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View Full Version : Broncos/Redskins - A dealing duo...


Popps
01-07-2010, 11:28 PM
Another nice write-up by Lewgold...

Despite 32 NFL teams doing business in 32 places, probably no two teams have swapped players or draft picks more in recent years than the Broncos and the Washington Redskins.
Former Broncos coach Mike Shana-han was introduced Wednesday as the Redskins' new coach in search of new players, meaning Denver may have a willing suitor for players it wants to unload. Shanahan won't need directory assistance to get the phones ringing.
"I know in my time, we always had a feeling Denver would kind of do a deal when it was time," former Redskins coach Joe Gibbs said. "And we were always willing to do things too. Neither team was hesitant about getting to it."
In recent seasons the Broncos and Redskins have manufactured the
NFL
View slide show of former Broncos coach Mike Shanahan.
rare blockbuster trade — Clinton Portis for Champ Bailey and a draft pick. They have swapped first-round draft picks. And they have been part of a multiteam deal that sent disgruntled wide receiver Ashley Lelie to the Atlanta Falcons.
The teams have been so willing to deal that even after the Broncos signed Dre Bly out from under the Redskins in 2007, the Redskins still pursued Bly in a trade in the days that followed by offering Shanahan a deal that included Shawn Springs.
"It's one of those places where they want a winner and the team does whatever it takes," said Bailey, who played five seasons for Washington to go with his six for Denver since the 2004 trade. "And you would expect with (owner Daniel Snyder) and Coach Shanahan, they'll do whatever it takes. If anybody can turn it around, (Shanahan) can."

Don't be surprised if Shanahan and the Redskins are interested in restricted free agents such as Denver wide receiver Brandon Marshall, tight end Tony Scheffler and guard Chris Kuper. Marshall and Scheffler almost certainly are headed elsewhere after being benched by Broncos coach Josh McDaniels for the season finale. Both would fit quickly into the Redskins' new playbook.
Washington, with many holes to fill along the offensive line, will be adjusting to Shanahan's zone-blocking run game, which calls for smaller, quicker linemen. The Redskins, who were battered by injuries up front this season, have not stocked their line in recent drafts, having selected only two offensive linemen over the past five drafts and only one offensive lineman in the first or second round in the past 10 drafts — left tackle Chris Samuels in the first round of the 2000 draft. Neck problems may have Samuels considering retirement.
That could put Kuper in demand by the Redskins. And because Snyder is one of the NFL's most free-spending owners, Shanahan will have the ability to send out plenty of offer sheets that are difficult for teams to match.

The Broncos, like any team, would have seven days to match an offer sheet for one of their restricted free agents after free agency opens in March.
Shanahan's hiring could affect the Broncos' coaching staff as well. McDaniels likely will make a few changes in the coming weeks.

Broncos offensive line coach Rick Dennison is being considered for the Houston Texans' offensive coordinator job. But Shanahan is poised to offer Dennison a job as well, two league sources said Tuesday night.

As of Wednesday afternoon, neither team had formally asked permission to interview Dennison. Broncos running backs coach Bobby Turner, strength and conditioning coach Rich Tuten, assistant strength coach Greg Saporta, special-teams assistant Keith Burns and director of football administration Mike Bluem all were longtime Shana-han associates who figure to draw interest from him.

And with final say over the Redskins' football operations, Shanahan promised Wednesday to move quickly and do "whatever it takes" to return the team to the playoffs.
"I'm looking forward to leading this football team. I'm excited to be here," Shanahan said at Redskins headquarters in Ashburn, Va. "I'm going to give it everything I've got."


Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_14137683#ixzz0c0H***OG

OBF1
01-08-2010, 12:02 AM
They have draft picks..... Let the talks begin :)

Elway777
01-08-2010, 12:30 AM
The Death of Zone Blocking in Denver with Dennison and Turner leaving most likely. No more 6 round 2000 yard runnings

Taco John
01-08-2010, 12:34 AM
Basically establishing Broncos East.

That's really fricken great. I don't know what to think about that.

Hey Redskins fans. We don't care about you. We don't care about your stupid tradition or your stupid team. But our HOF head coach happens to be running things over there, so good luck, eh. You can ride in the back of the truck on the way to the meetup in Canton.

In the meantime, don't get in our way.

Archer81
01-08-2010, 12:35 AM
Basically establishing Broncos East.

That's really fricken great. I don't know what to think about that.

Hey Redskins fans. We don't care about you. We don't care about your stupid tradition or your stupid team. But our HOF head coach happens to be running things over there, so good luck, eh. You can ride in the back of the truck on the way to the meetup in Canton.

In the meantime, don't get in our way.


Hmm. The velvet iron fist approach. Nice.

:Broncos:

Popps
01-08-2010, 12:39 AM
Basically establishing Broncos East.

That's really fricken great. I don't know what to think about that.

Hey Redskins fans. We don't care about you. We don't care about your stupid tradition or your stupid team. But our HOF head coach happens to be running things over there, so good luck, eh. You can ride in the back of the truck on the way to the meetup in Canton.

In the meantime, don't get in our way.

Time marches on.


I really don't care either way about the Redskins. But, I'll root for Shanny if there's no conflicting interest. My dad is a life-long Redskins fan, so it would be nice to see them give him another SB in his lifetime.


Beyond that, I do like the dynamic of what could go on, here with regards to trade possibilities. We've definitely got guys they need, and there may be some square peg/round hole situations as far as their current roster goes.

Florida_Bronco
01-08-2010, 12:45 AM
If they want to send us draft picks for Marshall and Scheffler, let em, although I wonder if they'd give up much for Scheffler since they already have Cooley.

Taco John
01-08-2010, 12:47 AM
Hmm. The velvet iron fist approach. Nice.

:Broncos:



I've never been in this much conflict as a sports fan. I can't help it. I was born and raised a Broncos fan. Broncos were my role models. And Shanahan at the top of the list.

