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View Full Version : Good article by Krieger on Hillis


Mile High Mojoe
12-16-2009, 07:40 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/krieger

My favorite line in the article is when Krieger said, "McDaniels would rather make a point than a first down."

oubronco
12-16-2009, 07:42 AM
Here we go again

bronco militia
12-16-2009, 07:42 AM
mcdaniels was forced to keep hillis in at FB after Larson was injured on he first play of the game.

oubronco
12-16-2009, 07:43 AM
mcdaniels was forced to keep hillis in at FB after Larson was injured on he first play of the game.

Yes that FB was real effective in one back sets

bowtown
12-16-2009, 07:43 AM
In on page 1.

azbroncfan
12-16-2009, 07:44 AM
Here is a new one.....McD won't play Hillis because he is a Shanny guy.

Mile High Mojoe
12-16-2009, 07:45 AM
Yes Larson got hurt and I know the OL didn't play in the Colts game but it was flat wrong that Hillis didn't get one carry when it was clear Moreno couldn't get a first on short yardage.

cutthemdown
12-16-2009, 07:47 AM
The problem is Hillis won't be any better with defenders and blockers in a pile, in the backfield, before he reaches LOS.

Even Kuper getting blown up right now and has taken a step back this yr. I don't see him blowing his guy off the line. Wiegman and the Hochstien/Hamitlon combo get dominated every short yardage play.

It just doesn't make sense to blame the rb. Mcdaniels is smart and there is nothing going on here but a failure of the oline to block well, and for people to understand how he is thinking.

cutthemdown
12-16-2009, 07:50 AM
I agree with giving the ball to Moreno. He needs to learn, gain experience, and become a better back. He is more talented, smarter, quicker, with way more wiggle in the hips then Hillis will ever hope to have. It's the right move to give him as many carries as he can handle so he improves.

He will get better at the short yardage stuff when the oline blocks better, and he has more experience.

Hillis can't even block anyone at the FB spot anyways. He is a horrid FB and IMO is better off being a bkup rb.

WolfpackGuy
12-16-2009, 07:52 AM
"The Coach" oughta just take any running plays between the guards and save them for next year.

yerner
12-16-2009, 07:52 AM
Is Moreno hurt? Will he play Sunday?

jhns
12-16-2009, 07:54 AM
I do like the way he runs and I don't understand him not getting a chance. It doesn't bother me to much though. It will be nice having him fresh now that it is late in the year and nearing the playoffs. The other backs are getting banged up so he should start seeing some play time soon.

Mile High Mojoe
12-16-2009, 07:55 AM
"The Coach" oughta just take any running plays between the guards and save them for next year.

Hilarious!

vancejohnson82
12-16-2009, 07:58 AM
yea...it will be pretty much a moot point this week....he's going to see some time with Buckhalter banged up and Moreno being a rookie and needign to regain his legs

if Hillis breaks 100 yards this board might explode

tsiguy96
12-16-2009, 07:59 AM
The problem is Hillis won't be any better with defenders and blockers in a pile, in the backfield, before he reaches LOS.

Even Kuper getting blown up right now and has taken a step back this yr. I don't see him blowing his guy off the line. Wiegman and the Hochstien/Hamitlon combo get dominated every short yardage play.

It just doesn't make sense to blame the rb. Mcdaniels is smart and there is nothing going on here but a failure of the oline to block well, and for people to understand how he is thinking.

watch the cleveland game last year. without hillis getting a 1st down on 4th and 2 after getting hit by several people in the backfield, we lose.

Mile High Mojoe
12-16-2009, 08:01 AM
yea...it will be pretty much a moot point this week....he's going to see some time with Buckhalter banged up and Moreno being a rookie and needign to regain his legs

if Hillis breaks 100 yards this board might explodeI think Hillis could easily put a 100 yards on the Raiders if they just gave him a chance.

vancejohnson82
12-16-2009, 08:05 AM
I think Hillis could easily put a 100 yards on the Raiders if they just gave him a chance.

the yards will be there...it depends on who gets the carries

Moreno got 90 last time against Oakland
Buckhalter had 108

Mr.Meanie
12-16-2009, 08:55 AM
It's obvious McD hates Shanny guys. Think about it... Royal, Hillis, Scheffler?? They were all Shanny guys and McD is trying to ruin their careers just to prove a point.

Rigs11
12-16-2009, 08:57 AM
the way the Oline played last week it woulnt of mattered if we had TD back there.

outdoor_miner
12-16-2009, 09:08 AM
So, I honestly don't understand why Hillis is not getting opportunities... It seems to me that he could bring something to this offense, both in the running game and catching the ball out of the backfield. It seems that he should be getting more touches.

With that being said - there must be more to the story. McDaniels is not out there losing games on purpose. So - while I don't understand this particular move as a fan, I do understand that the coach is playing the guys that he thinks give the team the best chance to win. For whatever reason, that does not include Hillis. The coach's philosophy has put the team on the edge of the playoffs, so I'm not going to bitch and moan about it.

colonelbeef
12-16-2009, 09:11 AM
Royal, Hillis, and Sheffler are all being misused. Royal and Sheffler can be attributed to Ortons' inability to hit receivers down the field in stride, whereas Hillis is simply being overlooked, to the overall detriment of the team

missingnumber7
12-16-2009, 09:16 AM
Royal, Hillis, and Sheffler are all being misused. Royal and Sheffler can be attributed to Ortons' inability to hit receivers down the field in stride, whereas Hillis is simply being overlooked, to the overall detriment of the team

Royal is interchangable with Gaffney and Gaff is the coaches guy.


I don't agree that Hillis is being overlooked. If you read that article there are some real inconsistencies in what McD says about him. He may be giving straight answers in his mind, but it flat out appears like he is dodging a question on a regular basis, and that question is always about Hillis.

cutthemdown
12-16-2009, 09:16 AM
watch the cleveland game last year. without hillis getting a 1st down on 4th and 2 after getting hit by several people in the backfield, we lose.

Yeah but we don't get to play the Browns every week. I know I know and Tatum Bell carried Ray Lewis for 5 yrds etc etc.

