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View Full Version : John Clayton's take on the Marshall Situation (3/17/10)


Denver724
03-18-2010, 07:17 AM
Marshall update: With the New York Jets unlikely to jump in on a possible Brandon Marshall trade, the Seahawks remain the main team interested in the wideout, but Seattle will most likely wait until the second round of the draft to acquire him.

The Seahawks don't want to surrender a first-round pick. They would like to fill other needs with the No.6 and No.14 picks. The Broncos have the leverage now because they can look for another team to offer a first-rounder. If the first round of the draft passes without a Marshall trade, however, the leverage would shift to the Seahawks or other interested teams.

Rabb
03-18-2010, 07:19 AM
so here is a question, going on this theory and the Tebow thread

IF we traded Marshall for a couple of 2nd round picks to give us extra...would you be upset if we took Tebow and still addressed other needs in that round?

eddie mac
03-18-2010, 07:22 AM
Clayton in talking out of his ass shocker. Broncos have the leverage now and will have throughout this process unless someone comes up with a 1st rd pick tender offer.

Unless they do something horrendously stupid like giving away a top 5 WR for a 2nd rd pick.

There isn't one wideout close to being a No1 WR in this draft.

tsiguy96
03-18-2010, 07:22 AM
we dont need tebow.

anyways, i dont understand how our trade leverage switches to another team because the first round has passed? at that point i make it well known that proper compensation will be needed and a 2nd rounder isnt going to get it done

BMarsh615
03-18-2010, 07:25 AM
It's like ESPN keeps forgetting that the Broncos don't have to trade Brandon Marshall.

Irish Stout
03-18-2010, 07:34 AM
3-13 is an idiot. This is the stupidest thing I've seen since the last time I paid any attention to Clayton.

crush17
03-18-2010, 07:40 AM
The Broncos will KEEP Marshall before settling for 2nd rounders.

Gcver2ver3
03-18-2010, 07:43 AM
It's like ESPN keeps forgetting that the Broncos don't have to trade Brandon Marshall.

this...

Rabb
03-18-2010, 07:48 AM
It's like ESPN keeps forgetting that the Broncos don't have to trade Brandon Marshall.

yes, exactly

ayjackson
03-18-2010, 08:17 AM
The only leverage change here is the leverage the Broncos are gaining in contract negotiations with The Player.

Rabb
03-18-2010, 08:18 AM
The only leverage change here is the leverage the Broncos are gaining in contract negotiations with The Player.

that is a good point too, after nobody offers anything worth looking at and we get past the draft, it's "so Brandon, let's talk market value"

eddie mac
03-18-2010, 08:23 AM
The only leverage change here is the leverage the Broncos are gaining in contract negotiations with The Player.

Exactly.

If even the Seahags had muttered contract numbers it would've been all over the media.

TheChamp24
03-18-2010, 08:23 AM
I laugh at people who think we will have to trade Marshall for 2nd round pick/picks.
We don't have to do anything.

peacepipe
03-18-2010, 08:30 AM
so here is a question, going on this theory and the Tebow thread

IF we traded Marshall for a couple of 2nd round picks to give us extra...would you be upset if we took Tebow and still addressed other needs in that round?yes,Tebow would be a wasted pick anywhere above the 3rd round.

broncofan7
03-18-2010, 08:32 AM
Clayton in talking out of his ass shocker. Broncos have the leverage now and will have throughout this process unless someone comes up with a 1st rd pick tender offer.

Unless they do something horrendously stupid like giving away a top 5 WR for a 2nd rd pick.

There isn't one wideout close to being a No1 WR in this draft.

Cosign.

Dez Bryant = Antonio Bryant.

gyldenlove
03-18-2010, 08:33 AM
Once the draft rolls around the Broncos are holding all the cards, since the deadline for offer sheets will have passed and we can trade Marshall if we please or not since no team can offer a poison pill contract.

Sodak
03-18-2010, 08:47 AM
No to Tebow. I can't stand watching a southpaw at QB. Drives me nuts.

