PDA

View Full Version : OT- 401K Rollover Question


SoDak Bronco
01-18-2010, 07:39 AM
I am not sure if we have any investment/financial experts here at the o-mane, but I thought I would see what everyone's thoughts were. I have had 3 jobs since I've gotten out of college, and am currently on the job hunt after getting laid off a few months back. After the first job, I rolled my 401K into a financial account at a bank my buddy worked at, now he doesn't work there so I won't be doing that again (investing with friends). I would like to find a nationwide company to work with.

At these jobs I did the 401K programs, and now have 3 seperate 401K accounts, and I am looking to roll them together and need some advice as to the direction I should go with this. When I was younger I setup a Roth IRA (not sure what this is, I know it has something to do tax free investing for a certain amount of time)? Its not like I have a lot of money with these accounts, but I don't want to be hit by a bunch of fees by putting them into the wrong thing.

I am looking to consolidate these accounts, and am hoping you guys/gals have some insight on what you would do. What financial company do you recommend working with and what sort of accounts would you look to move these to? Thanks in advance.

Slade
01-18-2010, 08:07 AM
I was a financial advisor in Denver, but i just moved to Chicago to trade options again. Give my friend Will Killhour a call, he is still in CO and works with Waddell & Reed. He is very helpful and can answer all your questions. 303-322-2122. www.waddell.com

TailgateNut
01-18-2010, 08:15 AM
I am not sure if we have any investment/financial experts here at the o-mane, but I thought I would see what everyone's thoughts were. I have had 3 jobs since I've gotten out of college, and am currently on the job hunt after getting laid off a few months back. After the first job, I rolled my 401K into a financial account at a bank my buddy worked at, now he doesn't work there so I won't be doing that again (investing with friends). I would like to find a nationwide company to work with.

At these jobs I did the 401K programs, and now have 3 seperate 401K accounts, and I am looking to roll them together and need some advice as to the direction I should go with this. When I was younger I setup a Roth IRA (not sure what this is, I know it has something to do tax free investing for a certain amount of time)? Its not like I have a lot of money with these accounts, but I don't want to be hit by a bunch of fees by putting them into the wrong thing.

I am looking to consolidate these accounts, and am hoping you guys/gals have some insight on what you would do. What financial company do you recommend working with and what sort of accounts would you look to move these to? Thanks in advance.



You should have bet all your "eggs" on the Chargers this past weekend.!Booya!

bronclvr
01-18-2010, 09:41 AM
It's almost a cliche', but I've had good luck with Edward Jones (they are outperforming my Employer's 401K plan)-

Pony Boy
01-18-2010, 09:59 AM
Can't go wrong with Edward Jones but try to get an agent that is in the top 100 in performance with the company. That might be difficult to do because they like to farm out their smaller investors to new Edward Jones agents but you still can't go wrong they are well trained.

Slade
01-18-2010, 10:09 AM
Can't go wrong with Edward Jones but try to get an agent that is in the top 100 in performance with the company. That might be difficult to do because they like to farm out their smaller investors to new Edward Jones agents but you still can't go wrong they are well trained.

As an advisor, I know its not about the company at all. It is about the advisor and how you work with them. At most places (not Edward Jones), you can investment in any investment product. And you shouldn't look for a "top 100" advisor either, cause if they only have high net worth clients and you dont have that kind of money, do you really think they will give you the service you deserve? Everybody deserves to be an "A" client! Like I said, it is about the relationshipo with the advisor...even younger people get support from hgher up, so you dont need to be scared.

MrPeepers
01-18-2010, 10:16 AM
I am not sure if we have any investment/financial experts here at the o-mane, but I thought I would see what everyone's thoughts were. I have had 3 jobs since I've gotten out of college, and am currently on the job hunt after getting laid off a few months back. After the first job, I rolled my 401K into a financial account at a bank my buddy worked at, now he doesn't work there so I won't be doing that again (investing with friends). I would like to find a nationwide company to work with.

At these jobs I did the 401K programs, and now have 3 seperate 401K accounts, and I am looking to roll them together and need some advice as to the direction I should go with this. When I was younger I setup a Roth IRA (not sure what this is, I know it has something to do tax free investing for a certain amount of time)? Its not like I have a lot of money with these accounts, but I don't want to be hit by a bunch of fees by putting them into the wrong thing.

