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View Full Version : bellichecks house of cards falling over???


tsiguy96
12-10-2009, 04:17 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/10/more-wisdom-from-adalius/
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/10/seymour-ex-teammates-say-we-could-use-you/

i think hes getting too confident in his coaching and too authoritative now it seems...wonder if it continues

gyldenlove
12-10-2009, 04:19 PM
I think this is more Adalius Thomas being Adalius Thomas, this isn't the first time he has had a problem up there.

Archer81
12-10-2009, 04:19 PM
It happens to every dynastic type franchise. You cant stay on top forever.


:Broncos:

tsiguy96
12-10-2009, 04:20 PM
It happens to every dynastic type franchise. You cant stay on top forever.


:Broncos:

i think it might be nearing, they have a lot of young talent however and if they can harness it theyll be good for the future, but you cant keep giving/trading away talent like vrabel and seymour and expecting to be great still.

Archer81
12-10-2009, 04:25 PM
i think it might be nearing, they have a lot of young talent however and if they can harness it theyll be good for the future, but you cant keep giving/trading away talent like vrabel and seymour and expecting to be great still.


This I agree with. Belitits is a pretty arrogant guy, and he has been fortunate alot of his moves worked out and turned into title-caliber rosters; but he had pretty excellent coaching to go with that roster.


:Broncos:

gyldenlove
12-10-2009, 04:26 PM
i think it might be nearing, they have a lot of young talent however and if they can harness it theyll be good for the future, but you cant keep giving/trading away talent like vrabel and seymour and expecting to be great still.

Getting rid of Vrabel was the right thing talentwise, Vrabel is largely over the hill, however they have lost a lot of veteran leadership in that lockerroom and I think that is showing.

Trading Seymour may have been the right move from a salary cap point of view, but I think it was a poor football decision.

Soul-Bronco
12-10-2009, 04:29 PM
Getting rid of Vrabel was the right thing talentwise, Vrabel is largely over the hill, however they have lost a lot of veteran leadership in that lockerroom and I think that is showing.

Trading Seymour may have been the right move from a salary cap point of view, but I think it was a poor football decision.

not when you have oaklands 1st round pick. NE is quietly in a rebuilding phase defensively

worm
12-10-2009, 04:29 PM
but you cant keep giving/trading away talent like vrabel and seymour and expecting to be great still.

You can if you draft well. The Patriots have 4 picks in the top 60 this next years deep draft...plus two #1s the following year.

Hardly 'giving away talent'.

Archer81
12-10-2009, 04:34 PM
You can if you draft well. The Patriots have 4 picks in the top 60 this next years deep draft...plus two #1s the following year.

Hardly 'giving away talent'.


Its giving away proven talent that has produced for you in return for the right to select a player who MIGHT produce for you. I dont think the Pats are going to sign 4 of the top 60 picks in this year's draft if they were concerned about paying a 3-4 DE who made plays for them.


:Broncos:

DarkHorse30
12-10-2009, 04:46 PM
what happened to the Patsies? McDaniels left......


Bwaha ha ha. Seriously though, the guy probably managed the egos in that locker room so Bill could concentrate on his newest cheating methods.....sorry, had to get that in

broncofan
12-10-2009, 05:03 PM
not when you have oaklands 1st round pick. NE is quietly in a rebuilding phase defensively

True.

They deal Seymour and get a 1st rounder (I'll go out on a limb and call it a top 5 overall pick). Previously having dealt Vrabel and Cassel (who is garbage) for a 2nd rounder (top 5 in the second round), while losing Harrison and Bruschi as well...all the while staying competitive at an elite level. With the rate of roster turnover these days, moves like that need to be done to shuffle salaries and stay under that cap...naturally, most teams dip down into the 4 to 7 win realm with that kind of star turnover on one side of the ball. Not these guys.

I agree 100% with sirhcyennek81 that draft picks are overvalued for the most part, but at some point you have to part ways with players and develop younger talent, even if you are taking a chance.

gyldenlove
12-10-2009, 05:28 PM
not when you have oaklands 1st round pick. NE is quietly in a rebuilding phase defensively

They need to replace an awful lot of players though, they need a DE, ILB, OLB, OT and they are weak at RB, they should probably start looking into what happens after Moss as well.

STBumpkin
12-10-2009, 05:57 PM
True.

