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View Full Version : What to do with Chicago's pick?


UboBronco
11-29-2009, 09:16 PM
Right now we would have I believe the 9th pick if the season ended today.

Do we take a QB? Trade down to 15-20 and get an extra high pick? Or just go for a D-lineman which I think we still need.

I know it is early, but the Bears have a game with the Packers and the Vikings, though both in Chicago, as well as games against St.Louis, and @Baltimore and @Detroit to end the season...

So I feel they will end up 6-10, 7-9 at the best, which would give us a top 12 pick. I bet Seattle is wishing they asked for the Bear pick now.

Just some more things to ponder.

SoCalBronco
11-29-2009, 09:18 PM
Locker.

Conklin
11-29-2009, 09:18 PM
Right now we would have I believe the 9th pick if the season ended today.

Do we take a QB? Trade down to 15-20 and get an extra high pick? Or just go for a D-lineman which I think we still need.

I know it is early, but the Bears have a game with the Packers and the Vikings, though both in Chicago, as well as games against St.Louis, and @Baltimore and @Detroit to end the season...

So I feel they will end up 6-10, 7-9 at the best, which would give us a top 12 pick. I bet Seattle is wishing they asked for the Bear pick now.

Just some more things to ponder.


is our season over yet?

UboBronco
11-29-2009, 09:20 PM
is our season over yet?

Ours is not over yet, though I believe the Bears have folded the blankets and gone into hibernation.

Finger Roll
11-29-2009, 09:29 PM
I would go QB because I don't think we can win anything with Orton.

RhymesayersDU
11-29-2009, 09:30 PM
I say RB or WR.


Tee hee!

Beantown Bronco
11-29-2009, 09:30 PM
I would go QB because I don't think we can win anything with Orton.

Can someone help me? I'm trying to figure out what the "7" in "7-4" stands for.....

NFLBRONCO
11-29-2009, 09:30 PM
QB NT is my top two choices. I'm not sure what McD will do at this point.

RhymesayersDU
11-29-2009, 09:32 PM
Can someone help me? I'm trying to figure out what the "7" in "7-4" stands for.....

Hey, we went 13-3 and drafted a QB once!

Finger Roll
11-29-2009, 09:33 PM
Can someone help me? I'm trying to figure out what the "7" in "7-4" stands for.....

I meant playoff games and division titles. 10-6 is the max for Orton

lex
11-29-2009, 09:35 PM
Some defense up the middle. Either Cody, McClain, or Spikes.

BroncoDoug
11-29-2009, 09:35 PM
DL....

Cody or Suh

Borks147
11-29-2009, 09:36 PM
trade down, get a 2nd tier DE and an OG

2KBack
11-29-2009, 09:37 PM
The middle of the defensive line and the offensive line

Lolad
11-29-2009, 09:38 PM
I say we take Lucker @ QB.. if not QB we need to go DT or DE or C if he's rated high enough to take in the 1st round.

Beantown Bronco
11-29-2009, 09:38 PM
I meant playoff games and division titles. 10-6 is the max for Orton

Why would you say that we are incapable of winning playoff games with Orton? Think about it. He's already beaten Cincy, New England, Dallas and San Diego. That's four teams that are currently leading their respective divisions and will make the playoffs barring anything crazy happening in the next month.

cutthemdown
11-29-2009, 09:39 PM
I never care what position they go for. IMO as long as your draft picks become good starting NFL players you can build a winner.

IMO Broncos don't have glaring holes. They just need more playmakers regardless of position.

If I had to say I would say

1-OG- Some interior beast who can dominate big player
2-RB- IMO we could still take one maybe 4th -6th round etc
3-DE-Mcbean and Peterson steady, but we could use a playmaker
4-DT- Fields needs help at NT
5-MLB/SSL maybe some youth to get ready, I doubt Haggan/Davis long term solution.

cutthemdown
11-29-2009, 09:41 PM
I would go QB because I don't think we can win anything with Orton.

IMO anytime the team has a chance to draft a QB they think is top line NFL talent you should do so. You can always develop more then one QB, then trade one etc. I don't anticipate Simms being back, but Brandstater prob will be. That mean either a VET bkup or a new rookie IMO will be obtained.

Popps
11-29-2009, 09:41 PM
OL, DL or ILB.

We need depth and future starters at all three places.

Mogulseeker
11-29-2009, 09:42 PM
Offensive guard. No question.

lex
11-29-2009, 09:44 PM
Offensive guard. No question.

I agree we need that but at 9?

Mogulseeker
11-29-2009, 09:45 PM
I agree we need that but at 9?

I haven't looked at the draft.... is there are top ten OG prospect?

You also have to look at BPA.

Killericon
11-29-2009, 09:45 PM
Defensive lineman.

Finger Roll
11-29-2009, 09:47 PM
i think the problem for this team is the offense. The defense looks great when the offense is not going three and out half the time

lex
11-29-2009, 09:47 PM
I haven't looked at the draft.... is there are top ten OG prospect?

You also have to look at BPA.

No and you rarely see OGs taken as high as the first. This year there is a guy out of Idaho is slotted to go in the first but in the late first. I dont agree with how guards are undervalued but at the same time its a shame to overpay or reach for one.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=86634

Finger Roll
11-29-2009, 09:47 PM
Offensive guard. No question.

in the second round yes

snowspot66
11-29-2009, 09:50 PM
If we go QB fine. But I'd like to see linemen and lots of them.

UberBroncoMan
11-29-2009, 09:57 PM
Kind of like what most everyone else is saying... DL, OL and maybe a MLB if we intend to get rid of Andra Davis (I don't see us letting go of Woodyard nor Larsen).

... I also could see us getting ANOTHER CB. We let go of JMFW for Law... I doubt Law is here next year.

I think McDaniels likes Orton and is happy with Brandstater. Perhaps another QB in the lower rounds though so we can get rid of Simms.

2KBack
11-29-2009, 09:58 PM
i think the problem for this team is the offense. The defense looks great when the offense is not going three and out half the time

That can be argued both ways, the fact remains the team isn't complete yet. The run defense can be taken advantage of, and often. Yes the D got worn down a couple games, but in those particular games they looked pretty bad in the first half as well. Personally I think the offense is steadily improving. McD has played it very conservative most of the season, beacuse he could. Unfortunately when he finally opened the offense up a little Orton went down, and Simms couldn't handle it.

The defense is still a lot of smoke and mirrors, especially in the middle. I really don't want to see Denver make the same mistake they did in 2006. Solidify this defense.

rastaman
11-29-2009, 10:01 PM
Right now we would have I believe the 9th pick if the season ended today.

Do we take a QB? Trade down to 15-20 and get an extra high pick? Or just go for a D-lineman which I think we still need.

I know it is early, but the Bears have a game with the Packers and the Vikings, though both in Chicago, as well as games against St.Louis, and @Baltimore and @Detroit to end the season...

So I feel they will end up 6-10, 7-9 at the best, which would give us a top 12 pick. I bet Seattle is wishing they asked for the Bear pick now.

Just some more things to ponder.

A QB that can make all the throws and hit the Receivers in STRIDE! Thats not too much to ask for.....Is it?:strong:

Hercules Rockefeller
11-29-2009, 10:03 PM
Suh, McCoy, Cody, or McClain

If not them, trade down 8-10 spots and try to pick up a couple extra mid-round picks and still go Front 7. Need more talent and depth there.

Don't see the QB thing happening, they won't be so quick to dump either Orton or Brandstater after only 1 year in the system.

lex
11-29-2009, 10:03 PM
A QB that can make all the throws and hit the Receivers in STRIDE! Thats not too much to ask for.....Is it?:strong:

Whats wrong with Brandstaters arm? He looked like he had some zip on the ball.

Garcia Bronco
11-29-2009, 10:03 PM
DL....

Cody or Suh

This

lostknight
11-29-2009, 10:13 PM
Right now we would have I believe the 9th pick if the season ended today.

Do we take a QB? Trade down to 15-20 and get an extra high pick? Or just go for a D-lineman which I think we still need.

I know it is early, but the Bears have a game with the Packers and the Vikings, though both in Chicago, as well as games against St.Louis, and @Baltimore and @Detroit to end the season...

So I feel they will end up 6-10, 7-9 at the best, which would give us a top 12 pick. I bet Seattle is wishing they asked for the Bear pick now.

Just some more things to ponder.

With this being the probable last year without a rookie pay scale system in effect, I think that trading picks this year for picks next year is a good idea.

s0phr0syne
11-29-2009, 10:14 PM
1st -- DL or WR/RB speedster or awesome DB (Berry?) or Trade back

2nd-- OG or DL or CB or QB

3rd-- ILB or DL or OG or CB

4th--etc.etc

Lev Vyvanse
11-29-2009, 10:16 PM
Punter.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-29-2009, 10:17 PM
With this being the probable last year without a rookie pay scale system in effect, I think that trading picks this year for picks next year is a good idea.

I don't know, if there's a mass exodus of draft eligible underclassmen, I'd rather have picks this year in a strong draft compared to a weaker draft in '11.

BroncoMan4ever
11-29-2009, 10:20 PM
Hey, we went 13-3 and drafted a QB once!

and history shows that was a great idea.

that was quite possibly the dumbest draft move in the franchise history.

let me elaborate on that. we were a 13-3 team a few defensive starters and an offensive playmaker away from being a super bowl team, only for Mike to blow up a 13-3 team in favor of a head case with a big arm.

i know the pick ended up netting us 2-1st rounders, a 3rd and Orton, but the cost we paid by taking Cutler with that pick was huge. blew up a legit super bowl contender of a team, and sunk the franchise into 3 consecutive years of mediocrity which has led to a rebuild.


Orton is a good QB and is getting better the longer he is in the system. QB is not an issue.

Depending on the Marshall situation WR is a possible need in the draft, depth along the line and replacements at the LG and C position are big needs, DL help is a major need, and if we are in a position to get Suh or Cody, that needs to be the pick, and if they are not available, we need to trade back, pick up additional 2nd and 3rd rounders

on a side note, if we do decide Orton is not the long term answer, Lefevour in the 2nd or 3rd would be a good pick.

Broncos_OTM
11-29-2009, 10:22 PM
No and you rarely see OGs taken as high as the first. This year there is a guy out of Idaho is slotted to go in the first but in the late first. I dont agree with how guards are undervalued but at the same time its a shame to overpay or reach for one.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=86634

lupati is his name and he is great in pass pro. Decent in the run game. i watched a couple of games and looks lost in space. is not quick on his feet. those are his major glareing weaknesses. he looks better against the pass. might be a liablity in the run game. i would say he looks more like a second round player. I would also question the quality of players he has faced. His combine if he comes out will make or break him

Jekyll15Hyde
11-29-2009, 10:23 PM
Cody. Nuff said

Broncos_OTM
11-29-2009, 10:33 PM
and history shows that was a great idea.

that was quite possibly the dumbest draft move in the franchise history.

let me elaborate on that. we were a 13-3 team a few defensive starters and an offensive playmaker away from being a super bowl team, only for Mike to blow up a 13-3 team in favor of a head case with a big arm.

i know the pick ended up netting us 2-1st rounders, a 3rd and Orton, but the cost we paid by taking Cutler with that pick was huge. blew up a legit super bowl contender of a team, and sunk the franchise into 3 consecutive years of mediocrity which has led to a rebuild.


Orton is a good QB and is getting better the longer he is in the system. QB is not an issue.

Depending on the Marshall situation WR is a possible need in the draft, depth along the line and replacements at the LG and C position are big needs, DL help is a major need, and if we are in a position to get Suh or Cody, that needs to be the pick, and if they are not available, we need to trade back, pick up additional 2nd and 3rd rounders

on a side note, if we do decide Orton is not the long term answer, Lefevour in the 2nd or 3rd would be a good pick.Lefevour is junk. I am not impressed.

its tough to say who i would think is the best pick. I think our Defense is closes to being unstopable so i would probably go D. I think McClain is the pick but its already a strong suit of our D unless they want to try him at SOLB and move Ayers to the RDE

I really wouldnt mind seeing that Since we run a Zone Blitz One gap system here it could be successful Ask ayers to gain about 10-20 lbs play him at the RDE. He is able to hold his ground great against the run. Ask him to blow up plays in the Backfield.

I see a major problem with us getting no pressure when we rush three or four guys. I think ayers might be able to help there.

s0phr0syne
11-29-2009, 10:34 PM
I can't be the only one who thinks it's a horrible idea to draft a HUGE FATTY up high in the 1st round where they get a big ol' signing bonus....right? I mean, where's the carrot to get better?

lex
11-29-2009, 10:35 PM
lupati is his name and he is great in pass pro. Decent in the run game. i watched a couple of games and looks lost in space. is not quick on his feet. those are his major glareing weaknesses. he looks better against the pass. might be a liablity in the run game. i would say he looks more like a second round player. I would also question the quality of players he has faced. His combine if he comes out will make or break him

If some juniors turn pro, it could be a really nice draft for OL. You have the Pounceys and also ODowd as well as a few others.

SportinOne
11-29-2009, 10:35 PM
and history shows that was a great idea.

that was quite possibly the dumbest draft move in the franchise history.

No. Not even close. Jake Plummer was not going to take us to a Super Bowl. We were lucky that we beat the Pats and we got slaughtered against Pitt. It was a solid team, but it was full of faults. Drafting a QB, specifically, the best QB in that draft, was the right move.

