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oubronco
11-23-2009, 06:28 PM
Moreno and Marshall go head-to-head after the RB fumbles the ball.
By Lindsay H. Jones
The Denver Post
Posted: 11/23/2009 01:00:00 AM MST

So much for the notion of the Broncos taking the frustrations of a month's worth of losses out on their opponent.

In Sunday's loss to San Diego, the Broncos' anger appeared on their own sideline, in the form of a brief shouting-and-shoving match that erupted between receiver Brandon Marshall and running back Knowshon Moreno.

Marshall, 6-feet-4, 230 pounds and with a personality at least as big, twice bumped himself up face mask to face mask with Moreno in the moments after the rookie running back lost a fumble into the end zone in the second quarter.

The message Marshall was sending to Moreno was that "we've got to pick it up," the receiver said afterward.

In return, Moreno gave Marshall a forceful shove in the chest.

"It's frustrating, those are plays that kill drives, and we've got to punch it in next time," Marshall said.

Both players downplayed the scene after the game, playing it off as a heat-of-the-moment airing of frustrations, but the messy exchange between two of the Broncos' biggest name players perhaps illuminates a bigger issue: The Broncos haven't just lost four games in a row, they've begun to lose their cool too.
"We've got a lot of emotional players on our team; I'm an emotional person myself," coach Josh McDaniels said. "I'm not saying it's good, as long as people can work those things out. Obviously, you don't want to make scenes, to make problems."

Moreno's fumble the fourth he's lost this season couldn't have happened at a worse time. With six seconds before the two-minute warning at the end of the first half, the Broncos were trailing 13-0. But they had reclaimed momentum with Kyle Orton's entrance into the game and had moved to the 4-yard line in only three plays.

Moreno bulled forward close to the goal line, and as he was falling forward reaching for the end zone, he was spun sideways, and the ball popped loose. The strip was officially credited to defensive end Jacques Cesaire, though it appeared it was the right knee of Broncos lineman Russ Hochstein that actually sent the ball into the end zone, where it was covered by safety Steve Gregory.

"Those are situations we want to capitalize on, and I was just trying to do too much, forgetting that we have three more downs," Moreno said. "You can't have those if you want to win."

Marshall said he didn't regret anything he said to Moreno after the fumble, but admitted that perhaps he "handled it wrong." Marshall said he would expect similar criticism from his teammates if he messed up.

"This is a game where you've got to have passion, and none of us can make any terrible plays," said Marshall, who caught three passes for 26 yards.

And now that his tiff with Moreno is over as both players said it is Marshall said he was turning his focus inward in preparation for Thursday's game against the New York Giants.

"I think everyone needs to look at themselves first," Marshall said. "I'm going to look at film of myself, and see what I'm doing wrong, what I changed from last year, how can I help move the ball down the field?"

http://www.denverpost.com/premium/broncos/ci_13847979

well everyone was speculating what was said, there you go

orinjkrush
11-23-2009, 07:26 PM
moreno should sit and work on his ball handling via tiki barber.

then he might be helpful....

SJ Bronco
11-23-2009, 07:31 PM
moreno should sit and work on his ball handling via tiki barber.

then he might be helpful....

Can we afford to sit him? We're a bit thin at RB right now..i don't know, he looked like he learned his lesson based on the way he protected the ball like it was his daughters virginity the rest of the game...

orinjkrush
11-23-2009, 07:35 PM
finger pointing always accompanies teams in trouble.

SJ Bronco
11-23-2009, 07:40 PM
finger pointing always accompanies teams in trouble.

this is true, but sometimes airing animosity can also get out the kinks and bring guys closer together.

tsiguy96
11-23-2009, 07:42 PM
atleast moreno is shining for us, hes gonna be very good as soon as he settles down a bit and stop fumbling.

SJ Bronco
11-23-2009, 07:44 PM
atleast moreno is shining for us, hes gonna be very good as soon as he settles down a bit and stop fumbling.

the thing is, he fumbles because of extra effort, not necessarily carelessness. I think he'll iron it out with experience...

tsiguy96
11-23-2009, 07:56 PM
the thing is, he fumbles because of extra effort, not necessarily carelessness. I think he'll iron it out with experience...

thats what im saying, he needs to settle down and realize where it is and isnt worth going the extra mile (he even said that in his last quote). as far as actual running ability, hes playing great, best rookie in the NFL, regardless of how the idiots want to convince you that beanie is better because his ypc is better.