Earlier this season I wrote this:

It's pretty difficult to second-guess a 4-0 start, even if one were to believe that we'd be 4-0 with Shanahan right now. Bowlen's decisions have panned out nicely. He most definitely deserves congratulations and kudos for his success.

And at this point, any doubts that ANYBODY had about Josh McDaniel's ability to coach have been put to rest. The guy clearly knows what he's doing.

I'm happy with the new situation. It doesn't mean that I don't still have a broken heart over the loss of Shanahan. The new situation certainly makes it a lot easier to swallow. I get it though. A lot of people were sick of Shanahan and are glad to see him gone. That's your perogative, and you're welcome to have it. And I will fully admit it, I have a tendancy to get attached to the moving pieces in this game.

I'm a big Shanahan fan, and have been ever since I was a kid reading Elway quotes about what Shanahan has done for his game. I was pissed at Reeves for canning Shanahan, and was ready to see Reeves go at that point. I rejoiced when Shanahan was hired as our coach, and knew in my heart of hearts that Elway would win MULTIPLE superbowls with Shanahan. As a young adult, I read Shanahan's book, and took his approach to life to heart. I was a fan of Shanahan in my young adulthood in the same way that I was a fan of Elway in my youth. Shanahan and Elway to me are immortal symbols of the Broncos. And for that matter, still are.

But that doesn't mean that I'm not on board with the new face of Broncos football. McDaniels may not have come up through the Broncos system like Shanahan did, but the way he has started his story here in Broncoland is damn impressive. The guy is like a younger version of Shanahan. At the end of the day, I loved Shanahan not only because of his history here, but also because he was an intense coach who managed to put his team in position to win games. That's exactly what Josh is. The guy is an incredible game day coach. People think our offense is boring. I'm loving it. We're not even scratching the surface of what this offense will be capable of as our coach let's his gambling nature out in full trust of the defense. Things on offense are going to pick up.

Whether we'd be 4-0 with Shanahan and Cutler right now - who knows? I'm sure there are a few thousand opinions on that here, and that they all know with a certainty that they are right. Whatever the answer is, it's a moot point because we're 4-0 with Josh right now.

The divorce is over. It was messy. But guess what? Your new step mother is your age, hot as hell, and she makes a killer breakfast in her undies. You might still feel pissed at dad for what happened with mom, but shut up and eat some ****ing pancakes.


I just hope we start winning again soon. We're seeding the league with a lot of bad blood. I just want to see this turn into wins again.

Archer81
01-08-2010, 12:52 AM
I've never been in this much conflict as a sports fan. I can't help it. I was born and raised a Broncos fan. Broncos were my role models. And Shanahan at the top of the list.




I just hope we start winning again soon. We're seeding the league with a lot of bad blood. I just want to see this turn into wins again.


I look at it like this. Shanahan won us championships. For that I'll love the guy forever, and because of that I wish him success with the redskins...just never against us. I love the Broncos, no matter who plays or coaches for them.

:Broncos:

Taco John
01-08-2010, 12:52 AM
Time marches on.


I really don't care either way about the Redskins. But, I'll root for Shanny if there's no conflicting interest. My dad is a life-long Redskins fan, so it would be nice to see them give him another SB in his lifetime.


Beyond that, I do like the dynamic of what could go on, here with regards to trade possibilities. We've definitely got guys they need, and there may be some square peg/round hole situations as far as their current roster goes.


It will sure be interesting to see who wins in a modern day Broncos/Redskins trade. I'd say that we've gotten the best of the Redskins in the past deals - though they made out decent enough with Portis lasting as long as he has.

Taco John
01-08-2010, 01:02 AM
I look at it like this. Shanahan won us championships. For that I'll love the guy forever, and because of that I wish him success with the redskins...just never against us. I love the Broncos, no matter who plays or coaches for them.

:Broncos:


I love the Broncos no matter what, too. It's just divorce dynamics. I believed in the direction we were going, but then bam! A divorce, a fun trip to Vegas, and then from there we ended up living out of our car in Detroit for the next three months. It's easy to think about what might have been with the way things have been going.

All that said, the purge is going to be completed, so there's nothing to do but hold on and hope that we make the right moves. I may not agree with the "throw the baby out with the bathwater" approach that the team seems to be taking, but it is exciting to know that a lot will be happening to evaluate. There's going to be plenty of red meat for types like us.

I love all of this.

Meck77
01-08-2010, 01:07 AM
Mike was a nice guy and all but I disagree that our franchise was headed in the right direction. Ten years, 1 playoff victory, and several truly pathetic seasons in a row gets you fired in this league no matter who you are. I chatted with Mike numerous times over the years and towards the end you could just sense that he was burning out and needed a break. He got it and maybe he's recharged again. He's not going to concern himself with how the Broncos are doing and I'm certainly not going to give a rats ;D ass how Mike is doing in washington.

Pat told his old buddy thanks for the memories but hit the bricks because you are failing miserably at running my business. Pat is the man who has repeatedly shown he can make big decisions when they need to be made. ^5

Archer81
01-08-2010, 01:23 AM
I love the Broncos no matter what, too. It's just divorce dynamics. I believed in the direction we were going, but then bam! A divorce, a fun trip to Vegas, and then from there we ended up living out of our car in Detroit for the next three months. It's easy to think about what might have been with the way things have been going.

All that said, the purge is going to be completed, so there's nothing to do but hold on and hope that we make the right moves. I may not agree with the "throw the baby out with the bathwater" approach that the team seems to be taking, but it is exciting to know that a lot will be happening to evaluate. There's going to be plenty of red meat for types like us.

I love all of this.


Honestly right now I am more excited for the next 10 months in regards to the Broncos then I have been in a long time. 09 is over with, and anyone who watched all 20 games the Broncos played this year knows we are farther away from competing than what we thought, but not so far that it seems like the playoffs and titles are not even in the realm of possibility.

:Broncos:

eddie mac
01-08-2010, 01:55 AM
Shanahan may well want those players but he'd have to give up a ****load for all 3.

I actually see Marshall and Kuper getting the top tenders. Scheffler just needs a deal for $1m and he's protected to 2nd rd value given where he was drafted.

