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OOJack
03-10-2010, 08:35 AM
Livin in a HELL HOLE, girl get me back to my HELL HOLE, you know where you stand in a HELL HOLE!

Reading your posts makes me very comfortable. Thanks playa! :thumbs:

I thought having spinal tap as your location was enough

2KBack
03-10-2010, 08:36 AM
I wonder what would happen if Josh McDaniels acquired Peyton Manning for a 5th round pick tomorrow. Would these retards still b**** and moan about everything and inject their hurt feelings into every thread?




My guess would be yes.

It says a lot that a charger fan is noticing this too

Kaylore
03-10-2010, 08:37 AM
I wonder what would happen if Josh McDaniels acquired Peyton Manning for a 5th round pick tomorrow. Would these retards still b**** and moan about everything and inject their hurt feelings into every thread?




My guess would be yes.

"Clearly this is just a move to save face. McDaniels is desperate and reaching for straws on guys like Peyton Manning, who is over thirty, by the way, for a fifth round pick, a pick that could be used to make a too old team younger, just shows his incompetence."

"If you still don't believe me then I'll just resort to calling him young, stupid and a liar. That's my MO."

/signed
Haters

OOJack
03-10-2010, 08:37 AM
he's old! And he duznt play gud! And also threw a pick in the super bowlz! Mcdummypantspoopyface strykes agin~!

is it too much to ask to bring in someone who is not injury prone and who is not 30+?

strafen
03-10-2010, 08:37 AM
for me the reason i continue to leave these guys and a few others who definitely deserve to be ignored off my ignore list goes back to my own personal belief that the moment this team turns it around and McDaniels proves the haters wrong, it is going to be so much fun to watch these guys all change their tunes and jump onto the McDaniels bandwagon and make claims that they always believed in the guy and never said anything bad, and weren't acting like trolls.

plus it is like watching a car accident or a donkey show. it is terrible, can make you sick to your stomach, but for some reason you just can't look away. you just have to keep watching just to know what is going to happen next.

There's always two side to a story, right?
So, what if we go 8-8 or worse?
What would that make you, then?
Will you be jumping off the wagon, or keep you in a delusional state alleging teams usually take 5 years to rebuild? :welcome:

jhns
03-10-2010, 08:39 AM
I wonder what would happen if Josh McDaniels acquired Peyton Manning for a 5th round pick tomorrow. Would these retards still b**** and moan about everything and inject their hurt feelings into every thread?

My guess would be yes.

I would worship him like you do if he pulled that off. His choice of QBs is one of my biggest complaints about him.

Popcorn Sutton
03-10-2010, 08:40 AM
No, I am using what the team said. He is using a rumor. There is no similarity.

All the team said is that they mutually parted ways. You've turned this into McDaniels wanting to hire a Yes man and forcing Nolan out the door. This is not based in facts. This is YOUR opinion which as always sides with the Anti-McDaniels crowd.

There are perfectly plausible explanations for both sides but we really don't know what happened. I do find it alarming that Nolan was hired less than 24 hours after leaving Denver and all the talk about Miami asking for permission to interview him prior to leaving.

Don't you think it's a little weird? Have you considered that Miami came along and wined and dined Nolan to the point that he saw greener pastures?

DBroncos4life
03-10-2010, 08:41 AM
i agree. and the main argument would come down to arm strength and his lack of mobility.

many would talk about the intelligence he possesses and that he is a winner and all that crap, but there would still be a few haters who would still find reasons to b**** about it.

I'm not sure Manning's ego and McD's ego could work together, then there is the O-line issue to deal with. That said even with the reason's you mentioned and what I was talking about I think the risks involved with dealing the 5th for Manning are worth it if he continues to play at the high level he is playing at now. ;) Do we have a 5th rounder though? A 4th would be pushing it. :giggle:

Kaylore
03-10-2010, 08:41 AM
is it too much to ask to bring in someone who is not injury prone and who is not 30+?

Like who, idiot? You make it sound like this free agent class is full of twenty-something pro-bowlers. Free agents are second tier veterans or star players in the twilight of their careers. That's why they are free agents!

Unless you know something we don't...


So here you go, nimwit:
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/fa?&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2ffa

Here is a list of every free agent available. If you would please list the guys we should have signed off that list and why the Broncos missed out, it will go a long way in making you look less like a troll who whines about everything and more like someone wanting to discuss football.

Popcorn Sutton
03-10-2010, 08:41 AM
is it too much to ask to bring in someone who is not injury prone and who is not 30+?

That would be what we call a draft.

Are you implying there were better options in free agency? Would you have been satisfied to pay a 30+ Julius Peppers over 13 million per year?

TheElusiveKyleOrton
03-10-2010, 08:42 AM
All the team said is that they mutually parted ways. You've turned this into McDaniels wanting to hire a Yes man and forcing Nolan out the door. This is not based in facts. This is YOUR opinion which as always sides with the Anti-McDaniels crowd.

There are perfectly plausible explanations for both sides but we really don't know what happened. I do find it alarming that Nolan was hired less than 24 hours after leaving Denver and all the talk about Miami asking for permission to interview him prior to leaving.

Don't you think it's a little weird? Have you considered that Miami came along and wined and dined Nolan to the point that he saw greener pastures?

That would require jhns to actually think critically. He's not capable.

"Weighing two sides of an argument? Too much work. I HATE MCD!"

strafen
03-10-2010, 08:45 AM
I would worship him like you do if he pulled that off. His choice of QBs is one of my biggest complaints about him.That right there, will negate anything McDaniels does.
I don't care if we got the #1 defense on the land, having Kyle Orton as our QB will negate everything.
But, but, but, but he will have another year in the system! :rofl:
He'll be much better :wiggle:

TheElusiveKyleOrton
03-10-2010, 08:46 AM
Like who, idiot? You make it sound like this free agent class is full of twenty-something pro-bowlers. Free agents are second tier veterans or star players in the twilight of their careers. That's why they are free agents!

Unless you know something we don't...


So here you go, nimwit:
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/fa?&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2ffa

Here is a list of every free agent available. If you would please list the guys we should have signed off that list and why the Broncos missed out, it will go a long way in making you look less like a troll who whines about everything and more like someone wanting to discuss football.

This should be an interesting spin. Can't wait!

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/Denverockwell/costanzaPopcorn.gif

jhns
03-10-2010, 08:48 AM
All the team said is that they mutually parted ways. You've turned this into McDaniels wanting to hire a Yes man and forcing Nolan out the door. This is not based in facts. This is YOUR opinion which as always sides with the Anti-McDaniels crowd.

There are perfectly plausible explanations for both sides but we really don't know what happened. I do find it alarming that Nolan was hired less than 24 hours after leaving Denver and all the talk about Miami asking for permission to interview him prior to leaving.

Don't you think it's a little weird? Have you considered that Miami came along and wined and dined Nolan to the point that he saw greener pastures?

Again, I do not listen to the rumors. I freely admit the yes man thing is speculation. I do not present it as a fact like people here are doing with rumors.

As for what Nolan did, I believe their falling out (and knowing they were going to split) happened well before the season ended. I don't think it is weird someone found a job in less than a day though. That happens when you know people. This is all speculation on my part though. All we know is that McDaniels didn't want the coordinator that improved the defense and his hand picked coordinator didn't want to work here after one year. That is a mutual parting. Again, I am just working with the facts that came from the team.

Popcorn Sutton
03-10-2010, 08:52 AM
Again, I am just spinning the facts that came from the team to support my opinions.

^^

Paladin
03-10-2010, 08:52 AM
He be OWNED!!!

Thanks, Kaylore.....


He will play "Yes..But" one more time.......

jhns
03-10-2010, 08:54 AM
^^

What spin? What does mutual parting say to you exactly? They wanted to work together?

Popcorn Sutton
03-10-2010, 08:55 AM
Again, I do not listen to the rumors. I freely admit the yes man thing is speculation. I do not present it as a fact like people here are doing with rumors.

I don't get it. I supply facts and reality and these guys go off the deep end.

:welcome:

BroncoMan4ever
03-10-2010, 09:00 AM
There's always two side to a story, right?
So, what if we go 8-8 or worse?
What would that make you, then?
Will you be jumping off the wagon, or keep you in a delusional state alleging teams usually take 5 years to rebuild? :welcome:

i am a Broncos fan to the core and i will stand by the team even if McDaniels leads them 0-16 and if Bowlen does not fire the guy after that season, I am going to remain on his side wishing the best for the team with eternal optimism. i may get upset with certain moves the team makes but regardless i am going to remain optimistic and not bash on the Broncos we have in favor of the former Broncos who have moved to new places and no longer give a rats fuzzy ass about anything pertaining to the blue and orange.

and truly think about your final attempted scenario with the time it takes to build a winner from the ground up.

it does take time to build a team into a winner when it was a loser.

on average in the NFL 40% of a roster is changed out every year. that means on a 53 man roster, on average 21 of those players are switched out yearly. now in the case of Denver last season. our secondary was easily the area in most need of dramatic improvement. now McDaniels saw that and invested in 7 players through a combination of FA and draft picks to come in and upgrade that secondary(that doesn't count UDFA or midseason pickups) meaning of the average 21 players who are replaced on a yearly basis, McDaniels used 7 of those roster spots on 1 single portion of the team...the secondary. meaning of the 14 remaining spots, he addressed the following groups, ST, LBs, DL, OL, WR, RB, and QB.

if it took him 7 pickups to fix the secondary, it can be assumed that to truly upgrade every section of the team he will need a few years to be able to address all positions. rebuilding is not a quick process, it takes time and usually comes with a few hits and misses

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:00 AM
:welcome:

It would help if you would read the conversation. We are obviously talking about the mutual parting at that point. What, you think that meant I never give an opinion either? Again, I present my opinions as opinions. Others are presenting rumors as facts. Not real hard to understand.

400HZ
03-10-2010, 09:00 AM
I would worship him like you do if he pulled that off. His choice of QBs is one of my biggest complaints about him.

Getting two first round picks and a serviceable starting quarterback for a perennial loser like Cutler really bummed you out, huh? I guess maybe you could relate better to Jay's whining, crying, and moping. Is that why you miss him so much?

