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ZONA
04-06-2010, 04:22 AM
Yep, it's that time of year again. The best golf tourny of the year, IMO.

Not many course changes but there are a few.


No. 15 green rebuilt

No. 2 green rebuilt and the front widened by 8 feet


Lots of story lines to come no doubt. Woods and his thing, Els playing very good again. Phil going for his 3rd jacket, Can Watson try and conjur up some more magic like he did last year at the British Open, and many more.

The 1st round pairings will be relased today, obviously not at 3AM in the morning as I write this, lol.

Can't wait to watch. Who ya pulling for?

I'm a Phil guy and I want him to win but I wouldn't be too hurt if David Duval played lights out and won, returning to the elite list of golfers.

Garcia Bronco
04-06-2010, 05:20 AM
Is this the official thread? I don't want to get involved in anything unofficial.

I'll be watching.

Dedhed
04-06-2010, 06:57 AM
Masters week is one of my favorite weeks of the year. Not only is it my favorite golf tourney to watch, but I use to mark the official end of the long New England winter.

The Masters this year has some intriguing story lines. There's, of course, Tiger, who I really hope misses the cut. Not because I'm a huge anti-Tiger guy, but because even if he isn't in contention on Sunday they'll show every shot and talk about him constantly, and it will detract from the actual tournament that's taking place.

There are people who think he'll win it, but I don't see that happening. He's going to feel more uncomfortable in his own skin this week than at any point in his life, and it's tough t o compete in a Masters with that feeling. I'll put it this way; it would be his most miraculous feat thus far in his career, and he won the U.S. Open on one leg.

Phil is another story line, but I don't think he's going to be in the hunt. He's still emotionally drained from his wife's battle with breast cancer, and his game just isn't in shape.

Els looks solid, and he would be a guy I could root for. He's struggled the last few years, but looks on point heading into the week.

Freddie Couples is always the emotional favorite to me. He loves Augusta and generally plays well there. He's been tearing up the Senior tour, which might give him a little added confidence going into his first Masters in the 50+ bracket.

My bet would be for a first time winner, and I think there will be a number of guys in contention who the general public doesn't really know about.

Camilo Villegas, Ian Poulter, and Oliver Wilson are a few sleeper picks.

SoDak Bronco
04-06-2010, 08:25 AM
Love Masters Week, not sure why ESPN doesn't start coverage until 3:00pm Central. They could start coverage at noon and everyone would be watching. I think you can still catch the pairings you want online, but that's not quite the same. I hope Tiger plays well, and is contention on Sunday it def makes for a much more exciting finish. I don't think he will play all that well, it is really tough to get the feel back even for the greatest player in the game. Should be fun to see what happens though.

Dukes
04-06-2010, 08:29 AM
I'll be rooting for Camilo Villegas (although I hate the way announcers pronounce his name) and Anthony Kim. Hopefully someone gets his first green jacket.

ColoradoBuff
04-06-2010, 08:40 AM
I'm going for Tiger, Ernie and Retief. Or anybody but Phil! :) I love this time of year!

Dukes
04-06-2010, 09:10 AM
I'm going for Tiger, Ernie and Retief. Or anybody but Phil! :) I love this time of year!

Anyone but that punk *** Sergio

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:13 AM
Lying on the couch on a sunny afternoon hungover from a blinder on Saturday night watching the final Sunday is one of my favorite days of the year.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:14 AM
I would love to see Sergio Garcia win it!

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:18 AM
The current world top 10.
http://i39.tinypic.com/2hgs6dy.png

Others to consider:

Defending champion Angel Cabrera was not a surprise winner last year, as he has some previous Augusta form. His form has been a bit ropey this year, but he missed the two cuts before Augusta last year. Former champions Mike Weir and Zach Johnson have both shown some form this season without winning.

The next 10 in the world ranking are:
Rory McIlroy - only one win as a pro, putting might be suspect
Camillo Villegas - only made one cut at Augusta, finishing 13th last year
Geoff Ogilvy - a winner in January and a former US Open champ, frequently features in majors only to run up an 8 somewhere. Bit of a dangerous habit at Augusta.
Hendrik Stenson - has the game but has not contended in a major
Retief Goosen - two time major winner, awesome putter and composure, in some form this year without quite winning, has had some high finishes at Augusta before.
Robert Allenby - Has played every Masters since 2000 without endangering the top 10
Sergio Garcia - Has two top 10s at Augusta but actually misses the cut much more often, has not featured in the last 5 years. No form this year either.
Kenny Perry - lost out in a play off last year, won in June but has had little form since.
Sean O'Hair - A man who hopefully will be Jim Furyk's foursomes partner in the Ryder Cup has little form this year, but had two top 15 finishes in his last 2 Masters.
Luke Donald - has been coming back into form this season without quite achieving a win. Has a 3rd and a couple of Top 10s at Augusta, as well as some poorer results.

azbroncfan
04-06-2010, 09:24 AM
I would love to see Sergio Garcia win it!

He doesn't putt well enough to win it.

Mr.Meanie
04-06-2010, 09:25 AM
I love April. The Masters, the Draft, the Final Four, NBA playoffs... 2nd best month of the year!

I hope Tiger owns the haters this week.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:26 AM
He doesn't putt well enough to win it.

I didn't say I thought he WOULD win it.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:27 AM
Historic Moments

In 1935, Gene Sarazen was trailing badly on the back 9 on the last day, until he holed a 3 wood for an albatross 2 on the par 5 15th and then went on to win in a play-off. The story brought the tournament to prominence in the golfing world and it joined the Open Championship (started 1860) the US Open (1904) and the USPGA (1912 approx) as one of the Majors.

In 1939, the tournament was first called "The Masters", having previously been the Augusta Invitiational.

In 1961, Gary Player becomes the first non-US player to win the title. He almost defended his title the following year, losing in a play off. In 1978, he made 7 birdies in the last 10 holes for a 64 and a third title. Gary http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/adore.gif

In 1966, Jack Nicklaus succesfully defended his title, winning for the third time, and helped himself into the green jacket - the first time that happened, and the only time until Nick Faldo in 1990.

In 1968, Roberto de Vicenzo signed his scorecard with a 4 on 17, when in fact he made a birdie 3. The wrong score is used, and he misses out on a play-off by that one shot. "I am a stupid" he tells the press. Yes, Roberto, that would sum it up. He won the Open later that year.

In 1979, Fuzzy Zoeller becomes the first player to win on his debut (apart from in the original tournament), triumphing after a play-off.

In 1980, Seve Ballesteros http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/adore.gif won the title. He was the first European to do so, and the youngest ever at the time. His win led to a period of European domination, with Ballesteros (83) Faldo (89, 90, 96) Langer (85, 93) Lyle (87) Woosnam (91) and Olazabal (94 and 99).

Sandy Lyle's win in 87 was the first by a Brit and featured a spectacular birdie on 18, after putting his tee shot in a bunker. He hit a brilliant 7 iron to about 8 feet and holed it for the win.

In 1986, Jack Nicklaus won his record 6th title at the age of 46 (also making him the oldest winner, 23 years after his first win, another record) with a last round 65, and an eagle and 4 birdies on the back 9. Ballesteros and Greg Norman both blew chances to beat him, with Norman bogeying 18 from the middle of the fairway, and Seve dumping it in the water on 15 when in a 2 shot lead. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jle1G5l-qsU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqisX1ESLT8&feature=relat ed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqisX1ESLT8&feature=related) Jack http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/adore.gif

In 1987, local boy Larry Mize chipped in from a no-hope position wide of the 11th green to beat Greg Norman in a sudden death play-off.

In 1996, Nick Faldo comes from 6 shots back with one round to go, to beat Greg Norman by 5. Faldo played a near perfect round, never leaving himself a downhill putt, but Norman endured an agonising collapse of nerve.

In 1997, Tiger Woods won his first major, winning the Masters with a record low total (270, 18 under par), by a record margin, and taking Seve's record as the youngest winner. All after being 4 over par after the first 9 holes. Start here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKFErwmgF4A&feature=relat ed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKFErwmgF4A&feature=related) (not great quality)

In 2000, Tiger won for the third time, to complete four consecutive majors, the "Tiger Slam" which had never been achieved before

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:30 AM
The par 3 12th.
http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp343/laert3s/12th.jpg

The second shot into the par 5 13th showing the slope on the fairway. It is usually a long iron or a wood to hit the green, and the slope makes a perfect contact difficult. Rae's Creek in front of the green catches a lot of greedy golfers.
http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp343/laert3s/13thfairway.jpg

The green on 13 with the creek in front.
http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp343/laert3s/13th.jpg

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:31 AM
Betting Odds from another website that compares odds.

Woods, T 4
Mickelson, P 12
Els, E 12
Harrington, P 18
Westwood, L 22
Goosen, R 20
Stricker, S 25
Casey, P 28
Furyk, J 33
Kim, A 40
Poulter, I 33
Villegas, C 40
Ogilvy, G 40
Kaymer, M 40
Mcilroy, R 40
Schwartzel, C 40
Johnson, Dustin 50
Mahan, H 60
O'Hair, S 60
Watney, N 50
Stenson, H 50
Cabrera, A 50
Choi, KJ 66
Garcia, S 60
Allenby, R 66
Fisher, R 66
Johnson, Z 66
Kuchar, M 66
Singh, V 66
Campbell, Chad 75
Cink, S 75
Weir, M 75
Scott, A 75
Clark, T 90
Couples, F 90
Donald, L 90
Karlsson, R 90
McDowell, G 90
Perry, K 90
Quiros, Alvaro 90
Glover, L 90
Moore, R 125
Oosthuizen, L 125
Molinari, F 150
Yang, Yong-Eun 150
Na, K 150
Leonard, J 125
Curtis, B 150
Hansen, S 150
Jimenez, MA 150
Molinari, E 150
Wilson, O 150
Haas, B 200
Immelman, T 150
Sabbatini, R 150
Gay, B 150
Marino, S 200
Toms, D 150
Senden, J 200
Kelly, Jerry 200
Crane, B 200
Flesch, S 200
Jaidee, T 200
Kjeldsen, S 200
Slocum, H 200
Wood, C 200
Ishikawa, R 200
Katayama, S 200
Verplank, S 200
Merrick, J 200
Hansen, A 200
Rollins, J 200
Duval, D 200
Dyson, S 200
Leishman, M 250
Palmer, R 250
Green, N 300
Barnes, R 250
Dufner, J 300
Langer, B 300
Ikeda, Y 300
Manassero, M 300
Hamilton, T 500
Watson, T 500
O'Meara, M 500
An, BH 1000
Martin, B 1000
Smith, N 1500
Benjamin, B 1000
Han, C 1500
Lyle, S 1500
Campbell, M 1000
Woosnam, I 1500
Crenshaw, B 2000
Mize, L 2000
Stadler, C 2500
Floyd, R 2500

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 09:31 AM
Interviews that will be shown live on www.masters.com (http://www.masters.com/) today include:

8am MST Padraig Harrington
9am Stewart Cink
10am Angel Cabrera
12pm David Duval
1230 Phil Mickelson
130 Steve Stricker
2pm Geoff Ogilvy
3pm Jack Nicklaus http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/adore.gif http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/adore.gif http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/adore.gif

Pony Boy
04-06-2010, 10:03 AM
As well as Freddie is playing, I wouldn't rule him out..... he won his first three starts on the seniors tour and he's putting lights out.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 11:28 AM
http://www.espn.co.uk/golf/sport/story/16128.html

Tiger Woods will have KJ Choi and Matt Kuchar standing by his side when he makes his official return to the PGA Tour at the Masters on Thursday.

