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strafen
03-28-2010, 10:55 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/28/mcdaniels-brady-once-went-three-weeks-without-talking-in-new-england/

The Denver Post takes a close look at second-year coach Josh McDaniels, the former Patriots offensive coordinator who arrived with much fanfare in 2009, and who then took the locals on a roller-coaster ride that ultimately ended in failure.

And here's a nugget from Mike Klis that won't make Broncos fans feel much better about their Boy Wonder. During McDaniels' first year as de facto offensive coordinator with the Patriots, McDaniels and quarterback Tom Brady once went three weeks without talking to each other.

Head coach Bill Belichick did a great job of keeping the spat under wraps, but the notion of player and coach not communicating for such a long stretch suggests that one of the two men has a personality flaw, or two. The fact that McDaniels has had public issues with multiple players in Denver suggests that McDaniels, not Brady, was the problem.

So what's wrong with this picture? Boomer Esiason of CBS tells Klis that McDaniels is trying to behave like Belichick before earning the ability to do so. "All these [coaches] are taking what Bill did in New England and trying to bring that with them wherever they go," Esiason said. "The one thing they're missing, though, is the credibility Bill Belichick has. The Super Bowl rings lead the players to believe he's leading them to victory."

Initially, it looked like McDaniels would be able to make the transition easily, as he led the team to six victories to start the season. But a 2-8 mark down the stretch has prompted folks to look more critically at McDaniels -- and it has many wondering whether the head coach will be inching toward the hot seat come 2010

Dagmar
03-28-2010, 03:10 PM
Brady went on to have a Pro Bowl season, and the Patriots made the playoffs. And, two years later, McDaniels, by then officially promoted to offensive coordinator, helped Brady set an NFL record with 50 touchdown passes in a season.

Clearly, McDaniels and Brady got past their spat.

You really are a wank son.

Requiem
03-28-2010, 03:11 PM
http://www.50poundnote.net/downloads/gay_shame.jpg

Cool Breeze
03-28-2010, 03:16 PM
Ha!

bpc
03-28-2010, 03:17 PM
Anybody surprised? This writing was on the wall about two weeks after he got to Denver. We gave full control to a powermad 33-yr old.

Florida_Bronco
03-28-2010, 03:18 PM
Yawn.

Popps
03-28-2010, 03:18 PM
..

http://www.225.ca/ivan/nov03/crybaby.jpg

Popps
03-28-2010, 03:21 PM
.

http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/cry-baby-girl-face.jpg

_Oro_
03-28-2010, 03:25 PM
I'm guessing that McDaniels was simply advocating that Cassel start over Brady and Brady threw a little temper tantrum that's all. No harm no foul.

Atwater His Ass
03-28-2010, 03:30 PM
Not surprising, but really, there's not enough information to make any sort of hard conclusion.

Could be any number of things from either party that caused the spat.

Drek
03-28-2010, 03:35 PM
And since then Tom Brady has publicly said many times that McDaniels was instrumental in making him the QB he is today and is one of the single best football people he's worked with.

Damn, what a sour relationship there huh?

Dagmar
03-28-2010, 03:39 PM
http://i44.tinypic.com/rkr605.jpg

NYBronco
03-28-2010, 03:43 PM
McDaniels was probably heard by Brady saying the "trade" word and found out three weeks later McDaniels was in the process of trading his car in for a new one and NOT the "franchise" QB.

HILife
03-28-2010, 03:47 PM
aaaawwww look at all the cute babies in this thread.

BMarsh615
03-28-2010, 03:50 PM
This was already posted http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=90332

bpc
03-28-2010, 03:50 PM
Not surprising, but really, there's not enough information to make any sort of hard conclusion.

Could be any number of things from either party that caused the spat.

I think you can definitely draw some conclusions from this incident and some of the other one's he's had in Denver thus far. Look no farther than the Cutler situation, the draft situation, the Marshall situation, the suspensions the final week of the season, to the Nolan incident. Bottom line, McDaniels is a control freak and when you don't act just as he wants, he retaliates with truly pathetic immature actions. You would think this guy has the clout of a Parcells or Belicheck by the way he moves and reacts.

elsid13
03-28-2010, 03:54 PM
I think you can definitely draw some conclusions from this incident and some of the other one's he's had in Denver thus far. Look no farther than the Cutler situation, the draft situation, the Marshall situation, the suspensions the final week of the season, to the Nolan incident. Bottom line, McDaniels is a control freak and when you don't act just as he wants, he retaliates with truly pathetic immature actions. You would think this guy has the clout of a Parcells or Belicheck by the way he moves and reacts.

I would say his approach to coaching seems to resemble that of Ohio High School Coach. Someone that not used to feedback from his players.

Popps
03-28-2010, 03:56 PM
I

http://raxdakkar.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/mobile_troll.jpg

Dagmar
03-28-2010, 03:58 PM
Called it Popps.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-28-2010, 04:17 PM
Anybody surprised? This writing was on the wall about two weeks after he got to Denver. We gave full control to a powermad 33-yr old.

Maybe he should find god

Florida_Bronco
03-28-2010, 04:29 PM
Maybe he should find god

Or Conservatism.

Archer81
03-28-2010, 04:31 PM
<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/jHjFxJVeCQs&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/jHjFxJVeCQs&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

:Broncos:

Archer81
03-28-2010, 04:35 PM
<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/TaMlmUbF19A&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/TaMlmUbF19A&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

:Broncos:

strafen
03-28-2010, 05:41 PM
Not surprising, but really, there's not enough information to make any sort of hard conclusion.

Could be any number of things from either party that caused the spat.

Come on?
Not enough information?
Marshall for one, everybody knows about his off the field issues, but he has never been a problem on the team until McDaniels got here.
Scheffler: never been a problem
Hillis: never been a problem
Cutler: never been a problem

And now this article about McDaniels having some personal issues with Brady, and you find it not to be telling enough of what issues McDaniels may have when dealing with people?

tsiguy96
03-28-2010, 05:55 PM
Come on?
Not enough information?
Marshall for one, everybody knows about his off the field issues, but he has never been a problem on the team until McDaniels got here.
Scheffler: never been a problem
Hillis: never been a problem
Cutler: never been a problem

And now this article about McDaniels having some personal issues with Brady, and you find it not to be telling enough of what issues McDaniels may have when dealing with people?

ive got a good idea. be sure to whine at us about it. what do we know, we are just stupid fans who like to enjoy following the team and the game of football. shame on us for being so dense that we cant spit the same load of **** out constantly about why mcdaniels is the worst coach of all time.

strafen
03-28-2010, 05:58 PM
ive got a good idea. be sure to whine at us about it. what do we know, we are just stupid fans who like to enjoy following the team and the game of football. shame on us for being so dense that we cant spit the same load of **** out constantly about why mcdaniels is the worst coach of all time.Truer words have never been spoken! :thumbs:

Baba Booey
03-28-2010, 05:59 PM
http://media.omfgif.com/gif/051154Baby_displeased.gif

Dedhed
03-28-2010, 06:02 PM
Anybody surprised? This writing was on the wall about two weeks after he got to Denver. We gave full control to a powermad 33-yr old.

Not surprised by your whiny anti-McDaniels take.

tsiguy96
03-28-2010, 06:05 PM
Not surprised by your whiny anti-McDaniels take.

really? i find his opinion to be contrasting and well written. it shines a new light on mcdaniels, a side weve never heard before.

strafen
03-28-2010, 06:08 PM
Not surprised by your whiny anti-McDaniels take.How so?
You may agree with everything McDenials has done so far and refuse to see we're not heading in the right direction.
There are some of us who don't agree with what McDenials has done and we hate where we're heading.
So, are you more right than we're wrong?
Explain...

Dagmar
03-28-2010, 06:09 PM
dragster being back = 'Mane quality dropping significantly.

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 06:12 PM
Bummer I thought you were gone permanently. Back on iggy.

strafen
03-28-2010, 06:13 PM
Bummer I thought you were gone permanently. Back on iggy.

True hurts like a mother****er, huh?
Face the music like a chapm! LOL

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 06:14 PM
dragster being back = 'Mane quality dropping significantly.

This

Popps
03-28-2010, 06:16 PM
mod note: pic is huge

http://www.jeffcrupper.com/images/the_pooping_dog.jpg

strafen
03-28-2010, 06:18 PM
ThisLike dogman has ever had anything of significance to say, huh?
All this mother****er does is antagonize people and post worthless crap.
I can see the value that idiot is talking about....
I wonder who he was going after while I was gone?
I bet the moron couldn't resist to go after and attack other people, huh?
Immigration needs to check his legal status. Illegal aliens don't just come from south of the border!

Archer81
03-28-2010, 06:20 PM
Like dogman has ever had anything of significance to say, huh?
All this mother****er does is antagonize people and post worthless crap.
I can see the value that idiot is talking about....
I wonder who he was going after while I was gone?
I bet the moron couldn't resist to go after and attack other people, huh?
Immigration needs to check his legal status. Illegal aliens don't just come from south of the border!


Dagmar is a good poster. Who realizes this is a message board, and not a soapbox for the bitchfest of the week.


:Broncos:

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 06:20 PM
super big picture of dog taking a dump

and this.

strafen
03-28-2010, 06:23 PM
Dagmar is a good poster. Who realizes this is a message board, and not a soapbox for the b****fest of the week.


:Broncos:Other than you sucking up to him, what makes him a good poster?
Maybe you've meant an imposter? :thumbsup:

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 06:25 PM
http://happybunny.orbitearthstores.com/images/runalongmag-huge.jpg

Archer81
03-28-2010, 06:30 PM
Other than you sucking up to him, what makes him a good poster?
Maybe you've meant an imposter? :thumbsup:


You never had anyone share blocks with you in kindergarten, did you?


:Broncos:

Popps
03-28-2010, 06:37 PM
http://msp317.photobucket.com/albums/mm368/FLUBJUB/elephant-size-poop.jpg

.

tsiguy96
03-28-2010, 06:53 PM
am i the only one who just sees the ridiculous length of dragsters posts, and realize hes trying to filibuster us? he has no real point to prove, so he drags on long enough hoping we just agree with him eventually.

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:01 PM
am i the only one who just sees the ridiculous length of dragsters posts, and realize hes trying to filibuster us? he has no real point to prove, so he drags on long enough hoping we just agree with him eventually.

I don't have a point to prove?
I'm not asking you to agree with me.
I'm giving my opinion on the way the Denver Broncos, my proud football team is being dismantled by a knucklehead that has no clue what he's doinf.
My point of contention is that so far, he's done nothing not only to impress me but for the better of the team.
We have another year to see if the nice line he speaks translate into some kind of success.
We shall see...

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:03 PM
You never had anyone share blocks with you in kindergarten, did you?


:Broncos:I've always brought my own! :thumbs:

tsiguy96
03-28-2010, 07:04 PM
I don't have a point to prove?
I'm not asking you to agree with me.
I'm giving my opinion on the way the Denver Broncos, my proud football team is being dismantled by a knucklehead that has no clue what he's doinf.
My point of contention is that so far, he's done nothing not only to impress me but for the better of the team.
We have another year to see if the nice line he speaks translate into some kind of success.
We shall see...

see what i mean? i just got filibustered

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 07:11 PM
see what i mean? i just got filibustered

Yup, that's what trolls do. They don't win the argument, they wear you down with constant nonsense and try to get you to give up getting through their retardation.

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:13 PM
see what i mean? i just got filibusteredWhat do you want me to say?

Better yet, what is it you want to hear? :thumbsup:

BroncoBuff
03-28-2010, 07:13 PM
You really are a wank son.

Dragster posted a Denver Post article, without comment ... and in the first responding post, you reacted like an insecure little girl.

How about this?

The next year, in the biggest scandal in NFL history, the Patriots and head coach Bill Belichick were fined a total of one million dollars and stripped of a first round draft pick for allegedly stealing their opponents' defensive signals and supplying the information to McDaniels, their offensive play-caller.


There. NOW Dagmar, NOW react like a defensive little girl :curtsey:

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:14 PM
Yup, that's what trolls do. They don't win the argument, they wear you down with constant nonsense and try to get you to give up getting through their retardation.

Then, make your point why I'm wrong, and about my nonsense :rofl:
I'm waiting...

BroncoBuff
03-28-2010, 07:19 PM
I'd love to hear Mike Nolan's take on this .... wasn't it reported he and Josh barely spoke for awhile there? Like the article says, Josh has had other run-ins with guys. Plus, although we only know him from TV interviews and such, Tom Brady seems like an extremely reasonable, nice guy. Never a jutting jaw, never any reported squabbles, none that I know of anyway.

We'll see ... this will all come out in the wash. Eventually.

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 07:21 PM
Dragster posted a Denver Post article, without comment ... and in the first responding post, you reacted like an insecure little girl.

How about this?




There. NOW Dagmar, NOW react like a defensive little girl :curtsey:

Didn't they go undefeated during the regular season that year? And came within a lucky "hold the football to the helmet" catch (or the int going through Samuel's hands) of winning the Superbowl and being the first 19-0 team ever?

I am glad that the Giants won (I was rooting hard for them, and still stick it to Pats fans with a simple, yet effective "18-1 LOL"), but let's not kid ourselves that they were anything other than utterly dominant that season.

BroncoBuff
03-28-2010, 07:25 PM
Didn't they go undefeated during the regular season that year? And came within a lucky "hold the football to the helmet" catch (or the int going through Samuel's hands) of winning the Superbowl and being the first 19-0 team ever?

I think it was the next year they went 18-0 ... but there's no arguing that quote I made. It was the largest scandal in league history, and Jolly Josh was right in the middle of it - he called the plays, ergo, he must have been provided whatever info they got from allegedly stealing signals.

baja
03-28-2010, 07:26 PM
Anybody surprised? This writing was on the wall about two weeks after he got to Denver. We gave full control to a powermad 33-yr old.

I will be interested to see how you handle yourself after it becomes crystal clear to you we have a stellar coach in Josh McDaniels.

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 07:29 PM
I think it was the next year they went 18-0 ... but there's no arguing that quote I made. It was the largest scandal in league history, and Jolly Josh was right in the middle of it - he called the plays, ergo, he must have been provided whatever info they got from allegedly stealing signals.

I know they got the fine at the beginning of the season that they went 18-0 Beli loves using the "us against the world" and was using that massively that season, it's something Josh used the first few games last season, just have to figure out how to get it to go longer.

I think what you're crossing is that as the Pats OC, he benefited from it. That doesn't mean that he was involved in it, but seeing how the offense was record setting after the scandal broke and they didn't tape anymore, I can't see that it was a material advantage.

Drek
03-28-2010, 07:31 PM
I'd love to hear Mike Nolan's take on this .... wasn't it reported he and Josh barely spoke for awhile there? Like the article says, Josh has had other run-ins with guys. Plus, although we only know him from TV interviews and such, Tom Brady seems like an extremely reasonable, nice guy. Never a jutting jaw, never any reported squabbles, none that I know of anyway.

We'll see ... this will all come out in the wash. Eventually.

I seem to recall Dan Reeves and Mike Shanahan having a rather unpleasant relationship at one point as well. But I'm sure that was nothing like Nolan and McDaniels not seeing eye to eye.

This was already brought up in another thread. Given that the two of them worked exceptionally well together over the next several years, and parted on very good terms, I just don't see the need for this having its own thread.

