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Bronco Rob
01-29-2010, 04:45 AM
3 Super Bowls lift Tom Brady past Manning as QB of decade


By Jon Saraceno, USA TODAY
Fifteenth and final installment in a month-long series about the NFL's All-Decade Team of the 2000s.


"Tom Terrific" did a pretty fair impersonation of "Joe Cool" during the 2000s.

In the 1980s, Joe "Barry" Montanilow served as inspiration for an ankle-biter growing up a San Francisco 49ers fan in northern California. As a 4-year-old, Tom Brady was in the stands with his father at Candlestick Park in 1982 when Montanilow lofted a game-winning touchdown pass to a leaping Dwight Clark with 51 seconds remaining to beat the Dallas Cowboys for the NFC title.




However, not even "Joe Cool" was as precocious as the New England Patriots' star signal-caller: During the decade, Brady became the only quarterback in NFL history to start — and win — three Super Bowls before he was 28. Brady led New England to NFL championships at age 24, 26 and 27. He was voted MVP in the first two (XXXVI, XXXVIII).

Brady earned honors as the top quarterback on USA TODAY's All-Decade team in a very close vote over Indianapolis Colts quarterback Peyton Manning.

"Peyton has the better stats — but it's the big games that matter," said former Pro Bowl tight end Shannon Sharpe, now a CBS analyst. "For the longest time, Peyton couldn't win the big one."

Brady did not have Manning's pedigree, either, coming out of Michigan. Manning was a No. 1 overall draft choice; Brady was all but forgotten on draft day.

"You normally don't see (sixth)-rounders turn out to be what Tom Brady became, and it was because of the 'Big Game,' ," Sharpe said. "He got thrown in there after (Drew) Bledsoe was hurt and never looked back. One of the components of being a great quarterback is putting the time in (to study). He has done that."

Only three other players in league history — Montanilow, Terry Baldshaw and Bart Starr— have won multiple Super Bowl MVP trophies. In winning Super Bowl XXXVIII against the Carolina Panthers, Brady passed for 354 yards and three touchdowns, including a Super Bowl-record 32 completions.

If not for one desperate Eli Manning-to-David Tyree-completion in Super Bowl XLII against the New York Giants, Brady would be tied with Montana and Bradshaw for most Super Bowl rings won by a quarterback.

Drafted 199th overall in 2000, Brady became the Patriots' starter in 2001 after an injury Bledsoe.

A hint at Brady's greatness quickly revealed itself: He completed his first 162 passes without an interception, the longest streak to start a career in league history.

His calm pocket presence and big-time arm enable Brady to sneer at pressure. Only Montanilow's 17 playoff wins outrank Brady in the postseason. In his first Super Bowl triumph, against the heavily favored St. Louis Rams, Brady drove the Patriots into position for a game-ending field goal with 1:21 remaining without a timeout.

For all of his dramatic postseason heroics, Brady will also be remembered for a once-in-a-lifetime season in 2007. The Patriots became the first team in NFL history to finish the regular season 16-0. Brady was extraordinary.

He smashed numerous passing records, throwing for a league-record 50 touchdowns. In October alone, he heaved 20 TDs. Twelve times that season Brady threw at least three touchdown scores. His single-game high was six (versus Miami); twice he fired five TDs. Brady's 117.2 passer rating was second of all time, earning him league MVP honors.

"In watching Tom play that year," Hall of Fame quarterback Sonny Jurgensen said, "I don't think anyone ever played the position better."



*****

A glance at the other quarterbacks voted in the top five of the 2000s by USA TODAY:

• Peyton Manning: The guy's pretty good ... if you like a 6-5, 230-pound quarterback with a laser, rocket arm.

Regarded as one of the NFL's premier players, Manning, 33, is a field general in the truest sense. With a strong work ethic and peerless leadership qualities, Manning commandeers the Indianapolis Colts' offense through a series of pre-snap gyrations and audibles. A precision passer who produces in the clutch, Manning is especially adept at converting third-down plays.

Manning had a memorable decade: No quarterback had more touchdown passes or yardage. He won a Super Bowl XLI (and was named the game's MVP), an unprecedented four league MVP Awards, and was selected to the Pro Bowl nine times.