Caligula
03-18-2010, 09:04 AM
Clayton in talking out of his ass shocker. Broncos have the leverage now and will have throughout this process unless someone comes up with a 1st rd pick tender offer.

Unless they do something horrendously stupid like giving away a top 5 WR for a 2nd rd pick.

There isn't one wideout close to being a No1 WR in this draft.

You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

Caligula
03-18-2010, 09:05 AM
Once the draft rolls around the Broncos are holding all the cards, since the deadline for offer sheets will have passed and we can trade Marshall if we please or not since no team can offer a poison pill contract.

Why can't a team offer a poison pill contract?

NFLBRONCO
03-18-2010, 09:06 AM
If Denver is tired BM act I could see them trade BM for less then fans think. BM is a top WR and Denver should get great value but, I'm not very convinced Denver wants him anymore. I can see him shipped for 2nd rounders or players. I don't agree with it myself but, just because they say they will keep him doesn't mean they will. I'm still expecting BM gone by draft day.

Hamrob
03-18-2010, 09:06 AM
McDaniels is too smart to trade Marshall for anything less than 1st round value. Now, that's not to say, that he wouldn't accept a 2nd rounder along with another player for Marshall.

Say, Tatupu and a 2nd...that would do it!

DeuceOfClub
03-18-2010, 09:12 AM
Now after the Seahawks squired Charlie Whitehurst, all they need is a WR.

Caligula
03-18-2010, 09:15 AM
McDaniels is too smart to trade Marshall for anything less than 1st round value. Now, that's not to say, that he wouldn't accept a 2nd rounder along with another player for Marshall.

Say, Tatupu and a 2nd...that would do it!

You mean like he was too smart to spend a 1st round on on Alphonso? or move up to get a blocking TE?

The problem is, McD may know Marshall is worth a 1st round pick, but he doesn't want him in Denver. He's going to agree to the BEST value he can get, THEN (here is the kicker)..THEN... he'll say "thats the most we could get for him"... and try to put the problem off on Marshall not having enough value in the NFL.

Everyone knows that Marshall won't be in Denver next season. Why would any team spend a 1st on him if they can get him for less?

TonyR
03-18-2010, 09:17 AM
...EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

I hate to admit it but I think you're right. I think he gets traded on draft day and that we don't get a current year first round pick. Hopefully we get enough comp to make it palatable.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-18-2010, 09:18 AM
You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

This is complete speculation on your part unless you have some glimpse into McD's mind which im sure you don't. At this point, i expect him to be in a Broncos uniform next year and playing hard (because it does him no good to do anything else). If the broncos trade him for a second rounder, you'll hear me shouting loudest about how dumb it is.

tsiguy96
03-18-2010, 09:18 AM
you guys act like mcdaniels is so stubborn that he will take a grilled cheese for marshall. guess what, hes not dumb, and will do what it takes to win. if that means getting rid of marshall tahts fine, but he WILL get proper compensation or he wont do it.

CEH
03-18-2010, 09:18 AM
Now after the Seahawks squired Charlie Whitehurst, all they need is a WR.

That's my thought as well plus SEA flip flopped with SD in the 2nd so their 2nd will be too low for us

#14 for the best WR available is not out of the question if they want a WR

gyldenlove
03-18-2010, 09:21 AM
Why can't a team offer a poison pill contract?

Because the deadline for offer sheets is a week before the draft, after that only the Broncos are allowed to talk to Marshall.

chex
03-18-2010, 09:21 AM
Moss is on his way out in NE, and they have 3 second round picks this year.....just sayin.

Rabb
03-18-2010, 09:22 AM
You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

sorry, I don't think that's foolish at all...sounds like your opinion is jaded

besides, eddie mac is as smart as they come around here IMO, I value his takes a lot more than the chicken little routine

~Crash~
03-18-2010, 09:22 AM
If Denver is tired BM act I could see them trade BM for less then fans think. BM is a top WR and Denver should get great value but, I'm not very convinced Denver wants him anymore. I can see him shipped for 2nd rounders or players. I don't agree with it myself but, just because they say they will keep him doesn't mean they will. I'm still expecting BM gone by draft day.

thing is you say that like this coach has time to win .:wiggle:

Beantown Bronco
03-18-2010, 09:23 AM
Everyone knows that Marshall won't be in Denver next season. Why would any team spend a 1st on him if they can get him for less?