The main reason for the offense scoring less is some oline probs, and a way tougher schedule.

If this team was playing last yrs schedule we would be scoring a lot more.

outdoor_miner
12-16-2009, 09:19 AM
Royal is interchangable with Gaffney and Gaff is the coaches guy.

I don't agree with this. Royal was positioned as "the star" of the offense this offseason. I guess that could have been BS, but I think the team truly expected more from him. For whatever reason, it is just not clicking with him and Orton.

cutthemdown
12-16-2009, 09:21 AM
If Mcdaniels problem with Hillis is because Hillis isn't that smart, then I wouldn't expect for him to ridicule Hillis by saying well he would play but the dude can't remember what his assignment it. All he is good for is giving ball to and saying run forrest run.

I'm not saying that is the problem just saying it could be possible.

If Hillis gets his shot I hope he proves all of you Hillis lovers correct and smashes some people in the mouth.

I just figure they play full speed at practice, they see what he can do. These coaches know way more about football then we do. There isn't really anyone in here dumb enough to think they know football as well as any NFL coach is there? Seriously everyone loves to armchair coach but you have to realize you don't know crap.

It's like a movie, you can watch and know its crap, but still not know how to make a better one. It's the same with football. It's easy to say that was stupid play calling, but seriously most of us wouldn't even be able to design one working play that was new or innovative.

Dedhed
12-16-2009, 09:24 AM
Yes Larson got hurt and I know the OL didn't play in the Colts game but it was flat wrong that Hillis didn't get one carry when it was clear Moreno couldn't get a first on short yardage.

He did get a carry, 2 yards. Oh, and blew his blocking assignment on one of the short attempts. but at least you know what you're talking about:welcome:

outdoor_miner
12-16-2009, 09:30 AM
Oh, and blew his blocking assignment on one of the short attempts.

That was brutal. Larsen really is a much much better blocking fullback. He was greatly missed last weekend.

Popps
12-16-2009, 09:34 AM
Please merge this with the Hillis thread.

We've got 2K posts to make. :)

Mr.Meanie
12-16-2009, 09:43 AM
If Mcdaniels problem with Hillis is because Hillis isn't that smart, then I wouldn't expect for him to ridicule Hillis by saying well he would play but the dude can't remember what his assignment it. All he is good for is giving ball to and saying run forrest run.

I'm not saying that is the problem just saying it could be possible.

If Hillis gets his shot I hope he proves all of you Hillis lovers correct and smashes some people in the mouth.

I just figure they play full speed at practice, they see what he can do. These coaches know way more about football then we do. There isn't really anyone in here dumb enough to think they know football as well as any NFL coach is there? Seriously everyone loves to armchair coach but you have to realize you don't know crap.

It's like a movie, you can watch and know its crap, but still not know how to make a better one. It's the same with football. It's easy to say that was stupid play calling, but seriously most of us wouldn't even be able to design one working play that was new or innovative.

well said.

Like someone mentioned in a post on MHR, how many of us were saying to pound it down Indy's throat a week ago? McD did just that, and this week everyone is saying how terrible and predictable the play calling was, because it wasn't executed well (or was out-executed by the Colts D).

If McD had stuck to the 3 yard bubble screens/slants and they didn't work, the major theme would be how arrogant he is and we would have won if he had just pounded it up the middle on Indy's small run D.

When any team loses, the armchair coaches on internet messageboards for every team think their play calling is terrible, predictable, boring, etc. Or that their coaches are not good, players aren't good, etc.

Hell... read the Bears message boards. In April, the Bears FO were geniuses... they had ripped off the Broncos and were SB bound with their weak schedule, superstar QB, revamped OL, shutdown D, and stud RB. Now every other post is calling for the entire FO to be fired.

We all like to discuss how players should be utilized, who we should draft, which schemes we should run... but the bottom line is no one really knows exactly what the hell they are talking about. And the people like dragster and rasta who think there is some sort of conspiracy out there to not play the best players or try to win games are the worst of them all.

Taco John
12-16-2009, 10:18 AM
He did get a carry, 2 yards. Oh, and blew his blocking assignment on one of the short attempts. but at least you know what you're talking about:welcome:

He didn't blow his blocking assignment. He got hung up on Hockstein's leg, who was blown off the block. And a two yard run on a single carry is nothing to be ashamed of. Obviously, you don't want to see a guy average 2 yards a carry. But you need more than one carry to be effective as a runningback. I think we've all seen that Peyton Hillis gets stronger as he gets more carries. Once the guy starts getting contact, he just gets fired up, and starts destroying people who get in his way. And he always falls forward.

I guess I just think that it's legitimate to wonder why this guy hasn't been used for the tools that he has. It makes sense to me to have a 250 lb. guy who can both catch, carry, and block as part of your third down package. Even if you're using him as a decoy, just having someone with that build on the field in short yardage sets gives opponents one more thing to account for.

I do have to say that I was amused at McDaniels comments about Moreno and Buckhalter being "big enough" backs. I would wager that both of them are probably hovering around 206-207 at this point in the season.

I guess we'll see how it goes this weekend against Oakland. I really believe that Hillis could give this team a spark if he's given the opportunity for at least 10 carries. And after last week, I think this offense could use a spark.

Taco John
12-16-2009, 10:30 AM
I just figure they play full speed at practice, they see what he can do. These coaches know way more about football then we do. There isn't really anyone in here dumb enough to think they know football as well as any NFL coach is there? Seriously everyone loves to armchair coach but you have to realize you don't know crap.

It's like a movie, you can watch and know its crap, but still not know how to make a better one. It's the same with football. It's easy to say that was stupid play calling, but seriously most of us wouldn't even be able to design one working play that was new or innovative.


I hear what you're saying, and I appreciate it for sure. But I think this situation is different than say an evaluation of Buckhalter vs. Moreno. We're talking about a 250lb. guy that we all witnessed pull our team out of desperate straits, and carry them on his back until he was finally injured in the process. And sure enough, the team was on his back, because the minute he left the field, the team fell back into the desperate straits it was before he was given his shot.