BroncoMan4ever
03-10-2010, 09:04 AM
Getting two first round picks and a serviceable starting quarterback for a perennial loser like Cutler really bummed you out, huh? I guess maybe you could relate better to Jay's whining, crying, and moping. Is that why you miss him so much?

damn that should be eye opening to the trolls on this site when the resident Chargers fan is even giving them ****.

also, dont forget we also got a 3rd rounder in that trade. looking back that was hard core anal rape what McDaniels did to the Bears. that is in line with the roughest rapings Shanahan ever gave the Skins

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:04 AM
Getting two first round picks and a serviceable starting quarterback for a perennial loser like Cutler really bummed you out, huh? I guess maybe you could relate better to Jay's whining, crying, and moping. Is that why you miss him so much?

I would say I miss his 4550 yards and 27 TDs. I miss having an offense that actually produces. I miss young stars like Royal that Cutler made better just by being our QB. I get it though. You are all a bunch of women and want a country club. You all care about personalities in football. I don't personally understand it but to each their own...

Popcorn Sutton
03-10-2010, 09:05 AM
Getting two first round picks and a serviceable starting quarterback for a perennial loser like Cutler really bummed you out, huh? I guess maybe you could relate better to Jay's whining, crying, and moping. Is that why you miss him so much?

They do have a lot in common.

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:07 AM
damn that should be eye opening to the trolls on this site when the resident Chargers fan is even giving them ****.

Maybe it should open your eyes that you are on the same side as a Charger fan. Maybe you think they want what is best for the Broncos?

BroncoMan4ever
03-10-2010, 09:09 AM
I would say I miss his 4550 yards and 27 TDs. I miss having an offense that actually produces. I miss young stars like Royal that Cutler made better just by being our QB. I get it though. You are all a bunch of women and want a country club. You all care about personalities in football. I don't personally understand it but to each their own...

i remember Cutler basically ignoring Royal for the entire middle of the 2008 season when the team spiraled down the ****ter. i also remember the 20 turnovers Cutler had, the ****ty attitude, and pissing contest he was having with a QB who totally owned his ass, and the fact he was never better than 8-8 or that the epic offense you claim he led only actually had the 16th ranked scoring offense.

yeah, we got rid of greatness.

400HZ
03-10-2010, 09:09 AM
I would say I miss his 4550 yards and 27 TDs. I miss having an offense that actually produces. I miss young stars like Royal that Cutler made better just by being our QB. I get it though. You are all a bunch of women and want a country club. You all care about personalities in football. I don't personally understand it but to each their own...

An offense that produces what? 28 interceptions? Middle of the road points vs ... middle of the road points? Is that what you really want? If Orton threw the ball 40 times a game like Cutler did and put up big yardage numbers, would you quit ruining every football thread on this board with your incessant ****ing whining?

Requiem
03-10-2010, 09:10 AM
The only reason Royal got as many catches as he did was the insane amount of balls thrown his way.

BroncoMan4ever
03-10-2010, 09:10 AM
Maybe it should open your eyes that you are on the same side as a Charger fan. Maybe you think they want what is best for the Broncos?

in a debate with you or the Charger fan, i will side with the Charger fan, because even with his lousy taste in teams, he actually contributes to the discussion instead of acting like a troll.

**** i will listen to Bob before you

chex
03-10-2010, 09:11 AM
I would say I miss his 4550 yards and 27 TDs.

I stopped reading right there. I always believed people like yourself care more about stats and pretty box scores than anything else. Thatís why the Cutler people still arenít over it. It doesnít bother you when he throws for 350 yards and has costly turnovers in a loss, because, well, he threw for 350 yards!!!! Just like from the movie, youíd rather lose pretty than win ugly. Wins donít matter to you, box scores and dazzling stats do.

Rabb
03-10-2010, 09:13 AM
I stopped reading right there. I always believed people like yourself care more about stats and pretty box scores than anything else. Thatís why the Cutler people still arenít over it. It doesnít bother you when he throws for 350 yards and has costly turnovers in a loss, because, well, he threw for 350 yards!!!! Just like from the movie, youíd rather lose pretty than win ugly. Wins donít matter to you, box scores and dazzling stats do.

wait until the "2nd ranked offense" card is played, that's my fave

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:13 AM
actually had the 16th ranked scoring offense.


Again with the not knowing your facts. You made your entire argument worthless the second you started making crap up and showing that you dont know what you are talking about.

BroncoMan4ever
03-10-2010, 09:17 AM
Again with the not knowing your facts. You made your entire argument worthless the second you started making crap up and showing that you dont know what you are talking about.

16th in points scored, you can look that stat up yourself. but i guess you prefer to use the stats that show yardage instead that says we were the 2nd best offense that year.

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:17 AM
An offense that produces what? 28 interceptions? Middle of the road points vs ... middle of the road points? Is that what you really want? If Orton threw the ball 40 times a game like Cutler did and put up big yardage numbers, would you quit ruining every football thread on this board with your incessant ****ing whining?

You have your numbers way off there dolt boy.

Anyways, your point about Orton is laughable. We opened up the offense for him one time. That one time, he threw 3 picks and 2 of those went for TDs. Yeah, he would have been real great if he had to carry the team on his back and throw it 40 times a game. He did no better when the defense regressed. Cutler got to work with the franchises worst ever defense and ended with the same results. Funny how you overlook this fact.

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:20 AM
16th in points scored, you can look that stat up yourself. but i guess you prefer to use the stats that show yardage instead that says we were the 2nd best offense that year.

Where do I look up this 16th ranked scoring offense? As far as I know, no one tracks that stat. You know why they don't track that stat? Because it is far to complicated to actually break down that stat.

Why are we even discussing the offense here anyways?

400HZ
03-10-2010, 09:22 AM
You have your numbers way off there dolt boy.

Anyways, your point about Orton is laughable. We opened up the offense for him one time. That one time, he threw 3 picks and 2 of those went for TDs. Yeah, he would have been real great if he had to carry the team on his back and throw it 40 times a game. He did no better when the defense regressed. Cutler got to work with the franchises worst ever defense and ended with the same results. Funny how you overlook this fact.

And Jay Cutler would have never done that, right?

I don't understand why some of you guys remain "fans" of your team if everything they do is just going to make you more and more bitter. Every team makes moves that not all fans like, but I don't think I've ever seen a group remain as collectively butthurt for so long as you guys.

Mr.Meanie
03-10-2010, 09:22 AM
What would you call the "mutual" parting? We want him here? Mutual now means he wanted out and we wanted him here? I come up with this stuff by using my brain.

It is pretty obvious Martindale is a yes man. McDaniels hand picked coordinator didn't even want to work with him after a single season. Anyone with experience that expects to have a say in the defense is going to have the same problem. We gave an inexperienced coach the job after this happens. What would you call it? Switching d-coordinators every year was Shanahans problem. Now we are dealing with it already with McDaniels. At least Shanahans coordinators actually made the defense worse before Shanahan wanted them gone.

True, true. And we are going to have a hard time attracting free agents, too. No one in the league wants to work with McD. He has made us the laughingstock.

Kaylore
03-10-2010, 09:23 AM
Where do I look up this 16th ranked scoring offense? As far as I know, no one tracks that stat. You know why they don't track that stat? Because it is far to complicated to actually break down that stat.

:spit: Yeah points per game and total points scored is SOOOOOOOO hard to track.

And total interceptions and redzone interceptions. Are those pretty hard to calculate as well? ROFL!




pretty much any site that keeps stats ranks teams in scoring offense and scoring defense.

Paladin
03-10-2010, 09:24 AM
This message is hidden because jhns is on your ignore list (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/profile.php?do=ignorelist)


I seriously implore all members to ignore this idiot, and not quote him. The leifmotif of some people like this dude is to be contrary to any known facts. To him, the earth is flat and the moon landings were faked, and aliens at Roswell were real.

In short, critical thinking is not his ....ummm....forte.......

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:26 AM
And Jay Cutler would have never done that, right?


Cutler = 8-8 with the worst ever Bronco defense.

Orton = 8-8 with a top 10 defense.

Sure, Orton and this offense never missed a beat. They did just as good as the Cutler led offense.

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:27 AM
:spit: Yeah points per game and total points scored is SOOOOOOOO hard to track.


What was our offensive scoring rank then? Let's see Mr. Smart Guy prove that he doesn't know what he is talking about.

400HZ
03-10-2010, 09:30 AM
Cutler = 8-8 with the worst ever Bronco defense.

Orton = 8-8 with a top 10 defense.

Sure, Orton and this offense never missed a beat. They did just as good as the Cutler led offense.

Where do I look up this top 10 defense? As far as I know, no one tracks that stat.


8-8 to 8-8. Same late season meltdown. Seems pretty similar. How come you have to bitch and moan about McDaniels' 8-8/late season meltdown in every thread here, though?

jhns
03-10-2010, 09:31 AM
I stopped reading right there. I always believed people like yourself care more about stats and pretty box scores than anything else. Thatís why the Cutler people still arenít over it. It doesnít bother you when he throws for 350 yards and has costly turnovers in a loss, because, well, he threw for 350 yards!!!! Just like from the movie, youíd rather lose pretty than win ugly. Wins donít matter to you, box scores and dazzling stats do.

Riiiight. The offense didn't decline at all when we got rid of Cutler! Who cares that the team did the exact same with a far superior defense? That shows the offense was the same, right?

Cutler had a lot to work on. I was willing to wait that part out. I'm not so impatient that I need an offense of rookie-third year guys to make 0 mistakes and be the best ever. I can see that guys can actually improve after year 3. I figured McDaniels would also be able to give the coaching needed for that. I guess you guys don't agree. Oh well.

55CrushEm
03-10-2010, 09:38 AM
You mean instead of the outright fiction that you and the haters are writing?

"NURRRRR MARTINDALE IS A YES MAN"

"How do you know? Where did you hear that?"

"NURRRR IS OBIOUS CUSE MCDANIELS HIRED HIM SO HEZ A YES MAN"

"That would be the opposite of his reputation every else in the league"

"WELL ITS TROO. N ALSO WE R JUS HIRING PEOPLE FUR THE D LINE SO MCDANIELS CUN SAVE FACE. NURRRRRRR"

"So you're saying if Nolan was still here we wouldn't be trying to upgrade the team this way?"

"UM, UH, WELL"

"You really think our defensive line was fine after last year? That this isn't related to improving at all"

"UH, NURRRR...."

"Even though we did the same thing last year with good results and it's clearly an MO of the new FO?"

"SHUT UP! MCDANELS SUKS! SHANY RULZ! CUTLER IS AWZUM!"

:spit:

jhns
03-10-2010, 10:03 AM
How come you have to b**** and moan about McDaniels' 8-8/late season meltdown in every thread here, though?