Kaymer/Ogilvy/Donald http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif
Cambell/Molinari/Casey http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif
Els/Kim/Ishikawa http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif
Villegas/Perry/McIlroy http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif
Schwartzel/Padraig/Cink http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif

azbroncfan
04-06-2010, 11:47 AM
As well as Freddie is playing, I wouldn't rule him out..... he won his first three starts on the seniors tour and he's putting lights out.

I agree, he is playing much better than two years ago when he was in final group and his putting left him when the pressure was on. He is striking it as well as anyone and his ball striking is as good as anyone on tour. Now if his putting is there I expect a good showing for Couples.

Garcia Bronco
04-06-2010, 11:59 AM
I agree, he is playing much better than two years ago when he was in final group and his putting left him when the pressure was on. He is striking it as well as anyone and his ball striking is as good as anyone on tour. Now if his putting is there I expect a good showing for Couples.

He had a bad back whne he made his run several years back. I'll root for him if he gets on going. Personally I don't care who wins, I just enjoy the whole thing.

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 12:39 PM
Gotta root for the Irishman!

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 12:40 PM
Also Im becoming a big Lucas Glover fan, hope he does well and wins the green jacket!

Garcia Bronco
04-06-2010, 12:40 PM
Gotta root for the Irishman!

Padrig?

That would be awesome as well.

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 12:41 PM
Padrig?

That would be awesome as well.

oh yeah, Padraig Harrington is my guy...usually unravels though on sunday.

Garcia Bronco
04-06-2010, 12:48 PM
oh yeah, Padraig Harrington is my guy...usually unravels though on sunday.

I got 3 Majors that says he can do it. Fast greens though.

JJJ
04-06-2010, 12:51 PM
Golf's holy week is here and Good Thursday is just two days away. I can't wait.

Anyone but Sergio is ok by me. But I do think a Euro is going to step up to the plate this week.

Graeme McDowell is a guy that will eventually win a major. Not really an Irishman as he is from that English bit up north.

Bronco CB40
04-06-2010, 12:54 PM
I like the Masters and will tune in, but the U.S. Open is the best golf tournament of the year.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 12:57 PM
I like the Masters and will tune in, but the U.S. Open is the best golf tournament of the year.

:spit:

Does your trolling ever cease?

Bronco CB40
04-06-2010, 01:02 PM
:spit:

Does your trolling ever cease?

Trolling? Because I disagreed with the original poster that the Masters wasn't the best tournament in golf? I think the Masters is the second best, hardly an insulting or outlandish statement.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 01:06 PM
Trolling? Because I disagreed with the original poster that the Masters wasn't the best tournament in golf? I think the Masters is the second best, hardly an insulting or outlandish statement.

It just goes with your previous posting history, PM history and rep history.

No one in their right mind thinks the US Open is better than the Masters.

Masters
British Open
US Open












USPGA

Bronco CB40
04-06-2010, 01:09 PM
It just goes with your previous posting history, PM history and rep history.

No one in their right mind thinks the US Open is better than the Masters.

Masters
British Open
US Open












USPGA

It's just personal preference. Jack Nicklaus said the U.S. Open was his favorite major, too. Mainly, I never liked how The Masters has limited their Thursday and Friday TV coverage, while the U.S. Open has televised all 18 rounds.

Bronco CB40
04-06-2010, 01:27 PM
Amen Corner is probably the closest thing to Heaven on earth

http://balleronamission.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/amen_corner.jpg

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 01:44 PM
I got 3 Majors that says he can do it. Fast greens though.

True, but last year he was full of unraveling once the weekend hits. Not his fault, he's irish so I'm sure hes up late saturday night getting ****-faced which would put a damper on a sunday tee-time.

JJJ
04-06-2010, 01:59 PM
Amen Corner is probably the closest thing to Heaven on earth

http://balleronamission.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/amen_corner.jpg

Only thing is they need to get rid of the astroturf on the bridges. They should be able to grow some real grass on there.

Baba Booey
04-06-2010, 02:05 PM
Hoping for a great tournament.

Bronco CB40
04-06-2010, 02:21 PM
Only thing is they need to get rid of the astroturf on the bridges. They should be able to grow some real grass on there.

That is an old photograph. From I recall last year, it did have real grass on the bridge.

DeuceOfClub
04-06-2010, 02:29 PM
Golf on TV....

The only thing that can make baseball look somewhat interesting.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 02:30 PM
Golf on TV....

The only thing that can make baseball look somewhat interesting.

Then why did you enter the thread?

And NOTHING makes baseball on tv interesting.

JJJ
04-06-2010, 02:58 PM
Golf on TV....

The only thing that can make baseball look somewhat interesting.

Somehow I suspect you are a soccer fan.

Dukes
04-06-2010, 03:02 PM
Somehow I suspect you are a soccer fan.

This

DeuceOfClub
04-06-2010, 03:12 PM
Somehow I suspect you are a soccer fan.

Well, I am a Soccer fan, but I hate to side-track the thread, so please, carry on. I'm done.

orangenblue2
04-06-2010, 03:35 PM
Lefty...all the way!

gunns
04-06-2010, 04:06 PM
I hope Tiger does well, don't think he will though, although he will improve over time. I was a huge Nicklaus fan back in the day, used to love when him and Arnold or Player went into sudden death. I root for Phil nowadays but don't really care who wins (as long as it's not Singh). I just enjoy Sunday afternoon because it's generally a good one.

Dagmar
04-06-2010, 05:17 PM
Fred Couples is worth the golden oldie bet this year I think.

Probably one of the Top 10 Masters' players of all time

He had health problems the last two times he played resulting in his consecutive CUT making streak been ended.

He is always worth a small wager

He lost by one shot to Tom Watson in his first Champions Tour start - and then won the next three. I think it's safe to safe that Boom Boom is in good form

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 06:59 PM
Well, I am a Soccer fan, but I hate to side-track the thread, so please, carry on. I'm done.

Having two working legs qualifies anyone to be a soccer goaltender

Garcia Bronco
04-06-2010, 07:10 PM
Having two working legs qualifies anyone to be a soccer goaltender

Bull****. They'll need at least one arm.

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 07:23 PM
Bull****. They'll need at least one arm.

Ah true, just to drop the ball as they punt it.

ZONA
04-06-2010, 07:34 PM
Check it out, you can play Augusta National on the PC. There is a pretty good golf game called Custom Play Golf and you can download custom user made courses. One of them happens to be Augusta.

<object width="660" height="405"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/qmUb5V-Omjc&hl=en_US&fs=1&color1=0x3a3a3a&color2=0x999999&border=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/qmUb5V-Omjc&hl=en_US&fs=1&color1=0x3a3a3a&color2=0x999999&border=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="660" height="405"></embed></object>


<object width="660" height="405"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8q9b7Gii2xI&hl=en_US&fs=1&color1=0x3a3a3a&color2=0x999999&border=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8q9b7Gii2xI&hl=en_US&fs=1&color1=0x3a3a3a&color2=0x999999&border=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="660" height="405"></embed></object>

Cito Pelon
04-06-2010, 08:33 PM
I don't like to derail this thread, but I have to point out that Tiger is juicing. It hasn't been proven yet, but there is no doubt in my mind Tiger is juicing. Nobody goes from a pudgy kid to being as muscular as an NFL linebacker in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow. Nobody goes from being hairless on his face to growing a DeNiro in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow.

What I see from Tiger is the same thing I saw from Jose Canseco back in the 1980's, where he was proclaimed as the greatest MLB player of all time, the first 30-30 MLB player, the first 40-40 player, the first 50-50 player. Tiger is Jose Canseco all over again.

I've seen Tiger show power that no normal player could ever make, that raises a red flag. Not the skill, Tiger has always had the skill, it's the physical power that raises a red flag. There's something abnormal about his physical skills that raises a red flag to me.

I watched Tiger wrap a 3-iron around a tree last year, then go on to play like it was no big deal. The iron was bent to a 45-degree angle. Is there any golfer on this board that could do that without being hurt? No. Tiger is juicing somehow, and as one of the wealthiest men on the planet, he can pay for it.

FADERPROOF
04-06-2010, 08:41 PM
I don't like to derail this thread, but I have to point out that Tiger is juicing. It hasn't been proven yet, but there is no doubt in my mind Tiger is juicing. Nobody goes from a pudgy kid to being as muscular as an NFL linebacker in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow. Nobody goes from being hairless on his face to growing a DeNiro in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow.

What I see from Tiger is the same thing I saw from Jose Canseco back in the 1980's, where he was proclaimed as the greatest MLB player of all time, the first 30-30 MLB player, the first 40-40 player, the first 50-50 player. Tiger is Jose Canseco all over again.

I've seen Tiger show power that no normal player could ever make, that raises a red flag. Not the skill, Tiger has always had the skill, it's the physical power that raises a red flag. There's something abnormal about his physical skills that raises a red flag to me.

I watched Tiger wrap a 3-iron around a tree last year, then go on to play like it was no big deal. The iron was bent to a 45-degree angle. Is there any golfer on this board that could do that without being hurt? No. Tiger is juicing somehow, and as one of the wealthiest men on the planet, he can pay for it.

There has been speculation that he was taking HGH ever since he was linked to that Canadian Doctor(name escapes me) that is under investigation with bringing HGH and other PED's across the border, he was A-Rod's supplier as well.

Tiger says that it was for platelet-plasma surgery for his torn knee, which can spped up recovering by repairing tissues quicker, but their are plenty of questions pertaining as to why he had a doctor fly from Canada to Florida for this surgery.

JJJ
04-06-2010, 09:55 PM
I don't like to derail this thread, but I have to point out that Tiger is juicing. It hasn't been proven yet, but there is no doubt in my mind Tiger is juicing. Nobody goes from a pudgy kid to being as muscular as an NFL linebacker in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow. Nobody goes from being hairless on his face to growing a DeNiro in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow.

What I see from Tiger is the same thing I saw from Jose Canseco back in the 1980's, where he was proclaimed as the greatest MLB player of all time, the first 30-30 MLB player, the first 40-40 player, the first 50-50 player. Tiger is Jose Canseco all over again.

I've seen Tiger show power that no normal player could ever make, that raises a red flag. Not the skill, Tiger has always had the skill, it's the physical power that raises a red flag. There's something abnormal about his physical skills that raises a red flag to me.

I watched Tiger wrap a 3-iron around a tree last year, then go on to play like it was no big deal. The iron was bent to a 45-degree angle. Is there any golfer on this board that could do that without being hurt? No. Tiger is juicing somehow, and as one of the wealthiest men on the planet, he can pay for it.

Are you going so far as to imply that Tiger would actually cheat? :wiggle:

I think he actually holds golf in higher regards than his marriage but it is clear the guy thought he could get away with anything so you could well be right.

baja
04-06-2010, 10:10 PM
Masters week is one of my favorite weeks of the year. Not only is it my favorite golf tourney to watch, but I use to mark the official end of the long New England winter.