Dagmar
11-23-2009, 08:06 PM
atleast moreno is shining for us, hes gonna be very good as soon as he settles down a bit and stop fumbling.

He's only fumbled twice. In 142 carries. Reed killed him and a lineman kneed the ball away yesterday.

SouthStndJunkie
11-23-2009, 09:13 PM
He's only fumbled twice. In 142 carries. Reed killed him and a lineman kneed the ball away yesterday.

I think Knowshon has fumbled 4 times and lost all 4 of them on the year.

The stats only show 2 lost while running the ball, but he has lost 2 on receptions as well.

PRBronco
11-23-2009, 09:19 PM
He's only fumbled twice. In 142 carries. Reed killed him and a lineman kneed the ball away yesterday.

Everyone needs to read this and get it through their heads.

Br0nc0Buster
11-23-2009, 09:53 PM
He's only fumbled twice. In 142 carries. Reed killed him and a lineman kneed the ball away yesterday.

He has fumbled 4 times and lost all of them

Popps
11-23-2009, 09:56 PM
I think Knowshon has fumbled 4 times and lost all 4 of them on the year.

The stats only show 2 lost while running the ball, but he has lost 2 on receptions as well.

To be fair, one fumble was on Ed Reed being shot out of a cannon, and the other wasn't a fumble.

If you Tivo'd the game, watch him carrying the ball. He carries it with 2 arms, like a newborn infant. The dude is trying to take care of the football. Stretching the ball over the goal-line and hitting a knee (after the ball crossed) was just bad luck.

I'm not saying he can't take better care of the ball, but if he fumbled 4 times... two were unusual circumstances. It's not like he's flinging the ball out wildly when he runs.

Let's look at a larger sample group of carries before we call him a fumbler.

DBroncos4life
11-23-2009, 10:00 PM
So fumbles don't count now when someone hits you hard?

SouthStndJunkie
11-23-2009, 10:34 PM
To be fair, one fumble was on Ed Reed being shot out of a cannon, and the other wasn't a fumble.

If you Tivo'd the game, watch him carrying the ball. He carries it with 2 arms, like a newborn infant. The dude is trying to take care of the football. Stretching the ball over the goal-line and hitting a knee (after the ball crossed) was just bad luck.

I'm not saying he can't take better care of the ball, but if he fumbled 4 times... two were unusual circumstances. It's not like he's flinging the ball out wildly when he runs.

Let's look at a larger sample group of carries before we call him a fumbler.

I'm not writing him off in any way....I think he will continue to learn and become a very good RB for us.

I am simply stating that he has lost 4 fumbles when some stated that he had only lost 2 all year.

Popps
11-23-2009, 10:44 PM
I'm not writing him off in any way....I think he will continue to learn and become a very good RB for us.

I am simply stating that he has lost 4 fumbles when some stated that he had only lost 2 all year.

Fair enough.

I'd just like to see the guy get enough carries to get in a rhythm. But, that's tough when we're falling behind, which we have as of late.

ZONA
11-24-2009, 02:28 AM
"Those are situations we want to capitalize on, and I was just trying to do too much, forgetting that we have three more downs," Moreno said. "You can't have those if you want to win."

Thank you. The rookie should understand this stuff. This is something that is coached in HS football. To try and reach for it in a crowd is never a good thing. If you have an open field with maybe somebody hanging onto your leg, then okay, reach the ball across. Otherwise, protect that thing, you got 2 more plays left.

BossChief
11-24-2009, 02:58 AM
This is the **** that happens to a young team that has lost 4 straight and is facing a run of teams that will be hard to beat.

I bet anything that the players respect Dawkins leadership more so than the coach at this point.

watermock
11-24-2009, 03:03 AM
IMO BM should of kept his mouth shut.

LG knocked it out.

BossChief
11-24-2009, 03:05 AM
IMO BM should of kept his mouth shut.

LG knocked it out.

BM is showing signs of leadership and you think he should just stfu? This is a joke right? That's probably it, it has to be a joke.

watermock
11-24-2009, 03:32 AM
No, he has issues, as Popps might explain.

