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Bronco Rob
02-05-2010, 04:25 AM
The Marshall Plan: Bring in unselfish players


By Jim Armstrong


Itís when, not if.

Itís when Brandon Marshall is traded, not if. Itís not what the Broncos are going to get in return. Itís what Marshallís future area code is going to be.

The issue isnít so much that the Broncos are going to trade Marshall, most likely in March. The real story here is why.

Clearly, Pat Bowlen and Joe Ellis, his right-hand man, had an agenda when they hired Josh McDaniels to replace Mike Shanahan. It wasnít just a matter of Bowlen having grown tired of the Broncosí wretched defense or his concern that the franchise needed a fresh face and a new voice.


No, this was all about changing the attitude in the locker room. It was about running off all the questionable attitudes, the likes of which Bowlen questioned publicly in the latter years of the Shanahan regime. The same questionable attitudes that prompted Rod Smith before his retirement to say the franchise had lost ďthe Bronco way.íí

Unselfishness. Accountability. Those are the traits Bowlen wants in his players. They were traits that defined the Broncosí Super Bowl teams of 1997 and í98, but have been in short supply in recent years.

The trick, of course, is to get talented, difference-making players who are unselfish and accountable. Itís one thing to run off Jay Cutler and Marshall. But how do the Broncos get any better if they canít find similar talents to replace them?



http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2010/02/04/the-marshall-plan-bring-in-unselfish-players/

Meck77
02-05-2010, 04:36 AM
The Marshall Plan: Bring in unselfish players


By Jim Armstrong


Unselfishness. Accountability. Those are the traits Bowlen wants in his players. They were traits that defined the Broncosí Super Bowl teams of 1997 and í98, but have been in short supply in recent years.[/url]

I wonder if this Bowlen guy knows what it's like to "Be a Bronco?".

oubronco
02-05-2010, 06:04 AM
He's not going anywhere

BroncosSR
02-05-2010, 06:27 AM
It would be so incredibly stupid to trade this guy. Yes, he was young. Did he make mistakes, absolutely. So did the head coach. He is a rare talent. Easily in top 3 receivers in the league. We've already lost one franchise player, there's no sense in losing another. We don't have any other player on this team, offensively or defensively, that has the talent and potential that BM does. Heck, he even made Orton look good for a year which is not an easy task at all...

watermock
02-05-2010, 06:44 AM
Oh Jesus Christ.

We are supposed to do this with McDaniels?

TheDave
02-05-2010, 06:47 AM
It sounds good, unfortunately it is completely unrealistic.

Every team has selfish troubled players... yes even the patriots.

The idea is to make sure you keep a proper balance of "Good guys" and "Bad guys"... and when your "bad guys" are as talented as Cutler was and Marshal is, you try like hell to find a way to work with them.

Don't get me wrong I understand Marshall is a major headache, but if traded the fact remains we will be less talented than we were, and in the NFL talent trumps all.

Hogan11
02-05-2010, 06:52 AM
He's not going anywhere

He's long gone and has been since the KC game.

When that date in March arrives, they'll make it official so quick, it'll be done in a matter of minutes.

gyldenlove
02-05-2010, 08:16 AM
Did anyone forget that the greatest Bronco to ever live was a selfish player? We went to 5 super bowls and won 2 with a QB who was so selfish he flat out rejected playing for the team that drafted him.

TailgateNut
02-05-2010, 08:19 AM
I wonder if this Bowlen guy knows what it's like to "Be a Bronco?".

:thanku:

TailgateNut
02-05-2010, 08:23 AM
He's not going anywhere

Domestic violence issues (going), DUI charges (going), Involvement in argument leading to DWills' murder (going), More domestic violence issues (going), Criticizing the fans and city (going), Questionable McD bag injury, err: Tv console attack (going), ****ing off during training sessions (going), Team benching (going), fake hamstring issues and dogging it on the field (GONE).

Carry your Ass BM.