Further than that, we've all seen this offense stall in short yardage, especially in the red zone. Were in the bottom third of the league in our third down conversion percentage (http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?offensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STAT S&season=2009&seasonType=REG&d-447263-o=2&conference=ALL&tabSeq=2&role=TM&d-447263-p=1&d-447263-s=DOWN_3RD_PERCENTAGE&d-447263-n=1). I think it's easy and logical to question why we wouldn't want the 250lb back who carried the team on his shoulders last year at least included into our short yardage and red zone sets, and maybe be given a couple of bonus carries a game.

broncocalijohn
12-16-2009, 10:40 AM
This reason really bothers me as we had run plays without a FB and Moreno seems to never follow the FB anyways so it is pretty much a wasted position. Just put another TE to block.
From Krieger:

2. When Spencer Larsen went down with a back injury on the opening kickoff, it left Hillis the only fullback for McDaniels' two-back sets, so he couldn't play halfback.

Rock Chalk
12-16-2009, 11:03 AM
He didn't blow his blocking assignment. He got hung up on Hockstein's leg, who was blown off the block. And a two yard run on a single carry is nothing to be ashamed of. Obviously, you don't want to see a guy average 2 yards a carry. But you need more than one carry to be effective as a runningback. I think we've all seen that Peyton Hillis gets stronger as he gets more carries. Once the guy starts getting contact, he just gets fired up, and starts destroying people who get in his way. And he always falls forward.

I guess I just think that it's legitimate to wonder why this guy hasn't been used for the tools that he has. It makes sense to me to have a 250 lb. guy who can both catch, carry, and block as part of your third down package. Even if you're using him as a decoy, just having someone with that build on the field in short yardage sets gives opponents one more thing to account for.

I do have to say that I was amused at McDaniels comments about Moreno and Buckhalter being "big enough" backs. I would wager that both of them are probably hovering around 206-207 at this point in the season.

I guess we'll see how it goes this weekend against Oakland. I really believe that Hillis could give this team a spark if he's given the opportunity for at least 10 carries. And after last week, I think this offense could use a spark.

If he didnt blow his assignment and got hung up on Hoch's leg in teh backfield what makes you think that he could have got the first down in that situation anyway?

Its like you idiots dont watch the game. Every single short yardage situation there was no hope of it going anywhere NO MATTER WHO WAS RUNNING THE BALL.

Popps
12-16-2009, 11:09 AM
It is cute to see these writers who claimed McDaniels would be a failure at every turn in the off-season, now grasping for statements like... "he'd rather prove a point than gain a first down."

Obviously, they have to try to sell bird-cage-liners, but can't any of these hacks put a decent story together?

ColoradoDarin
12-16-2009, 11:20 AM
Hillis must have compromising pictures of a bunch of Maners, I've never seen someone suck so much in his opportunities this year and get so much love. He did well in scrub-time against the Chiefs, that's it.

Maybe if the argument was "how about a play-action pass" instead of changing out which RB was going to get blown up behind the line on yet another 3rd & 1...

TheElusiveKyleOrton
12-16-2009, 11:29 AM
It's obvious McD hates Shanny guys. Think about it... Royal, Hillis, Scheffler?? They were all Shanny guys and McD is trying to ruin their careers just to prove a point.

This is... I mean... you're joking right?

I couldn't make out your sarcasm font, I guess.

Marshall is also a Shanny guy. So is Clady. They seem fine.

tsiguy96
12-16-2009, 11:31 AM
If Mcdaniels problem with Hillis is because Hillis isn't that smart, then I wouldn't expect for him to ridicule Hillis by saying well he would play but the dude can't remember what his assignment it. All he is good for is giving ball to and saying run forrest run.

I'm not saying that is the problem just saying it could be possible.

If Hillis gets his shot I hope he proves all of you Hillis lovers correct and smashes some people in the mouth.

I just figure they play full speed at practice, they see what he can do. These coaches know way more about football then we do. There isn't really anyone in here dumb enough to think they know football as well as any NFL coach is there? Seriously everyone loves to armchair coach but you have to realize you don't know crap.

It's like a movie, you can watch and know its crap, but still not know how to make a better one. It's the same with football. It's easy to say that was stupid play calling, but seriously most of us wouldn't even be able to design one working play that was new or innovative.

thats the thing though, we have seen what hillis can do on the field in real game situations, and its impressive. and its not being taken advantage of, especially on short yardage

Popps
12-16-2009, 11:39 AM
Hillis must have compromising pictures of a bunch of Maners, I've never seen someone suck so much in his opportunities this year and get so much love. He did well in scrub-time against the Chiefs, that's it.

Maybe if the argument was "how about a play-action pass" instead of changing out which RB was going to get blown up behind the line on yet another 3rd & 1...

Yea, they were re-running the game on NFLN last night, late... and I couldn't avert my eyes long enough to miss that play.

Basically, there were two DBs in the backfield that could have almost taken the handoff from Orton. Moreno never got anywhere near the line of scrimmage. He had 3-4 tacklers meeting him probably 2 yards from where he needed to be to gain a first down.

We had no chance on that play, whatsoever.... regardless of what RB. If anyone has any doubts, go back and watch it again.

Gaffney seemed to just let his man through. Maybe he was supposed to, or maybe a mental error.

Taco John
12-16-2009, 11:55 AM
If he didnt blow his assignment and got hung up on Hoch's leg in teh backfield what makes you think that he could have got the first down in that situation anyway?

Its like you idiots dont watch the game. Every single short yardage situation there was no hope of it going anywhere NO MATTER WHO WAS RUNNING THE BALL.


I don't know if he could have in that situation. I'm talking about averages and probabilities. I think Hillis improves our odds on any given third down or goal line drive due to the match-up problems that he creates by being a 250lb. back who can run it inside, outside, or receive the ball.

Mr.Meanie
12-16-2009, 11:55 AM
This is... I mean... you're joking right?

I couldn't make out your sarcasm font, I guess.

Marshall is also a Shanny guy. So is Clady. They seem fine.

Of course...I thought that was obvious. My bad.

Got my first neg rep on that too Ha!

ColoradoDarin
12-16-2009, 12:00 PM
Yea, they were re-running the game on NFLN last night, late... and I couldn't avert my eyes long enough to miss that play.

