's clear that he would've fetched more than Roy did. And on the flip side, if Roy was on the block today, it's clear he would've been dealt for a lot less than what Marshall brought.

Markets change. It happens.

mhgaffney
04-14-2010, 10:49 AM
Bowlen had something to do with this decision.

It's his money, after all.

Mr.Meanie
04-14-2010, 10:56 AM
Waiting for the day when Mcd gets fired.
I never thought a coach could be this horrible.
To me, he prefers good guys though they suck in playing football.
He can't coach NFL players.he is better suited to coach college players.

I am so upset now..Now there are no good player's on offense.
On top of that, he sucks in drafting player's.

The only good thing he did till now is trading cutler.
Unfortunately, he did many bad things.

MCD..YOU SUCK..I HATE YOU

Says the guy who thought we would win 2 games last year. Two. lol

Smiling Assassin27
04-14-2010, 10:58 AM
The baggage that we unloaded today makes this trade a positive one for Denver. Worst case scenario was that Marshall signed his tender and played for us one more year, leaving for another team next year and basically allowing us to obtain nothing for him. I guess he could've always held out and not played this year on principle, but even he's not dumb enough to damage his future earnings that way.

The guy has 2 strikes against him already and his next screw up means a season suspension. Based on his track record, it's not a matter of 'if', but 'when' this will occur. In the interim, even with a ridiculous contract like the one the fins are gonna give him (how they pay him more than fitzgerald, i'll never know), he's still liable to pull the crank-job stuff he did last year and is fully capable of creating a bad vibe in the locker room.

Dude's talent is top 5, to be sure. But the Fitzgerald comparison holds true. One is a guy with immense talent and an attitude conducive to building a winner around him. One is a guy with immense talent that could implode at the drop of a hat. Marshall's talent will be missed, but teams like the Steelers, Saints, Ravens, Giants, et al are examples that a superstar WR is not necessary to win a title. Even the Pats got it done with the likes of Troy Brown and David Givens, not Randy Moss.

The key will be what Denver does with its picks. If we pluck the next Jarvis Moss or Paul Toviessi, we will pay with poor performance on the field. But I believe Denver is better for setting Brandon free--addition by subtraction, basically.

lex
04-14-2010, 10:58 AM
Bowlen had something to do with this decision.

It's his money, after all.

Where does that money come from?

Mr.Meanie
04-14-2010, 10:59 AM
This place is great...

When this offseason began 2/3rds of this board said the compensation began at Roy Williams and went up from there.

Now that we have gotten significantly less for him suddenly 2/3rds of the board is happy with it.

That's what the market is. We only placed a 1st round tender on him, and not one team even came close to tendering him. Not even playoff teams desperate for impact WR's with late round picks.

I think that should have been the 1st clue that his value isn't what some people thought it was.

lex
04-14-2010, 11:01 AM
That's what the market is. We only placed a 1st round tender on him, and not one team even came close to tendering him. Not even playoff teams desperate for impact WR's with late round picks.

I think that should have been the 1st clue that his value isn't what some people thought it was.

They didnt HAVE TO trade him.

A real GM probably wouldnt have.

BroncoInferno
04-14-2010, 11:03 AM
This place is great...

When this offseason began 2/3rds of this board said the compensation began at Roy Williams and went up from there.

Now that we have gotten significantly less for him suddenly 2/3rds of the board is happy with it.

You have to admit...the market changed drastically. Probably part of the reason for that was how much of a failure the Williams trade was for Dallas. It started with Boldin going for only a 3rd and a 4th. That set the market. Then Holmes goes for a 5th. McNabb--an established Pro Bowl QB--goes for a 2nd and future 3rd or 4th. The market simply ain't what it used to be.

That said, I'm not crazy about the deal. Whatever the market is, two 2nd for a talent like Marshall isn't what one would hope for. On the other hand, I would not have been crazy about giving him $25 million guaranteed either. I am pretty ambivalent about this trade right now. Hopefully, we end up with a couple of good players.

Mr.Meanie
04-14-2010, 11:04 AM
They didnt HAVE TO trade him.

A real GM probably wouldnt have.

They didn't have to. They could have gotten production for another year on the cheap.

In the process, they would have a locker room headache that would hold out all through training camp and cause major distractions all year again like last year (and the year before)... only to lose him to FA for nothing at the end.

WolfpackGuy
04-14-2010, 11:04 AM
It really comes down to what happens with the two picks.

After last year, I'm not expecting much.