Brady probably didn't like McDaniels pointing out the **** he was doing wrong. When he finally decided to listen McDaniels made him a better QB.

ColoradoDarin
03-28-2010, 07:31 PM
I'm out for the night Buff, I probably shouldn't have started replying know that I wasn't going to hang around much longer tonight.

BroncoBuff
03-28-2010, 07:36 PM
I think what you're crossing is that as the Pats OC, he benefited from it. That doesn't mean that he was involved in it, but seeing how the offense was record setting after the scandal broke and they didn't tape anymore, I can't see that it was a material advantage.

Doesn't matter if it was an advantage .... bank robbers are thrown in prison even if they get no money.

And no no ... Josh was neck-deep in the scandal. Follow the logic: He called the offensive plays, so then he must've known whatever information they took from defensive signals. Otherwise, what's the point? The guy who's calling the plays is all that matters, so if he doesn't know the info, then why bother? And we know this was a very big deal, the fines and penalties were huge ... if you recall, they forced BB to pay his $500k fine personally, did not let the team pay it for him. W3e don't know exactly what they know, but that shows pretty clearly something very serious was up.


And yes, they set the records and went 18-0 without the cheating .... and you will NEVER hear me question Josh's coaching, he is an EXCELLENT coach. H

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:40 PM
Dragster posted a Denver Post article, without comment ... and in the first responding post, you reacted like an insecure little girl.

How about this?




There. NOW Dagmar, NOW react like a defensive little girl :curtsey:That's why they are "good posters"
What a crock of **** if I've ever heard one
I've been challenging them to prove me wrong. All they have to say so far is that I'm troll, but not a single intelligent reply to refute my posts.
Because they can't. They can't argue my point wrong...

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:41 PM
Brady probably didn't like McDaniels pointing out the **** he was doing wrong. When he finally decided to listen McDaniels made him a better QB.How in the hell do you know that?

BroncoBuff
03-28-2010, 07:43 PM
That's why they are "good posters"
What a crock of **** if I've ever heard one
I've been challenging them to prove me wrong. All they have to say so far is that I'm troll, but not a single intelligent reply to refute my posts.
Because they can't. They can't argue my point wrong...

All you did was post an article. And a link.

You said NOTHING in that post.

But Dagmar immediately attacked you, called you a name.

That's just sad.

BroncoBuff
03-28-2010, 07:48 PM
How in the hell do you know that?

Brady did get better ad better after that, we gotta acknowledge that.

Myself, I think Josh is a stubborn, top-down, authoritative personality. Jury is out on him as a head coach. But he has proven himself a magnificent QB coach and offensive coordinator, can't argue that. He made Matt Cassel a rich man, and it looks like Cassel probably sucks without Josh.



I seem to recall Dan Reeves and Mike Shanahan having a rather unpleasant relationship at one point as well. But I'm sure that was nothing like Nolan and McDaniels not seeing eye to eye.

This was already brought up in another thread. Given that the two of them worked exceptionally well together over the next several years, and parted on very good terms, I just don't see the need for this having its own thread.

Brady probably didn't like McDaniels pointing out the **** he was doing wrong. When he finally decided to listen McDaniels made him a better QB.

I hand't seen it elsewhere, but you're correct. Brady and Josh had immense, near unparalleled success together after this spat, TB continued to be a great quarterback and Josh became a great coach, a great coordinator.

And come to think of it, we do know something not so great about Tom Brady the person .... wasn't there an article that said Tom's big wedding party and Lonie Paxton's farewell party were the same night, and all the players went to Paxton's party?

strafen
03-28-2010, 07:50 PM
All you did was post an article. And a link.

You said NOTHING in that post.

But Dagmar immediately attacked you, called you a name.

That's just sad.That's all he does. I wouldn't expect any better of him.
I was being attacked as if I was the one who wrote the article.
They're too stupid to discuss anything.
It's a hell of whole lot easier for them to insult, call names and attack people than make a good post to debate.
That's why I have dagmar on my ignore list. I'm not missing any relevant information I care to read from him
Yup, that's sad and a totally acceptable way to behave here

Archer81
03-28-2010, 07:55 PM
All you did was post an article. And a link.

You said NOTHING in that post.

But Dagmar immediately attacked you, called you a name.

That's just sad.


Its a continuation of prior behavior, proving he learned nothing from the vacation given to him. We have heard, at great length, how much dragster dislikes McDaniels. Posting threads like this do nothing but agitate the two sides and encourage the petty arguing and bull****.

:Broncos:

colonelbeef
03-28-2010, 07:55 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/28/mcdaniels-brady-once-went-three-weeks-without-talking-in-new-england/

Boomer Esiason is of course obviously correct, but don't let that stop you from covering your eyes and ears, homers

Popps
03-28-2010, 07:56 PM
http://msp317.photobucket.com/albums/mm368/FLUBJUB/elephant-size-poop.jpg

.

.

Lev Vyvanse
03-28-2010, 07:58 PM
Boomer Esiason is of course obviously correct

There's a first time for everything.

Missouribronc
03-28-2010, 07:59 PM
Oh snap!

Mike Klis, who most of the idiots who want McDaniels fired say is the "mouthpiece of McDaniels," says this, and they believe him after telling us for months that he's just a reporting shill?

Really?

And even if it was the case, who the hell cares? They set a **** ton of records. We all know that NFL players/coaches are cocky sons of b****es. People shouldn't be surprised. They got into it. There was very little chit-chat in their day-to-day work, and they moved on.

Good thing they aren't women. That would have lasted for years and they would have never set any records or have gone 18-0.

Missouribronc
03-28-2010, 08:00 PM
Unfortunately, our former quarterback is a bitch, and he holds grudges.

Plus...he sucks.

colonelbeef
03-28-2010, 08:02 PM
There's a first time for everything.

Sweet ad hominem.

Boomer is a sharp guy actually, and knows what he is talking about.

Blueflame
03-28-2010, 08:20 PM
see what i mean? i just got filibustered


You call that a "filibuster"? Clearly you never saw one of Robb's lengthy cut n' paste religious tracts... you'd have to scroll at least 3 times to get past a single post.

strafen
03-28-2010, 08:26 PM
You call that a "filibuster"? Clearly you never saw one of Robb's lengthy cut n' paste religious tracts... you'd have to scroll at least 3 times to get past a single post.Filibuster. i like that word. I feel like a congressman ;)

theAPAOps5
03-28-2010, 08:37 PM
I seem to recall Dan Reeves and Mike Shanahan having a rather unpleasant relationship at one point as well. But I'm sure that was nothing like Nolan and McDaniels not seeing eye to eye.

This was already brought up in another thread. Given that the two of them worked exceptionally well together over the next several years, and parted on very good terms, I just don't see the need for this having its own thread.

Brady probably didn't like McDaniels pointing out the **** he was doing wrong. When he finally decided to listen McDaniels made him a better QB.

Shhh you speak too much sense. Shanahan is a level above God so how dare you equate his once turbulent assistant career to that of McD and the Devil Belicheck.

People will find anything to hate McD its just how its going to be until he either proves his talent or the team moves on. Its still up in the air what he will end up doing but he is far from the anti-christ that the people here who constantly rail against him label him as.

I was upset about the Nolan parting of ways and do have reservations about some things with McD but I love his no BS, no coddling of inflated ego's(see Marshall and Cutleaf) type coaching

Missouribronc
03-28-2010, 08:48 PM
Shhh you speak too much sense. Shanahan is a level above God so how dare you equate his once turbulent assistant career to that of McD and the Devil Belicheck.

People will find anything to hate McD its just how its going to be until he either proves his talent or the team moves on. Its still up in the air what he will end up doing but he is far from the anti-christ that the people here who constantly rail against him label him as.

I was upset about the Nolan parting of ways and do have reservations about some things with McD but I love his no BS, no coddling of inflated ego's(see Marshall and Cutleaf) type coaching

Nothing turbulent ever happened under Shanahan because he was so smooth with the media...the comical part of that is that I now hear Mike Klis is McDaniels' media mouth piece.

Oh how wrong that is...

Popps
03-28-2010, 09:02 PM
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/0902/nfl.worst.free.agent.signings.all.time/images/dale-carter.jpg

http://latino-talk.com/wp-content/fotos/2008/03/ihop.jpg

http://letsblogsports.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/maruice-clarett-mugshot-arrested-fantasy-failure.jpg

http://images.usatoday.com/Wires2Web/20080715/3402924787_Javon_Walker_Suspect_Footballx.jpg

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0fnP7Og7kwce1/610x.jpg

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2006/0824/20060824_015550_sp24lelie_400.jpg

http://davesplaybook.com/Articles/Ed_Reed.jpg

strafen
03-28-2010, 09:06 PM
Shhh you speak too much sense. Shanahan is a level above God so how dare you equate his once turbulent assistant career to that of McD and the Devil Belicheck.

People will find anything to hate McD its just how its going to be until he either proves his talent or the team moves on. Its still up in the air what he will end up doing but he is far from the anti-christ that the people here who constantly rail against him label him as.

I was upset about the Nolan parting of ways and do have reservations about some things with McD but I love his no BS, no coddling of inflated ego's(see Marshall and Cutleaf) type coaching

The apologies made on behalf of McDenials has deflected the point of the article.
McDenials has had some issues dealing with people since he became the Broncos HC.
The article points out that there's been a precendent that people should take note of.
It exposes a disturbing trait in his personality.
It's not about what Reeves, Shanahan or what have you did in the past, it's about our current headcoach personality annihilating our franchise...

Broncojef
03-28-2010, 09:12 PM
Nothing turbulent ever happened under Shanahan because he was so smooth with the media...the comical part of that is that I now hear Mike Klis is McDaniels' media mouth piece.

Oh how wrong that is...

The two trophys Mike won went a long way with both the fans and the media (and rightfully so) and bought him the benefit of the doubt for many years. I think we needed the house cleaning and the change McDaniels brought. In the end even Mike's good friend Bowlen had seen enough of the "calm waters" with little production. Mike made his share of huge mistakes that people forgave because of his past credit. Give McDaniels some time, this team was very disfunctional when McD took over and will take some time to fix. We constantly heard how close we were with the old Broncos and we'd get embarassed on every Monday night or Charger game.

Broncojef
03-28-2010, 09:19 PM
The apologies made on behalf of McDenials has deflected the point of the article.
McDenials has had some issues dealing with people since he became the Broncos HC.
The article points out that there's been a precendent that people should take note of.
It exposes a disturbing trait in his personality.
It's not about what Reeves, Shanahan or what have you did in the past, it's about our current headcoach personality annihilating our franchise...

Sometimes the hard road needed to clean up disfunctional problems produces conflict. Jay Cutler has done nothing and I remember hearing even Shanny was debating cutting Marshall the year before his termination so all was not well in bronco land. there is probably 90% of the issues that never make the media or the news. I personally think it was time we cleaned out the problems and started fresh, Jay had lots of talent and BM is a stud but if they are going to be detrimental to the team lets get someone in with fresh ideas and wants to be a leader and drive forward minus the baggage.

Bigdawg26
03-28-2010, 09:25 PM
http://www.wearebored.com/gallery2/d/4867-2/Power+trip.JPG

Officially sponsored by Josh McDaniels!!

strafen
03-28-2010, 09:51 PM
Sometimes the hard road needed to clean up disfunctional problems produces conflict. Jay Cutler has done nothing and I remember hearing even Shanny was debating cutting Marshall the year before his termination so all was not well in bronco land. there is probably 90% of the issues that never make the media or the news. I personally think it was time we cleaned out the problems and started fresh, Jay had lots of talent and BM is a stud but if they are going to be detrimental to the team lets get someone in with fresh ideas and wants to be a leader and drive forward minus the baggage.You could say this team is now Mcdaniels team. There's no bones about it.
What I find disturbing about this article is that McD put himself first before the team when he didn't communicate with the star QB for 3 WEEKS.
You've gotta pause here and think about that for a second.
That cannot be good regardless.
Then the same pattern seems to follow him to Denver where he also started squabbles with talent.
The only thing right now, -if not a scary one- is that he's now in charge and the one with the authority to resolve those issues he seems to bring upon himself.
So far, his preferred method of dealing with adversity is by the way of trade players away...

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 09:56 PM
So if we make the play-offs, will you guys become non-Broncos fans?

It seems as if you get more hyped up and excited to post when you hear negative news about McDaniels and the Broncos... coming out of the wood works - OH DAMN I KNEW IT.

But when you're calling McDaniels an idiot, the worst coach of all time and his incapability of evaluating talent for not putting Chris Simms in... you seem to go on as if you know what the **** you're talking about.

LOL LOL LOL

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 09:58 PM
You could say this team is now Mcdaniels team. There's no bones about it.
What I find disturbing about this article is that McD put himself first before the team when he didn't communicate with the star QB for 3 WEEKS.
You've gotta pause here and think about that for a second.
That cannot be good regardless.
Then the same pattern seems to follow him to Denver where he also started squabbles with talent.
The only thing right now, -if not a scary one- is that he's now in charge and the one with the authority to resolve those issues he seems to bring upon himself.
So far, his preferred method of dealing with adversity is by the way of trade players away...

I don't find it disturbing at all. People have to adjust to other peoples' personalities. I would find it disturbing if it caused the Patriots franchise a ship wreck.

But when you're able to adjust - and come together and put a historical/record breaking season - I don't see a problem.

BS happens all the time you just never hear about it.

strafen
03-28-2010, 09:58 PM
So if we make the play-offs, will you guys become non-Broncos fans?

It seems as if you get more hyped up and excited to post when you hear negative news about McDaniels and the Broncos... coming out of the wood works - OH DAMN I KNEW IT.

But when you're calling McDaniels an idiot, the worst coach of all time and his incapability of evaluating talent for not putting Chris Simms in... you seem to go on as if you know what the **** you're talking about.

LOL LOL LOL

What does this rant from you have to do with the article?

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 09:59 PM
What does this rant from you have to do with the article?

What do you have to do with being a Broncos fan?

It has to do with people posting in the thread, son.

strafen
03-28-2010, 10:00 PM
I don't find it disturbing at all. People have to adjust to other peoples' personalities. I would find it disturbing if it caused the Patriots franchise a ship wreck.

But when you're able to adjust - and come together and put a historical/record breaking season - I don't see a problem.

BS happens all the time you just never hear about it.I wouldn't have espected you to find it disturbing, are you kiddin' me? Hilarious!

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 10:02 PM
Get with reality, that was how long ago? Obviously ANYONE is going to have their bumps and bruises along the way. Are you gonna pull Shanahan's faults when he was younger?

No one seems to be talking about the horrible character guys Shanahan drafts.

I mean you guys SWORE no one liked McDaniels, yet he went into FA and signed many players, AGAIN...

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 10:03 PM
I wouldn't have espected you to find it disturbing, are you kiddin' me? Hilarious!

No - because I'm actually exposed to reality rather than this nonsense going on in here.

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 10:06 PM
The apologies made on behalf of McDenials has deflected the point of the article.
McDenials has had some issues dealing with people since he became the Broncos HC.
The article points out that there's been a precendent that people should take note of.
It exposes a disturbing trait in his personality.
It's not about what Reeves, Shanahan or what have you did in the past, it's about our current headcoach personality annihilating our franchise...


:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

FireFly
03-28-2010, 10:24 PM
McDaniel's team first philosophy is not going to sit well with every player in today's NFL. Nor is his every job is up for grabs, everyone is expendable philosophy.