Dr. Broncenstein
01-08-2010, 03:49 AM
Anyone want to bet that the poison pill comes back in a hurry this year?

Drek
01-08-2010, 04:31 AM
Shanahan may well want those players but he'd have to give up a ****load for all 3.

I actually see Marshall and Kuper getting the top tenders. Scheffler just needs a deal for $1m and he's protected to 2nd rd value given where he was drafted.

That's about what I'm expecting. For all of $7M they can lock the three of those guys up at very good compensation. I doubt anyone would give Kuper an offer if it would cost them a 1st and 3rd. Marshall I think is 50/50. Scheffler at a 2nd round pick is interesting. A team sold on him as a big play TE could bite, but that is a lot to give for someone who isn't an elite TE. Tony Gonzalez was traded for a 2010 2nd rounder last year.

Anyone want to bet that the poison pill comes back in a hurry this year?

I'm sure it will. But we'll probably also see a lot of teams over tendering to protect guys. No one will try to poison pill Kuper away from us for example, at a 1st and 3rd compensation price tag.

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 05:02 AM
From my Redskin Buddies, Kuper is the target.....

DivineLegion
01-08-2010, 05:07 AM
If we lose Kuper like we lost Chris Myers I think I will be sick.

elsid13
01-08-2010, 05:14 AM
From my Redskin Buddies, Kuper is the target.....

Of the three, he make the most sense. Scheffer isn't needed with Davis and Cooley on the line-up and Marshall would help but Shanahan won't overpay for him.

cousinal11
01-08-2010, 05:34 AM
If they want to send us draft picks for Marshall and Scheffler, let em, although I wonder if they'd give up much for Scheffler since they already have Cooley.


And Fred Davis. He looked pretty damn good down the stretch.

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 06:38 AM
Of the three, he make the most sense. Scheffer isn't needed with Davis and Cooley on the line-up and Marshall would help but Shanahan won't overpay for him.

Cooley will probably be trade bait....He can recoup the cost of what it will take to get Kupe...

I don't want to see Kuper go though

elsid13
01-08-2010, 06:41 AM
Cooley will probably be trade bait....He can recoup the cost of what it will take to get Kupe...

I don't want to see Kuper go though

Neither do I. Do you think anyone would really trade for Cooley? He's solid H-back, but he is worth more then a 4th?

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 06:45 AM
Neither do I. Do you think anyone would really trade for Cooley? He's solid H-back, but he is worth more then a 4th?

same teams that will be in line for Sheff:

1. Bills
2. St. Louis
3. Carolina
4. Tenn
5. Balt
6. Cleve
7. Ariz

Rohirrim
01-08-2010, 06:54 AM
This whole thing is based on the assumption that Mike will continue with the ZBS as a base system, with the lighter, faster linemen. It hasn't done him much good for ten years, other than stats. He's been sitting around studying the league for a year. I wonder if he continues in that direction?

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 07:03 AM
Mike was a nice guy and all but I disagree that our franchise was headed in the right direction. Ten years, 1 playoff victory, and several truly pathetic seasons in a row gets you fired in this league no matter who you are.

Then what in the hell do you call 2009? HYPOCRITE.

bpc
01-08-2010, 07:04 AM
If Shanny wants to overpay for some of our guys, to help his transition, i'm definitely down with that. He can take Marshall first.

Ultimately, i don't recall Shanahan blowing many trades from a value standpoint. His reach on Jarvis Moss a few years ago, might be the only one I can recall.

missingnumber7
01-08-2010, 07:05 AM
Time marches on.


I really don't care either way about the Redskins. But, I'll root for Shanny if there's no conflicting interest. My dad is a life-long Redskins fan, so it would be nice to see them give him another SB in his lifetime.


Beyond that, I do like the dynamic of what could go on, here with regards to trade possibilities. We've definitely got guys they need, and there may be some square peg/round hole situations as far as their current roster goes.

I like to see whom ever the coach is here do to Shanny what Shanny did to Reeves.

Rohirrim
01-08-2010, 07:06 AM
If Shanny wants to overpay for some of our guys, to help his transition, i'm definitely down with that. He can take Marshall first.

Ultimately, i don't recall Shanahan blowing many trades from a value standpoint. His reach on Jarvis Moss a few years ago, might be the only one I can recall.

The fuse is burning on this one.

Hercules Rockefeller
01-08-2010, 07:17 AM
And because Snyder is one of the NFL's most free-spending owners, Shanahan will have the ability to send out plenty of offer sheets that are difficult for teams to match.[/B]


This is where the article loses me, and Eddie Mac has somewhat touched it already. The issue is not putting out an offer sheet that others can't match, the issue is: is Shanny really going to gut his first draft in DC by signing guys to offer sheets?

Marshall will get a 1st and 3rd tender, Kuper I would hope gets at least a 1st. Scheffler will get the round compensation, so that's a 2nd. The Skins are not going to give out high picks like that simply because these were Shanny picks in the past.

TheReverend
01-08-2010, 07:19 AM
From my Redskin Buddies, Kuper is the target.....

It's been less than 48 hours since he's had the job. So not only has he finished evaluating his new team, he's already targeting personnel from his old AND told enough people that it spread to your buddies that fast?

Kuper is clearly the one that makes sense considering their weak OL, Cooley's presence and his history with Brandon, but I highly doubt anything official has legitimately crept out of DC yet. There's probably a good 2-3 weeks of evaluating and assembling his staff before they start on potentially available players

Wes Mantooth
01-08-2010, 07:31 AM
Basically establishing Broncos East.

That's really fricken great. I don't know what to think about that.

Hey Redskins fans. We don't care about you. We don't care about your stupid tradition or your stupid team. But our HOF head coach happens to be running things over there, so good luck, eh. You can ride in the back of the truck on the way to the meetup in Canton.

In the meantime, don't get in our way.

don't forget about all the players that will be going over there.

elsid13
01-08-2010, 07:34 AM
It's been less than 48 hours since he's had the job. So not only has he finished evaluating his new team, he's already targeting personnel from his old AND told enough people that it spread to your buddies that fast?