I would still rather have Cutler right now than what we ended up with for him. Here, there is no way he has as many picks as he does in Chicago. He would have a much better offensive line and much better weapons. He'd have McDaniels, too. The way he likes to control things, I don't think there is any way that Cutler finishes the season with 20 picks. With the way our defense can play when the offense is moving, if we were 7-4 right now I think people would call us a disappointment.

But, it is much easier to look at the crap numbers he is putting up in Chicago and say he would have done that here while pretending that Orton is something special.

lex
11-29-2009, 10:37 PM
I can't be the only one who thinks it's a horrible idea to draft a HUGE FATTY up high in the 1st round where they get a big ol' signing bonus....right? I mean, where's the carrot to get better?

Thats a concern with Cody. Ultimately, I dont care who it is if they can play NT. If Suh can put on 20 lbs and dominate at NT, then, by all means, take him. BUt one thing I like about Cody is that he has responded well to Saban's coaching.

DBroncos4life
11-29-2009, 10:43 PM
I don't how Suh will be there at number 9. I would love to get him, but at the same time I kind of would like to see the Skins draft him. Still if we landed him I don't think we should mess with his weight. Jay Ratliff has no problem playing NT at 310.

Lolad
11-29-2009, 10:47 PM
and history shows that was a great idea.

that was quite possibly the dumbest draft move in the franchise history.

let me elaborate on that. we were a 13-3 team a few defensive starters and an offensive playmaker away from being a super bowl team, only for Mike to blow up a 13-3 team in favor of a head case with a big arm.

i know the pick ended up netting us 2-1st rounders, a 3rd and Orton, but the cost we paid by taking Cutler with that pick was huge. blew up a legit super bowl contender of a team, and sunk the franchise into 3 consecutive years of mediocrity which has led to a rebuild.


Orton is a good QB and is getting better the longer he is in the system. QB is not an issue.

Depending on the Marshall situation WR is a possible need in the draft, depth along the line and replacements at the LG and C position are big needs, DL help is a major need, and if we are in a position to get Suh or Cody, that needs to be the pick, and if they are not available, we need to trade back, pick up additional 2nd and 3rd rounders

on a side note, if we do decide Orton is not the long term answer, Lefevour in the 2nd or 3rd would be a good pick.

How can you say QB is not an issue? I think we need a QB who can do everything the coaches ask of him to do. And do it consistently not the "my bad" we get from Orton.

Orton can NOT efficiently throw a ball down the field with zip.. I think we can all agree he misses more than he hits... It would make our offense that much better if we had an accurate QB with an arm to throw darts down the field. I'm not asking for a QB to throw bombs the entire game because that's not going to work.

If you look @ QB's that have thrown passes over 20+ yards they're teams are either division leaders or competing for a playoff spot.

strafen
11-29-2009, 10:49 PM
We need a dominant defensive lineman, a guard, lb, QB
Tim Tebow would do it for me. The media has spread this idea that Tebow is not an NFL QB
This is a guy that all he's done in his career is win, and win against the top elite teams in College Football. The same teams that NFL teams get their draft picks from.

Finger Roll
11-29-2009, 10:52 PM
How can you say QB is not an issue? I think we need a QB who can do everything the coaches ask of him to do. And do it consistently not the "my bad" we get from Orton.

Orton can NOT efficiently throw a ball down the field with zip.. I think we can all agree he misses more than he hits... It would make our offense that much better if we had an accurate QB with an arm to throw darts down the field. I'm not asking for a QB to throw bombs the entire game because that's not going to work.

If you look @ QB's that have thrown passes over 20+ yards they're teams are either division leaders or competing for a playoff spot.

I agree he limits us with his lack of downfield accuracy and zip. Not sure if Bradford or Locker is the answer either.

strafen
11-29-2009, 10:53 PM
How can you say QB is not an issue? I think we need a QB who can do everything the coaches ask of him to do. And do it consistently not the "my bad" we get from Orton.

Orton can NOT efficiently throw a ball down the field with zip.. I think we can all agree he misses more than he hits... It would make our offense that much better if we had an accurate QB with an arm to throw darts down the field. I'm not asking for a QB to throw bombs the entire game because that's not going to work.

If you look @ QB's that have thrown passes over 20+ yards they're teams are either division leaders or competing for a playoff spot.God, I really hope Orton will not be our QB next year. That will suck.
The guy is what it is. A decent QB for lack of a better word.
Our offensive ranking this year are pathetic, we're winning but stats don't lie and usually comeback to bite you in the ass
We're terrible scoring inside the red zone, Orton lacks the killing instinc required to put teams away and he also lacks the ability to rally our team from a deficit.
He had the fortune to play most of the season with the lead...

Finger Roll
11-29-2009, 10:58 PM
Claussen and Locker will be gone by the time the Broncos pick. That leaves only Bradford but he's a major injury risk.

uplink
11-29-2009, 11:08 PM
trade it to Chicago for Cutler, Tommie Harris and lance Briggs. Then give Cutler a cell phone and make him answer calls from Mr. Bowlen's secretary all day.
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Denver724
11-29-2009, 11:10 PM
OL, DL or ILB.

We need depth and future starters at all three places.

I really think McClain will be available between 8-12. They are projecting him as a great ILB. We need to pounce on this guy if he is there.

Denver724
11-29-2009, 11:11 PM
I don't how Suh will be there at number 9. I would love to get him, but at the same time I kind of would like to see the Skins draft him. Still if we landed him I don't think we should mess with his weight. Jay Ratliff has no problem playing NT at 310.

Schefter was stating today on ESPN that Suh and McCoy could go #1 and #2.

DBroncos4life
11-29-2009, 11:17 PM
Schefter was stating today on ESPN that Suh and McCoy could go #1 and #2.

I know I am a homer but I don't see how Suh won't get picked in the top 5. I wouldn't mind taking the chance on Bradford if we could resign Orton for a two year deal or something short like that. I think they said there was a 97% success rate with the surgery he is going to have.

outdoor_miner
11-29-2009, 11:40 PM
God, I really hope Orton will not be our QB next year. That will suck.
The guy is what it is. A decent QB for lack of a better word.
Our offensive ranking this year are pathetic, we're winning but stats don't lie and usually comeback to bite you in the ass
We're terrible scoring inside the red zone, Orton lacks the killing instinc required to put teams away and he also lacks the ability to rally our team from a deficit.
He had the fortune to play most of the season with the lead...

1. You are crazy if you think Orton is not going to be our QB next year. Even if we do draft a QBOTF in the 1st (which I highly doubt), there is almost no way that he would start next year given the success we've had this year.

2. Orton rallied our team from deficits against both Dallas and New England. The New England game, in particular, was a really nice comeback due in large part to a clutch performance by Orton. Just sayin.

KevinJames
11-29-2009, 11:43 PM
I hope Eric Berry falls to us some how and we take him, he could play any secondary position.

I think we would have to draft him if hes there.

Kaylore
11-29-2009, 11:58 PM
Best player available.

Though I'd love to see us trade down for more picks.

Doggcow
11-30-2009, 12:05 AM
All this locker talk needs to go. This ****er cant throw accurately AT ALL. He has a terrible arm, and is only good at scrambling into LBs that knock his head off and end his season.

Doggcow
11-30-2009, 12:07 AM
Claussen and Locker will be gone by the time the Broncos pick. That leaves only Bradford but he's a major injury risk.

LOCKER IS AN INJURY RISK, THIS IS HIS FIRST SEASON NOT GETTING INJURED. God damn, people pay attention. He can't even light up my pathetic Cougars (probably the worst team in the league)

Broncosfreak_56
11-30-2009, 12:10 AM
Good guards can be had in the second. With our first, either the best 3-4 d line player available, or if we are lucky, Jimmy Clausen.

Rohirrim
11-30-2009, 12:17 AM
Mount Cody. Alabama has the best D in the country, largely because of him. He makes everybody around him better. He creates a QB's worst enemy: Pressure up the middle. He requires a double team every down he plays. I can't even imagine what happens to Dumervil's numbers with Cody in the middle.

snowspot66
11-30-2009, 12:24 AM
No. Not even close. Jake Plummer was not going to take us to a Super Bowl. We were lucky that we beat the Pats and we got slaughtered against Pitt. It was a solid team, but it was full of faults. Drafting a QB, specifically, the best QB in that draft, was the right move.

I would still rather have Cutler right now than what we ended up with for him. Here, there is no way he has as many picks as he does in Chicago. He would have a much better offensive line and much better weapons. He'd have McDaniels, too. The way he likes to control things, I don't think there is any way that Cutler finishes the season with 20 picks. With the way our defense can play when the offense is moving, if we were 7-4 right now I think people would call us a disappointment.

But, it is much easier to look at the crap numbers he is putting up in Chicago and say he would have done that here while pretending that Orton is something special.

Dude, he damn near did do that even with the offensive talent around him. We didn't do **** on offense with him except move through the mid field really fast.

UberBroncoMan
11-30-2009, 12:26 AM
I hope Eric Berry falls to us some how and we take him, he could play any secondary position.

I think we would have to draft him if hes there.

I'd kill for him... or Mount Cody.

I just can't see how they aren't top 5 picks though along with two QB's and Dez Bryant.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-30-2009, 12:34 AM
I'd kill for him... or Mount Cody.

I just can't see how they aren't top 5 picks though along with two QB's and Dez Bryant.

Conditioning and motivation will always be a concern for Cody until he shows he can get it done in the pros.

Granted it's only McShay's list at Scouts, Inc., but they don't even have Cody in their Top 32 at this point.

UberBroncoMan
11-30-2009, 12:42 AM
Conditioning and motivation will always be a concern for Cody until he shows he can get it done in the pros.

Granted it's only McShay's list at Scouts, Inc., but they don't even have Cody in their Top 32 at this point.

Serious hmmm alright. I was under the impression that his physical stature made him an extremely rare and high ranking commodity.

My BIGGEST issue with Cody is his intelligence. Intellectually he's pretty dumb. But outside of that he's a mammoth that can take up multiple blockers, which is just what an NT is made to do.

Regardless I want Eric Berry the most. The man screams Ed Reed 2.0.

Gives us a future with him and McBath (who's done a solid job when Dawkins has been out).

Al Wilson
11-30-2009, 01:00 AM
I honestly think if we can draft a superstar WR and have him play next to Marshall then we'd be unstoppable. I don't think we have a legitimate threat other than Marshall. Having another big talented target next to Marshall would create many more mismatches, and more points on the board...just saying..

And people, you seriously gotta stop with this drafting a QB in the first round cuz McD isn't a retard.

Orton is the ****ing man.

Broncos_OTM
11-30-2009, 01:03 AM
Serious hmmm alright. I was under the impression that his physical stature made him an extremely rare and high ranking commodity.

My BIGGEST issue with Cody is his intelligence. Intellectually he's pretty dumb. But outside of that he's a mammoth that can take up multiple blockers, which is just what an NT is made to do.

Regardless I want Eric Berry the most. The man screams Ed Reed 2.0.

Gives us a future with him and McBath (who's done a solid job when Dawkins has been out).

With Cody intellegance really doesnt mean jack ****. Take on the guy in front of you and push the pocket. and stop the guy with the ball in front of you. its not like he would be asked to play a skill position or something that requires him to put to much thought into a play.

I like him though. i definetly would be happy with the pick. or better yet

Move Chris Baker to LDE. Draft Dan WIlliams, Ronaldo Mclain. Move Ayers to RDE and i think that is some serious up gradeing to that Defense. Mclain can start out of the box. Dan WIlliams can play rotationally and it drafstically improves this team.

Broncos_OTM
11-30-2009, 01:08 AM
I honestly think if we can draft a superstar WR and have him play next to Marshall then we'd be unstoppable. I don't think we have a legitimate threat other than Marshall. Having another big talented target next to Marshall would create many more mismatches, and more points on the board...just saying..

And people, you seriously gotta stop with this drafting a QB in the first round cuz McD isn't a retard.

Orton is the ****ing man.

Drafting another top flight WR is not gonna help this offense. Marshall and Royal had Superior years last year. this year, the production has slipped. and i highly doubt its because they have failed.

I like orton but its due to him that their production has slipped. Orton is a good QB but unless we get to where Pitts or Baltimore on Defense we are not gonna win a SB with orton. He is alot like Plummer. Good QB. but he just cannot carry a team like some of the elite do. I am all for drafting a QB. I would let him learn the system before starting him. .. . Yes we all know that every great once in a while a journey man QB can win but if you do have a franchise QB your chances are alot better.

ward63
11-30-2009, 01:18 AM
D-line, G, MLB, QB, P....that's what I want in the draft...in that order

cutthemdown
11-30-2009, 01:34 AM
Good guards can be had in the second. With our first, either the best 3-4 d line player available, or if we are lucky, Jimmy Clausen.

But what if said guard was Hutchinson good etc? I could care less what position they take in first, 2nd, 3rd etc. If you find 2 really good starters a draft, and maybe a role player or 2 you can be a really good team in very little time.

So even if it was an OG in first round, if the dude is a great player it wouldn't matter he went in first. Now sure if you think the stud is going to be there in 2nd etc then you play strategy. But I don't think you ever pass on best player available, not ever IMO.

Draft the best players regardless, use FA to fill spots of need. In the end you will have young good players and vets filling the spots you missed on.