Players who think that they are bigger than the team aren't going to get on well with him. Cutler was a prime example of this, Cutler bought into his own hype -that's where the problem started.

strafen
03-28-2010, 10:31 PM
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:Let me explain it you so you and I can both laugh later this year...
We're not getting any younger. The old worn-out guys we're signing from the FA market is to WIN NOW.
The picks we've squandered may come back to bite us in the ass.
We've failed to addressed important positions at last year's draft.
This upcoming draft may or may not be the same as last year in terms of signing or addressing our needs.

When you put that all together, the decisions to get rid of talent, and the inability to draft good players, you'd better hope McD got it right.
Because if he doesn't, you're looking at a few more years to wait for our draft picks to pan out; perhaps another year or two, while the short-term FA signings you'd hope they be able to produce at a high level as they pass their prime of their careers.

This is a high risk approach. You want to cheer to that kind of philosphy, then more power to you, but at the end of the day, all it matters is we make the play-offs this year. If we don't. Mcd will be on the hot seat sooner than he got Lonnie Paxton signed.

Again, this year will be crucial for McDaniels and for the Broncos. If he doesn't succeed he will have led the biggest debacle in franchise history, and it will leave a mess for the next coach to sort out. It will have once again to start from scratch...

bpc
03-28-2010, 10:38 PM
Or Conservatism.

We're trying to succeed as a football program, not correct all the corruptness and evil individuals in the US today.

Go fish.

bpc
03-28-2010, 10:39 PM
I will be interested to see how you handle yourself after it becomes crystal clear to you we have a stellar coach in Josh McDaniels.

Very simple, if i'm wrong, i'll admit it.

If i'm right... i'll let you all know about it. Daily. :thumbsup:

bpc
03-28-2010, 10:42 PM
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/0902/nfl.worst.free.agent.signings.all.time/images/dale-carter.jpg

http://latino-talk.com/wp-content/fotos/2008/03/ihop.jpg

http://letsblogsports.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/maruice-clarett-mugshot-arrested-fantasy-failure.jpg

http://images.usatoday.com/Wires2Web/20080715/3402924787_Javon_Walker_Suspect_Footballx.jpg

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0fnP7Og7kwce1/610x.jpg

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2006/0824/20060824_015550_sp24lelie_400.jpg

http://davesplaybook.com/Articles/Ed_Reed.jpg

Of course you would try and piss on Shanahan again. That's so YOU. What, no pictures of Mike holding up super bowl trophies? At least you could balance out your bias because without him, Denver's the laughing stock of the NFL. The ultimate losers when it comes to big games.

Don't let accuracy stand in your way of ****ting on Shanahan. We all know that was your MO all along.

bpc
03-28-2010, 10:46 PM
McDaniel's team first philosophy is not going to sit well with every player in today's NFL. Nor is his every job is up for grabs, everyone is expendable philosophy.

Players who think that they are bigger than the team aren't going to get on well with him. Cutler was a prime example of this, Cutler bought into his own hype -that's where the problem started.

Was this before or after he returned immediately from the pro bowl to Denver, post 2008 season, to specifically put in extra time with McDaniels getting a jumpstart learning the offense while all the other players were lounging on beaches or hanging in their hometowns for the offseason? You see, because I fail to realize where his me-first attitude is showing here. Sounds like the committment it takes to succeed in the national football league to me. It also sounds like you don't know what the hell you're talking about. Chalk that up to 95% of the McD apologists around here tho'.

strafen
03-28-2010, 10:55 PM
(Copy and paste from BPC's quote)

Originally Posted by baja http://www.orangemane.com/BB/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=2789304#post2789304)
I will be interested to see how you handle yourself after it becomes crystal clear to you we have a stellar coach in Josh McDaniels.

^
I'll be waiting long and hard for that one.
This is why starting 6-0 was the worst thing that could've happened to Mcdaniels.
It's statements like these that prove his 6-0 start was not a good thing.
People were marveled by that.

strafen
03-28-2010, 10:58 PM
Of course you would try and piss on Shanahan again. That's so YOU. What, no pictures of Mike holding up super bowl trophies? At least you could balance out your bias because without him, Denver's the laughing stock of the NFL. The ultimate losers when it comes to big games.

Don't let accuracy stand in your way of ****ting on Shanahan. We all know that was your MO all along.Don't expect the coward to stick around to offer any kind of intelligent reply.
That's as much as you'll get out of him. This is as far as his football acumen goes...

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 11:24 PM
Let me explain it you so you and I can both laugh later this year...
We're not getting any younger. The old worn-out guys we're signing from the FA market is to WIN NOW.
The picks we've squandered may come back to bite us in the ass.
We've failed to addressed important positions at last year's draft.
This upcoming draft may or may not be the same as last year in terms of signing or addressing our needs.

When you put that all together, the decisions to get rid of talent, and the inability to draft good players, you'd better hope McD got it right.
Because if he doesn't, you're looking at a few more years to wait for our draft picks to pan out; perhaps another year or two, while the short-term FA signings you'd hope they be able to produce at a high level as they pass their prime of their careers.

This is a high risk approach. You want to cheer to that kind of philosphy, then more power to you, but at the end of the day, all it matters is we make the play-offs this year. If we don't. Mcd will be on the hot seat sooner than he got Lonnie Paxton signed.

Again, this year will be crucial for McDaniels and for the Broncos. If he doesn't succeed he will have led the biggest debacle in franchise history, and it will leave a mess for the next coach to sort out. It will have once again to start from scratch...

So it's already in your reality that the Broncos will have a losing season? :thumbsup:

Idiots stay idiots.

"Once again" start from scratch? Do you really think we had to start from scratch?

The Lions are starting from scratch. The Browns are starting from scratch.

The Broncos are/were far from it...

like I said, get with reality - but I guess it's already in yours that Broncos lose.

losers stay losers...

Your post is garbage

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 11:29 PM
And the inability to draft good players? So because we've seen what the players have done in their post-rookie seasons right?

You're like a broken record... I'm done with you, you've already proven yourself to be mentally challenged in the same bracket as Crash, Mock, etc.

strafen
03-28-2010, 11:35 PM
So it's already in your reality that the Broncos will have a losing season? :thumbsup:

Idiots stay idiots.

"Once again" start from scratch? Do you really think we had to start from scratch?

The Lions are starting from scratch. The Browns are starting from scratch.

The Broncos are/were far from it...

like I said, get with reality - but I guess it's already in yours that Broncos lose.

losers stay losers...

Your post is garbageI didn't say we're going to have a losing season, did I?
You can call me names, you can say my posts are garbage, we'll see who's right.
We need to make the play-offs, not just have a winning season. Nothing short of that will cut it. The only idiot is McDaniels. I stand by that until proven otherwise...
I just don't feel what McD is doing will work.
Could I be wrong?
Sure, that's why we need to wait and see.

Until then, keep insulting and bench pressing your way to 145lbs :thumbsup:

strafen
03-28-2010, 11:39 PM
And the inability to draft good players? So because we've seen what the players have done in their post-rookie seasons right?

You're like a broken record... I'm done with you, you've already proven yourself to be mentally challenged in the same bracket as Crash, Mock, etc.

Again, did you see anything from their playing last year that encourages you to think otherwise?
I thought so. Neither did I...
People here are already lobbying for a RB in the draft. That's pretty much all you need to know how they feel about Moreno.
A lot of people don't think he'll be able to get more than 1000 yards!
Wake up!

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 11:49 PM
I didn't say we're going to have a losing season, did I?
You can call me names, you can say my posts are garbage, we'll see who's right.
We need to make the play-offs, not just have a winning season. Nothing short of that will cut it. The only idiot is McDaniels. I stand by that until proven otherwise...
I just don't feel what McD is doing will work.
Could I be wrong?
Sure, that's why we need to wait and see.

Until then, keep insulting and bench pressing your way to 145lbs :thumbsup:

Like I said you're mentally challenged.

It's funny you love using retard logic... so because my past (3-4 years ago) is indicative of now, as you seem to love using that logic for everything (rookies, coaches, etc) and combined with the fact you love talking about my body + talking about cock - I guess every man have tiny penises because that's how we looked when we came out of our mothers wombs.

Until proven otherwise? :rofl:

Because going 8-8 is being an idiot for a 1st year NFL head coach that was damn near the youngest ever...

:rofl:

Popps
03-28-2010, 11:51 PM
2000 15 Deltha O'Neal Cornerback California BUST [m]
2001 24 Willie Middlebrooks Cornerback Minnesota BUST
2002 19 Ashley Lelie Wide receiver Hawaii BUST
2003 20 George Foster Offensive tackle Georgia BUST
2004 17 D. J. Williams Linebacker Miami (FL) [n] AVERAGE
2005 — No pick — — [o]
2006 11 Jay Cutler Quarterback Vanderbilt [p] LOSER
2007 17 Jarvis Moss Defensive end Florida [q]BUST
2008 12 Ryan Clady Offensive tackle Boise State STUD

One great fisrt pick since the 2000s began.

No wonder our team has had no foundation for years.

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 11:51 PM
Again, did you see anything from their playing last year that encourages you to think otherwise?
I thought so. Neither did I...
People here are already lobbying for a RB in the draft. That's pretty much all you need to know how they feel about Moreno.
A lot of people don't think he'll be able to get more than 1000 yards!
Wake up!

People have been lobbying for Spiller because he might be BPA and Buckhalter is injury prone - get it straight dumbass. We don't have a home run hitter - that's what people are lobbying for.

We still might get an RB regardless because it's the new NFL fad - keep your RB's legs fresh.

A lot of people have you blocked - WAKE UP.

:spit:

strafen
03-28-2010, 11:53 PM
Like I said you're mentally challenged.

It's funny you love using retard logic... so because my past (3-4 years ago) is indicative of now, as you seem to love using that logic for everything (rookies, coaches, etc) and combined with the fact you love talking about my body + talking about cock - I guess every man have tiny penises because that's how we looked when we came out of our mothers wombs.

Until proven otherwise? :rofl:

Because going 8-8 is being an idiot for a 1st year NFL head coach that was damn near the youngest ever...

:rofl:Adding insults doesn't prove your point.
What's your point?

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 11:53 PM
I didn't say we're going to have a losing season, did I?

you and I can both laugh later this year...

^^^ you're obviously insinuating that the Broncos will lose... LOL

strafen
03-28-2010, 11:57 PM
2000 15 Deltha O'Neal Cornerback California BUST [m]
2001 24 Willie Middlebrooks Cornerback Minnesota BUST
2002 19 Ashley Lelie Wide receiver Hawaii BUST
2003 20 George Foster Offensive tackle Georgia BUST
2004 17 D. J. Williams Linebacker Miami (FL) [n] AVERAGE
2005 — No pick — — [o]
2006 11 Jay Cutler Quarterback Vanderbilt [p] LOSER
2007 17 Jarvis Moss Defensive end Florida [q]BUST
2008 12 Ryan Clady Offensive tackle Boise State STUD

One great fisrt pick since the 2000s began.

No wonder our team has had no foundation for years.

2009 12 Knowshon Moreno Running back Georgia Bust in the making
2009 18 Robert Ayers Linebacker Tennessee Bust material

The MVPlaya
03-28-2010, 11:58 PM
Adding insults doesn't prove your point.
What's your point?

did you completely miss the last part of the post? holy **** - talking with you is LITERALLY like talking with a dumbass/retard/someone below your knowledge level.

It's like a kid trying to argue with his parents on why he should have a kid at 17 years old.

"I'll prove you right when my kid is happy unlike you treated me!"

You've pretty much admitted Shanny failed to build a foundation here.

I know what you're going to say - McDaniels traded it away - that's the obvious because you're a dumbass.

I will not respond until you can actually understand WHY Shanny didn't build a foundation, because the blaming of McDaniels "trading it away" or "getting rid" is obviously pathetic.

We actually have a real defense and defensive scheme now.

Until you understand why Shanny failed to build a foundation - I'm done.

You will forever-be a an illiterate football fan.

strafen
03-28-2010, 11:58 PM
^^^ you're obviously insinuating that the Broncos will lose... LOLDo a couple push-ups for me, buttercup :thumbsup:

strafen
03-29-2010, 12:01 AM
We actually have a real defense and defensive scheme now.

I just deleted all the worthless crap you're spewing out of your mouth, so, this one above in bold caught my eye, and I must ask...
Do we?

Popps
03-29-2010, 12:01 AM
Hey, let's all make a deal... if we go 10 years and only win 1 playoff game, we'll get a new coach.

Fair?

The MVPlaya
03-29-2010, 12:01 AM
Do a couple push-ups for me, buttercup :thumbsup:

I won.

Hilarious!:spit:

:lombardi:

The MVPlaya
03-29-2010, 12:04 AM
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I'll bet you dragster will still respond to me - this guy is a dumbass... I've got to admit I've degraded myself for even talking to this guy.

strafen
03-29-2010, 12:05 AM
Hey, let's all make a deal... if we go 10 years and only win 1 playoff game, we'll get a new coach.

Fair?I think is fair.
We gave Shanny 10 years and one play-off win before we can him, so, to make you all happy, and think Mcd should get the same treatment.
He's already off to a great start...

Mogulseeker
03-29-2010, 12:08 AM
Of course you would try and piss on Shanahan again. That's so YOU. What, no pictures of Mike holding up super bowl trophies? At least you could balance out your bias because without him, Denver's the laughing stock of the NFL. The ultimate losers when it comes to big games.

Don't let accuracy stand in your way of ****ting on Shanahan. We all know that was your MO all along.

I saw a guy wearing a Daryl Gardner Broncos jersey the other day. The thing that made it weird was it was one of the mustard yellow throwbacks.

strafen
03-29-2010, 12:08 AM
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I'll bet you dragster will still respond to me - this guy is a dumbass... I've got to admit I've degraded myself for even talking to this guy.I didn't know how dumb you are, I would bet you wouldn't take a peek.
So, my money is on you'll read this one...

To answer your crying, after reading your posts it makes me realize how much smarter I really am!

Mogulseeker
03-29-2010, 12:09 AM
You know what I think when I read that article?

McDaniels had a spat with a player. It was fixed and he won a Super Bowl with him.

Requiem
03-29-2010, 12:11 AM
I'm glad the quarterback with diabetes is not on our team. And I'm glad we have a smart guy like McDaniels running the team. I like how he is getting rid of turds.

Popps
03-29-2010, 12:14 AM
I'm glad the quarterback with diabetes is not on our team. And I'm glad we have a smart guy like McDaniels running the team. I like how he is getting rid of turds.

http://gameinformer.com/cfs-filesystemfile.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Discussions.Components.Files/31/4503.end_2D00_of_2D00_thread_5F00_do_2D00_not_2D00 _post_2D00_more.jpg

The MVPlaya
03-29-2010, 12:15 AM
You know what I think when I read that article?

McDaniels had a spat with a player. It was fixed and he won a Super Bowl with him.
Someone with some real logic....there is HOPE

ROFL!

The MVPlaya
03-29-2010, 12:16 AM
Now.

http://gameinformer.com/cfs-filesystemfile.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Discussions.Components.Files/31/4503.end_2D00_of_2D00_thread_5F00_do_2D00_not_2D00 _post_2D00_more.jpg

strafen
03-29-2010, 12:16 AM
You know what I think when I read that article?