Mr.Meanie
04-14-2010, 11:06 AM
You have to admit...the market changed drastically. Probably part of the reason for that was how much of a failure the Williams trade was for Dallas. It started with Boldin going for only a 3rd and a 4th. That set the market. Then Holmes goes for a 5th. McNabb--an established Pro Bowl QB--goes for a 2nd and future 3rd or 4th. The market simply ain't what it used to be.

That said, I'm not crazy about the deal. Whatever the market is, two 2nd for a talent like Marshall isn't what one would hope for. On the other hand, I would not have been crazy about giving him $25 million guaranteed either. I am pretty ambivalent about this trade right now. Hopefully, we end up with a couple of good players.

I agree with this take.

I think it was a win/win/win for everyone involved. No one got trade-raped this time (like the Bears did), everyone gave up a bit of something and got something in return. Not a fantastic trade for the Broncos, but I think it will benefit both teams in the long run.

Bob's your Information Minister
04-14-2010, 11:08 AM
I'm down with it.

worm
04-14-2010, 11:15 AM
Dolphins 2010 Schedule

Home: Buffalo Bills, New England Patriots, New York Jets, Cleveland Browns, Pittsburgh Steelers, Tennessee Titans, Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions

Away: Buffalo Bills, New England Patriots, New York Jets, Baltimore Ravens, Cincinnati Bengals, Oakland Raiders, Green Bay Packers, Minnesota Vikings

Mr.Meanie
04-14-2010, 11:18 AM
Dolphins 2010 Schedule

Home: Buffalo Bills, New England Patriots, New York Jets, Cleveland Browns, Pittsburgh Steelers, Tennessee Titans, Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions

Away: Buffalo Bills, New England Patriots, New York Jets, Baltimore Ravens, Cincinnati Bengals, Oakland Raiders, Green Bay Packers, Minnesota Vikings

That's actually a tough schedule. I think they end up 3rd in their division... so hopefully a top 40 pick next year!

worm
04-14-2010, 11:25 AM
That's actually a tough schedule. I think they end up 3rd in their division... so hopefully a top 40 pick next year!

Tough division and tough road schedule. I agree. A 3rd in the division and hopefully a top 40 for us.

Popps
04-14-2010, 11:28 AM
I'm happy with the bounty, honestly. We're going to have a nice nucleus of young players going forward.

A 1st round pick would have been sexier, but this might end up being more practical/productive in the long run.

DenverBrit
04-14-2010, 11:34 AM
Waiting for the day when Mcd gets fired.
I never thought a coach could be this horrible.
To me, he prefers good guys though they suck in playing football.
He can't coach NFL players.he is better suited to coach college players.

I am so upset now..Now there are no good player's on offense.
On top of that, he sucks in drafting player's.

The only good thing he did till now is trading cutler.
Unfortunately, he did many bad things.

MCD..YOU SUCK..I HATE YOU



Awwww.
http://zincplatepressblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/toddler-tantrum-001.jpg

Kaylore
04-14-2010, 11:38 AM
I think given Marshall's off the field issues as well as market value, and the fact that we would get less value if any if we kept him, we did well on paper. Really the contract blows this thing open. I would not feel good throwing 50 mil at that kid back on his home turf. That's a recipe for problems.

We need to draft well. I know everyone has written off last years' draft, but the fact is they can still develop. Also McDaniels was pretty late to the game last year so hopefully a full year of scouting and tape review will create better, more immediate results. If we bomb our draft picks, it will be a bad trade, even if Marshall flames out.

TheDave
04-14-2010, 11:40 AM
In fairness to McD & Co... Marshall had to be one huge pain in the ass. (Even beyond the public rap sheet)

The guy is only 26 years old and already has 3 straight 100+ catch seasons with 2 coordinators, 2 QB's, and did it in 2 totally different systems.

To give up on that talent, he had to be a nightmare behind the scenes.

gyldenlove
04-14-2010, 11:54 AM
I think given Marshall's off the field issues as well as market value, and the fact that we would get less value if any if we kept him, we did well on paper. Really the contract blows this thing open. I would not feel good throwing 50 mil at that kid back on his home turf. That's a recipe for problems.

We need to draft well. I know everyone has written off last years' draft, but the fact is they can still develop. Also McDaniels was pretty late to the game last year so hopefully a full year of scouting and tape review will create better, more immediate results. If we bomb our draft picks, it will be a bad trade, even if Marshall flames out.

