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View Full Version : Brandon Marshall poll - if it comes down to it...


Popps
04-11-2010, 11:44 AM
Now that we've clearly established that Shanahan is copying McDaniels plan, the next order of business is to figure out the Marshall situation.

It appears plausible that we may not get better than a 2nd round offer for him.

Knowing what we know about Marshall, if the situations arisis... what do we do? Let's say draft day has come, and a 2nd is the best offer we've received... do we take it?

A 2nd isn't much, but it's compensation and we have a lot of needs. Some of the best O-linemen in the draft will be available in the 2nd. Beyond that, it will allow us to move into the future and put this situation behind us.

Conversely, a 2nd is certainly less than we all expected. We have the ability to force Marshall to sit out the season without pay. It's very apparent that given his situation and the labor problems, we won't write him a long-term contract this season. We hold the cards, and we can play hardball if we choose. He can only cause so much distraction when he's not under contract and inactive.

So, what do you think? If it came down to it.... what would you prefer?

Br0nc0Buster
04-11-2010, 11:48 AM
I would not trade Brandon Marshall for a 2nd

Dedhed
04-11-2010, 12:03 PM
I would not trade Brandon Marshall for a 2nd

I agree. If no one coughs up a first rounder we should sign him to a long term deal, with as many protectors written in as possible, and hope he doesn't implode.

I would do a 2nd rounder and a starting caliber player.

tsiguy96
04-11-2010, 12:05 PM
we keep him and make him play, worse case scenario, hes gone next year and we get a 3rd round compensation pick.

Borks147
04-11-2010, 12:06 PM
If no one offers a 1st, hopefully it gets through his scull that he simply isn't that valuable, sign an incentive laden 2-3 year contract and just ride it out. If he leaves after that the Broncos got the prime years out of a beast of a WR.

BroncoInferno
04-11-2010, 12:07 PM
I would be unhappy if we took a 2nd rounder straight up for Marshall. I would not necessarily be adverse to accepting less than a 1st, but any such deal would have to include a quality (established) starter at a position of need (i.e. inside linebacker, center, or left guard).

SpringStein
04-11-2010, 12:10 PM
The one pick in the second I would take is the Rams at #33. Having the option of overnight re-setting the draft board and taking calls for trades is a strong position - especially in this draft where real good players will be selected in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

Otherwise, I'd still like him to stay and play in Denver.

baja
04-11-2010, 12:11 PM
If the coaching staff thinks that marshall is likely to mature and become a team guy than keep him and play him in 2010 all the while try to get him signed to a contract that works for both sides

If the coaching staff thinks Marshall will not turn it around than yes get what you can and move on.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-11-2010, 12:13 PM
Keep him

Requiem
04-11-2010, 12:14 PM
Agree with SpringStein.

CEH
04-11-2010, 12:17 PM
The one pick in the second I would take is the Rams at #33. Having the option of overnight re-setting the draft board and taking calls for trades is a strong position - especially in this draft where real good players will be selected in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

Otherwise, I'd still like him to stay and play in Denver.

I agree 100% maybe even 1000%
Who are you? :P

Popps
04-11-2010, 12:18 PM
The one pick in the second I would take is the Rams at #33. .

Interesting.

Tombstone RJ
04-11-2010, 12:55 PM
The one pick in the second I would take is the Rams at #33. Having the option of overnight re-setting the draft board and taking calls for trades is a strong position - especially in this draft where real good players will be selected in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

Otherwise, I'd still like him to stay and play in Denver.

If the Rams offered #33 then they'd have to throw in their 3rd round pick too. That would be the equivolent of the #20 pick of the first round and I could live with that.

Killericon
04-11-2010, 01:18 PM
I STILL think David Hawthorne and a late pick for Marshall would be sublime. As far as a 2nd straight up? I'm as sick of Marshall as anyone, but no, that's not enough.