I am looking to consolidate these accounts, and am hoping you guys/gals have some insight on what you would do. What financial company do you recommend working with and what sort of accounts would you look to move these to? Thanks in advance.

www.diehards.org
http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6211

The process is easy, you can do this yourself. That website is excellent in terms of how to and education. Regardless of the amounts, you need to determine your asset allocation and create percentages based on your risk tolerance and future needs.

If you use a brokerage, or fee based service you may be giving away 1-2% or more of your money. Nothing wrong with that if you don't mind giving other people your money.

Pony Boy
01-18-2010, 10:40 AM
As an advisor, I know its not about the company at all. It is about the advisor and how you work with them. At most places (not Edward Jones), you can investment in any investment product. And you shouldn't look for a "top 100" advisor either, cause if they only have high net worth clients and you dont have that kind of money, do you really think they will give you the service you deserve? Everybody deserves to be an "A" client! Like I said, it is about the relationshipo with the advisor...even younger people get support from hgher up, so you dont need to be scared.

My Edward Jones guy is a top 100 agent and calls me a couple of times a week and when I pop into his office I'm treated like family. I weathered the financial crisis the past 5 years better than any of my friends and I don't have to worry about him picking up and moving to Chicago and his referring clients to a friend that stayed in Denver.

Jekyll15Hyde
01-18-2010, 11:04 AM
It all depends how much you want to do on your own. How "hands on" are you and how much risk can you tolerate? There are several online test for the risk tolerance. This is more to tell you if you should be in mutual funds, bonds, single stocks, index funds, etc. If you want to set it and forget it, then an index fund may be for you.

You could easily roll all 3 into one Roth with an etrade or scotttrade and then have the flexibility to control everything on your own. That is what I do

Since you already have the roth, you can just put those 401ks in that. If your Roth is at a place that doesnt let you invest in the entire market, I recommend moving it to somewhere that does.

SoDak Bronco
01-18-2010, 11:53 AM
My Edward Jones guy is a top 100 agent and calls me a couple of times a week and when I pop into his office I'm treated like family. I weathered the financial crisis the past 5 years better than any of my friends and I don't have to worry about him picking up and moving to Chicago and his referring clients to a friend that stayed in Denver.

haha good point.

kappys
01-18-2010, 12:51 PM
To some degree this depends on your age. I'm going to assume you're young (less than 35).

In that case put all you can into the Roth. If you're out of work and therefore will have a low income this year this is the perfect time to do it. You don't even have to have an advisor, you could do it yourself online though advice is probably worth the price. Basically a Roth takes post-tax dollars(i.e. your real money) and puts it into an account. The money then grows tax free and when you take it out you don't pay any tax - meaning you don't pay any tax on the money you make from it. I also believe early withdrawal has less of a penalty than for 401k. However there is a smaller contribution limit per year(around $5k right now I think for individuals) and your total taxable income has to be less than $100k a year or so.

A traditional 401k takes pre-tax dollars and invests them. When you remove the money after retirement you pay tax on the money removed. If you remove the money early you pay both tax and a penalty. The money withdrawn is taxed as ordinary income. In some ways it would almost be better to invest outside a 401k because if you held the investments for 1 year they would count as capital gains and be taxed at a nice low rate. However the employer matching and asset protections with this plan do make it quite nice.

There is also now a Roth 401k which I keep meaning to look into but just haven't yet. Its not offerred by my employer.

TonyR
01-18-2010, 01:04 PM
Can't go wrong with Vanguard, Fidelity, or Charles Schwab, among many others. They'll make the rollovers easy and offer more investment choices than you'll ever need.

Cito Pelon
01-19-2010, 04:00 PM
You could take one and cash it out with the 10% penalty since you're unemployed.

Roll them into one plan, sure, a mutual fund group like Putnam, American, ING. There's a bunch of groups out there, do a little research, it's easy to see their ratings. I've had good luck with Putnam and American, they have all kinds of diversity and I think all IRA funds allow one to move money between their different mutual funds with no commission paid, once you've bought it, of course. Some have less commission to buy in, have less overhead costs.

Just take a little time to do some online research, shouldn't take you more than 8 hours.

I did well with American back in the 90's, moved into Putnam in the 90's and since have more than doubled my money despite the two massive stock declines in the 2000's. I remember looking at ING, and they were kicking ass, but I think the mimimum buyin is pretty high.

R8R H8R
01-19-2010, 05:08 PM
My Edward Jones guy is a top 100 agent and calls me a couple of times a week and when I pop into his office I'm treated like family. I weathered the financial crisis the past 5 years better than any of my friends and I don't have to worry about him picking up and moving to Chicago and his referring clients to a friend that stayed in Denver.