Really? Every thread? I bet you can't find a thread in the first 3 pages of central discussion where I mention this.

jhns
03-10-2010, 10:05 AM
wait until the "2nd ranked offense" card is played, that's my fave

And why does this keep getting brought up? You guys can't refute what I am saying so you go with made up arguments? This has been discussed for 2 pages and this has only been said by your side of the argument.

jhns
03-10-2010, 10:07 AM
True, true. And we are going to have a hard time attracting free agents, too. No one in the league wants to work with McD. He has made us the laughingstock.

Again, making up random arguments that have nothing to do with anything I have ever claimed here. It shows who the irrational ones are.

Rulon Velvet Jones
03-10-2010, 10:12 AM
Who is this fag?

sixtimeseight
03-10-2010, 10:28 AM
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Ahhhhhhh much better

400HZ
03-10-2010, 11:45 AM
Really? Every thread? I bet you can't find a thread in the first 3 pages of central discussion where I mention this.

Well you certainly **** all over this one.

jhns
03-10-2010, 12:00 PM
Well you certainly **** all over this one.

LOL

Riiight. I stated an opinion. You guys freaked out about the opinion. You guys then start arguing that rumors are facts, fake stats are real(still waiting for a source for offensive scoring), and then go off on a bunch of arguments that I have never made. I state facts and say what is opinion and I am the one that **** on the thread? I'm pretty sure you are the troll that took this thread way off topic into and into an offensive debate. That is way further away from the topic than any topic change I had something to do with. In fact, I'm pretty sure the Nolan discussion was going before I showed up so I never took it off topic at all. You **** on the thread buddy. You are all irrational and over the top.

As you can clearly see, I am the victim here.

400HZ
03-10-2010, 12:35 PM
LOL

Riiight. I stated an opinion. You guys freaked out about the opinion. You guys then start arguing that rumors are facts, fake stats are real(still waiting for a source for offensive scoring), and then go off on a bunch of arguments that I have never made. I state facts and say what is opinion and I am the one that **** on the thread? I'm pretty sure you are the troll that took this thread way off topic into and into an offensive debate. That is way further away from the topic than any topic change I had something to do with. In fact, I'm pretty sure the Nolan discussion was going before I showed up so I never took it off topic at all. You **** on the thread buddy. You are all irrational and over the top.

As you can clearly see, I am the victim here.

You stated an unwanted opinion that had nothing to do with the OP. A thread that had many potentially interesting facets to discuss - Jamal Williams' performance over the past couple years, defensive tackles playing into their mid-thirties, the age of Denver's defense, etc etc - turned into a Josh McDaniels/Kyle Orton/Jay Cutler wishy washy b****fest. Douchebags like you are making this board less and less compelling. Congratulations. You act like you're fighting the good fight or something. You're not. You are just annoying the posters who would like to move past what happened a year ago and discuss revelant football. And now I'll just go ahead and ignore you.

jhns
03-10-2010, 12:39 PM
You stated an unwanted opinion that had nothing to do with the OP. A thread that had many potentially interesting facets to discuss - Jamal Williams' performance over the past couple years, defensive tackles playing into their mid-thirties, the age of Denver's defense, etc etc - turned into a Josh McDaniels/Kyle Orton/Jay Cutler wishy washy b****fest. Douchebags like you are making this board less and less compelling. Congratulations. You act like you're fighting the good fight or something. You're not. You are just annoying the posters who would like to move past what happened a year ago and discuss football. And now I'll just go ahead and ignore you.

Ummm, YOU made it about Cutler and Orton. If me arguing it after you changed the topic means I did, then you still are just as much to blame as me. Stop crying. I said I like the pickup. I also commented on something that has been discussed throughout this thread. I said that Nolan leaving isn't a good thing and that I hope Martindale can handle the job. So now I'm not allowed to give my opinions on these subjects if they aren't sucking off McD? What a joke. It is those of you that can't take opinions that don't match your own that are ruining this board.

Stop being so doltish.

TonyR
03-10-2010, 12:40 PM
...turned into a Josh McDaniels/Kyle Orton/Jay Cutler wishy washy b****fest. Douchebags like you are making this board less and less compelling. Congratulations. You act like you're fighting the good fight or something. You're not. You are just annoying the posters who would like to move past what happened a year ago and discuss football.

Well said. I think jhns, dragster, BF7, and several others are very capable of adding good stuff to the forum but have to agree that they generally derail more than contribute. I hope you guys can find a way to rise above this garbage and make this a better place for everyone including yourselves. That doesn't mean you have to be a pollyanna but you really don't need to ride a wave of over the top negativity into every thread.

jhns
03-10-2010, 12:45 PM
That doesn't mean you have to be a pollyanna but you really don't need to ride a wave of over the top negativity into every thread.

I said I like the offseason FA pickups. That is positive.

Again though, this isn't just us. Look at the responses to my post. From there, people take offense and start arguing the dumbest stuff. You all become irrational because you don't agree with an opinion.

Until you guys realize that the "positive" crowd is just as much to blame for the way threads go, it will never get better.

broncocalijohn
03-10-2010, 12:59 PM
never amazes that i can read a couple of pages into a thread (i havent been around for a few days) and notice that it goes on to page 13 in less than 24 hours. I wonder, "Ok, where did this go off the topic?" Sure enough, it is the Cutlerites bringing down a thread. Congrats JHNS for another superb job at whining and making people hungry because this is now ruined for a foodjack. A-hole!

jhns
03-10-2010, 01:03 PM
Congrats JHNS for another superb job at whining and making people hungry because this is now ruined for a foodjack. A-hole!

I do have talent.

OOJack
03-10-2010, 01:06 PM
Like who, idiot? You make it sound like this free agent class is full of twenty-something pro-bowlers. Free agents are second tier veterans or star players in the twilight of their careers. That's why they are free agents!

Unless you know something we don't...


So here you go, nimwit:
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/fa?&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2ffa

Here is a list of every free agent available. If you would please list the guys we should have signed off that list and why the Broncos missed out, it will go a long way in making you look less like a troll who whines about everything and more like someone wanting to discuss football.

Do you need communication lessons, "idiot"

I asked a question, and what is the response of 90% of the douche internet touch guys on this forum? "you're an idiot, here's a copy/paste of something someone else wrote to prove you're an idiot, go EFF yourself"

So basically you're non @ssface response is , yes, it is too much to ask to get a non-injury prone, non-30+ guy?!?

DenverBrit
03-10-2010, 02:01 PM
Well said. I think jhns, dragster, BF7, and several others are very capable of adding good stuff to the forum but have to agree that they generally derail more than contribute. I hope you guys can find a way to rise above this garbage and make this a better place for everyone including yourselves. That doesn't mean you have to be a pollyanna but you really don't need to ride a wave of over the top negativity into every thread.

A good start would be to put the 'haters' and whiners you mention on ignore.

The threads become unreadable when they jack them for their 'b*tchfest'... even if they have something to offer, you have to wade through a lot of crap to find anything worthwhile that hasn't already been beaten to death.

Arguing with them is purely circular, nothing new gets added to the conversation and more and more good posters are going elsewhere.

jhns
03-10-2010, 02:22 PM
What happened to the food jack? It would be more interesting than reading all of this crying.

You guys are actually trying to say people like me are just arguing with ourselves in these threads? The positive fan has nothing to do with the way they turn out? Funny stuff.

I guess that's what it takes to actually like all of McDaniels decisions. You just have to be half retarded and be completely irrational about everything. Oh and who can forget that you also have to live off of rumors and fake stats. It seems you also have to react like a whiney b**** every time someone says something you don't agree with.

Sorry, I just can't be like all of you. I actually respect myself. Well, that and I would never put McDaniels above the team like you jokes.

strafen
03-10-2010, 02:25 PM
Well said. I think jhns, dragster, BF7, and several others are very capable of adding good stuff to the forum but have to agree that they generally derail more than contribute. I hope you guys can find a way to rise above this garbage and make this a better place for everyone including yourselves. That doesn't mean you have to be a pollyanna but you really don't need to ride a wave of over the top negativity into every thread.

Why does my name always come up?
I try to contribute to the discussion the best I can.
Not agreeing with McDaniels all the time, doesn't make me an ignorant and a hater.
What I post, I leave it up for discussion and debate.
I'm not just throwing stuff out there.

You can agree or disagree with me. In both cases you're open to make your point.
The derailing, oddly enough is not started by any of the people you're mentioning. You know that. Look closely. You can back track and see for yourself where a thread started to go off-topic.
It's all there. It's not hard for anybody to see who started the crap.
Just because you like everything McDaniels doesn't exhonerate from being a trouble maker.
I understand those who don't like what McDaniels is doing are the minority, but that doesn't make them less of a fan that it would make you one for supporting what the coach does for better or for worse

The derailing of threads occur when somebody can't handle a discussion where somebody has had the audacy to question McDaniels. That's when all insults and name calling ensue.

Now, if you want to respond and debate in a civil manner, I don't see how a thread has to run off-course, but when people don't even read the content of what one is saying and immediately assume that they don't have any credibility just because they don't cheer for Mcdaniels that's when things go bad in a hurry; insults, name calling, etc...
What do you expect?
I'm not going to take insults from anyone just because they don't like my takes on McDaniels, nor would I insult anyone for liking McDaniels.
This whole thing is so stupid, is not even funny!
A better moderation of this board, would cut down on insults.
Holding people accountable for insults will force them to focus more on the debate at hand than trying to pollute the thread.
It's happening here, simply because it's allowed to happen...

strafen
03-10-2010, 02:29 PM
A good start would be to put the 'haters' and whiners you mention on ignore.

The threads become unreadable when they jack them for their 'b*tchfest'... even if they have something to offer, you have to wade through a lot of crap to find anything worthwhile that hasn't already been beaten to death.

Arguing with them is purely circular, nothing new gets added to the conversation and more and more good posters are going elsewhere.What makes me a hater and a whinner and what makes you a true fan?

Again, make your point. Don't b!tch yourself about others b!tching...

TheElusiveKyleOrton
03-10-2010, 02:31 PM
The derailing of threads occur when somebody can't handle a discussion where somebody has had the audacy to question McDaniels. That's when all insults and name calling ensue.



You can repeat that lie til you're blue in the face. Doesn't make it true.

Fact is, threads go off topic when someone makes an outlandish disagreement or statement about the coach or front office. If you merely said "I disagree with this move," do you really think anyone would have a problem with you?