Basically, there were two DBs in the backfield that could have almost taken the handoff from Orton. Moreno never got anywhere near the line of scrimmage. He had 3-4 tacklers meeting him probably 2 yards from where he needed to be to gain a first down.

We had no chance on that play, whatsoever.... regardless of what RB. If anyone has any doubts, go back and watch it again.

Gaffney seemed to just let his man through. Maybe he was supposed to, or maybe a mental error.

Gaffney saw it and tried to point it out to Orton, but since the defender can move before the snap, he moved inside. Gaffney had no shot of blocking him whatsoever, the best he could have done was just grab him from behind, take the 10 yards and hope we come up with a big play next down (Indy would have declined though).

Popps
12-16-2009, 12:08 PM
Gaffney saw it and tried to point it out to Orton, but since the defender can move before the snap, he moved inside. Gaffney had no shot of blocking him whatsoever, the best he could have done was just grab him from behind, take the 10 yards and hope we come up with a big play next down (Indy would have declined though).

Got it. Didn't notice that, but then again... I couldn't stand to watch it again.

HEAV
12-16-2009, 12:27 PM
The short-yardage struggles had nothing to do with the runners and everything to do with the offensive line.

Irish Stout
12-16-2009, 12:36 PM
The article and the comments afterwards along with some of the comments here blow my mind. We have people calling McD arrogant and stubborn... which is nothing new, but that died down a lot after the NE win. The same people who are pounding on McD now seem to be the same people who were pounding on him during the preseason... they see their opportunity to question and attack his decisions... even though he has gotten us as many wins as we had last season and most people thought he would get 3-5 this season.

McD clearly knows what he is doing and he clearly knows more than the jokesters and the pundits who want to question him and his motives. I personally would love to see Hillis toting the rock a little more because he seems to have an amazing ability to move through and with defenders. However, I am not going to attack McD for not playing him cause he clearly knows more about football than me and I am sure he knows way more than Krieger. Hey Krieger, what was your early season prediction for the Broncos? bet he didn't have them winning 8 games.

missingnumber7
12-16-2009, 01:56 PM
The short-yardage struggles had nothing to do with the runners and everything to do with the offensive line.

So you are saying you would line up in a single back formation in 4th and short and run the ball and not sneak it, not motion a WR or TE into the hole you want to run to give a little extra space, not audible out of the play?

The MVPlaya
12-16-2009, 02:12 PM
You guys do realize there was also a reason he wasn't used in college much either, right?

bronco militia
12-16-2009, 02:15 PM
You guys do realize there was also a reason he wasn't used in college much either, right?

Felix Jones and Darren McFadden>

Beantown Bronco
12-16-2009, 02:18 PM
You guys do realize there was also a reason he wasn't used in college much either, right?

McDaniels probably knew his coach and told him to bench him....

tsiguy96
12-16-2009, 02:29 PM
You guys do realize there was also a reason he wasn't used in college much either, right?

did you watch him play last year? did you see what he can do on an NFL field against starters when he is given the ball? now knowing that, what real reason is he not out there this year? we dont know and thats the confusion here, its fear that mcd may be too stuck on using his rookie as opposed to using what works.

Rabb
12-16-2009, 02:31 PM
did you watch him play last year? did you see what he can do on an NFL field against starters when he is given the ball? now knowing that, what real reason is he not out there this year? we dont know and thats the confusion here, its fear that mcd may be too stuck on using his rookie as opposed to using what works.

or maybe McD sees him more in practice and all of the other times and thinks he is not the right fit for some reason

we could go on all day and believe me, I was screaming for Hillis in the last game but there is some reason none of us know about, and there is a reason none of us make these decisions

we all questioned the Cutler thing and it is pretty clear why McD didn't want him also, just have some faith in the coach

The MVPlaya
12-16-2009, 02:33 PM
Felix Jones and Darren McFadden>

But I thought Hillis is a BEAST in short yardage situations? I mean ****, McFadden gets less than 10 carries a game now, Felix Jones doesn't start, ...but Hillis he's a damn pro bowler.

rastaman
12-16-2009, 02:35 PM
mcdaniels was forced to keep hillis in at FB after Larson was injured on he first play of the game.

Why didn't McD script some passing plays for his FB? McD already admitted that his FB by the name of Hillis had exceptional receiving skills! What was McD's excuse then!:sunshine:

The MVPlaya
12-16-2009, 02:37 PM
did you watch him play last year? did you see what he can do on an NFL field against starters when he is given the ball? now knowing that, what real reason is he not out there this year? we dont know and thats the confusion here, its fear that mcd may be too stuck on using his rookie as opposed to using what works.

It's real funny how you think we fans who only get to see players a 16 times a year think we have the right to hold judgement on a certain player.

With Hillis' situation it is less than 16 games...much less.

Hillis was bitter that he didn't get the ball much in college. He was so happy he was able to get carries after all the Denver RB's went down.

Yeah he is too "stuck" on using his rookie.
Hilarious!

rastaman
12-16-2009, 02:41 PM
yea...it will be pretty much a moot point this week....he's going to see some time with Buckhalter banged up and Moreno being a rookie and needign to regain his legs

if Hillis breaks 100 yards this board might explode

All Hillis needs to do is avg 5 plus yards a carry, run with power, catch a few short passes and turn them into nice gains, convert 3rd downs, and should he score TD(s).....BRING BACK THE MILE HIGH SALUTE (if McD doesn't mind)!

bowtown
12-16-2009, 02:43 PM
Why does everyone assume this is all McDaniels doing? Maybe Bobby Turner, the man who teaches these guys every day, is advising him that his best option is Moreno in the short yardage situations. Would like to know Turner's feelings on the whole thing.