DBroncos4life
11-30-2009, 01:37 AM
If the rumors are true about Quinn then I wouldn't rule out Claussen.

cutthemdown
11-30-2009, 01:46 AM
I really do trust this regime to find some good players in the draft. I think Moreno could end up a nice player, he has a ways to go. Ayers IMO about what you expect from a rookie playing a tough position to learn. He could still turn out to be a nice player. Smith also playing a tough position, not a bad job for a rookie.

If those 3 turn out to be good starters, and we got 3 more this yr, throw in a few more FA hits and Broncos could build a really good team. I have faith Bowlen will try harder then most owners to win.

Also I think Colo not such a bad place to live, players will continue to find things about city they like.

I'm not worried.

Archer81
11-30-2009, 01:57 AM
Tim Tebow. Dude wins. The change of pace from sweet baby Jay would be striking.


:Broncos:

KevinJames
11-30-2009, 02:17 AM
Tim Tebow. Dude wins. The change of pace from sweet baby Jay would be striking.


:Broncos:

you can't be serious right?notsofast

UberBroncoMan
11-30-2009, 02:55 AM
you can't be serious right?notsofast

Who says we need Ryan Clady protecting his blindside?!

IMO our QB has to be a right handed player. Clady on the blindside is too big of a luxury to pass up, even if Ryan Harris is a solid RT.

A lot of people forget how crazy Orton was in college.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=119358

Almost 3,100 yards to go with 31 TD's and 5 INT's in his final year.

While I'm not the "highest" on Orton, I think once he has a year of this system under his belt he'll be better ie... we're going to see much better offensive numbers next year.

Maybe 20-25 TD's and 3600 - 4200 passing yards with 7-9 INT's.

KevinJames
11-30-2009, 04:05 AM
if none of the the Big 4 on defense fall to us than we should try to trade down and acquire more picks

Big 4 we need to target:
Eric Berry
Ndamukong Suh
Gerald McCoy
Rolando McClain

call me crazy but say there are no D players we really want I would not be shocked to see us add an offensive weapon to the arsenal. On offense we lack explosion plays CJ Spiller from Clemson is a real home run hitter with speed for days yeah Moreno is the future but hes more so our every down power back CJ could be a nice change of pace back for us sure it be a luxury pick and it would get some fans scratching their heads but think of that 1-2 punch for years to come its a long shot but speed kills in the NFL Chris Johnson for example also look at Williams and Stewart in Carolina:thumbsup:.

rastaman
11-30-2009, 04:43 AM
God, I really hope Orton will not be our QB next year. That will suck.
The guy is what it is. A decent QB for lack of a better word.
Our offensive ranking this year are pathetic, we're winning but stats don't lie and usually comeback to bite you in the ass
We're terrible scoring inside the red zone, Orton lacks the killing instinc required to put teams away and he also lacks the ability to rally our team from a deficit.
He had the fortune to play most of the season with the lead...

I agree Orton is not a QB you lean on to get you to the SB or build a dynasty around. In fact Orton needs a lot of talent around him on both sides of the ball to be successfull.

rastaman
11-30-2009, 04:48 AM
if none of the the Big 4 on defense fall to us than we should try to trade down and acquire more picks

Big 4 we need to target:
Eric Berry
Ndamukong Suh
Gerald McCoy
Rolando McClain

call me crazy but say there are no D players we really want I would not be shocked to see us add an offensive weapon to the arsenal. On offense we lack explosion plays CJ Spiller from Clemson is a real home run hitter with speed for days yeah Moreno is the future but hes more so our every down power back CJ could be a nice change of pace back for us sure it be a luxury pick and it would get some fans scratching their heads but think of that 1-2 punch for years to come its a long shot but speed kills in the NFL Chris Johnson for example also look at Williams and Stewart in Carolina:thumbsup:.

Moreno should be our RB of the future or next 6 to 8 years. He's only missing a lead block FB and more stretch the line zone blocking where Moreno can make "One Read", "One Cut" and run down hill.

The same running scheme TD and Griffen used in 96, 97, and 98 should be used with Moreno and Larsen. It won't happen, however if you want take the running attack to the next this would be the running scheme to use.

rastaman
11-30-2009, 04:54 AM
I honestly think if we can draft a superstar WR and have him play next to Marshall then we'd be unstoppable. I don't think we have a legitimate threat other than Marshall. Having another big talented target next to Marshall would create many more mismatches, and more points on the board...just saying..

And people, you seriously gotta stop with this drafting a QB in the first round cuz McD isn't a retard.

Orton is the ****ing man.

Don't see Orton as the man. He has yet to prove he can hit his WR's in full stride! Getting another big time WR to play along side Brandon will not be that effective if Orton can't throw the deep ball or intermediate ball with consistency and accuracy. Perhaps next season with a year under his belt with offense Orton will prove everyone wrong. But right now around the league Orton has the reputation as a QB who can't throw the accurately and consistently.

Drek
11-30-2009, 04:58 AM
What I'd like to see round by round:
1st - DL or ILB. Order of preference would be Cody, McClain, Spikes (I don't think we'd have a shot at Suh or McCoy for a 3-4 end).
2nd - Best OG available.
3rd - Tim Tebow. I think he'll slide and quite a bit if Locker, Clausen, etc. come out. Good developmental guy for McDaniels.
4th - best return man we can find.
5th - best punter in the draft class.
6th - best 3-4 DE still remaining.
7th - whatever might be left, maybe a new FB?

rastaman
11-30-2009, 04:59 AM
Whats wrong with Brandstaters arm? He looked like he had some zip on the ball.

Question is when does Bradstater take the field?

Broncoman13
11-30-2009, 05:30 AM
I kind of like the Vikings recent philosophy of drafting offensive playmakers regardless of perceived needs. So with that in mind, a QB would make a lot of sense. Locker, Pike, and McCoy are my three favorite in the draft at this point. Tebow is the biggest risk but a leader of his caliber... I wouldn't doubt the kid. He seems like he may be the best leader to come along in several years. A RB/WR/KR specialist type player also makes a lot of sense. Look no further than what guys like Percy Harvin and Chris Johnson have done in the NFL. I see a lot of both of those guys in CJ Spiller. IF we decide to trade BMarsh or let him walk (with draft picks in return via RFA) then Spiller becomes a must. Then you have guys like Dez Bryant, Mt. Cody, Eric Berry, Taylor Mays, and Brandon Spikes. They may not fill immediate needs (Cody does), but look at a guy like Eric Berry and then look at what guys like Palmaulo, Ed Reed, and Bob Sanders mean to their defenses. A top tier safety truly makes the best defenses go.

barryr
11-30-2009, 07:04 AM
If you want to have success for the future, the Broncos need to pick the best player at that pick, the player they feel has the best chance to be a really good player at the very least regardless of position.

_Oro_
11-30-2009, 07:04 AM
No. Not even close. Jake Plummer was not going to take us to a Super Bowl. We were lucky that we beat the Pats and we got slaughtered against Pitt. It was a solid team, but it was full of faults. Drafting a QB, specifically, the best QB in that draft, was the right move.

I would still rather have Cutler right now than what we ended up with for him. Here, there is no way he has as many picks as he does in Chicago. He would have a much better offensive line and much better weapons. He'd have McDaniels, too. The way he likes to control things, I don't think there is any way that Cutler finishes the season with 20 picks. With the way our defense can play when the offense is moving, if we were 7-4 right now I think people would call us a disappointment.

But, it is much easier to look at the crap numbers he is putting up in Chicago and say he would have done that here while pretending that Orton is something special.

The first step is admitting there is a problem.

Beantown Bronco
11-30-2009, 07:20 AM
I agree Orton is not a QB you lean on to get you to the SB or build a dynasty around. In fact Orton needs a lot of talent around him on both sides of the ball to be successfull.

Name one active QB that doesn't.

Manning? Has the #1 ranked defense in the league, A+ receivers and A+ TE.

Brady? Please.

bpc
11-30-2009, 07:21 AM
Most can forget about McCoy (best DT in the country, IMO), Suh, Berry or Clausen. Those four should be the top guys selected next year.

Clausen is easily the best QB over Locker. Locker is the better athlete but as pointed out, he's had some injuries that have set him back. His arm is a plus but his mechanics stink right now and he isn't ready to read NFL defenses. He's going to have to sit on the sidelines for awhile and some coach is going to have to break him down completely and build him back up a la what Reid did with McNabb in Philly.

Sam Bradford looked great before the injury. He won't run for many yards but the guy has a great arm and is accurate as heck. If he hadn't got injured, he would be in the top 5 of this draft. He's give Denver the player we're looking for a QB but with his shoulder being damaged goods, I'd be VERY cautious going near him.

The 3 guys who jump out at me from our spot right now would be Rolando McClain, a complete ILB who could come in and give us another huge playmaker in the 3-4, or two WR's, Golden Tate or Dez Bryant.

Tate compares favorably to Steve Smith in my mind. No doubt about it. He's probably the most explosive playmaker at WR this year. The guy is probably running a 4.35 at least. His hands are good but his athletic ability and his route running are going to set him apart. This offense is devoid of explosive plays right now.

Dez Bryant is a physical and athletic freak. His game is very similar to BMarshall's. He's faster and has better hops though. His hands probably are better too.

Jerry Hughes could also factor into consideration here if we're looking for an elite pass rushing option opposite of Doom.

gyldenlove
11-30-2009, 08:11 AM
If we draft at number 9 we go DL and pick a beast.

The only way we draft anything other than DL is if a: Orton implodes over the last 5 games or b: Dumervil or Marshall are not resigned, in which case we will replace whoever left in the first round.

bpc
11-30-2009, 08:17 AM
If we draft at number 9 we go DL and pick a beast.

The only way we draft anything other than DL is if a: Orton implodes over the last 5 games or b: Dumervil or Marshall are not resigned, in which case we will replace whoever left in the first round.

What if there is no beast? Suh and McCoy will be gone in the top 5. No doubt in my mind. Cody is not a beast, just a pig.

McClain makes the most sense.

Hopefully in round 2 there are some players there. I think Tyson Alualu would be a great find at that spot. He won't blow your mind in any one area, but the kid is strong as an ox, will hold the LOS of scrimmage in the 3-4, and can pass rush in the phone booth. I think he's limited upside, but he's the kind of guy you need to have to play the 3-4. Something we're semi-lacking with our frontline guys.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
11-30-2009, 08:23 AM
I can't be the only one who thinks it's a horrible idea to draft a HUGE FATTY up high in the 1st round where they get a big ol' signing bonus....right? I mean, where's the carrot to get better?

Worked for JaMarcus... right?

TheElusiveKyleOrton
11-30-2009, 08:25 AM
God, I really hope Orton will not be our QB next year. That will suck.
The guy is what it is. A decent QB for lack of a better word.
Our offensive ranking this year are pathetic, we're winning but stats don't lie and usually comeback to bite you in the ass
We're terrible scoring inside the red zone, Orton lacks the killing instinc required to put teams away and he also lacks the ability to rally our team from a deficit.
He had the fortune to play most of the season with the lead...

Really? Then what were those two 90+ yard drives against New England all about? Or the go ahead drive for a field goal to win it in overtime?

What about the drive against Dallas to win THAT game?

Some people.

FantomForce
11-30-2009, 08:29 AM
Locker.

SoCal you are amazingly right!:sunshine:

rastaman
11-30-2009, 08:34 AM
Name one active QB that doesn't.

Manning? Has the #1 ranked defense in the league, A+ receivers and A+ TE.

Brady? Please.

Point is, if we are going to keep Orton and sign him to a contract extention while paying him bargain friendly cap salary, McD may as well load up and draft for Defense over the next two years in the first, second, third, and fourth rounds. Orton can still you to the SB if Denver has a shutdown tough as nails defense.

Think about it. With Nolan evaluating draft talent for Defense over the next 2 years, we are talking 8 defensive players drafted. I'd imagine in two years we should have a pretty darn good defense by then. McD could then use FA and draft picks in the 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds for offensive picks.

If we are going to keep Orton surrounding Kyle with a stout lights out Defense that can keep the game close enough for the offense to win the game in the 4th quarter is how he can be most effective with a game manager of Orton's capability.

rastaman
11-30-2009, 08:36 AM
Really? Then what were those two 90+ yard drives against New England all about? Or the go ahead drive for a field goal to win it in overtime?

What about the drive against Dallas to win THAT game?

Some people.

I doubt very seriously if Orton faces the same NE team next week that he could duplicate the same effort and win b/c the Patriots are a different team.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
11-30-2009, 08:39 AM
What I'd like to see round by round:
1st - DL or ILB. Order of preference would be Cody, McClain, Spikes (I don't think we'd have a shot at Suh or McCoy for a 3-4 end).
2nd - Best OG available.
3rd - Tim Tebow. I think he'll slide and quite a bit if Locker, Clausen, etc. come out. Good developmental guy for McDaniels.
4th - best return man we can find.
5th - best punter in the draft class.
6th - best 3-4 DE still remaining.
7th - whatever might be left, maybe a new FB?

I've got your return man in the fourth. And if we don't get him, I'm not just going to be sad, I'm going to be wicked pissed.

Marc Mariani - The University of Montana.

Guy is the man. Had an 80 yard punt return for a touchdown Saturday in the playoffs, then singlehandedly WILLED the Grizzlies to a victory.