McDaniels had a spat with a player. It was fixed and he won a Super Bowl with him.I understand that.
Point is...3 weeks!
How selfish is that?
He put himself over the team.
That's fine and I see your point, but that didn't stop in New England, eventhough it may just have been a "single isolated" incident from all the years he's spent in NE.
The guy has just completed a year in the organization and McD already had more spats and squabbles with players than most coaches have their entire career!
We're not talking one TO, or one Pacman, or one Rany Moss here and there on different teams around the NFL, we're talking multiple players from the same team in less than one year.
How can you downplay that, man?
It is what it is, and McD has some issues...

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 12:32 AM
I'm glad the quarterback with diabetes is not on our team. And I'm glad we have a smart guy like McDaniels running the team. I like how he is getting rid of turds.

Yet two years ago if someone had suggested having Kyle Orton as our starting QB instead of Jay Cutler, the reaction would have been merciless... and the idea of Marshall... Hillis... Scheffler...being on the trading block as well would have been incomprehensible. From that vantage point (March '08), none of them looked anything like "turds"....

I'm just hoping that we get "some" value from all the "trading of turds".... we certainly haven't seen much yet... in fact it kinda looks like "turd for turd" at this point in time (or in Cutler's case, 1 turd for 2... perhaps soon to be 3).

strafen
03-29-2010, 12:36 AM
Yet two years ago if someone had suggested having Kyle Orton as our starting QB instead of Jay Cutler, the reaction would have been merciless... and the idea of Marshall... Hillis... Scheffler...being on the trading block as well would have been incomprehensible. From that vantage point (March '08), none of them looked anything like "turds"....

I'm just hoping that we get "some" value from all the "trading of turds".... we certainly haven't seen much yet... in fact it kinda looks like "turd for turd" at this point in time.

Blueflame, you're killing them! lol!!! LOL ^5 :~ohyah!: Hilarious!
ROFL!
No way they can comeback and defend that one, but then again, they will...thinking that you have it all wrong! ;D

This is why I have little respect from the majority of the McD homers here.
They're programmed to defend the guy and make themselves look like jackasses in the process, and they don't even care!
Seriously. Posters like this guy is why I turned against McDaniels.
Unbelievable!!!

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 12:39 AM
Blueflame, you're killing them! lol!!! LOL ^5 Hilarious!

:~ohyah!:

Actually I hope like Hell that McXanders hit a complete and total homerun with #11 this year..... and that they do get/make a good pick with... Seattle's #6 overall if Marshall is traded.

Good value (if the Broncos are gonna trade) is what I want most.... I'm not convinced we got it in the last draft.

strafen
03-29-2010, 12:52 AM
Actually I hope like Hell that McXanders hit a complete and total homerun with #11 this year..... and that they do get/make a good pick with... Seattle's #6 overall if Marshall is traded.

Good value (if the Broncos are gonna trade) is what I want most.... I'm not convinced we got it in the last draft.That's what I hope too.
The problem that I have is the thought of McDaniels drafting someone we really don't need makes me cringe.
Remember Richard Quinn the TE he reached to get?
About Moreno?
We didn't need a RB at #12 and given Moreno's production, a later round RB could've done just fine.
Alphonso Smith?
We needed big guys on defense. The irony of this whole thing is that not only do we have the same exact needs we've had last year at draft time, but even more now when we need to find a center, a guard or two, and we only have 5 freakin' picks to do it...

1st (Bears)
2nd
3rd
4th
6th

Is that laughable or what?
Yup. Five lousy picks, and we better strike gold, or it's going to be a nightmare.

Let's get rid of those turds: Hillis, Scheffler, Marshall, and then try to find replacement from them in the draft, plus, defensive help, and OL players.
Oh wait!
We only have 5 picks!!! :loser:

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 01:22 AM
That's what I hope too.
The problem that I have is the thought of McDaniels drafting someone we really don't need makes me cringe.
Remember Richard Quinn the TE he reached to get?
About Moreno?
We didn't need a RB at #12 and given Moreno's production, a later round RB could've done just fine.
Alphonso Smith?
We needed big guys on defense. The irony of this whole thing is that not only do we have the same exact needs we've had last year at draft time, but even more now when we need to find a center, a guard or two, and we only have 5 freakin' picks to do it...

1st (Bears)
2nd
3rd
4th
6th

Is that laughable or what?
Yup. Five lousy picks, and we better strike gold, or it's going to be a nightmare.

Let's get rid of those turds: Hillis, Scheffler, Marshall, and then try to find replacement from them in the draft, plus, defensive help, and OL players.
Oh wait!
We only have 5 picks!!! :loser:

If the FA acquisitions pan out... and we have a good draft (and any player trades could add to the 5 draft picks)... then maybe we can all relax a bit more.

Florida_Bronco
03-29-2010, 02:30 AM
Yet two years ago if someone had suggested having Kyle Orton as our starting QB instead of Jay Cutler, the reaction would have been merciless... Two years ago we didn't have Jay Cutler lying to the entire fan base and then insulting us when he went to his new team.

Opinions changed accordingly.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 03:20 AM
Two years ago we didn't have Jay Cutler lying to the entire fan base and then insulting us when he went to his new team.

Opinions changed accordingly.

Front office version of the "story"... I believe that the truth lies somewhere in between what McDaniels says and what Cutler said at the time. I don't totally buy into either version.

And my opinion "may have" changed accordingly.....

Meck77
03-29-2010, 03:41 AM
Gone are the days when Wabbit would give us something of substance in the off season.....

chrisp
03-29-2010, 04:37 AM
Gone are the days when Wabbit would give us something of substance in the off season.....

...ah, them was the days... :-)

Without any insider knowledge then this is WITHOUT DOUBT the MOST POINTLESS argument ever becuase no-one can ever know how exactly it went down.

Thing is, though, people assume McDaniels provoked the issues, and talk about it as if that's the only possible explanation for one guy having so many issues with players. Nobody seems to consider the possibility that highly-paid, egotistical players saw a young inexperienced guy come in and thought they'd be able to push him around. Its already been said by others that Shanny let the luntics run the asylum to an extent, and that that was possibly part of the problem, so its not surprising in that case that players wouldn't react well to the new guy..

Anyway, as far as these 'issues' go:

Marshall: his issue was always with money, not McD
Cutler: Definitely issues there, but Cutler wanted McD to promise him he was effectively untradeable, and that was not something McD was prepared to do, nor should he have done IMHO
Sheffler: One suspension and trade rumours, but no hard evidence of what the 'issues' are
Hillis: didn't like him so didn't play him, no evidence of any 'issues', just didn't see the guy as a fit for his system.

At the end of the day, however, we still don't know, nor will we ever know. the only thing we can do is see what happens on the field. Bring on September!!

Dedhed
03-29-2010, 04:51 AM
it's about our current headcoach personality annihilating our franchise...

Therein lies the rub. You have a problem with annihilating an unproductive franchise. Which I don't understand.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 04:57 AM
...ah, them was the days... :-)

Without any insider knowledge then this is WITHOUT DOUBT the MOST POINTLESS argument ever becuase no-one can ever know how exactly it went down.

Thing is, though, people assume McDaniels provoked the issues, and talk about it as if that's the only possible explanation for one guy having so many issues with players. Nobody seems to consider the possibility that highly-paid, egotistical players saw a young inexperienced guy come in and thought they'd be able to push him around. Its already been said by others that Shanny let the luntics run the asylum to an extent, and that that was possibly part of the problem, so its not surprising in that case that players wouldn't react well to the new guy..

Anyway, as far as these 'issues' go:

Marshall: his issue was always with money, not McD
Cutler: Definitely issues there, but Cutler wanted McD to promise him he was effectively untradeable, and that was not something McD was prepared to do, nor should he have done IMHO
Sheffler: One suspension and trade rumours, but no hard evidence of what the 'issues' are
Hillis: didn't like him so didn't play him, no evidence of any 'issues', just didn't see the guy as a fit for his system.

At the end of the day, however, we still don't know, nor will we ever know. the only thing we can do is see what happens on the field. Bring on September!!

Anytime that you have conflicting (contradictory) stories from two sides of an issue... it's pretty safe to presume that the truth just might be "slanted" when listening to one (either) side... and that the truth is probably somewhere between the two perspectives....

ColoradoDarin
03-29-2010, 05:30 AM
I like how it's become all McDaniels' fault with everything!

I mean, it's not like we had the entire team come to the head coach at the end of the year and tell him to bench Marshall and Sheffler for the last game with the playoffs on the line.

And apparently, he's supposed to slam the phone down, put his fingers in his ears and yell "lalalallalalalalalalala" whenever another coach or gm calls to inquire if a player is available.

Hercules Rockefeller
03-29-2010, 06:19 AM
If the FA acquisitions pan out... and we have a good draft (and any player trades could add to the 5 draft picks)... then maybe we can all relax a bit more.

You realize that not knowing a simple fact, like how many draft picks this team has, doesn't help your rep that you don't know what you're talking about most of the time? Especially when you just blindly accept someone else's mistaken assertion, no matter how minor.

Hercules Rockefeller
03-29-2010, 06:25 AM
That's what I hope too.
The problem that I have is the thought of McDaniels drafting someone we really don't need makes me cringe.
Remember Richard Quinn the TE he reached to get?
About Moreno?
We didn't need a RB at #12 and given Moreno's production, a later round RB could've done just fine.
Alphonso Smith?
We needed big guys on defense. The irony of this whole thing is that not only do we have the same exact needs we've had last year at draft time, but even more now when we need to find a center, a guard or two, and we only have 5 freakin' picks to do it...

1st (Bears)
2nd
3rd
4th
6th

Is that laughable or what?
Yup. Five lousy picks, and we better strike gold, or it's going to be a nightmare.

Let's get rid of those turds: Hillis, Scheffler, Marshall, and then try to find replacement from them in the draft, plus, defensive help, and OL players.
Oh wait!
We only have 5 picks!!! :loser:

Yeah, could have used a later pick to replace Moreno's production. What was he, the 1st rookie RB to not be named OROY when leading all rookies in rushing yds, yds from scrimmage, and TDs? He didn't have a great season, but even you morons lose what little credibility you have when you're so over-the-top about his production level last season.

And they have 6 picks, getting minor facts right are your friend, makes you look like you actually follow the team to some degree instead of just b****ing.

oubronco
03-29-2010, 06:44 AM
Gone are the days when Wabbit would give us something of substance in the off season.....

I agree so where is that pesky wabbit

theAPAOps5
03-29-2010, 07:24 AM
Nothing turbulent ever happened under Shanahan because he was so smooth with the media...the comical part of that is that I now hear Mike Klis is McDaniels' media mouth piece.

Oh how wrong that is...

That was in reference to Shanahan's spats with Reeves not his head coaching tenure. Thus the first sentence of my quote that said Shanny's assistant career.

Beantown Bronco
03-29-2010, 07:50 AM
All this mother****er does is antagonize people and post worthless crap.

Definition of irony.

baja
03-29-2010, 07:50 AM
2000 15 Deltha O'Neal Cornerback California BUST [m]
2001 24 Willie Middlebrooks Cornerback Minnesota BUST
2002 19 Ashley Lelie Wide receiver Hawaii BUST
2003 20 George Foster Offensive tackle Georgia BUST
2004 17 D. J. Williams Linebacker Miami (FL) [n] AVERAGE
2005 — No pick — — [o]
2006 11 Jay Cutler Quarterback Vanderbilt [p] LOSER
2007 17 Jarvis Moss Defensive end Florida [q]BUST
2008 12 Ryan Clady Offensive tackle Boise State STUD

One great fisrt pick since the 2000s began.

No wonder our team has had no foundation for years.



This should end all arguments about why the team is where it is and why McD has to clean house and do a ground up rebuild. Shannys free agent list (2000 to 2008) would be nice too Popps. We won 8 games during a complete change over and some of you are bitching, go figure.....

Popps
03-29-2010, 08:01 AM
This should end all arguments about why the team is where it is and why McD has to clean house and do a ground up rebuild. Shannys free agent list (2000 to 2008) would be nice too Popps. We won 8 games during a complete change over and some of you are b****ing, go figure.....

Our free agent list since 2000 is an absolute disaster. It's a joke. It's pretty much...

John Lynch - Good.
Jake Plummer - Good.

The rest of the decade - Bad. (Until you get to Dawkins, etc.)

It would be interesting to look at the list of guys we signed from 2000-2008 and compare them against the guys we signed in 09 to see which group had more quality players. It's probably close.

Drek
03-29-2010, 08:06 AM
How in the hell do you know that?

1. I said "probably" it was an assumption.

2. What else could they have been arguing about? Their preference between Coke and Pepsi? Tom Brady made significant strides shortly after McDaniels took over, including a better deep ball and better pre-snap decision making. Key aspects to his success the last few years. I'm willing to bet they where arguing about football and the changes Brady needed to make to take the next step.

Brady did get better ad better after that, we gotta acknowledge that.

Myself, I think Josh is a stubborn, top-down, authoritative personality. Jury is out on him as a head coach. But he has proven himself a magnificent QB coach and offensive coordinator, can't argue that. He made Matt Cassel a rich man, and it looks like Cassel probably sucks without Josh.





I hand't seen it elsewhere, but you're correct. Brady and Josh had immense, near unparalleled success together after this spat, TB continued to be a great quarterback and Josh became a great coach, a great coordinator.

And come to think of it, we do know something not so great about Tom Brady the person .... wasn't there an article that said Tom's big wedding party and Lonie Paxton's farewell party were the same night, and all the players went to Paxton's party?

Another thing we know about Brady: after this tiff he's had nothing but praise for McDaniels. Effusive praise at times.

Man, what a horrible relationship.

Maybe if Jay Cutler had a bit thicker skin (or didn't have an ulterior motive) he'd still be here and improving as opposed to in Chicago and the same significantly flawed QB he's been his entire NFL career.

Popps
03-29-2010, 08:06 AM
Gone are the days when Wabbit would give us something of substance in the off season.....

So you're saying my elephant on the commode picture isn't substantive?

strafen
03-29-2010, 08:46 AM
Yeah, could have used a later pick to replace Moreno's production. What was he, the 1st rookie RB to not be named OROY when leading all rookies in rushing yds, yds from scrimmage, and TDs? He didn't have a great season, but even you morons lose what little credibility you have when you're so over-the-top about his production level last season.

And they have 6 picks, getting minor facts right are your friend, makes you look like you actually follow the team to some degree instead of just b****ing.First of all...I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings. Are you ok now?
Good.
Now, I was wrong on the 5 picks. We actually have 6 picks. I apologize for having left out the 7th round pick from the list.
And we're going to need evey single one of them, aren't we?

Second...it's got nothing to do with Moreno per-se or an attack on the guy. It's about the important fact that we didn't need a freakin' RB with the #12 pick, I don't care who it was. Understand that?
You want to attack my credibility but you want to justify picking a RB with our #12 pick last year?

strafen
03-29-2010, 08:50 AM
Two years ago we didn't have Jay Cutler lying to the entire fan base and then insulting us when he went to his new team.

Opinions changed accordingly.Florida Bronco, one of the best ever at spinning things to ever post at the mane.
If he doesn't win an argument, he goes for the tie! :~ohyah!:

HAT
03-29-2010, 09:09 AM
and the idea of Marshall... Hillis... Scheffler...being on the trading block as well would have been incomprehensible. From that vantage point (March '08), none of them looked anything like "turds"....