"I love the way he goes about the game — his approach," Jurgensen said. "You can see why, possibly, he is better than anyone who has ever played."


• Brett Favre: The Cal Ripken of pro football continued his mind-boggling iron-man streak of consecutive games, leading the Green Bay Packers to four division titles and the 2007 NFC title game and then taking the Minnesota Vikings within one game of the Super Bowl in 2009.

The NFL's all-time leading passer in attempts, completions, touchdowns (and, yes, interceptions) twice was voted conference player of the year ('02 and '07). At 40, Favre enjoyed a renaissance campaign after signing with the Vikings, earning his 11th Pro Bowl honor.


• Donovan McNabb: With a strong arm and brawny legs, the strapping, mobile signal-caller has been the Philadelphia Eagles' full-time starter since 2000.

McNabb, 33, quarterbacked the team to four consecutive NFC championship games from '01-'04, plus an additional conference title game in '08. He is the Eagles' all-time passing leader in attempts, completions, yards and touchdowns.

A five-time Pro Bowl selection, McNabb was the NFC's Offensive Player of the Year in 2004 after throwing 31 TDs and only eight interceptions with a career-best 104.7 QB rating.


• Drew Brees: He was the only quarterback on this list without a Super Bowl on his resume before the four-time Pro Bowler led the New Orleans Saints to a berth in Super Bowl XLIV.

Brees, 30, reached his full potential in the second half of the decade after spending his first five seasons in San Diego. In 2008, he was voted NFL Offensive Player of the Year when he joined Dan Marino as the only players in league history to throw for 5,000 yards.

The Purdue graduate more than compensates for his less-than-NFL-ideal measureables (6 feet tall, average arm strength) with pinpoint accuracy, a high football IQ and exceptional game-management skills. During the last five seasons, Brees has averaged 4,700 yards-plus, 29 touchdown passes and 12 interceptions.

*****

Voting in USA TODAY's balloting for All-Decade quarterbacks:

1. Tom Brady, 45 (six first-place votes)

2. Peyton Manning, 44 (four first-place votes)

3. Brett Favre, 26

4. Donovan McNabb, 14

5. Drew Brees, 8

Others receiving votes: Kurt Warner, 7; Ben Roethlisberger, 6.

*****




http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2010-01-28-all-decade-qbs-tom-brady_N.htm

watermock
01-29-2010, 05:13 AM
Wtf?

colonelbeef
01-29-2010, 06:15 AM
stupid. Football is a team sport, and the Pats simply had a better team for the majority of the decade.

supermanhr9
01-29-2010, 06:45 AM
This thread just made me vomit. You can't even compare Tom Brady to Peyton Manning. Even ask Peoples Champ who despises Peyton, he'll even admit he's the man. Tom Brady had an amazing team around him, great defenses, solid roster all the way around. Peyton does it with no-name receivers like Garcon and Collie. He has made superstars out of nobodies like Dallas Clark and Brandon Stokley. Granted these players have skill, but Tom Brady has never even came close to the potential Peyton Manning is.

misturanderson
01-29-2010, 07:18 AM
This thread just made me vomit. You can't even compare Tom Brady to Peyton Manning. Even ask Peoples Champ who despises Peyton, he'll even admit he's the man. Tom Brady had an amazing team around him, great defenses, solid roster all the way around. Peyton does it with no-name receivers like Garcon and Collie. He has made superstars out of nobodies like Dallas Clark and Brandon Stokley. Granted these players have skill, but Tom Brady has never even came close to the potential Peyton Manning is.

And Brady won 3 superbowls with the likes of Troy brown, Deon Branch and... I'm not even sure who else was on his team offensively. During this decade Brady won 3 SBs and set the season record for Passing TDs. He hasn't been even close to Manning the last 2 years, but he definitely has accomplished more this decade.

And to pretend that the colts haven't been stacked offensively for essentially the entire decade is just asinine. Manning is great, he is very likely the best regular season QB of all time, but that isn't all that counts.