Reviewing the 2nd round of the drafts from 03 to 07 reveals that on average 4 players per year make it to the level that Marshall was performing at, that is 1 in 8.

That gives us about 23% probability of hitting a player of Marshall's level with the picks we got - I just find it hard to justify that we set ourselves up with a 77% probability of having reduced the talent level of the team significantly, especially since we are not exactly loaded at the WR position.

Considering that Ricky Williams is behaving well in Miami I would say odds are that the Dolphins powers that be can reign in Marshall as well, unless we somehow hit the 1.6% probability that we get 2 great players with those picks this trade looks like a bad deal to me.

gyldenlove
04-14-2010, 11:59 AM
I'm happy with the bounty, honestly. We're going to have a nice nucleus of young players going forward.

A 1st round pick would have been sexier, but this might end up being more practical/productive in the long run.

Just like Al Smith, what a good decision that was, at least we don't have to pay money to a player like Iupati or Dan Williams instead, they would have been ruiniously expensive and would not have added anything more to the team.

rastaman
04-14-2010, 12:03 PM
So what would have been better, in the long run, 2 2nd rounders (if true), or the #14 pick this year (only)?

Getting two 2nd rounders was a much better deal at least for Bowlens wallet. Now McD has more picks to address the O-line and D-line during our rebuilding period over the next two years.

bloodsunday
04-14-2010, 01:13 PM
I don't think we could have done better after Holmes and Boldin deals.

NYBronco
04-14-2010, 01:18 PM
Good payday for the Broncos, I'm very pleased.

ZONA
04-14-2010, 01:24 PM
I think Seattle will be kicking themselves for not giving up the 14th pick for Marshall. he would've been worth it.

agreed. Well, at least we know the Hawks will be looking for one of the top WR's with either of their 2 1st rounders. Hopefully they will take Dez with their 1st pick and that way McD won't have a chance to, hahahaha.

Old Dude
04-14-2010, 02:11 PM
It basically translates to a 2d and a 3d. Could have been worse, given all the baggage, but I'm not giddy about it.

At least we don't have to worry about his off-the-field issues and game-day mood.

STBumpkin
04-14-2010, 03:00 PM
Considering that Ricky Williams is behaving well in Miami I would say odds are that the Dolphins powers that be can reign in Marshall as well, unless we somehow hit the 1.6% probability that we get 2 great players with those picks this trade looks like a bad deal to me.

Williams MO was never domestic violence. He just liked to toke up too much. Marshall is gonna mess up again in Miami, it's just a matter of when.

DenverBrit
04-14-2010, 03:12 PM
Reviewing the 2nd round of the drafts from 03 to 07 reveals that on average 4 players per year make it to the level that Marshall was performing at, that is 1 in 8.

That gives us about 23% probability of hitting a player of Marshall's level with the picks we got - I just find it hard to justify that we set ourselves up with a 77% probability of having reduced the talent level of the team significantly, especially since we are not exactly loaded at the WR position.

Considering that Ricky Williams is behaving well in Miami I would say odds are that the Dolphins powers that be can reign in Marshall as well, unless we somehow hit the 1.6% probability that we get 2 great players with those picks this trade looks like a bad deal to me.

But how many players.....any position, had as many police run ins as BM?

Come to think of it, how many people do you know or have heard of having had 15 incidents by age 25.....or in a lifetime.

BM's production will be missed, but one can't ignore the elephant in the room.

SoCalBronco
04-14-2010, 03:30 PM
It's very solid compensation in light of the circumstances. Two 2nd rounders are arguably better than a single first rounder since, as I've long argued, quantity is more important than really high picks in the draft. That's a fine job by Josh and the FO. There's no way they were going to get the true market value given the off the field problems and the there's also no way they could have extended his contract without assuming the risk. Since the current CBA does not allow them to properly insure the risk, they really had only two choices: string it out another year and franchise him or try get a decent deal. This is, on balance, a pretty good deal. I would have liked to have kept him long term as this does leave a rather large hole in our WR corps, but there was simply no way to safely do that at this time. I think this was a reasonably good return, given the circumstances. They acquitted themselves well in this negotiation.

Bronco Yoda
04-14-2010, 03:34 PM
I guess it's better than a swift kick in the nutters... but the pain will last longer.