The Masters this year has some intriguing story lines. There's, of course, Tiger, who I really hope misses the cut. Not because I'm a huge anti-Tiger guy, but because even if he isn't in contention on Sunday they'll show every shot and talk about him constantly, and it will detract from the actual tournament that's taking place.

There are people who think he'll win it, but I don't see that happening. He's going to feel more uncomfortable in his own skin this week than at any point in his life, and it's tough t o compete in a Masters with that feeling. I'll put it this way; it would be his most miraculous feat thus far in his career, and he won the U.S. Open on one leg.

Phil is another story line, but I don't think he's going to be in the hunt. He's still emotionally drained from his wife's battle with breast cancer, and his game just isn't in shape.

Els looks solid, and he would be a guy I could root for. He's struggled the last few years, but looks on point heading into the week.

Freddie Couples is always the emotional favorite to me. He loves Augusta and generally plays well there. He's been tearing up the Senior tour, which might give him a little added confidence going into his first Masters in the 50+ bracket.

My bet would be for a first time winner, and I think there will be a number of guys in contention who the general public doesn't really know about.

Camilo Villegas, Ian Poulter, and Oliver Wilson are a few sleeper picks.

I think Tiger's troubles will have to opposite effect, it will cause him to focus like never before. Look for him to play in the zone and win going away.

ZONA
04-07-2010, 01:32 AM
Anybody who thinks Tiger Woods looks like an NFL linebacker must be a skinny rail. Tiger's not that big really. He just looks big next to all the out of shape golfers. Put him next to a real athelete (like an NFL Linebacker) and he looks very small. Don't get me wrong, he's fit, he's got some muscle, but he doesn't look like a beast or anything.

I mean, does this look like a bowflex body? Hahahahaha.

http://www.insidesocal.com/tomhoffarth/TigerWoods_450x400.jpg



Tiger easily could have added this amount of muscle without roids. Very easy. Now, if he looked like this, I could see the argument.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sfQzIpvw2LM/SxOrm7OfcTI/AAAAAAAACAw/KmeFCgr8ORA/s1600/Tiger-Woods--419.jpg

azbroncfan
04-07-2010, 07:17 AM
I don't like to derail this thread, but I have to point out that Tiger is juicing. It hasn't been proven yet, but there is no doubt in my mind Tiger is juicing. Nobody goes from a pudgy kid to being as muscular as an NFL linebacker in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow. Nobody goes from being hairless on his face to growing a DeNiro in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow.

What I see from Tiger is the same thing I saw from Jose Canseco back in the 1980's, where he was proclaimed as the greatest MLB player of all time, the first 30-30 MLB player, the first 40-40 player, the first 50-50 player. Tiger is Jose Canseco all over again.

I've seen Tiger show power that no normal player could ever make, that raises a red flag. Not the skill, Tiger has always had the skill, it's the physical power that raises a red flag. There's something abnormal about his physical skills that raises a red flag to me.

I watched Tiger wrap a 3-iron around a tree last year, then go on to play like it was no big deal. The iron was bent to a 45-degree angle. Is there any golfer on this board that could do that without being hurt? No. Tiger is juicing somehow, and as one of the wealthiest men on the planet, he can pay for it.

Tiger is juicing because he wrapped a 3 iron around a tree? I am not saying he didn't use some sort of supplement enhancement but your arguement for it is a little funny. Do you play golf? It is so easy to bend shafts plus Tiger hit the ball just as far when he was a young bean pole. Bench press and gym strength means nothing for how far you can hit the ball.

Dukes
04-07-2010, 07:55 AM
I think Tiger's troubles will have to opposite effect, it will cause him to focus like never before. Look for him to play in the zone and win going away.

He missed the cut after his father died. Just saying.

bowtown
04-07-2010, 07:55 AM
LOL at Tiger using HGH. The only reason for him to possibly have taken enhancements would have been to speed up his knee surgery recovery. Putting on lots of bulk as a golfer doesn't really do you any good, in fact it can totally eff up your swing.

ColoradoBuff
04-07-2010, 08:29 AM
[QUOTE=Dagmar;2796654]It just goes with your previous posting history, PM history and rep history.

No one in their right mind thinks the US Open is better than the Masters.

Masters
British Open
US Open


+1! Masters, British Open and then the US Open!

ColoradoBuff
04-07-2010, 08:33 AM
How about Colorado's own David Duval? I loved seeing him get back in the mix of things last year at the US Open. Make us proud DD!

baja
04-07-2010, 08:57 AM
He missed the cut after his father died. Just saying.

Ya but this is very different he has something to prove.

Garcia Bronco
04-07-2010, 09:08 AM
Anyone who is successful in sports must be juicing. LMAO. This isn't baseball. And in Baseball, they have been taking PEDs since the 50's. Good grief.

Dukes
04-07-2010, 09:23 AM
Ya but this is very different he has something to prove.

Yes, but both were tramatic events in his life.

bowtown
04-07-2010, 09:25 AM
Yes, but both were tramatic events in his life.

So was his knee surgery. How'd that turn out? I'd liken this much more to that, than a sudden event like the death of his father.

Mr.Meanie
04-07-2010, 09:26 AM
I don't like to derail this thread, but I have to point out that Tiger is juicing. It hasn't been proven yet, but there is no doubt in my mind Tiger is juicing. Nobody goes from a pudgy kid to being as muscular as an NFL linebacker in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow. Nobody goes from being hairless on his face to growing a DeNiro in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow.

What I see from Tiger is the same thing I saw from Jose Canseco back in the 1980's, where he was proclaimed as the greatest MLB player of all time, the first 30-30 MLB player, the first 40-40 player, the first 50-50 player. Tiger is Jose Canseco all over again.

I've seen Tiger show power that no normal player could ever make, that raises a red flag. Not the skill, Tiger has always had the skill, it's the physical power that raises a red flag. There's something abnormal about his physical skills that raises a red flag to me.

I watched Tiger wrap a 3-iron around a tree last year, then go on to play like it was no big deal. The iron was bent to a 45-degree angle. Is there any golfer on this board that could do that without being hurt? No. Tiger is juicing somehow, and as one of the wealthiest men on the planet, he can pay for it.

If PEDs had any impact whatsoever on golf, golfers would all look like football players. Tiger looks like a freak of nature only because they show him walking next to tubs like Angel Cabrerra and flabby Phil.

Drunk Monkey
04-07-2010, 09:42 AM
I love this weekend. I might have to go play http://www.tour18-dallas.com/golf/proto/tour18-dallas/index.htm That's as close to Agusta as I will ever get. Fun course.

Irish Stout
04-07-2010, 09:56 AM
Fred Couples is worth the golden oldie bet this year I think.

Probably one of the Top 10 Masters' players of all time

He had health problems the last two times he played resulting in his consecutive CUT making streak been ended.

He is always worth a small wager

He lost by one shot to Tom Watson in his first Champions Tour start - and then won the next three. I think it's safe to safe that Boom Boom is in good form

Freddy's game has been on fire the past few weeks. Not that that is an indicator for the Masters, but I would love to see him in the running on Sunday!

baja
04-07-2010, 10:00 AM
Yes, but both were tramatic events in his life.

I just think this sex scandal is going to motivate him like no other event he has experienced..

Dedhed
04-07-2010, 10:02 AM
Ya but this is very different he has something to prove.

What he has to prove is totally unrelated to golf.

baja
04-07-2010, 10:05 AM
What he has to prove is totally unrelated to golf.

My bet is he doesn't see it that way we all want to be excepted and loved. That is what will motivate him, his fans.

We will see how he plays.

azbroncfan
04-07-2010, 10:08 AM
How about Colorado's own David Duval? I loved seeing him get back in the mix of things last year at the US Open. Make us proud DD!

Is Duval from Colorado or just a transplant from florida that lives there now? I would like to see him do it though.

bronco militia
04-07-2010, 10:27 AM
http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx307/DougS1957/Tiger1.jpg

http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx307/DougS1957/Tiger3.jpg

http://i766.photobucket.com/albums/xx307/DougS1957/Tiger6.jpg

jonny1
04-07-2010, 11:00 AM
Tiger did not go from a "pudgy kid" to an "NFL linebacker body" in one year.

He was skinny in college, he was skinny his first year on tour. Teammates at Stanford said he was a gym rat, loved working out. So you have a 19 year old, who spends his days practicing and working out for 11 years, don't you think any normal person would fill out?

Plus, Tiger has been at the forefront of asking for drug testing on the tour, which is not the actions of someone who is juicing.

Ridiculous.

Dagmar
04-07-2010, 11:22 AM
I don't like to derail this thread, but I have to point out that Tiger is juicing. It hasn't been proven yet, but there is no doubt in my mind Tiger is juicing. Nobody goes from a pudgy kid to being as muscular as an NFL linebacker in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow. Nobody goes from being hairless on his face to growing a DeNiro in one year like Tiger did without juicing somehow.

What I see from Tiger is the same thing I saw from Jose Canseco back in the 1980's, where he was proclaimed as the greatest MLB player of all time, the first 30-30 MLB player, the first 40-40 player, the first 50-50 player. Tiger is Jose Canseco all over again.

I've seen Tiger show power that no normal player could ever make, that raises a red flag. Not the skill, Tiger has always had the skill, it's the physical power that raises a red flag. There's something abnormal about his physical skills that raises a red flag to me.

I watched Tiger wrap a 3-iron around a tree last year, then go on to play like it was no big deal. The iron was bent to a 45-degree angle. Is there any golfer on this board that could do that without being hurt? No. Tiger is juicing somehow, and as one of the wealthiest men on the planet, he can pay for it.

A, you did derail the thread, B, the argument is retarded but enough people above me have pointed out that.

Cito Pelon
04-07-2010, 06:09 PM
A, you did derail the thread, B, the argument is retarded but enough people above me have pointed out that.

Well, I had a good rant prepared as a retort - I have an agenda, dude. But, I'll back off and let it play itself out instead of going on a crusade. It was wrong for me to ruin everybody else's fun.

This is always a good tourney, all the Majors are.

Dedhed
04-07-2010, 06:26 PM
How about Colorado's own David Duval? I loved seeing him get back in the mix of things last year at the US Open. Make us proud DD!Duval is a world class douche. He's serving karmic justice right now for his doucheness.

Dedhed
04-07-2010, 06:30 PM
My bet is he doesn't see it that way we all want to be excepted and loved. That is what will motivate him, his fans.

We will see how he plays.
I'll bet you sigs for a week that he's closer, by strokes, to missing the cut than he is to the winning score.

Dedhed
04-07-2010, 06:43 PM
It just goes with your previous posting history, PM history and rep history.

No one in their right mind thinks the US Open is better than the Masters.

Masters
British Open
US Open


+1! Masters, British Open and then the US Open!

The Masters is considered the best major by just about every serious golf fan out there.
Masters is designed for fireworks and low scores on Sunday. The masters always has the best finishes because anyone within 8 strokes on Sunday can make a run because they set the course up for birdies.

The USGA runs a terrible tournament where they've developed this obsession with "protecting par" so they set up courses that are nearly impossible to play. You hardly ever see a come from behind victory on the final day, and there's only 3-4 guys who stand a chance on Sunday. There are no birdies to be had, so if you've got a 3 stroke lead on Sunday, you only have to play ultra conservative and not make bogeys.