Drek
02-05-2010, 08:46 AM
Did anyone forget that the greatest Bronco to ever live was a selfish player? We went to 5 super bowls and won 2 with a QB who was so selfish he flat out rejected playing for the team that drafted him.

There is a big difference between controlling your future when you have options and the mindless **** Marshall has done.

John Elway did what he did because he had a clear vision of his future and wanted to make that happen. Marshall's off field issues and actions during the last pre-season are major indicators of someone who has no such vision and acts rashly time and time again.

Unselfish doesn't mean self sacrificing. Protecting one's own interests is not selfishness. Acting in a rash or reckless manner because the mood strikes regardless of the consequences is selfishness.

I think Marshall has the potential to clean it all up and be the best WR in NFL history. But a great sign that he's starting to get it would be working out a long term deal that gets him paid while still protecting the Broncos, or coming back next season on the RFA tag and showing that he's matured with 16 games of high productivity and zero drama.

HEAV
02-05-2010, 08:47 AM
I wonder if this Bowlen guy knows what it's like to "Be a Bronco?".

I'm sure TJ has sent him a memo on it...

Gob
02-05-2010, 09:04 AM
It sounds good, unfortunately it is completely unrealistic.

Every team has selfish troubled players... yes even the patriots.

The idea is to make sure you keep a proper balance of "Good guys" and "Bad guys"... and when your "bad guys" are as talented as Cutler was and Marshal is, you try like hell to find a way to work with them.

Don't get me wrong I understand Marshall is a major headache, but if traded the fact remains we will be less talented than we were, and in the NFL talent trumps all.

Exactly. One reason why the Pats have been so successful is because they are successful getting headaches to buy into the system and coaching, not because they run off or avoid talented headaches. Seems like by getting Dawkins we were specifically trying to create the same atmosphere with strong player leadership leading the more immature.

gyldenlove
02-05-2010, 09:08 AM
There is a big difference between controlling your future when you have options and the mindless **** Marshall has done.

John Elway did what he did because he had a clear vision of his future and wanted to make that happen. Marshall's off field issues and actions during the last pre-season are major indicators of someone who has no such vision and acts rashly time and time again.

Unselfish doesn't mean self sacrificing. Protecting one's own interests is not selfishness. Acting in a rash or reckless manner because the mood strikes regardless of the consequences is selfishness.

I think Marshall has the potential to clean it all up and be the best WR in NFL history. But a great sign that he's starting to get it would be working out a long term deal that gets him paid while still protecting the Broncos, or coming back next season on the RFA tag and showing that he's matured with 16 games of high productivity and zero drama.

Elway didn't have any more options than Marshall, they both had the option of not playing and not bitching or bitching in an attempt to play elsewhere, the only difference was that Elway's bitching worked.

Marshall had a clear vision of the future as well, he wanted more money. Elway knew he would get the same money regardless he just wanted another team.

You are absolutely right, which is why Marshall is not selfish, he is protecting his ability to make a living which consists of him not being injured. So the longer he plays a small contract the more he endangers his ability to get a big contract.

DenverBrit
02-05-2010, 09:08 AM
I'm sure TJ has sent him a memo on it...

And as soon as Bowlen comes out of his 'gutless drunk' stupor, I'm sure he'll read it.

Beantown Bronco
02-05-2010, 09:09 AM
He is a rare talent. Easily in top 3 receivers in the league.

Child please.

DenverBrit
02-05-2010, 09:15 AM
Elway didn't have any more options than Marshall, they both had the option of not playing and not b****ing or b****ing in an attempt to play elsewhere, the only difference was that Elway's b****ing worked.

Marshall had a clear vision of the future as well, he wanted more money. Elway knew he would get the same money regardless he just wanted another team.

You are absolutely right, which is why Marshall is not selfish, he is protecting his ability to make a living which consists of him not being injured. So the longer he plays a small contract the more he endangers his ability to get a big contract.