When he returned that punt, Montana was down 41-14. That return sparked the team to a 61-48 win.

He's sick. Would be an unreal threat out of the slot, has monstrous speed and will be an NFL player. Whether he's here or not, he will play on Sundays, and he will be an impact player.

Scouting Report (http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=81276&draftyear=2010&genpos=WR)

TheElusiveKyleOrton
11-30-2009, 08:41 AM
I doubt very seriously if Orton faces the same NE team next week that he could duplicate the same effort and win b/c the Patriots are a different team.

Oh blah blah blah. Teams change week to week. This isn't news.

And that's not the point. Someone stupidly said that Orton has been playing with the lead most of the year. I pointed out that it wasn't true. I know it's hard for you with Cutler's balls in your mouth, but pay attention.

HEAV
11-30-2009, 08:49 AM
Best talent available on the draft board

gyldenlove
11-30-2009, 08:57 AM
Tim Tebow. Dude wins. The change of pace from sweet baby Jay would be striking.


:Broncos:

We already have Spencer Larsen at FB, we don't need another one.

gyldenlove
11-30-2009, 09:04 AM
What if there is no beast? Suh and McCoy will be gone in the top 5. No doubt in my mind. Cody is not a beast, just a pig.

McClain makes the most sense.

Hopefully in round 2 there are some players there. I think Tyson Alualu would be a great find at that spot. He won't blow your mind in any one area, but the kid is strong as an ox, will hold the LOS of scrimmage in the 3-4, and can pass rush in the phone booth. I think he's limited upside, but he's the kind of guy you need to have to play the 3-4. Something we're semi-lacking with our frontline guys.

Jared Odrick or Carlos Dunlap will both do in my oppinion - both are playmakers.

I agree that Cody is not a beast, I wouldn't like to draft him in the top 10.

A LB would also be fine.

DrFate
11-30-2009, 09:21 AM
I haven't looked at the draft.... is there are top ten OG prospect?


Is there such a thing?

Jekyll15Hyde
11-30-2009, 10:09 AM
Tim Tebow. Dude wins. The change of pace from sweet baby Jay would be striking.


:Broncos:

Worst post ever

Pick Six
11-30-2009, 10:58 AM
Worst post ever

Nobody really knows how a player will perform at the next level, but Chris is right. Tebow is a winner...

Tombstone RJ
11-30-2009, 11:09 AM
Broncos need to draft defense. On offense, the Broncos need to resign Marshall and add some interior olinemen. Punter is a need position.

But if McD has a brain, he'll draft defense early and often.

Peoples Champ
11-30-2009, 11:11 AM
whatever we think we are going to use the 1st round pick for, it will probably be the opposite, so I wont worry about it until the preseason next year to see how our #1 pick looks

jhns
11-30-2009, 11:17 AM
I would like to see us take a QB or the best front 7 player available. We could use another playmaker in the front 7 and I think we can do better at QB.

We need o-line but not a tackle. You can get top centers and guards in the second and third rounds. Interior o-line doesn't get picked that early in the first.

oubronco
11-30-2009, 11:23 AM
Right now we would have I believe the 9th pick if the season ended today.

Do we take a QB? Trade down to 15-20 and get an extra high pick? Or just go for a D-lineman which I think we still need.

I know it is early, but the Bears have a game with the Packers and the Vikings, though both in Chicago, as well as games against St.Louis, and @Baltimore and @Detroit to end the season...

So I feel they will end up 6-10, 7-9 at the best, which would give us a top 12 pick. I bet Seattle is wishing they asked for the Bear pick now.

Just some more things to ponder.

Mt. Saint Cody

Jekyll15Hyde
11-30-2009, 12:21 PM
Nobody really knows how a player will perform at the next level, but Chris is right. Tebow is a winner...

There are lots of winners in college that do squat in the pros. He is a less athletic and slower version of VY (although probably smarter). And VY is a marginally successful QB in the pros.

Tebow better be prepared to to play S or maybe a flex HB/TE like Dallas Clark if he has any dreams of playing on Sunday. IMO, he is suited for neither.

Denver724
11-30-2009, 12:21 PM
What I'd like to see round by round:
1st - DL or ILB. Order of preference would be Cody, McClain, Spikes (I don't think we'd have a shot at Suh or McCoy for a 3-4 end).
2nd - Best OG available.
3rd - Tim Tebow. I think he'll slide and quite a bit if Locker, Clausen, etc. come out. Good developmental guy for McDaniels.
4th - best return man we can find.
5th - best punter in the draft class.
6th - best 3-4 DE still remaining.
7th - whatever might be left, maybe a new FB?

We don't have a 5th this year. We traded Dallas's pick during the draft and trading ours for the DE (Smith) from NE.

lex
11-30-2009, 12:52 PM
What if there is no beast? Suh and McCoy will be gone in the top 5. No doubt in my mind. Cody is not a beast, just a pig.

McClain makes the most sense.

Hopefully in round 2 there are some players there. I think Tyson Alualu would be a great find at that spot. He won't blow your mind in any one area, but the kid is strong as an ox, will hold the LOS of scrimmage in the 3-4, and can pass rush in the phone booth. I think he's limited upside, but he's the kind of guy you need to have to play the 3-4. Something we're semi-lacking with our frontline guys.

Call it whatever you want but the guy, a) has responded to Saban's coaching, and b) occupies blocks like few others. I have a concern that he'll eat his way out of the league but Im not absolutely certain he will. Again, I refer to the fact that he has responded well to Saban and Im not convinced he wont do the same at the next level with other NFL caliber coaches.

bpc
11-30-2009, 12:59 PM
Jared Odrick or Carlos Dunlap will both do in my oppinion - both are playmakers.

I agree that Cody is not a beast, I wouldn't like to draft him in the top 10.

A LB would also be fine.

Dunlap sucks. He's a larger version of Jarvis Moss. There's potential with his size, but there is nothing that i've seen on film yet that proves he's more than a project.

He's listed at 6'6", 290lbs, but he's one of the softer players i've seen. Much like Moss he doesn't show lateral quickness or the ability to anchor and shed in as a 3-4 DE/DT. When pass rushing, he's just a soft bull rusher who gets by because of measurables and long arms. He doesn't have any pass rush moves that one would brag about.

This guy has bust all over him. The identical nature of his game and Moss' is scary.

I haven't seen Odrick enough but most think he's a late 1st rounder, 2nd rounder at most. There is not way I would reach for a DL if we're drafting around #10. Especially in the 3-4 where there are a lot of tweeners that fall back each round. Just look at the Steelers. Their starting DE's are Keisel and Aaron Smith. They were drafted in the 4th and 7th rounds respectively.

bpc
11-30-2009, 01:02 PM
Call it whatever you want but the guy, a) has responded to Saban's coaching, and b) occupies blocks like few others. I have a concern that he'll eat his way out of the league but Im not absolutely certain he will. Again, I refer to the fact that he has responded well to Saban and Im not convinced he wont do the same at the next level with other NFL caliber coaches.

From KC Joyner on ESPN Draft Lab and their take on Terrance Cody. Lot's of warning signs here.

The NFL scouting combine has a wide variety of drills to gauge a player's proficiency in many physical areas -- the bench press measures strength, the vertical jump and broad jump grade short-area burst capabilities and the 20- and 60-yard shuttle drills rank a player's ability to start and stop quickly.

As valuable as these training methods are, after looking at game tapes of Alabama Crimson Tide nose tackle Terrence Cody, it is clear there is one physical attribute the combine doesn't measure that it badly needs to.

That attribute is endurance. Look at Cody's relative lack of playing time in a key, four-game SEC stretch that the Crimson Tide recently went through (at Kentucky, at Mississippi, vs. South Carolina, vs. Tennessee).


Alabama faced 116 rushing plays in those games and Cody was on the field for only 68 of them, or 58.6 percent. Nick Saban's defense also faced 165 pass plays and Cody was in the game on but 54 of those plays, or 32.7 percent. Add the two together and Cody was in the Alabama defensive lineup on only 122 of 281 plays -- or only 43.4 percent of the time. To look at it another way, he was on the field for approximately 30 out of 70 plays per game.

That sounds like a low number, but a key element in the Draft Lab series is that any collegiate totals have to be compared to NFL totals to see how they contrast. The expectation is that a draft prospect should be able to post totals against the lower level of competition in college that are appreciably better than a pro player's totals against NFL talent.

In Cody's case, a perfect comparison would be how his playing time matches up against that of NFL nose tackles. I don't have those numbers available, but I do have a reasonable facsimile in a 2007 study I did on playing time for three top 4-3 defensive tackles the previous season: Albert Haynesworth, Cory Redding and Kevin Williams. Here are the results of that study:

Three Of The Best
2007 endurance metrics for some of the best nose tackles in the National Football League:

Player Plays in games Plays not in games Total plays % of time on field
Albert Haynesworth 532 370 902 59.0
Cory Redding 858 227 1,085 79.1
Kevin Williams 866 214 1,080 80.2
At the time of the study, Redding and Williams were both noted for their ability as every-down players, but Haynesworth had the same knock on him about his inability to stay on the field that he has today. If Cody's collegiate playing time doesn't even match Haynesworth's it cannot be seen as a good sign, but there is a caveat: Alabama has a deep defensive line rotation. It is possible that Cody could play more, but without a way of measuring endurance, NFL teams will have a tough time determining if that is the case.

That isn't the only caveat, however. Cody reportedly weighed more than 400 pounds as a juco player, and the first thing the Crimson Tide coaching staff told him when he transferred to Alabama was that he would have to lose a good deal of weight in order to get on the field. He certainly accomplished that, with his reported weight now at 354 pounds, but it very well could be that the Bama coaching staff still lacks faith in his ability to stay on the field for longer periods of time.

The Haynesworth comparison is also not entirely apt because Cody's performance metrics in these four games come nowhere close to matching Haynesworth's totals. Cody did draw a higher rate of double-teams (63.6 percent to Haynesworth's 2007 double-team mark of 51.3 percent) but he notched only five Point of Attack (POA) blocking wins in 22 POA runs, or a win rate of 22.7 percent. In the three full seasons of run metrics I have completed on Haynesworth over the years, his POA win rates were 43.4 percent (2005), 32.3 percent (2007) and 23.8 percent (2008). Haynesworth's metrics are a high bar to reach, but if Cody cannot exceed those totals against college blockers, it stands to reason that he might struggle to equal those numbers at the pro level.

Cody also was basically nonexistent as a pass-rusher. He relied heavily on the bull rush and sometimes got into a very bad habit of doing a one-armed bull rush. That move didn't work for him in these games and it absolutely won't cut it at the next level.

His pass-rushing metrics also reflect a lack of success. He made three splash plays in these four games and one of them was a borderline call that I decided in his favor (splash plays being defined as when a defensive player does something that impacts a passing play -- sacks, passes knocked down and offensive holding penalties being three examples). Good NFL nose tackles tend to generate six to eight splash plays a year and Cody is barely on track to reach that total.

The last item of note is that Cody's draft prospects seemed to get a bit of a shot in the arm when he blocked two critical field goals in Alabama's win over Tennessee. As impressive as those were on their face, in both cases Cody was part of a double-team. He didn't defeat either blocker on his own, so the blocks should be seen as more of a collective effort than a singular effort. That he took his helmet off after the second field goal while the play was still live (something that should have cost the Crimson Tide a penalty) also indicates that he may have a bit of the bad part of Leon Lett in him.


TFS Lab Result: Cody's size, strength and ability to draw a double-team are impressive, but his subpar metric performance and the overriding concerns about his endurance give him a qualified TFS overhyped grade. If a team takes him in the second round with the idea that he is a two-down space-eater who can plug run gaps, he's a good fit. If a team takes him in the first round with the idea that he will be an every-down nose tackle, that would be a mistake.

KC Joyner, aka The Football Scientist, is a regular contributor to ESPN Insider. His Countdown Daily by IBM weekly video matchups can be found every Tuesday here. He also can be found on Twitter (@kcjoynertfs) and at his Web site.

lex
11-30-2009, 01:08 PM
From KC Joyner on ESPN Draft Lab and their take on Terrance Cody. Lot's of warning signs here.

The NFL scouting combine has a wide variety of drills to gauge a player's proficiency in many physical areas -- the bench press measures strength, the vertical jump and broad jump grade short-area burst capabilities and the 20- and 60-yard shuttle drills rank a player's ability to start and stop quickly.

As valuable as these training methods are, after looking at game tapes of Alabama Crimson Tide nose tackle Terrence Cody, it is clear there is one physical attribute the combine doesn't measure that it badly needs to.

That attribute is endurance. Look at Cody's relative lack of playing time in a key, four-game SEC stretch that the Crimson Tide recently went through (at Kentucky, at Mississippi, vs. South Carolina, vs. Tennessee).


Alabama faced 116 rushing plays in those games and Cody was on the field for only 68 of them, or 58.6 percent. Nick Saban's defense also faced 165 pass plays and Cody was in the game on but 54 of those plays, or 32.7 percent. Add the two together and Cody was in the Alabama defensive lineup on only 122 of 281 plays -- or only 43.4 percent of the time. To look at it another way, he was on the field for approximately 30 out of 70 plays per game.

That sounds like a low number, but a key element in the Draft Lab series is that any collegiate totals have to be compared to NFL totals to see how they contrast. The expectation is that a draft prospect should be able to post totals against the lower level of competition in college that are appreciably better than a pro player's totals against NFL talent.