If you're making pars at the Masters, the field is going to pass you on Sunday every time. That's golf that is fun to watch.

Jack liked the US Open so much because the course setup always favors the longest hitters, thereby eliminating a good chunk of the field. Of course Jack smiles on a tourney that tilted the odds in his favor every year.

The US Open is a distant 3rd when it comes to golf Majors. The Masters reigns, and The Open is solidly second.

baja
04-07-2010, 07:54 PM
I'll bet you sigs for a week that he's closer, by strokes, to missing the cut than he is to the winning score.

OK I'll take that bet.

Dagmar
04-07-2010, 07:59 PM
I thought sigs were off?

bowtown
04-07-2010, 08:03 PM
Oh crap, Rusty wasn't supposed to find out about that...

BroncoBuff
04-07-2010, 08:06 PM
I'll bet you sigs for a week that he's closer, by strokes, to missing the cut than he is to the winning score.

Agree completely ... golf is such a repetitive motion sport, any absence from a routine will cause your game to suffer. By all accounts Tiger hasn't been swinging the clubs, so I'm not expecting much.

Dagmar
04-07-2010, 08:16 PM
Oh crap, Rusty wasn't supposed to find out about that...

I have sigs enabled yet only see SoCal's obnoxious sparkling one.

I'm confused.

bowtown
04-07-2010, 08:22 PM
I have sigs enabled yet only see SoCal's obnoxious sparkling one.

I'm confused.

I actually have no idea. I always have them disabled.

Dedhed
04-07-2010, 08:34 PM
OK I'll take that bet.

Alright. You're on. So for clarity, if the cut is even par and Tiger's at -2 after 36 holes he has to finish within 2 strokes of the lead.

Tiger misses the cut, I win. I'll give you .5 strokes so that if it's a tie, you win.

Archer81
04-07-2010, 08:36 PM
I have sigs enabled yet only see SoCal's obnoxious sparkling one.

I'm confused.


Mods get Sigs.

Like a perk...I guess.

:Broncos:

Dagmar
04-07-2010, 08:41 PM
So how can these guys do a sig bet?

Dedhed
04-07-2010, 08:43 PM
So how can these guys do a sig bet?

It is starting to lose luster. Just a gentlemen's bet anyway. I was going to bet him a billion dollars.

BroncoBuff
04-07-2010, 09:08 PM
Mods have sigs.

Mortals do not.

baja
04-07-2010, 10:39 PM
It is starting to lose luster. Just a gentlemen's bet anyway. I was going to bet him a billion dollars.

How about avatars than and the sub title under them?

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 11:01 AM
Leaderboard as of 10:45 am MST today.

----------------------------------------------------
http://img1.imagehousing.com/100408/028a4172fc4cefe5c03912d5c661dbbd.jpg

-------------------------------------------------------
As of 11:30am

http://img1.imagehousing.com/100408/4cf3328eff86c78eb404ead4d5d5f7aa.jpg

Rohirrim
04-08-2010, 12:04 PM
I want Tom Watson to win.

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 12:13 PM
Tom would be sweet

ludo21
04-08-2010, 12:20 PM
Love the Masters, why they dont show it all day I have no idea.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 12:21 PM
I want Tom Watson to win.

This would be fantastic, I was absolutely gutted for him at the Open, I can't remember who won (Perry?) but I felt bad for him too, no one wanted him to win!

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 12:21 PM
Tom Watson turns in a 67 on the first day and finishes at -5

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 12:22 PM
I want Tom Watson to win.Watson had a heck of a round today!

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http://img1.imagehousing.com/100408/e3a530b0f35fabd826ecc7c505835552.jpg

azbroncfan
04-08-2010, 12:27 PM
Love the Masters, why they dont show it all day I have no idea.

Yeah it is irritating that it is only major without full coverage just because of the kooks that run that place. On sunday you used to only be able to see normal coverage.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 12:29 PM
If you have an iphone the free Masters app allows you to watch live, it's fantastic!

bowtown
04-08-2010, 12:37 PM
If you have an iphone the free Masters app allows you to watch live, it's fantastic!

You can watch it online too on their website. Though I hate that they only show Amen Corner and the 15th and 16th holes. They have the Featured Group channel, but all they've shown is Westwood and Weir on it so far. Why in the world, if Tiger has teed off, is he not the Featured Group? I really hate Mike Weir.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 01:00 PM
You can watch it online too on their website. Though I hate that they only show Amen Corner and the 15th and 16th holes. They have the Featured Group channel, but all they've shown is Westwood and Weir on it so far. Why in the world, if Tiger has teed off, is he not the Featured Group? I really hate Mike Weir.I don't hate Weir but not showing Tiger's group is pretty stupid. Live TV coverage begins @ 2 MST on ESPN.

----------------------------------------------------------
http://img1.imagehousing.com/100408/83dd7878d6bed618f25505e3c37ec851.jpg

baja
04-08-2010, 01:02 PM
Love the Masters, why they dont show it all day I have no idea.

I was hoping it would be on Satellite but I can't find it anywhere.

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 01:02 PM
I was hoping it would be on Satellite but I can't find it anywhere.

Stream it. Masters.com

baja
04-08-2010, 01:05 PM
Thanks Garcia.

Calros Slim is a theif he collects for 2 megs of bandwidth and delivers .5

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 01:06 PM
Obligatory Scottish winner picture.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44554000/jpg/_44554834_sandy_lyle_masters203b.jpg

Westwood 67
Manassero, the 16 year old amateur, a 71 (-1)

Nice.

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 01:06 PM
It'll be on ESPN at 2 mountain as BS has posted.

ColoradoBuff
04-08-2010, 01:41 PM
Duval playing well....-1 thru 5

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 02:40 PM
Woods on the leaderboard with a storm on the way...

---------------------------------------------------

http://img1.imagehousing.com/100408/3f014aa5927bb68c6c2c6934c09ed6cf.jpg

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 03:16 PM
Luckily for Tiger him hitting a tree has benefited him this time.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 03:16 PM
*zing*!

Bronco CB40
04-08-2010, 03:47 PM
Tom Watson is simply amazing. It defies logic what he is doing. Old guys rule.

I am also pulling for Fred Couples.

ColoradoBuff
04-08-2010, 04:10 PM
Me too....nothing better than seeing Boom Boom in contention!

The Joker
04-08-2010, 04:12 PM
Shaping up very nicely so far, great to see the older guys like Watson, Couples and Lyle having such good rounds.

My bets are going well so far too. Backed Mickelson to win, and have each way bets on Poulter and... erm... Stenson.

Still, two out of three going well.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 05:24 PM
Great round for Couples today also. Tiger only 2 back after not playing for months.

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http://img1.imagehousing.com/100408/abbaf8277492a8e7e12b5502e8ea6357.jpg

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 05:45 PM
I've got a feeling this will be a fantastic weekend.

baja
04-08-2010, 05:47 PM
I'll bet you sigs for a week that he's closer, by strokes, to missing the cut than he is to the winning score.


Good day for me ;D

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 05:48 PM
I can't look at that leader board, but I thing Freddy is going be first after today.

baja
04-08-2010, 05:48 PM
I might need help selecting an avatar for Dedhed

baja
04-08-2010, 05:49 PM
I can't look at that leader board, but I thing Freddy is going be first after today.

All by himself.;D

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 05:50 PM
Look at a Tiger on number 9. He literally hooked it covering about 40 feet and put in on the green. Amzing. That's video game ****.

baja
04-08-2010, 05:53 PM
Look at a Tiger on number 9. He literally hooked it covering about 40 feet and put in on the green. Amzing. That's video game ****.

It was an unbelievable shot.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 06:06 PM
I might need help selecting an avatar for Dedhed

http://i41.tinypic.com/20kunpv.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/6sfjur.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2ec0uxf.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/2wfiskj.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/24dfy47.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/bfh0no.jpg

baja
04-08-2010, 06:13 PM
na none of those

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 06:20 PM
What are you looking for exactly?

ZONA
04-08-2010, 06:26 PM
Some very nice golf out there today. I have mixed feelings about Tigers game. He did hit some incredible shots and some of his putts were just so close, but he also had quite a few bad shanks and the gods of golf luck bailed him out with some lucky bounces, even a few off the trees and back into the rough near the fairways. He could have been -7 under or he could have easily been even par. Duval looked like crap on the back nine. His putting was disgustingly bad. And how about Watson and then Couples playing with no spikes or socks. What's next Freddy, barefoot? lol

baja
04-08-2010, 06:27 PM
something seriously gay with a self debasing phrase.

ZONA
04-08-2010, 06:28 PM
something seriously gay with a self debasing phrase.

Probably not quite as gay as Ian's pink shoes though, hahahaha.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 06:39 PM
something seriously gay with a self debasing phrase.

http://z.about.com/d/gaylife/1/0/8/_/edhardytigerbrief.jpg

ZONA
04-08-2010, 06:44 PM
http://z.about.com/d/gaylife/1/0/8/_/edhardytigerbrief.jpg

oh my god, I want a pair of those, hahahahaha.

baja
04-08-2010, 07:01 PM
http://z.about.com/d/gaylife/1/0/8/_/edhardytigerbrief.jpg


LOL that will work LOL

baja
04-08-2010, 07:04 PM
Now for the caption, I like..... "My Tiger Rules"

Dedhed
04-08-2010, 07:09 PM
Now for the caption, I like..... "My Tiger Rules"

Don't count your chickens.

baja
04-08-2010, 07:17 PM
Don't count your chickens.

like a good Boy Scout just getting prepared. ;D

Cito Pelon
04-08-2010, 07:33 PM
Masters week is one of my favorite weeks of the year. Not only is it my favorite golf tourney to watch, but I use to mark the official end of the long New England winter.

The Masters this year has some intriguing story lines. There's, of course, Tiger, who I really hope misses the cut. Not because I'm a huge anti-Tiger guy, but because even if he isn't in contention on Sunday they'll show every shot and talk about him constantly, and it will detract from the actual tournament that's taking place.

There are people who think he'll win it, but I don't see that happening. He's going to feel more uncomfortable in his own skin this week than at any point in his life, and it's tough t o compete in a Masters with that feeling. I'll put it this way; it would be his most miraculous feat thus far in his career, and he won the U.S. Open on one leg.

Phil is another story line, but I don't think he's going to be in the hunt. He's still emotionally drained from his wife's battle with breast cancer, and his game just isn't in shape.

Els looks solid, and he would be a guy I could root for. He's struggled the last few years, but looks on point heading into the week.

Freddie Couples is always the emotional favorite to me. He loves Augusta and generally plays well there. He's been tearing up the Senior tour, which might give him a little added confidence going into his first Masters in the 50+ bracket.

My bet would be for a first time winner, and I think there will be a number of guys in contention who the general public doesn't really know about.

Camilo Villegas, Ian Poulter, and Oliver Wilson are a few sleeper picks.