Considering Hillis wasn't on the roster in March of '08 I guess the idea of trading him would've been pretty incomprehensible.

HAT
03-29-2010, 09:17 AM
Now, I was wrong on the 5 picks. We actually have 6 picks. I apologize for having left out the 7th round pick from the list.


And you are further wrong in assuming that by the time the draft is over that Denver will have only made 6 picks.

Tell ya what: If Denver only makes 6 selections in rounds 1-7 of the 2010 NFL draft, I will accept a 6 week ban....on the condition that you accept a week per selection if they have 7 or more. 7 picks=7 weeks, 8 picks=8 weeks, etc.

:contract:

TailgateNut
03-29-2010, 09:22 AM
Maybe he should find god


:yayaya:

strafen
03-29-2010, 09:25 AM
And you are further wrong in assuming that by the time the draft is over that Denver will have only made 6 picks.

Tell ya what: If Denver only makes 6 selections in rounds 1-7 of the 2010 NFL draft, I will accept a 6 week ban....on the condition that you accept a week per selection if they have 7 or more. 7 picks=7 weeks, 8 picks=8 weeks, etc.

:contract:As of right now, we have 6 picks.
If we manage to acquire any more picks between now and draft day, I will be happy...
Why am I wrong?
That's your own assumption.

Lev Vyvanse
03-29-2010, 09:26 AM
Our free agent list since 2000 is an absolute disaster. It's a joke. It's pretty much...

John Lynch - Good.
Jake Plummer - Good.

The rest of the decade - Bad. (Until you get to Dawkins, etc.)

It would be interesting to look at the list of guys we signed from 2000-2008 and compare them against the guys we signed in 09 to see which group had more quality players. It's probably close.

I created this list from a bunch of sources, so I'm sure there are some omissions and mistakes.

2000
DE Lester Archambeau (Atlanta)
G David Diaz-Infante (Philadelphia)
QB Gus Frerotte (Detroit)
DT Bob Kuberski (New England)
CB Jeremy Lincoln (N.Y. Giants)
LB Ricardo McDonald (Chicago)
DE Kavika Pittman (Dallas)
CB Darryl Pounds (Washington)

2001
T Ethan Brooks (Arizona)
FB Tony Carter (New England)
LB Henri Crockett (Atlanta)
T Todd Fordham (Jacksonville)
TE Patrick Hape (Tampa Bay)
WR Eddie Kennison (Chicago)
DT Leon Lett (Dallas)
CB Denard Walker (Tennessee)

2002
DT Lional Dalton (Baltimore)
LB Terry Killens (San Francisco)
S Izell Reese (Dallas)
T Ephraim Salaam (Atlanta)

2003
DT Daryl Gardener (Washington)
G Heath Irwin (St. Louis)
QB Jake Plummer (Arizona)

2004
QB Mike Quinn (Houston)
DE Marco Coleman (Philadelphia)
WR Willie Jackson
TE Jed Weaver (49ers)
S John Lynch(Tampa)
DE Raylee Johnson (Chargers)
DE Luther Elliss (Lions)
Cornell Green (Tampa)
TE O.J. Santiago (Raiders)
TE Byron Chamberlain (Redskins)

2005
LB Ian Gold (Tampa)
TE Stephen Alexander (Lions)
LB Keith Burns (Tampa)
OT Anthony Clement (Arizona)


2006
DE Kenard Lang (Browns)
LB Nate Webster (Bengals)

2007
RB Travis Henry (Titans)
G Montrae Holland (Saints)
TE Daniel Graham (New England)
DT Alvin McKinley (Browns)
WR Brandon Stokley (Colts)

2008
LB Boss Bailey(Lions)
WR Darrell Jackson (49ers)
WR Keary Colbert (Carolina)
RB Michael Pittman (Tampa)
C Casey Wiegmann (KC)
WR Samie Parker (KC)
LB Niko Koutouvides (Seattle)

2009
S Brian Dawkins (Eagles)
LS Lonie Paxton (New England)
WR Jabar Gaffney (New England)
RB Correll Buckhalter (Eagles)
LB Andra Davis (Browns)
S Renaldo Hill (Miami)
DE/LB Darrell Reid (Colts)
CB Andre' Goodman (Miami)
DT Ronnie Fields (49ers)
RB LaMont Jordan (New England)
QB Chris Simms (Tampa)
WR Brandon Lloyd (Chicago)

Br0nc0Buster
03-29-2010, 09:30 AM
I created this list from a bunch of sources, so I'm sure there are some omissions and mistakes.

2000
DE Lester Archambeau (Atlanta)
G David Diaz-Infante (Philadelphia)
QB Gus Frerotte (Detroit)
DT Bob Kuberski (New England)
CB Jeremy Lincoln (N.Y. Giants)
LB Ricardo McDonald (Chicago)
DE Kavika Pittman (Dallas)
CB Darryl Pounds (Washington)

2001
T Ethan Brooks (Arizona)
FB Tony Carter (New England)
LB Henri Crockett (Atlanta)
T Todd Fordham (Jacksonville)
TE Patrick Hape (Tampa Bay)
WR Eddie Kennison (Chicago)
DT Leon Lett (Dallas)
CB Denard Walker (Tennessee)

2002
DT Lional Dalton (Baltimore)
LB Terry Killens (San Francisco)
S Izell Reese (Dallas)
T Ephraim Salaam (Atlanta)

2003
DT Daryl Gardener (Washington)
G Heath Irwin (St. Louis)
QB Jake Plummer (Arizona)

2004
QB Mike Quinn (Houston)
DE Marco Coleman (Philadelphia)
WR Willie Jackson
TE Jed Weaver (49ers)
S John Lynch(Tampa)
DE Raylee Johnson (Chargers)
DE Luther Elliss (Lions)
Cornell Green (Tampa)
TE O.J. Santiago (Raiders)
TE Byron Chamberlain (Redskins)

2005
LB Ian Gold (Tampa)
TE Stephen Alexander (Lions)
LB Keith Burns (Tampa)
OT Anthony Clement (Arizona)


2006
DE Kenard Lang (Browns)
LB Nate Webster (Bengals)

2007
RB Travis Henry (Titans)
G Montrae Holland (Saints)
TE Daniel Graham (New England)
DT Alvin McKinley (Browns)
WR Brandon Stokley (Colts)

2008
LB Boss Bailey(Lions)
WR Darrell Jackson (49ers)
WR Keary Colbert (Carolina)
RB Michael Pittman (Tampa)
C Casey Wiegmann (KC)
WR Samie Parker (KC)
LB Niko Koutouvides (Seattle)

2009
S Brian Dawkins (Eagles)
LS Lonie Paxton (New England)
WR Jabar Gaffney (New England)
RB Correll Buckhalter (Eagles)
LB Andra Davis (Browns)
S Renaldo Hill (Miami)
DE/LB Darrell Reid (Colts)
CB Andre' Goodman (Miami)
DT Ronnie Fields (49ers)
RB LaMont Jordan (New England)
QB Chris Simms (Tampa)
WR Brandon Lloyd (Chicago)

I think the 09 haul beats all the others combined, but Shanny found got a couple gems like Stokely, and Graham, and Lynch

Lev Vyvanse
03-29-2010, 09:33 AM
I think the 09 haul beats all the others combined, but Shanny found got a couple gems like Stokely, and Graham, and Lynch
I'd give 09 a couple more years, but looking at the list I was thinking the same thing.

TailgateNut
03-29-2010, 09:35 AM
I'm glad the quarterback with diabetes is not on our team. And I'm glad we have a smart guy like McDaniels running the team. I like how he is getting rid of turds.

:approve:

bronco militia
03-29-2010, 09:35 AM
I created this list from a bunch of sources, so I'm sure there are some omissions and mistakes.

2000
DE Lester Archambeau (Atlanta)
G David Diaz-Infante (Philadelphia)
QB Gus Frerotte (Detroit)
DT Bob Kuberski (New England)
CB Jeremy Lincoln (N.Y. Giants)
LB Ricardo McDonald (Chicago)
DE Kavika Pittman (Dallas)
CB Darryl Pounds (Washington)

2001
T Ethan Brooks (Arizona)
FB Tony Carter (New England)
LB Henri Crockett (Atlanta)
T Todd Fordham (Jacksonville)
TE Patrick Hape (Tampa Bay)
WR Eddie Kennison (Chicago)
DT Leon Lett (Dallas)
CB Denard Walker (Tennessee)

2002
DT Lional Dalton (Baltimore)
LB Terry Killens (San Francisco)
S Izell Reese (Dallas)
T Ephraim Salaam (Atlanta)

2003
DT Daryl Gardener (Washington)
G Heath Irwin (St. Louis)
QB Jake Plummer (Arizona)

2004
QB Mike Quinn (Houston)
DE Marco Coleman (Philadelphia)
WR Willie Jackson
TE Jed Weaver (49ers)
S John Lynch(Tampa)
DE Raylee Johnson (Chargers)
DE Luther Elliss (Lions)
Cornell Green (Tampa)
TE O.J. Santiago (Raiders)
TE Byron Chamberlain (Redskins)

2005
LB Ian Gold (Tampa)
TE Stephen Alexander (Lions)
LB Keith Burns (Tampa)
OT Anthony Clement (Arizona)


2006
DE Kenard Lang (Browns)
LB Nate Webster (Bengals)

2007
RB Travis Henry (Titans)
G Montrae Holland (Saints)
TE Daniel Graham (New England)
DT Alvin McKinley (Browns)
WR Brandon Stokley (Colts)

2008
LB Boss Bailey(Lions)
WR Darrell Jackson (49ers)
WR Keary Colbert (Carolina)
RB Michael Pittman (Tampa)
C Casey Wiegmann (KC)
WR Samie Parker (KC)
LB Niko Koutouvides (Seattle)

2009
S Brian Dawkins (Eagles)
LS Lonie Paxton (New England)
WR Jabar Gaffney (New England)
RB Correll Buckhalter (Eagles)
LB Andra Davis (Browns)
S Renaldo Hill (Miami)
DE/LB Darrell Reid (Colts)
CB Andre' Goodman (Miami)
DT Ronnie Fields (49ers)
RB LaMont Jordan (New England)
QB Chris Simms (Tampa)
WR Brandon Lloyd (Chicago)

why did you omit the 95-99? you have to take the good with the bad

Lev Vyvanse
03-29-2010, 09:37 AM
why did you omit the 95-99? you have to take the good with the bad

Go back and look at the original post I quoted. I don’t think anyone will try and argue that in the 90’s the Broncos were bad in free agency.

bronco militia
03-29-2010, 09:40 AM
Go back and look at the original post I quoted. I don’t think anyone will try and argue that in the 90’s the Broncos were bad in free agency.

you haven't been here long enough Ha!

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 09:57 AM
I didn't say we're going to have a losing season, did I?


http://i39.tinypic.com/55nsdc.png

Mogulseeker
03-29-2010, 09:58 AM
I though we ended this discussion a couple pages ago?

Mr.Meanie
03-29-2010, 10:05 AM
I think the 09 haul beats all the others combined, but Shanny found got a couple gems like Stokely, and Graham, and Lynch

This

baja
03-29-2010, 10:06 AM
Florida Bronco, one of the best ever at spinning things to ever post at the mane.
If he doesn't win an argument, he goes for the tie! :~ohyah!:

You are like "Mikie" you don't like anything.

Popps
03-29-2010, 10:13 AM
I created this list from a bunch of sources, so I'm sure there are some omissions and mistakes.

2000
DE Lester Archambeau (Atlanta)
G David Diaz-Infante (Philadelphia)
QB Gus Frerotte (Detroit)
DT Bob Kuberski (New England)
CB Jeremy Lincoln (N.Y. Giants)
LB Ricardo McDonald (Chicago)
DE Kavika Pittman (Dallas)
CB Darryl Pounds (Washington)

2001
T Ethan Brooks (Arizona)
FB Tony Carter (New England)
LB Henri Crockett (Atlanta)
T Todd Fordham (Jacksonville)
TE Patrick Hape (Tampa Bay)
WR Eddie Kennison (Chicago)
DT Leon Lett (Dallas)
CB Denard Walker (Tennessee)

2002
DT Lional Dalton (Baltimore)
LB Terry Killens (San Francisco)
S Izell Reese (Dallas)
T Ephraim Salaam (Atlanta)

2003
DT Daryl Gardener (Washington)
G Heath Irwin (St. Louis)
QB Jake Plummer (Arizona)

2004
QB Mike Quinn (Houston)
DE Marco Coleman (Philadelphia)
WR Willie Jackson
TE Jed Weaver (49ers)
S John Lynch(Tampa)
DE Raylee Johnson (Chargers)
DE Luther Elliss (Lions)
Cornell Green (Tampa)
TE O.J. Santiago (Raiders)
TE Byron Chamberlain (Redskins)

2005
LB Ian Gold (Tampa)
TE Stephen Alexander (Lions)
LB Keith Burns (Tampa)
OT Anthony Clement (Arizona)


2006
DE Kenard Lang (Browns)
LB Nate Webster (Bengals)

2007
RB Travis Henry (Titans)
G Montrae Holland (Saints)
TE Daniel Graham (New England)
DT Alvin McKinley (Browns)
WR Brandon Stokley (Colts)

2008
LB Boss Bailey(Lions)
WR Darrell Jackson (49ers)
WR Keary Colbert (Carolina)
RB Michael Pittman (Tampa)
C Casey Wiegmann (KC)
WR Samie Parker (KC)
LB Niko Koutouvides (Seattle)



That is an absolute embarrassment. 2 B-grade (or better) players in 8 seasons.

Add to that, basically 2 quality top draft picks in that same time frame, and you wonder why people are so confused on the issue of a coaching change.

Without question, our 09 free agent crop surpassed the prior 8 seasons. The draft? That's yet to be seen. But, I knew we had been bad in the open market for a long time. I just forgot how bad until I saw this list.

HAT
03-29-2010, 10:15 AM
As of right now, we have 6 picks.
If we manage to acquire any more picks between now and draft day, I will be happy...
Why am I wrong?


My point was that you are bitching about "only" having 6 picks when the odds are that that won't be the case. And by not taking my bet, you are basically saying that you agree that that won't be the case.


Why bitch about something that probably won't happen? Oh yeah, you're you.

Popps
03-29-2010, 10:16 AM
why did you omit the 95-99? you have to take the good with the bad

Before 09, you basically had to go back to the grunge era to find a string of good free agent signings. People aren't judged in the NFL by what they did 10 years ago. They're judged by what they've done lately.

TailgateNut
03-29-2010, 10:17 AM
http://i39.tinypic.com/55nsdc.png



Talk about shoving a sock in his mouth.

Come on dragqueen, everyone would consider 1-15 a LOSING SEASON.

baja
03-29-2010, 10:20 AM
That's impressive only jordan did not shine and even he contributed

Lev Vyvanse
03-29-2010, 10:21 AM
Talk about shoving a sock in his mouth.

Come on dragqueen, everyone would consider 1-15 a LOSING SEASON.

This is right about the time dragqueen deletes the thread.

strafen
03-29-2010, 10:27 AM
Talk about shoving a sock in his mouth.

Come on dragqueen, everyone would consider 1-15 a LOSING SEASON.