In Cody's case, a perfect comparison would be how his playing time matches up against that of NFL nose tackles. I don't have those numbers available, but I do have a reasonable facsimile in a 2007 study I did on playing time for three top 4-3 defensive tackles the previous season: Albert Haynesworth, Cory Redding and Kevin Williams. Here are the results of that study:

Three Of The Best
2007 endurance metrics for some of the best nose tackles in the National Football League:

Player Plays in games Plays not in games Total plays % of time on field
Albert Haynesworth 532 370 902 59.0
Cory Redding 858 227 1,085 79.1
Kevin Williams 866 214 1,080 80.2
At the time of the study, Redding and Williams were both noted for their ability as every-down players, but Haynesworth had the same knock on him about his inability to stay on the field that he has today. If Cody's collegiate playing time doesn't even match Haynesworth's it cannot be seen as a good sign, but there is a caveat: Alabama has a deep defensive line rotation. It is possible that Cody could play more, but without a way of measuring endurance, NFL teams will have a tough time determining if that is the case.

That isn't the only caveat, however. Cody reportedly weighed more than 400 pounds as a juco player, and the first thing the Crimson Tide coaching staff told him when he transferred to Alabama was that he would have to lose a good deal of weight in order to get on the field. He certainly accomplished that, with his reported weight now at 354 pounds, but it very well could be that the Bama coaching staff still lacks faith in his ability to stay on the field for longer periods of time.

The Haynesworth comparison is also not entirely apt because Cody's performance metrics in these four games come nowhere close to matching Haynesworth's totals. Cody did draw a higher rate of double-teams (63.6 percent to Haynesworth's 2007 double-team mark of 51.3 percent) but he notched only five Point of Attack (POA) blocking wins in 22 POA runs, or a win rate of 22.7 percent. In the three full seasons of run metrics I have completed on Haynesworth over the years, his POA win rates were 43.4 percent (2005), 32.3 percent (2007) and 23.8 percent (2008). Haynesworth's metrics are a high bar to reach, but if Cody cannot exceed those totals against college blockers, it stands to reason that he might struggle to equal those numbers at the pro level.

Cody also was basically nonexistent as a pass-rusher. He relied heavily on the bull rush and sometimes got into a very bad habit of doing a one-armed bull rush. That move didn't work for him in these games and it absolutely won't cut it at the next level.

His pass-rushing metrics also reflect a lack of success. He made three splash plays in these four games and one of them was a borderline call that I decided in his favor (splash plays being defined as when a defensive player does something that impacts a passing play -- sacks, passes knocked down and offensive holding penalties being three examples). Good NFL nose tackles tend to generate six to eight splash plays a year and Cody is barely on track to reach that total.

The last item of note is that Cody's draft prospects seemed to get a bit of a shot in the arm when he blocked two critical field goals in Alabama's win over Tennessee. As impressive as those were on their face, in both cases Cody was part of a double-team. He didn't defeat either blocker on his own, so the blocks should be seen as more of a collective effort than a singular effort. That he took his helmet off after the second field goal while the play was still live (something that should have cost the Crimson Tide a penalty) also indicates that he may have a bit of the bad part of Leon Lett in him.


TFS Lab Result: Cody's size, strength and ability to draw a double-team are impressive, but his subpar metric performance and the overriding concerns about his endurance give him a qualified TFS overhyped grade. If a team takes him in the second round with the idea that he is a two-down space-eater who can plug run gaps, he's a good fit. If a team takes him in the first round with the idea that he will be an every-down nose tackle, that would be a mistake.

KC Joyner, aka The Football Scientist, is a regular contributor to ESPN Insider. His Countdown Daily by IBM weekly video matchups can be found every Tuesday here. He also can be found on Twitter (@kcjoynertfs) and at his Web site.

I already know that Cody isnt on the field for a lot of plays. But it might be skewed by the fact that so many teams run the kinds of spread offenses that you dont see in the NFL. Id be more interested in how much he played against teams like Tennessee which run more conventional offenses like what you more typically see in the NFL.

Rohirrim
11-30-2009, 01:11 PM
Ha! I love it. Yeah, Cody is just a fat pig. I'll bet Urban Meyer doesn't think so, since he's already mentioned he's planning on possible triple teams. Anyway, it's a moot point. I suggest all the experts sit down on Dec. 5th and watch Cody play. I've always said, one of the most important things to know about a player is how he performs on a big stage in the big games. Can't beat the SEC Championship game. We'll meet here afterwards and discuss.

MVP-06
11-30-2009, 01:43 PM
I can't be the only one who thinks it's a horrible idea to draft a HUGE FATTY up high in the 1st round where they get a big ol' signing bonus....right? I mean, where's the carrot to get better?

see albert Haynesworth.

Im not a fan of him this high. Reminds me of allen branch a few years back. I think he could slide to the lower 1st, upper 2nd

Lolad
11-30-2009, 03:24 PM
With the way our conditioning program went this offseason I'm not even sure he would last 1 practice. If we look at him it has to be in the 2nd rd. Meaning we've already picked up our QB in the 1st

SoDak Bronco
11-30-2009, 03:49 PM
I haven't seen enough Alabama games to really comment on how good Cody is, but he has been hyped like few others I can remember at the DT position. I know McDaniels always stresses smart, tough football players, so I look for someone to fit that mold. Is Cody the best 3-4 NT in the draft? I think Ron Fields is okay, but i'd love to have a Ngata or Jenkins type.

SoDak Bronco
11-30-2009, 03:51 PM
http://walterfootball.com/draft2010.php

This has us taking ILB McClain, and Cody dropping to 16 calling him a 2 down player.

HAT
11-30-2009, 03:58 PM
Temporary thread derail...

@lex Re: your quoting of bpc's 15 paragraph copy/paste job only to add your 3 sentences in the very next post.....

It's a lot easier to navigate around here when that doesn't happen.

Why not just:

@bpc Re: That Cody article...

""""I already know that Cody isn't on the field blah, blah blah"""" ?

:thumbs:

lex
11-30-2009, 04:06 PM
I haven't seen enough Alabama games to really comment on how good Cody is, but he has been hyped like few others I can remember at the DT position. I know McDaniels always stresses smart, tough football players, so I look for someone to fit that mold. Is Cody the best 3-4 NT in the draft? I think Ron Fields is okay, but i'd love to have a Ngata or Jenkins type.

He's just gargantuan. He occupies blocks like crazy. He does play limited downs but in college you see a lot of spreads that choose other ways of attacking the defense. In the NFL its harder to avoid running up the middle. So, it could be a little skewed but the guys specialty is definitely run defense.

Everyone keeps talking about McClain and he is a stud but he also has Cody in front of him.

bombay
11-30-2009, 04:07 PM
Cody is one of those exceptional athletes in a fat man's body. Like Barkley was at Auburn, but a lot bigger. Take him.

Caveat Lector
11-30-2009, 04:08 PM
Best talent available on the draft board

McD's draft board is so small it could be empty by the 2nd round...

bpc
11-30-2009, 04:29 PM
I'm not even saying that Cody isn't talented. I'm saying that at a pick like #10, you better be getting a difference maker and not a player who sits on the bench 2/3's of the time, which his college stats indicate.

The proliferation of passing offenses in the NFL, which rivals the spread in college is making 2 down run stopping DT's pretty much unpractical. Which is why a lot of pundits aren't high on him and his stock is sliding.

I'd much rather take an athlete like Rolando McClain who is going to be be on the field every down, no matter the defense.

Beantown Bronco
11-30-2009, 05:22 PM
Everyone keeps talking about McClain and he is a stud but he also has Cody in front of him.

....for less than half the defensive snaps.

elsid13
11-30-2009, 05:34 PM
I already know that Cody isnt on the field for a lot of plays. But it might be skewed by the fact that so many teams run the kinds of spread offenses that you dont see in the NFL. Id be more interested in how much he played against teams like Tennessee which run more conventional offenses like what you more typically see in the NFL.

Actually Saban and his staff have stated that they decided to limit him to 2 downs to keep him fresh. They were happy about this weight loss, but his conditioning is still a concern. He has the potential to be Gilbert Brown 2.0.

elsid13
11-30-2009, 05:37 PM
I haven't seen enough Alabama games to really comment on how good Cody is, but he has been hyped like few others I can remember at the DT position. I know McDaniels always stresses smart, tough football players, so I look for someone to fit that mold. Is Cody the best 3-4 NT in the draft? I think Ron Fields is okay, but i'd love to have a Ngata or Jenkins type.

Cody isn't a Ngata or Jenkins, both are extremely mobile for big men. Cody reminds me of Gilbert Brown from Green Bay. A good strong player but you need to watch his conditioning and weight he carries because of his knees. This is very deep draft for NT so even if they don't draft Cody, there are others out there.

s0phr0syne
11-30-2009, 05:47 PM
I keep posting in this thread so I shouldn't talk, but this is all so premature. Some of the names we're mentioning in the 2nd and 3rd will end up rocketing up the draft boards into the top 15 picks, and people who are sure fire top 15 picks will slide way the hell down. I guess it's just the nature of the best, but I always find it amusing when threads like this get bumped again before the draft, and then once again afterward to compare how things actually shake out.

Also, while interior OL don't go super high in the first traditionally, both Mack and Wood went in the late first this year so I don't know how long you can necessarily wait on those picks anymore. Seems like teams are coveting OL higher and higher in the draft, but I'm not sure if that's statistically true or just the impression I'm getting. Last few drafts have had man run on OT through the first rounds. (speaking of which, wtf happened to Tony Ugoh??)

mhgaffney
11-30-2009, 06:01 PM
Look at the numbers for our receivers.

They are truly anemic. Royal is second with -- get this -- 31 catches.

We need a franchise QB -- who can scramble and throw the long ball accurately.

BroncoBuff
11-30-2009, 06:08 PM
Top drawer safety ... a new Atwater.

Archer81
11-30-2009, 06:31 PM
Broncos need to draft defense. On offense, the Broncos need to resign Marshall and add some interior olinemen. Punter is a need position.

But if McD has a brain, he'll draft defense early and often.


Huh...dejavu.


:Broncos:

UberBroncoMan
11-30-2009, 06:36 PM
Top drawer safety ... a new Atwater.

I honestly don't see us going heavy on safety picks... we just drafted two and still have a quality ST safety in Barrett. Burton has also proved quite effective as an ST'er.

The only way I see us getting one is if we get Eric Berry and make him our ball hawk Ed Reed opposite Dawkins (and eventually McBath).

If we go backfield it's going to be another CB to compete with Alphonso since Ty Law will probably not be here next year and both Champ and Goodman will be another year up in age.

I'd like to see us add to the D-Line myself along with a Guard to take over for Hamilton's old spot and maybe a Center too.

eddie mac
11-30-2009, 06:37 PM
Top drawer safety ... a new Atwater.

WTF is wrong with Dawkins, Hill, McBath and Bruton???

Have to give the latter 2 a chance to develop under the beast.

BroncoBuff
11-30-2009, 06:45 PM
WTF is wrong with Dawkins, Hill, McBath and Bruton???

Have to give the latter 2 a chance to develop under the beast.

I want a top-drawer guy, a latter day BT-DS-Atwater-Lynch. A new Brian Dawkins ... Eric Berry is about right.

Maybe a NT.

lex
11-30-2009, 06:46 PM
....for less than half the defensive snaps.

Yeah, well considering one of his big strengths is tackling in the running game, its relevant to look at what happens when the other team runs. Im sure Cody is in there a lot on predictable running downs.

BTW, I wouldnt complain if we drafted McClain. I also wouldnt complain if we drafted Cody or Spikes.

Archer81
11-30-2009, 06:47 PM
Way Bruton hits on ST's makes you wonder if the next Broncos topflight safety is not already on the roster.


:Broncos:

BroncoBuff
11-30-2009, 06:49 PM
Plus I'm still high on Larsen taking over for Davis in a year or two.

We're loaded on offense, right down the line.

I don't understand the WR talk ... McKinley will be very good, and Brandon and Royal are both still kids. Gaffney's not even 30.

Finger Roll
11-30-2009, 07:00 PM
if we're loaded on offense then way are we 24th in scoring?

Archer81
11-30-2009, 07:07 PM
if we're loaded on offense then way are we 24th in scoring?

4 game losing streaks tend to **** the stat line.


:Broncos:

Hamrob
11-30-2009, 07:14 PM
I was one of the biggest critics of Orton on this board. I've come around some this year. I now believe he is serviceable for the near future. But, I'd rather have a Manning, Brady, Rivers, Roethlesberger etc. They are clearly a notch or two or three above Orton and each notch improves your football team immensely.

As such, if a QB prospect is available that McDaniels feels can develop into an elite NFL QB...he should take him. You just don't get those types of oppurtunities very often and when you do...you need to take advantage of it.

However, if you don't go QB....then go NT, DT, MLB, G in that order.

WABronco
11-30-2009, 07:25 PM
Locker is an exciting prospect but he's entirely unrefined. I'd say definitely invest in the trenches.

cabronco
11-30-2009, 07:43 PM
I was one of the biggest critics of Orton on this board. I've come around some this year. I now believe he is serviceable for the near future. But, I'd rather have a Manning, Brady, Rivers, Roethlesberger etc. They are clearly a notch or two or three above Orton and each notch improves your football team immensely.