Been a problem for a long time. I realize Tiger has brought in a lot of younger golf fans, upped viewership, upped purses, but the constant focus on Tiger can be irritating. For god's sake, I'll see 5 minutes of TV coverage of Tiger on the driving range warming up, meanwhile there's golfers on the course making birdies, yet the TV coverage is all about Tiger, Tiger, Tiger. Show the players on the course, show the course itself, show anything except Tiger getting out of his Buick and walking into the clubhouse.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 07:44 PM
Now for the caption, I like..... "My Tiger Rules"

http://cheezburger.com/lolbuilder.aspx?preview=1&source=http%3A//images.cheezburger.com/imagestore/2010/4/8/fb13e803-8144-4ec0-b3fd-6471a6500b24.jpg&top=Be%20Careful&bottom=My%20Tiger%20Spits&middle=&font=Impact&color=White&size=30&bold=true&italic=false&underlined=false&style=outline&opacity=100&topalignment=left&middlealignment=center&bottomalignment=right

baja
04-08-2010, 07:48 PM
try this

I love me some Tiger

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 08:39 PM
Been a problem for a long time. I realize Tiger has brought in a lot of younger golf fans, upped viewership, upped purses, but the constant focus on Tiger can be irritating. For god's sake, I'll see 5 minutes of TV coverage of Tiger on the driving range warming up, meanwhile there's golfers on the course making birdies, yet the TV coverage is all about Tiger, Tiger, Tiger. Show the players on the course, show the course itself, show anything except Tiger getting out of his Buick and walking into the clubhouse.I don't know why since he is rarely out of the top 10 and winning more tourneys on a ratio like 10 to 1 over everybody else. He is by far, the best golfer ever to play the game to this point so all of the media attention is justified IMO.

And he's makes shots that no one else in the world can make (like today's hook shot that might have came back some 30 yards or so and hit the green).

Cito Pelon
04-08-2010, 09:00 PM
I don't know why since he is rarely out of the top 10 and winning more tourneys on a ratio like 10 to 1 over everybody else. He is by far, the best golfer ever to play the game to this point so all of the media attention is justified IMO.

And he's makes shots that no one else in the world can make (like today's hook shot that might have came back some 30 yards or so and hit the green).

I'd rather watch golfers on the course than Tiger walking from his courtesy car to the clubhouse. I'd rather watch golf than a five-minute segment on Tiger taking practice swings on the driving range.

Apparently, you think differently.

ZONA
04-08-2010, 09:08 PM
I don't know why since he is rarely out of the top 10 and winning more tourneys on a ratio like 10 to 1 over everybody else. He is by far, the best golfer ever to play the game to this point so all of the media attention is justified IMO.

And he's makes shots that no one else in the world can make (like today's hook shot that might have came back some 30 yards or so and hit the green).

By far the best golfer ever huh? You must be 25 or something and grew up with Tiger posters on your wall. What a ridiculous statement. If Tiger ever gets to 20 majors, then we can start talking about him in the same breath as Jack. Until then, keep staring at your Tiger posters and keep dreaming.

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 09:10 PM
try this

I love me some Tiger

http://cheezburger.com/lolbuilder.aspx?preview=1&source=http%3A//images.cheezburger.com/imagestore/2010/4/8/b0a85054-6916-4c51-932f-3001708f1d2f.jpg&top=I%20love%20me...&bottom=...some%20Tiger&middle=&font=Impact&color=White&size=25&bold=true&italic=false&underlined=false&style=outline&opacity=100&topalignment=left&middlealignment=center&bottomalignment=right

baja
04-08-2010, 09:17 PM
that's it good job

baja
04-08-2010, 09:23 PM
Dedhad should you lose our bet this will be your avatar with help from Dagmar;

http://cheezburger.com/lolbuilder.aspx?preview=1&source=http%3A//images.cheezburger.com/imagestore/2010/4/8/b0a85054-6916-4c51-932f-3001708f1d2f.jpg&top=I%20love%20me...&bottom=...some%20Tiger&middle=&font=Impact&color=White&size=25&bold=true&italic=false&underlined=false&style=outline&opacity=100&topalignment=left&middlealignment=center&bottomalignment=right

Bronco_Beerslug
04-08-2010, 09:25 PM
By far the best golfer ever huh? You must be 25 or something and grew up with Tiger posters on your wall. What a ridiculous statement.No, I'm 50 something and personally have watched them all since TV has been around, you? And apparently you didn't notice I stated "to this point" as why there is NO question Tiger is the best golfer ever to play the game.


If Tiger ever gets to 20 majors, then we can start talking about him in the same breath as Jack. Until then, keep staring at your Tiger posters and keep dreaming.
Geeezus, are you paying attention? Nicklaus's records came over a 25 year period and Tiger has been playing for 14 years.

Look at the stats to date. Tiger will pass Nicklaus in total wins shortly and the majors record is only a matter of time...

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<table id="sortable_table_id_0" class="sortable wikitable" style="text-align: center;"><tbody><tr><th>Rank http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Name http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Lifespan http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Country http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Wins http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Majors (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men%27s_major_golf_championships) http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Winning
span http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> <th>Span
(years) http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/sort_none.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_golfers_with_most_PGA_Tour_wins#)</th> </tr> <tr> <td>1</td> <td align="left">Sam Snead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Snead)</td> <td align="left">1912–2002</td> <td align="left"> United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States)</td> <td>82</td> <td>7</td> <td>1936–1965</td> <td>30</td> </tr> <tr> <td>2</td> <td align="left">Jack Nicklaus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Nicklaus)</td> <td align="left">1940–</td> <td align="left">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a4/Flag_of_the_United_States.svg/22px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States)</td> <td>73</td> <td>18</td> <td>1962–1986</td> <td>25</td> </tr> <tr> <td>3</td> <td align="left">Tiger Woods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_Woods)</td> <td align="left">1975–</td> <td align="left">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a4/Flag_of_the_United_States.svg/22px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States)</td> <td>71</td> <td>14</td> <td>1996–2009</td> <td>14</td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>1938–1959</td> <td>22</td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>1955–1973</td> <td>19</td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td align="left">
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>1935–1951</td> <td>17</td></tr></tbody></table>

Dagmar
04-08-2010, 09:30 PM
I'm sorry dedhed...

Dedhed
04-08-2010, 09:41 PM
No, I'm 50 something and personally have watched them all since TV has been around, you? And apparently you didn't notice I stated "to this point" as why there is NO question Tiger is the best golfer ever to play the game.


Geeezus, are you paying attention? Nicklaus's records came over a 25 year period and Tiger has been playing for 14 years.

Look at the stats to date. Tiger will pass Nicklaus in total wins shortly and the majors record is only a matter of time...

BTW, Tom Watson, at 60, is leading Tiger at the Masters and beat him at the British Open last year at age 59.

Says a little something about the level of competition Jack faced compared to Tiger that one of Jack's contemporaries is still beating Tiger at that age. Who would you compare Gary Player, Lee Trevino, Arnold Palmer, Seve Ballesteros, Greg Norman, and others to on today's tour?

Phil? couldn't hold Player's jock. Vijay? Compared to Arnie, give me a break. Jack competed against champions who built the game of golf and knew how to win because they were self made men.

Tiger competes against brats raised on silver spoons who pee down their leg when faced with any adversity or competition.

Tiger is great, but to say he's easily the best golfer ever fails to acknowledge the history of the game.

The Joker
04-08-2010, 10:11 PM
BTW, Tom Watson, at 60, is leading Tiger at the Masters and beat him at the British Open last year at age 59.

Says a little something about the level of competition Jack faced compared to Tiger that one of Jack's contemporaries is still beating Tiger at that age. Who would you compare Gary Player, Lee Trevino, Arnold Palmer, Seve Ballesteros, Greg Norman, and others to on today's tour?

Phil? couldn't hold Player's jock. Vijay? Compared to Arnie, give me a break. Jack competed against champions who built the game of golf and knew how to win because they were self made men.

Tiger competes against brats raised on silver spoons who pee down their leg when faced with any adversity or competition.

Tiger is great, but to say he's easily the best golfer ever fails to acknowledge the history of the game.

I'm not sure the Tom Watson point has any real merit whatsoever because the guys that Tiger is facing in his time haven't really had the chance to show what kind of golf they're capable of in their late 50's yet, for obvious reasons.

Also, I think you're really doing a disservice to the current crop of golfers with your comment that they "pee down their leg when faced with any adversity or competition". What type of men you perceive them to be really has no bearing on how they perform on the course, and to say that modern golfers tend to fall apart under pressure is just flat out wrong, IMO. (with the notable exception of Sergio Garcia, of course.)

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 10:48 PM
Tiger is amazing. Fred Couples is inspiring. Tom Watson is near perfect. Enjoy it.

Garcia Bronco
04-08-2010, 10:52 PM
Imagine if Woods, Watson, Couples, Phil, Poulter and Yang are in contention on Sunday.

baja
04-08-2010, 10:56 PM
Imagine if Woods, Watson, Couples, Phil, Poulter and Yang are in contention on Sunday.

Who would you pull for out of that group?

azbroncfan
04-08-2010, 11:35 PM
Who would you pull for out of that group?

Watson and Freddie in the Vans. He has been winning all year wearing those skater style shoes with no socks.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 06:12 AM
BTW, Tom Watson, at 60, is leading Tiger at the Masters and beat him at the British Open last year at age 59.This is great for Watson. I'm a fan of his and always have been. Come Sunday though, I doubt you will find him on the leaderboard.


Tiger competes against brats raised on silver spoons who pee down their leg when faced with any adversity or competition. Els, Mickelson, Singh, Goosen, etc... are all excellent players. They just pale in comparison to the greatest golfer ever, to this point. Stereotyping them all as "brats" is pretty stupid.

Tiger is great, but to say he's easily the best golfer ever fails to acknowledge the history of the game.You apparently didn't read what I wrote either. I'm very aware of the history of the game and there is no comparison at this point.

-----------------------------------------------------
Woods has won 71 official PGA Tour events including 14 majors. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_Woods) He is 141 when going into the final round of a major with at least a share of the lead. He has been heralded as "the greatest closer in history" by multiple golf experts. He owns the lowest career scoring average and the most career earnings of any player in PGA Tour history.

He has spent the most consecutive and cumulative weeks atop the world rankings. He is one of five players (along with Gene Sarazen, Ben Hogan, Gary Player, and Jack Nicklaus) to have won all four professional major championships in his career, known as the Career Grand Slam, and was the youngest to do so. Woods is the only player to have won all four professional major championships in a row, accomplishing the feat in the 2000-2001 seasons.


* PGA Tour wins (71)
* European Tour wins (38)
* Japan Golf Tour wins (2)
* Asian Tour wins (1)
* PGA Tour of Australasia wins (1)
* Other professional wins (15)
* Amateur wins (21)

2009

* PGA Tour Player of the Year (10)
* PGA Player of the Year (10)
* PGA Tour Money Leader (9)
* Vardon Trophy (8)
* Byron Nelson Award (9)
* Mark H. McCormack Award (12)
* FedEx Cup (2)
* Golf Writers Association of America Player of the Year (10)
* Associated Press Athlete of the Decade

rbackfactory80
04-09-2010, 06:30 AM
I don't know why since he is rarely out of the top 10 and winning more tourneys on a ratio like 10 to 1 over everybody else. He is by far, the best golfer ever to play the game to this point so all of the media attention is justified IMO.

And he's makes shots that no one else in the world can make (like today's hook shot that might have came back some 30 yards or so and hit the green).