Bronco Rob
04-11-2010, 01:28 PM
I would not trade Brandon Marshall for a 2nd


With career stats like this....

Career REC 327 YDS 4019 TD 25

A first rounder @ the very least.

orange&blue87
04-11-2010, 01:34 PM
I'm fine with a 2nd if there is not a decent long term deal in place. You might get a solid year from Marshall if he's not traded, then again, he could get suspended/injured and miss a majority of the season. There's no guarantee that Denver gets a 3rd Compensatory pick for him, it depends on a host of factors.

If it's possible to sign him to a decent deal that won't kill the franchise in the event Brandon proceeds to be Brandon, then sign him. Unfortunately, it appears that the rest of the league agrees that his talent is not worth his inherent risk.

The draft appears to be pretty deep. Some have 50 players with a 1st round grade. Making a trade and hoping that a player pans out isn't any riskier than signing him to what he wants. He's had issues before getting a the security of a guaranteed contract, what makes anyone confident that once he gets paid he'll be a model citizen?

orange&blue87
04-11-2010, 01:42 PM
With career stats like this....

Career REC 327 YDS 4019 TD 25

A first rounder @ the very least.

What if a player had this stat line in his first four years, what would he be worth?

308 receptions, 4123 yards, 37 TDs

tsiguy96
04-11-2010, 01:48 PM
I'm fine with a 2nd if there is not a decent long term deal in place. You might get a solid year from Marshall if he's not traded, then again, he could get suspended/injured and miss a majority of the season. There's no guarantee that Denver gets a 3rd Compensatory pick for him, it depends on a host of factors.

If it's possible to sign him to a decent deal that won't kill the franchise in the event Brandon proceeds to be Brandon, then sign him. Unfortunately, it appears that the rest of the league agrees that his talent is not worth his inherent risk.

The draft appears to be pretty deep. Some have 50 players with a 1st round grade. Making a trade and hoping that a player pans out isn't any riskier than signing him to what he wants. He's had issues before getting a the security of a guaranteed contract, what makes anyone confident that once he gets paid he'll be a model citizen?

no chance they DONT get a 3rd for marshall for compensatory.

oubronco
04-11-2010, 01:48 PM
I would not trade Brandon Marshall for a 2nd

no way in hell would I trade him for a second just another stupid thread about B Marsh

orange&blue87
04-11-2010, 01:58 PM
no chance they DONT get a 3rd for marshall for compensatory.

So if Marshall has an off year or Denver signs a high end FA who plays stellar, the league will say, ah we'll just give you a 3rd rounder for having put up with him all those years?

Compensatory picks are based on a formula on FA lost and signed, the amount they sign for and the level at which they play.

As I said, There is no guarantee that Denver gets a 3rd for him. They may end up with one, but it's not guaranteed.

Mogulseeker
04-11-2010, 02:01 PM
I hope this isn't a serious poll. Marshall better be worth more than a 2nd. Otherwise sign him and deal with it.

tsiguy96
04-11-2010, 02:03 PM
So if Marshall has an off year or Denver signs a high end FA who plays stellar, the league will say, ah we'll just give you a 3rd rounder for having put up with him all those years?

Compensatory picks are based on a formula on FA lost and signed, the amount they sign for and the level at which they play.

As I said, There is no guarantee that Denver gets a 3rd for him. They may end up with one, but it's not guaranteed.

we would not sign a fA anywhere near as good as marshall. if you lose a top tier FA, you get compensatory picks. i would take a bet that we would get a 3rd because anyone we sign will not properly fill the shoes that marshall left.

misturanderson
04-11-2010, 02:57 PM
we would not sign a fA anywhere near as good as marshall. if you lose a top tier FA, you get compensatory picks. i would take a bet that we would get a 3rd because anyone we sign will not properly fill the shoes that marshall left.

And if we did, who cares what happens with Marshall?

Popps
04-11-2010, 03:01 PM
What if a player had this stat line in his first four years, what would he be worth?