Obviously, your guy is the kind of guy SoDak should look for, however, as an advisor for 25 years, I have to agree w/ most of Slades post. Here's why:

Most, if not all, of the advisor driven firms, rank their reps by commisions(or revenues for fee-based planners), not performance. So, most(but possibly not all) top 100 reps generally will have minimums in account size. They probably specialize in high net worth clients, so they wll pass on lower account values because they view it as not worth thier time(to put it bluntly).

If you have a true top 100 advisor, here are the probable reasons:

1. You are his definition of an "A" or "B" client, or close to it.
2. You were a referral from an "A" client, and he didn't want to jeopardise that relationship.
3. You were a friend beforeyou opened the account.
4. At the time you opened your account, you met his minimum at that time.

As far as advice for SoDak, here goes:

First decide if you want to make the decisions on the account w/o an advisor. If so, look at the discount brokers such as TD Ameritrade, etc. This option assumes you either know what you are doing, or are willing to learn. But learn beforeyou make any investments.

If instead, you want help from an adviser, then simply ask friends or family that are near your age and live near you, who they use; and do they like him/her?
Why near your age? Because they will probably have accounts similar to yours.

Good luck.

JJJ
01-19-2010, 05:28 PM
Definitely do it yourself. You will learn a lot and save giving your hard earned cash to overpaid advisors. While you are young invest in building up your knowledge. It will serve you well when you have more cabbage and an advisor might come in handy.

Just make sure a large amount is in index funds as it doesn't sound like you have a lot of time for research. With all due respect to the advisors out there, most advisors can't provide better results than the index funds anyways.

R8R H8R
01-19-2010, 11:39 PM
definitely do it yourself. you will learn a lot and save giving your hard earned cash to overpaid advisors. while you are young invest in building up your knowledge. It will serve you well when you have more cabbage and an advisor might come in handy.

For the record, I'm not suggesting that SoDak use an advisor because that's up to him on whether or not he wants to do his own homework or not; but rather I am only responding to your post, which is pretty insulting and ignorant.

Most, if not all advisers, are paid exactly what they are worth, regardless if they make $20,000 a year or $2,000,000 a year(I know both). Most advisers are paid either by commission or by fees(such as financial planners), or a combination of both. In other words, they do not get salaries, and they and their clients decide what they get paid.

The $20,000 a year adviser is paid exactly what he/she is worth, which isn't much. That person should probably look for another career.

Likewise, the $2,000,000 a year adviser is also paid exactly what he/she is worth. Obviously, his clients think so because they pay him/her their fees.

These two examples are of course extremes, and most advisers will fall somewhere in-between, but it makes my point, because most advisers do not have a cushy salary(which may exist somewhere, but is rare).

just make sure a large amount is in index funds as it doesn't sound like you have a lot of time for research. With all due respect to the advisors out there, most advisors can't provide better results than the index funds anyways.

With all due respect to you, but once again you don't know what you are talking about. An adviser isn't hired to beat an index (or at least shouldn't), but rather to fill the needs of his/her clients. This goes way beyond index funds, load/no-load, performance, etc.

Anyway, it comes down to whether SoDak wants to do his own homework or not. It's really that simple, but maybe not easy.

Slade
01-20-2010, 03:23 AM
My Edward Jones guy is a top 100 agent and calls me a couple of times a week and when I pop into his office I'm treated like family. I weathered the financial crisis the past 5 years better than any of my friends and I don't have to worry about him picking up and moving to Chicago and his referring clients to a friend that stayed in Denver.

If you are happy with your guy at Edward Jones, then great. I referred the business to a friend in Denver, cause I am no longer an advisor...I trade for myself now, which is my background and what I did in the Caribbean.

And FYI, in order to do business with someone, the advisor has to be licensed in the state the client resides...so me referring someone to a friend in Denver has everything to do with the fact that this person can provide answers and is a licensed professional...not Joe Blow from some forum.

Pony Boy
01-20-2010, 08:47 AM
Definitely do it yourself. You will learn a lot and save giving your hard earned cash to overpaid advisors. While you are young invest in building up your knowledge. It will serve you well when you have more cabbage and an advisor might come in handy.

Just make sure a large amount is in index funds as it doesn't sound like you have a lot of time for research. With all due respect to the advisors out there, most advisors can't provide better results than the index funds anyways.

Good idea, and if you need to have you appendix removed, do it yourself in the bathroom, no reason to use an overpaid surgeon.