Bold = opinion

Give me a break, no one in the world could hit that shot.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 07:01 AM
I'm not sure the Tom Watson point has any real merit whatsoever because the guys that Tiger is facing in his time haven't really had the chance to show what kind of golf they're capable of in their late 50's yet, for obvious reasons.???? How does that compute? The point is that Watson is still beating Tiger in a 60 year old body because he knows how to compete. What Tiger's contemporaries do in their 50s is irrelevant.

Also, I think you're really doing a disservice to the current crop of golfers with your comment that they "pee down their leg when faced with any adversity or competition". What type of men you perceive them to be really has no bearing on how they perform on the course, and to say that modern golfers tend to fall apart under pressure is just flat out wrong, IMO. (with the notable exception of Sergio Garcia, of course.)
I don't think you understand the landscape of golf today compared to when the legends were playing. They were paid nothing, frowned on by a large part of society, and built an existence based solely on their ability. There was no safety net.

No one handed out multi-million dollar endorsement deals to the Ty Tryons of the world. The vast majority of golfers on tour today make more money in endorsements than they do in prize money. They care less about winning.

Tie a dog to a tree in the woods for a few days, and then put him in a closed room another dog who's eaten every day and been sleeping on the sofa. Throw in a nice steak on the floor and see who comes up with it. Jack played against the neglected dogs of the golfing world. Tiger plays against the coddled pooches.

If you put Trevino, Watson, Palmer, Ballesteros, Player, Venturi, Miller, Weiskopf in their prime into today's fields, I'd dare say that Tiger has at least a few fewer majors and his eclipsing of Jack's 18 would not be anywhere near a foregone conclusion.

Jack finished second in 19 Majors, meaning that he was beaten by only one other player. Beaten by only a single other GREAT player.Tiger has a mere 5 runner ups, and will never approach 19.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 07:03 AM
I'm sorry dedhed...

Yeah, that's pretty cute. I need to work on something for Baja in case Tiger tanks, or Freddie runs away and wins by 10 strokes.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 07:21 AM
This is great for Watson. I'm a fan of his and always have been. Come Sunday though, I doubt you will find him on the leaderboard.Doesn't really matter if he is or not.

Els, Mickelson, Singh, Goosen, etc... are all excellent players. They just pale in comparison to the greatest golfer ever, to this point.
The point is that they pale in comparison to Jack's contemporaries as well.


You apparently didn't read what I wrote either. I'm very aware of the history of the game and there is no comparison at this point.You know stats. You don't know the history of the game. Huge difference.

He is one of five players (along with Gene Sarazen, Ben Hogan, Gary Player, and Jack Nicklaus) to have won all four professional major championships in his career, known as the Career Grand SlamYou'll note that Jack competed for major titles with two of those guys. Tiger, none.

The Joker
04-09-2010, 07:30 AM
???? How does that compute? The point is that Watson is still beating Tiger in a 60 year old body because he knows how to compete. What Tiger's contemporaries do in their 50s is irrelevant.

But what if the likes of Mickelson, Els or Singh lead a Masters after Round 1 when they're 60 years old?

Does this then mean that Tiger's rivals "know how to compete"?

Your point seems to assume that Tiger's rivals don't know how to compete based on the fact that Tom Watson is playing well at age 60, when you've no real idea what the likes of Mickelson and Els are going to be capable of at a similar point in their lives.

I don't think you understand the landscape of golf today compared to when the legends were playing. They were paid nothing, frowned on by a large part of society, and built an existence based solely on their ability. There was no safety net.

No one handed out multi-million dollar endorsement deals to the Ty Tryons of the world. The vast majority of golfers on tour today make more money in endorsements than they do in prize money. They care less about winning.

Tie a dog to a tree in the woods for a few days, and then put him in a closed room another dog who's eaten every day and been sleeping on the sofa. Throw in a nice steak on the floor and see who comes up with it. Jack played against the neglected dogs of the golfing world. Tiger plays against the coddled pooches.

This is all waffle, essentially.

At the end of the day it's still 18 holes of golf with a ball and some sticks with pieces of metal on the end to hit it with.

We've seen nobodies like Rich Beem and Y.E Yang go toe-to-toe with Tiger in majors and beat him. Others like Chris DiMarco and Rocco Mediate have given valiant final day efforts only to come up just shy. Countless majors over the past few years we've seen fantastic efforts under pressure by a number of different golfers.

You seem to assume that because these guys have money that they can't actually play golf under pressure, which doesn't make any sense.

If you put Trevino, Watson, Palmer, Ballesteros, Player, Venturi, Miller, Weiskopf in their prime into today's fields, I'd dare say that Tiger has at least a few fewer majors and his eclipsing of Jack's 18 would not be anywhere near a foregone conclusion.

Jack finished second in 19 Majors, meaning that he was beaten by only one other player. Beaten by only a single other GREAT player.Tiger has a mere 5 runner ups, and will never approach 19.

Yes but by the same token if you put the best golfers from today in Jack's generation then he'd have fewer wins I'm sure.

I certainly don't subscribe to the idea that Tiger sits alone as the undisputed greatest to ever play the game. At the same age Tiger is now, Nicklaus had 12 Majors to his name, just two shy of Tiger.

So they're pretty close in that regard.

My guess is that Tiger will pass him one day, and finish with a tally of majors in the low 20's. If you factor in how much he has dominated on the regular tour, then I think that eclipsing Nicklaus' record for majors would have to earn him the right to be called the best ever.

But 5 majors won't be easy to come by, so until he actually does it he can't be crowned the greatest ever, and certainly not "by far", even to this point in his career.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 07:56 AM
But what if the likes of Mickelson, Els or Singh lead a Masters after Round 1 when they're 60 years old?

Does this then mean that Tiger's rivals "know how to compete"?

Your point seems to assume that Tiger's rivals don't know how to compete based on the fact that Tom Watson is playing well at age 60, when you've no real idea what the likes of Mickelson and Els are going to be capable of at a similar point in their lives.My point doesn't assume anything. They aren't competing in their 30s and 40s. Player, Watson, Trevino, Palmer, and Ballesteros had 35 major wins between them. Mickelson, Els, Singh have 9. Pick those three and any other 2 of Tiger's contemporaries and they won't sniff 35.





You seem to assume that because these guys have money that they can't actually play golf under pressure, which doesn't make any sense. Sure it does. I find it hard to believe that a guy fighting for is life and a guy fighting for his 13th Mercedes have an equal stake and will compete equally hard.



Yes but by the same token if you put the best golfers from today in Jack's generation then he'd have fewer wins I'm sure. I think that's more debatable than what I posed.


My guess is that Tiger will pass him one day, and finish with a tally of majors in the low 20's. If you factor in how much he has dominated on the regular tour, then I think that eclipsing Nicklaus' record for majors would have to earn him the right to be called the best ever.

But 5 majors won't be easy to come by, so until he actually does it he can't be crowned the greatest ever, and certainly not "by far", even to this point in his career.I just don't subscribe to the idea that the # of wins automatically means he's deserving of the title.

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 08:13 AM
Who would you pull for out of that group?

Easy. Fred Couples.

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 08:30 AM
I agree with Beerslug. Tiger is the greatest today and probably the greatest ever. Just look at the win percentage.If you know nothing about Pro Golf...look at his approach shot on 9 from yesterday. No one but him can make that shot. People can try and get lucky, but it's notluck for him.

baja
04-09-2010, 08:35 AM
I can hook the ball

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 08:49 AM
Let's not fight about this "greatest" nonsense.

It's golf, lets be civilized!

What are we all expecting the cut to be? Could it possibly be under par??

Projected Cut - lowest 44 scores and ties, plus those within 10 strokes of leader

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 08:52 AM
look at his approach shot on 9 from yesterday. No one but him can make that shot. This speaks only to your ignorance of professional golf.

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 09:02 AM
Woods hits the trees again. He likes hitting trees! Makes par though.

ba-zing!

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 09:06 AM
This speaks only to your ignorance of professional golf.

All you do talk a bunch of ****. Probably the result of poor home training.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 09:06 AM
I can hook the ball
Ha!
So can I, of course, it usually goes nowhere near the green and sometimes I'm further away than when I hit it.

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 09:08 AM
I can hook the ball

Around a tree? And leave yourself a 7 footer on the Green in the wind, and make your putt, consistently?

mizzoutigers
04-09-2010, 09:08 AM
Tiger is definitely the greatest "player" ever

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 09:09 AM
Woods hits the trees again. He likes hitting trees! Makes par though.

ba-zing!Another thing he does better than anyone that's ever played the game is recover from errant shots, just amazing really!

baja
04-09-2010, 09:12 AM
Around a tree? And leave yourself a 7 footer on the Green in the wind, and make your putt, consistently?


Of course not

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 09:15 AM
???? How does that compute? The point is that Watson is still beating Tiger in a 60 year old body because he knows how to compete. What Tiger's contemporaries do in their 50s is irrelevant.


I don't think you understand the landscape of golf today compared to when the legends were playing. They were paid nothing, frowned on by a large part of society, and built an existence based solely on their ability. There was no safety net.

No one handed out multi-million dollar endorsement deals to the Ty Tryons of the world. The vast majority of golfers on tour today make more money in endorsements than they do in prize money. They care less about winning.

Tie a dog to a tree in the woods for a few days, and then put him in a closed room another dog who's eaten every day and been sleeping on the sofa. Throw in a nice steak on the floor and see who comes up with it. Jack played against the neglected dogs of the golfing world. Tiger plays against the coddled pooches.

If you put Trevino, Watson, Palmer, Ballesteros, Player, Venturi, Miller, Weiskopf in their prime into today's fields, I'd dare say that Tiger has at least a few fewer majors and his eclipsing of Jack's 18 would not be anywhere near a foregone conclusion.

Jack finished second in 19 Majors, meaning that he was beaten by only one other player. Beaten by only a single other GREAT player.Tiger has a mere 5 runner ups, and will never approach 19.

:notworthy The truth has been spoken. And as far as bending the ball 20 yards around a tree to put it on the green, some of you guys must be newbies to golf. Trevino could make that shot, left handed, right handed, and with his eyes closed. Ha!

Not only that, we haven't even begun the discussion about the changes in equipment.

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 09:16 AM
tiger is definitely the greatest "player" ever

lol

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 09:17 AM
:notworthy The truth has been spoken. And as far as bending the ball 20 yards around a tree to put it on the green, some of you guys must be newbies to gold. Trevino could make that shot, left handed, right handed, and with his eyes closed. Ha!

I must have missed Trevino on the leaderboard.

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 09:21 AM
I must have missed Trevino on the leaderboard.

Modern golfers have very little idea about how to "work" the ball. The old timers were unbelievable at it. Of course, with modern equipment it's more difficult. Modern clubs and balls are designed to hit straight shots. With a forged club and a balata ball, you could pull all kinds of stuff that players today can't even imagine.

Tiger, the greatest of all time? Hell, he hasn't even caught Nicklaus yet.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 09:23 AM
All you do talk a bunch of ****. Probably the result of poor home training.
Is this English?

Sir_Robin
04-09-2010, 09:27 AM
My point doesn't assume anything. They aren't competing in their 30s and 40s. Player, Watson, Trevino, Palmer, and Ballesteros had 35 major wins between them. Mickelson, Els, Singh have 9. Pick those three and any other 2 of Tiger's contemporaries and they won't sniff 35...I just don't subscribe to the idea that the # of wins automatically means he's deserving of the title.