Your statements like "McDaniels is ruining this team, and player x sucks because I say so" are the ones that take threads off topic. That's not a sensible argument or conclusion, so please, PLEASE, stop acting like the ****ing victim.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
03-10-2010, 02:32 PM
What makes me a hater and a whinner and what makes you a true fan?

Again, make your point. Don't b!tch yourself about others b!tching...

Pot? Meet kettle.

baja
03-10-2010, 02:39 PM
well this is fun.... not

jhns
03-10-2010, 02:47 PM
well this is fun.... not

Fine contribution baja. I am currently working to become a great poster like baja here. You know, with all of these insightful on topic posts that do nothing but improve threads. It is a struggle but I will get there one day. First I need to work on the Brit example of crying about everyone else and adding 0 to threads in that way.

Trust me guys. I will get this all eventually. Give it time.

baja
03-10-2010, 02:51 PM
Fine contribution baja. I am currently working to become a great poster like baja here. You know, with all of these insightful on topic posts that do nothing but improve threads. It is a struggle but I will get there one day. First I need to work on the Brit example of crying about everyone else and adding 0 to threads in that way.

Trust me guys. I will get this all eventually. Give it time.

I don't hold out much hope.

BTW how should one respond to your endless blathering?

jhns
03-10-2010, 03:26 PM
I don't hold out much hope.

BTW how should one respond to your endless blathering?

Maybe don't respond if you don't find it worth while? Don't know. I am not the one that makes up what good and bad posts are. I just find it funny that all of you add nothing to the threads as some cry about how only negative fans add nothing to threads. I enjoy comedy so I wanted to point it out to everyone else. I just want to share the laughs baja! Get off my back.

p7superfly
03-10-2010, 04:04 PM
Catfight

DBroncos4life
03-10-2010, 04:27 PM
never amazes that i can read a couple of pages into a thread (i havent been around for a few days) and notice that it goes on to page 13 in less than 24 hours. I wonder, "Ok, where did this go off the topic?" Sure enough, it is the Cutlerites bringing down a thread. Congrats JHNS for another superb job at whining and making people hungry because this is now ruined for a foodjack. A-hole!

What a load of ****. A Charger fan (400HZ) was the first to bring in Cutlers name. Jhns responded to that. Then BroncoMan4ever, chex, Kaylore, 400HZ and McRabb continued to give Jhns a reason to keep arguing about Cutler. One poster that liked Cutler was fighting with 5 that didn't like him. Like any fights it takes two sides but you want to continue to point the finger at Cutlerites. If anything 400HZ baited the derailment of this thread.

Posters could have just left the post alone where Jhns claimed he missed the 4500 yards and 27 TD's, but no a gang of people that don't like Cutler couldn't let that go.

Florida_Bronco
03-10-2010, 04:36 PM
Why does my name always come up?
I try to contribute to the discussion the best I can.
Not agreeing with McDaniels all the time, doesn't make me an ignorant and a hater.

I agree. You've improved alot as a poster over the last month or so. You used to be a pretty serious McDaniels hater but now you're at least willing to have a discussion about the matter and come to some logical conclusions.

BroncoBuff
03-10-2010, 04:58 PM
now you're at least willing to have a discussion about the matter and come to some logical conclusions.

Said the man who sees "logic" exclusively in his own opinions.

Jamal Williams is great, but Justin Bannan will be a bigger deal in the long run. He is the prototype 3-4 DE, a borderline Pro-Bowler. It's a lot of money, but still, I'm surprised the Ravens let him sign.

Old Dude
03-10-2010, 05:09 PM
We got Jamal.

Cool.

Florida_Bronco
03-10-2010, 05:15 PM
Said the man who sees "logic" exclusively in his own opinions. Because I base my opinions off logic.

And you're already on thin ice with me dude. Your Chris Simms debacle from last year has you in jeopardy of keeping the QB coach spot on my mock coaching staff. You should be nicer to me. :approve:

BroncoBuff
03-10-2010, 05:21 PM
Oh .... sorry ::)

thumpc
03-10-2010, 05:21 PM
We got Jamal.

Cool.
Wrong thread.

Florida_Bronco
03-10-2010, 05:36 PM
Oh .... sorry ::)

Lighten up, Francis.

400HZ
03-10-2010, 06:07 PM
What a load of ****. A Charger fan (400HZ) was the first to bring in Cutlers name. Jhns responded to that. Then BroncoMan4ever, chex, Kaylore, 400HZ and McRabb continued to give Jhns a reason to keep arguing about Cutler. One poster that liked Cutler was fighting with 5 that didn't like him. Like any fights it takes two sides but you want to continue to point the finger at Cutlerites. If anything 400HZ baited the derailment of this thread.

Posters could have just left the post alone where Jhns claimed he missed the 4500 yards and 27 TD's, but no a gang of people that don't like Cutler couldn't let that go.

Actually it started as a post about the merits of signing Jamal Williams, which drew several Chargers fans including myself to give their opinions. A respectable football thread for a short while. Then one of the McPoopypantsers declared that it would be a waste since McDaniels was an idiot and surrounds himself with yes men. That started the orangemane spiral that inevitably ends with somebody crying about how Orton sucks and they want baby Jay back.

DBroncos4life
03-10-2010, 06:15 PM
Actually it started as a post about the merits of signing Jamal Williams, which drew several Chargers fans including myself to give their opinions. A respectable football thread for a short while. Then one of the McPoopypantsers declared that it would be a waste since McDaniels was an idiot and surrounds himself with yes men. That started the orangemane spiral that inevitably ends with somebody crying about how Orton sucks and they want baby Jay back.

Jhns is the only one arguing for Cutler in this thread. The only reason he brought it up is because you started talking about Jay. Then others had to chime in and drag the same tired argument out. Just like there is only one person claiming that McD is surrounding himself with yes men and another ten claiming that isn't true.

Drek
03-10-2010, 06:16 PM
Said the man who sees "logic" exclusively in his own opinions.

Jamal Williams is great, but Justin Bannan will be a bigger deal in the long run. He is the prototype 3-4 DE, a borderline Pro-Bowler. It's a lot of money, but still, I'm surprised the Ravens let him sign.

Long term that is definitely possible, but for 2010 a healthy Jamal Williams for 20 snaps a game will be more vital to our success than a healthy Justin Bannan for 35 or 40.

There is only a finite number of 3-4 NTs in the world, when healthy Jamal Williams is one of them. In order for a 3-4 defense to run effectively it needs to control the LOS and kill the run on first down. At that point you make the opposition look to the air and that is when the 3-4 OLBs can get to the passer and create chaos, either with sacks or forcing bad passes that become turnovers.

Bannan will play an integral role in what happens after we establish control of the series on first down, but without a healthy Williams we'll be a lot like last year's team needing to scheme up ways to win on 1st instead of just physically dominating and dictating to the opposition.

400HZ
03-10-2010, 06:25 PM
Jhns is the only one arguing for Cutler in this thread. The only reason he brought it up is because you started talking about Jay. Then others had to chime in and drag the same tired argument out. Just like there is only one person claiming that McD is surrounding himself with yes men and another ten claiming that isn't true.

Give me a break. When they start moaning about how crappy Orton is, grabbing the vaseline and fondly reminiscing the glorious Jay Cutler days is the what always happens next. Sorry if I preempted someone.

tsiguy96
03-10-2010, 06:41 PM
Give me a break. When they start moaning about how crappy Orton is, grabbing the vaseline and fondly reminiscing the glorious Jay Cutler days is the what always happens next. Sorry if I preempted someone.

you KNOW something is wrong when a charger fan makes fun of bronco doom and gloomers. he should be fueling the fire, but now he cant even stand it anymore!

Kaylore
03-10-2010, 06:53 PM
So basically you're non @ssface response is , yes, it is too much to ask to get a non-injury prone, non-30+ guy?!?

I'm still waiting for you and the rest of your crew to point out the free agents we should have signed. Rather than b****ing about the quality of Free agents this year (something we have ZERO control over) please enlighten us all on who we should be signing?

If you're going to suggest a certain choice is bad and provide no alternative then you're just a stupid whiny troll who hates everything the organization does purely b/c you're personally mad at the coach.

So I again challenge all the detractors to please name the player we should have signed instead that is "younger" and of the same calbre player. Since supposedly they are out there ready to be signed. I'm on pins a needles.

eddie mac
03-10-2010, 07:02 PM
Carlsberg dont do free agent 3-4 line signings in an uncapped year with very little young talent available but if they did, they'd be the best in the world.

Dudeskey
03-10-2010, 07:22 PM
I think so too, but I'm used to seeing 5 year contracts (or more) regardless of age for the cap spreadibility of the bonus money - so it's a whole new ballgame here we're seeing.

I' suppose that teams are prefering to get that dead money off the books sooner rather than later should the aging player retire. If I recall correctly Dawkins signed a 3 year deal as well.

DBroncos4life
03-10-2010, 07:43 PM
Give me a break. When they start moaning about how crappy Orton is, grabbing the vaseline and fondly reminiscing the glorious Jay Cutler days is the what always happens next. Sorry if I preempted someone.

Bringing up the name Cutler is a easy way to get a thread of topic. :D

Caveat Lector
03-10-2010, 07:51 PM
Jamal Williams is great, but Justin Bannan will be a bigger deal in the long run. He is the prototype 3-4 DE, a borderline Pro-Bowler. It's a lot of money, but still, I'm surprised the Ravens let him sign.

The guy didn't even start in Baltimore and you're calling him a bordeline Pro-Bowler? Don't get me wrong I like the signing, but lets be honest with ourselves and not over-hype the guy. He'll be solid, that's it...

BroncoMan4ever
03-10-2010, 08:25 PM
The guy didn't even start in Baltimore and you're calling him a bordeline Pro-Bowler? Don't get me wrong I like the signing, but lets be honest with ourselves and not over-hype the guy. He'll be solid, that's it...

while i agree borderline pro bowler is really making him seem a lot better than he actually played, i believe he is going to be the signing we all end up liking the best out of this seasons FA signings. he is very versatile having lined up as both an End and Nose while in Baltimore.

Mr.Meanie
03-10-2010, 09:31 PM
I'm still waiting for you and the rest of your crew to point out the free agents we should have signed. Rather than b****ing about the quality of Free agents this year (something we have ZERO control over) please enlighten us all on who we should be signing?

If you're going to suggest a certain choice is bad and provide no alternative then you're just a stupid whiny troll who hates everything the organization does purely b/c you're personally mad at the coach.