Kuper is clearly the one that makes sense considering their weak OL, Cooley's presence and his history with Brandon, but I highly doubt anything official has legitimately crept out of DC yet. There's probably a good 2-3 weeks of evaluating and assembling his staff before they start on potentially available players

Shanahan know that was most likely going to be the Redskins coach for last 3 plus months, and we know he hasn't been idle. I have pretty strong feeling that he has mapped everything out.

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 07:44 AM
It's been less than 48 hours since he's had the job. So not only has he finished evaluating his new team, he's already targeting personnel from his old AND told enough people that it spread to your buddies that fast?

Kuper is clearly the one that makes sense considering their weak OL, Cooley's presence and his history with Brandon, but I highly doubt anything official has legitimately crept out of DC yet. There's probably a good 2-3 weeks of evaluating and assembling his staff before they start on potentially available players


what every lets you sleep at night, sweetie.....

I have had buddies that have close ties to the Skins for a long time....

TheDave
01-08-2010, 07:51 AM
Wasn't there some pretty strong rumors going around that Shanahan was sick of Marshalls' act?

Assuming there is some truth to that I doubt he goes after him.

Unfortunately the Kuper thing is probably true... Better get at least a 2nd for him.

TheReverend
01-08-2010, 08:10 AM
what every lets you sleep at night, sweetie.....

I have had buddies that have close ties to the Skins for a long time....

No, I certainly believe you do, I just think it's REALLY early into the process. He and Bruce Allen are probably absurdly busy just evaluating coaches and trying to assemble their staff at the moment.

I think the Kuper rumor holds the most weight, because he seems like the obvious choice. I just HAVE to doubt any "official rumors" due to the timing.

Mr.Meanie
01-08-2010, 08:17 AM
Anyone want to bet that the poison pill comes back in a hurry this year?

So everyone keeps talking about the "poison pill". How does that work?

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 08:32 AM
No, I certainly believe you do, I just think it's REALLY early into the process. He and Bruce Allen are probably absurdly busy just evaluating coaches and trying to assemble their staff at the moment.

I think the Kuper rumor holds the most weight, because he seems like the obvious choice. I just HAVE to doubt any "official rumors" due to the timing.

no rumor is every official....

Tombstone RJ
01-08-2010, 08:36 AM
Then what in the hell do you call 2009? HYPOCRITE.

The beginning of a rebuilding process.

ColoradoDarin
01-08-2010, 08:36 AM
So everyone keeps talking about the "poison pill". How does that work?

Sign a player to a contract that has an addition which states "If Kuper plays more than 3 games a year in the state of Colorado, he will be paid $50 million" It makes it almost impossible for the team to match.

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 08:49 AM
No, I certainly believe you do, I just think it's REALLY early into the process. He and Bruce Allen are probably absurdly busy just evaluating coaches and trying to assemble their staff at the moment.

I think the Kuper rumor holds the most weight, because he seems like the obvious choice. I just HAVE to doubt any "official rumors" due to the timing.

Shanahan has had a year to assemble his coaches, ID what players he wants to bring in, trade for, and set up a draft board.....

Notice Mr. Kupe has been quiet here....

oubronco
01-08-2010, 09:06 AM
Mike Shanahan's hiring in Washington sets up a cross-country competition. Who will get to the Super Bowl first?</TD></TR> <TR><TD class=pollsViewResults>Total Votes =<SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript>document.write(total);</SCRIPT> 2864</TD></TR> <TR><TD><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD class=pollsAnswer><SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript> if (total > 0) { percent = ((values[++count] / total) * 100) + ""; if (percent.length > 4) { percent = percent.substring(0,5); } } else { percent = 0; } </SCRIPT>Josh McDaniels: Broncos have a better organization, from owner to grounds crew. McDaniels will get them there first.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=pollsResult><SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript> document.write('http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/std/polls_results.gif'); </SCRIPT>http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/std/polls_results.gif <SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript>writeValue(954,total);</SCRIPT> 954 Votes, or 33.31 %</TD></TR><TR><TD class=pollsAnswer><SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript> if (total > 0) { percent = ((values[++count] / total) * 100) + ""; if (percent.length > 4) { percent = percent.substring(0,5); } } else { percent = 0; } </SCRIPT>Mike Shanahan: The mastermind will carry the Hogs there himself, nevermind they don't have a big-time quarterback.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=pollsResult><SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript> document.write('http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/std/polls_results.gif'); </SCRIPT>http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/std/polls_results.gif <SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript>writeValue(1737,total);</SCRIPT> 1737 Votes, or 60.64 %</TD></TR><TR><TD class=pollsAnswer><SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript> if (total > 0) { percent = ((values[++count] / total) * 100) + ""; if (percent.length > 4) { percent = percent.substring(0,5); } } else { percent = 0; } </SCRIPT>Battle's brewing: Turnarounds are quick in the NFL. Next season look out: Broncos vs. 'Skins in the Super Bowl.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=pollsResult><SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript> document.write('http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/std/polls_results.gif'); </SCRIPT>http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/std/polls_results.gif <SCRIPT language=JavaScript type=text/javascript>writeValue(173,total);</SCRIPT> 173 Votes, or 6.040 %</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR>

Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos?_requestid=325168#ixzz0c2dJKOSA (http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos?_requestid=325168#ixzz0c2dJKOSA)

gunns
01-08-2010, 09:08 AM
I've never been in this much conflict as a sports fan. I can't help it. I was born and raised a Broncos fan. Broncos were my role models. And Shanahan at the top of the list.

Earlier this season I wrote this:




I just hope we start winning again soon. We're seeding the league with a lot of bad blood. I just want to see this turn into wins again.

I can understand. For me it was Elway and I would have had a lot of conflict had he gone somewhere else. I'm so thankful he never did.

To the Redskins: YOU MAY NOT HAVE CLADY, DOOM, DAWKINS OR BAILEY. Others are open to discussion and lots of picks or choice of players.