DenverBrit
04-14-2010, 03:54 PM
It's very solid compensation in light of the circumstances. Two 2nd rounders are arguably better than a single first rounder since, as I've long argued, quantity is more important than really high picks in the draft. That's a fine job by Josh and the FO. There's no way they were going to get the true market value given the off the field problems and the there's also no way they could have extended his contract without assuming the risk. Since the current CBA does not allow them to properly insure the risk, they really had only two choices: string it out another year and franchise him or try get a decent deal. This is, on balance, a pretty good deal. I would have liked to have kept him long term as this does leave a rather large hole in our WR corps, but there was simply no way to safely do that at this time. I think this was a reasonably good return, given the circumstances. They acquitted themselves well in this negotiation.

:thumbsup:

eddie mac
04-14-2010, 04:15 PM
It really comes down to what happens with the two picks.

After last year, I'm not expecting much.

McDaniels scouting network should be more polished this year, afterall he fired and binned all the previous draft work done for 2009 and had 2-3 months to analyse everything.

Still out of all those draft picks only 1 didn't make the roster, so at least he'll be giving the 09 guys a chance to prove their worth.

BroncoInferno
04-14-2010, 04:22 PM
It's very solid compensation in light of the circumstances. Two 2nd rounders are arguably better than a single first rounder since, as I've long argued, quantity is more important than really high picks in the draft. That's a fine job by Josh and the FO. There's no way they were going to get the true market value given the off the field problems and the there's also no way they could have extended his contract without assuming the risk. Since the current CBA does not allow them to properly insure the risk, they really had only two choices: string it out another year and franchise him or try get a decent deal. This is, on balance, a pretty good deal. I would have liked to have kept him long term as this does leave a rather large hole in our WR corps, but there was simply no way to safely do that at this time. I think this was a reasonably good return, given the circumstances. They acquitted themselves well in this negotiation.

Yeah, I wouldn't have been happy with a single 2nd, but two isn't bad given the market. I knew the market was down once Boldin went for a 3rd and 4th. Then holmes goes for a 5th, so I think we did OK all things considered.

By the way, SoCal, who is your preference for #11?

lex
04-14-2010, 04:22 PM
It basically translates to a 2d and a 3d. Could have been worse, given all the baggage, but I'm not giddy about it.

At least we don't have to worry about his off-the-field issues and game-day mood.

A dollar today is worth more than a dollar tomorrow, guys. Same with draft picks. A 2nd next year doesnt equate to a 2nd this year. Old Dude is right. Get it into your heads.

HEAV
04-14-2010, 04:28 PM
I think given Marshall's off the field issues as well as market value, and the fact that we would get less value if any if we kept him, we did well on paper. Really the contract blows this thing open. I would not feel good throwing 50 mil at that kid back on his home turf. That's a recipe for problems.

We need to draft well. I know everyone has written off last years' draft, but the fact is they can still develop. Also McDaniels was pretty late to the game last year so hopefully a full year of scouting and tape review will create better, more immediate results. If we bomb our draft picks, it will be a bad trade, even if Marshall flames out.

I would not feel good throwing 50 mil at that kid back on his home turf. That's a recipe for problems.

Me to bro...me too. Miami police better get ready for the fun.

gyldenlove
04-14-2010, 04:34 PM
But how many players.....any position, had as many police run ins as BM?

Come to think of it, how many people do you know or have heard of having had 15 incidents by age 25.....or in a lifetime.

BM's production will be missed, but one can't ignore the elephant in the room.

That is very fine if you are more concerned with having good people than good players. But to my mind and apparently Bill Parcells' mind (and he should know) talent wins more games than decency.

Hamrob
04-14-2010, 05:01 PM
No...because I don't see us replacing Marshall. That being said, I don't know that Brandon Marshall fits McDaniels passing philosophy. Yeah, he caught 100 balls...because they were transitioning last year. This year, look for a fast big guy (ala Moss) on one side to go along with Royal and Gaffney. I think we'll be fine. I'm hope for D. Thomas...I think he fits the bill perfectly. I hope we stay away from Dez Bryant...too big of a risk for a slow receiver.

Considering he had to go...it could have been worse than 2-2's.

DenverBrit
04-14-2010, 05:35 PM
That is very fine if you are more concerned with having good people than good players. But to my mind and apparently Bill Parcells' mind (and he should know) talent wins more games than decency.

My point was that Marshall was a unique risk, one in which Bowlen wasn't willing to risk $50 million.

It's not a case of substituting 'nice' guys for talent, it's about recognizing the real reason BM is no longer a Bronco.

Parcells has a track record of working with 'problem' players and maybe he can keep BM out of trouble.