So I again challenge all the detractors to please name the player we should have signed instead that is "younger" and of the same calbre player. Since supposedly they are out there ready to be signed. I'm on pins a needles.

Don't hold your breath...

ghwk
03-10-2010, 10:40 PM
Now all we need is a quarterback! ROFL

jhns
03-11-2010, 05:59 AM
Now all we need is a quarterback! ROFL

That, a center, a guard, experienced GM, and a coach.

jhns
03-11-2010, 06:07 AM
Actually it started as a post about the merits of signing Jamal Williams, which drew several Chargers fans including myself to give their opinions. A respectable football thread for a short while. Then one of the McPoopypantsers declared that it would be a waste since McDaniels was an idiot and surrounds himself with yes men. That started the orangemane spiral that inevitably ends with somebody crying about how Orton sucks and they want baby Jay back.

LOL

So you turn this into a Cutler thread but it is my fault we talked about Cutler? See? Again, it just takes an irrational and unreasonable person to think getting rid of Cutler and Nolan are good things. You all prove this every day.

By the way, you don't even have my original post correct. I said I liked the FA signings and now we just have to see how good Martindale is. As in, he hasn't been a coordinator but I think we have a complete defense being built. I said it was a mistake to get rid of Nolan because I would love to see what he could do with this complete defense. It is my opinion that Martindale is a yes man just like Shanahan used to hire and this was Shanahans downfall. You guys think rumors are facts. One of the biggest rumors about Nolan leaving is that he wanted some say in how the defense is run. If that causes a problem with McDaniels, how is he not looking for a yes man? Anyways, not once did I say it was a waste. That is just your over the top drama queen reaction causing you to make stuff up again.

I know, that is such a horrible thing to say. Sorry I hurt all of your feelings and made you feel you just had to defend your hero McD from the big bad jhns.

fontaine
03-11-2010, 07:28 AM
It's an ok signing. On the plus side we've signed the best of what was available and upgraded our DL in the short term.

But I still remain skeptical whether these guys can really make the kind of difference we need to stop the end of season slide we see every year, especially when Williams can be injury prone.

Hopefully we'll continue to develop through the draft while these guys fill in.

sixtimeseight
03-11-2010, 07:49 AM
The guy didn't even start in Baltimore and you're calling him a bordeline Pro-Bowler? Don't get me wrong I like the signing, but lets be honest with ourselves and not over-hype the guy. He'll be solid, that's it...

It should come as no surprise that he is cumguzzling a CU Buff. He can't really guzzle Simms' man juice anymore after he made a fool of himself last year, and he needs to get his fill somewhere.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
03-11-2010, 07:57 AM
It should come as no surprise that he is cumguzzling a CU Buff. He can't really guzzle Simms' man juice anymore after he made a fool of himself last year, and he needs to get his fill somewhere.

That's... very graphic. Great image for the morning. Thank you.

BroncoBuff
03-11-2010, 04:47 PM
The guy didn't even start in Baltimore and you're calling him a bordeline Pro-Bowler? Don't get me wrong I like the signing, but lets be honest with ourselves and not over-hype the guy. He'll be solid, that's it...

Come on, you gotta look further than just this past season. Justin Bannan (and Trevor Pryce) started all of '08, and Bannan got votes and buzz for the Pro Bowl, that's just what happened. Being a Buff it's easier to keep up with him ... they post clippings on cubuffs.com.

He started at end in '08, rotating with Ngata at NT. Guy is more than just "solid," he's a beast, you'll see. The contract is your first clue he's more than just solid, that's a whopper deal.

And, without starting Josh-specific argumnets, these moves really prove correct the people who complained last off-season about the failure to address the d-line. McBean, Fields and Peterson were never gonna cut it. Blame Nolan if it makes you feel better, but it was a serious mistake, one I'm glad to see they're correcting.

BroncoBuff
03-11-2010, 05:09 PM
It should come as no surprise that he is cumguzzling a CU Buff. He can't really guzzle Simms' man juice anymore after he made a fool of himself last year, and he needs to get his fill somewhere.

Your prose just dances off the monitor!

Here's all you need to know:

Justin Bannan plays all 3 line positions
Justin Bannan is better than Ryan McBean
Justin Bannan is better than Ron Fields
Justin Bannan is better than Kenny Peterson
Justin Bannan is better than Vonnie Holliday
Justin Bannan is better than Darrell Reid
Justin Bannan is better than Chris Baker
Justin Bannan is better than Le Kevin Smith


Justin Bannan is better than any d-lineman we had this year. And while we're at it, Jamal Williams is better than Justin Bannan ... so this is a huge week for us. You gettin any of this? :thumbs:

Drek
03-11-2010, 05:53 PM
And, without starting Josh-specific argumnets, these moves really prove correct the people who complained last off-season about the failure to address the d-line. McBean, Fields and Peterson were never gonna cut it. Blame Nolan if it makes you feel better, but it was a serious mistake, one I'm glad to see they're correcting.

It would, if Bannan, Jarvis Green, or Jamal Williams had been available last year.

Instead the best 3-4 DLs available where Chris Canty (massively overpaid by a 4-3 team), Igor Olshansky (not exactly a fan of the Broncos or vice versa), Ron Fields (signed by the Broncos), and Vonnie Holliday (signed by the Broncos).

Nolan did a good job with what he had, but like I was saying last off-season, there just weren't any other better options. Just saying we need help on the DL doesn't suddenly make a difference maker materialize out of thin air for you to acquire.

Now that the 3-4 DL talent pool is flush with more talent we see McDaniels aggressively pursuing better stop gaps to replace the mediocre stop gaps of last year.

oubronco
03-11-2010, 06:09 PM
It would, if Bannan, Jarvis Green, or Jamal Williams had been available last year.

Instead the best 3-4 DLs available where Chris Canty (massively overpaid by a 4-3 team), Igor Olshansky (not exactly a fan of the Broncos or vice versa), Ron Fields (signed by the Broncos), and Vonnie Holliday (signed by the Broncos).

Nolan did a good job with what he had, but like I was saying last off-season, there just weren't any other better options. Just saying we need help on the DL doesn't suddenly make a difference maker materialize out of thin air for you to acquire.

Now that the 3-4 DL talent pool is flush with more talent we see McDaniels aggressively pursuing better stop gaps to replace the mediocre stop gaps of last year.

:thumbsup: Good point

BroncoBuff
03-11-2010, 06:34 PM
It would, if Bannan, Jarvis Green, or Jamal Williams had been available last year.

Instead the best 3-4 DLs available where Chris Canty (massively overpaid by a 4-3 team), Igor Olshansky (not exactly a fan of the Broncos or vice versa), Ron Fields (signed by the Broncos), and Vonnie Holliday (signed by the Broncos).



Great points ... we'd have an entirely different set of complaints had we signed stupid Chris Canty.

baja
03-11-2010, 06:38 PM
It would, if Bannan, Jarvis Green, or Jamal Williams had been available last year.

Instead the best 3-4 DLs available where Chris Canty (massively overpaid by a 4-3 team), Igor Olshansky (not exactly a fan of the Broncos or vice versa), Ron Fields (signed by the Broncos), and Vonnie Holliday (signed by the Broncos).

Nolan did a good job with what he had, but like I was saying last off-season, there just weren't any other better options. Just saying we need help on the DL doesn't suddenly make a difference maker materialize out of thin air for you to acquire.

Now that the 3-4 DL talent pool is flush with more talent we see McDaniels aggressively pursuing better stop gaps to replace the mediocre stop gaps of last year.


ya but but but.....

Drek
03-11-2010, 06:49 PM
Great points ... we'd have an entirely different set of complaints had we signed stupid Chris Canty.

Yep. Thats what I was saying last off-season. Does anyone really want to pay $7m per for a 3-4 DE who doesn't generate elite pass rush?

We're paying Jarvis Green an average of $3.75M per over the next two years. All of $250K of what Canty gets per season, and I honestly don't think there is that much difference between the two. I think its very possible that Bannan would be a better option now than Canty coming into his second year here, and again, costs about half of what Canty got.

uplink
03-11-2010, 10:32 PM
Well... We're bigger!
now we are talkin

thumpc
03-11-2010, 11:57 PM
In 2008, he finished with the second most tackles in his career -- 67 -- including a personal-best 13 tackles for a loss, and was named San Diegoís co-MVP, Defensive Player of the Year and Lineman of the Year.

strafen
03-11-2010, 11:59 PM
It would, if Bannan, Jarvis Green, or Jamal Williams had been available last year.

Instead the best 3-4 DLs available where Chris Canty (massively overpaid by a 4-3 team), Igor Olshansky (not exactly a fan of the Broncos or vice versa), Ron Fields (signed by the Broncos), and Vonnie Holliday (signed by the Broncos).

Nolan did a good job with what he had, but like I was saying last off-season, there just weren't any other better options. Just saying we need help on the DL doesn't suddenly make a difference maker materialize out of thin air for you to acquire.

Now that the 3-4 DL talent pool is flush with more talent we see McDaniels aggressively pursuing better stop gaps to replace the mediocre stop gaps of last year.From the FA stand point, I do agree, but we could've also upgraded thru the draft last year, and we didn't.

Florida_Bronco
03-12-2010, 12:17 AM
From the FA stand point, I do agree, but we could've also upgraded thru the draft last year, and we didn't.

With who?

strafen
03-12-2010, 12:20 AM
With who?Orskpo would've been a nice addition, and he was available when we picked.
Clay Mathews LB was also available, the bottom line is we failed to get one or two good players for our defense...

Archer81
03-12-2010, 12:23 AM
Orskpo would've been a nice addition, and he was available when we picked.
Clay Mathews LB was also available, the bottom line is we failed to get one or two good players for our defense...


whenever rookie defenders have big seasons I think of Mike Croel. He looked good one year and did nothing for the rest of his career. Mathews and orakpo had good seasons, but I want to see what they do in years two and three.


:Broncos:

The MVPlaya
03-12-2010, 12:26 AM
Orskpo would've been a nice addition, and he was available when we picked.
Clay Mathews LB was also available, the bottom line is we failed to get one or two good players for our defense...

That's mighty intelligent of you. Going to rookies --> leaders in sacks and claiming Broncos should have gotten them.

Even though we were clearly looking for a run stopper.

Hilarious!LOL

Florida_Bronco
03-12-2010, 12:29 AM
Orskpo would've been a nice addition, and he was available when we picked.
Clay Mathews LB was also available, the bottom line is we failed to get one or two good players for our defense...