As such, if a QB prospect is available that McDaniels feels can develop into an elite NFL QB...he should take him. You just don't get those types of oppurtunities very often and when you do...you need to take advantage of it.

However, if you don't go QB....then go NT, DT, MLB, G in that order.


I agree w/ your post but would put G ahead of MLB. Also if Marshall goes somewhere else, I think we need to look at a tall talented younger receiver, similar to Marshall just w/o the baggage. I hope we retain BM, but it comes with risks obviously.

Caveat Lector
11-30-2009, 09:04 PM
Does anyone else think corner should be a top priority? Everyone is saying that Champ will most likely be gone next year, leaving an aging Goodman and a raw Smith. Behind that there's nothing.

BroncoBuff
11-30-2009, 09:07 PM
Does anyone else think corner should be a top priority? Everyone is saying that Champ will most likely be gone next year, leaving an aging Goodman and a raw Smith. Behind that there's nothing.

Very good point .... JMFW is gone, too.

Beantown Bronco
11-30-2009, 09:10 PM
if we're loaded on offense then way are we 24th in scoring?

1. Chris Simms
2. Learning a completely new system with new guys at QB, RB and OLine.
3. Opponents defensive rankings (pts given up) are as follows:

#1, 2, 3, 5, 9, 10 and 14.

Who else has faced a gauntlet of defenses like that? NOBODY is lighting up those defenses.

BroncoBuff
11-30-2009, 09:13 PM
if we're loaded on offense then way are we 24th in scoring?

We're loaded on offense personnel-wise ... that doesn't necessarily translate to points.

UboBronco
11-30-2009, 09:34 PM
There is something about Tony Pike that intrigues me, if we could trade for a later first and an early 2nd, I could see a defensive front 7 and Pike. I know it is way early to think about things, but you must always plan ahead.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-30-2009, 11:18 PM
Does anyone else think corner should be a top priority? Everyone is saying that Champ will most likely be gone next year, leaving an aging Goodman and a raw Smith. Behind that there's nothing.

No. The only people who think Champ will be gone next year are people who post on the Internetz, because 31 is old and even though he's under contract, it calls for him to get paid a lot of money.

Find me an actual reporter who follows this team on a daily basis who thinks Champ will be gone next year, and then you have an argument.

Champ is still playing at a high level at one of the toughest positions to fill. He's not going get cut. He's not going to get traded, and I'd bet money he's going to be a Bronco through 2010 and into the future.

azbroncfan
11-30-2009, 11:43 PM
Build the OL's and DL's. Add some ILB depth too.

BroncoMan4ever
11-30-2009, 11:44 PM
Tim Tebow. Dude wins. The change of pace from sweet baby Jay would be striking.


:Broncos:

i am with you on that. guy is a natural born leader, makes his teammates better, has a ton of football intelligence, and especially since it seems likely that Orton is here at least a few more years, it would be nice to have a guy like Tebow being groomed by McDaniels to take over in a couple seasons.

BroncoMan4ever
11-30-2009, 11:48 PM
WTF is wrong with Dawkins, Hill, McBath and Bruton???

Have to give the latter 2 a chance to develop under the beast.

don't forget Barrett. i believe he is the guy who in a couple years will be a beast of a starter for us.

KevinJames
11-30-2009, 11:50 PM
i am with you on that. guy is a natural born leader, makes his teammates better, has a ton of football intelligence, and especially since it seems likely that Orton is here at least a few more years, it would be nice to have a guy like Tebow being groomed by McDaniels to take over in a couple seasons.

Ill stab kittens if we draft Tebow McDaniels would truly be an idiot.

but no fear we wont draft tebow we don't need another fullback.

BroncoMan4ever
11-30-2009, 11:56 PM
No. Not even close. Jake Plummer was not going to take us to a Super Bowl. We were lucky that we beat the Pats and we got slaughtered against Pitt. It was a solid team, but it was full of faults. Drafting a QB, specifically, the best QB in that draft, was the right move.

I would still rather have Cutler right now than what we ended up with for him. Here, there is no way he has as many picks as he does in Chicago. He would have a much better offensive line and much better weapons. He'd have McDaniels, too. The way he likes to control things, I don't think there is any way that Cutler finishes the season with 20 picks. With the way our defense can play when the offense is moving, if we were 7-4 right now I think people would call us a disappointment.

But, it is much easier to look at the crap numbers he is putting up in Chicago and say he would have done that here while pretending that Orton is something special.

Orton was a winner in Chicago and is a winner here in Denver
Cutler was an overrated loser in Denver and is an overrated loser in Chicago.

regardless of the stats, a players true colors show up regardless of where they are playing.

and who is to say that Plummer couldn't win us a super bowl? get the guy a good RB and a few D playmakers and we probably get to and win the super bowl that year.

Cutler was not a needed pick. we had 2-1st rounders that year which we packaged up and used to work our way up to 11 to get Cutler, but we could have easily used both picks to get 2 top flight D talents to upgrade our defense, or used 1 for a RB and a Defensive help, regardless had those picks been used to upgrade the team as opposed to drafting Cutler our team in 2006 would have definitely been a contender and we wouldn't have sucked for the last 3 years

cutthemdown
11-30-2009, 11:57 PM
Look at the numbers for our receivers.

They are truly anemic. Royal is second with -- get this -- 31 catches.

We need a franchise QB -- who can scramble and throw the long ball accurately.

McDaniels I think will play out the first 2 yrs with Orton, develop Brandstater, and like you mention probably keep his eye out for a real stud in the draft. I doubt though Broncos go into draft saying we have to find a franchise QB.

IMO they will continue to add size to the OLINE and Dline. They will continue to look for linebackers and safety's that are versatile and play physical. I also think they will take another RB. I don't see both Jordan and Hillis back next yr. They will probably snag up a young runner later in the draft. IMO someone in that Kevin Faulk type role.

BroncoMan4ever
11-30-2009, 11:57 PM
Ill stab kittens if we draft Tebow McDaniels would truly be an idiot.

but no fear we wont draft tebow we don't need another fullback.

i'm allergic to cats. so if you are truly serious i hope McDaniels drafts Tebow and then you proceed to off the entire world's population of cats

cutthemdown
11-30-2009, 11:58 PM
Orton was a winner in Chicago and is a winner here in Denver
Cutler was an overrated loser in Denver and is an overrated loser in Chicago.

regardless of the stats, a players true colors show up regardless of where they are playing.

and who is to say that Plummer couldn't win us a super bowl? get the guy a good RB and a few D playmakers and we probably get to and win the super bowl that year.

Cutler was not a needed pick. we had 2-1st rounders that year which we packaged up and used to work our way up to 11 to get Cutler, but we could have easily used both picks to get 2 top flight D talents to upgrade our defense, or used 1 for a RB and a Defensive help, regardless had those picks been used to upgrade the team as opposed to drafting Cutler our team in 2006 would have definitely been a contender and we wouldn't have sucked for the last 3 years

In hindsight we should have stuck with Plummer. But lets see how Orton/Ayers/Smith end up. Maybe they wont make us feel so bad about it in a couple yrs.

cutthemdown
11-30-2009, 11:59 PM
i'm allergic to cats. so if you are truly serious i hope McDaniels drafts Tebow and then you proceed to off the entire world's population of cats

It's not the cat you are allergic to, its the dander!!!!! LOL someone said that one time to me and I was like.......ok who the **** cares, the dander comes off the friggin cat...

Then I threw his cat out the window.

Archer81
12-01-2009, 03:02 AM
Ill stab kittens if we draft Tebow McDaniels would truly be an idiot.

but no fear we wont draft tebow we don't need another fullback.

Tebow's passing stats.

2006 22 33 358 66.7 10.85 55 5 1 0 201.73
2007 234 350 3286 66.9 9.39 66 32 6 13 172.47
2008 192 298 2746 64.4 9.22 70 30 4 15 172.37
2009 162 244 2166 66.4 8.88 77 17 4 25 160.67


Clearly a little more than a glorified fullback. If the Broncos resign Orton and draft Tebow, McDaniels could work on Tebow's footwork and mechanics. It would not be a bad pick.

:Broncos:

Rabb
12-01-2009, 07:16 AM
Taylor ****ing Mays

let's not make the Ed Reed mistake again

oubronco
12-01-2009, 07:22 AM
Orton was a winner in Chicago and is a winner here in Denver
Cutler was an overrated loser in Denver and is an overrated loser in Chicago.

regardless of the stats, a players true colors show up regardless of where they are playing.

and who is to say that Plummer couldn't win us a super bowl? get the guy a good RB and a few D playmakers and we probably get to and win the super bowl that year.

Cutler was not a needed pick. we had 2-1st rounders that year which we packaged up and used to work our way up to 11 to get Cutler, but we could have easily used both picks to get 2 top flight D talents to upgrade our defense, or used 1 for a RB and a Defensive help, regardless had those picks been used to upgrade the team as opposed to drafting Cutler our team in 2006 would have definitely been a contender and we wouldn't have sucked for the last 3 years

No way does Plummer win us a superbowl he choked in almost every big game he played in but you gotta love the left handed throws Hilarious!

oubronco
12-01-2009, 07:24 AM
Tebow's passing stats.

2006 22 33 358 66.7 10.85 55 5 1 0 201.73
2007 234 350 3286 66.9 9.39 66 32 6 13 172.47
2008 192 298 2746 64.4 9.22 70 30 4 15 172.37
2009 162 244 2166 66.4 8.88 77 17 4 25 160.67


Clearly a little more than a glorified fullback. If the Broncos resign Orton and draft Tebow, McDaniels could work on Tebow's footwork and mechanics. It would not be a bad pick.

:Broncos:

The only reason his stats are inflated like that is his wr's are so wide open on almost every play and playing qb in college is totally different than the NPL

peacepipe
12-01-2009, 07:55 AM
Tebow's passing stats.

2006 22 33 358 66.7 10.85 55 5 1 0 201.73
2007 234 350 3286 66.9 9.39 66 32 6 13 172.47
2008 192 298 2746 64.4 9.22 70 30 4 15 172.37
2009 162 244 2166 66.4 8.88 77 17 4 25 160.67


Clearly a little more than a glorified fullback. If the Broncos resign Orton and draft Tebow, McDaniels could work on Tebow's footwork and mechanics. It would not be a bad pick.

:Broncos:

tebow will get converted to TE in the pros. No team,not even the Broncos, has the 3-4 yrs to spare to teach him how to play QB in the NFL.

Urban meyers offense isn't a very good system that prepares QBs for the NFL. As a matter of fact, it's a terrible system when it comes to preparing QBs for the NFL. Just ask the 49ers about how Alex Smith turned out for them.

Old Dude
12-01-2009, 08:23 AM
Build the OL's and DL's. Add some ILB depth too.

Ditto. Wiegman was already on the verge of retirement. Hamilton is probably done. We need a G/C but I don't think we need to go there until the 2d round at the earliest.

Our DL needs to get bigger and stronger. And Vonnie Holliday is no spring chicken.

I also think that at some point this team needs more depth at RB. Buckhalter and Moreno have looked very good at times, but Jordan is aging and hasn't been much of a factor. Hilis has disappeared.

You have to seriously wonder wheher Brandon Marshall will hang around next year. WR will be a need.

The ILB question has already been raised.

Given all these issues, I'd be tempted to try to trade down to get some additional first day picks.

UboBronco
12-01-2009, 08:36 AM
Hope this pick stays lower than Jacksonville, as they want Tebow for "Marketing and ticket sales", we then send our first, for their first, probably around 15-17, and pick up their 2nd, or maybe even the 2011 number one. I could live with that.

Hercules Rockefeller
12-01-2009, 08:45 AM
http://www.gbnreport.com/weeklydraftorder.html

Pick is at 10, Seattle is at 26

UboBronco
12-01-2009, 08:57 AM
http://www.gbnreport.com/weeklydraftorder.html

Pick is at 10, Seattle is at 26

I guess I was off by one slot, so come on Chicago, you have much more losing to do........

gtown
12-01-2009, 09:04 AM
I think we need to get look at these defensive players early in the draft:

Joe Haden - great cover corner and great blitzer. Looks NFL ready.
Eric Berry - best secondary player in the country bar none
Rolando McClain - great 3-4 ILB, but may look better than he is because of Cody
Terrance Cody - is only a two down player, but really creates havoc in the run game
Jerry Hughes - OLB/DE tweener that would serve as a bookend to Doom
Sergio Kindle - See Hughes
Colt McCoy - didn't like this guy initially, but the more tape I see the more I like him
Ryan Mallett - huge arm and size, needs better accuracy and mobility
Mike Iaputi - best interior OL besides O'Dowd
CJ Spiller - one of the best KR/PR in college football history

ColoradoBuff
12-01-2009, 09:11 AM
Taylor ****ing Mays

let's not make the Ed Reed mistake again

True dat!!!

Drek
12-01-2009, 09:24 AM
No way does Plummer win us a superbowl he choked in almost every big game he played in but you gotta love the left handed throws Hilarious!

Plummer choked in the playoffs. Jay Cutler choked a good four weeks before the playoffs even started.

Who's the bigger choker there?

azbroncfan
12-01-2009, 09:35 AM
Taylor ****ing Mays

let's not make the Ed Reed mistake again

Mays blows in coverage, looks lost in space and isn't disciplined at all. I think he might be the bust of the draft.