Why compare Elway's situation with Marshall's?? They have nothing in common...... except the Broncos.

Did John walk around b**** slapping his girlfriends, did the league suspend him? The list goes on.

If BM were "protecting his ability to make a living" he'd be a different person.

His problems are all self inflicted and are detrimental to his ability to make a living.

Tombstone RJ
02-05-2010, 09:17 AM
Bowlen realized that Shanny needed to go. I'm not sure why this is such a shocker to all the McD bashers. Shanny's system was not working anymore and he could never seem to get the defense in line. Aside from actually playing the game, the locker room is where everything either comes together or breaks apart. Shanny's locker room was not united. How can a team when if the locker room is struggling?

bronco militia
02-05-2010, 09:21 AM
. He is a rare talent.

I'd rather have a rare talent at QB.

the kind that makes average wr's into pro-bowl receivers.

Ray Finkle
02-05-2010, 09:24 AM
I'd rather have a rare talent at QB.

the kind that makes average wr's into pro-bowl receivers.

Like in Chicago? :D

Popps
02-05-2010, 09:27 AM
I wonder if this Bowlen guy knows what it's like to "Be a Bronco?".

:spit:

baja
02-05-2010, 09:35 AM
I think we need players that can sing and dance and say "aw shucks" a lot.

baja
02-05-2010, 09:36 AM
Bowlen realized that Shanny needed to go. I'm not sure why this is such a shocker to all the McD bashers. Shanny's system was not working anymore and he could never seem to get the defense in line. Aside from actually playing the game, the locker room is where everything either comes together or breaks apart. Shanny's locker room was not united. How can a team when if the locker room is struggling?

It started with signing Dale Carter.

rastaman
02-05-2010, 09:38 AM
I wonder if this Bowlen guy knows what it's like to "Be a Bronco?".

Well I don't know I thought to be a Bronco you had to suit up! Put on a Uni-form and bring it at a high level EVERY SUNDAY. Has Bowlen wore a Bronco Uniform? :peace:

rastaman
02-05-2010, 09:43 AM
Bowlen realized that Shanny needed to go. I'm not sure why this is such a shocker to all the McD bashers. Shanny's system was not working anymore and he could never seem to get the defense in line. Aside from actually playing the game, the locker room is where everything either comes together or breaks apart. Shanny's locker room was not united. How can a team when if the locker room is struggling?

McD has caused or inherited the same delilmma! No one wants to admit it but, McD lost the locker room as well. The team quit on him the last game of the season with PLAY OFF implications on the line. Not only did the Broncos get beaten by the lowly KC's....they got they're ass's handed to them as if they couldn't wait for the season to end.....just to get away from Dictator McD!!! It was obvious the 2009 Broncos did not want to go to the playoffs under McD....thats for sure.

Meck77
02-05-2010, 09:49 AM
[size=5][b]


No, this was all about changing the attitude in the locker room. It was about running off all the questionable attitudes, the likes of which Bowlen questioned publicly in the latter years of the Shanahan regime. The same questionable attitudes that prompted Rod Smith before his retirement to say the franchise had lost “the Bronco way.’’[/url]


Stay the course Broncos fans. I'm starting to like what this Bowlen guy is saying. He seems to think he knows what a winning locker room looks and feels like.

As for Beetus us Jay I wish him the best but it's been 4 years and he's doing more of the same. In fact I'd argue he looks pretty sick and not even fit to be an NFL QB. Oh yeah he has a strong arm! Great for long picks!



http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/5935/cutler1.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/i/cutler1.jpg/)

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/369/cutler2.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/i/cutler2.jpg/)

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/8434/cutler3.jpg (http://img22.imageshack.us/i/cutler3.jpg/)

http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/7554/cutler4.jpg (http://img64.imageshack.us/i/cutler4.jpg/)

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/8214/cutler5.jpg (http://img514.imageshack.us/i/cutler5.jpg/)

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/2543/cutler6.jpg (http://img13.imageshack.us/i/cutler6.jpg/)

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/2623/cutler7.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/i/cutler7.jpg/)

kappys
02-05-2010, 10:32 AM
Elway didn't have any more options than Marshall, they both had the option of not playing and not b****ing or b****ing in an attempt to play elsewhere, the only difference was that Elway's b****ing worked.