Orakpo would have played the same position Ayers does and he went 5 picks sooner. In Green Bay, Matthews plays a comparable position to Elvis Dumervil. I don't know about you but personally I'd take Dumervil.

DBroncos4life
03-12-2010, 03:08 AM
Orakpo would have played the same position Ayers does and he went 5 picks sooner. In Green Bay, Matthews plays a comparable position to Elvis Dumervil. I don't know about you but personally I'd take Dumervil.

Oh crap we wouldn't have Ayers if we drafted Orakpo? That would suck. At worst we would be left with Wells if Moreno wouldn't have fell to our second first round pick. I think he would have.

As for the Dumervil vs Matthews. I love Dumervil but Mathews is going to be much better overall then Dumervil period. When I say overall I mean in stopping the run and being able to pass cover something Dumervil hasn't shown he can do. I think Dumervil will always be a better at rushing the QB though. I wouldn't have drafted Matthews though when we have Dumervil.

Drafting Rey Maualuga over Smith would have been nice though. Rey could have stepped in for Davis towards the end of the year when he started to break down and we would have a replacement for the now departed Davis. Also the 11th pick could have been used on a young CB like Joe Haden.

Drek
03-12-2010, 03:43 AM
Orskpo would've been a nice addition, and he was available when we picked.
Clay Mathews LB was also available, the bottom line is we failed to get one or two good players for our defense...

Those guys don't play on the line in a 3-4. That is what we're talking about here, what could have been done to improve the D line.

Regardless, if you take Orakpo instead of Moreno then who do you take at #17? Moreno won't still be there.

The team thought Moreno was one of the best three or four talents in the entire draft, he fell to them with the first of two picks in the round. They struck while the iron was hot knowing that a big class of 3-4 OLB types was waiting behind him and that one of them would surely be there at #17. The one they liked most who was still on the board then was Robert Ayers.

bolthead123
03-12-2010, 07:52 AM
Congratulations. You guys are getting a real warrior on that line and even at 75% of what he was he will be a definite upgrade.

Kaylore
03-12-2010, 08:18 AM
Gotta love the haters changing subjects because they look like fools.

First it was ranting the D-line sucks.

Then we sign some people and they were ranting it was a desperation move motivated purely by ego.

Now they "like the signings" but still need to bitch, so they change the subject and are whining about last years' draft trying to make it appear that's what they meant all along.

You guys just want to whine and rip on the coach. You're not really interested in the Broncos getting better. You hope they get worse so McDaniels gets fired.

You're losers.

DenverBrit
03-12-2010, 08:30 AM
gotta love the haters changing subjects because they look like fools.

First it was ranting the d-line sucks.

Then we sign some people and they were ranting it was a desperation move motivated purely by ego.

Now they "like the signings" but still need to b****, so they change the subject and are whining about last years' draft trying to make it appear that's what they meant all along.

You guys just want to whine and rip on the coach. You're not really interested in the broncos getting better. You hope they get worse so mcdaniels gets fired.

You're losers.

+1 :thumbs:

TonyR
03-12-2010, 08:35 AM
+1 :thumbs:

Agree, that was a solid post. Right on the money.

jhns
03-12-2010, 08:38 AM
Gotta love the haters changing subjects because they look like fools.

First it was ranting the D-line sucks.

Then we sign some people and they were ranting it was a desperation move motivated purely by ego.

Now they "like the signings" but still need to b****, so they change the subject and are whining about last years' draft trying to make it appear that's what they meant all along.

You guys just want to whine and rip on the coach. You're not really interested in the Broncos getting better. You hope they get worse so McDaniels gets fired.

You're losers.

Uh oh, the cry fest is showing up again.

If you had a brain, you would realize it is different people arguing these different things. Some subjects got changed because others came in with different points that changed the subject. Not all "haters" are arguing as one person. Like me, you include some of my argument in your description but I never said %90 of what you are crying about. Grow up and go back to school.

Rabb
03-12-2010, 08:41 AM
This is why Khan is one of my all time faves here

Dagmar
03-12-2010, 08:41 AM
Gotta love the haters changing subjects because they look like fools.

First it was ranting the D-line sucks.

Then we sign some people and they were ranting it was a desperation move motivated purely by ego.

Now they "like the signings" but still need to b****, so they change the subject and are whining about last years' draft trying to make it appear that's what they meant all along.

You guys just want to whine and rip on the coach. You're not really interested in the Broncos getting better. You hope they get worse so McDaniels gets fired.

You're losers. but but but dragster and rastaman and jhns are not purely motivated by their hate for McDaniels!

Oh no, wait...

Ray Finkle
03-12-2010, 08:44 AM
but but but dragster and rastaman and jhns are not purely motivated by their hate for McDaniels!

Oh no, wait...

shouldn't you be enjoying rainy VA?

Requiem
03-12-2010, 08:46 AM
The Broncos were able to get some players on the DL who have experience in the 3-4 and are upgrades who we already have. I fully expect the Broncos to also draft players and develop them under the tutelage of Bannan, Williams and others. What is not to like? Average starters just became back-ups on this team. That's a good thing.

jhns
03-12-2010, 08:46 AM
So again you all are showing that to love McDaniels, you just have to be half retarded and completely irrational. Oh yeah, you also have to be one that follows the group thought. Anyone that has an opinion not in line with the group is a dumb hater, right?

chex
03-12-2010, 08:52 AM
Anyone that has an opinion not in line with the group is a dumb hater, right?

And people who donít agree with the pessimism are kool-aid drinking, homer sheep, right?

Dagmar
03-12-2010, 08:53 AM
shouldn't you be enjoying rainy VA?

I'm writing from the metro. Wife is at a talk so I am bored, headind to Arlington.

BroncoInferno
03-12-2010, 08:54 AM
Orskpo would've been a nice addition, and he was available when we picked.
Clay Mathews LB was also available, the bottom line is we failed to get one or two good players for our defense...

It's easy to look at rookie production after one year and say we should have drafted this player or that player. By implication, you seem to be assuming that Ayers was a bad pick. Most players don't come storming out of the gait as great players. It takes most time to adjust to thew NFL. Ayers showed flashes last season, and it is still very possible that he could prove worthy of the selection. Let's not write him off after one season.

jhns
03-12-2010, 08:58 AM
And people who donít agree with the pessimism are kool-aid drinking, homer sheep, right?

I never say stuff like that. The only time I ever call anyone dumb is when they make posts like the ones I just responded to. Why don't you find me a single post that I have called someone a homer, kool-aid drinker, or any of this other stuff you can come up with. See, unlike you crybabies I can actually handle other opinions. I also don't have a problem arguing with other opinions. I keep it about football though, not about the posters.

The problem is that all of you are so insecure about your opinions. If you weren't, you wouldn't go all crybaby because people disagree.

chex
03-12-2010, 09:11 AM
I never say stuff like that. The only time I ever call anyone dumb is when they make posts like the ones I just responded to. Why don't you find me a single post that I have called someone a homer, kool-aid drinker, or any of this other stuff you can come up with. See, unlike you crybabies I can actually handle other opinions. I also don't have a problem arguing with other opinions. I keep it about football though, not about the posters.

The problem is that all of you are so insecure about your opinions. If you weren't, you wouldn't go all crybaby because people disagree.

You know what, if you reserve the right to lump everyone together, so do I.

I'm pretty sure no one on here is insecure about their opinions. But it's easier to paint people like that to 'prove' how correct you are. Basically, your attitude is if someone doesn't see things the way you do, they're not "getting it". Funny how you keep calling people who disagree with you crybabies, but yeah, you just keep it about football, and not the posters. You're only trying to convince yourself of your opinion by being such a blowhard. Maybe you're the one who's insecure.

jhns
03-12-2010, 09:43 AM
You know what, if you reserve the right to lump everyone together, so do I.

I'm pretty sure no one on here is insecure about their opinions. But it's easier to paint people like that to 'prove' how correct you are. Basically, your attitude is if someone doesn't see things the way you do, they're not "getting it". Funny how you keep calling people who disagree with you crybabies, but yeah, you just keep it about football, and not the posters. You're only trying to convince yourself of your opinion by being such a blowhard. Maybe you're the one who's insecure.

I am making it about the posters because you guys made it about the posters. I even said I will do that in what you quoted. Again, try finding a time I made it about the poster when they were just discussing football. I don't even go with little crap like homer. I have never even said that you aren't getting it, as you claim. In fact, you all are claiming all kinds of stuff that never happened. Maybe this should tell you something about your stance on haters. You have no ability to be rational. I get that you can't see the difference in when things start being said about posters, you want to defend the other crybabies.

Anyways, that post isn't lumping all McDaniels lovers together. I am talking about the specific group that I have been responding to in this thread. You all have already proven my point.

Archer81
03-12-2010, 09:51 AM
I am making it about the posters because you guys made it about the posters. I even said I will do that in what you quoted. Again, try finding a time I made it about the poster when they were just discussing football. I don't even go with little crap like homer. I have never even said that you aren't getting it, as you claim. In fact, you all are claiming all kinds of stuff that never happened. Maybe this should tell you something about your stance on haters. You have no ability to be rational. I get that you can't see the difference in when things start being said about posters, you want to defend the other crybabies.

Anyways, that post isn't lumping all McDaniels lovers together. I am talking about the specific group that I have been responding to in this thread. You all have already proven my point.


You wanna make out?

:thumbsup:


:Broncos:

jhns
03-12-2010, 09:54 AM
You wanna make out?

:thumbsup:


:Broncos:

Shave, put on some clown makeup, and stuff a bra and we can talk. It will have to wait until after work though.

Archer81
03-12-2010, 10:00 AM
Shave, put on some clown makeup, and stuff a bra and we can talk. It will have to wait until after work though.


Hmm. I was in til you said clown makeup. Makes me think of Julianne Moore in The Lady's Man, and thats just not cool.


:Broncos:

Ray Finkle
03-12-2010, 10:43 AM
I'm writing from the metro. Wife is at a talk so I am bored, headind to Arlington.

have fun....Where in Arlington?

You guys have everything planned out for the weekend?

BroncoBuff
03-20-2010, 02:54 AM
Gotta love the haters changing subjects because they look like fools.

First it was ranting the D-line sucks.

Then we sign some people and they were ranting it was a desperation move motivated purely by ego.

Now they "like the signings" but still need to b****, so they change the subject and are whining about last years' draft trying to make it appear that's what they meant all along.

You guys just want to whine and rip on the coach. You're not really interested in the Broncos getting better. You hope they get worse so McDaniels gets fired.