HorseHead
01-08-2010, 09:18 AM
"Shanny won us Super Bowls"...actually TD won us those rings, plain & simple...

Pony Boy
01-08-2010, 09:25 AM
Mike Shanahan's hiring in Washington sets up a cross-country competition. Who will get to the Super Bowl first?

Maybe we will get there at the same time......

TonyR
01-08-2010, 09:28 AM
Then what in the hell do you call 2009? HYPOCRITE.

You're equating one season to several seasons in a row? Go back and read what you highlighted and responded to and then just respond to this post by saying "oops".

uplink
01-08-2010, 09:36 AM
I've never been in this much conflict as a sports fan. I can't help it. I was born and raised a Broncos fan. Broncos were my role models. And Shanahan at the top of the list.


Have the skins under shanny as your 2nd favorite team. They are in another conference and only play once every 3 years. Its kind of like Shanny is part of the broncos to me even if he coaching elsewhere.

uplink
01-08-2010, 09:38 AM
Lewgold didn't mention that the broncos and skins sat across from each other at the NFL owners meeting, which likely facilitated the working relationships/trades etc. (per Shanny speach the other day)<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

bronco_diesel
01-08-2010, 09:49 AM
Wasn't there some pretty strong rumors going around that Shanahan was sick of Marshalls' act?

Assuming there is some truth to that I doubt he goes after him.

Unfortunately the Kuper thing is probably true... Better get at least a 2nd for him.

I recall reading that. From what I remember there was a consideration in cutting/trading him.

Garcia Bronco
01-08-2010, 09:49 AM
Shanahan isn't going to get Kuper or MArshall and he can have Tony

azbroncfan
01-08-2010, 09:57 AM
Mike was a nice guy and all but I disagree that our franchise was headed in the right direction. Ten years, 1 playoff victory, and several truly pathetic seasons in a row gets you fired in this league no matter who you are. I chatted with Mike numerous times over the years and towards the end you could just sense that he was burning out and needed a break. He got it and maybe he's recharged again. He's not going to concern himself with how the Broncos are doing and I'm certainly not going to give a rats ;D ass how Mike is doing in washington.

Pat told his old buddy thanks for the memories but hit the bricks because you are failing miserably at running my business. Pat is the man who has repeatedly shown he can make big decisions when they need to be made. ^5

Exactly it is hard to say the franchise was headed in the right direction when a Norv Turner led team has had more playoff wins than yours. Especially when you got to pick your suposed Franchise QB that led the league in INT's.

Pony Boy
01-08-2010, 09:58 AM
Shanahan isn't going to get Kuper or MArshall and he can have Tony

He's got that "shanny death stare" on McDaniels just waiting for him to release Hillis.....

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 10:19 AM
You're equating one season to several seasons in a row? Go back and read what you highlighted and responded to and then just respond to this post by saying "oops".

No oops about it.

Riddle me this: the 24-24 record that MECK deemed 'pathetic' is what winning %?

OH.

So Shanny rebuilding = pathetic.

McGenius inherits a top two offense (yards) top 3 in 3rd down conversions and proceeds to have that unit REGRESS--interesting considering THAT IS HIS AREA OF EXPERTISE.

This team was poised to be 10-6 or 11-5 with ONLY SOME DEFENSIVE TINKERING. McD blew the whole thing up--made us OLDER in the process--and we are right back we we god damned started.

I wanted Shanny replaced because I had no faith in him to rebuild our defense

I have ZERO faith in McGenius to build an offense.......and without Nolan on board--I'd have zero faith in him on defense either.

How about his two first round picks there, buddy? Oh and Alphonso is starting for us, right?

2 and 8.

bowtown
01-08-2010, 10:21 AM
Please stop saying "riddle me this."

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 10:22 AM
Please stop saying "riddle me this."

Please quit responding in a football related thread since you rarely ,if ever, discuss football.

kupesdad
01-08-2010, 10:27 AM
From my Redskin Buddies, Kuper is the target.....

Chris and Shanahan have a very good relationship. Shanny had an open house for a resteraunt he is opening last night and I know that a number of players were invited.

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 10:32 AM
Chris and Shanahan have a very good relationship. Shanny had an open house for a resteraunt he is opening last night and I know that a number of players were invited.


So if your son does leave to Washington, do you promise to divulge all that Kupe had to say about McDaniels and to divulge if the lockerroom was as split as I think it was down the stretch..........;)

TheReverend
01-08-2010, 10:33 AM
So if your son does leave to Washington, do you promise to divulge all that Kupe had to say about McDaniels and to divulge if the lockerroom was as split as I think it was down the stretch..........;)

Of course he won't. Chris seems too classy and the same for his dad. Even though his dad wears ladies' clothing... that part disturbs me Kupesdad.

TonyR
01-08-2010, 10:34 AM
So Shanny rebuilding = pathetic.


No, but how about "rebuilding" for the better part of ten years?



This team was poised to be 10-6 or 11-5 with ONLY SOME DEFENSIVE TINKERING.

Yes, because everybody gave this team a chance to go 10-6 or 11-5 before the season...



How about his two first round picks there, buddy? Oh and Alphonso is starting for us, right?


So you're officially writing off Moreno and Ayers?

kupesdad
01-08-2010, 10:36 AM
Of course he won't. Chris seems too classy and the same for his dad. Even though his dad wears ladies' clothing... that part disturbs me Kupesdad.

Not while the ladies are still in them.....

TonyR
01-08-2010, 10:36 AM
Chris and Shanahan have a very good relationship. Shanny had an open house for a resteraunt he is opening last night and I know that a number of players were invited.

Oh now why did you have to go and say this. The drama queens around here are going to equate this to the end of Broncos civilization as we know it. Players aren't allowed to be friendly with former coaches! And clearly liking Shanahan means you hate McDaniels! Oh whatever shall we do!

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 10:36 AM
Of course he won't. Chris seems too classy and the same for his dad. Even though his dad wears ladies' clothing... that part disturbs me Kupesdad.

