State of the Union address

[ak1971]

I think Pelosi must have snorted a couple lines before the speech..shes grinding her teeth like shes wired, Im pretty sure Biden is wasted.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Being wasted should improve their standing in the minds of people who liked Dubya.

[ak1971]

Being wasted should improve their standing in the minds of people who liked Dubya.

oh LA..when can you just have some fun, and leave your obsession with Bush.

check out McCain..I think he looks like he just got back from the embalmer.

[cutthemdown]

oh LA..when can you just have some fun, and leave your obsession with Bush.

check out McCain..I think he looks like he just got back from the embalmer.

LABF can't help it. He is so used to bashing repubs he doesn't know what to do now that dems in control and nothings changed!!!!!!

[Rigs11]

Wow. Obama came out swinging.against both parties. Dems need to stop running to the hills and repubs need to stop just saying no.

[ElwayMD]

So now we have Obama 2.0...lets see if this version is free of bugs.

[rastaman]

So now we have Obama 2.0...lets see if this version is free of bugs.

Ha! free of bugs you say? Good luck with that theory. Obama would have had to spray the entire Congress with "Raid" to get rid of all the roaches, spiders, beetles, and worms on both sides of the Aisle. ;)

[Meck77]

I missed it. Are we getting out of the war?

[spdirty]

I missed it. Are we getting out of the war?

yes. and soon LABF and rasta will be able to serve in the military.

[rastaman]

yes. and soon LABF and rasta will be able to serve in the military.

I served 22 honorable years in the Military....what are you talking about?:wiggle:

[Florida_Bronco]

I missed it. Are we getting out of the war?

Obama has been doing exactly what he promised in regards to the war.

[Mr.Meanie]

yes. and soon LABF and rasta will be able to serve in the military.

:rofl:

[Mr.Meanie]

Great speech btw. Wow.

I loved how he took shots at Dems, Repubs, and the Supreme Court. haha

[Spider]

he pretty much let everyone have it .......... but seemed like a lot of fluff

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

oh LA..when can you just have some fun, and leave your obsession with Bush.

You're obviously the one who is unable to "have fun" insofar as you still knee-jerk to Oil Boy's defense instead of laughing at a joke at Dumbya's expense.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Cut One vs. Reality:

LABF can't help it. He is so used to bashing repubs he doesn't know what to do now that dems in control and nothings changed!!!!!!

The WSJ/NBC poll found 65 percent felt Obama inherited the economic mess, while only 17 percent said his policies were “mostly responsible” for the current situation.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20100122/pl_politico/31837

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

yes. and soon LABF and rasta will be able to serve in the military.

Been there/done that long before you were an itch in your daddy's Wranglers.

[baja]

Guy can deliver a speech, loved the folksy slant.

[baja]

Course everything he said is true and that is why nothing will get fixed and why the governing system in broken beyond repair.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Quote of the Day

"I want him to issue a call to arms. We're waiting for him to join the fray
and to lead the fight.."

- PA Gov Ed Rendell Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6_j0nxXqag&feature=player_embedded#)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

http://www.bartcop.com/o-hit-anything.jpg

[epicSocialism4tw]

I think Pelosi must have snorted a couple lines before the speech..shes grinding her teeth like shes wired, Im pretty sure Biden is wasted.


Biden looked like some sort of weird animatronic robot that constantly moves its mouth and holds a "compassionate" look on its face.

I think that RoboBiden has probably been employed as a Chuck-E-Cheese band member at some point.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Janet Neopolitan-o looks like a weird grade school librarian.

[ak1971]

Justice Ginsburg looked like she was going to die right in her chair. There were a bunch of other notables on both sides, but I have no idea who most of them are

[55CrushEm]

oh LA..when can you just have some fun, and leave your obsession with Bush.

check out McCain..I think he looks like he just got back from the embalmer.

He can't. 10 years from now......I can hear him now.

"Baaaaaah, it's all Bush's fault!!!" "**** all you and your straw men!!! Ahhh!!"

Oh, and :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

[rastaman]

He can't. 10 years from now......I can hear him now.

"Baaaaaah, it's all Bush's fault!!!" "**** all you and your straw men!!! Ahhh!!"

Oh, and :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

We all knew Bush was never elected President by the people, so why should we credit or talk about his illegal presidency in the first place?

[55CrushEm]

We all knew Bush was never elected President by the people, so why should we credit or talk about his illegal presidency in the first place?