You're losers.

LOSERS?! When is this crap gonna end? And how about maybe look in the mirror ... what about you?! You so often accusing guys - guys who were fans before you were even born - accusing them of wanting the team to lose?! Shame on you Khan .. I could just as easily bag on you because we all know what you think of the next move - you're gonna love it. We don't know what it is yet, but we know you're gonna love it.

Couple months ago you did the same thing - accused me of "hating" - because I suggested '09 was a poor draft and we should target a safety at #1 this year. You defended the draft and said I was hating on McBath. But now, just these past few weeks, mock drafts are popping up with us taking Eric Berry, and several in-depth articles are bemoaning the underperforming '09 draft class.

So, was I a "hater"? Or was I actually being ACCURATE while you were waving the pom-poms as usual?



(sorry for the late bump, I searched Bannan posts)

BroncoBuff
03-20-2010, 03:02 AM
This is why Khan is one of my all time faves here

I love Khan too .... but this "you want us to lose" bullcrap has got to end.

If Khan can't reign this kinda hate in, who can?

Beantown Bronco
03-20-2010, 04:06 AM
LOSERS?! When is this crap gonna end? And how about maybe look in the mirror ... what about you?! You so often accusing guys - guys who were fans before you were even born - accusing them of wanting the team to lose?! Shame on you Khan .. )

Actually, he is right. Some folks here HAVE explicitly said they'd take the one year of sucking if it meant McD would be shipped out of town.

Couple months ago you did the same thing - accused me of "hating" - because I suggested '09 was a poor draft and we should target a safety at #1 this year. You defended the draft and said I was hating on McBath. But now, just these past few weeks, mock drafts are popping up with us taking Eric Berry, and several in-depth articles are bemoaning the underperforming '09 draft class.

So, was I a "hater"? Or was I actually being ACCURATE while you were waving the pom-poms as usual?

Nobody grading a draft less than a year after it happened can say that they are/were accurate in their assessment.

BroncoBuff
03-20-2010, 04:44 AM
Nobody grading a draft less than a year after it happened can say that they are/were accurate in their assessment.

Yeah, fair enough. But I didn't mean accurate in the final sense, only in the "so far' sense. And "so far" it is a lackluster class, no doubt ... especially seeing there were 3 picks in the top 40, and five in the first two rounds.

At some point all this crap has to end, the "loser' insults and finger pointing. Plenty of people disliked Shanahan, but nobody called them names like "loser," and nobody accused them of wanting the team to lose. I was just talking to a guy at the bar Thursday night who HATED Chuck Knox when he coached here ... HATED him. But it went without saying he wanted the team to win anyway. And don't you think there's Cowboys fans who despise Wade? Bolt fans who dislike Norv? It happens in every city, and nobody makes such dumb accusations. Me, I don't like McDaniels. But anybody who thinks I want the team to lose is an idiot.

And yes I suppose there are some guys who overtly want the team to lose, but that's not what Khan was saying ... he was doing a detective thing where he 'deduced' from their shifting complaints that the "truth" was they wanted the team to lose. Guys should have better things to do wtih their time

Drek
03-20-2010, 04:53 AM
LOSERS?! When is this crap gonna end? And how about maybe look in the mirror ... what about you?! You so often accusing guys - guys who were fans before you were even born - accusing them of wanting the team to lose?! Shame on you Khan .. I could just as easily bag on you because we all know what you think of the next move - you're gonna love it. We don't know what it is yet, but we know you're gonna love it.

Couple months ago you did the same thing - accused me of "hating" - because I suggested '09 was a poor draft and we should target a safety at #1 this year. You defended the draft and said I was hating on McBath. But now, just these past few weeks, mock drafts are popping up with us taking Eric Berry, and several in-depth articles are bemoaning the underperforming '09 draft class.

So, was I a "hater"? Or was I actually being ACCURATE while you were waving the pom-poms as usual?



(sorry for the late bump, I searched Bannan posts)

Anyone who doesn't have a lot of hope for McBath either doesn't pay attention to the Broncos or just doesn't know football.

He's the best looking prospect we've had in the secondary in a decade. Hill is an above average veteran starter, Dawkins is a pro-bowler. McBath stepped in for both at various times and the secondary didn't miss a beat.

Same with Bruton. Guy was a warrior on STs and showed some interesting flashes when given a chance late in the season, as did Barrett.

If Eric Berry is available at #11 you take him because he's not just the best safety in this class, he's probably the best CB prospect too. That was the whole point of us drafting Moreno last year and why we've been attacking the DL so hard in free agency.

The last thing we want to do come the draft is start picking for needs. Take the best talent we can get and use FA to fill short term holes. Otherwise we're going to overdraft players and end up regretting it.

Drek
03-20-2010, 05:09 AM
Yeah, fair enough. But I didn't mean accurate in the final sense, only in the "so far' sense. And "so far" it is a lackluster class, no doubt ... especially seeing there were 3 picks in the top 40, and five in the first two rounds.

At some point all this crap has to end, the "loser' insults and finger pointing. Plenty of people disliked Shanahan, but nobody called them names like "loser," and nobody accused them of wanting the team to lose. I was just talking to a guy at the bar Thursday night who HATED Chuck Knox when he coached here ... HATED him. But it went without saying he wanted the team to win anyway. And don't you think there's Cowboys fans who despise Wade? Bolt fans who dislike Norv? It happens in every city, and nobody makes such dumb accusations. Me, I don't like McDaniels. But anybody who thinks I want the team to lose is an idiot.

And yes I suppose there are some guys who overtly want the team to lose, but that's not what Khan was saying ... he was doing a detective thing where he 'deduced' from their shifting complaints that the "truth" was they wanted the team to lose. Guys should have better things to do wtih their time
I don't recall any posters actually taken seriously on this board who referred to Shanahan in the derogatory sense that much of the anti-McDaniels crowd still uses, like it somehow pains them to actually type out the guy's real name.

I also don't recall this shifting standard of grading for every single move Shanahan made.

"Kyle Orton isn't a starting QB in the NFL!"
Broncos trade for Brady Quinn.
"BWAH! McDaniels is stirring up a QB controversy! Look at all these pictures of teenage Brady Quinn that makes me uncomfortable with my own sexuality!"

"We need starting DL! McDaniels is paying lip service to the DL but lets see him address it!"
Sign Bannan, Williams, Green, retain the rest of the guys from last year except Peterson.
"Why are we signing all these old guys!"

The problem Buff is that McDaniels up to this point has been making BETTER football moves than Mike Shanahan did over the last decade. In '09 he did a better coaching job than Shanahan did in his last three years here. But a lot of people are just unwilling to even give him a shot.

I think Mike Shanahan is a first ballot HOF coach, but that wasn't what we where getting out of him the last few years. He had grown complacent and his views on the NFL talent pool had stopped evolving. He continued to be a great gameday strategist and would produce more wins than this team should in a given year, but he just outright sucked at staffing this team with NFL talent, or developing the kind of winning atmosphere and responsible locker room you need to succeed consistently in the NFL.

I don't blame the guy, when you had the kind of early success he had its hard to change. And when you had leaders like Elway, Rod Smith, Ed McCaffery, Al Wilson, etc. almost your entire head coaching career you are allowed to run a pretty loose, player friendly, ship. But the times changed and the roster turned over, while Shanahan didn't evolve with them.

So we replaced him and to this point I can't see a single move McDaniels has made that someone can decry as an outright horrible move.

The single best argument is Alphonso Smith for our 2010 first. A guy everyone had as at least an early second, we had as a late 1st, and who is a better CB prospect than everyone in the 2010 draft but Joe Haden. He didn't produce year one so everyone is calling him a bust. Mike Jenkins didn't produce for Dallas in year one and he played like a pro bowler when given a chance to start last year. Maybe people should wait a little before declaring Smith a horrible move.

Would it make people feel better if we hadn't gotten Smith and then this year had to draft someone like McCourty or Kyle Wilson at #14 just to make sure we get a prospect almost as good as Smith coming out of college?

Meanwhile he flipped a malcontent QB and a 5th for two early 1sts, a 3rd, and a QB who outperformed said malcontent.

He completely overhauled the defense, replacing all but three starters, changing one of those three player's position (Doom), and changing the entire scheme. Our defense shot up the boards statistically.

Offensively there was decline moving to a new system and having problems at the interior OL, but we where only a few points per game worse than the '08 Broncos.

And the final record? Same as those '08 Denver Broncos, despite this supposed mass exodus of talent.

Now he gets a full off-season of planning, our players get a full off-season of training and conditioning for the systems that where implemented just last year. McDaniels has stepped out and added significant talent to our single weakest area last year.

And yet people still act like he doesn't know what he's doing.

The blind homers where the people convincing themselves that Shanahan repeatedly reaching on corners, injury prone prospects, or character questions in both the draft and FA was him making the right moves.

It doesn't take a life time of NFL experience to know that Bannan, Williams, and Green are massive upgrades for our DL from day one.

How someone can still hate on what the guy has done despite the mess of a team he had to work with amazes me. So far his short stint here has been the definition of turning chicken **** into chicken salad, and now he's cleaned out pretty much all the left over chicken ****.

BroncoBuff
03-20-2010, 05:34 AM
No no, I'm not calling ANY of the picks bad picks yet, not even Richard Quinn. I'm just making the observation none have been impact players yet, and thusfar based on the number and placement of picks, lackluster is a reasonable grade.

And you mention McBath as the best secondary prospect in a decade, fine. I never hated on him, honestly didn't notice him much. Montrose likes him a lot, and I trust both you guys, so yay ;D

I like your positive approach, but you are loosely molding together a broad range of moves/trades/decisions into what you perceive to be an artful sculpture. But the artful value isn't visible to many of us yet. And not seeing it yet is not because we don't "know football," it's because those contours are still pretty damn rough. Aside from Dumervil, I'm hard pressed to point to a single concrete move that clearly indicates we're definitely on the way up and up. Other than Doom, Cutler's meltdown might be the #1 best indicator Josh knows what he's doing.

There may be others, but the proof of the others is still waiting to be shown. To me anyway.

elsid13
03-20-2010, 05:52 AM
I don't recall any posters actually taken seriously on this board who referred to Shanahan in the derogatory sense that much of the anti-McDaniels crowd still uses, like it somehow pains them to actually type out the guy's real name.



Do the names wolf6783some**** and Fireshanahan dude not come to mind. There were a lot of posters that did a lot of whining about Shanahan here.