Just like everyone knew Cutler wasn't going to stay in Denver last year and that there were only two bidders, and they still managed to get two firsts, a third and a starting QB back for him?

SonOfLe-loLang
03-18-2010, 09:24 AM
If there is one thing you can say about McD, he's gotten fair value on trades. The one argument you can make is the alphonso deal, but a 2nd for a first next year is not unprecedented and i still say that Bowlen refused to pay 4 first rounders in two years (especially when it looked like he was going to extend Kuper, Marshall, Dumervil).

SonOfLe-loLang
03-18-2010, 09:24 AM
sorry, I don't think that's foolish at all...sounds like your opinion is jaded

besides, eddie mac is as smart as they come around here IMO, I value his takes a lot more than the chicken little routine

Its just his accent :)

~Crash~
03-18-2010, 09:28 AM
I hate to admit it but I think you're right. I think he gets traded on draft day and that we don't get a current year first round pick. Hopefully we get enough comp to make it palatable.

At what point do you think this coach gets fired ? oh say next year when we are average again . seems to me you can let talent go only so long and not replace it and sooner rather than later it bites you in the ass .

If you think you are going to replace Marshall with a 2nd rounder I got some land to sell you real cheap .

colonelbeef
03-18-2010, 09:28 AM
so here is a question, going on this theory and the Tebow thread

IF we traded Marshall for a couple of 2nd round picks to give us extra...would you be upset if we took Tebow and still addressed other needs in that round?

Why the **** would you want to draft Tim Tebow?

tsiguy96
03-18-2010, 09:29 AM
If there is one thing you can say about McD, he's gotten fair value on trades. The one argument you can make is the alphonso deal, but a 2nd for a first next year is not unprecedented and i still say that Bowlen refused to pay 4 first rounders in two years (especially when it looked like he was going to extend Kuper, Marshall, Dumervil).

the first next year for 2nd this year is common, panthers did it last year too for everette brown

misturanderson
03-18-2010, 09:31 AM
If they were to somehow get another 2nd round pick I could see 2 2nds and a 3rd potentially being enough compensation, especially in this draft and with our needs.

ayjackson
03-18-2010, 09:38 AM
If they were to somehow get another 2nd round pick I could see 2 2nds and a 3rd potentially being enough compensation, especially in this draft and with our needs.

this. the first round talent in this draft extends well into the second round. if we got two 2's in this draft, we could be better off than getting the 22nd. or we could get a 2 this year and a 1 in 2011. there are a lot of possibilities.

if marshall won't sign an extension, and you can't get a reasonable deal for him, however, then you let him play another year, franchise him and hope is value is higher next year (after another trouble free year and 100 catches).

SonOfLe-loLang
03-18-2010, 09:41 AM
the first next year for 2nd this year is common, panthers did it last year too for everette brown

read what i wrote again, i never claimed it wasnt

broncocalijohn
03-18-2010, 09:43 AM
You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

On the flip side, BM wont be holding the cards either. Once no one gives up a first, his ego might be a little shot from the lack of interest of what he thinks he is worth. If Seattle can give a flip flop to Chargers and a 3rd rounder in next year's draft on a 3rd string QB, then I would think they would spend a first rounder on a Top 5 WR. Broncos will hold the cards if they think keeping BM is better than any 2nd round pick.....and they should!

Gcver2ver3
03-18-2010, 09:47 AM
You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

what you're missing is that people said the same thing about Cutler last year...

McD said he'd take no lower than TWO 1st rd picks and people like you laughed saying we didn't have any leverage because everyone knows Cutler wants out and McD doesn't want him there...

and as you can see, we got exactly that and more...

McD isn't bluffing...he's not trading a top 5 WR for scraps...