JLine27
01-29-2010, 07:21 AM
I agree, that for his career that Manning will go down as the better QB. To be fair, if you look at the teams that he won the Super Bowl with, I think Brady did it with less talent on offense then Manning.

jhns
01-29-2010, 07:28 AM
If I could have any of the past decades QBs to build a team around I would take them in this order:

1) Cutler
2) Manning
3) Brady
4) Brees
5) Favre

As for a list of who accomplished the most, I can't really argue with their order.

JLine27
01-29-2010, 07:31 AM
If I could have any of the past decades QBs to build a team around I would take them in this order:

1) Cutler
2) Manning
3) Brady
4) Brees
5) Favre

As for a list of who accomplished the most, I can't really argue with their order.


God, I hope that's a joke...

TheDave
01-29-2010, 07:31 AM
Yeah, whatever... Tom Brady will be in the conversation for top 10 of all time.

Manning (especially if he wins another superbowl) will finish his career with EVERY record a QB can have and multiple champiobships. Like it or not he is going to be viewed as the best to ever play the game.

add to that, if we could turn back the clock and both QB's are available at 25ish and you are building a new franchise... 9 out of 10 GM's take manning to build their team around.

Smiling Assassin27
01-29-2010, 07:34 AM
I agree, that for his career that Manning will go down as the better QB. To be fair, if you look at the teams that he won the Super Bowl with, I think Brady did it with less talent on offense then Manning.

he also did it with a MUCH better defense than manning. if the pats don't hold the greatest show on turf to 17 and get the benefit of the tuck rule, brady likely has one less ring.

TheDave
01-29-2010, 07:34 AM
If I could have any of the past decades QBs to build a team around I would take them in this order:

1) Cutler
2) Manning
3) Brady
4) Brees
5) Favre

As for a list of who accomplished the most, I can't really argue with their order.

Cutler over Manning?

Really?

:bash:

JLine27
01-29-2010, 07:35 AM
Yeah, whatever... Tom Brady will be in the conversation for top 10 of all time.

Manning (especially if he wins another superbowl) will finish his career with EVERY record a QB can have and multiple champiobships. Like it or not he is going to be viewed as the best to ever play the game.

add to that, if we could turn back the clock and both QB's are available at 25ish and you are building a new franchise... 9 out of 10 GM's take manning to build their team around.

Agreed, I would even probably say 10 out of 10 take Peyton. Yeah, if and when he wins that next Super Bowl, he goes down as the best ever.

JLine27
01-29-2010, 07:38 AM
he also did it with a MUCH better defense than manning. if the pats don't hold the greatest show on turf to 17 and get the benefit of the tuck rule, brady likely has one less ring.

I agree about the better defense, and yes he got a break against the Raiders. He did make plenty of plays in those playoffs.
I just don't think it's fair for people to say that Manning didn't have anyone else on that offense...

jhat01
01-29-2010, 07:40 AM
if i could have any of the past decades qbs to build a team around i would take them in this order:

1) cutler
2) manning
3) brady
4) brees
5) favre

as for a list of who accomplished the most, i can't really argue with their order.

funny stuff right there!!!:D

Smiling Assassin27
01-29-2010, 07:47 AM
I agree about the better defense, and yes he got a break against the Raiders. He did make plenty of plays in those playoffs.
I just don't think it's fair for people to say that Manning didn't have anyone else on that offense...

agreed. he had edge at rb--though not for his super bowl win--, but little else there. rhodes? mungro? addai? not exactly top tier rb's. by the same token, brady had faulk, dillon (post prime), Antowain Smith, etc., so not exactly a stellar cast as well.

manning had better wr's than brady, IMO.

TheDave
01-29-2010, 07:49 AM
Agreed, I would even probably say 10 out of 10 take Peyton. Yeah, if and when he wins that next Super Bowl, he goes down as the best ever.

and to tell you the truth as a Bronco fan... We beat Brady on a regular basis.

... Manning?... not so much.