Of course now Rasta will come in here and write me a one act play:

"Every night Bobby Turner drives home down his long oak-lined streets and wonders 'why doesn't coach listen to me more often? I've been telling him since day one that Hillis is the greatest running back to ever live, but he just never listens to me.' Then Bobby goes home and kisses his wife hello and they have a long dinner and afterwards they pull out the photo album and talk about how great life used to be with Shanahan, and Bobby says 'remember when I used to be allowed to really teach these guys? This McDainels kid has such an ego that he hampers my ability to develop the what is possibly the greatest white football player to ever live.' Then Bobby and his wife go down into their basement and climb into their hyperbolic chambers so that their alien skin won't peel off in earth's dry colorado atmosphere, and Bobby thinks to himself as he slowly drifts off into darkness, 'maybe someday Peyton Hillis will be president.'" TRUE history, people.

rastaman
12-16-2009, 02:44 PM
But I thought Hillis is a BEAST in short yardage situations? I mean ****, McFadden gets less than 10 carries a game now, Felix Jones doesn't start, ...but Hillis he's a damn pro bowler.

Hillis doesn't need to start! He just needs to have plays scripted for him with the first team offense. All Hillis wants is 10-15 carries and have 5-7 passes thrown his way.....and let the chips fall where they may. Hillis doesn't ask for much----he just wants to help the team win! He's the ultimate team player.:sunshine:

Archer81
12-16-2009, 02:50 PM
Hillis doesn't need to start! He just needs to have plays scripted for him with the first team offense. All Hillis wants is 10-15 carries and have 5-7 passes thrown his way.....and let the chips fall where they may. Hillis doesn't ask for much----he just wants to help the team win! He's the ultimate team player.:sunshine:


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:Broncos:

rastaman
12-16-2009, 02:50 PM
He did get a carry, 2 yards. Oh, and blew his blocking assignment on one of the short attempts. but at least you know what you're talking about:welcome:

At least Hillis doesn't have 5 fumbles like Moreno already has. At least Hillis hasn't missed the same number of blocking assignments that Moreno has already had. And YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!;D

oubronco
12-16-2009, 02:53 PM
It is cute to see these writers who claimed McDaniels would be a failure at every turn in the off-season, now grasping for statements like... "he'd rather prove a point than gain a first down."

Obviously, they have to try to sell bird-cage-liners, but can't any of these hacks put a decent story together?

Hell a blind person could see running it right into the middle of the line wasn't working so why do it relentlessly over and over........Was he trying to prove a point?

rastaman
12-16-2009, 02:54 PM
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:Broncos:

Whats wrong are you SPEECHLESS!:thumbs:

HILife
12-16-2009, 02:55 PM
It's obvious McD hates Shanny guys. Think about it... Royal, Hillis, Scheffler?? They were all Shanny guys and McD is trying to ruin their careers just to prove a point.

Marshall? Clady? DJ? Champ? Harris, Kuper, Weigman, Peterson, Doom, Graham? Did I miss someone?

bowtown
12-16-2009, 02:57 PM
Marshall? Clady? DJ? Champ? Harris, Kuper, Weigman, Peterson, Doom, Graham? Did I miss someone?

Does Vernon Fox count, or is he considered a McD guy because he cut him after Shanahan and then resigned him?





PS. I think he was being sarcastic.

rastaman
12-16-2009, 02:57 PM
It's real funny how you think we fans who only get to see players a 16 times a year think we have the right to hold judgement on a certain player.

With Hillis' situation it is less than 16 games...much less.

Hillis was bitter that he didn't get the ball much in college. He was so happy he was able to get carries after all the Denver RB's went down.

Yeah he is too "stuck" on using his rookie.
Hilarious!

So you just blindly trust everything that comes out of McD's mouth! Good For Ya!

Just don't expect everyone to believe the spin coming out of McD's mouth!:~ohyah!:

Archer81
12-16-2009, 02:57 PM
Whats wrong are you SPEECHLESS!:thumbs:


http://tinyurl.com/fhl56



:Broncos:

bowtown
12-16-2009, 02:58 PM
So you just blindly trust everything that comes out of McD's mouth! Good For Ya!

Just don't expect everyone to believe the spin coming out of McD's mouth!:~ohyah!:

Well I trust it over the spin that come out of yours.

rastaman
12-16-2009, 03:00 PM
http://tinyurl.com/fhl56



:Broncos:

Glad to see you're finally coming around about McDaniel's. Keep posting and thinking in Pictures....Dumb Billy.8')

Tombstone RJ
12-16-2009, 03:07 PM
Hillis doesn't need to start! He just needs to have plays scripted for him with the first team offense. All Hillis wants is 10-15 carries and have 5-7 passes thrown his way.....and let the chips fall where they may. Hillis doesn't ask for much----he just wants to help the team win! He's the ultimate team player.:sunshine:

I like the world you live in. It's nice. The World of Make Believe can be fun for everyone, but it's especially nice for you.

I often dream that I'm a surrounded by nekid women, all wanting to explore their natural sexuality with me. It's fantastic. Oh to dream...

^5

Archer81
12-16-2009, 03:09 PM
Glad to see you're finally coming around about McDaniel's. Keep posting and thinking in Pictures....Dumb Billy.8')


http://tinyurl.com/ygut78n



:Broncos:

rastaman
12-16-2009, 03:23 PM
I like the world you live in. It's nice. The World of Make Believe can be fun for everyone, but it's especially nice for you.

I like how you drink the McDaniel's "Kool-Aide". "In McD You Trust"

I often dream that I'm a surrounded by nekid women, all wanting to explore their natural sexuality with me. It's fantastic. Oh to dream...

Are sure those dreams aren't about "nekid" Men! Shhhhhhhh....don't bother trying to explain! Stay in the closet and help hummanity.



Have a Nice Day!!!:

s0phr0syne
12-16-2009, 03:26 PM
I'm a big Hillis advocate, but I don't want to say I'm on the same side of the fence as rasta b/c this dude is just obnoxious. I guess he feels like he was driven to this by whoever he (thinks he) is arguing with, but it's sad that the "Feed teh Hillis" campaign main representative on this board is such a poor example.

rastaman
12-16-2009, 03:27 PM
http://tinyurl.com/ygut78n



:Broncos:

Aren't you being a little harsh towards McD? You want to run him out of town already!

McD has 6 years to return us back to the SB.....don't you want to give him a chance?