So you use # of wins in one breath to indicate superior competition and in the next breath you say you don't subscribe to the idea? I'm confused.

Nevertheless it would seem, assuming your numbers are correct, that Jack was not that far set apart from his contemporaries given the high number of majors won by his opponents. So, by the numbers you have presented here, Jack was only slightly better than his peers while Tiger is head and shoulders above his.

hookemhess
04-09-2010, 09:28 AM
Tiger is playing so well, you'd think he was cheating.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 09:34 AM
So you use # of wins in one breath to indicate superior competition and in the next breath you say you don't subscribe to the idea? I'm confused.

Nevertheless it would seem, assuming your numbers are correct, that Jack was not that far set apart from his contemporaries given the high number of majors won by his opponents. So, by the numbers you have presented here, Jack was only slightly better than his peers while Tiger is head and shoulders above his.

# of wins are certainly part of the equation, as I've used them above. They are not the be all end all.

Is Joe Louis the undisputable best heavyweight fighter of all time?

Given your stance, how do you reconcile the fact that Tiger rarely finishes in contention if he doesn't win, and has never come from behind to win a major?

The Joker
04-09-2010, 09:35 AM
The shot on 9 yesterday was superb, but pretty much every golfer on the tour is capable of playing that shot.

baja
04-09-2010, 09:36 AM
where is it on TV now

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 09:36 AM
where is it on TV now

No where. Well, the golf channel. Stream it on Masters.com

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 09:38 AM
Freddie Couples. What a guy.

baja
04-09-2010, 09:39 AM
No where. Well, the golf channel. Stream it on Masters.com
Can't stream outside the USA, it's a legal thing.

Mr.Meanie
04-09-2010, 09:41 AM
So you use # of wins in one breath to indicate superior competition and in the next breath you say you don't subscribe to the idea? I'm confused.

Nevertheless it would seem, assuming your numbers are correct, that Jack was not that far set apart from his contemporaries given the high number of majors won by his opponents. So, by the numbers you have presented here, Jack was only slightly better than his peers while Tiger is head and shoulders above his.

That's exactly right.

And the equipment argument is a non-starter for me. Yes the equipment is better, but every pro golfer out there uses the same superior equipment, and they can all afford top notch trainers. Not only that, just about every tourney course is much longer and more difficult than it was 40 years ago.

As far as a money motive, having a lot of money in the sport attracts the absolute best in the world to the sport, with the best training and equipment.... just like what has happened with Football. The last 10 years everyone watched a 20yr old skinny golf prodigy light up the world and make $100M per year playing a game just about anyone in the world can play. You think that doesn't increase competition?

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 09:47 AM
Tiger is a great golfer. No doubt. He's also a phony.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 09:48 AM
The shot on 9 yesterday was superb, but pretty much every golfer on the tour is capable of playing that shot.
I haven't seen any other golfer on tour that can make that shot. They may try, and they may get a nice bend on it, but they aren't going to land on the middle of the green for a 1 putt. And when you hear the announcers comment that Wood's is the only that can hit that shot, you tend to believe them since they see all these guys play every week.

Couples still in the lead.

-------------------------------------------------------
http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/1324/masters2010a.jpg

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 09:55 AM
Go Freddy and Tom! :thumbsup:

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 10:00 AM
That's exactly right.

And the equipment argument is a non-starter for me. Yes the equipment is better, but every pro golfer out there uses the same superior equipment, and they can all afford top notch trainers. Not only that, just about every tourney course is much longer and more difficult than it was 40 years ago.

As far as a money motive, having a lot of money in the sport attracts the absolute best in the world to the sport, with the best training and equipment.... just like what has happened with Football. The last 10 years everyone watched a 20yr old skinny golf prodigy light up the world and make $100M per year playing a game just about anyone in the world can play. You think that doesn't increase competition?
I agree, in part, to your equipment take.

However the money part is a poor take. Because of the money and training needed to compete it takes hundreds of thousands of dollars to get to that level. It takes hundreds of thousands of dollars just to cover expenses for a year on the mini tour. There is hardly a player on tour these days who has ever had a real job. They've been carried and sponsored to get to this level.

They have nicer looking golf swings, all the same btw, but that doesn't speak to their competitive fire.

To borrow your football analogy. DJ Williams may be a far superior athlete than Dick Butkus, but I'll take Butkus every Sunday. Same way I'll take Trevino, Player, and Palmer over Vijay, Phil, and Ernie.

baja
04-09-2010, 10:06 AM
Tiger is a great golfer. No doubt. He's also a phony.

Very very few people know who they really are so you can say most people are phony.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 10:09 AM
. And when you hear the announcers comment that Wood's is the only that can hit that shot, you tend to believe them since they see all these guys play every week.


Yeah, because announcers never sensationalize.

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 10:11 AM
Given the press coverage, they should rename this tournament "The Tigers."

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 10:13 AM
Very very few people know who they really are so you can say most people are phony.

Tiger publicly packaged himself as something, and somebody, that he knew he wasn't. Hey, we live in the era where money is the only thing that counts, so I realize that what he did isn't anything out of the ordinary.

Mr.Meanie
04-09-2010, 10:14 AM
I agree, in part, to your equipment take.

However the money part is a poor take. Because of the money and training needed to compete it takes hundreds of thousands of dollars to get to that level. It takes hundreds of thousands of dollars just to cover expenses for a year on the mini tour. There is hardly a player on tour these days who has ever had a real job. They've been carried and sponsored to get to this level.

They have nicer looking golf swings, all the same btw, but that doesn't speak to their competitive fire.

To borrow your football analogy. DJ Williams may be a far superior athlete than Dick Butkus, but I'll take Butkus every Sunday. Same way I'll take Trevino, Player, and Palmer over Vijay, Phil, and Ernie.

I agree with you on Vijay and Ernie, definately.

On the money side, I disagree.

I think the fact that it takes years of training speaks to the talent out there on the golf course. If someone who was a dishwasher by night and a golfer by day could make it on the Tour, there would obviously be a severe lack of talent out there. The idea that someone has to almost be bred for it, playing with a golf club as a toddler, play all through school and basically do nothing but live and breathe golf... and they can get to the pros and it takes them sometimes over a decade to win a big tournament speaks to the absolute level playing field and quality competition out there.

Which makes what Tiger does out there so much more incredible. IMO.

Mr.Meanie
04-09-2010, 10:15 AM
Given the press coverage, they should rename this tournament "The Tigers."

Every tourney tiger plays in is somewhat like this. They really should just rename golf to Tigerball.

baja
04-09-2010, 10:18 AM
Deion Sanders just called the mcNabb trade the second worse in NFL history

The Joker
04-09-2010, 10:22 AM
I haven't seen any other golfer on tour that can make that shot. They may try, and they may get a nice bend on it, but they aren't going to land on the middle of the green for a 1 putt. And when you hear the announcers comment that Wood's is the only that can hit that shot, you tend to believe them since they see all these guys play every week.


It was a hook shot.

I can play them, they're not particularly hard.

Now, would I get it just the right amount around the tree to land on the green and leave a makeable putt? No, but Mickelson played a shot very similar to that last year and some of the real shotmakers on tour, like Garcia for instance, play shots like that all the time.

Are there shots that only Tiger can play?

Yes, but that sure wasn't one of them, good a shot as it was.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 10:26 AM
I think the fact that it takes years of training speaks to the talent out there on the golf course. If someone who was a dishwasher by night and a golfer by day could make it on the Tour, there would obviously be a severe lack of talent out there. The idea that someone has to almost be bred for it, playing with a golf club as a toddler, play all through school and basically do nothing but live and breathe golf... and they can get to the pros and it takes them sometimes over a decade to win a big tournament speaks to the absolute level playing field and quality competition out there.

Which makes what Tiger does out there so much more incredible. IMO.I don't agree with your logic at all. You're basically watering down the talent part of the equation in favor of having the means to do nothing but play golf every day of your life. I don't think that increases the level of competition at all.

I've played with better players in meet up rounds at the local muni than I've played against in mini tour events.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 10:55 AM
It was a hook shot.

I can play them, they're not particularly hard.

Now, would I get it just the right amount around the tree to land on the green and leave a makeable putt? No, but Mickelson played a shot very similar to that last year and some of the real shotmakers on tour, like Garcia for instance, play shots like that all the time.
Are there shots that only Tiger can play?
Yes, but that sure wasn't one of them, good a shot as it was.It was a draw shot that might have moved 80 or 90 ft. back left. I can play draws/fades also and if I could putt a little better I'd be shooting in the 70s, but controlling that much draw with distance is pretty darn good.

Look how far right of the green he is lined up...


<object style="height: 344px; width: 425px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/jH7Zy5KX-Rs"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/jH7Zy5KX-Rs" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></object>

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 10:58 AM
It was a hook shot.

I can play them, they're not particularly hard.

Now, would I get it just the right amount around the tree to land on the green and leave a makeable putt? No, but Mickelson played a shot very similar to that last year and some of the real shotmakers on tour, like Garcia for instance, play shots like that all the time.

Are there shots that only Tiger can play?

Yes, but that sure wasn't one of them, good a shot as it was.

If you made it 1 out of 20 I'd be impressed. He did it in the Masters after 144 day layoff. You can't down play it.

The Joker
04-09-2010, 11:06 AM
If you made it 1 out of 20 I'd be impressed. He did it in the Masters after 144 day layoff. You can't down play it.

Nobody's saying it wasn't a great shot, people are just taking issue with the notion that it was some sort of once in a lifetime shot that nobody else in the world could play.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 11:08 AM
Nobody's saying it wasn't a great shot, people are just taking issue with the notion that it was some sort of once in a lifetime shot that nobody else in the world could play.

And to use it as verification that he's the greatest of all time? Seriously?

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 11:10 AM
Nobody's saying it wasn't a great shot, people are just taking issue with the notion that it was some sort of once in a lifetime shot that nobody else in the world could play.

In the Masters? You better believe it.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 11:14 AM
In the Masters? You better believe it.

Jack's 1 iron in the US Open, in a final round into a howling wind makes that look like child's play.

The Joker
04-09-2010, 11:20 AM
Mickelson played a better shot in last year's final round.

Massive hook around a tree to about 12 inches from the cup. The ball had so much spin on it that it was rotating on the spot even after it finally came to rest.

rbackfactory80
04-09-2010, 11:47 AM
It was a draw shot that might have moved 80 or 90 ft. back left. I can play draws/fades also and if I could putt a little better I'd be shooting in the 70s, but controlling that much draw with distance is pretty darn good.

Look how far right of the green he is lined up...


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Its a hook not a draw. A draw moves about 5 feet, that shot is an intentional hook. Every player in the field could hit that shot. With Masters pressure it is more difficult, but these guys can easily hook it that much.

Rohirrim
04-09-2010, 11:48 AM
Hasn't anybody here been to a driving range? I see that shot all the time. Hilarious!

ColoradoBuff
04-09-2010, 11:51 AM
Freddie just chuggin along even for the day -6 for the tourney. Westwood is tearin it up....-3 after 3 for the day.

ColoradoBuff
04-09-2010, 11:53 AM
Hasn't anybody here been to a driving range? I see that shot all the time. Hilarious!

unfortunately so do i! damn hookers! ;)

rbackfactory80
04-09-2010, 12:01 PM
Jack's 1 iron in the US Open, in a final round into a howling wind makes that look like child's play.