Rohirrim
12-01-2009, 09:40 AM
There might also be some really good juniors coming out, like Marvin Austin from UNC.

SoDak Bronco
12-01-2009, 09:42 AM
Mays blows in coverage, looks lost in space and isn't disciplined at all. I think he might be the bust of the draft.

He has Raiders all over him. Speed, Size, will suck in the Pros. Al Davis will fall in love with him.

ColoradoBuff
12-01-2009, 10:10 AM
Cody, Mays, McCain, Berry or Clausen please!

Rohirrim
12-01-2009, 10:16 AM
Taylor ****ing Mays

let's not make the Ed Reed mistake again

Taylor Mays is no Ed Reed. He doesn't play with the fire in his belly, like Reed does. Sometimes, he makes great plays, but sometimes, he doesn't.

BroncoMan4ever
12-01-2009, 10:51 AM
Way Bruton hits on ST's makes you wonder if the next Broncos topflight safety is not already on the roster.


:Broncos:

he is on the roster. his name is Josh Barrett

BroncoMan4ever
12-01-2009, 11:03 AM
tebow will get converted to TE in the pros. No team,not even the Broncos, has the 3-4 yrs to spare to teach him how to play QB in the NFL.

Urban meyers offense isn't a very good system that prepares QBs for the NFL. As a matter of fact, it's a terrible system when it comes to preparing QBs for the NFL. Just ask the 49ers about how Alex Smith turned out for them.

Tebow has a very similar skill set to VY, plus coming out of college he is much more football intelligent and mentally sound that Young was when he came out, and Young was still the number 3 overall pick in 06. He will at least begin his NFL career as a QB

there will be at least a few teams willing to take a shot on a guy like Tebow as a QB to groom and build up for a season or 2. look at the Aaron Rodgers situation. he wasn't expected to sit on the bench as long as he did, but he rode pine until the final year in his rookie deal, so it isnt a stretch that a team that is set at the postion for a couple of years wouldn't want to take Tebow.

Mr.Meanie
12-01-2009, 11:17 AM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if we went top-shelf CB in the 1st and top-shelf LG in the 2nd.... and developmental LB and DL in later rounds. And a punter... please.

BroncoMan4ever
12-01-2009, 11:19 AM
Ditto. Wiegman was already on the verge of retirement. Hamilton is probably done. We need a G/C but I don't think we need to go there until the 2d round at the earliest.

Our DL needs to get bigger and stronger. And Vonnie Holliday is no spring chicken.

I also think that at some point this team needs more depth at RB. Buckhalter and Moreno have looked very good at times, but Jordan is aging and hasn't been much of a factor. Hilis has disappeared.

You have to seriously wonder wheher Brandon Marshall will hang around next year. WR will be a need.

The ILB question has already been raised.

Given all these issues, I'd be tempted to try to trade down to get some additional first day picks.

i agree on depth at the RB position. Hillis is probably good as gone, Jordan doesn't see the field anymore, and behind Buck and Moreno there is nothing. that is something that can be addressed in the later rounds though so it isn't a pressing need on day 1 of the draft

if we offer Marshall a deal for 5 years at around 45 million like Roddy WHite got, he will shut his mouth and sing the praises of being a Bronco. it just depends on whether McDaniels wants to keep him here. Judging from the way that they seem to act with eachother during games, i believe Marshall is in McDaniels plans for the franchise's future, so WR is not a major day 1 need, depth behind he and Royal would be nice, because even though Gaffney has been decent he is not a long term option for us, and Stokley is another year older. youth and depth is a good thing at the WR position, but i would not draft WR in the 1st.

OL is my main concern. LG and C need to be addressed immediately. even if Weigman comes back for another year, we need someone waiting in the wings to take over. LG needs to be fixed now. Hochstein is filling in great, but he is not the long term answer. Depth is also a concern. Polumbus has been a really great surprise. took him a little time to gel with the rest of the line and get his timing down, but he has been pretty damn good for us, but after him we really don't have anyone that can step up in case of emergency.

DL even though it has gotten better, still needs to get bigger and stronger. I believe Baker is part of our plans for the future, so I am more concerned with the DEs. Baker and Fields in a rotation at the Nose seems like a good move

LBs especially the ILBs are the biggest concern for me in the front 7. Davis has been lights out for us, but DJ is the one who worries me. he is constantly out of place, making bad reads and tends to get washed out of plays. i am begining to believe more and more that the only way he can ever be truly successful is on a 4-3 team at the weak side LB position. i wouldn't be against trading him and drafting someone like McClain.

for me if i were in charge of this draft. i would go Front 7, OL, WR, RB, depth along the defensive and offensive lines as well as a punter and return man.

Rohirrim
12-01-2009, 11:51 AM
I really wonder how much of McClain is Cody.

Beantown Bronco
12-01-2009, 11:57 AM
I really wonder how much of McClain is Cody.

Just focus on McClain during the 65% of snaps Cody is on the sideline. :egbgb:

Rohirrim
12-01-2009, 12:07 PM
Just focus on McClain during the 65% of snaps Cody is on the sideline. :egbgb:

I think it's more like 33%. I figure if Cody can play only 2/3ds of the time and leave them at 3rd and long just about every time, that works too. :approve:

cartel
12-01-2009, 12:18 PM
i haven't read the entire thread, but i want more team speed and explosion. all of our playmakers lack incredible speed. royal has a little but seems lost in the system and champ is aging. we need a harvin or cj that can take an end around to the house. as everyone else says, interior line on both sides need depth. just want more explosive playmakers on both sides.

Rohirrim
12-01-2009, 12:22 PM
i haven't read the entire thread, but i want more team speed and explosion. all of our playmakers lack incredible speed. royal has a little but seems lost in the system and champ is aging. we need a harvin or cj that can take an end around to the house. as everyone else says, interior line on both sides need depth. just want more explosive playmakers on both sides.

Trindon Holliday, anybody? ;D

Tombstone RJ
12-01-2009, 12:25 PM
Huh...dejavu.


:Broncos:

This draft is much stronger on the dline. Broncos still need a lot of help in that area.

epicSocialism4tw
12-01-2009, 05:42 PM
Tebow has a very similar skill set to VY, plus coming out of college he is much more football intelligent and mentally sound that Young was when he came out, and Young was still the number 3 overall pick in 06. He will at least begin his NFL career as a QB

there will be at least a few teams willing to take a shot on a guy like Tebow as a QB to groom and build up for a season or 2. look at the Aaron Rodgers situation. he wasn't expected to sit on the bench as long as he did, but he rode pine until the final year in his rookie deal, so it isnt a stretch that a team that is set at the postion for a couple of years wouldn't want to take Tebow.

Tebow will go into the scouting combine with something to prove. His throwing mechanics are bad and he might not have a strong enough arm for the NFL. If Tebow doesnt change the scouts' mind, then he'll end up like Matt Jones. The thing of it is, Tebow really doesnt appear to have the measurables for the NFL. He's a big, tough kid with a great attitude and a strong competitive drive. He's more like a DE than an offensive skill player.

epicSocialism4tw
12-01-2009, 05:52 PM
I would absolutely love to see the Broncos pick up Sam Bradford because I think that Cherokee Sam is the perfect QB for the Broncos' new offense. He's super accurate, has a strong arm that delivers a tight ball, and he can make all the throws. Great attitude, great competitor...the guy has it all for a pocket QB. However, I dont see Sam lasting any further than St. Louis. Several of the teams at the top of the draft would love the chance at drafting a franchise QB, and Sam will probably be the first QB off of the board. Washington, Oakland, St. Louis, Cleveland, and Buffalo could all potentially draft Bradford.

I hope that the Broncos actually do some more scouting for this draft because that last one was a joke.

I think that Terrence Cody would be a solid pick.

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 05:59 PM
If we got a shot a Jake Locker I think we have to take it. The guy is a physical specimen and comes from the New Washington system which was USC's which was first BYU's! Have to be smart and quickminded, and would fit perfectly in McD's system. If not there are not many QBs that impress more than Brandstater will when he get some reps! Watch the guy on tape in college..not quite the mobility of Locker but his arm is stronger (which is saying alot) An Orton type manager wih mobility and bigger arm would be Max Hall from Byu. Upside: smart game manager (ala Orton) with good mobility and a much stronger arm than Orton and comes from the same system as Locker at a 3rd or 4th round price.

Other than QB (don't count out Brandstater) we go best player the first round...DL monster or LB orCB first choice. We need Center or Guard second round on the first time we can get a mauler.

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:01 PM
Bradford is a glass tiger! The guy is so fragile he won't work out in the pros...write it down! and his arm isn't all that. The guy bailed on his team to go for the money before they all figure it out!

Archer81
12-01-2009, 06:13 PM
Bradford is a glass tiger! The guy is so fragile he won't work out in the pros...write it down! and his arm isn't all that. The guy bailed on his team to go for the money before they all figure it out!


1. He's a senior. 2. He seperated his shoulder twice. 3. Who is they?


:Broncos:

epicSocialism4tw
12-01-2009, 06:16 PM
Bradford is a glass tiger! The guy is so fragile he won't work out in the pros...write it down! and his arm isn't all that. The guy bailed on his team to go for the money before they all figure it out!

You haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about.

Bradford is a better prospect coming out of Oklahoma than Tommie Harris or Adrian Peterson were.

Bradford has an excellent shot at not only playing well in the pro's, but his ceiling is at the height of the greats.

2KBack
12-01-2009, 06:19 PM
Tebow will go into the scouting combine with something to prove. His throwing mechanics are bad and he might not have a strong enough arm for the NFL. If Tebow doesnt change the scouts' mind, then he'll end up like Matt Jones. The thing of it is, Tebow really doesnt appear to have the measurables for the NFL. He's a big, tough kid with a great attitude and a strong competitive drive. He's more like a DE than an offensive skill player.

What exactly do you consider a measurable?

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:26 PM
You haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about.

Bradford is a better prospect coming out of Oklahoma than Tommie Harris or Adrian Peterson were.

Bradford has an excellent shot at not only playing well in the pro's, but his ceiling is at the height of the greats.

He opted for surgery (Bradford) instead of trying to come back for the last games of the season. He has minimal arm strength and limited mobility. And there are 5 or 6 better qbs in this draft than him..especially for our system!
Also he was getting owned by my BYU Cougars before he got hurt and would have been exposed as "Not so great" had he played the year. Give me Locker, Clausen, McCoy or Max Hall anyday before Scam Bradford!

epicSocialism4tw
12-01-2009, 06:27 PM
What exactly do you consider a measurable?

Everything that the scouts use drills to measure players with at the combine.

epicSocialism4tw
12-01-2009, 06:28 PM
He opted for surgery (Bradford) instead of trying to come back for the last games of the season. He has minimal arm strength and limited mobility. And there are 5 or 6 better qbs in this draft than him..especially for our system!
Also he was getting owned by my BYU Cougars before he got hurt and would have been exposed as "Not so great" had he played the year. Give me Locker, Clausen, McCoy or Max Hall anyday before Scam Bradford!

Wow.

From now on, whatever "Bronco Warrior" says...you can go ahead and mark me down for the exact opposite.

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:30 PM
1. He's a senior. 2. He seperated his shoulder twice. 3. Who is they?


:Broncos:

1.Opted for surgery half way through the year even though he could have played. 2. Um yeah twice in one year on minimal contact! 3. "They" is the Pro scouts who will now look at his over-rated Junior year on tape and base it on that instead of his weakass play (when healthy) as a Senior!

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:32 PM
Wow.

From now on, whatever "Bronco Warrior" says...you can go ahead and mark me down for the exact opposite.

Good! I hate retarded followers like you who just base your opinions on what ESPN's Mel Kiper says or buys any hype coming down the pike instead of making your own observations! I hope Bradford goes First..will give us (Bears pick) a chance to get a real QB in Locker!

2KBack
12-01-2009, 06:32 PM
He opted for surgery (Bradford) instead of trying to come back for the last games of the season. He has minimal arm strength and limited mobility. And there are 5 or 6 better qbs in this draft than him..especially for our system!
Also he was getting owned by my BYU Cougars before he got hurt and would have been exposed as "Not so great" had he played the year. Give me Locker, Clausen, McCoy or Max Hall anyday before Scam Bradford!

how was it he wasn't exposed as "not so great" the other two years he started, won a heisman, and accumulated 86 TD's to 16 ints?

Lev Vyvanse
12-01-2009, 06:38 PM
how was it he wasn't exposed as "not so great" the other two years he started, won a heisman, and accumulated 86 TD's to 16 ints?

Dude Lockers got good stats too. 33td and 26ints in the ****ing pac 10.ROFL!

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:41 PM
how was it he wasn't exposed as "not so great" the other two years he started, won a heisman, and accumulated 86 TD's to 16 ints?

I just don't seem to have the same high esteem for the guy as a lot of people on here so what? I've watched him play not that impressed. He got ate for lunch by what should have been an inferior BYU team, and looked like **** in the pocket. The hit he took wasn't that bad..wait till a Dawkins or Lewis gets a shot at that shoulder! As a guy who has had 3 shoulder separations, once you get the first one it's a timebomb waiting to happen. It's my opinion that's all. Neither one of our opinions is fact so don't all of you get your panties in a bunch!

