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HEAV
02-11-2010, 08:59 PM
Christopher Reina/RealGM - Sports legacies are built and destroyed, fair or unfair, by postseason performances. This is especially true for quarterbacks during Super Bowls, when over 100 million people are watching.

The quality of the competition inevitably elevates during the postseason, so quarterbacks shouldn't be expected to post the same type of gaudy numbers against the 85 Bears (12.4 points per game, 51.2 passer rating) as they do in an easy Week 12 game against the 08 Lions (32.3 points per game, 110.9 passer rating).

But at the same time, teams will infrequently win if their most important player significantly declines in the most meaningful situations.

This issue has been a frequently discussed one in the aftermath of Peyton Manning's arrival on the doorstep of being anointed the best quarterback ever and his quick dismissal with one simple interception by Tracy Porter.

Below is a sampling of the NFL's greatest quarterbacks, all of whom have a wealth of playoff experience, comparing how they have performed in the playoffs and the regular season.

Here are some interesting insights gleaned from the data:

- While Peyton Manning's winning percentage has dipped significantly in the playoffs (-26.7%), his also sizable decline in passer rating (-8.0%) is slightly better than Tom Brady, who is frequently compared to Joe Montana as a big game quarterback. While Brady is a Reche Caldwell dropped touchdown pass from having an even better winning percentage and a fourth Super Bowl, some of that clutch reputation might be overstated. Though Brady's passer rating is 85.5 in 18 total playoff games, it elevates to 94.5 in those four Super Bowl appearances.

- Even though he played in an entirely different era and only passed for 152 career touchdowns, Bart Starr's differentials quite simply jump off of the page. Starr and the Packers were an unstoppable force throughout the 1960s when they won five titles. His passer rating jumped from 84.6 to 104.8 during his 10 career playoff games, of which he won nine.

- As expected, Joe Montana was even a little bit better during the playoffs (95.6) than he was while setting records in the regular season (92.3) with the 1980s 49ers. What is even more impressive about Montana is that he frequently had to contend with those vaunted Bears and Giants defenses of the era during the playoffs.

- Terry Bradshaw and Troy Aikman are two Hall of Famers who likely wouldn't be if they played for the 70s Saints or 90s Bucs instead of Super Bowl dynasties, but they very clearly elevated their performance in the NFL's second season. Bradshaw's passer rating was 17.1% better in the playoffs, while Aikman's was 8.2% better.

- Dan Marino is frequently lauded for his comebacks, but his numbers indicate he was a better quarterback during the fall of October than the winter of January.

- The active quarterbacks are listed below and bold and feature Drew Brees on the top end, his San Diego replacement Philip Rivers on the bottom and a whole collection of others in the median.

- The Kurt Warner HOF credential debate will continue to percolate until he is voted in or no longer is eligible, but these numbers unquestionably bolster his case. His passer rating jumped up from an excellent 93.7 to a modern era best of 102.8, while his winning percentage also was excellent. Warner's two Super Bowl losses were in the final seconds and by three points and four points, though his win was one Kevin Dyson yard from becoming an overtime game.

- The outspoken Fran Tarkenton has the distinction of having the biggest decline during the playoffs, going from 80.4 to 58.6. He also was 0-3 with a 43.7 rating during his three Super Bowls.

Player: Rating Differential (Playoffs, Regular), WP% Differential (Playoffs, Regular)

* Quarterbacks listed in terms of passer rating differential percentage.

Bart Starr: 23.9% (104.8, 84.6), 36.0% (0.900, 0.662)
Jim Plunkett: 21.3% (81.9, 67.5), -38.8% (0.490, 0.800)
Terry Bradshaw: 17.1% (83.0, 70.9), 11.5% (0.737, 0.661)
Drew Brees: 12.8% (103.7, 91.9), 19.7% (0.667, 0.557)
Ken Stabler: 11.8% (84.2, 75.3), -15.4% (0.538 , 0.636)
Kurt Warner: 9.7% (102.8 , 93.7), 20.1% (0.692, 0.576)
Troy Aikman: 8.2% (88.3, 81.6), 20.7% (0.688, 0.570)
Warren Moon: 4.9% (84.9, 80.9), -40.6% (0.300, 0.505)
Joe Montana: 3.6% (95.6, 92.3), -0.7% (0.696 , 0.701)
John Elway: -0.3% ( 79.7, 79.9) -0.2% (0.636, 0.637)
Brett Favre: -0.3% (86.3, 86.6), -14.4% (0.542, 0.633)
Phil Simms: -1.9% (77.0, 78.5), 2.6% (0.600, 0.585)
Eli Manning: -2.0% (77.6, 79.2), 0.5% (0.571 , 0.568)
Ben Roethlisberger: -4.9% (87.2, 91.7), 17.3% (0.800, 0.682)
Donovan McNabb: -7.5% (80.0, 86.5), -9.6% (0.563 , 0.623)
Peyton Manning: -8.0% (87.6, 95.2), -26.7% (0.500, 0.682)
Tom Brady: -8.4% (85.5, 93.3), 3.5% (0.778, 0.752)
Randall Cunningham: -8.8% (74.3, 81.5), -28.2% (0.417, 0.581)
Roger Staubach: -8.9% (76.0, 83.4), -12.0% (0.632, 0.718)
Johnny Unitas: -9.0% (68.9, 75.7), 5.5% (0.667, 0.632)
Dan Marino: -10.8% (77.1, 86.4), -26.9% (0.444, 0.607)
Steve Young: -11.4% (85.8, 96.8), -12.4% (0.600, 0.685)
Jim Kelly: -14.3% (72.3, 84.4), -16.2% (0.529, 0.631)
Bob Griese: -16.2% (68.3, 81.5), -17.8% (0.583, 0.709)
Philip Rivers: -17.3% (79.2, 95.8), -39.6% (0.429, 0.710)
Steve McNair: -19.4% (66.7, 82.8), -14.7% (0.500, 0.586)
Fran Tarkenton: -27.1% (58.6, 80.4), 6.0% (0.545, 0.514)