Wow, dagmar showing up on my radar once again.The illegal alien got as usual nothing of substance to post but go and attack people.
We can go 1-15. just like nobody predicted we'd start 6-0 last season.
That's why we play the games, to find out.
So, now this thread by the mere presence of dagmar is about to take a ****?
Is it now time to become flame war?
Isn't this how this board operates and love to do?

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 10:27 AM
This is right about the time dragqueen deletes the thread.

Because of the language (the language of being pwned)?

Then creates another 6 and gets banned again?

*Rubs hands in anticipation*

strafen
03-29-2010, 10:29 AM
My point was that you are b****ing about "only" having 6 picks when the odds are that that won't be the case. And by not taking my bet, you are basically saying that you agree that that won't be the case.


Why b**** about something that probably won't happen? Oh yeah, you're you.So you're not that sure either, huh? :thumbsup:
Yeah. We only have 6 picks. Why would I be happy with that?
Will you?
Taking what bet?
I'm saying and agreeing with you that I'll be happy IF we acquired more pics.
What's there to bet about?

HAT
03-29-2010, 10:31 AM
We can go 1-15. just like nobody predicted we'd start 6-0 last season.
That's why we play the games, to find out.


The screenshot that Rusty owned you with says..."Bank it".

TailgateNut
03-29-2010, 10:33 AM
Wow, dagmar showing up on my radar once again.The illegal alien got as usual nothing of substance to post but go and attack people.
We can go 1-15. just like nobody predicted we'd start 6-0 last season.
That's why we play the games, to find out.
So, now this thread by the mere presence of dagmar is about to take a ****?
Is it now time to become flame war?
Isn't this how this board operates and love to do?


Is this how you defend your claim of never saying we were going to have a losing season when you had in fact predicted the Broncos going 1-15.

You ARE FOS, AND a liar!

strafen
03-29-2010, 10:36 AM
The screenshot that Rusty owned you with says..."Bank it".That was on another thread and making a mockery of what was beingtalked about.
You need to take what gaymar says with a grain of salt and see what his agenda is.
He is a misunderstood guy. I'd love for him to show up at the Orangemane Weekend 2010. I think I can talk him into being a different person. Just some good communication to clear things up will be enough.

strafen
03-29-2010, 10:38 AM
Is this how you defend your claim of never saying we were going to have a losing season when you had in fact predicted the Broncos going 1-15.

You ARE FOS, AND a liar!On the context I was talking in this specific thread, I wasn't referring to having a losing season.
Have I said we could go 1-15 on ANOTHER thread?
Yes, I have.
Happy now?

PS: it is amazing how people were actually having a good debate and bringing up good points to the discussion, and it only took one scumbag to bring it all down to the low level some people here are more comfortable and interested in arguing about.
That's just mind boggling.
Feel free to add something meaningful to the debate at hand if you can.

misturanderson
03-29-2010, 10:39 AM
I'm so confused as to why anyone on this board doesn't have dragster on ignore. Can someone explain it to me (and stop quoting him)?

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 10:40 AM
It's like watching a dog chase its tail...

strafen
03-29-2010, 10:43 AM
I'm so confused as to why anyone on this board doesn't have dragster on ignore. Can someone explain it to me (and stop quoting him)?

So what you're saying you agree with douchebags like gaymar?
Is that where your intelect level is at?
Figures...

baja
03-29-2010, 10:44 AM
I'm so confused as to why anyone on this board doesn't have dragster on ignore. Can someone explain it to me (and stop quoting him)?

It's the same oddity as rubber necking at a car accident.

Archer81
03-29-2010, 10:44 AM
Just another manic monday...wish it were sunday...thats my fun day...


:Broncos:

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 10:46 AM
So what you're saying you agree with douchebags like gaymar?
Is that where your intelect level is at?
Figures...

:spit:

TailgateNut
03-29-2010, 10:56 AM
On the context I was talking in this specific thread, I wasn't referring to having a losing season.
Have I said we could go 1-15 on ANOTHER thread?
Yes, I have.
Happy now?

PS: it is amazing how people were actually having a good debate and bringing up good points to the discussion, and it only took one scumbag to bring it all down to the low level some people here are more comfortable and interested in arguing about.
That's just mind boggling.
Feel free to add something meaningful to the debate at hand if you can.

Meaningful to a debate about WHY Tom Brady(PromQueen) and Josh McD had a three week "failure to communicate", if that's actually a fact?

First of all, I have no inside info as to the validity.
Second, I couldn't care less because if it did happen, I would think it was Tom B who was pouting.

In addition, regarding the "scumbag" reference. I would tend to think that you would get plenty of votes.

watermock
03-29-2010, 10:59 AM
2000 15 Deltha O'Neal Cornerback California BUST [m]
2001 24 Willie Middlebrooks Cornerback Minnesota BUST
2002 19 Ashley Lelie Wide receiver Hawaii BUST
2003 20 George Foster Offensive tackle Georgia BUST
2004 17 D. J. Williams Linebacker Miami (FL) [n] AVERAGE
2005 — No pick — — [o]
2006 11 Jay Cutler Quarterback Vanderbilt [p] LOSER
2007 17 Jarvis Moss Defensive end Florida [q]BUST
2008 12 Ryan Clady Offensive tackle Boise State STUD

One great fisrt pick since the 2000s began.

No wonder our team has had no foundation for years.

Heh, the Goodmans produced 2 great drafts in 3 years. The '06 one exceptional, even if you considered Cutler a bust, we got great compensation.

We had 4 picks in the first 60 which are mediocre and got some DL that were replaced.

With AZ emasculated and a weak NFC and AFC west, nything other than 10-6 should be considered fail.

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 11:08 AM
So, I'm gaymar the scumbag illegal alien?

Cooooooooooool.

http://i41.tinypic.com/23qz6a9.jpg

Br0nc0Buster
03-29-2010, 11:11 AM
So, I'm gaymar the scumbag illegal alien?

Cooooooooooool.

http://i41.tinypic.com/23qz6a9.jpg

wait I thought you were dogfart?
Too many names to keep track of

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 11:17 AM
wait I thought you were dogfart?
Too many names to keep track of

Wait, I thought I was rustytrombone?

Popps
03-29-2010, 11:54 AM
H.

http://www.cwrl.utexas.edu/~bump/oxford/miscellaneous/alcoholic.jpg

Florida_Bronco
03-29-2010, 12:46 PM
Front office version of the "story"... I believe that the truth lies somewhere in between what McDaniels says and what Cutler said at the time. I don't totally buy into either version.

We know exactly what happened. Jay Cutler requested a trade as soon as Bates was let go (confirmed by Schefter), went on a media blitz against the organization mere hours after the trade rumors (we watched it happen) refused to meet personally with McD (again, confirmed), left town and refused to return Bowlen's phone calls while publicly requesting a trade again. Then when the news of the trade breaks he is caught on film cheering and high fiving his friends before he does his interview where he claims he never wanted to be traded in the first place.

Anyone with functioning brain cells can look at the situation and see which side was being dishonest.

bronco militia
03-29-2010, 01:22 PM
Before 09, you basically had to go back to the grunge era to find a string of good free agent signings. People aren't judged in the NFL by what they did 10 years ago. They're judged by what they've done lately.




shanny gets dinged because he lasted 14 years?

what a pile of ****

Drek
03-29-2010, 01:34 PM
shanny gets dinged because he lasted 14 years?

what a pile of ****

He gets dinged because his last 10 years weren't very good on the FA front.

I'd like to think that no self respecting Bronco fan fails to appreciate what Shanahan did for this organization in the early years of his tenure. But at some point you've got to take the rose (or in this case orange) tinted glasses off and admit that his last several years here he did not have this team going in the right direction.

Saying that doesn't mean you hate Shanahan or don't appreciate what he did for the Broncos, just that decade old accomplishments aren't reason for continued employment, let alone blind faith.

bronco militia
03-29-2010, 01:39 PM
He gets dinged because his last 10 years weren't very good on the FA front.

I'd like to think that no self respecting Bronco fan fails to appreciate what Shanahan did for this organization in the early years of his tenure. But at some point you've got to take the rose (or in this case orange) tinted glasses off and admit that his last several years here he did not have this team going in the right direction.

Saying that doesn't mean you hate Shanahan or don't appreciate what he did for the Broncos, just that decade old accomplishments aren't reason for continued employment, let alone blind faith.

I'm not blind to his failures in the free agency. Popps pissed me off with his bogus argument Ha!

I can argue that Shanny's early success in free agency is why he's still coaching the NFL.

Paladin
03-29-2010, 01:40 PM
Jezus. 8 pages of BS on a subject not worth talking about....

Glad I didn't read them........

DBroncos4life
03-29-2010, 01:52 PM
Jezus. 8 pages of BS on a subject not worth talking about....

Glad I didn't read them........

Both sides of this are ridiculous. Bringing up the same tired busted ass facts over and over again to debate something that has been talked about to death. The people quoting Drag are almost worse. They KNOW he is just stirring the pot and trying to push their buttons and they let him do it too them.

Ray Finkle
03-29-2010, 01:58 PM
Shanahan and Elway had fights all the time....Theisman and Gibbs were the same...

IT F'N HAPPENS PEOPLE....move on.

Drek
03-29-2010, 02:07 PM
I'm not blind to his failures in the free agency. Popps pissed me off with his bogus argument Ha!

I can argue that Shanny's early success in free agency is why he's still coaching the NFL.

Of course, but thats about as easy an argument to make as there is.

His early success lead to back to back championships. With that on your resume you can basically work until you die in this league, if you so wish.

Now I could argue that Shanahan and the Broncos will both benefit from his departure. The Broncos because they're getting a new HC not so different from a young Mike Shanahan, and Shanahan because being fired and taken the year off has hopefully re-lit the fire in him.

bronco militia
03-29-2010, 02:18 PM
Of course, but thats about as easy an argument to make as there is.

His early success lead to back to back championships. With that on your resume you can basically work until you die in this league, if you so wish.

.

I didn't think it was that obvious...most would point to Elway and TD

strafen
03-29-2010, 02:43 PM
I think the 09 haul beats all the others combined, but Shanny found got a couple gems like Stokely, and Graham, and LynchIf you're talking post SB era, I would have to agree there.
However, when we won SB's XXXII and XXXIII it was on the strength of FA signings that I doubt it would ever be topped; it was a complete well-balanced FA signings on both side of the ball that brought us back-to-back championship:

Gary Zimmerman
Mark Schreleth
Brian Habib
Tony Jones
Ed McCaffrey
Alfred Williams
Darrien Gordon
Neil Smith
Howard Griffith
Glenn Cadrez
Bill Romanowski

This is just to name a few and the ones who made the team we were...

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 02:46 PM
You realize that not knowing a simple fact, like how many draft picks this team has, doesn't help your rep that you don't know what you're talking about most of the time? Especially when you just blindly accept someone else's mistaken assertion, no matter how minor.

A lot can change between now and draft day too, Herc. Any number of trades can affect the number of picks we actually get in a few weeks. So if it's six today, then it could be five... or seven... or whatever number when the day actually comes, your nitpicking notwithstanding.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 02:54 PM
We know exactly what happened. Jay Cutler requested a trade as soon as Bates was let go (confirmed by Schefter), went on a media blitz against the organization mere hours after the trade rumors (we watched it happen) refused to meet personally with McD (again, confirmed), left town and refused to return Bowlen's phone calls while publicly requesting a trade again. Then when the news of the trade breaks he is caught on film cheering and high fiving his friends before he does his interview where he claims he never wanted to be traded in the first place.

Anyone with functioning brain cells can look at the situation and see which side was being dishonest.

No, we do not know "exactly" what happened because we were not there. We know what each side said happened. And the truth... again... is most likely somewhere in the middle.

bpc
03-29-2010, 02:54 PM
I created this list from a bunch of sources, so I'm sure there are some omissions and mistakes.

2000
DE Lester Archambeau (Atlanta)
G David Diaz-Infante (Philadelphia)
QB Gus Frerotte (Detroit)
DT Bob Kuberski (New England)
CB Jeremy Lincoln (N.Y. Giants)
LB Ricardo McDonald (Chicago)
DE Kavika Pittman (Dallas)
CB Darryl Pounds (Washington)

2001
T Ethan Brooks (Arizona)
FB Tony Carter (New England)
LB Henri Crockett (Atlanta)
T Todd Fordham (Jacksonville)
TE Patrick Hape (Tampa Bay)
WR Eddie Kennison (Chicago)
DT Leon Lett (Dallas)
CB Denard Walker (Tennessee)

2002
DT Lional Dalton (Baltimore)
LB Terry Killens (San Francisco)
S Izell Reese (Dallas)
T Ephraim Salaam (Atlanta)

2003
DT Daryl Gardener (Washington)
G Heath Irwin (St. Louis)
QB Jake Plummer (Arizona)

2004
QB Mike Quinn (Houston)
DE Marco Coleman (Philadelphia)
WR Willie Jackson
TE Jed Weaver (49ers)
S John Lynch(Tampa)
DE Raylee Johnson (Chargers)
DE Luther Elliss (Lions)
Cornell Green (Tampa)
TE O.J. Santiago (Raiders)
TE Byron Chamberlain (Redskins)

2005
LB Ian Gold (Tampa)
TE Stephen Alexander (Lions)
LB Keith Burns (Tampa)
OT Anthony Clement (Arizona)


2006
DE Kenard Lang (Browns)
LB Nate Webster (Bengals)

2007
RB Travis Henry (Titans)
G Montrae Holland (Saints)
TE Daniel Graham (New England)
DT Alvin McKinley (Browns)
WR Brandon Stokley (Colts)

2008
LB Boss Bailey(Lions)
WR Darrell Jackson (49ers)
WR Keary Colbert (Carolina)
RB Michael Pittman (Tampa)
C Casey Wiegmann (KC)
WR Samie Parker (KC)
LB Niko Koutouvides (Seattle)

2009
S Brian Dawkins (Eagles)
LS Lonie Paxton (New England)
WR Jabar Gaffney (New England)
RB Correll Buckhalter (Eagles)
LB Andra Davis (Browns)
S Renaldo Hill (Miami)
DE/LB Darrell Reid (Colts)
CB Andre' Goodman (Miami)
DT Ronnie Fields (49ers)
RB LaMont Jordan (New England)
QB Chris Simms (Tampa)
WR Brandon Lloyd (Chicago)

Interesting list. Mike Shanahan still led the Broncos to an 85-59 record over all those terrible years, winning at a 60% clip.

I don't expect people to appreciate that but it does show how spoiled we are as fans. I wonder how many teams would sign up for guaranteed winning?

Popps
03-29-2010, 02:56 PM
The 90s were awesome, weren't they?

Anyhoo... back to reality....

bpc
03-29-2010, 03:01 PM
The 90s were awesome, weren't they?

Anyhoo... back to reality....

85-59 in 00's. Wake up?

Hercules Rockefeller
03-29-2010, 03:08 PM
A lot can change between now and draft day too, Herc. Any number of trades can affect the number of picks we actually get in a few weeks. So if it's six today, then it could be five... or seven... or whatever number when the day actually comes, your nitpicking notwithstanding.

Wow, this is a classic even for you.

They have 6 draft picks right now. Saying they have 5, like you did, is incorrect. Claiming they could end up with less between now and draft day as your defense to you not knowing how many picks they have is just mind boggling.

I can't wait to watch Denver execute 20 draft picks next month. What? They don't have that many right now? Well, a lot can change between now and then, so I'll stand by my number.