Honestly......do you think reapeating this statement, oh for at least the 100th time.....somehow bothers people? You and LABF are just 2 over the top fools.....there are other ways to carry on intelligent dialogue....I just don't think either of you have discovered them.

I disagree with much of what Rigs and Roh have to say.....but somehow, it's easire to have a conversation with them.....I wonder why?

All you and LABF do is cry "Bush,bush, bush!!!" Get over it!! We ALL had problems with Bush. And all LABF can do is quote Thom Hartmann, and post political cartoons and the :laugh: :laugh:, as if that somehow adds weight to any feeble argument he attempts to make.

[rastaman]

Bush never was never elected by the people anyway so why are you still complaining about Bush!

[Garcia Bronco]

Bush never was never elected by the people anyway so why are you still complaining about Bush!

Except in 2000 and 2004. LOL loser

[Garcia Bronco]

Honestly......do you think reapeating this statement, oh for at least the 100th time.....somehow bothers people? You and LABF are just 2 over the top fools.....there are other ways to carry on intelligent dialogue....I just don't think either of you have discovered them.

I disagree with much of what Rigs and Roh have to say.....but somehow, it's easire to have a conversation with them.....I wonder why?

All you and LABF do is cry "Bush,bush, bush!!!" Get over it!! We ALL had problems with Bush. And all LABF can do is quote Thom Hartmann, and post political cartoons and the :laugh: :laugh:, as if that somehow adds weight to any feeble argument he attempts to make.

Rastaman is LABF's newer account. They are posting from the same IP's. I thought everyone knew that.

[55CrushEm]

Did anyone mention the "lie" that Obama told regarding the SCOTUS ruling last week? Wait, I won't resort to the tactics of the last 8 years.....so I won't say he LIED.....but his statement was false. Whether he KNEW it was false is unknown....so let's just leave it as his statement was false.

In the speech he said that the ruling "open[ed] the floodgates for special interests — including foreign corporations — to spend without limit in our elections. Well I don't think American elections should be bankrolled by America's most powerful interests, or worse, by foreign entities."

This is simply false.

The Court held that 2 U.S.C. Section 441a, which prohibits all corporate political spending, is unconstitutional. Foreign nationals, specifically defined to include foreign corporations, are prohibiting from making "a contribution or donation of money or ather thing of value, or to make an express or implied promise to make a contribution or donation, in connection with a Federal, State or local election" under 2 U.S.C. Section 441e, which was not at issue in the case. Foreign corporations are also prohibited, under 2 U.S.C. 441e, from making any contribution or donation to any committee of any political party, and they prohibited from making any "expenditure, independent expenditure, or disbursement for an electioneering communication."

Anyway......"LIAR! LIAR! LIAR!" That's about right, huh?

[TailgateNut]

Did anyone mention the "lie" that Obama told regarding the SCOTUS ruling last week? Wait, I won't resort to the tactics of the last 8 years.....so I won't say he LIED.....but his statement was false. Whether he KNEW it was false is unknown....so let's just leave it as his statement was false.

In the speech he said that the ruling "open[ed] the floodgates for special interests — including foreign corporations — to spend without limit in our elections. Well I don't think American elections should be bankrolled by America's most powerful interests, or worse, by foreign entities."

This is simply false.

The Court held that 2 U.S.C. Section 441a, which prohibits all corporate political spending, is unconstitutional. Foreign nationals, specifically defined to include foreign corporations, are prohibiting from making "a contribution or donation of money or ather thing of value, or to make an express or implied promise to make a contribution or donation, in connection with a Federal, State or local election" under 2 U.S.C. Section 441e, which was not at issue in the case. Foreign corporations are also prohibited, under 2 U.S.C. 441e, from making any contribution or donation to any committee of any political party, and they prohibited from making any "expenditure, independent expenditure, or disbursement for an electioneering communication."

Anyway......"LIAR! LIAR! LIAR!" That's about right, huh?

Hey Brainfart, riddle me this.

Who owns corporations?
Is there a requirement for all stockholders to be american citizens?

I'm waiting................................

[Rohirrim]

Gee, I wonder if Walmart would be willing to support the interests of China? Ya think?

I wonder if Exxon Mobil would support legislation leading us into a war to protect the interests of Saudi Arabia? hmmm

[55CrushEm]

Hey Brainfart, riddle me this.

Who owns corporations?
Is there a requirement for all stockholders to be american citizens?

I'm waiting................................

Hey Douchebag......(yes, this namecalling is fun). I have 2 Constitutional lawyers in my office, and we've discussed this.....I'll take their word over yours anyday.