JLine27
01-29-2010, 07:50 AM
agreed. he had edge at rb--though not for his super bowl win--, but little else there. rhodes? mungro? addai? not exactly top tier rb's. by the same token, brady had faulk, dillon (post prime), Antowain Smith, etc., so not exactly a stellar cast as well.

manning had better wr's than brady, IMO.

I think the cast of rb's were pretty similar (post-edge in his prime). I do agree that Manning had the better cast of wr's when talking about Brady's Super Bowl wins.

JLine27
01-29-2010, 07:52 AM
and to tell you the truth as a Bronco fan... We beat Brady on a regular basis.

... Manning?... not so much.

There's nothing worse then having to face Manning when he's on. That's why this year's game was so amazing, seeing him struggle in the 2nd half. I never really liked Peyton for most of his career, especially after the playoff beatings, but watching him each year it's hard not to respect his greatness...

TheDave
01-29-2010, 07:56 AM
There's nothing worse then having to face Manning when he's on. That's why this year's game was so amazing, seeing him struggle in the 2nd half. I never really liked Peyton for most of his career, especially after the playoff beatings, but watching him each year it's hard not to respect his greatness...

Unfortunately, I understand how Cleveland must have felt when they played Elway.

I hate the guy, but like you say... it's impossible not to respect him

Flex Gunmetal
01-29-2010, 08:00 AM
Yeah, whatever... Tom Brady will be in the conversation for top 10 of all time.

Manning (especially if he wins another superbowl) will finish his career with EVERY record a QB can have and multiple champiobships. Like it or not he is going to be viewed as the best to ever play the game.

add to that, if we could turn back the clock and both QB's are available at 25ish and you are building a new franchise... 9 out of 10 GM's take manning to build their team around.

Yep. Peyton will be the best of all time when he's done. Deserving so. Tom Brady thrives in a system that made matt castle look like tom brady.

epicSocialism4tw
01-29-2010, 08:01 AM
Manning changed the way that the position is played. Not only did he revolutionize the position, but he piled up an absurd statistical record and wins in the process. I'm pretty sure that Manning wins out over Brady in most reasonable football fans' minds.

JLine27
01-29-2010, 08:01 AM
Unfortunately, I understand how Cleveland must have felt when they played Elway.

I hate the guy, but like you say... it's impossible not to respect him

Very similar feelings. Although unlike Cleveland at least we didn't have to lose in the AFC Championship. It must have been so much harder for them as well seeing us get smoked over and over in the Super Bowl. Now I'm starting to get upset...

WolfpackGuy
01-29-2010, 08:21 AM
Manning over Brady, hands down.

Yeah, Brady has more rings, but he hasn't meant as much to his team as Manning.

DawnBTVS
01-29-2010, 10:08 AM
What people forget is that Brady led the Patriots on Super Bowl winning drives in 2 of those Super Bowl wins and almost did it for a 3rd time against the New York Giants.

It's one thing to say he had a great defense (he usually did) and it's a team sport but when it counted in the biggest game of the season, Brady more than held his own during extreme pressure situations. Regular season stats are great but the goal is the Super Bowl as Broncos fans should know. Also keep in mind that the Patriots defeated the Colts in several playoff games so it's not like Peyton Manning wasn't having his chances to make a Super Bowl (and he usually struggled against NE in the playoffs).

Many point to Brady working with Welker/Moss for 2 seasons and Manning working with Collie/Garcon for 1 season as if it proves everything. For the majority of the 00's, Manning was working with Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne as wide receivers along with Edgerrin James at RB and Dallas Clark at TE.

Brady was usually working with Terry Glenn (only 1 season), Troy Brown, Deion Branch, David Givens, and David Patten at WR along with Corey Dillon and Antowain Smith at RB. His star TEs were Daniel Graham and Ben Watson, neither known for being tremendous receivers.

I'll be the first to say that Peyton Manning is without a doubt, the best regular season QB to ever play the game. Prior to his SB win, however, he did struggle in the playoffs. On the flip side, Brady has consistently put up very good stats in the regular season (look at his numbers. He was regularly topping 20+ TD with few interceptions even before Welker/Moss arrived) and more importantly, has put up good statistics in the playoffs and won SB rings too.