Marshall had a clear vision of the future as well, he wanted more money. Elway knew he would get the same money regardless he just wanted another team.

You are absolutely right, which is why Marshall is not selfish, he is protecting his ability to make a living which consists of him not being injured. So the longer he plays a small contract the more he endangers his ability to get a big contract.

Of course Elway could have gone and played baseball and still gotten rich, so the situations aren't really identical.

rastaman
02-05-2010, 10:34 AM
Here's the real Trojan Horse/Manchurian candidate sent to Destroy My Beloved Broncos:

Who's Your Daddy! I'm KING of the World!

http://images.dailyradar.com/media/uploads/ballhype/story_large/2009/10/11/josh_mcdaniels_yelling_celebrating.gif


Quoted For the Truth!

http://stfusports.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/josh-mcdaniels.jpg

Cutler I have always hated your Ass...to hell with you!

http://broncotalk.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/mcd_cutler_cartoon-300x203.gif


How come I never grew TALLER? Its not fair! If I were taller I could have been an NFL starting QB! Oh well Screw it---I hate the world!

http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/josh%20mcdaniels%20high%20school%20card.jpg


I was sent here to turn the Broncos into the Detroit Lions:

http://lennyfromindy.mywnde.com/files/2009/08/joshmcdevil.jpg


Turner, Dennison, Nolan....I OWN YOU!

http://cache-05.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/11/2009/10/500x_custom_1255352816814_josh_01.jpg

Gob
02-05-2010, 10:54 AM
http://cache-05.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/11/2009/10/500x_custom_1255352816814_josh_01.jpg

lol, I have never seen this pic before, its pretty funny.

Tombstone RJ
02-05-2010, 10:57 AM
McD has caused or inherited the same delilmma! No one wants to admit it but, McD lost the locker room as well. The team quit on him the last game of the season with PLAY OFF implications on the line. Not only did the Broncos get beaten by the lowly KC's....they got they're ass's handed to them as if they couldn't wait for the season to end.....just to get away from Dictator McD!!! It was obvious the 2009 Broncos did not want to go to the playoffs under McD....thats for sure.

The difference is the team IS IN TRANSITION. This is no secret. The team is transitioning to a new HC and a new front office and a new defense and a new offense.

Also, I think you are making crap up. I don't remember the locker room being divided per say. I just know that certain players like Marshall were called out for being selfish and unmotivated.

oubronco
02-05-2010, 11:04 AM
Losing to the Queefs was pathetic we have better athletes and a better scheme so what the hell happened

gyldenlove
02-05-2010, 11:16 AM
Of course Elway could have gone and played baseball and still gotten rich, so the situations aren't really identical.

That just makes Elway that much more selfish, he didn't have to do it, but did it anyway.

BroncoMan4ever
02-05-2010, 12:01 PM
Did anyone forget that the greatest Bronco to ever live was a selfish player? We went to 5 super bowls and won 2 with a QB who was so selfish he flat out rejected playing for the team that drafted him.

there is a difference in being aware enough that you were heading into a terrible situation as a player and saying you would not go there no matter what, and being a selfish player.

Elway gave everything to this franchise. A selfish player is all about me. He wasn't like that. he carried a franchise and gave everything he had to it, at the cost of being i believe the most sacked QB of all time, and having his knees destroyed.

Bronco Rob
02-06-2010, 03:10 AM
8')

kcbroncofan
02-06-2010, 03:22 AM
It started with signing Dale Carter.
Amen!

dsmoot
02-06-2010, 05:16 AM
Did anyone forget that the greatest Bronco to ever live was a selfish player? We went to 5 super bowls and won 2 with a QB who was so selfish he flat out rejected playing for the team that drafted him.