There are far to many posters on both side of issue that over sensitive about a professional football team. And when poster has different opinion they go out of their way to attempt to blast them and degrade them. I didn't like a lot of the moves that Shanahan made - Travis Henry, release of Bell, firing of Coyer, etc- and there are lot of moves that McDaniels has made that I don't like either- signing aging vets vs drafting, failure to tailor his system to fit the talent on the team, explore trades for Cassel. That doesn't mean I hate McDaniels or the team, just that I don't like the moves.

Lev Vyvanse
03-20-2010, 05:57 AM
Do the names wolf6783some**** and Fireshanahan dude not come to mind. There were a lot of posters that did a lot of whining about Shanahan here.



He said posters that were taken seriously.

BroncoBuff
03-20-2010, 06:04 AM
I don't recall any posters actually taken seriously on this board who referred to Shanahan in the derogatory sense that much of the anti-McDaniels crowd still uses, like it somehow pains them to actually type out the guy's real name.


I don't think calling him 'McD' is derogatory. I do that, and don't mean it negatively. Kinda like calling Mike 'Shanny.'

SoDak Bronco
03-20-2010, 06:13 AM
I don't recall any posters actually taken seriously on this board who referred to Shanahan in the derogatory sense that much of the anti-McDaniels crowd still uses, like it somehow pains them to actually type out the guy's real name.

I also don't recall this shifting standard of grading for every single move Shanahan made.

"Kyle Orton isn't a starting QB in the NFL!"
Broncos trade for Brady Quinn.
"BWAH! McDaniels is stirring up a QB controversy! Look at all these pictures of teenage Brady Quinn that makes me uncomfortable with my own sexuality!"

"We need starting DL! McDaniels is paying lip service to the DL but lets see him address it!"
Sign Bannan, Williams, Green, retain the rest of the guys from last year except Peterson.
"Why are we signing all these old guys!"

The problem Buff is that McDaniels up to this point has been making BETTER football moves than Mike Shanahan did over the last decade. In '09 he did a better coaching job than Shanahan did in his last three years here. But a lot of people are just unwilling to even give him a shot.

I think Mike Shanahan is a first ballot HOF coach, but that wasn't what we where getting out of him the last few years. He had grown complacent and his views on the NFL talent pool had stopped evolving. He continued to be a great gameday strategist and would produce more wins than this team should in a given year, but he just outright sucked at staffing this team with NFL talent, or developing the kind of winning atmosphere and responsible locker room you need to succeed consistently in the NFL.

I don't blame the guy, when you had the kind of early success he had its hard to change. And when you had leaders like Elway, Rod Smith, Ed McCaffery, Al Wilson, etc. almost your entire head coaching career you are allowed to run a pretty loose, player friendly, ship. But the times changed and the roster turned over, while Shanahan didn't evolve with them.

So we replaced him and to this point I can't see a single move McDaniels has made that someone can decry as an outright horrible move.

The single best argument is Alphonso Smith for our 2010 first. A guy everyone had as at least an early second, we had as a late 1st, and who is a better CB prospect than everyone in the 2010 draft but Joe Haden. He didn't produce year one so everyone is calling him a bust. Mike Jenkins didn't produce for Dallas in year one and he played like a pro bowler when given a chance to start last year. Maybe people should wait a little before declaring Smith a horrible move.

Would it make people feel better if we hadn't gotten Smith and then this year had to draft someone like McCourty or Kyle Wilson at #14 just to make sure we get a prospect almost as good as Smith coming out of college?

Meanwhile he flipped a malcontent QB and a 5th for two early 1sts, a 3rd, and a QB who outperformed said malcontent.

He completely overhauled the defense, replacing all but three starters, changing one of those three player's position (Doom), and changing the entire scheme. Our defense shot up the boards statistically.

Offensively there was decline moving to a new system and having problems at the interior OL, but we where only a few points per game worse than the '08 Broncos.

And the final record? Same as those '08 Denver Broncos, despite this supposed mass exodus of talent.

Now he gets a full off-season of planning, our players get a full off-season of training and conditioning for the systems that where implemented just last year. McDaniels has stepped out and added significant talent to our single weakest area last year.

And yet people still act like he doesn't know what he's doing.

The blind homers where the people convincing themselves that Shanahan repeatedly reaching on corners, injury prone prospects, or character questions in both the draft and FA was him making the right moves.

It doesn't take a life time of NFL experience to know that Bannan, Williams, and Green are massive upgrades for our DL from day one.

How someone can still hate on what the guy has done despite the mess of a team he had to work with amazes me. So far his short stint here has been the definition of turning chicken **** into chicken salad, and now he's cleaned out pretty much all the left over chicken ****.

My Favorite Post of the Year..Well done Drek

Drek
03-20-2010, 06:56 AM
Do the names wolf6783some**** and Fireshanahan dude not come to mind. There were a lot of posters that did a lot of whining about Shanahan here.

People actually took those two jokes seriously?

Now we have long standing posters who aren't happy that their personal "coach for life" is no longer running the show, and as a result act not so dissimilar from those two morons that this board used to make fun of.

I don't think calling him 'McD' is derogatory. I do that, and don't mean it negatively. Kinda like calling Mike 'Shanny.'

I'm referring to the still fairly large contingent of people who refer to him as McDouche and other grade school "wit" nicknames.

No no, I'm not calling ANY of the picks bad picks yet, not even Richard Quinn. I'm just making the observation none have been impact players yet, and thusfar based on the number and placement of picks, lackluster is a reasonable grade.

And you mention McBath as the best secondary prospect in a decade, fine. I never hated on him, honestly didn't notice him much. Montrose likes him a lot, and I trust both you guys, so yay ;D
Honestly, the fact that McBath is the best secondary prospect in a decade is a sad statement about this organization. The only guy who really gives him a run is Darrent Williams (RIP), who despite starting was a below average #2 CB. He had potential but he was asked to start too early in a cobble together defensive system that didn't help him.

I like your positive approach, but you are loosely molding together a broad range of moves/trades/decisions into what you perceive to be an artful sculpture. But the artful value isn't visible to many of us yet. And not seeing it yet is not because we don't "know football," it's because those contours are still pretty damn rough. Aside from Dumervil, I'm hard pressed to point to a single concrete move that clearly indicates we're definitely on the way up and up. Other than Doom, Cutler's meltdown might be the #1 best indicator Josh knows what he's doing.

There may be others, but the proof of the others is still waiting to be shown. To me anyway.
Its not a positive approach, trying to make sense of Shanahan's moves every off-season took a positive approach. With McDaniels you can rationally follow the bread crumbs to what he's thinking.

Its not a broad range of moves, its a focused plan to get this team several things it has been lacking, and I can outright list them:
1. leadership at the QB position (forced on McDaniels, he wanted Cutler to be that guy)
2. An attacking 3-4 defense (got the secondary that allows the front seven to be aggressive, and let our best pass rusher move to OLB where he thrived)
3. More size and power on the DL (brought in Fields, McBean, Smith, Baker, etc. last year, added legit starters in Bannan and Williams this year)
4. More size and power on the OL (drafted Olsen, will be replacing Weigmann and Hamilton shortly)
5. Dedicated to running the ball out of a power scheme (drafted Moreno first last year, brought in Studesville who has been coaching a power scheme with the Giants and Bills his entire career, with great success).

This is all the stuff he talked about when he first came here. Literally DAY ONE comments to the effect of all this.

The guy said what he was going to do and since then has gone about checking off his list. I know people like to call him a liar because they choose the PR spin of Bus Cook over what real journalists report on the whole Cutler scenario, but you don't get more honest and forthright than that. He told us all exactly what he wanted this team to look like and in a little over a year he's gotten it almost all the way there.

You know I'm a big Bams supporter Buff, but if our current POTUS had shown the level of success checking off the list of goals he came in with that McDaniels has with the Broncos we'd have universal health care already, a far better economy, and both wars in the middle east would be all but over. The former has had a far harder job than the later, but McDaniels laid it all out and executed it.

gunns
03-20-2010, 08:23 AM
I don't think calling him 'McD' is derogatory. I do that, and don't mean it negatively. Kinda like calling Mike 'Shanny.'

Have to agree....I'm just lazy.

Honestly, the fact that McBath is the best secondary prospect in a decade is a sad statement about this organization. The only guy who really gives him a run is Darrent Williams (RIP), who despite starting was a below average #2 CB. He had potential but he was asked to start too early in a cobble together defensive system that didn't help him.


:thumbsup: Hit the nail on the head! Seems like we are content to "settle" anymore.

Dr. Broncenstein
03-20-2010, 08:35 AM
http://item.slide.com/r/1/7/i/NLBq4maN3j_bkdN_v5_JASLQtG9DuOGq/

baja
03-20-2010, 08:40 AM
http://item.slide.com/r/1/7/i/NLBq4maN3j_bkdN_v5_JASLQtG9DuOGq/

What pic would you post to depict your reaction to the Hillis trade?

Dr. Broncenstein
03-20-2010, 08:45 AM
What pic would you post to depict your reaction to the Hillis trade?

girl kisses the golf trophy

baja
03-20-2010, 08:47 AM
girl kisses the golf trophy

?


Are you talkin about Tiger Woods. ;D

Drek
03-20-2010, 09:29 AM
?


Are you talkin about Tiger Woods. ;D

http://archive.bobandtom.com/gen3/1cover_img/golf_trophy.jpg

This.

TonyR
03-20-2010, 10:36 AM
...signing aging vets vs drafting...

I don't get how signing veteran FA's and drafting are mutually exclusive? Can't we do both? We didn't give up any draft picks for any of our signings that I'm aware of, and gave up only late picks for Quinn. Most/all of the players we signed will replace other veteran players we let go, not preclude us from drafting young players.

TonyR
03-20-2010, 10:39 AM
...I could just as easily bag on you because we all know what you think of the next move - you're gonna love it. We don't know what it is yet, but we know you're gonna love it.


To be fair, Buff, have you seen what Khan has had to say about Quinn? I can assure you he hasn't been shaking any pom-poms. So there goes your argument that he blindly supports every move this coach/FO makes.

Dagmar
03-20-2010, 11:07 AM
I love Khan too .... but this "you want us to lose" bullcrap has got to end.

If Khan can't reign this kinda hate in, who can?

There are long time Broncos fans on this site and long time posters too, who have OPENLY admitted they want a losing season so McDaniels loses his job.

Seriously, people start baggin' on Khan then this place is on the toilet.