Besides for someone who's only 28 years old you have so much anger! Instead of posting in pictures, why don't you try getting laid...."It does a body good"

Take Care!:sunshine:

barryr
12-16-2009, 03:29 PM
The amount of attention Hillis gets is ridiculous. If McDaniels really didn't like the guy, he would have been cut long ago. Reality and sense escapes some people.

jhns
12-16-2009, 03:29 PM
Marshall? Clady? DJ? Champ? Harris, Kuper, Weigman, Peterson, Doom, Graham? Did I miss someone?

Mario Haggan, although Shanny didn't give him much love other than signing him.

rastaman
12-16-2009, 03:30 PM
I'm a big Hillis advocate, but I don't want to say I'm on the same side of the fence as rasta b/c this dude is just obnoxious. I guess he feels like he was driven to this by whoever he (thinks he) is arguing with, but it's sad that the "Feed teh Hillis" campaign main representative on this board is such a poor example.

Man you couldn't be more bias or off base with your assessments and opinions...but hey believe what you will and welcome reading your opinions.

Dedhed
12-16-2009, 05:16 PM
At least Hillis doesn't have 5 fumbles like Moreno already has. At least Hillis hasn't missed the same number of blocking assignments that Moreno has already had. And YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!;D
Hillis has 1 fumble in 14 touches this year. Moreno has 4 fumbles in 224 touches. Do the math.

Are you really trying to argue that a player that hasn't played all year is better because he hasn't missed blocking assignments? Can you be that dumb? That's like saying Ryan Leaf is better than Manning because he's thrown fewer INTs in the NFL.

Not to mention that Hillis ratio of blown assignments hovers around 50%. You should try watching the games some time, it helps in these discussions.

It hurts my brain just thinking about how numb you are.

Dedhed
12-16-2009, 05:17 PM
Mario Haggan, although Shanny didn't give him much love other than signing him.Prater.

SJ Bronco
12-16-2009, 05:46 PM
Hey TJ? Can the server handle 2 seperate 100 page threads about the 3rd string RB?

theAPAOps5
12-16-2009, 05:53 PM
http://www.denverpost.com/krieger

My favorite line in the article is when Krieger said, "McDaniels would rather make a point than a first down."

Well that point seems to have hit home because most "experts" had this team winning only 3 games. But where are they now? Oh thats right, on the verge of clinching a playoff spot, having given the best team in football a run for their money, and showing signs of fight rather than collapse.

So yeah keep making that point McD its working.

Dedhed
12-16-2009, 08:05 PM
Clinging to Krieger for support is like clinging to an anchor in the hope it will give you oxygen.

mhgaffney
12-16-2009, 08:07 PM
It isn't only that Hillis is not being used.

Moreno has great hands -- and is a weapon as a receiver. The goal ought to be to get him the ball in space --- yet how many times has Orton thrown to Moreno in play action?

Hardly at all.

Denver's offensive problems are not limited to the line.

ZONA
12-16-2009, 08:18 PM
He did get a carry, 2 yards. Oh, and blew his blocking assignment on one of the short attempts. but at least you know what you're talking about:welcome:

Yeah, like Moreno didn't miss a block himself. He only failed to pick up the blitzing LB who sacked Orton while he looked in another direction and didn't do jack. And then when Orton was on the ground he turned and shook his head. So STFU. Everybody is going to miss a play or 2 and if Hillis missed 1 frickin block then so be it. Frickin chill out.

theAPAOps5
12-16-2009, 08:20 PM
Yeah, like Moreno didn't miss a block himself, which resulted in Orton getting sacked. So STFU.

Thats a great point, Moreno totally blew an assignment and it killed Denver. Difference between Moreno doing it and Hillis is one is a rookie and one played a lot last year and shouldn't make the same mistake.

ZONA
12-16-2009, 08:30 PM
Thats a great point, Moreno totally blew an assignment and it killed Denver. Difference between Moreno doing it and Hillis is one is a rookie and one played a lot last year and shouldn't make the same mistake.

For real? The dude didn't play alot last year. He had 63 carries. He was buried on the bench at the start of the season as an unknown and then when he finally got his chance, he shined for 3 games and then out for the year. That's hardly playing alot, just saying.

Dedhed
12-16-2009, 08:45 PM
Yeah, like Moreno didn't miss a block himself. He only failed to pick up the blitzing LB who sacked Orton while he looked in another direction and didn't do jack. And then when Orton was on the ground he turned and shook his head. So STFU. Everybody is going to miss a play or 2 and if Hillis missed 1 frickin block then so be it. Frickin chill out.

Yup missed a block. Everyone is going to miss on a play or two. Only problem is that Hillis's miss or two amounts to about 85% of the plays he's on the field. For Moreno it's about 2%.

SJ Bronco
12-16-2009, 09:41 PM
I love that i got negative reped for pointing out that we have 2 (now 3) ongoing threads about our third string RB. Some of you people are seriously funny! !Booya!;D:rofl:

Popps
12-16-2009, 09:43 PM
I love that i got negative reped for pointing out that we have 2 (now 3) ongoing threads about our third string RB. Some of you people are seriously funny! !Booya!;D:rofl:

I'm thinking of starting another, just so you know. :)

Only problem is, I don't want to dilute our 1500 post gem we have going.

tsiguy96
12-16-2009, 09:45 PM
im really getting tired of this topic. i like hillis as much as anyone on this forum, his attitude of blowing people up whenever he touchesthe ball is amazing, his blocking ability is below par, maybe because he doenst want to be a blocker full time, and i wouldnt blame him. either way, discussing it through the roof is going to be as productive as the discussions on how much mcdaniels destroyed this franchise in hte offseason, they will amount to nothing.

SJ Bronco
12-16-2009, 09:48 PM
im really getting tired of this topic. i like hillis as much as anyone on this forum, his attitude of blowing people up whenever he touchesthe ball is amazing, his blocking ability is below par, maybe because he doenst want to be a blocker full time, and i wouldnt blame him. either way, discussing it through the roof is going to be as productive as the discussions on how much mcdaniels destroyed this franchise in hte offseason, they will amount to nothing.

I agree. We found some common ground there....yet we both keep getting drawn back in don't we...;D

SJ Bronco
12-16-2009, 09:50 PM
I'm thinking of starting another, just so you know. :)

Only problem is, I don't want to dilute our 1500 post gem we have going.