So true. It was a tough shot, nothing more, nothing less.

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 12:14 PM
A couple of Brits leading.

http://i41.tinypic.com/qnjjb8.png

Weather is supposed to be fantastic for the rest of the tournament.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 12:15 PM
Its a hook not a draw. A draw moves about 5 feet, that shot is an intentional hook. Every player in the field could hit that shot. With Masters pressure it is more difficult, but these guys can easily hook it that much. It's regional terminology. Draws and Fades can move any distance left or right depending on the length of shot. And how come you never see these shots from "every player"? :)

baja
04-09-2010, 12:17 PM
It's regional terminology. Draws and Fades can move any distance left or right depending on the length of shot. And how come you never see these shots from "every player"? :)

Because they don't find themselves behind trees???

The Joker
04-09-2010, 12:17 PM
Poulter and Westwood tied at -8.

Poulter will be hard to beat, they said yesterday he's only missed one putt from inside 5 feet all year on the tour.

That's basically insane, and the exact recipe for winning at Augusta.

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 12:22 PM
Just to say, the feed from Masters.com is http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif

Garcia Bronco
04-09-2010, 12:24 PM
Poulter and Westwood tied at -8.

Poulter will be hard to beat, they said yesterday he's only missed one putt from inside 5 feet all year on the tour.

That's basically insane, and the exact recipe for winning at Augusta.

I think he'll do well today. It's his Saturday Sunday that I am worried about.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 12:25 PM
It's regional terminology. Draws and Fades can move any distance left or right depending on the length of shot. And how come you never see these shots from "every player"? :)

Just keep digging. Have you ever played golf?

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 12:29 PM
Poulter and Westwood tied at -8.

Poulter will be hard to beat, they said yesterday he's only missed one putt from inside 5 feet all year on the tour.

That's basically insane, and the exact recipe for winning at Augusta.Poulter is a steely player, who certainly has a good chance to take this thing with the way he rolls the ball.

Both he and Westwood will be around the scene on Sunday.

The Joker
04-09-2010, 12:32 PM
Poulter is a steely player, who certainly has a good chance to take this thing with the way he rolls the ball.

Both he and Westwood will be around the scene on Sunday.

Westwood is a guy I can't figure out.

He has the game, but I don't trust him with the putter, especially under pressure.

Hard to back a guy like that, especially at Augusta where you're going to have to hole some pressure 4-6 footers on Sunday.

Sir_Robin
04-09-2010, 12:34 PM
# of wins are certainly part of the equation, as I've used them above. They are not the be all end all.

Is Joe Louis the undisputable best heavyweight fighter of all time?

Given your stance, how do you reconcile the fact that Tiger rarely finishes in contention if he doesn't win, and has never come from behind to win a major?

I know little regarding the history of golf. I watch the games from time to time and I enjoy playing when I can afford it. I dislike arguments which strive to compare players across generations simply because there can never be resolution. Granted - that's also what makes it fun. Numbers are not the end all be all, I agree, but it strikes me as the only reasoned way to compare players across generations.

As for his failure to come from behind - I could only guess that it's some manner of psychological deficit (as it applies to his golf game). Someone posted earlier that he's phony. I tend to agree. What if, however, he genuinely believes his own hype? How would that impact his game when he finds himself behind? I don't know - it's all just fun speculation. In that regard - I'd take Jack over Tiger. It certainly makes the Master's all the more interesting though.

bowtown
04-09-2010, 12:35 PM
Poulter is a steely player, who certainly has a good chance to take this thing with the way he rolls the ball.

Both he and Westwood will be around the scene on Sunday.

Poultry is a wuss. I can't wait for him to fall apart.

baja
04-09-2010, 12:35 PM
so where are the guys saying Tiger would miss the cut?

Drunk Monkey
04-09-2010, 01:26 PM
Just to say, the feed from Masters.com is http://forum.football365.com/images/smiley_icons/3.gif

Yes, yes it is. If it gets any worst I may actually end up doing some work today.

baja
04-09-2010, 01:49 PM
Tiger at 6 under = amazing

The Joker
04-09-2010, 02:03 PM
Mickelson has had a poor front 9, back to -4 for the tournament. Missed a par putt from not much more than a foot on the 5th.

Anthony Kim going well, if that unbearable little wanker wins I'll not watch golf for a long time I reckon.

Pick Six
04-09-2010, 02:31 PM
so where are the guys saying Tiger would miss the cut?

They should know better than that. Tiger doesn't miss many holes...8')

Bronco CB40
04-09-2010, 04:30 PM
The Masters is a very classy operation. I was reading they sell beer there for $2.50 and also sell a $2.50 cheese sandwich. Very reasonable prices.

Most of all, I yet to hear a "get in the hole!" cry from the gallery. I guess $1,000+ seats keeps those dirtbags out of Augusta.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 05:18 PM
Just keep digging. Have you ever played golf?
A little bit, say you me give 5 a side, $50 a hole, since I don't know much about it?

Dagmar
04-09-2010, 05:49 PM
Tiger at 6 under = amazing

Doesn't someone owe you an avatar change?

baja
04-09-2010, 05:52 PM
Doesn't someone owe you an avatar change?

not yet

Tiger has to finish closer to the winner than to the cut number.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 06:16 PM
not yet

Tiger has to finish closer to the winner than to the cut number.

So 9.5 strokes is the official line. I'm thinking I'm in trouble, but I'm not giving up.

I'm hoping the Augusta crowd will be a little more liberal with the sauce on the weekend, and start making a few comments that might throw Tiger off a little.

I wish I could move this thing to New York for the weekend instead of having it in the demure south.

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 06:25 PM
A little bit, say you me give 5 a side, $50 a hole, since I don't know much about it?

Only two kinds of golfers ask for strokes: Sandbaggers and hustlers.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-09-2010, 06:28 PM
Doesn't someone owe you an avatar change?Only a matter of time now. Betting against Tiger in a golf tournament isn't the smartest thing someone can do. :)
Only two kinds of golfers ask for strokes: Sandbaggers and hustlers.Not me, I just like to gamble. :wiggle:

baja
04-09-2010, 06:37 PM
So 9.5 strokes is the official line. I'm thinking I'm in trouble, but I'm not giving up.

I'm hoping the Augusta crowd will be a little more liberal with the sauce on the weekend, and start making a few comments that might throw Tiger off a little.

I wish I could move this thing to New York for the weekend instead of having it in the demure south.

Have you seen your avatar? ;D

baja
04-09-2010, 06:41 PM
Ya see this;




http://crfranke.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/the-grateful-dead-collage-poster-c10314578.jpg


That's not it. ;D

baja
04-09-2010, 06:42 PM
http://artfiles.art.com/5/p/LRG/9/959/1D2K000Z/grateful-dead.jpg


......nope not this one either.

baja
04-09-2010, 06:44 PM
This is my favorite


http://991.com/newGallery/Grateful-Dead-Blues-For-Allah--252737.jpg



.....but that's not it either.

baja
04-09-2010, 06:46 PM
http://www.nationalbankruptcyforum.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Grateful-Dead.jpg


Maybe......

Dedhed
04-09-2010, 06:56 PM
http://www.nationalbankruptcyforum.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Grateful-Dead.jpg


Maybe......

YYYYYYEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!! this one

baja
04-10-2010, 04:28 PM
Good day

The Joker
04-10-2010, 04:30 PM
Yeah, that run by Mickelson from 13 to 15 was insane.

Hard to look beyond Mickelson or Westwood tomorrow.

baja
04-10-2010, 04:35 PM
Westwood looks ready to crack to me.

Mickelson is in the zone right now.

Woods is too much in his head today but hanging none the less. (strong player)

Dedhed
04-10-2010, 05:16 PM
Westwood looks ready to crack to me.

Mickelson is in the zone right now.

Woods is too much in his head today but hanging none the less. (strong player)

I don't see that from Westwood, although he won't shoot better than 70 tomorrow. Phil has to be the favorite with the way he's playing and the experience factor.

Tiger was battling everything in his game today, which doesn't bode well for tomorrow. Sometimes with golf it's easier when you haven't played for awhile because the memories of bad shots has faded, and you don't have too many thoughts banging around in your head. After today he'll certainly have some thoughts.

The crowd was noticeably more subdued in their support for Tiger today as well. It's going to be a real battle for him tomorrow on a number of levels. Of course if anyone can pull it off...

Prediction:

Westwood shoots a solid but unspectacular 70 to finish -14.
Mickelson plays terrifically. Shoots 67 to win the tournament by 2 at -16
Tiger struggles with his driver, putter, and emotions and limps home with a 74 to finish -6.

Phil wins his 3rd green jacket, and I win my avatar bet with Baja.

Bronco_Beerslug
04-10-2010, 05:23 PM
Phil wins his 3rd green jacket, and I win my avatar bet with Baja.I thought Woods had to finish closer to cut number than the winning number?

baja
04-10-2010, 05:24 PM
I don't see that from Westwood, although he won't shoot better than 70 tomorrow. Phil has to be the favorite with the way he's playing and the experience factor.

Tiger was battling everything in his game today, which doesn't bode well for tomorrow. Sometimes with golf it's easier when you haven't played for awhile because the memories of bad shots has faded, and you don't have too many thoughts banging around in your head. After today he'll certainly have some thoughts.

The crowd was noticeably more subdued in their support for Tiger today as well. It's going to be a real battle for him tomorrow on a number of levels. Of course if anyone can pull it off...

Prediction:

Westwood shoots a solid but unspectacular 70 to finish -14.
Mickelson plays terrifically. Shoots 67 to win the tournament by 2 at -16
Tiger struggles with his driver, putter, and emotions and limps home with a 74 to finish -6.

Phil wins his 3rd green jacket, and I win my avatar bet with Baja.

In your dreams

baja
04-10-2010, 05:27 PM
I thought Woods had to finish closer to cut number than the winning number?

He said a while ago 9.5 was the spread between winner and Tiger to make a push.

I didn't ever do the math though.


His scenario had Mickelson -16 / Woods -6

Dedhed
04-10-2010, 05:39 PM
I thought Woods had to finish closer to cut number than the winning number?

Please learn how to read.

Dedhed
04-10-2010, 05:41 PM
In your dreams

I guess it's possible that Tiger shoots 72 and Phil shoots 65. 8')

Sassy
04-10-2010, 05:53 PM
I guess it's possible that Tiger shoots 72 and Phil shoots 65. 8')

Only if Phil skips 17 and 18 ;D
That's usually where he screws up! LOL!

baja
04-10-2010, 05:57 PM
Only if Phil skips 17 and 18 ;D
That's usually where he screws up! LOL!


Ya Phil's problem is he is too airy, not grounded this causes him to lose focus

Tiger on the other hand uses his stress to fuel his fires of intensity and focus. That's what makes him so great. The thing is called "It".

Sassy
04-10-2010, 05:58 PM
Elway had "IT" ;D

baja
04-10-2010, 06:05 PM
Elway had "IT" ;D

Wayne Gretzky

Michael Jorden

Michael Jackson

FADERPROOF
04-10-2010, 06:25 PM
ahhh...the mandatory "find some obscure way to toss Elways name in every thread" has been completed!