CEH
03-18-2010, 09:50 AM
the first next year for 2nd this year is common, panthers did it last year too for everette brown

Common or not
JP Losman, Brady Quinn, Zo Smith, Everette Brown, Kyle Boller,

Help me out here when was the last time a 2nd for next year 1st worked out?

I bet you have to go back to Bobby Beathard in SD to find a successful trade.

The monetary angle plays better but I don't like it from a value standpoint

tsiguy96
03-18-2010, 09:55 AM
Common or not
JP Losman, Brady Quinn, Zo Smith, Everette Brown, Kyle Boller,

Help me out here when was the last time a 2nd for next year 1st worked out?

I bet you have to go back to Bobby Beathard in SD to find a successful trade.

The monetary angle plays better but I don't like it from a value standpoint

hey didnt say i liked the trade, just saying tahts what it takes to get a 2nd rounder this year.

bendog
03-18-2010, 10:03 AM
unless they take dez bryant, you're looking at gaffney royals and stokely and royals and a cast of unknowns. But two twos might get you a starting NT and OG. And for not first round money. God, did anyone ever thing money would mean anything unless it was about cap?

BroncoBen
03-18-2010, 10:17 AM
I don't get it... the Broncos have pretty much let it be know that Marshal is availible to any team for a 1st round pick. Sign him to an offer sheet, and he is yours. If not the Broncos are willing to keep him another year and see what kind of human/player he will be. Where is this trade for a 2nd round pick coming from ?

fontaine
03-18-2010, 10:17 AM
I still don't see the point of trading a 1000 yard young WR that's a matchup nightmare for virtually any CB in the league. If we had a ready replacement, sure.

But we don't. The best we got is Gaffney with two other slot receivers in Royal/Stokely.

Why don't we actually get the most out of our high picks first (Ayers, A Smith, Moreno, Moss, etc etc) before we go trading a stud WR?

If McDaniels does trade Marshall it won't be because Marshall is an unproductive and uncooperative player. McDaniels will be trading him because HE personally can't get along with the guy while professionally Marshall is getting it done on the field.

If McDaniels roster has enough space for a major bust like Jarvis Moss and not a pro bowl WR then the coach is doing what's best for him and his ego. Not what's best for the team and that's not just retarded. That's Al Davis brain dead level stupid.

eddie mac
03-18-2010, 10:23 AM
You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

Hardly. Where you not around for the Cutler trade, or the Marshall and Scheffler suspensions, then benchings or maybe Nolan getting his **** kicked out of Colorado.

One thing you get with McD is stubborness and plenty of it.

IMHO he'd rather let Marshall rot on the sidelines than take less than the appropriate value.

bendog
03-18-2010, 10:29 AM
these questions can only be answered by mcdaniels. I was trying to suggest that, assuming the team was intent on dumping him, would the team be worse with dez bryant and two no 2s? I don't know because I have no way of knowing whether mcdaniels is really smart at drafting, or just a smartass. Shanny gambled: he got darrius 'the hook' watts and BM both outside of the first round. The hook had a bad hand that didn't get better. BM's got a 'tude. Play it straight, and there's jd walton, cam thomas and duchasse all in the second. Plus some DTs will be there, and some will fit the 3-4

Requiem
03-18-2010, 10:35 AM
If we can't land a # for Marshall, a package of several second rounders and future picks or later won't matter.

bendog
03-18-2010, 10:41 AM
I dunno. I wasn't happy with last year's draft. The top looked suspect to me, and mcdaniels wasn't even interested in the back end. jmo. (and yeah shanny traded a back end for marcus thomas) But, if I had faith in the front office, this team is so bad, imo, that maxing out the number of picks in the 2-4 rounds would be the way to go.

As for BM, he's a bum. But he's talented. And he seems to know how to push mcdaniels' buttons, and I admit that I find that sort of amusing.

NFLBRONCO
03-18-2010, 11:03 AM
thing is you say that like this coach has time to win .:wiggle:

This is what fans say but, this team is years away from being good. If Bowlen truly likes McD's he'll give him longer.

gyldenlove
03-18-2010, 11:17 AM
They are not going to trade Marshall just to trade him, he is not Javon Walker.