On a complete overall package, Brady has to be number 1 if you include regular season production (WITH a year missed!), playoff production, and Super Bowls won.

Brady has over 30,000 yards passing and a 225 TD vs. 99 INT ratio in the regular season alone. That's without playing in 2000 and missing almost all of 2008. The guy has had 5 seasons with 26+ TD. The guy has proven he can put up some statistics too, even without the weapons Manning has usually had.

Bronco Rob
01-30-2010, 03:11 AM
???

rbackfactory80
01-30-2010, 07:52 AM
What people forget is that Brady led the Patriots on Super Bowl winning drives in 2 of those Super Bowl wins and almost did it for a 3rd time against the New York Giants.

It's one thing to say he had a great defense (he usually did) and it's a team sport but when it counted in the biggest game of the season, Brady more than held his own during extreme pressure situations. Regular season stats are great but the goal is the Super Bowl as Broncos fans should know. Also keep in mind that the Patriots defeated the Colts in several playoff games so it's not like Peyton Manning wasn't having his chances to make a Super Bowl (and he usually struggled against NE in the playoffs).

Many point to Brady working with Welker/Moss for 2 seasons and Manning working with Collie/Garcon for 1 season as if it proves everything. For the majority of the 00's, Manning was working with Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne as wide receivers along with Edgerrin James at RB and Dallas Clark at TE.

Brady was usually working with Terry Glenn (only 1 season), Troy Brown, Deion Branch, David Givens, and David Patten at WR along with Corey Dillon and Antowain Smith at RB. His star TEs were Daniel Graham and Ben Watson, neither known for being tremendous receivers.

I'll be the first to say that Peyton Manning is without a doubt, the best regular season QB to ever play the game. Prior to his SB win, however, he did struggle in the playoffs. On the flip side, Brady has consistently put up very good stats in the regular season (look at his numbers. He was regularly topping 20+ TD with few interceptions even before Welker/Moss arrived) and more importantly, has put up good statistics in the playoffs and won SB rings too.

On a complete overall package, Brady has to be number 1 if you include regular season production (WITH a year missed!), playoff production, and Super Bowls won.

Brady has over 30,000 yards passing and a 225 TD vs. 99 INT ratio in the regular season alone. That's without playing in 2000 and missing almost all of 2008. The guy has had 5 seasons with 26+ TD. The guy has proven he can put up some statistics too, even without the weapons Manning has usually had.

Very good post. I agree on all your points. You have to separate the regular season from the playoffs.

TomServo
01-31-2010, 01:03 AM
What people forget is that Brady led the Patriots on Super Bowl winning drives in 2 of those Super Bowl wins and almost did it for a 3rd time against the New York Giants.
That is what makes The Drive so special. Nowadays any half decent qb can drive 30 yards in 30 seconds for a cheap field goal. back then the defense was allowed to play defense. marvin(armor peircing) harrison and dallas clark would have been decapitated playing against D49 and steve atwater.
recall Lynch got fined for a legal hit against dallas clark?
i truly believe Elway couldve played in any era. brady and peyton? No way

extralife
01-31-2010, 02:34 AM
Peyton is the better QB right now, but over the course of the decade the answer is still Brady.

Circle Orange
01-31-2010, 08:24 AM
Who gives a rat's ass whether writers think these guys are so special? It's just another silly puff piece of Manning/Brady suckling. And Manning isn't doing anything qbs in the past haven't done, like run an offence and call plays.

Jim Kelly did it, and I don't hear all the breathless awe. So did Elway to a degree late. Lot's of qbs from the 70s on back did this too. Stats don't make you better, either. These articles are a waste of time, because eventually qbs will throw for 65k yards in this "new" nfl.

Also, who says Manning is "running it all?" That's the dumbest myth out there...he's been in the same freaking system for ten plus years with small turnover in coaching staff. Playcall terminology is the same, and he rarely gets touched. So I expect the results he gets! I swear, it must be the big forehead...people spend so much time babbling about his intelligence, but it's not like he scored highest on the tests. And standing on the line of scrimmage like a scarecrow on crack doesn't prove he's callilng all the plays either. There's probably a handful of favorite plays he runs all the time. People need to study football and ignore all the misinformation out there.