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:43 PM
Dude Lockers got good stats too. 33td and 26ints in the ****ing pac 10.ROFL!

On a ****ty team! Tore USC a new rectum though didn't he! And he has three times the physical ability and his SYSTEM is more pro ready!

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:46 PM
For the record my stance is if we do take a QB take somebody with more upside like a Jake Locker. But don't count out Brandstater..he was a hella QB at Fresno St. Watch how many 60 plus yarders he hit recievers in stride and then we'll take ;)

Archer81
12-01-2009, 06:48 PM
1.Opted for surgery half way through the year even though he could have played. 2. Um yeah twice in one year on minimal contact! 3. "They" is the Pro scouts who will now look at his over-rated Junior year on tape and base it on that instead of his weakass play (when healthy) as a Senior!



1. How do you know he could have played? You his spiritual advisor as well? 2Have you ever played with a seperated shoulder? 3. He played a half before he got hurt...a whole "weak ass" half.


:Broncos:

Northman
12-01-2009, 06:51 PM
Punter 1st round.

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 06:52 PM
Punter 1st round.

But would he beat out the Bomber Berger? lol

2KBack
12-01-2009, 06:52 PM
On a ****ty team! Tore USC a new rectum though didn't he! And he has three times the physical ability and his SYSTEM is more pro ready!

you talking about that 16-13 hurting he put on USC without throwing a single TD? Pretty impressive, he almost had 250 yards too.

Archer81
12-01-2009, 06:53 PM
Punter 1st round.


Fullback.


Hilarious!


:Broncos:

Lev Vyvanse
12-01-2009, 06:55 PM
On a ****ty team! Tore USC a new rectum though didn't he! And he has three times the physical ability and his SYSTEM is more pro ready!

That was the D that tore USC a new one dumb****. 16 points.LOL

s0phr0syne
12-01-2009, 07:03 PM
I just don't seem to have the same high esteem for the guy as a lot of people on here so what? I've watched him play not that impressed. He got ate for lunch by what should have been an inferior BYU team, and looked like **** in the pocket. The hit he took wasn't that bad..wait till a Dawkins or Lewis gets a shot at that shoulder! As a guy who has had 3 shoulder separations, once you get the first one it's a timebomb waiting to happen. It's my opinion that's all. Neither one of our opinions is fact so don't all of you get your panties in a bunch!


It's just one shoulder separation that he didn't let heal completely.

I thought BYU played lights out against OU, and it's not like they beat Bradford per se. If you watched the game, OU's team was absolutely horrible on the OL with 4 new starters, and the 5th in a new position (Trent Williams cannot play LT at the pro level based on his performance as a senior. He is strictly RT material in my book)

Anyway, like others here, I think Bradford would be a good pick for our system. Unlike some others, I'm not convinced he will find success in EVERY system, but I do think he fits ours quite well. He's very cerebral. The only thing I worry about is his ability to mount comebacks. I'm not sure how many (if any) he was able to engineer while at OU...it's a problem often faced when trying to evaluate OU players :strong::strong: (they don't get behind often, in MOST seasons)

I was impressed by Max Hall, but I only saw him in the first game of the season. Could be a bargain bin pick as a backupQBOTF.

epicSocialism4tw
12-01-2009, 07:26 PM
It's just one shoulder separation that he didn't let heal completely.

I thought BYU played lights out against OU, and it's not like they beat Bradford per se. If you watched the game, OU's team was absolutely horrible on the OL with 4 new starters, and the 5th in a new position (Trent Williams cannot play LT at the pro level based on his performance as a senior. He is strictly RT material in my book)

Anyway, like others here, I think Bradford would be a good pick for our system. Unlike some others, I'm not convinced he will find success in EVERY system, but I do think he fits ours quite well. He's very cerebral. The only thing I worry about is his ability to mount comebacks. I'm not sure how many (if any) he was able to engineer while at OU...it's a problem often faced when trying to evaluate OU players :strong::strong: (they don't get behind often, in MOST seasons)

I was impressed by Max Hall, but I only saw him in the first game of the season. Could be a bargain bin pick as a backupQBOTF.

Bradford has played well in big games for OU. I dont recall the exact number of drops, but Oklahoma receivers basically lost the National Championship game for the Sooners. Time after time, they dropped balls in the red zone.

Bronco Warrior
12-01-2009, 07:45 PM
Max Hall plays in our exact system now...Bradford nothing close. Max Hall has lead a ton of masterful comebacks in his carreer and has thrown a ton more TDs than Bradford BUT.... He has choked in big games junior year and choked hard AT HOME against TCU and Florida State. He played great the rest of the year including OU and the "Holy War" game with our arch rivals Utah,,who shoulda won the Title last year. For the record Utah vs BYU is the nastiest college rivalry for the last 90 years! lol!

colonelbeef
12-01-2009, 09:44 PM
if the right QB is left, grab one, then go DL->CB->OG->LB

DL twice, just to be sure.

azbroncfan
12-01-2009, 10:05 PM
Max Hall plays in our exact system now...Bradford nothing close. Max Hall has lead a ton of masterful comebacks in his carreer and has thrown a ton more TDs than Bradford BUT.... He has choked in big games junior year and choked hard AT HOME against TCU and Florida State. He played great the rest of the year including OU and the "Holy War" game with our arch rivals Utah,,who shoulda won the Title last year. For the record Utah vs BYU is the nastiest college rivalry for the last 90 years! lol!

Let me guess Bronco Mendenhall invented the system we run now.

JCMElway
12-01-2009, 10:50 PM
Cody. Nuff said

I was high on Cody, but have read a couple of things that say he has bust potential. Says he's not too bright and doesn't have a great motor. Does not sound like a McDaniel's kind of guy. There's a great article over at milehighreport about it.

JCMElway
12-01-2009, 10:50 PM
I really think McClain will be available between 8-12. They are projecting him as a great ILB. We need to pounce on this guy if he is there.

Agreed.

Lolad
12-01-2009, 11:06 PM
We need to go QB if he's at the right spot in the 1st.. I'll take a chance on Bradford if he slips to the 2nd round. Then we need to go DL/LB in round 1. Then OG/C in rounds 3 or 4 throw in a CB/KR

cousinal11
12-02-2009, 07:40 AM
I don't think we're drafting a QB.

TailgateNut
12-02-2009, 08:01 AM
I think we should give their pick back, 'cause we ****ed them by giving them Jay.

Bawahahahah

Rabb
12-02-2009, 08:11 AM
I don't think we're drafting a QB.

me neither

TheElusiveKyleOrton
12-02-2009, 08:25 AM
Max Hall plays in our exact system now...Bradford nothing close. Max Hall has lead a ton of masterful comebacks in his carreer and has thrown a ton more TDs than Bradford BUT.... He has choked in big games junior year and choked hard AT HOME against TCU and Florida State. He played great the rest of the year including OU and the "Holy War" game with our arch rivals Utah,,who shoulda won the Title last year. For the record Utah vs BYU is the nastiest college rivalry for the last 90 years! lol!

WHO?

Utah/BYU does not touch -- not even close -- the rivalries of Army/Navy, Michigan/OSU, Florida/Tennessee, even Montana/Montana State.

If Max Hall is BYU's quarterback, how would he react to being cursed at? And is he going to have to go on a two year mission before we start playing him?

FAIL.

fontaine
12-02-2009, 08:26 AM
and who is to say that Plummer couldn't win us a super bowl? get the guy a good RB and a few D playmakers and we probably get to and win the super bowl that year.

Cutler was not a needed pick. we had 2-1st rounders that year which we packaged up and used to work our way up to 11 to get Cutler, but we could have easily used both picks to get 2 top flight D talents to upgrade our defense, or used 1 for a RB and a Defensive help, regardless had those picks been used to upgrade the team as opposed to drafting Cutler our team in 2006 would have definitely been a contender and we wouldn't have sucked for the last 3 years

I laughed my ass off from the very first sentence here to the last. Thanks.

But in all seriousness, if you think a QB like Plummer who
only had half an arm,
with half a brain,
and could only see half the field
could somehow win us a superbowl, then good luck to you man.

fontaine
12-02-2009, 08:40 AM
I have no way of verifying this but part of the reason why Bowlen brought in McDaniels in the first place was to get away from the pig headed, down right stupid finesse picks we made under Shanahan.

A bustathon of Lelie, Moss, Middlebrooks, Clarett, Paymah etc etc. I figure Bowlen looked at the way New England are built through the trenches and wanted some of that so I hope McDaniels goes for Front 7/OL in the first day.

Rohirrim
12-02-2009, 08:40 AM
That punter on Nebraska is pretty amazing.

Kaylore
12-02-2009, 08:42 AM
Max Hall plays in our exact system now...Bradford nothing close. Max Hall has lead a ton of masterful comebacks in his carreer and has thrown a ton more TDs than Bradford BUT.... He has choked in big games junior year and choked hard AT HOME against TCU and Florida State. He played great the rest of the year including OU and the "Holy War" game with our arch rivals Utah,,who shoulda won the Title last year. For the record Utah vs BYU is the nastiest college rivalry for the last 90 years! lol!

I love BYU and Max Hall sucks. He's a sixth round pick at best.

TheChamp24
12-02-2009, 09:53 AM
Okay, I gotta back up my boy Sam Bradford here.
All this talk about how Sam has minimal arm strength, lacks mobility, "sucked" against BYU, uh yeah right.
Watch last years throws he made, he threw long touchdown completions, IN STRIDE, of 50+ yards. If you say Bradford lacks the arm strength, then I guess Tom Brady does too.
His mobility I guess was called into question due to this season, but it is fine. Again, he has the mobility to get out of the pocket, throw on the run or scramble for some yards. He isn't a speedster, but he doesn't exactly lack mobility. The two times he got hurt this year were on two blitz plays, the one against BYU the OL let a LB run right free and Bradford had to scramble quickly and threw a decent pass on the run while getting hit, and the other was a designed rollout right into a blitzer who easily took Bradford down as he was right there.
As for him "sucking" against BYU, he was 10-14 for 96 yards and 1 TD. Not great, but the OL was dreadful that game and it didn't help matters when OU had 2 turnovers deep in BYU territory, fumbles by Murray and Broyles that would've most likely led to points.
Also, in the NC game last year against Florida, the 2 interceptions Bradford threw hit his receivers right in the hands.
I think he would be a good fit for this system due to his accuracy, smart decision making and a good enough arm. I don't know where he will go though, but I also don't think we should take a QB in the 1st round.

As for who I think we should look at, well, I'm thinking defensive.
Eric Berry
Sergio Kindle
Rolando McClain
Joe Haden
Terrence Cody
Brandon Spikes
Corey Wootton

Tombstone RJ
12-02-2009, 01:04 PM
Punter 1st round.

McD should go all "Al Davis" and piss away all these picks.

Draft the fastest WR at the combine (or the heisman trophy winner) come hell or high water, then take a punter and a CB in the second round.

;) I kid because I care...

oubronco
12-02-2009, 01:07 PM
Fullback.


Hilarious!


:Broncos:

or a long snapper DOH!

Br0nc0Buster
12-02-2009, 01:13 PM
A short list of players I like that I think we have a shot at in the early teens are:
Rolando McClain
Joe Haden
and if Josh fell in love with one of the qbs not named Tebow or McCoy I wouldnt mind that as well

elpasojoe
12-02-2009, 01:42 PM
If the draft took place today we would get the tenth pick from Chicago. Correct me if I am wrong, but the Broncos have not had a Top-Ten pick in some 15 years (1993, the Nebraska Linebacker). I would look at ILB, OG and NT as our biggest needs for the first three picks, BPA for everything else. Since there probably won't be a DT or OG worthy of the top ten, Cody of Alabama and Iupati of Idaho would be reaches, Rolando McClain, ilb Alabama would be perfect: stout against the run and at 4.6 can cover recievers and tight ends over the middle. Reportedly intelligent and hard working. Great player to continue building around.
Round Two: there will be some DT/NT prospects during our portion of the second round. The guard prospect of Idaho: Iupati is expected to be gone late first round (rare for a guard) or early second. I would lean towards Dan Williams of Tenn or the DT from Penn State.
Round three: Sergio Bender of Virginia Tech or Mick Pouncey of Florida; big and talented prospects from good schools and conferences.

I would be delighted with this haul from the first three picks

azbroncfan
12-02-2009, 01:47 PM
Build the trenches please.

Jerry Curl
12-02-2009, 01:50 PM
Max Hall plays in our exact system now...Bradford nothing close. Max Hall has lead a ton of masterful comebacks in his carreer and has thrown a ton more TDs than Bradford BUT.... He has choked in big games junior year and choked hard AT HOME against TCU and Florida State. He played great the rest of the year including OU and the "Holy War" game with our arch rivals Utah,,who shoulda won the Title last year. For the record Utah vs BYU is the nastiest college rivalry for the last 90 years! lol!

My homer alert is going off the charts here.

If we're at this point at the end of the season then I'd say Rolando McClain for sure but I wouldn't mind if Chicago kept losing and bumping us up in the draft.

colonelbeef
12-02-2009, 06:46 PM
Look at the numbers for our receivers.

They are truly anemic. Royal is second with -- get this -- 31 catches.

We need a franchise QB -- who can scramble and throw the long ball accurately.

Yep. Orton is the caretaker, nothing more. The OL and receivers deserve better.