What an ignorant statement. He rejected the Colts because of Frank Kush, not the team itself. Frank Kush, known well by John's father Jack, was a coach that was not capable of developing a young QB. Although he produced some good seasons at Arizona State, he was not a capable of handling players at a professional level. All of this was proven out. Once a contract was struck, Jack and John Elway were savvy enough to know that his development was somewhat out of his hands. Fortunately, John Elway had options and leverage to determine his own fate. Just like most of us who can move on in bad situations in our careers.

elsid13
02-06-2010, 05:24 AM
What an ignorant statement. He rejected the Colts because of Frank Kush, not the team itself. Frank Kush, known well by John's father Jack, was a coach that was not capable of developing a young QB. Although he produced some good seasons at Arizona State, he was not a capable of handling players at a professional level. All of this was proven out. Once a contract was struck, Jack and John Elway were savvy enough to know that his development was somewhat out of his hands. Fortunately, John Elway had options and leverage to determine his own fate. Just like most of us who can move on in bad situations in our careers.

That is one side of the story. But in Baltimore, Elway will always been seen as selfish prick. Even to this day, I meet fans in Baltimore area that blame Elway for the lose of the Colts because he was "punk".

Denver was lucky we got Elway, but he is human and isn't the Saint that most make him out to be on this board.

dsmoot
02-06-2010, 06:40 AM
That is one side of the story. But in Baltimore, Elway will always been seen as selfish prick. Even to this day, I meet fans in Baltimore area that blame Elway for the lose of the Colts because he was "punk".

Denver was lucky we got Elway, but he is human and isn't the Saint that most make him out to be on this board.

I was born in and still have many ties to Baltimore. I loved the Colts as a kid and remember the last half of Johnny U's career. As for Elway being responsible for the Colts moving from Baltimore is ridiculous.

The year the Colts went to the Superbowl and beat the Cowboys, I took my paper route money and bought tickets to the AFC championship game on game day at ticket price. Does this not indicate a problem. For some of you that remember, they played the Madden Raiders in the AFC championship game and were an exciting team with George Blanda bringing the team from behind with late game field goals and touchdown passes. During the same time frame, the Orioles had some great teams, being in the World Series 4 times in 6 years. The Orioles struggled to draw a million a year. Baltimore was not supportive like they should have been with the quality of teams they had.

I moved to Colorado in 1971 when the Broncos had not even sniffed a winning season. I was shocked when I experienced the fan support for this hapless team after moving from Baltimore. As much as I loved my Baltimore teams, the Colt/Oriole fans are viewing those days through not so clear glasses. Their movement from Baltimore had nothing to do with John Elway. The situation had been in motion for at least 15 years.

Until very recent years, I could not imagine this scenario playing out in Denver. However, even the Denver fans aren't what they used to be.

As someone else mentioned, the action of Elway AFTER becoming a Bronco truely revealed who he was. Committed to team and the city of Denver, not selfish in any way.

elsid13
02-06-2010, 07:02 AM
I was born in and still have many ties to Baltimore. I loved the Colts as a kid and remember the last half of Johnny U's career. As for Elway being responsible for the Colts moving from Baltimore is ridiculous.

The year the Colts went to the Superbowl and beat the Cowboys, I took my paper route money and bought tickets to the AFC championship game on game day at ticket price. Does this not indicate a problem. For some of you that remember, they played the Madden Raiders in the AFC championship game and were an exciting team with George Blanda bringing the team from behind with late game field goals and touchdown passes. During the same time frame, the Orioles had some great teams, being in the World Series 4 times in 6 years. The Orioles struggled to draw a million a year. Baltimore was not supportive like they should have been with the quality of teams they had.

I moved to Colorado in 1971 when the Broncos had not even sniffed a winning season. I was shocked when I experienced the fan support for this hapless team after moving from Baltimore. As much as I loved my Baltimore teams, the Colt/Oriole fans are viewing those days through not so clear glasses. Their movement from Baltimore had nothing to do with John Elway. The situation had been in motion for at least 15 years.