They deal Seymour and get a 1st rounder (I'll go out on a limb and call it a top 5 overall pick). Previously having dealt Vrabel and Cassel (who is garbage) for a 2nd rounder (top 5 in the second round), while losing Harrison and Bruschi as well...all the while staying competitive at an elite level. With the rate of roster turnover these days, moves like that need to be done to shuffle salaries and stay under that cap...naturally, most teams dip down into the 4 to 7 win realm with that kind of star turnover on one side of the ball. Not these guys.

7-5 is not an elite level. They could still end up 7-9. The probably won't, but they probably won't be 11-5 either. 11-5 isn't elite even if they pull it off.

Patriots=Not Elite Anymore

Archer81
12-10-2009, 06:12 PM
7-5 is not an elite level. They could still end up 7-9. The probably won't, but they probably won't be 11-5 either. 11-5 isn't elite even if they pull it off.

Patriots=Not Elite Anymore


NE is 1-5 on the road...they wont win the top 2 seeds, they will have to go to either Indi, Cinci, SD or Denver (if they overtake SD...) if they get out of the first round of the playoffs.


:Broncos:

loborugger
12-10-2009, 06:32 PM
When I saw the Pats get manhandled by the Saints a few weeks back, I was definitely thinking that was the death knell of the Pats dynasty. Losing to the Giants in the SB was the first wound, and the Saints gave the death blow. I think they are done. Doesnt mean they wont have winning season or even put together a playoff win or two, but they are done.

DBroncos4life
12-10-2009, 07:00 PM
If the Pats want to move Adalius Thomas in the off-season I hope its to us. Nolan has coached him and he would be a upgrade at OLB.

tsiguy96
12-10-2009, 07:27 PM
If the Pats want to move Adalius Thomas in the off-season I hope its to us. Nolan has coached him and he would be a upgrade at OLB.

over who?

haggan is playing great football, elvis is elite and ayers is still growing...

ZONA
12-10-2009, 07:42 PM
over who?

haggan is playing great football, elvis is elite and ayers is still growing...

Yeah, I agree. I think the Broncos will be looking more at the 3 down linemen on defense rather then any of the 4 LB spots. They might draft an inside LB but Haggen and Davis are doing fine and I still think Larsen could pan out. Still, I would probably use a 5th rounder on ILB this year.

tsiguy96
12-10-2009, 07:45 PM
Yeah, I agree. I think the Broncos will be looking more at the 3 down linemen on defense rather then any of the 4 LB spots. They might draft an inside LB but Haggen and Davis are doing fine and I still think Larsen could pan out. Still, I would probably use a 5th rounder on ILB this year.

yep, our LB are set for the next year or two minimum, a dominant DL would be good, our secondary is also playing good, hill champ and goodman arent that old either.

Lev Vyvanse
12-10-2009, 07:55 PM
yep, our LB are set for the next year or two minimum, a dominant DL would be good, our secondary is also playing good, hill champ and goodman arent that old either.

Who do you want to replace on the line?

Archer81
12-10-2009, 08:02 PM
Who do you want to replace on the line?


Fields. More size in the middle would be a benefit. But Fields is a player, and would give us a more than decent rotation if Denver goes NT in the draft early.


:Broncos:

Lev Vyvanse
12-10-2009, 08:04 PM
Fields. More size in the middle would be a benefit. But Fields is a player, and would give us a more than decent rotation if Denver goes NT in the draft early.


:Broncos:

He is the best Dlineman we have right now.

broncosteven
12-10-2009, 08:07 PM
True.

They deal Seymour and get a 1st rounder (I'll go out on a limb and call it a top 5 overall pick). Previously having dealt Vrabel and Cassel (who is garbage) for a 2nd rounder (top 5 in the second round), while losing Harrison and Bruschi as well...all the while staying competitive at an elite level. With the rate of roster turnover these days, moves like that need to be done to shuffle salaries and stay under that cap...naturally, most teams dip down into the 4 to 7 win realm with that kind of star turnover on one side of the ball. Not these guys.

I agree 100% with sirhcyennek81 that draft picks are overvalued for the most part, but at some point you have to part ways with players and develop younger talent, even if you are taking a chance.

Isn't there a chance that next year will be uncapped?

Why send a big time DE, which are hard to come by, for a 1st round pick who you have to pay a lot of $ for anyway but you won't know what said 1st round pick can actually do?