But BM needs only to revert just one time.

baja
04-14-2010, 05:39 PM
My point was that Marshall was a unique risk, one in which that Bowlen wasn't willing to risk $50 million.

It's not a case of substituting 'nice' guys for talent, it's about recognizing the real reason BM is no longer a Bronco.

Parcells has a track record of working with 'problem' players and maybe he can keep BM out of trouble.

But BM needs only to revert just one time.

Marshall's problem is reacting to women who "get out of line" so unless Parcells is going to sleep on Brandon's coach that it is out of his hands.

Requiem
04-14-2010, 05:39 PM
I think the "no's" are more of a vote towards, "I didn't want him moved at all." -- rather than people not liking what we got in return. What would you guys rather preferred? Him walk in 2011 and get the #99 compensatory pick in that draft? Suck a fat one you goons.

baja
04-14-2010, 05:44 PM
I think the "no's" are more of a vote towards, "I didn't want him moved at all." -- rather than people not liking what we got in return. What would you guys rather preferred? Him walk in 2011 and get the #99 compensatory pick in that draft? <B>Suck a fat one you goons.

Funny you should say that, I'm sucking a fat one right now.

http://www.danheller.com/images/LatinAmerica/Cuba/People/Men/fat-cigar-big.jpg

DenverBrit
04-14-2010, 05:44 PM
Marshall's problem is reacting to women who "get out of line" so unless Parcells is going to sleep on Brandon's coach that it is out of his hands.

Good point. TO didn't have off-field issues.

Anyway, it's Miami's turn to watch him now.

Requiem
04-14-2010, 05:45 PM
Bust a fat blunt, Baja.

DenverBrit
04-14-2010, 05:45 PM
[QUOTE=baja;2805333]Funny you should say that, I'm sucking a fat one right now.


That's the kind of talk that keeps Boob coming back to the Mane. ;D

baja
04-14-2010, 06:15 PM
[QUOTE=baja;2805333]Funny you should say that, I'm sucking a fat one right now.


That's the kind of talk that keeps Boob coming back to the Mane. ;D

I think he prefers to be the sucker as vs the suckee

azbroncfan
04-14-2010, 07:17 PM
Marshall getting 10 million a year and going to be living close to South Beach is a recipe for destruction.

The MVPlaya
04-14-2010, 08:17 PM
lol I'm surprised by the voting - it's ridiculous to be honest, but it's also clear as day how some people will hate regardless of what happens.

I recall many of the people who voted "No" who would obsess over Broncos spending money as if was theirs. I recall people acting like bitches as if a 1st round pick is not worth it because of the big pay day for an unproven rookie.

Two 2nd's is solid value, and it's honestly a lot better than what the league was expecting (a 2nd and 4th/later or a player).

strafen
04-14-2010, 08:21 PM
lol I'm surprised by the voting - it's ridiculous to be honest, but it's also clear as day how some people will hate regardless of what happens.

I recall many of the people who voted "No" who would obsess over Broncos spending money as if was theirs. I recall people acting like b****es as if a 1st round pick is not worth it because of the big pay day for an unproven rookie.

[QUOTE]Two 2nd's is solid value, and it's honestly a lot better than what the league was expecting (a 2nd and 4th/later or a player)Where did you pull that out of?

broncolife
04-14-2010, 08:36 PM
if it was 2 2nds this year I probably would be happy with what we got

Captain Bronco
04-14-2010, 08:38 PM
Marshall getting 10 million a year and going to be living close to South Beach is a recipe for destruction.


well said. it's easy to harp on how freakishly talented marshall is. but keep in mind that he's one stupid thing away from being suspended for a whole year. and also keep in mind that marshall seems physically incapable of not doing stupid things. if we had kept marshall, we would have had to throw a truckload of money at him, he would have been a cancer in the locker room, and there's a strong chance he would have gotten a long-term suspension.

those two second round picks sound pretty good by comparison......

broncocalijohn
04-14-2010, 11:47 PM
Marshall getting 10 million a year and going to be living close to South Beach is a recipe for destruction.

arent those fat karnashian chicks living down there now? Dont watch the show but if he is on there while dating one, there will be a camera there for the boxing match.

NFLBRONCO
04-15-2010, 12:05 AM
If we hit the mark with the two picks we got from Miami will help. This will give us the answer how Marshall handles being paid and being home will all the drama go away or not.

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:34 AM
If we hit the mark with the two picks we got from Miami will help. This will give us the answer how Marshall handles being paid and being home will all the drama go away or not.