Hercules Rockefeller
03-29-2010, 03:10 PM
If you're talking post SB era, I would have to agree there.
However, when we won SB's XXXII and XXXIII it was on the strength of FA signings that I doubt it would ever be topped; it was a complete well-balanced FA signings on both side of the ball that brought us back-to-back championship:

Gary Zimmerman
Mark Schreleth
Brian Habib
Tony Jones
Ed McCaffrey
Alfred Williams
Darrien Gordon
Neil Smith
Howard Griffith
Glenn Cadrez
Bill Romanowski

This is just to name a few and the ones who made the team we were...

2 of those guys were acquired through trade, not free agency Superfan.

SouthStndJunkie
03-29-2010, 03:10 PM
If Josh McDaniels replicates the 14 years that Mike Shanahan had in Denver, I will do cartwheels.

Almost 10 wins a year on average, 2 Super Bowls and only 2 losing seasons.

Sign me up.

elsid13
03-29-2010, 03:14 PM
I am sorry, I just don't see how two member of an organization that are mutual dependent on each for success can go 3 weeks without talking. That just ****ing weird. You don't hear about that kinda problems with Bates, Kyle Shanahan, Morris (all the young hot OC right now)

strafen
03-29-2010, 03:14 PM
2 of those guys were acquired through trade, not free agency Superfan.And so were there a couple of our 2009 signings. so what's your point?

Hercules Rockefeller
03-29-2010, 03:16 PM
And so were there a couple of our 2009 signings. so what's your point?

Let's see, you made a list of FA signings that included guys that were traded for and weren't FA signings, one of which was acquired by Wade.

I think most understood the basic point, I'll be much more clear next time Superfan.

Florida_Bronco
03-29-2010, 03:18 PM
No, we do not know "exactly" what happened because we were not there. We know what each side said happened. And the truth... again... is most likely somewhere in the middle.

Except we had the Pinnacle of sports journalism integrity (Schefter) there to give us the non-biased version.

bpc
03-29-2010, 03:21 PM
I am sorry, I just don't see how two member of an organization that are mutual dependent on each for success can go 3 weeks without talking. That just ****ing weird. You don't hear about that kinda problems with Bates, Kyle Shanahan, Morris (all the young hot OC right now)

Oh you didn't hear? McD is King ****. He walks on water, and turns ****ty QB's into wine. He does whatever he likes without regard. Don't you know his record on Madden 06 with the Patriots? He's like undefeated! That's a better job though because then he never has to talk to players or defensive coordinators he doesn't like and his brother can sit in whenever he likes!

elsid13
03-29-2010, 03:23 PM
Except we had the Pinnacle of sports journalism integrity (Schefter) there to give us the non-biased version.

Scheffer never reported about Cutler asking for trade after Bates, that was from Peter King. Who also threw the little unconfirmed snippet about Shanahan wanting to trade Marshall.

tsiguy96
03-29-2010, 03:24 PM
Oh you didn't hear? McD is King ****. He walks on water, and turns ****ty QB's into wine. He does whatever he likes without regard. Don't you know his record on Madden 06 with the Patriots? He's like undefeated! That's a better job though because then he never has to talk to players or defensive coordinators he doesn't like and his brother can sit in whenever he likes!

dont you get tired of this?

elsid13
03-29-2010, 03:25 PM
Just to throw a log on the fire, maybe it things like this that lead Pioli to state that McDaniels wasn't ready to be a head coach.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 03:29 PM
Wow, this is a classic even for you.

They have 6 draft picks right now. Saying they have 5, like you did, is incorrect. Claiming they could end up with less between now and draft day as your defense to you not knowing how many picks they have is just mind boggling.

I can't wait to watch Denver execute 20 draft picks next month. What? They don't have that many right now? Well, a lot can change between now and then, so I'll stand by my number.

Um... "I" didn't say they have 5 now... all I did was fail to correct another poster because I'm not into nitpicking. Furthermore, it's a fact that a Marshall trade would presumably add one more pick to the total (and a Scheffler trade would perhaps add another, etc.). It's also not impossible for McDaniels to package a couple of our picks in order to move up in the draft... or to add one or two more via a trade down. It happens in the draft all the time.

Lev Vyvanse
03-29-2010, 03:29 PM
Just to throw a log on the fire, maybe it things like this that lead Pioli to state that McDaniels wasn't ready to be a head coach.

If Pioli said McDaniels was ready then I'd be worried. That guy is full of fail.

baja
03-29-2010, 03:33 PM
85-59 in 00's. Wake up?

One playoff win and many many embarrassing losses.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 03:33 PM
Except we had the Pinnacle of sports journalism integrity (Schefter) there to give us the non-biased version.

Being there is the only way to be absolutely certain of what happened in a "he said; no he said" situation like McDaniels/Cutler... where the versions of events wildly differ.

Schefter had his "take" on what happened; you have yours... but no one who wasn't actually there really knows "exactly" what happened. We speculate, but that's all it is. Speculation.

strafen
03-29-2010, 03:34 PM
Um... "I" didn't say they have 5 now... all I did was fail to correct another poster because I'm not into nitpicking. Furthermore, it's a fact that a Marshall trade would presumably add one more pick to the total (and a Scheffler trade would perhaps add another, etc.). It's also not impossible for McDaniels to package a couple of our picks in order to move up in the draft... or to add one or two more via a trade down. It happens in the draft all the time.Rather than once in a while say I'm wrong, or you're right, they instead try to nitpick any little insignicant BS they can find to make a huge argument out of it...
That's classic! :~ohyah!:

Hercules Rockefeller
03-29-2010, 03:35 PM
Um... "I" didn't say they have 5 now... all I did was fail to correct another poster because I'm not into nitpicking. Furthermore, it's a fact that a Marshall trade would presumably add one more pick to the total (and a Scheffler trade would perhaps add another, etc.). It's also not impossible for McDaniels to package a couple of our picks in order to move up in the draft... or to add one or two more via a trade down. It happens in the draft all the time.

Uh huh, you "failed to correct" him because you don't nitpick.

If the FA acquisitions pan out... and we have a good draft (and any player trades could add to the 5 draft picks)... then maybe we can all relax a bit more.

But you agreed with the assertion they only had 5 picks. Of course if you actully knew the correct total, you wouldn't have repeated what he said and actually included the correct number in your post without pointing it out. Do you always repeat things that you know are wrong, just so you're not seen as nit picking?

Next excuse Mod for why you didn't know how many picks they had?

strafen
03-29-2010, 03:36 PM
Let's see, you made a list of FA signings that included guys that were traded for and weren't FA signings, one of which was acquired by Wade.

I think most understood the basic point, I'll be much more clear next time Superfan.Again, what's your point?
McD has a couple of FA signings from Shanahan.
How's that relevant?
Both McDaniels and Shanahan had veto power to get rid of those guys if they felt wouldn't help the team regardless of who signed them...

baja
03-29-2010, 03:36 PM
I am sorry, I just don't see how two member of an organization that are mutual dependent on each for success can go 3 weeks without talking. That just ****ing weird. You don't hear about that kinda problems with Bates, Kyle Shanahan, Morris (all the young hot OC right now)

Vince Lombardi is generally considered the best coach ever do you think he ever had a player pissed off at him?

DBroncos4life
03-29-2010, 03:37 PM
One playoff win and many many embarrassing losses.

How many of those playoff losses came against the super bowl winning teams?

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 03:38 PM
Uh huh, you "failed to correct" him because you don't nitpick.



But you agreed with the assertion they only had 5 picks. Of course if you actully knew the correct total, you wouldn't have repeated what he said and actually included the correct number in your post without pointing it out. Do you always repeat things that you know are wrong, just so you're not seen as nit picking?

Next excuse Mod for why you didn't know how many picks they had?

Who gives a sh*t, Herc? (no one). It's a highly changeable number and doesn't matter an iota at this point in time. It will matter on draft day.

strafen
03-29-2010, 03:39 PM
Uh huh, you "failed to correct" him because you don't nitpick.



But you agreed with the assertion they only had 5 picks. Of course if you actully knew the correct total, you wouldn't have repeated what he said and actually included the correct number in your post without pointing it out. Do you always repeat things that you know are wrong, just so you're not seen as nit picking?

Next excuse Mod for why you didn't know how many picks they had?Does it really matter?
5 picks 6 picks?
The fact is the pick I failed to include was the 7th round pick. Wow. How can I exclude such an important pick that could make or break the team, huh?
Get a grip, man!
It is nitpicking. You want to make a big deal out of the exclusion of our 7th round?
That's pathetic!

elsid13
03-29-2010, 03:40 PM
Vince Lombardi is generally considered the best coach ever do you think he ever had a player pissed off at him?

interest you bring that up. From yahoo today about McDaniels.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/McDaniels-mercurial-nature-goes-back-to-Brady-d;_ylt=Ah6IWdrten5dqc3GD.WK6TJDubYF?urn=nfl,230658

Despite his lifetime adherence to an almost military level of discipline, Vince Lombardi understood that different players must be treated differently, and that quarterbacks are a different breed of cat. Early in their time together in Green Bay, Lombardi let Bart Starr have an earful over an interception that he thought Starr was responsible for. Starr corrected the coach, telling him that the ball was tipped, and let him know what he could do with that earful. It was the last time Lombardi raised his voice to Starr. Quarterback and coach went on to win five NFL championships and two Super Bowls together.

Current Denver Broncos head coach Josh McDaniels, who fancies himself quite the disciplinarian, emerged from the Bill Belichick school with the idea that all players must be held to the same standards at all times, under any circumstances. This notion led to McDaniels going through personnel in his first year in Denver like a bull in a China shop. From jettisoning Jay Cutler(notes), to dumping the zone blocking that had been a Denver staple for over two decades, to benching Brandon Marshall(notes) because he was too hurt to play (as we mentioned then, this was a slightly redundant gesture), McDaniels showed that he was not a negotiator. You either did things his way, or you were eradicated.

Lest you think that McDaniels went that way only when he had the power as head coach of a team ... well, think again. Courtesy of PFT, here's an interesting story from Mike Klis and Lindsay H. Jones of the Denver Post. In 2005, McDaniels' first season as New England's offensive coordinator, he and Tom Brady(notes) once went three weeks without speaking to each other. The two obviously made their peace, especially in the 2007 season when Brady had perhaps the single best quarterback season of all time, but at what point does McDaniels' "no matter what" approach to player relations cost him? It's understandable if Belichick wants to put Brady under this thumb to whatever degree he can -- as a three-time Super Bowl-winning coach and one of the best defensive coordinators of all time, he's earned the credibility.

"He comes from New England seed," team owner Pat Bowlen said of McDaniels. "He uses a lot of the experience he had there. And that doesn't bother me. He wants people to toe the line. He expects his coaches to be working hard. It's not like you have a veteran coach in there who's comfortable with his position and happy with all his staff. You've got a young coach trying to make his mark."

And that continues to be the question with McDaniels. What's more important to him -- winning, or making his mark? The Brady story indicates that the question goes back further than we may have imagined. Will he learn what Lombardi learned in time?"

Beside being pissed off and not talking to each other when your job depends on it is complete different.

tsiguy96
03-29-2010, 03:44 PM
interest you bring that up. From yahoo today about McDaniels.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/McDaniels-mercurial-nature-goes-back-to-Brady-d;_ylt=Ah6IWdrten5dqc3GD.WK6TJDubYF?urn=nfl,230658

Despite his lifetime adherence to an almost military level of discipline, Vince Lombardi understood that different players must be treated differently, and that quarterbacks are a different breed of cat. Early in their time together in Green Bay, Lombardi let Bart Starr have an earful over an interception that he thought Starr was responsible for. Starr corrected the coach, telling him that the ball was tipped, and let him know what he could do with that earful. It was the last time Lombardi raised his voice to Starr. Quarterback and coach went on to win five NFL championships and two Super Bowls together.

Current Denver Broncos head coach Josh McDaniels, who fancies himself quite the disciplinarian, emerged from the Bill Belichick school with the idea that all players must be held to the same standards at all times, under any circumstances. This notion led to McDaniels going through personnel in his first year in Denver like a bull in a China shop. From jettisoning Jay Cutler(notes), to dumping the zone blocking that had been a Denver staple for over two decades, to benching Brandon Marshall(notes) because he was too hurt to play (as we mentioned then, this was a slightly redundant gesture), McDaniels showed that he was not a negotiator. You either did things his way, or you were eradicated.

Lest you think that McDaniels went that way only when he had the power as head coach of a team ... well, think again. Courtesy of PFT, here's an interesting story from Mike Klis and Lindsay H. Jones of the Denver Post. In 2005, McDaniels' first season as New England's offensive coordinator, he and Tom Brady(notes) once went three weeks without speaking to each other. The two obviously made their peace, especially in the 2007 season when Brady had perhaps the single best quarterback season of all time, but at what point does McDaniels' "no matter what" approach to player relations cost him? It's understandable if Belichick wants to put Brady under this thumb to whatever degree he can -- as a three-time Super Bowl-winning coach and one of the best defensive coordinators of all time, he's earned the credibility.

"He comes from New England seed," team owner Pat Bowlen said of McDaniels. "He uses a lot of the experience he had there. And that doesn't bother me. He wants people to toe the line. He expects his coaches to be working hard. It's not like you have a veteran coach in there who's comfortable with his position and happy with all his staff. You've got a young coach trying to make his mark."

And that continues to be the question with McDaniels. What's more important to him -- winning, or making his mark? The Brady story indicates that the question goes back further than we may have imagined. Will he learn what Lombardi learned in time?"

Beside being pissed off and not talking to each other when your job depends on it is complete different.


omg! evidence taht mcdaniels is the worst coach in the NFL!

what do we do? i got an idea....convince bronco fans that mcdaniels is the worst coach in the league, then we will....(finish this sentence)

baja
03-29-2010, 03:54 PM
When I look at the two players in question (Cutler & Marshall) it is clear to me they were the ones out of line not McD. Could he have found a way to bring them around? Maybe. I still think Marshall is about the money not Mcd's personality.

The MVPlaya
03-29-2010, 03:55 PM
How many of those playoff losses came against the super bowl winning teams?

2 out of 4

lol I don't think that's an excuse to lose - if it is that's a pretty poor/losing mentality. It isn't ok to lose to a team just because they went on to win the Super Bowl.

If it eases you that we lost to a team who won the super bowl, then I see nothing but fail written all over you.

Do you think the Vikings are sitting at home telling themselves, it's ok that we lost to a team that won the super bowl? Do you think Childress is getting a pass for losing to a team who won the Super Bowl?

Make no mistake though - being one game away from the Super Bowl was tougher than blue balls with your favorite celebrity - but I'm not hating on Shanny for that season.