The thing I find hilarious is that I have so many posts on here that they could negative rep, but they chose the one that was completely neutral to the debate. I called him the "3rd sting RB" and that got them steamed.Hilarious! Truth hurts don't it?

Archer81
12-16-2009, 09:52 PM
http://tinyurl.com/pokmqy


:Broncos:

theAPAOps5
12-16-2009, 09:55 PM
For real? The dude didn't play alot last year. He had 63 carries. He was buried on the bench at the start of the season as an unknown and then when he finally got his chance, he shined for 3 games and then out for the year. That's hardly playing alot, just saying.

Thanks for making my point. People are screaming for a guy who could barely make the field last year until injuries hit. So if the guy is so good why can't he make the field.

Truth is, he really isn't that good.

Broncos_OTM
12-16-2009, 10:57 PM
It's obvious McD hates Shanny guys. Think about it... Royal, Hillis, Scheffler?? They were all Shanny guys and McD is trying to ruin their careers just to prove a point.

Marshall and Dumervil were shanny guys to. Dude fail at its best.

Br0nc0Buster
12-16-2009, 11:02 PM
Marshall and Dumervil were shanny guys to. Dude fail at its best.

Im pretty sure Mr Meanie was being sarcastic

strafen
12-16-2009, 11:06 PM
It's obvious McD hates Shanny guys. Think about it... Royal, Hillis, Scheffler?? They were all Shanny guys and McD is trying to ruin their careers just to prove a point.

That's where the whole misconception is.
Why don't look at what makes more sense.
I'm not buying the Hillis is not playing because he's a shanny's guy crap.

Moreno was a pick Denver didn't have to make with our 1st pick in the draft given the dismal defense we had and that was an area we needed help at.

Mcdaniels received a lot of criticism for making that pick.
McDaniles is now committed to make Moreno his guy win or fail.

strafen
12-16-2009, 11:07 PM
Royal is interchangable with Gaffney and Gaff is the coaches guy.


I don't agree that Hillis is being overlooked. If you read that article there are some real inconsistencies in what McD says about him. He may be giving straight answers in his mind, but it flat out appears like he is dodging a question on a regular basis, and that question is always about Hillis.I couldn't have said it better myself.
He knows he's not making any sense to anybody by not playing Hillis, and he knows it.
Good post!

Br0nc0Buster
12-16-2009, 11:09 PM
That's where the whole misconception is.
Why don't look at what makes more sense.
I'm not buying the Hillis is not playing because he's a shanny's guy crap.

Moreno was a pick Denver didn't have to make with our 1st pick in the draft given the dismal defense we had and that was an area we needed help at.

Mcdaniels received a lot of criticism for making that pick.
McDaniles is now committed to make Moreno his guy win or fail.

this doesnt make sense
He also picked Robert Ayers and Alphonso Smith, and was quite criticized for the latter

The very fact that Mario Haggan starts and Alphonso is the dime cb is proof that McD doesnt elevate "his players" above everyone else

theAPAOps5
12-16-2009, 11:09 PM
I couldn't have said it better myself.
He knows he's not making any sense to anybody by not playing Hillis, and he knows it.
Good post!


makes sense to those not upset about his hiring. Look at his record this year. Makes plenty of sense to me.

strafen
12-16-2009, 11:14 PM
makes sense to those not upset about his hiring. Look at his record this year. Makes plenty of sense to me.McDaniels proved to be the right choice.
But the guy doesn't come without flaws.
He's 33 years old and first time headcoach in the NFL.
He has some ego issues and stuborness to go with that.
He's been lucky to have things go his way so far.
By the grace of Cleveland, the Raiders and KC plus a lucky miracle play in Cincy, we're sporting an 8-5 record.
It could be worse, but it's not. That's all it matters.
Just saying...

Popps
12-16-2009, 11:35 PM
Mcdaniels received a lot of criticism for making that pick.
McDaniles is now committed to make Moreno his guy win or fail.

Absolutely incorrect.

From the VERY FIRST draft analysis I clicked on...

Picking 12th in the first round they Broncos made a very astute move by drafting Georgia RB Knowshon Moreno. Moreno was the second highest rated back in this draft, and the very best way to protect a shaky QB is to provide him with a strong running game. Rookie running backs generally have the easiest time transferring from College to the NFL game. With that in mind we must rate this pick an A.

http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-19045-NFL-Draft-Examiner~y2009m9d1-2009-Denver-Broncos-Draft-Analysis


Most draft reviews I read saw Moreno is a safe pick, considering we were able to take a defensive front 7 player a few picks later. He was easily considered the best back in the draft.

If you want to know where he took the MOST criticism, it was Alphonso Smith. He was railed for that trade, and it continues to be a topic of conversation.

Even poll this forum, and I guarantee you the majority will call the Smith pick more questionable. (Though I didn't mind it.)


So, with that in mind... McDaniels has had NO problem making his most scrutinized pick inactive.

We're talking about the same coach who looked the collective NFL in the face and said "I'm trading Jay Cutler and I don't care what you think about it."


Now, you're telling me that suddenly this coach became frightened over a 4th string running back? A back-up fullback?

Big, gaping, massive holes in your logic there, sport. As I've said... you have a mountain of evidence to show that McDaniels is NOT REMOTELY afraid to go against the grain, against the media and against his own picks.

Your conspiracy theory holds no water, because it falls in the face of a host of evidence.


Sorry.

Borks147
12-17-2009, 12:16 AM
i heart you

Absolutely incorrect.

From the VERY FIRST draft analysis I clicked on...

Picking 12th in the first round they Broncos made a very astute move by drafting Georgia RB Knowshon Moreno. Moreno was the second highest rated back in this draft, and the very best way to protect a shaky QB is to provide him with a strong running game. Rookie running backs generally have the easiest time transferring from College to the NFL game. With that in mind we must rate this pick an A.

http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-19045-NFL-Draft-Examiner~y2009m9d1-2009-Denver-Broncos-Draft-Analysis


Most draft reviews I read saw Moreno is a safe pick, considering we were able to take a defensive front 7 player a few picks later. He was easily considered the best back in the draft.