308 receptions, 4123 yards, 37 TDs

If it were solely about stats, we'd be getting a top 10 pick thrown our way.

Of course, there are other factors complicating this whole thing.

Tombstone RJ
04-11-2010, 03:06 PM
What if a player had this stat line in his first four years, what would he be worth?

308 receptions, 4123 yards, 37 TDs

Is this a hypothetical question?

eddie mac
04-11-2010, 03:13 PM
I'd take Carriker and 33 or better still Atogwe and 33.

cmhargrove
04-11-2010, 04:07 PM
A second rounder would be fine, but it also needs something else added to the deal.

A second and a fourth?
A second and a 2011 conditional pick?
A second and a player?

Not just a second rounder straight up. Although I think the top of the second is one of the best spots in this year's draft, it would be bad poker to let Marshall go so easily. Other teams might be scared of Marshall's behavior, but in the end, offensive coordinators should be willing to give their left nut for a guy who can consistently get 100 catches each year.

He's worth more than a straight up second rounder.

Dagmar
04-11-2010, 04:08 PM
A 2nd and an established player. Nothing less.

orange&blue87
04-11-2010, 04:25 PM
Is this a hypothetical question?

Stat line for Andre Rison's first four years. He had two more years with ATL that were good, signed with Cleveland as a free agent, and the production was never the same. He, like Brandon, had troubles off the field but was one of the best on the field.

In no way am I saying that Marshall IS Risen, or will be just like him. I just want to show precedence of players that are similar, and what happens to them when they got paid. I see way too many post that emphatically scream "Just PAY the man" and under ideal terms, it would be great, but there are too many concerns on Marshall that it that simple. If Denver signs him to a large deal and gets burned, there will be $4-5M worth of cap space that can't go to signing players because of Marshall's contract.

CEH
04-11-2010, 04:49 PM
The one pick in the second I would take is the Rams at #33. Having the option of overnight re-setting the draft board and taking calls for trades is a strong position - especially in this draft where real good players will be selected in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

Otherwise, I'd still like him to stay and play in Denver.

Hey Geo,

Looks like BB agrees with you

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/04/11/belichick-sees-second-round-as-being-another-first-round/

baja
04-11-2010, 04:51 PM
BB - "In the past, you kind of rolled into that round. Now, to actually stop and have the whole night to sit there and think about it and talk to other teams and develop a new strategy. Everybody does that on the second day; now we have three days. It's a different dynamic."




This is going to make for a much more fun draft

CEH
04-11-2010, 05:03 PM
This is going to make for a much more fun draft

Sure will make for an interesting Thursday night into Friday here on the Mane and at Dove Valley

I really think with the #33 pick if we had it during the 1st round we could alway jump back into the first pretty easily and having the overnight who knows maybe some young ,dumb and full of *** HC will call Denver on Thursday night and trade a '11 1st round and swap 2nds for #33
( Gee wasn't that Zo Smith's number before changing it to #22).


Heck NY Jets could sign BMarsh tommorrow and we get pick #29
(if we don't match)

Not sure #33 is any less valuable then the last 4-5 picks in round #1 plus you don't have the 15 minute time limit

Dr. Broncenstein
04-11-2010, 05:50 PM
Make him play for the RFA tender, and franchise tag him next year. If he doesn't like it... and he won't... then **** him. We either get fair value for this idiot, or he stays here for as long and as cheap as possible.

bowtown
04-11-2010, 05:56 PM
Make him play for the RFA tender, and franchise tag him next year. If he doesn't like it... and he won't... then **** him. We either get fair value for this idiot, or he stays here for as long and as cheap as possible.

I'd offer im the exact same contract we offered him last offseason, see if he's changed his mind after seeing what the market will bear for his baggage. If he won't take it, make him play for the tender. Then next year, franchise him, and offer him the deal again. If he's been a good citizen for the entire year, then maybe throw a little more guaranteed on top of it.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2010, 06:04 PM
I'd take Carriker and 33 or better still Atogwe and 33.