Once again, no substance, namecalling.....par for the course. Keep up the good work. :thumbsup:

Anyway, do you know the difference between a foreign-BASED corporatioin and a U.S.-BASED one? Need me to give you a hint?

[mhgaffney]

Justice Ginsburg looked like she was going to die right in her chair. There were a bunch of other notables on both sides, but I have no idea who most of them are

I wish I had seen it.

She gets an "A" for honesty.

[mhgaffney]

Honestly......do you think reapeating this statement, oh for at least the 100th time.....somehow bothers people? You and LABF are just 2 over the top fools.....there are other ways to carry on intelligent dialogue....I just don't think either of you have discovered them.

I disagree with much of what Rigs and Roh have to say.....but somehow, it's easire to have a conversation with them.....I wonder why?

All you and LABF do is cry "Bush,bush, bush!!!" Get over it!! We ALL had problems with Bush. And all LABF can do is quote Thom Hartmann, and post political cartoons and the :laugh: :laugh:, as if that somehow adds weight to any feeble argument he attempts to make.

So what do you propose?

Would you have us shout "Obama! Obama! Obama!"???

You don't get it. You want Obama to fail - - so we can return the Republicans to power.

So we can be dysfunctional on the right again.

WAKE UP. The whole system is dysfunctional.

We are terminal. We need a fundamental shift.

[rastaman]

Rastaman is LABF's newer account. They are posting from the same IP's. I thought everyone knew that.

We all know your family tree doesn't have any branches nor leaves! Why is that? :sunshine:

[Spider]

He can't. 10 years from now......I can hear him now.

"Baaaaaah, it's all Bush's fault!!!" "**** all you and your straw men!!! Ahhh!!"

Oh, and :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

And how long did you crackers blame Clinton for everything ? Hell clinton was still gettin blamed in the last part of Juniors term

[Dukes]

We all know your family tree doesn't have any branches nor leaves! Why is that? :sunshine:

Oh yeah! My dad can beat up your dad!

Dude are you ****ing serious with this? Wow. Everyone, welcome to the 3rd grade. Again. Compliments of Rasta.

[Dukes]

And how long did you crackers blame Clinton for everything ? Hell clinton was still gettin blamed in the last part of Juniors term

Crackers? Did you have some Michael Jackson surgeries lately? ;D

[Spider]

crackers? Did you have some michael jackson surgeries lately? ;d

:~ohyah!: .........

[ak1971]

I wish I had seen it.

She gets an "A" for honesty.

thats pretty funny..

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

All you and LABF do is cry "Bush,bush, bush!!!" Get over it!!

Translation:

"The survival of my party and 'movement' depend on Americans having short memories when it comes to the Bush debacle."

News flash, moron:

Bush was arguably the worst president in American history. He left the economy in the worst shape since the great depression. The damage Bush and your goose-stepping GOP did to this country is going to be felt for generations to come.

[Hizaki]

If you have 15 minutes, it's worth a listen for both Rep's and Dem's. It addresses many of the issues the President talked about.

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[barryr]

More stupidity from Obama and the liberal clowns. So give money to people to go to college(assuming there's even a job to go to) and then after a number of years, their debts will be washed away and not have to be repaid. So why would anyone, who is already likely thousands in debt since don't have a job as it is, going to bother making payments on school loans when they know after a number of years, it will be forgiven and washed away? Then you have a ton of college graduates going after jobs that before, didn't need a college diploma. Only makes sense to the liberal dullards.

[barryr]