If you want to know where he took the MOST criticism, it was Alphonso Smith. He was railed for that trade, and it continues to be a topic of conversation.

Even poll this forum, and I guarantee you the majority will call the Smith pick more questionable. (Though I didn't mind it.)


So, with that in mind... McDaniels has had NO problem making his most scrutinized pick inactive.

We're talking about the same coach who looked the collective NFL in the face and said "I'm trading Jay Cutler and I don't care what you think about it."


Now, you're telling me that suddenly this coach became frightened over a 4th string running back? A back-up fullback?

Big, gaping, massive holes in your logic there, sport. As I've said... you have a mountain of evidence to show that McDaniels is NOT REMOTELY afraid to go against the grain, against the media and against his own picks.

Your conspiracy theory holds no water, because it falls in the face of a host of evidence.


Sorry.

Mr.Meanie
12-17-2009, 09:40 AM
Why does everyone assume this is all McDaniels doing? Maybe Bobby Turner, the man who teaches these guys every day, is advising him that his best option is Moreno in the short yardage situations. Would like to know Turner's feelings on the whole thing.

Of course now Rasta will come in here and write me a one act play:

"Every night Bobby Turner drives home down his long oak-lined streets and wonders 'why doesn't coach listen to me more often? I've been telling him since day one that Hillis is the greatest running back to ever live, but he just never listens to me.' Then Bobby goes home and kisses his wife hello and they have a long dinner and afterwards they pull out the photo album and talk about how great life used to be with Shanahan, and Bobby says 'remember when I used to be allowed to really teach these guys? This McDainels kid has such an ego that he hampers my ability to develop the what is possibly the greatest white football player to ever live.' Then Bobby and his wife go down into their basement and climb into their hyperbolic chambers so that their alien skin won't peel off in earth's dry colorado atmosphere, and Bobby thinks to himself as he slowly drifts off into darkness, 'maybe someday Peyton Hillis will be president.'" TRUE history, people.

:rofl:

Kaylore
12-17-2009, 04:30 PM
Why does everyone assume this is all McDaniels doing? Maybe Bobby Turner, the man who teaches these guys every day, is advising him that his best option is Moreno in the short yardage situations. Would like to know Turner's feelings on the whole thing.

Of course now Rasta will come in here and write me a one act play:

"Every night Bobby Turner drives home down his long oak-lined streets and wonders 'why doesn't coach listen to me more often? I've been telling him since day one that Hillis is the greatest running back to ever live, but he just never listens to me.' Then Bobby goes home and kisses his wife hello and they have a long dinner and afterwards they pull out the photo album and talk about how great life used to be with Shanahan, and Bobby says 'remember when I used to be allowed to really teach these guys? This McDainels kid has such an ego that he hampers my ability to develop the what is possibly the greatest white football player to ever live.' Then Bobby and his wife go down into their basement and climb into their hyperbolic chambers so that their alien skin won't peel off in earth's dry colorado atmosphere, and Bobby thinks to himself as he slowly drifts off into darkness, 'maybe someday Peyton Hillis will be president.'" TRUE history, people.

:rofl:

Bronco Yoda
12-17-2009, 05:06 PM
Since I posted this article first over on Popps Hillis thread... I claim this thread should be merged. We're working on 2k over there.

houghtam
12-17-2009, 05:58 PM
Even Kuper getting blown up right now and has taken a step back this yr. I don't see him blowing his guy off the line. Wiegman and the Hochstien/Hamitlon combo get dominated every short yardage play.

QFT. Just out of curiosity, I wonder what Kupesdad's take is thus far on the play of the Oline?

rastaman
12-17-2009, 06:27 PM
makes sense to those not upset about his hiring. Look at his record this year. Makes plenty of sense to me.

McD could be the second coming of Jon Gruden. Nothing spectacular we could get to at least one SB with him before his coaching style gets stale and players start to tune him out. Or he could become another Mangini. Who the hell knows.

uplink
12-17-2009, 11:58 PM
one thing about Hillis is that when he plays and runs over somebody the team responds with greater intensity and confidence. I noticed this last year when he played. Something McD should consider but probably doesn't
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uplink
12-18-2009, 12:09 AM
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Archer81
12-18-2009, 12:12 AM
one thing about Hillis is that when he plays and runs over somebody the team responds with greater intensity and confidence. I noticed this last year when he played. Something McD should consider but probably doesn't
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Joy.

Another idiotic take on this board's favorite 3rd string HB and 2nd string FB.

:Broncos:

broncocalijohn
12-18-2009, 12:45 AM
Joy.

Another idiotic take on this board's favorite 3rd string HB and 2nd string FB.

:Broncos:

wally, i think you are a little hard on the beaver.

Bronco Yoda
12-19-2009, 06:08 PM
QFT. Just out of curiosity, I wonder what Kupesdad's take is thus far on the play of the Oline?

I'd like to hear that too. And how they're taking the scheme change.

rastaman
12-19-2009, 06:22 PM
Joy.

Another idiotic take on this board's favorite 3rd string HB and 2nd string FB.

:Broncos:

Hillis is now 2nd on the depth chart behind Moreno. Peyton has taken C-Bucks place b/c of all his injuries! In fact if C-Buck was on crutches all this week....Hillis should have been given his carries/reps.

Archer81
12-19-2009, 06:34 PM
Hillis is now 2nd on the depth chart behind Moreno. Peyton has taken C-Bucks place b/c of all his injuries! In fact if C-Buck was on crutches all this week....Hillis should have been given his carries/reps.


Oh.

So he gets an opportunity to play because someone else got hurt. Thats not new or typical at all.


:Broncos:

rastaman
12-19-2009, 06:38 PM
Oh.

So he gets an opportunity to play because someone else got hurt. Thats not new or typical at all.


:Broncos:

I agree. However, you do realize injuries are part of the game and that's why you have a depth CHART with reserve players....correct.

Maybe you can take Hillis's place as 4th on the depth chart. You're only 28 years old....and should be ready to go!:sunshine:

uplink
12-19-2009, 07:12 PM
could shorten the thread title since 'article on Hillis' and 'good article' are redundant
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