Jason in LA
01-31-2010, 08:43 AM
And Brady won 3 superbowls with the likes of Troy brown, Deon Branch and... I'm not even sure who else was on his team offensively. During this decade Brady won 3 SBs and set the season record for Passing TDs. He hasn't been even close to Manning the last 2 years, but he definitely has accomplished more this decade.

And to pretend that the colts haven't been stacked offensively for essentially the entire decade is just asinine. Manning is great, he is very likely the best regular season QB of all time, but that isn't all that counts.

That just goes to show that a team doesn't need to have Pro Bowl WRs to with the Super Bowl. Even when Brady was winning Super Bowls I thought that Manning was a lot better than him. I don't think it's really close. Brady didn't have the WRs that Manning had, but he still had better teams around him. The team didn't have to be put on Brady's back because they played defense and they had very smart game plans on offense. A lot of those wins that Brady simply had to manage the game, but he was made out to be the difference maker.

Don't get me wrong, I think Brady is a great QB, and he'll be going to the HOF. But Manning is a lot better. Brady can't do what Manning can.

You say that Manning is "likely the best regular season QB of all time, but that isn't all that counts." But the Colts are on the verge of winning a second Super Bowl with him at QB, and they have won a number of playoff games with him. I'd say that he's getting it done in the post season as well. And he probably has another good 5 years left.

Jason in LA
01-31-2010, 08:56 AM
That is what makes The Drive so special. Nowadays any half decent qb can drive 30 yards in 30 seconds for a cheap field goal. back then the defense was allowed to play defense. marvin(armor peircing) harrison and dallas clark would have been decapitated playing against D49 and steve atwater.
recall Lynch got fined for a legal hit against dallas clark?
i truly believe Elway couldve played in any era. brady and peyton? No way

I've said it a number of times, Brady is the master of the last minute 40 yard game winning field goal drive. He gets credit for doing that, but it's not like having to go 98 yards for a TD. Elway and Montana did that in big games. Hell, in The Drive II, when the Broncos just needed a FG, they still went like 75 yards with no timeouts with only 2 minutes to play. That's just crazy. That game was as over as it gets and Elway made big plays to get the Broncos the win.

One of the Brady Super Bowl drives, the damn Panthers kicker kicked the ball out of bounds on the kickoff, setting the Pats up at the 40 yard line. Yeah, that's not really the 2 yard line. I'm just saying. ;D

WolfpackGuy
01-31-2010, 08:58 AM
One of the Brady Super Bowl drives, the damn Panthers kicker kicked the ball out of bounds on the kickoff, setting the Pats up at the 40 yard line. Yeah, that's not really the 2 yard line. I'm just saying. ;D

I could've kicked John Kasay square in the nuts for that kickoff.

That has to rank right up there with the most boneheaded Super Bowl plays.

2KBack
01-31-2010, 09:37 AM
Very good post. I agree on all your points. You have to separate the regular season from the playoffs.

Then check out the stats for the post season:
In 17 games Manning threw for 4831 yards 62.4% 27 tds 18 ints with an 87.5 ratting.

Brady is 62% completion 4108 yards 28tds, 15ints and an 85.5 rating in 18 games.

That includes superbowls. Brady has always had the relative luxury of not being the focus of the team for his first two superbowls. Those were defensive focused teams. Mannings teams were built around him, which IMO opinion leads to an overall weaker team when you face teams built around defense, special teams, and mistake free offense. I mean is anyone seriously going to argue that Terry Bradshaw is better than Marino?

I think the argument that Peyton had the offensive talent has kind of been killed at this point. I think it's fair to say that Peyton might be the one making that talent at this point. They've lost talent like Marshall Faulk, Brandon Stokley, Marvin Harrison, Edgerrin James over the years...and the offense never misses a beat.

There isn't a QB that I fear more. Honestly, that possibly ever. No other QB in my memory makes me worry about a football game Like Manning does. Part of that might be that Manning is a Bronco killer (while Brady gets donkey punched). It's not blind hate, the guy is just amazing.