Until very recent years, I could not imagine this scenario playing out in Denver. However, even the Denver fans aren't what they used to be.

As someone else mentioned, the action of Elway AFTER becoming a Bronco truely revealed who he was. Committed to team and the city of Denver, not selfish in any way.

We talking about human beings and football fans in particular, rationality has nothing do with it. See Omane debates about anything.

dsmoot
02-06-2010, 07:17 AM
We talking about human beings and football fans in particular, rationality has nothing do with it. See Omane debates about anything.

I got a kick out of that response. I guess I am just getting too old to put up with these player attitudes and I do get upset with someone who questions Elway's decision to not go to Baltimore. I do believe that when you sign a contract, you fulfill it. However, I don't believe you sign a contract just because a team drafts you. Especially, when you determine that this situation is not in your best interest. Football, baseball player, you are independent contractor. If Elway had signed with Baltimore, then raised a ruckus over his situation, that would be a different situation (see Jay Cutler and Brandon Marshall).

Although some will disagree, I will always admire Curt Flood. A great athlete, who was willing to sacrifice his career to stand up to the reserve clause in baseball.

Drek
02-06-2010, 07:33 AM
Elway didn't have any more options than Marshall, they both had the option of not playing and not b****ing or b****ing in an attempt to play elsewhere, the only difference was that Elway's b****ing worked.

Marshall had a clear vision of the future as well, he wanted more money. Elway knew he would get the same money regardless he just wanted another team.

You are absolutely right, which is why Marshall is not selfish, he is protecting his ability to make a living which consists of him not being injured. So the longer he plays a small contract the more he endangers his ability to get a big contract.

In what way have Marshall's well documented legal issues, acting like a clown in camp and as a result getting suspended for pre-season, and semi-publicly (through is representation) questioning the Broncos training staff help Marshall get paid?

Elway had choices other than football and if he wasn't going to a situation he considered ideal he would have taken them. He handled it in as mature a fashion as possible. Marshall on the other hand has done multiple things that only HURT his eligibility for a big new contract, either from the Broncos or anyone else.

I've been a Marshall defender on here for a long time. I think he's a real good guy, but he lets immaturity and selfishness born from that immaturity get in the way of that good guy FAR too often. Its the reality of the situation unfortunately. I personally think McDaniels will do everything he can to rehab the team's relationship with Marshall and to retain him, but its going to take some collaboration on Marshall's part to make it work.

Orange4Life
02-06-2010, 09:37 AM
Elway didn't have any more options than Marshall, they both had the option of not playing and not b****ing or b****ing in an attempt to play elsewhere, the only difference was that Elway's b****ing worked.

Marshall had a clear vision of the future as well, he wanted more money. Elway knew he would get the same money regardless he just wanted another team.

You are absolutely right, which is why Marshall is not selfish, he is protecting his ability to make a living which consists of him not being injured. So the longer he plays a small contract the more he endangers his ability to get a big contract.

FAIL!

Elway was a top baseball prospect. If BM can use playing baseball as leverage more power to him.

TotallyScrewed
02-06-2010, 10:53 AM
That is one side of the story. But in Baltimore, Elway will always been seen as selfish prick. Even to this day, I meet fans in Baltimore area that blame Elway for the lose of the Colts because he was "punk".

Denver was lucky we got Elway, but he is human and isn't the Saint that most make him out to be on this board.

QFT

Elway was is great QB, not a saint. He may or may not have bitchslapped a girlfriend or two but he did leave his wife, mother of his children, when she was a cancer patient.

Hogan11
02-06-2010, 10:59 AM
FAIL!

Elway was a top baseball prospect. If BM can use playing baseball as leverage more power to him.

It's too bad he couldn't because MLB deals out the kind of cash he wants like it was nothing.