R8R H8R
01-20-2010, 08:54 AM
Good idea, and if you need to have you appendix removed, do it yourself in the bathroom, no reason to use an overpaid surgeon.

:spit: :notworthy

Pony Boy
01-20-2010, 11:13 AM
I am not sure if we have any investment/financial experts here at the o-mane, but I thought I would see what everyone's thoughts were. I have had 3 jobs since I've gotten out of college, and am currently on the job hunt after getting laid off a few months back. After the first job, I rolled my 401K into a financial account at a bank my buddy worked at, now he doesn't work there so I won't be doing that again (investing with friends). I would like to find a nationwide company to work with.

At these jobs I did the 401K programs, and now have 3 seperate 401K accounts, and I am looking to roll them together and need some advice as to the direction I should go with this. When I was younger I setup a Roth IRA (not sure what this is, I know it has something to do tax free investing for a certain amount of time)? Its not like I have a lot of money with these accounts, but I don't want to be hit by a bunch of fees by putting them into the wrong thing.

I am looking to consolidate these accounts, and am hoping you guys/gals have some insight on what you would do. What financial company do you recommend working with and what sort of accounts would you look to move these to? Thanks in advance.

What I'm saying is find an expert to help you, someone you are comfortable with and trust. Edward Jones has preformed well with my investments and I'm not worried they will disappear with my funds. I went thought the day trading phase that was popular a few years ago, when every Tom Dick and Harry was buying and selling online with etrade. It was fun for a while but when the bottom dropped out I lost my ass. I was lucky because I was only playing with some money that I could afford to lose and not my retirement funds. R8R H8R is giving you some excellent advice, you might pm him if you have more questions……

Fedaykin
01-20-2010, 11:57 AM
Find an expert, and you have to basic questions:

1.) What sort of account should I rollover to (IRA, rIRA, 401k, etc.)
2.) What do I invest in once I have an account.

The difference between a standard IRA and a Roth IRA is when you are taxed. With a standard IRA, the money you contribute each year can be deducted from your taxes that year. For example, if you contribute $4,000 this year, you won't pay any taxes on that $4,000. However, you are taxed on withdrawls. This is exactly the same as your 401ks work.

A Roth IRA contribution is not tax deductible, but withdrawls are (generally) not taxed. This means that if you contribute that $4,000 you still pay taxes on that, but when you turn 59.5 you can then withdrawl money from the account tax free.

Basically, it's pay your taxes now or pay them later. The main benefit is that generally your tax rate is much lower when you retire because you have, in theory, much less income.

To understand the pros and cons better, talk to a professional.

Whatever you do, DON'T treat your IRA/401k as something that will take care of itself -- it won't. Work with a financial adviser and give your accounts plenty of care and feeding (both in contributions and management).

ak1971
01-20-2010, 12:02 PM
cash it out...hookers, blow and donkeys for everyone!

SoDak Bronco
01-20-2010, 04:40 PM
Thanks for all the advice. I am looking into a few different options. I am leaning towards using a financial advisor to help, I know enough to get me in trouble, so I am going to find an expert to help.

Meck77
01-20-2010, 04:53 PM
Gold pulled back slightly to $1113.30 an Ounce as of today. Not sure how much you have in there but I'd recommend picking up a couple of nuggets if this is retirement money. I have little faith in the stability of the American dollar anymore. WHEN not if the dollar crashes so will your 401k. Gold will skyrocket. Gold will bounce around in value but at the end of the day you'll always be able to trade it around the world. That isn't the case with the American dollar.

The chinese announced they are tightening their banking belt a bit and that actually strengthened the dollar a bit but at the end of the day the smart money is buying more gold on the dips.

Get some. :thumbs:

NYBronco
01-20-2010, 05:07 PM
Gold pulled back slightly to $1113.30 an Ounce as of today. Not sure how much you have in there but I'd recommend picking up a couple of nuggets if this is retirement money. I have little faith in the stability of the American dollar anymore. WHEN not if the dollar crashes so will your 401k. Gold will skyrocket. Gold will bounce around in value but at the end of the day you'll always be able to trade it around the world. That isn't the case with the American dollar.

The chinese announced they are tightening their banking belt a bit and that actually strengthened the dollar a bit but at the end of the day the smart money is buying more gold on the dips.

Get some. :thumbs:

Where/what are good sources to buy gold?
Do you buy gold coins or actual nuggets as you mentioned?
How and where are good sources to "cash" in the gold?