:rofl:

kupesdad
01-08-2010, 10:37 AM
So if your son does leave to Washington, do you promise to divulge all that Kupe had to say about McDaniels and to divulge if the lockerroom was as split as I think it was down the stretch..........;)

not gun doit...wouldn't be prudent

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 10:44 AM
No, but how about "rebuilding" for the better part of ten years?

He blew up the offense after the AFCCG and you KNOW it. Cutler, Marshall Scheff via the draft---prior years he reloaded--we still had Sharpe(for a portion) Eddie Mac, Rod, then Lelie and our O-line remained the cornerstone--there ws no rebuilding needed there.






Yes, because everybody gave this team a chance to go 10-6 or 11-5 before the season...

If some McGenius had not come in and traded the heart of our 2008 offense and instead had focused mostly on the defense--a 10 win season in what was thought to be a weak division with 2 rebuilding teams seemed highly plausible, considering that we were 24-24 during that rebuild--the 2007 7-9 Broncos got better offensively in 2008 from 20 to 23 pts/gm and would have probably improved slightly on that up to around 25 with a year's more continuity.....but we will NEVER know--because we hired this piss ant with more moxy than talent to run our franchise. I am DISGUSTED while writing this that Bowlen and the powers that be don't see this EPIC failure of a 2010 season that we will be approaching.........





So you're officially writing off Moreno and Ayers?

Moreno will be servicable..Ayers is DOG POOH. Orapko @ 12 and Wells where Ayers was taken (18?) would have been a HOMERUN.

And don;t forget our third 1st rounder from 2008--Alphonso Smith--who got slightly more playing time than an undrafted FA (carter)--and made LESS PLAYS than Carter did.

McDaniels andf Xanders literally SWUNG AND MISSED ON 3 First ROUNDER LAST YEAR--yuck, yuck yuck........

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 10:52 AM
not gun doit...wouldn't be prudent

How about a PM? Ha!

TheReverend
01-08-2010, 10:52 AM
Not while the ladies are still in them.....

:spit:

Well played

kupesdad
01-08-2010, 10:57 AM
How about a PM? Ha!

nice try

Mr.Meanie
01-08-2010, 11:08 AM
This team was poised to be 10-6 or 11-5 with ONLY SOME DEFENSIVE TINKERING. McD blew the whole thing up--made us OLDER in the process--and we are right back we we god damned started.

Interesting, because in the thread you started before the season, you predicted we would go 3-13...

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 11:26 AM
Interesting, because in the thread you started before the season, you predicted we would go 3-13...

For emphasis:

If some McGenius had not come in and traded the heart of our 2008 offense and instead had focused mostly on the defense--a 10 win season in what was thought to be a weak division with 2 rebuilding teams seemed highly plausible, considering that we were 24-24 during that rebuild--the 2007 7-9 Broncos got better offensively in 2008 from 20 to 23 pts/gm and would have probably improved slightly on that up to around 25 with a year's more continuity.....but we will NEVER know--because we hired this piss ant with more moxy than talent to run our franchise. I am DISGUSTED while writing this that Bowlen and the powers that be don't see this EPIC failure of a 2010 season that we will be approaching.........

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 11:47 AM
Chris and Shanahan have a very good relationship. Shanny had an open house for a resteraunt he is opening last night and I know that a number of players were invited.

Thought so.....if you had to guess (not using any insider info) but do you place Chris's odds at returning? 50%-80%

snowspot66
01-08-2010, 12:41 PM
Thought so.....if you had to guess (not using any insider info) but do you place Chris's odds at returning? 50%-80%

Kind of asking the wrong guy there hoss. I'm pretty sure McDaniels will be making that decision and not Kupe's dad. We get to choose who we keep and who we don't.

snowspot66
01-08-2010, 12:47 PM
No oops about it.

Riddle me this: the 24-24 record that MECK deemed 'pathetic' is what winning %?

OH.

So Shanny rebuilding = pathetic.

McGenius inherits a top two offense (yards) top 3 in 3rd down conversions and proceeds to have that unit REGRESS--interesting considering THAT IS HIS AREA OF EXPERTISE.

This team was poised to be 10-6 or 11-5 with ONLY SOME DEFENSIVE TINKERING. McD blew the whole thing up--made us OLDER in the process--and we are right back we we god damned started.

I wanted Shanny replaced because I had no faith in him to rebuild our defense

I have ZERO faith in McGenius to build an offense.......and without Nolan on board--I'd have zero faith in him on defense either.

How about his two first round picks there, buddy? Oh and Alphonso is starting for us, right?

2 and 8.

Our offense was a turnover machine and getting older in the place it counts most. The offensive line. The offense hasn't been any good since 2005.

McDaniels selected his coaches, his players, and the scheme. He is the guy that built the defense. Nolan ran it. He's already improved the defense.

Moreno put up stats that in every other instance when a player has done what he did as a rookie they won OROY.

Ayers played a lot, learned a lot, and even had his name called a few times. It looks promising. But you go ahead and keep ignoring the fact that everybody knew he was going to be a multi-year project to reach his full potential. You would have probably shot Mario Williams after his rookie year if you were a Texans fan (and wouldn't it be great if you were).

Smith played and did well the first six games, got dinged, and then couldn't crack the starting line up consisting of Goodman, Champ, and Law. Three guys who know a bit about football and played pretty damned good the entire year. Almost every rookie CB struggles. Almost every rookie in general struggles. What do you expect? HoF credentials after one year?

Your expectations are impossible and you get all pissy when people call you on it.

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 01:33 PM
Kind of asking the wrong guy there hoss. I'm pretty sure McDaniels will be making that decision and not Kupe's dad. We get to choose who we keep and who we don't.

not true...If Chris wanted to leave, all he has to do is refuse to agree to a contract, get tendered and have the new club sign him. Properly placed poison pill here and he ends up on a new team......

