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View Full Version : OT [Belated] Document Friday: 1974 CIA doc says "Israel's already got nukes."


Natedogg
04-12-2010, 07:26 AM
Forgot to put this up on Friday! Thought it might be topical with the nuclear summit going on and Netanyahu stepping out.

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2010/04/09/document-friday-cia-estimate-declares-in-1974%E2%80%9Cwe-believe-that-israel-already-has-produced-nuclear-weapons-%E2%80%9D/

Yesterday, Israeli Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu abruptly announced that he has decided not attend President Obama’s Nuclear Security Summit in Washington, sending Deputy Prime Minister Dan Meridor in his place. The Washington Post reported this was due to concern over “Arab criticism of Israel’s undeclared nuclear arsenal.” Attempting to be topical, I’m reposting this 1974 CIA document in which the Agency declared, “We believe that Israel already has produced nuclear weapons.”

The rest and the actual doc is here:

http://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2010/04/09/document-friday-cia-estimate-declares-in-1974%E2%80%9Cwe-believe-that-israel-already-has-produced-nuclear-weapons-%E2%80%9D/

BTW, the one I did last week got linked to by slashdot and got over 25,000 hits (and quite an opinionated discussion in the comments section... just sayin'.):bronxrox:

Archer81
04-12-2010, 07:31 AM
Of course the Arabs are going to criticize Israeli nukes...can't try and roll them into the sea when they have a bigger gun.

Congrats on the slashdot link.

:Broncos:

llayne
04-12-2010, 10:48 AM
Yea'!

Killericon
04-12-2010, 11:55 AM
Always confused me as to why you'd try to keep your nuclear arsenal secret. Kind of defeats the deterrent benefit.

Archer81
04-12-2010, 12:02 PM
Always confused me as to why you'd try to keep your nuclear arsenal secret. Kind of defeats the deterrent benefit.


Cold war politics rarely make sense in hindsight. I am sure there was some guy on the NSC who thought providing the Israelis with nuclear weaponry, and hinting about it would make the Soviets reciprocate by providing nuclear weapons to Egypt, Iran, Jordan or Syria (which they would not want to do...crazy muslims could use them on the USSR just as easily as Israel) and potentially creating a sure fire flashpoint for a nuclear exchange between the West and the Eastern Bloc. So clearly the USSR did not respond in kind, and outright war between Israel and its neighbors has not happened since...so who am I to say it was wrong to do?

:Broncos:

Tombstone RJ
04-12-2010, 12:04 PM
Always confused me as to why you'd try to keep your nuclear arsenal secret. Kind of defeats the deterrent benefit.

It's actually a brilliant move by Israel. Think about it. If they don't declare they have nukes then they don't have to participate in shams like the one Obama is fronting today.

Also, it keeps your enemies guessing.

I'm pretty sure Israel can deliver nukes via submarine too. :thumbs: Love me some Israel!

bronco militia
04-12-2010, 12:06 PM
It's actually a brilliant move by Israel. Think about it. If they don't declare they have nukes then they don't have to participate in shams like the one Obama is fronting today.

Also, it keeps your enemies guessing.

I'm pretty sure Israel can deliver nukes via submarine too. :thumbs: Love me some Israel!

this

broncocalijohn
04-12-2010, 02:08 PM
It's actually a brilliant move by Israel. Think about it. If they don't declare they have nukes then they don't have to participate in shams like the one Obama is fronting today.

Also, it keeps your enemies guessing.

I'm pretty sure Israel can deliver nukes via submarine too. :thumbs: Love me some Israel!

So if McGoofey ever comes over from the War threads to the Mane threads, he will be all over this....and providing a link to buy his book.

Archer81
04-12-2010, 02:11 PM
So if McGoofey ever comes over from the War threads to the Mane threads, he will be all over this....and providing a link to buy his book.


Shh...its like talking about Freddy Kruger...thats how he finds you...


:Broncos:

Natedogg
04-12-2010, 02:24 PM
Cold war politics rarely make sense in hindsight. I am sure there was some guy on the NSC who thought providing the Israelis with nuclear weaponry, and hinting about it would make the Soviets reciprocate by providing nuclear weapons to Egypt, Iran, Jordan or Syria (which they would not want to do...crazy muslims could use them on the USSR just as easily as Israel) and potentially creating a sure fire flashpoint for a nuclear exchange between the West and the Eastern Bloc. So clearly the USSR did not respond in kind, and outright war between Israel and its neighbors has not happened since...so who am I to say it was wrong to do?

:Broncos:

We actually didn't give israel nukes. And were pretty pissed when it got them. The French gave them the reactor.

Archer81
04-12-2010, 02:28 PM
We actually didn't give israel nukes. And were pretty pissed when it got them. The French gave them the reactor.


Right..."French"...

kidding. I did not know that.


:Broncos:

mhgaffney
04-12-2010, 02:48 PM
Here's the short video about the Israeli nuke program. It ran on Israeli TV a few years ago. It's based on the information provided by whistleblower Mordechai Vanunu, who worked at Dimona in Israel's plutonium separation plant.

Vanunu turned whistleblower in 1986 -- then was kidnapped by the Mossad, convicted of treason in a kangaroo court, and spent 18 years in maximum security at Ashkelon prison, 11 of them in solitary.

Try to imagine 11 years in solitary confinement.

Vanunu was released in 2004 and continues to speak out. He's been nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize every year since 1987.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYeJ7uIPEbE

Israel remains the only state on the Mideast to possess nukes. They are aimed at the Arab world. But also at Europe, at MOscow, and even at the US.

In fact, Israel's nukes are aimed at the entire world. Here's the threat: Do not try to prevent us from completing our agenda of ethnically cleansing the indigenous inhabitants of Palestine -- and consolidating our racist apartheid state.