In the past Belly has made personel moves that didn't bite him in the ass, laws of average are catching up IMO.

Archer81
12-10-2009, 08:08 PM
He is the best Dlineman we have right now.


All three (McBean, Fields and Peterson) have played beyond the garbage moniker given to them by ESPN, our run defense suffered with McBean out and fields and Peterson make plays. Should be interesting to see what we do in this year's draft to find some guys who can rotate with these three.


:Broncos:

Lev Vyvanse
12-10-2009, 08:09 PM
All three (McBean, Fields and Peterson) have played beyond the garbage moniker given to them by ESPN, our run defense suffered with McBean out and fields and Peterson make plays. Should be interesting to see what we do in this year's draft to find some guys who can rotate with these three.


:Broncos:

Yep, what we need is a backup NT.

ZONA
12-10-2009, 08:18 PM
Our 3 top Dlinemen have been solid but just that. It certainly would help out tremendously if there was a DOMINANT linemen in there. If you think Peterson, Fields and McBean are dominant then that's your opinion. I think if those were our backup players or even if 1 or 2 of them were our backup players and you had a few dominant guys in front of them, now you're talking a defensive line to be feared. A line that can absolutely hold their own against any offensive line out there. It won't happen all at once but this team really does need 1 dominant defensive lineman in there, hopefully at NT.

Lev Vyvanse
12-10-2009, 08:33 PM
Our 3 top Dlinemen have been solid but just that. It certainly would help out tremendously if there was a DOMINANT linemen in there. If you think Peterson, Fields and McBean are dominant then that's your opinion. I think if those were our backup players or even if 1 or 2 of them were our backup players and you had a few dominant guys in front of them, now you're talking a defensive line to be feared. A line that can absolutely hold their own against any offensive line out there. It won't happen all at once but this team really does need 1 dominant defensive lineman in there, hopefully at NT.

Its 5 vs 3 now you should get use to not having a DOMINANT dline it's not going to happen. I agree Peterson could be a backup, but Fields and McBean are playing about as good as it gets in the 3-4. In the best 3-4 defenses you never hear about the line because their job is to funnel the ball to the linebackers.
We have a very good NT.

DBroncos4life
12-10-2009, 09:02 PM
over who?

haggan is playing great football, elvis is elite and ayers is still growing...

lol over Haggan and Ayers. Thomas would bring more pass rushing to our team to go along with Elvis. Haggan might be playing solid but Thomas can do what Haggan does plus more.

broncosteven
12-10-2009, 09:07 PM
lol over Haggan and Ayers. Thomas would bring more pass rushing to our team to go along with Elvis. Haggan might be playing solid but Thomas can do what Haggan does plus more.

Ayers is not playing well at all. Haggan reminds me of Cadrez, a solid LB who won't be an elite LB but is where he is supposed to be and plays in the system.

DBroncos4life
12-10-2009, 09:14 PM
Ayers is not playing well at all. Haggan reminds me of Cadrez, a solid LB who won't be an elite LB but is where he is supposed to be and plays in the system.

I just don't understand how anyone wouldn't think Adalius Thomas isn't a upgrade over Haggan. Mike Nolan knows him very well (01-04) and Thomas is flat out a much better pass rusher then Haggan and Ayers.

Mr.Meanie
12-10-2009, 09:46 PM
not when you have oaklands 1st round pick. NE is quietly in a rebuilding phase defensively

It's a 2011 1st rounder...

uplink
12-10-2009, 11:27 PM
this i agree with. Beliboobies is a pretty arrogant guy, and he has been fortunate alot of his moves worked out
....25691

USAFBronco
12-11-2009, 04:46 AM
not when you have oaklands 1st round pick. NE is quietly in a rebuilding phase defensively


nothing quiet about it, their defensive suck is pretty loud.

bowtown
12-11-2009, 05:55 AM
not when you have oaklands 1st round pick. NE is quietly in a rebuilding phase defensively

Ummm... you mean Oakland's 2011 1st.

cmhargrove
12-11-2009, 06:39 AM
If the Pats want to move Adalius Thomas in the off-season I hope its to us. Nolan has coached him and he would be a upgrade at OLB.

Not at his price tag. We can do better. I love Thomas, but I think we can do just as well for much, much less.