<CITE class=vcard>By CALVIN WOODWARD, Associated Press Writer Calvin Woodward, Associated Press Writer </CITE>– <ABBR class=timedate title=2010-01-28T00:12:36-0800>Thu Jan 28, 3:12 am ET</ABBR>
<!-- end .byline -->
WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama told Americans the bipartisan deficit commission he will appoint won't just be "one of those Washington gimmicks." Left unspoken in that assurance was the fact that the commission won't have any teeth.
Obama confronted some tough realities in his State of the Union speech Wednesday night, chief among them that Americans are continuing to lose their health insurance as Congress struggles to pass an overhaul.
Yet some of his ideas for moving ahead skirted the complex political circumstances standing in his way.
A look at some of Obama's claims and how they compare with the facts:
___
OBAMA: "Starting in 2011, we are prepared to freeze government spending for three years. Spending related to our national security, Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security will not be affected. But all other discretionary government programs will. Like any cash-strapped family, we will work within a budget to invest in what we need and sacrifice what we don't."
THE FACTS: The anticipated savings from this proposal would amount to less than 1 percent of the deficit — and that's if the president can persuade Congress to go along.
Obama is a convert to the cause of broad spending freezes. In the presidential campaign, he criticized Republican opponent John McCain for suggesting one. "The problem with a spending freeze is you're using a hatchet where you need a scalpel," he said a month before the election. Now, Obama wants domestic spending held steady in most areas where the government can control year-to-year costs. The proposal is similar to McCain's.
___
OBAMA: "I've called for a bipartisan fiscal commission, modeled on a proposal by Republican Judd Gregg and Democrat Kent Conrad. This can't be one of those Washington gimmicks that lets us pretend we solved a problem. The commission will have to provide a specific set of solutions by a certain deadline. Yesterday, the Senate blocked a bill that would have created this commission. So I will issue an executive order that will allow us to go forward, because I refuse to pass this problem on to another generation of Americans."
THE FACTS: Any commission that Obama creates would be a weak substitute for what he really wanted — a commission created by Congress that could force lawmakers to consider unpopular remedies to reduce the debt, including curbing politically sensitive entitlements like Social Security and Medicare. That idea crashed in the Senate this week, defeated by equal numbers of Democrats and Republicans. Any commission set up by Obama alone would lack authority to force its recommendations before Congress, and would stand almost no chance of success.
___
OBAMA: Discussing his health care initiative, he said, "Our approach would preserve the right of Americans who have insurance to keep their doctor and their plan."
THE FACTS: The Democratic legislation now hanging in limbo on Capitol Hill aims to keep people with employer-sponsored coverage — the majority of Americans under age 65 — in the plans they already have. But Obama can't guarantee people won't see higher rates or fewer benefits in their existing plans. Because of elements such as new taxes on insurance companies, insurers could change what they offer or how much it costs. Moreover, Democrats have proposed a series of changes to the Medicare program for people 65 and older that would certainly pinch benefits enjoyed by some seniors. The Congressional Budget Office has predicted cuts for those enrolled in private Medicare Advantage plans.
___
OBAMA: The president issued a populist broadside against lobbyists, saying they have "outsized influence" over the government. He said his administration has "excluded lobbyists from policymaking jobs." He also said it's time to "require lobbyists to disclose each contact they make on behalf of a client with my administration or Congress" and "to put strict limits on the contributions that lobbyists give to candidates for federal office."
THE FACTS: Obama has limited the hiring of lobbyists for administration jobs, but the ban isn't absolute; seven waivers from the ban have been granted to White House officials alone. Getting lobbyists to report every contact they make with the federal government would be difficult at best; Congress would have to change the law, and that's unlikely to happen. And lobbyists already are subject to strict limits on political giving. Just like every other American, they're limited to giving $2,400 per election to federal candidates, with an overall ceiling of $115,500 every two years.

___
OBAMA: "Because of the steps we took, there are about 2 million Americans working right now who would otherwise be unemployed. ... And we are on track to add another one and a half million jobs to this total by the end of the year."
THE FACTS: The success of the Obama-pushed economic stimulus that Congress approved early last year has been an ongoing point of contention. In December, the administration reported that recipients of direct assistance from the government created or saved about 650,000 jobs. The number was based on self-reporting by recipients and some of the calculations were shown to be in error.
The Congressional Budget Office has been much more guarded than Obama in characterizing the success of the stimulus plan. In November, it reported that the stimulus increased the number of people employed by between 600,000 and 1.6 million "compared with what those values would have been otherwise." It said the ranges "reflect the uncertainty of such estimates." And it added, "It is impossible to determine how many of the reported jobs would have existed in the absence of the stimulus package."
___
OBAMA: He called for action by the White House and Congress "to do our work openly, and to give our people the government they deserve."
THE FACTS: Obama skipped past a broken promise from his campaign — to have the negotiations for health care legislation broadcast on C-SPAN "so that people can see who is making arguments on behalf of their constituents, and who are making arguments on behalf of the drug companies or the insurance companies." Instead, Democrats in the White House and Congress have conducted the usual private negotiations, making multibillion-dollar deals with hospitals, pharmaceutical companies and other stakeholders behind closed doors. Nor has Obama lived up consistently to his pledge to ensure that legislation is posted online for five days before it's acted upon.
___
OBAMA: "The United States and Russia are completing negotiations on the farthest-reaching arms control treaty in nearly two decades."
THE FACTS: Despite insisting early last year that they would complete the negotiations in time to avoid expiration of the 1991 Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty in early December, the U.S. and Russia failed to do so. And while officials say they think a deal on a new treaty is within reach, there has been no breakthrough. A new round of talks is set to start Monday. One important sticking point: disagreement over including missile defense issues in a new accord. If completed, the new deal may arguably be the farthest-reaching arms control treaty since the original 1991 agreement. An interim deal reached in 2002 did not include its own rules on verifying nuclear reductions.
___
OBAMA: Drawing on classified information, he claimed more success than his predecessor at killing terrorists: "And in the last year, hundreds of al-Qaida's fighters and affiliates, including many senior leaders, have been captured or killed — far more than in 2008." THE FACTS: It is an impossible claim to verify. Neither the Bush nor the Obama administration has published enemy body counts, particularly those targeted by armed drones in the Pakistan-Afghanistan border region. The pace of drone attacks has increased dramatically in the last 18 months, according to congressional officials briefed on the secret program.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100128/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_fact_check