DBroncos4life
03-29-2010, 03:55 PM
omg! evidence taht mcdaniels is the worst coach in the NFL!

what do we do? i got an idea....convince bronco fans that mcdaniels is the worst coach in the league, then we will....(finish this sentence)

That is far from the case. The issue of how McD handles problems or players is a legit concern whether you and other posters want to admit. I'm very concerned about how bad things are handled in house. This season it was the worst display of keeping things from being leaked I have ever seen from the Denver Broncos ran FO. There are more things to deal with then just X's and O's for a HC to be good at. Right now McD has room to grow as a HC in public relations. Lucky for us he is very young so hopefully he can change some of the ways he handles things.

tsiguy96
03-29-2010, 03:57 PM
That is far from the case. The issue of how McD handles problems or players is a legit concern whether you and other posters want to admit. I'm very concerned about how bad things are handled in house. This season it was the worst display of keeping things from being leaked I have ever seen from the Denver Broncos ran FO. There are more things to deal with then just X's and O's for a HC to be good at. Right now McD has room to grow as a HC in public relations. Lucky for us he is very young so hopefully he can change some of the ways he handles things.

i wouldnt be very concerned, it may or may not be a problem, but he gets more than one year to develop and learn how to properly cater to some of these guys fragile egos (and yes some do have them).

hes not great at it now, some of it should be handled in house, but like you said, you cant write him off during his first year on the job.

elsid13
03-29-2010, 04:03 PM
omg! evidence taht mcdaniels is the worst coach in the NFL!

what do we do? i got an idea....convince bronco fans that mcdaniels is the worst coach in the league, then we will....(finish this sentence)

I am not saying that he worse coach in the NFL, just that he need to mature into his leadership position and learn when to be a hard ass and when to balance that out. Acting like high school coach isn't the way to win in the NFL.

bpc
03-29-2010, 04:10 PM
That is far from the case. The issue of how McD handles problems or players is a legit concern whether you and other posters want to admit. I'm very concerned about how bad things are handled in house. This season it was the worst display of keeping things from being leaked I have ever seen from the Denver Broncos ran FO. There are more things to deal with then just X's and O's for a HC to be good at. Right now McD has room to grow as a HC in public relations. Lucky for us he is very young so hopefully he can change some of the ways he handles things.

If McD doesn't like you, he'll stare at you, and ignore you straight. Works with children all the time.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 04:18 PM
When I look at the two players in question (Cutler & Marshall) it is clear to me they were the ones out of line not McD. Could he have found a way to bring them around? Maybe. I still think Marshall is about the money not Mcd's personality.

When I look at the situation, it seems logical that every individual involved played some role and thus bears some responsibility for the results. I do believe McDaniels could benefit from more experience/maturity and a fine-tuning of his "people skills". And maybe keeping issues "in house" rather than playing them out in the media...

In a sport where a freak accident on any given down could prematurely end his season (or even his career), I don't blame Marshall a bit for wanting to be paid. He plays like a top-10 WR and should be paid like one.

HAT
03-29-2010, 04:25 PM
You realize that not knowing a simple fact, like how many draft picks this team has, doesn't help your rep that you don't know what you're talking about most of the time? Especially when you just blindly accept someone else's mistaken assertion, no matter how minor.


A lot can change between now and draft day too, Herc. Any number of trades can affect the number of picks we actually get in a few weeks. So if it's six today, then it could be five... or seven... or whatever number when the day actually comes, your nitpicking notwithstanding.

Whether or not the amount of draft picks is nitpicking....Herc's main point is still valid. You really do come off as not knowing what you are talking about most of the time.

and the idea of Marshall... Hillis... Scheffler...being on the trading block as well would have been incomprehensible. From that vantage point (March '08),

Considering Hillis wasn't on the roster in March of '08 I guess the idea of trading him would've been pretty incomprehensible.

Is that nitpicking?

DBroncos4life
03-29-2010, 04:28 PM
i wouldnt be very concerned, it may or may not be a problem, but he gets more than one year to develop and learn how to properly cater to some of these guys fragile egos (and yes some do have them).

hes not great at it now, some of it should be handled in house, but like you said, you cant write him off during his first year on the job.

I know you won't be concerned. You seem to down play every bad event over the last year involving the FO which consists of more then just McD. The Cutler trade rumor was handled wrong and how the Marshall suspension right before our biggest game of the year was very wrong as well.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 04:31 PM
Whether or not the amount of draft picks is nitpicking....Herc's main point is still valid. You really do come off as not knowing what you are talking about most of the time.





Is that nitpicking?

I don't care, HAT.

My bad. Hillis was a rookie in the '08 season... and a fairly impressive one at that. Better? :pfbbt:

Dagmar
03-29-2010, 04:36 PM
http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0805/retards-reatrd-they-are-everywhere-lol-owned-infinity-pwned-demotivational-poster-1211381319.jpg

GreatBronco16
03-29-2010, 04:41 PM
McDaniels, Brady once went three weeks without talking in New England....


http://everestwu.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/oh_noes.jpg

colonelbeef
03-29-2010, 04:48 PM
2 out of 4

lol I don't think that's an excuse to lose - if it is that's a pretty poor/losing mentality. It isn't ok to lose to a team just because they went on to win the Super Bowl.

If it eases you that we lost to a team who won the super bowl, then I see nothing but fail written all over you.

Do you think the Vikings are sitting at home telling themselves, it's ok that we lost to a team that won the super bowl? Do you think Childress is getting a pass for losing to a team who won the Super Bowl?

Make no mistake though - being one game away from the Super Bowl was tougher than blue balls with your favorite celebrity - but I'm not hating on Shanny for that season.

Youre right, the Broncos should have won at least 3 more superbowls and mowed down the Manning led Colts and Polamalu Steelers during that period after having lost the superstar QB, RB, WRs, and o-line from the championship teams, just like the Steelers continued to win championships after Bradshaw, Franco, and Swann left, or the Cowboys continued to dominate after Aikman, Smith, and Irvin left.... oh wait...

they went through much worse transitional periods than the Broncos ever did and actually sucked for long periods, I totally forgot. What Shanahan managed after that roster turnover and the freakishly unfortunate Davis injury was amazing to say the least.

Just because some of you spoiled tards are blind and cannot see what Mike Shanahan was trying to do (rebuild the roster on the fly without benefit of totally bottoming out) doesn't make it any less admirable.

You people are hilarious

Br0nc0Buster
03-29-2010, 04:50 PM
Youre right, the Broncos should have won at least 3 more superbowls and mowed down the Manning led Colts and Polamalu Steelers during that period after having lost the superstar QB, RB, WRs, and o-line from the championship teams, just like the Steelers continued to win championships after Bradshaw, Franco, and Swann left, or the Cowboys continued to dominate after Aikman, Smith, and Irvin left.... oh wait...

they went through much worse transitional periods than the Broncos ever did and actually sucked for long periods, I totally forgot. What Shanahan managed after that roster turnover and the freakishly unfortunate Davis injury was amazing to say the least.

Just because some of you spoiled tards are blind and cannot see what Mike Shanahan was trying to do (rebuild the roster on the fly without benefit of totally bottoming out) doesn't make it any less admirable.

You people are hilarious

check out his FA signings and recent draft picks though
he was doing a poor job of acquiring championship caliber talent

good coach, terrible GM on the defensive side
that is what got him canned

The MVPlaya
03-29-2010, 05:05 PM
Youre right, the Broncos should have won at least 3 more superbowls and mowed down the Manning led Colts and Polamalu Steelers during that period after having lost the superstar QB, RB, WRs, and o-line from the championship teams, just like the Steelers continued to win championships after Bradshaw, Franco, and Swann left, or the Cowboys continued to dominate after Aikman, Smith, and Irvin left.... oh wait...

they went through much worse transitional periods than the Broncos ever did and actually sucked for long periods, I totally forgot. What Shanahan managed after that roster turnover and the freakishly unfortunate Davis injury was amazing to say the least.

Just because some of you spoiled tards are blind and cannot see what Mike Shanahan was trying to do (rebuild the roster on the fly without benefit of totally bottoming out) doesn't make it any less admirable.

You people are hilarious

lol when the Broncos lost to the Colts they didn't go on to win a SB. The two teams that went on were the Steelers (which I said was a respectable season, especially with Jake Plummer LMAO) and the Ravens which was a WILD CARD game, meaning Ravens used Broncos as momentum to build up to the SB...

You are hilarious.

1 playoff win in 10 years ... if 10 years is not a good enough period to evaluate what a head coach has done, you are living in the ultra slow lane.

tsiguy96
03-29-2010, 05:09 PM
I know you won't be concerned. You seem to down play every bad event over the last year involving the FO which consists of more then just McD. The Cutler trade rumor was handled wrong and how the Marshall suspension right before our biggest game of the year was very wrong as well.

marshall told the coach he couldnt play, mcdaniels didnt believe it and benched him (redundant he wasnt going to play anyway).

clearly he needs to work on the whole media thing, but to act like hes already lost the team while he clearly continues to improve it is kinda dumb.

Mr.Meanie
03-29-2010, 05:10 PM
This notion led to McDaniels going through personnel in his first year in Denver like a bull in a China shop.

um...other than Cutler and the 20+ scrubs that never caught on with another team, what personnell did he go through "like a bull in a China shop"?

HAT
03-29-2010, 05:15 PM
Just because some of you spoiled tards are blind and cannot see what Mike Shanahan was trying to do (rebuild the roster on the fly without benefit of totally bottoming out) doesn't make it any less admirable.


You're right about that. It was 'admirable'. However, admirable is not championship caliber & he got deservedly canned.

There is a reason coaches rarely guide teams to championships once they've been ingrained for over a decade. You know why that is? Because admirable becomes acceptable.

There are a very few exceptions but years 3-6 of a coaches tenure tend to be the money years.

Popps
03-29-2010, 05:18 PM
Anyone win yet?

We still talking about the 90s?

You guys should check out the new Toad the Wet Sprocket CD. It's bitchin'.

DBroncos4life
03-29-2010, 05:19 PM
marshall told the coach he couldnt play, mcdaniels didnt believe it and benched him (redundant he wasnt going to play anyway).

clearly he needs to work on the whole media thing, but to act like hes already lost the team while he clearly continues to improve it is kinda dumb.

That is not what happened. Players wanted him benched. Then it was leaked Williams, Bailey and Dawkins all went to McD to have Marshall benched.

Blueflame
03-29-2010, 05:19 PM
marshall told the coach he couldnt play, mcdaniels didnt believe it and benched him (redundant he wasnt going to play anyway).

clearly he needs to work on the whole media thing, but to act like hes already lost the team while he clearly continues to improve it is kinda dumb.

It would have been far better if McDaniels had kept things "in house"... between player and coach... rather than going to the media. His method served to do nothing other than add controversy and possibly make other teams think maybe they can get a bargain basement price on Marshall. (it's in the Broncos' best interests to get as much compensation as possible for him, after all).

Popps
03-29-2010, 05:20 PM
http://neatorama.cachefly.net/images/2006-11/elephant-poop-catcher.jpg

Popps
03-29-2010, 05:27 PM
http://www.freshyounginsight.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/travis-henry1.gif

Ahhh.. the good old days.

ZachKC
03-29-2010, 05:32 PM
ive got a good idea. be sure to whine at us about it. what do we know, we are just stupid fans who like to enjoy following the team and the game of football. shame on us for being so dense that we cant spit the same load of **** out constantly about why mcdaniels is the worst coach of all time.

Hey, tsiguy is mocking someone for whining.

This is fantastic.

HAT
03-29-2010, 05:38 PM
You're right about that. It was 'admirable'. However, admirable is not championship caliber & he got deservedly canned.

There is a reason coaches rarely guide teams to championships once they've been ingrained for over a decade. You know why that is? Because admirable becomes acceptable.

There are a very few exceptions but years 3-6 of a coaches tenure tend to be the money years.

I'm gonna pull a Mock & quote myself only because I couldn't remember where I posted this originally.....To illustrate the above point, a post from November of 2007:

Not going to harp on today's result or even last weeks b/c my point this entire thread has been the bigger picture.

SB Champ. / Coach / years as coach
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

colts / Dungy / 5th
pitt / Cowher / 13th
NE / Bellicheck / 5th
NE / Bellicheck / 4th
TB / Gruden / 1st
NE / Bellicheck / 2nd
Balt / Billick / 2nd
Stl / Dick4meal / 3rd
Den / Shanny / 4th
Den / Shanny / 3rd
GB / Holmgren / 5th
Dal / Switzer / 2nd
SF / Siefert / 6th
Dal / JJ / 5th
Dal / JJ / 4th
Wash / Gibbs / 11th
NYG / Parcells / 8th
SF / Siefert / 1st
SF / Walsh / 10th

(Got tired of searching after 20 years)

Clearly, it's pretty rare for a 10+ year tenured HC to strike gold....just like it is for a first or second year one. Years 3-6 are the money years.

Makes sense if you think about it. 1st & 2nd year coaches are usually inheriting terrible teams and need time to implement their own brand of football, with personell of their choosing & to build continuity. (Sans Siefert/Gruden). Long time HC's (9.10,11 + years) have either burntout, lost their ability to motivate or the game has just flat passed them by.

Let's see if Shanny can strike gold in 2008 (his 14th year). I don't care if they win it all, go 1 and done in the PO's or finish 6-10 again.....2008 needs to be his last year.

Let's update it for current times:

SB Champ. / Coach / years as coach
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
NO / Payton / 3
Pitt / Tomlin / 2
NYG / Coughlin / 4

Drek
03-29-2010, 05:57 PM
interest you bring that up. From yahoo today about McDaniels.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/McDaniels-mercurial-nature-goes-back-to-Brady-d;_ylt=Ah6IWdrten5dqc3GD.WK6TJDubYF?urn=nfl,230658


Awesome way to reference the blogs there champ. Hell of a good show.

I'm awestruck at how so many people on here are either full on ****ing morons or so attached to their own perceptions of reality that they begin to behave in intellectually dishonest manners even with themselves to help protect that fragile little bubble of belief.

How many of you clowns realize the difference between "no player is above the team" and "every player is to be treated 100% identical, like a cog in a machine."?

Because while so many of you are trying to paint McDaniels as the later, he's really just a strong believer in the former.

He gave veterans more time off in camp last year. He's already talked about doing it again this year. So how is that treating guys like cogs in a machine?

He actually sought out the opinions of Dawkins, Champ, and Doom when picking a new defensive coordinator. He then agreed with their recommendation and hired the guy they wanted. He didn't ask every single guy on the defense or whole team who they thought should be DC, just the veteran leaders.

I could go on with examples of where McDaniels has treated players as individuals, but the fact that I have to really underscores just how rife with straw man arguments this entire fan base has become.

Just because McDaniels and a QB who literally pouts and acts like a 5 year old girl who found out daddy didn't get her a pony for her birthday when a pass rusher so much as brushes his foot during a pass didn't speak for 3 weeks McDaniels is some kind of tyrant? Never mind that said QB transformed from a solid game manager into one of the elite passers in the NFL under McDaniels, or that he attributes that transformation almost entirely to McDaniels. Obviously McDaniels was in the wrong there.

Same with how a spoiled brat QB who wanted a new contract and had his agent run the "Disgruntled QB Playbook" in its entirety, the same one said agent used with both Steve McNair and Brett Favre (complete with leaking private team meetings to the press and waging a PR war against the club within the local TV market). I mean ****, what does it take for some of you people? Bus Cook said "At Jay's request I've asked that the Broncos allow me to seek a trade for my client". When Jay sits down at a presser in Chicago? "I never wanted to be traded".

And McDaniels is the disingenuous guy who couldn't get a long with people. Never mind the $30M extension that actually guarantees Cutler over $50M when you consider the optional roster bonuses it forced Chicago to pick up.

The **** some of you people delude yourselves into believing is incredible.

I guess though, never underestimate the innate power of people to act like complete and total ****ing sheep, especially when put around herds of like minded sheep all bleating out the same myopic cries.

watermock
03-29-2010, 06:16 PM
Wow.

Forget the strawman, you need the "Potty Patch".