NFLBRONCO
12-11-2009, 09:34 AM
When you win 3 sb's in short order like they did that is a tough bar to hold up. Imo why they have slipped is since no more rings have happened the intimidation of success they had is over. I think Brady isn't as good as he was in the 3 ring run. Losing McD having kids wife I think he lost his focus foir football only. They are old right now but, thanks to dips that give them high picks via trade could get them alot better real fast in the next 2yrs.

loborugger
12-11-2009, 09:53 AM
What hasnt been mentioned in this equation is that the AFC East is also improving. When NE was at its most dominate, some of its Div rivals were pretty piss poor. The Pats only had to worry about playing Indy, Pitt (and oddly enough, Denver) each year. Now that the Fins and Jets have reached respectability and play off contender level, the Pats have split the season with them.

Archer81
12-11-2009, 10:37 AM
When you win 3 sb's in short order like they did that is a tough bar to hold up. Imo why they have slipped is since no more rings have happened the intimidation of success they had is over. I think Brady isn't as good as he was in the 3 ring run. Losing McD having kids wife I think he lost his focus foir football only. They are old right now but, thanks to dips that give them high picks via trade could get them alot better real fast in the next 2yrs.


This sentence does not make sense. If you intimidate success, doesnt that make you the Oakland Raiders or the Cleveland Browns?

:Broncos:

Archer81
12-11-2009, 10:38 AM
....25691


Yeah? And where it Belitits looking? Not at the rack in front of him...


:Broncos:

rastaman
12-11-2009, 01:49 PM
It happens to every dynastic type franchise. You cant stay on top forever.


:Broncos:

Yep couldn't agree with you more. Bill Walsh said it best. HC's shouldn't stay with any team longer than 10 years. After that, your methods and leadership techniques become old with the players.

Rohirrim
12-11-2009, 02:14 PM
Thinking your schemes are more important than your talent?

They should call that "The Shanahan Syndrome." :rofl:

Circle Orange
12-11-2009, 06:19 PM
But...isn't Brady all that and a bag of chips? Can't he LIFT his teammates, no matter the talent level? And all the other cliches? :clown: ROFL!

On another hair note, that 'do Tom is sporting looks horrendous...like a twelve year old on crack. What on earth is wrong with Giselle, letting him go around like that? Ha!

BlaK-Argentina
12-11-2009, 06:39 PM
But...isn't Brady all that and a bag of chips? Can't he LIFT his teammates, no matter the talent level? And all the other cliches? :clown: ROFL!

On another hair note, that 'do Tom is sporting looks horrendous...like a twelve year old on crack. What on earth is wrong with Giselle, letting him go around like that? Ha!

Talking about Brady's hair should be on that pansy's list.

You = Pansy. ROFL!

Los Broncos
12-11-2009, 06:44 PM
i think it might be nearing, they have a lot of young talent however and if they can harness it theyll be good for the future, but you cant keep giving/trading away talent like vrabel and seymour and expecting to be great still.

And Samuel was a big loss, should of kept him around.

tsiguy96
12-11-2009, 06:45 PM
its funny the comparison between him and shanahan. started to think that the system was bigger than the players, led to downfall? well see if he continues or not.

broncosteven
12-11-2009, 07:51 PM
But...isn't Brady all that and a bag of chips? Can't he LIFT his teammates, no matter the talent level? And all the other cliches? :clown: ROFL!

On another hair note, that 'do Tom is sporting looks horrendous...like a twelve year old on crack. What on earth is wrong with Giselle, letting him go around like that? Ha!

She will dump him and shack up with Mark Schanze should he win a SB or two after Brady's career goes into the toilet.

ScottXray
12-12-2009, 12:25 AM
Yeah? And where it Beliboobies looking? Not at the rack in front of him...


:Broncos:
He's thinking ...."Fracking Tom is ogling my wifes tits AGAIN. If he wasn't
so damn good I'd trade his ass to Detroit!"

lazarus4444
12-12-2009, 10:25 AM
I don't think it is collapsing, i think they are reloading for the next decade.

Circle Orange
12-13-2009, 12:28 AM
Talking about Brady's hair should be on that pansy's list.

You = Pansy. ROFL!

Me = Good Taste! ;D
Brady = Not...

Although I must admit that "bowl" on his head is eyecatching, especially with the EIGHT INCH BANG. I think he's styling it with toe clippers...http://scosoft.com/s/k/5f9c66c6.gif


BellyChick = Massive Ego Trip