Try to stop us and we'll do something crazy.

That's the threat. The only chance for peace is to call Israel's bluff -- and withdraw US financial support -- compelling Israel to sit down and negotiate a long term peace deal.

MHG

Archer81
04-12-2010, 02:55 PM
Here's the short video about the Israeli nuke program. It ran on Israeli TV a few years ago. It's based on the information provided by whistleblower Mordechai Vanunu, who worked at Dimona in Israel's plutonium separation plant.

Vanunu turned whistleblower in 1986 -- then was kidnapped by the Mossad, convicted of treason in a kangaroo court, and spent 18 years in maximum security at Ashkelon prison, 11 of them in solitary.

Try to imagine 11 years in solitary confinement.

Vanunu was released in 2004 and continues to speak out. He's been nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize every year since 1987.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYeJ7uIPEbE

Israel remains the only state on the Mideast to possess nukes. They are aimed at the Arab world. But also at Europe, at MOscow, and even at the US.

In fact, Israel's nukes are aimed at the entire world. Here's the threat: Do not try to prevent us from completing our agenda of ethnically cleansing the indigenous inhabitants of Palestine -- and consolidating our racist apartheid state.

Try to stop us and we'll do something crazy.

That's the threat. The only chance for peace is to call Israel's bluff -- and withdraw US financial support -- compelling Israel to sit down and negotiate a long term peace deal.

MHG


Silly, silly man.

:Broncos:

Requiem
04-12-2010, 03:15 PM
I don't see what is so silly with Gaffney's post at all. There is a reason Israel pulled out of this summit. A part of it is accountability. They don't want others to know what they are up to, regardless of the fact that those who aren't blind realize what they are up to. More of it has to do with the goons that run their country. Have absolutely no sympathy for state of Israel and hope one day we can stop financially supporting them, but they are the "chosen people" and as long as religious doctrine and dogma makes the world go round, we'll be supporting these loons.

Garcia Bronco
04-12-2010, 03:34 PM
I don't see what is so silly with Gaffney's post at all. There is a reason Israel pulled out of this summit. A part of it is accountability. They don't want others to know what they are up to, regardless of the fact that those who aren't blind realize what they are up to. More of it has to do with the goons that run their country. Have absolutely no sympathy for state of Israel and hope one day we can stop financially supporting them, but they are the "chosen people" and as long as religious doctrine and dogma makes the world go round, we'll be supporting these loons.

There is much more to it than that. I hope we continue to support them and their expansion in the region. If you aren't strong enough to keep then you deserve to lose it.

Requiem
04-12-2010, 03:37 PM
There is much more to it than that. I hope we continue to support them and their expansion in the region. If you aren't strong enough to keep then you deserve to lose it.

Yeah, a lot more to the whole conflict -- and a lot of things that could be posted that would make the pro-Israel crowd **** the bed.

"If you aren't strong enough to keep it, then you deserve to lose it." -- Could we flip this around and say this about the Jewish population during the Holocaust? Just curious, because if it can be used as a statement to undermine Palestinians. . . well. . .

Tombstone RJ
04-12-2010, 05:35 PM
Here's the short video about the Israeli nuke program. It ran on Israeli TV a few years ago. It's based on the information provided by whistleblower Mordechai Vanunu, who worked at Dimona in Israel's plutonium separation plant.

Vanunu turned whistleblower in 1986 -- then was kidnapped by the Mossad, convicted of treason in a kangaroo court, and spent 18 years in maximum security at Ashkelon prison, 11 of them in solitary.

Try to imagine 11 years in solitary confinement.

Vanunu was released in 2004 and continues to speak out. He's been nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize every year since 1987.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYeJ7uIPEbE

Israel remains the only state on the Mideast to possess nukes. They are aimed at the Arab world. But also at Europe, at MOscow, and even at the US.

In fact, Israel's nukes are aimed at the entire world. Here's the threat: Do not try to prevent us from completing our agenda of ethnically cleansing the indigenous inhabitants of Palestine -- and consolidating our racist apartheid state.

Try to stop us and we'll do something crazy.

That's the threat. The only chance for peace is to call Israel's bluff -- and withdraw US financial support -- compelling Israel to sit down and negotiate a long term peace deal.

MHG

BOOOH!



















Did I scare you gaff?

Rigs11
04-12-2010, 06:28 PM
the isrealis can defend themselves. Not sure why we keep giving them 3 billion a year in military aid.

Archer81
04-12-2010, 07:41 PM
the isrealis can defend themselves. Not sure why we keep giving them 3 billion a year in military aid.


Probably the same reasons we give billions in aid to Egypt or Jordan or Saudi Arabia...


:Broncos:

mhgaffney
04-12-2010, 08:04 PM
43 heads of state at nuclear summit

Obama's conference on nuclear non proliferation is now underway in Washington. It's being billed as "the largest domestic summit since the founding of the United Nations..."

43 heads of state are on hand. Let's hope something positive comes out of it.

http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=58714

Archer81
04-12-2010, 08:09 PM
43 heads of state at nuclear summit

Obama's conference on nuclear non proliferation is now underway in Washington. It's being billed as "the largest domestic summit since the founding of the United Nations..."

43 heads of state are on hand. Let's hope something positive comes out of it.

http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=58714


What will come out of this conference?

Nothing but flimsy spin for a hot air president.


:Broncos:

Rigs11
04-12-2010, 09:16 PM
Probably the same reasons we give billions in aid to Egypt or Jordan or Saudi Arabia...


:Broncos:

What reason is that? Other than to sell them our weapons.

Killericon
04-12-2010, 09:59 PM
the isrealis can defend themselves.

...Because you give them $3 Billion a year in military aid.

Not sure why we keep giving them 3 billion a year in military aid.

It's too complicated for any one person to understand, I think...