[barryr]

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State of the Union Fact Check (http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/01/28/state-of-the-union-fact-check/)

Posted by Cato Editors (blog@cato.org)
http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/wp-content/uploads/obama-sotu-300x168.jpgCato experts put some of President Obama’s core State of the Union claims to the test. Here’s what they found.
THE STIMULUS
Obama’s claim:
The plan that has made all of this possible, from the tax cuts to the jobs, is the Recovery Act. That’s right — the Recovery Act, also known as the Stimulus Bill. Economists on the left and the right say that this bill has helped saved jobs and avert disaster.
Back in reality: At the outset of the economic downturn, Cato ran an ad in the nation’s largest newspapers (http://www.cato.org/fiscalreality) in which more than 300 economists (Nobel laureates among them) signed a statement saying a massive government spending package was among the worst available options. Since then, Cato economists have published dozens of op-eds (http://www.cato.org/research/subtopic_pub_list.php?topic_id=22&pub_list=3) in major news outlets (http://www.cato.org/research/subtopic_pub_list.php?topic_id=19&pub_list=3) poking holes in big-government solutions to both the financial system crisis and the flagging economy.
CUTTING TAXES
Obama’s claim:
Let me repeat: we cut taxes. We cut taxes for 95 percent of working families. We cut taxes for small businesses. We cut taxes for first-time homebuyers. We cut taxes for parents trying to care for their children. We cut taxes for 8 million Americans paying for college. As a result, millions of Americans had more to spend on gas, and food, and other necessities, all of which helped businesses keep more workers.
Back in reality: Cato Director of Tax Policy Studies Chris Edwards: “When the president says that he has ‘cut taxes’ for 95 percent of Americans, he fails to note that more than 40 percent of Americans pay no federal incomes taxes and the administration has simply increased subsidy checks to this group. Obama’s refundable tax credits are unearned subsidies, not tax cuts.”
Visit Cato’s Tax Policy Page (http://www.cato.org/us-tax-policy) for much more on this.
SPENDING FREEZE

Obama’s claim:
Starting in 2011, we are prepared to freeze government spending for three years.
Back in reality: Edwards: “The president’s proposed spending freeze covers just 13 percent of the total federal budget, and indeed doesn’t limit the fastest growing components such as Medicare.
“A better idea is to cap growth in the entire federal budget including entitlement programs, which was essentially the idea behind the 1980s bipartisan Gramm-Rudman-Hollings law. The freeze also doesn’t cover the massive spending under the stimulus bill, most of which hasn’t occurred yet. Now that the economy is returning to growth, the president should both freeze spending and rescind the remainder of the planned stimulus.”
Plus, here’s why these promised freezes have never worked (http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/01/26/obamas-spending-freeze-is-it-real-or-is-he-copying-bush/) in the past and a chart illustrating the fallacy of Obama’s spending claims. (http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/01/26/obamas-spending-freeze/)
JOB CREATION
Obama’s claim:
Because of the steps we took, there are about two million Americans working right now who would otherwise be unemployed. 200,000 work in construction and clean energy. 300,000 are teachers and other education workers. Tens of thousands are cops, firefighters, correctional officers, and first responders. And we are on track to add another one and a half million jobs to this total by the end of the year.
Back in reality: Cato Policy Analyst Tad Dehaven: “Actually, the U.S. economy has lost 2.7 million jobs since the stimulus passed (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm) and 3.4 million total since Obama was elected. How he attributes any jobs gains to the stimulus is the fuzziest of fuzzy math. ‘Nuff said.”



http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/01/28/state-of-the-union-fact-check/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Cato-at-liberty+%28Cato+at+Liberty%29 (http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/01/28/state-of-the-union-fact-check/)
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[Bronco_Beerslug]

Cato Policy Analyst Tad Dehaven: “Actually, the U.S. economy [/B]has lost 2.7 million jobs since the stimulus passed (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm) and 3.4 million total since Obama was elected. How he attributes any jobs gains to the stimulus is the fuzziest of fuzzy math. ‘Nuff said.”
Yep, overcoming the pile crap the Bush cartel left this country in is going to take time.