Okay I will bite buddy. how many starters do most teams get with a draft ? come on maN ? IK want to hear that **** MaN

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:35 AM
and Yes I am on Rum..

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:38 AM
So tell me what does Marshal15 think LOL

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:43 AM
[QUOTE=The MVPlaya;2805594]lol I'm surprised by the voting - it's ridiculous to be honest, but it's also clear as day how some people will hate regardless of what happens.

I recall many of the people who voted "No" who would obsess over Broncos spending money as if was theirs. I recall people acting like b****es as if a 1st round pick is not worth it because of the big pay day for an unproven rookie.

Where did you pull that out of?

I see it as you are a bad person !Golly lee you talk native and all . and to think we are with a great Coach like MCduffuss and alll:afro:

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:47 AM
If we hit the mark with the two picks we got from Miami will help. This will give us the answer how Marshall handles being paid and being home will all the drama go away or not.

Here is the thing NFL I really respect you ! but we do not hit both sorry .I would take one pick hit .

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:49 AM
Marsahal will be missed .and Mcd will be one hell of a coach for the chiefs !

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:54 AM
Rum the breakfast of champion's

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:57 AM
At what point do you start to think what the **** ......................... just checking is all ?

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 12:58 AM
funny you should say that, i'm sucking a fat one right now.

http://www.danheller.com/images/latinamerica/cuba/people/men/fat-cigar-big.jpg

lmao

cutthemdown
04-15-2010, 01:01 AM
2 2nds probably just as good as a 1st. In fact you may have better chance at a good starter with the 2 second round picks.

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 01:02 AM
AM I a hell cat. Cause I see a big ****ing poll Number that pisses me off ! you p***Y that Voted yes **** You you p***Ys ! I bet you scream fire MCD after we start out 0-5 !

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 01:03 AM
2 2nds probably just as good as a 1st. In fact you may have better chance at a good starter with the 2 second round picks.

Go suck a egg.,

~Crash~
04-15-2010, 01:04 AM
yes rum rules

BowlenBall
04-15-2010, 01:23 AM
A pick the following year loses value. So a 2nd next year is really more like a 3rd.

I've never really understood that concept... the owner of every NFL team, with rare exceptions, signs off on these kinds of trades. So you have to ask two questions:

Will Pat Bowlen be the owner of the Broncos next year? Answer=Yes

Which would Pat Bowlen prefer, a 2nd round pick or a 3rd round pick? Answer=2nd

Therefore, why does a 2nd rounder next year equate to a 3rd rounder this year?

Short term logical, long term foolish.

lex
04-15-2010, 01:30 AM
I've never really understood that concept... the owner of every NFL team, with rare exceptions, signs off on these kinds of trades. So you have to ask two questions:

Will Pat Bowlen be the owner of the Broncos next year? Answer=Yes

Which would Pat Bowlen prefer, a 2nd round pick or a 3rd round pick? Answer=2nd

Therefore, why does a 2nd rounder next year equate to a 3rd rounder this year?

Short term logical, long term foolish.

Because the present value of a 2011 2nd round pick, is a 3rd round pick. We're standing in this year. At this point, the 2nd next year is worth a 3rd this year. Thats how it translates.

watermock
04-15-2010, 01:38 AM
Given how Beavis ****ed up, and the owners mood, we're lucky the Tuna bailed us out.

I have ZERO confidence about our drafting prowress.

The MVPlaya
04-15-2010, 01:44 AM
Everyone is going around talking about a 2nd round pick next year being "valued" as a 3rd round this year... but it's getting quite obvious it's starting to trend that people are saying this in such a narrow tense... I'm pretty sure most of you don't know WHY it is valued at a 3rd this year. A simple answer of "because we're standing in the current year" is probably as dumb as the statement sky is blue because the ocean is blue.

Everyone gave McDaniels all this **** for trading a 1st from this year for a 2nd last year... yet now everyone is is running around as if you guys know what the fucc you're talking about with future/present/past draft picks values?

:rofl:

Like in any scenario - when you're not in the actual room or presence of the people involved - there are many factors. As a team, you ask yourself do you need extra picks this year? How many players are on your draft board? Do you have players on your draft board that you really want in which you believe will be there in the 3rd round? Where do you think the other team (Dolphins) will finish next year? And more.

I think if we traded Marshall for a 2nd and 3rd we'd be getting much worse reactions from fans and media than we are now, people are just essentially spinning it that way to decrease the trade value... "Two 2nd round picks" is much easier to digest.