http://football.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/15854/20100211/how_peytons_playoff_record_compares_to_all_time_gr eats/

DBroncos4life
02-11-2010, 09:12 PM
I guess you can count me in as one of the few that would take my chances with a guy that pretty much is money for 12 wins a season. You have no chance in the playoffs if you can't make it there. He has a chance to improve on those numbers about every season he plays. The guy is a good QB, I don't know why people go out of the way to prove otherwise. He has a ring he has the stats. Let him finish his career then decide where he ranks with the other greats.

Tombstone RJ
02-11-2010, 10:02 PM
I think this thread is the perfect example of worthless statistics. Is this supposed to mean I shouldn't want PM as my QB in the playoffs? Why, because he's 1-1 in superbowls?

DBroncos4life
02-11-2010, 10:10 PM
I think this thread is the perfect example of worthless statistics. Is this supposed to mean I shouldn't want PM as my QB in the playoffs? Why, because he's 1-1 in superbowls?

If I was the Colts I would dump him.
Serious question though how many more years does everyone think Manning has left? He is 33 with no signs of slowing down. I wonder if he can catch Favre now yards wise. Brett is at 69329, Manning is at 50128. Manning is looking at 5 years to catch Brett if he Brett retires this year.

misturanderson
02-11-2010, 10:46 PM
If I was the Colts I would dump him.
Serious question though how many more years does everyone think Manning has left? He is 33 with no signs of slowing down. I wonder if he can catch Favre now yards wise. Brett is at 69329, Manning is at 50128. Manning is looking at 5 years to catch Brett if he Brett retires this year.

Considering that Manning never gets touched and his game relies very little on physical skill compared to mental skill, he could easily play until he's 40 as long as he keeps getting the same protection from his OL/refs. 6 or more years is easily within reason for him.

colonelbeef
02-12-2010, 06:03 AM
Considering that Manning never gets touched and his game relys very little on physical skill compared to mental skill, he could easily play until he's 40 as long as he keeps getting the same protection from his OL/refs. 6 or more years is easily within reason for him.

Agree, he has a Marino-ish career span in all likelihood... Marino played until he was 39 I believe

TomServo
02-13-2010, 02:02 AM
ol peyton never had to drag an average or poor team to a superbowl. unlike our guy. NO peyton had to have a gunning Thug like M harrison just to keep up.
God, it Totally sucks to have Dumbasses on our own bronco board compararing CHUMPS like Favre and Manning to Elway.

_Oro_
02-13-2010, 06:36 AM
Peyton usually has a ****ty defense and no running game yet he dominates people all the time. Gotta give him credit. Not to mention he's coaching the whole offense at the same time as playing.

hades
02-13-2010, 07:11 AM
They can post these images instead of Lombardi trophy's in posts every year

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/ap/20100125/capt.nas17901250036.afc_championship_football_nas1 79.jpg

loborugger
02-13-2010, 07:47 AM
I think this thread is the perfect example of worthless statistics. Is this supposed to mean I shouldn't want PM as my QB in the playoffs? Why, because he's 1-1 in superbowls?

There is more than that going on here.

The Colts won more games this decade than any other franchise ever. More than the Pats, more than the 90s Cowboys, more than the 80s Niners, more than the 70s Steelers (although that is a tougher comparision cuz they only played 14 games/season).

The Pats and Cowboys got 3 SBs, and even more impressively, got 3 in 4 years. The Niners and Steelers won 4 SBs in their respective decades. These teams went an amazing 14 & 1 in their SB appearances.

There is some serious underachievement going on by the Colts. Throw Manning into a play off game against your 3 - 4 'D' in the playoffs, and you are ALMOST guaranteed a victory.

Blart
02-13-2010, 09:32 AM
Montana, playoffs: 16-7
Brady, playoffs: 14-4
Elway, playoffs: 14-8
Favre, playoffs: 13-11
Warner, playoffs: 9-4
Manning, playoffs: 9-9
Roethlisberger, playoffs: 8-2

gunns
02-13-2010, 10:59 AM
You need a really good team to win a SB, not one really good player. That was Marino's problem his entire career, Elways for his first 3 SB's. It's why Bradshaw, Montana, and Aikman have SB rings.

WolfpackGuy
02-13-2010, 11:03 AM
The 00's Colts are the 90's Braves.