[Fedaykin]

Did anyone mention the "lie" that Obama told regarding the SCOTUS ruling last week? Wait, I won't resort to the tactics of the last 8 years.....so I won't say he LIED.....but his statement was false. Whether he KNEW it was false is unknown....so let's just leave it as his statement was false.

In the speech he said that the ruling "open[ed] the floodgates for special interests — including foreign corporations — to spend without limit in our elections. Well I don't think American elections should be bankrolled by America's most powerful interests, or worse, by foreign entities."

This is simply false.

The Court held that 2 U.S.C. Section 441a, which prohibits all corporate political spending, is unconstitutional. Foreign nationals, specifically defined to include foreign corporations, are prohibiting from making "a contribution or donation of money or ather thing of value, or to make an express or implied promise to make a contribution or donation, in connection with a Federal, State or local election" under 2 U.S.C. Section 441e, which was not at issue in the case. Foreign corporations are also prohibited, under 2 U.S.C. 441e, from making any contribution or donation to any committee of any political party, and they prohibited from making any "expenditure, independent expenditure, or disbursement for an electioneering communication."

Anyway......"LIAR! LIAR! LIAR!" That's about right, huh?

They can't directly pay a candidate money, but they are now allowed to produce their own campaign advertisements without restriction -- which is functionally equivalent. This means that for example Sony, a Japanese owned company, now has a legal voice in American politics.

[Bob]

Wow. Obama came out swinging.against both parties. Dems need to stop running to the hills and repubs need to stop just saying no.

A serious question .... the growing majority of Americans are saying NO -- and go figure -- the Progressives (15% in power) are not listening -- they think that they know better... which might be a tad dangerous. if a leader, in this case Obama, is proposing things that are going to restrict Liberty, or create more debt -- is it possible, that doing nothing (ie not jumping off a cliff) if better than doing something (ie. jumping off a cliff?)

I would also contend that R's (some of them) have proposed other ideas that actually increases competition -- like buying insurance accross state lines, that might lower costs? Why cannot this be considered? Because he seems hell-bent on taking over various sectors of the economy (banks, healthcare) and taking power that does not belong to the executive branch.

[Fedaykin]

I would also contend that R's (some of them) have proposed other ideas that actually increases competition -- like buying insurance accross state lines, that might lower costs?
Why cannot this be considered? Because he seems hell-bent on taking over various sectors
of the economy (banks, healthcare) and taking power that does not belong to the executive branch.

That idea (or any idea designed to increase competition) doesn't work. It only has a prayer of working if the government also mandates that corporations who claim health benefits as a part of employee compensation would need to have an option for increased salary (or perhaps "health vouchers" of some sort) instead of the company chosen health plan. Most non-wealthy people who can actually afford health care without government assistance do so through their employer.

And, frankly, if someone proposed that we'd hear no end of complains from the republicans and even a good chunk of the democrats.

[Bronx33]

Guy can deliver a speech, loved the folksy slant.


Pretty speeches are no excuse for poor policies hes just pandering to his base which is a socialist/progressive agenda obama needed to move more center so basically he pissed away any votes from independents ( another poor choice) by team obama.

[Bob]

That idea (or any idea designed to increase competition) doesn't work. It only has a prayer of working if the government also mandates that corporations who claim health benefits as a part of employee compensation would need to have an option for increased salary (or perhaps "health vouchers" of some sort) instead of the company chosen health plan. Most non-wealthy people who can actually afford health care without government assistance do so through their employer.

And, frankly, if someone proposed that we'd hear no end of complains from the republicans and even a good chunk of the democrats.

Not being sarcastic -- but, I still dont see why it could not work. I think states have a big roll in chosing...

[Spider]

Not being sarcastic -- but, I still dont see why it could not work. I think states have a big roll in chosing...

yeah ........ if they handle healthcare the way the states handle over size loads ......... were ****ed ... It is that simple