DBroncos4life
04-15-2010, 02:00 AM
Everyone is going around talking about a 2nd round pick next year being "valued" as a 3rd round this year... but it's getting quite obvious it's starting to trend that people are saying this in such a narrow tense... I'm pretty sure most of you don't know WHY it is valued at a 3rd this year. A simple answer of "because we're standing in the current year" is probably as dumb as the statement sky is blue because the ocean is blue.

Everyone gave McDaniels all this **** for trading a 1st from this year for a 2nd last year... yet now everyone is is running around as if you guys know what the fucc you're talking about with future/present/past draft picks values?

:rofl:

Like in any scenario - when you're not in the actual room or presence of the people involved - there are many factors. As a team, you ask yourself do you need extra picks this year? How many players are on your draft board? Do you have players on your draft board that you really want in which you believe will be there in the 3rd round? Where do you think the other team (Dolphins) will finish next year? And more.

I think if we traded Marshall for a 2nd and 3rd we'd be getting much worse reactions from fans and media than we are now, people are just essentially spinning it that way to decrease the trade value... "Two 2nd round picks" is much easier to digest.

While I agree with this, I think the drop off in talent in the 2010 draft to the 2011 draft we might have been better off in the long run with the 2010 3rd. Like I said in another thread we will see what happens with some of the juniors in next years class. Clearly on paper we got a much better deal with the 2 2nd's

The MVPlaya
04-15-2010, 02:04 AM
While I agree with this, I think the drop off in talent in the 2010 draft to the 2011 draft we might have been better off in the long run with the 2010 3rd. Like I said in another thread we will see what happens with some of the juniors in next years class. Clearly on paper we got a much better deal with the 2 2nd's

It depends where Miami pick is... the 2011 class is still to be determined.

Theoretically, say it's at 40... will people be mad? At the same time say it's at 60, will people be mad? It also depends on player performance. Like the Chicago trade - people were spinning our 5th that we gave them as "high value" because of Knox's performance... therefore smacking away at the Broncos even more.

Next years class is suppose to have a lot of big WR's (Marshall-esque)...

DBroncos4life
04-15-2010, 02:14 AM
It depends where Miami pick is... the 2011 class is still to be determined.

Theoretically, say it's at 40... will people be mad? At the same time say it's at 60, will people be mad? It also depends on player performance. Like the Chicago trade - people were spinning our 5th that we gave them as "high value" because of Knox's performance... therefore smacking away at the Broncos even more.

Next years class is suppose to have a lot of big WR's (Marshall-esque)...

I think next years class will be top heavy with WR's. Right now guys like A.J. Green 6-4 190, Julio Jones 6-4 210, Michael Floyd 6-3 220 are all sitting inside a projected top ten. Jonathan Baldwin 6-5 225 should be a top 20 pick too. The problem is I think they are all Juniors this season. So much is riding on what happens with the CBA. After those guys I don't think there is much from a real talent stand point. If they stay in school because of a lock out or a rookie cap then the 2011 class could look bad.

The MVPlaya
04-15-2010, 02:20 AM
I think next years class will be top heavy with WR's. Right now guys like A.J. Green 6-4 190, Julio Jones 6-4 210, Michael Floyd 6-3 220 are all sitting inside a projected top ten. Jonathan Baldwin 6-5 225 should be a top 20 pick too. The problem is I think they are all Juniors this season. So much is riding on what happens with the CBA. After those guys I don't think there is much from a real talent stand point. If they stay in school because of a lock out or a rookie cap then the 2011 class could look bad.

Are you talking about at the WR position or in general?


As far as CBA - it's a wait and see thing but I personally believe it will get done... there is FAR FAR FAR FAR too much money to be made... I'm not sure about rankings but football is extremely profitable and they're growing unlike the NBA.

Anything can happen... I mean just look at Mayweather and Manny Pac...both gave up a bunch of money over some BS. Then again, that's a whole different situation where they could be milking money with the fights they chose instead...and then set Mayweather vs Pac later...

However the NFL doesn't have that option... they HAVE to get something done in 2011... there is just too much to made and too much to LOSE.

DBroncos4life
04-15-2010, 02:31 AM
Are you talking about at the WR position or in general?


As far as CBA - it's a wait and see thing but I personally believe it will get done... there is FAR FAR FAR FAR too much money to be made... I'm not sure about rankings but football is extremely profitable and they're growing unlike the NBA.