This.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2010, 06:07 PM
A 2nd and an established player. Nothing less.

Exactly, I agree an established player must be part of any deal.

Falling in love with draft picks is just not a position supported by reality, even 1st round picks are a crap shoot. Here's the top 10 picks a mere 5 years ago:

1 San Francisco 49ers - Alex Smith QB
2 Miami Dolphins - Ronnie Brown RB
3 Cleveland Browns - Braylon Edwards WR
4 Chicago Bears - Cedric Benson RB
5 Tampa Bay Bucs - Carnell Williams RB
6 Tennessee Titans - Adam Jones CB
7 Minnesota Vikings - Troy Williamson WR
8 Arizona Cardinals - Antrel Rolle CB
9 Washington Redskins - Carlos Rogers CB
10 Detroit Lions - Mike Williams WR


More than half are no longer with the team that drafted them, and few if any produced much return value upon departure. And none are difference makers like Brandon. And that's the TOP TEN PICKS!

Mr
04-11-2010, 07:19 PM
It would be like selling the Rolls Royce for fifty bucks and a old fridge.

baja
04-11-2010, 07:21 PM
Sure will make for an interesting Thursday night into Friday here on the Mane and at Dove Valley

I really think with the #33 pick if we had it during the 1st round we could alway jump back into the first pretty easily and having the overnight who knows maybe some young ,dumb and full of *** HC will call Denver on Thursday night and trade a '11 1st round and swap 2nds for #33
( Gee wasn't that Zo Smith's number before changing it to #22).


Heck NY Jets could sign BMarsh tommorrow and we get pick #29
(if we don't match)

Not sure #33 is any less valuable then the last 4-5 picks in round #1 plus you don't have the 15 minute time limit

The more I think about it the more I realize how epic this 24 hours between rd 1 and rd 2 really is. This is really going to add a wonderful dynamic to the process.

Popps
04-11-2010, 07:40 PM
I see way too many posts that emphatically scream "Just PAY the man"

Yep, that's about as shallow of an approach as someone could take to the situation. If it were that simple, we wouldn't be having these conversations.

SoCalBronco
04-11-2010, 07:51 PM
A 2nd and an established player. Nothing less.

That's probably the best that Denver could hope for given the off the field issues.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2010, 07:53 PM
I see way too many post that emphatically scream "Just PAY the man" and under ideal terms, it would be great, but there are too many concerns on Marshall that it that simple.

That seems pretty clear. And remember, this is the SECOND Broncos administration that's declined to offer him a long-term lockup.

SoCalBronco
04-11-2010, 08:00 PM
That seems pretty clear. And remember, this is the SECOND Broncos administration that's declined to offer him a long-term lockup.

I think the only thing holding the Broncos back here is the CBA. They are kind of restricted under the current CBA as to how much they could recoup in morals clauses....I think someone said 7%..I don't remember when or in what thread, though. There's simply no way to properly insure the risk with such a small percentage you could recoup. Josh's hands are tied. He's correctly refusing to extend him without a more expansive method of insurance and Marshall is correctly refusing to accept an incentive laden offer since he knows there is at least one team out there and probably closer to 5 that would be willing to completely assume the risk. Denver is not in a horrible spot. If they don't get something relatively decent, they don't have to move him. They can just back this thing up another year and then slap him with the franchise tag to ensure someone can't take him for free. We don't have to do anything right now. Wait for the new CBA.

Requiem
04-11-2010, 08:16 PM
I think the second and a player would be worth it, especially if the second is the Rams.

I'd rather get that compensation, then have Brandon walk in FA and us only get a compensatory third round selection.

Who knows, maybe something will happen on draft day.

At any case, I'd prefer he stayed -- but if he has to be moved, I'd rather it be for something potentially better than a compensatory selection.