DenverBrit
03-18-2010, 11:44 AM
You are foolish to believe this. There hasn't been a SINGLE first-round RFA signed yet. No-one is giving out first round picks. Denver doesn't hold the cards, because EVERYONE knows that McD wants Brandon out of Denver... period.

The coach doesn't want him. He's not going to coach him next year. He's may say "we'll only accept a 1st" but everyone knows he's full of crap. We will end up with a 2nd round pick in this years draft, and probably a 3rd in next years draft.... and Marshall will be gone.

Everyone? Really? Got a link to that story? ;D

I do recall a story where the broncos apparently offered BM $9.5 mill a year, with little or no up front money.
Not exactly the actions of a team trying to get rid of him.....more like a team trying to find a price /deal that both BM and Denver can live with.
The solo 1st round tender is another signal that the Broncos want to find a market value for BM.
I haven't read once where MCD has said he wants BM gone. Marshall's grievance began when Shanny was still HC not McDaniels.

And Denver does still hold all the cards.
They can match any offer, take the compensation or just sign BM for this year........though if that happens, chances are Denver will try again to work out a deal with BM.

Marshall and his agent are learning quickly that no matter how much talent one has, behavior still counts.

Requiem
03-18-2010, 11:47 AM
I think if Marshall is moved it'll be sometime on draft day, I'd agree with Clayton in that assessment. It probably would come when the Broncos could feel they are going to get good value and a player they want on their board. I'm not sure what we will end up getting for Marshall, but if it's a combination of picks that could land us several solid second or third round prospects who could be starters down the road, I'd take that gamble.

Tombstone RJ
03-18-2010, 12:18 PM
I think if Marshall is moved it'll be sometime on draft day, I'd agree with Clayton in that assessment. It probably would come when the Broncos could feel they are going to get good value and a player they want on their board. I'm not sure what we will end up getting for Marshall, but if it's a combination of picks that could land us several solid second or third round prospects who could be starters down the road, I'd take that gamble.

I dunno. The Broncos would have to get great compensation for him. I think McD has no problem keeping Bmarsh for another year.

Requiem
03-18-2010, 12:27 PM
Or another year by using tags on him. Marshall has no leverage here, we do.

Rather than just get a #1 pick for him, I'd actually be interested in what some people are saying here. Maybe the Broncos get two additional second-rounders, maybe a little less. I'm just saying I could think of a lot of solid combination's if that was the case.

I'm just a dreamer, but if it came down to the Broncos getting Ducasse, C. Thomas and someone else later on for Marshall, I'd be interested in that prospect.

UberBroncoMan
03-18-2010, 12:41 PM
Marshall update: With the New York Jets unlikely to jump in on a possible Brandon Marshall trade, the Seahawks remain the main team interested in the wideout, but Seattle will most likely wait until the second round of the draft to acquire him.

The Seahawks don't want to surrender a first-round pick. They would like to fill other needs with the No.6 and No.14 picks. The Broncos have the leverage now because they can look for another team to offer a first-rounder. If the first round of the draft passes without a Marshall trade, however, the leverage would shift to the Seahawks or other interested teams.

Hilarious!

TotallyScrewed
03-18-2010, 12:57 PM
Clayton in talking out of his ass shocker. Broncos have the leverage now and will have throughout this process unless someone comes up with a 1st rd pick tender offer.

Unless they do something horrendously stupid like giving away a top 5 WR for a 2nd rd pick.

There isn't one wideout close to being a No1 WR in this draft.

I agree. If they don't get quality picks (meaning round 1) then keep him but just don't be too skimpy on the money...unless they actually enjoyed fighting with him last year and want to ratchet it up a couple of notches.

oubronco
03-18-2010, 02:25 PM
so here is a question, going on this theory and the Tebow thread

IF we traded Marshall for a couple of 2nd round picks to give us extra...would you be upset if we took Tebow and still addressed other needs in that round?

Hell yes that would suck at this point we just need to keep Marshall and pay him