Anything can happen... I mean just look at Mayweather and Manny Pac...both gave up a bunch of money over some BS. Then again, that's a whole different situation where they could be milking money with the fights they chose instead...and then set Mayweather vs Pac later...

However the NFL doesn't have that option... they HAVE to get something done in 2011... there is just too much to made and too much to LOSE.

I think all positions to a degree. Ryan Broyles 5-11 175, DeVier Posey 6-3 205, and Terrance Toliver 6-5 205 are all 2nd guys right now. If that top half doesn't come out then they move up. A lot can happen in a college season though. I think most positions are the same. QB Jake Locker is a top 5 lock right now. Next would be four underclassmen. Andrew Luck, Ryan Mallett, Terrelle Pryor and Nick Foles. Luck and Mallett have top 10 ability. Pryor he is a question mark but he gets top 20 as well. If they all stay then Pat Devlin could become the number two QB in the draft and he could be a 2nd round player if they come out.

Clearly I think the junior players that are a lock for the top 20 will come out. I think most years have about 50 to 60 juniors. I could be wrong about that. The more juniors that stay in school really affects the talent pool.

BowlenBall
04-15-2010, 02:35 AM
A dollar today is worth more than a dollar tomorrow, guys. Same with draft picks. A 2nd next year doesnt equate to a 2nd this year. Old Dude is right. Get it into your heads.

Fallacious argument here. Currency and NFL draft picks are two completely different things.

An 2nd round pick in this year's deep draft is worth more than a 2nd round pick in last year's shallower draft, and MUCH more than the crappy draft of 2007.

Time does not devalue a draft pick, except for short-sighted franchises and coaches on the hot seat.

DBroncos4life
04-15-2010, 02:39 AM
I think the biggest thing to worry about is a NFL rookie cap. No junior is going to come out in the draft if he isn't 85% sure he is going to be selected in the best spot to land him the most money. If you are a borderline late 1st or 2nd round player this year but after another year of school (if you don't get hurt) you would be a lock for top 20 then you stay in school.

The MVPlaya
04-15-2010, 02:51 AM
I think all positions to a degree. Ryan Broyles 5-11 175, DeVier Posey 6-3 205, and Terrance Toliver 6-5 205 are all 2nd guys right now. If that top half doesn't come out then they move up. A lot can happen in a college season though. I think most positions are the same. QB Jake Locker is a top 5 lock right now. Next would be four underclassmen. Andrew Luck, Ryan Mallett, Terrelle Pryor and Nick Foles. Luck and Mallett have top 10 ability. Pryor he is a question mark but he gets top 20 as well. If they all stay then Pat Devlin could become the number two QB in the draft and he could be a 2nd round player if they come out.

Clearly I think the junior players that are a lock for the top 20 will come out. I think most years have about 50 to 60 juniors. I could be wrong about that. The more juniors that stay in school really affects the talent pool.

Are you sure Pryor will be a top 20 pick? I never thought his game would be able to effectively translate into the NFL...

DBroncos4life
04-15-2010, 03:39 AM
Are you sure Pryor will be a top 20 pick? I never thought his game would be able to effectively translate into the NFL...

It's just a rough guess. Still if he takes his game to the next level this year anything is possible with him. Personally I agree with you but looking at his size, 6-6 235 and his speed sub 4.6 (4.4 coming out of HS) I think you have to put him in the first round.

The MVPlaya
04-15-2010, 03:49 AM
It's just a rough guess. Still if he takes his game to the next level this year anything is possible with him. Personally I agree with you but looking at his size, 6-6 235 and his speed sub 4.6 (4.4 coming out of HS) I think you have to put him in the first round.

He's definitely got the body... however from the few games I've seen him play it just seems like he plays the game at a mediocre level, in college.

You gotta ask, will Vince Young's transition to the NFL harm him? Now, Pryor is probably a better passer than Vince... but are you bringing Pryor to the draft for his arm or his legs? Vince ran a sub 4.6 40 too I think.

He better have a good year... or else he might have to stay 1 more year to up his stock, and risk more QBs coming out the following year. He had a completion % of under 55% in 6 out of 11 games last year.

He's definitely got the physical tools... but everything else is just not there right now... and you'd probably be drafting Pryor on pure potential and nothing "now." Which would lead me to guess if he WAS in the 1st round, it'd be later than 20...

then again I could be wrong. Hilarious!

Troy Smith was drafted in the 5th round even tho he played great and Ohio State... then again he had the height knock on him.


The jury is still out on Pryor.