I hope we keep Chris....if not, I have some suggestions on places to live and avoid in the DC/VA area :D

elsid13
01-08-2010, 01:47 PM
not true...If Chris wanted to leave, all he has to do is refuse to agree to a contract, get tendered and have the new club sign him. Properly placed poison pill here and he ends up on a new team......

I hope we keep Chris....if not, I have some suggestions on places to live and avoid in the DC/VA area :D

He'll want to live out near Ashburn. There are lot of great large homes for sell near Great Falls.

Hogan11
01-08-2010, 01:55 PM
Can't stand the Redskins.....of course, the Super Bowl loss back in the 80's and having an aquaintence that was a unbearable fan of them probably contributed to that feeling.

Shanahan becoming the new HC there does nothing to alter my feelings towards them

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 02:05 PM
He'll want to live out near Ashburn. There are lot of great large homes for sell near Great Falls.

ashburn sucks.....

DBroncos4life
01-08-2010, 02:08 PM
Our offense was a turnover machine and getting older in the place it counts most. The offensive line. The offense hasn't been any good since 2005.

McDaniels selected his coaches, his players, and the scheme. He is the guy that built the defense. Nolan ran it. He's already improved the defense.

Moreno put up stats that in every other instance when a player has done what he did as a rookie they won OROY.

Ayers played a lot, learned a lot, and even had his name called a few times. It looks promising. But you go ahead and keep ignoring the fact that everybody knew he was going to be a multi-year project to reach his full potential. You would have probably shot Mario Williams after his rookie year if you were a Texans fan (and wouldn't it be great if you were).

Smith played and did well the first six games, got dinged, and then couldn't crack the starting line up consisting of Goodman, Champ, and Law. Three guys who know a bit about football and played pretty damned good the entire year. Almost every rookie CB struggles. Almost every rookie in general struggles. What do you expect? HoF credentials after one year?

Your expectations are impossible and you get all pissy when people call you on it.

Then why did McD do nothing to fix this problem? Our O-line gave up 12 sacks the year before now its too old? It had TWO players over the age of thirty. Hamilton is 32 that isn't exactly ancient for a OG in the NFL. His injuries that he has taken over the years are more of a problem then his age. He was a warrior this season, kind of like Lepisis was his last year. The system change without the personal to run the system was the problem, not the age of the O-Line.

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 02:15 PM
Your expectations are impossible and you get all pissy when people call you on it.

Improving 2 games on 8-8 and having an incremental increase of 2 points per game are impossible expectations?

Did you consider that we improved 1 game from 2007 and 2008 and 3 points from 2007 to 2008.

The defense needed an overhaul--the offense needed some more time to gel.......We are stuck with McGenius for another season--if you think that 2-8 is bad like I do--wait until we get a 4-12 or 5-11 season in 2010....then the rest of the homers will come around to the fact that he wasn't the right choice.

snowspot66
01-08-2010, 02:29 PM
not true...If Chris wanted to leave, all he has to do is refuse to agree to a contract, get tendered and have the new club sign him. Properly placed poison pill here and he ends up on a new team......

I hope we keep Chris....if not, I have some suggestions on places to live and avoid in the DC/VA area :D

Yeah but we can tender him at a price that nobody will pay. Would you give up a first for Kupe? He's been great for us but very few guards ever go in the first.

Soul-Bronco
01-08-2010, 02:33 PM
Improving 2 games on 8-8 and having an incremental increase of 2 points per game are impossible expectations?

Did you consider that we improved 1 game from 2007 and 2008 and 3 points from 2007 to 2008.

The defense needed an overhaul--the offense needed some more time to gel.......We are stuck with McGenius for another season--if you think that 2-8 is bad like I do--wait until we get a 4-12 or 5-11 season in 2010....then the rest of the homers will come around to the fact that he wasn't the right choice.

jeez dude the more and more i keep reading your posts, the more i come to the conclusion that you have that transformers toy stuck way deep up ur @ss and Mcd put it there

snowspot66
01-08-2010, 02:34 PM
Then why did McD do nothing to fix this problem? Our O-line gave up 12 sacks the year before now its too old? It had TWO players over the age of thirty. Hamilton is 32 that isn't exactly ancient for a OG in the NFL. His injuries that he has taken over the years are more of a problem then his age. He was a warrior this season, kind of like Lepisis was his last year. The system change without the personal to run the system was the problem, not the age of the O-Line.

In the middle yes. Guess what? That's what killed us. Over and over.

Too small and too old. They won't be getting any better. Why didn't McDaniels fix it?

Well what do you expect? The guy had to rebuild an entire defense and now you're mad he didn't take care of the offensive line on top of that?

DBroncos4life
01-08-2010, 02:57 PM
In the middle yes. Guess what? That's what killed us. Over and over.

Too small and too old. They won't be getting any better. Why didn't McDaniels fix it?

Well what do you expect? The guy had to rebuild an entire defense and now you're mad he didn't take care of the offensive line on top of that?

lol, I'm not mad at anything. Fact of the matter is he resigned our Center. He could have let him retire. Again how is two players being over the age of 30 out of five too old? They might have been too small for his system which is a mistake on his part. You either replace the guys there and bring in the proper players or you adjust the system to fit your players you have now. McD retained everything from our old system so there is no reason to think we couldn't have pulled of the ZBS for another year till we could fix the line for his system.

I guess what you are trying to say is that McD ended up making too many scheme changes for the team to handle in one year and I agree with you.

ColoradoDarin
01-08-2010, 02:59 PM
Then why did McD do nothing to fix this problem? Our O-line gave up 12 sacks the year before now its too old? It had TWO players over the age of thirty. Hamilton is 32 that isn't exactly ancient for a OG in the NFL. His injuries that he has taken over the years are more of a problem then his age. He was a warrior this season, kind of like Lepisis was his last year. The system change without the personal to run the system was the problem, not the age of the O-Line.

McD did bring in Hochstein, who was (marginally) better than Hamilton, and he drafted Seth Olsen. We had an all pro line last year, who would have thought it was going to fall apart that quickly?

Merlin
01-08-2010, 03:04 PM
Chris and Shanahan have a very good relationship. Shanny had an open house for a resteraunt he is opening last night and I know that a number of players were invited.
That seems like a nice, underhanded way to avoid tampering charges. If I were McD I would send a letter to the NFL just to keep them Skins well behaved. As much as I liked Shanny when he was here, I would not trust him talking to our players in his territory.

elsid13
01-08-2010, 03:07 PM
ashburn sucks.....

I know that why I recommend house on either Georgetown Pike or Towlston Rd. There are some very big homes back there. He not going to want to leave in Old Town or Arlington to far away.

Merlin
01-08-2010, 03:08 PM
He's been great for us but very few guards ever go in the first.
Luckily KC and the Raiders like picking "Tackle" linemen in the first that should be guards. They keep that up and they will never be able to protect their QBs (although the Raiders seemed better this yr).

Merlin
01-08-2010, 03:10 PM
McD did bring in Hochstein, who was (marginally) better than Hamilton, and he drafted Seth Olsen. We had an all pro line last year, who would have thought it was going to fall apart that quickly?
Anyone who knows football and it is told the coach expects them to protect a statute, so they must change from a moving line to a power line.

Merlin
01-08-2010, 03:15 PM
Smith played and did well the first six games, got dinged, and then couldn't crack the starting line up consisting ... Law. Three guys who know a bit about football and played pretty damned good the entire year.
A old man who was signed off the street. Yes, I would expect him to outplay Law. What did we give up for Smith again?

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 03:18 PM
I know that why I recommend house on either Georgetown Pike or Towlston Rd. There are some very big homes back there. He not going to want to leave in Old Town or Arlington to far away.

Oh I know...I live near old town and work in Herndon....

Mr.Meanie
01-08-2010, 03:19 PM
Improving 2 games on 8-8 and having an incremental increase of 2 points per game are impossible expectations?

Again, those weren't your expectations. Your expectation was 3-13. You already made up your mind that you hated the coach and QB before the season even started.

elsid13
01-08-2010, 03:20 PM
Oh I know...I live near old town and work in Herndon....

Where you going recommend Del Ray?

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 03:29 PM
Again, those weren't your expectations. Your expectation was 3-13. You already made up your mind that you hated the coach and QB before the season even started.

You have the mental capacity of corpse..........go back and read my posts again........with Jay Cutler I expected us to win 10 games. There was no reason to trade him except for McGenius's inkling to do so........It all falls back to him


-2 and 8 in the last 10
-a 20 point loss AT HOME to a 4 win team in a game we had to have (worse than the SD game b/c the chiefs are not as good and it was at home)

This is what happens when our team gets better acclimated to McGenius's 'system'........a .200 winning %

kupesdad
01-08-2010, 04:48 PM
That seems like a nice, underhanded way to avoid tampering charges. If I were McD I would send a letter to the NFL just to keep them Skins well behaved. As much as I liked Shanny when he was here, I would not trust him talking to our players in his territory.

Chris was invited to the grand opening long before Shanny landed the job. It doesn't take much to figure that Mike will do the same thing that McD did... go after people familiar with his system. Chris is a Bronco and wants to be a Bronco so we will see what happens with the CBA.

Popps
01-08-2010, 05:08 PM
Chris was invited to the grand opening long before Shanny landed the job. It doesn't take much to figure that Mike will do the same thing that McD did... go after people familiar with his system. Chris is a Bronco and wants to be a Bronco so we will see what happens with the CBA.

What a mess. I'm praying they get something worked out. It's going to be a downer for a lot of players, but for fans as well... who are looking forward to seeing teams build out their roster with some of the potentially huge FA pool out there this year.

Hogan11
01-08-2010, 05:10 PM
Chris was invited to the grand opening long before Shanny landed the job. It doesn't take much to figure that Mike will do the same thing that McD did... go after people familiar with his system. Chris is a Bronco and wants to be a Bronco so we will see what happens with the CBA.

Here's hoping he stays a Bronco.

2KBack
01-08-2010, 05:11 PM
Here's hoping he stays a Bronco.

seconded

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 05:25 PM
Where you going recommend Del Ray?

love Del Ray....miss living there.

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 05:26 PM
Chris was invited to the grand opening long before Shanny landed the job. It doesn't take much to figure that Mike will do the same thing that McD did... go after people familiar with his system. Chris is a Bronco and wants to be a Bronco so we will see what happens with the CBA.

If he leaves, you realize you'll have to deal with Kaylore's baggage...

:D

elsid13
01-08-2010, 05:38 PM
love Del Ray....miss living there.

Everyone that I know say that. I going to start looking down there. I am serious thinking about moving from my condo.

gunns
01-08-2010, 05:55 PM
McDaniels andf Xanders literally SWUNG AND MISSED ON 3 First ROUNDER LAST YEAR--yuck, yuck yuck........


As if Shanahan didn't do that more than once.

broncofan7
01-08-2010, 06:42 PM
As if Shanahan didn't do that more than once.

in ONE draft? Enlighten me.........

Ray Finkle
01-08-2010, 08:15 PM
Everyone that I know say that. I going to start looking down there. I am serious thinking about moving from my condo.

Where are you now? Let me know when you look. There are a few places you want to avoid in Del Ray.....great place. I live a few miles away from there and still make it over there.

elsid13
01-09-2010, 05:04 AM
Where are you now? Let me know when you look. There are a few places you want to avoid in Del Ray.....great place. I live a few miles away from there and still make it over there.

I own over in Skyline. It be the spring, if I decide to look. I like the location and place, I'm just getting antsy lately like I need to move.

Ray Finkle
01-09-2010, 08:41 AM
I own over in Skyline. It be the spring, if I decide to look. I like the location and place, I'm just getting antsy lately like I need to move.

you're right down the street from me....I am near the Bradlee Shopping Center....funny.

elsid13
01-09-2010, 10:10 AM
you're right down the street from me....I am near the Bradlee Shopping Center....funny.

My buddy live down there to. You near Lindsy Cadillac