He didn't even know what happened on the play.

Buy a clue.

meangene
11-24-2009, 03:50 AM
Analysis: When push comes to shove, Marshall wrong
By Mike Klis
The Denver Post
Posted: 11/24/2009 01:00:00 AM MST

Push him again, Knowshon.

Brandon Marshall was wrong for showing up Moreno after the Broncos' rookie running back fumbled the ball away in the first half as he tried reaching across the goal line Sunday against the San Diego Chargers.

And Marshall was wrong again in the second half for showing up quarterback Kyle Orton on a pass that sailed beyond the endline, well out of Marshall's reach.

No doubt, Moreno's fumble was a killer. It was exasperating.

But it's when frustration reaches its zenith that teams must hold it together.

Marshall's animated actions were divisive.

In Marshall's defense, I do think he thought he was doing right for the sake of the team. I do think he thought he needed to step up and be a leader for Moreno's sake.

Marshall's not a bad guy. And he is a smart guy, smarter than people know.

But sometimes smart guys don't make smart decisions, especially when they are also emotional guys.

Some guys were born to lead. Some guys were born to follow. And then there are guys like Marshall who were put on this earth to do their own thing.

Moreno, who is as conscientious as they come, justifiably pushed Marshall away.

Marshall committed arguably the most costly turnover of the 2008 season. The Broncos were 3-0 going into Kansas City to play the 0-3 Chiefs.

The Broncos were up 7-6 and had the ball near midfield when Marshall fumbled away a reverse. The Chiefs returned his fumble to the 1-yard line, from where Larry Johnson easily scored a go-ahead touchdown.

The Broncos lost that game one of only two the Chiefs won last season. And in the end, the Broncos lost the AFC West by a tiebreaker.
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Have to say I agree with Klis on this one. I have been bothered by Marshall's body language all season. It is one thing to be emotional but it is another to show your frustration in negative ways or to show up teammates.
Marshall is still the same guy underneath despite all the talent. He is toeing the line right now only in hopes of a big contract this offseason. We really need to think long and hard whether this is a guy we want to commit big bucks to. How will he act once he gets a deal?

BossChief
11-24-2009, 04:13 AM
Buy a clue.

really? buy a clue? very witty!


I would be happy about a young player of mine that is a probowler and showing enough emotion over a turnover that he is willing to call out a teammate during a game.

Right or wrong, it is a good sign imo. He stepped up and showed leadership quality and that is a valuable trait when it comes to winning football games.

watermock
11-24-2009, 04:21 AM
Hey, I didn't make the pick early in round 1.

Hes a fumbler. In this case he got it booted out from his lead blocker.

TD would of fumbled that.

watermock
11-24-2009, 04:23 AM
BTW, he was in.

long beach bronco
11-24-2009, 05:23 AM
I remember when Tatum Bell fumbled four times during the whole season and we were ready to castrate him and run him out of town, and to this day still hasn't lived that down. Moreno has fumbled seven times and lost four and he still gets a pass. This offense starts at quaterback and our qb's aren't that good. No pocket awarness, no escapability in the pocket, no throwing downfield, great offensive weapons not being used right. We seem to be more into keeping the ball away from the other team as opposed to scoring and moving the ball downfield. Just a shame to watch. It doesn't matter how many playmakers you have on offense, if your qb is not one of them, the team will reflect the qb's abilities.

yerner
11-24-2009, 05:33 AM
two retards tryin to **** a doorknob

Bronco Yoda
11-24-2009, 05:37 AM
I can't blame that fumble on KM. He was protecting it properly. It was just a feak hit by his own lineman. IMO it was a TD also.

however...

Maybe....just maybe.... Scheffler & Hillis shouldn't be sitting on the sideline when we're inside the 10 yard line.

...Just a crazy thought there.

long beach bronco
11-24-2009, 05:49 AM
You maybe right master Yoda, this offense is putrid, and here we have the solutions sitting on the bench. Sheff at least should be catching all kinds of balls, but he has vanished and that's Mcd and our qb's fault.

barryr
11-24-2009, 07:10 AM
Moreno can't sit since Buckhalter hasn't been hanging onto the ball any better than him. Jordan doesn't usually fumble, so I guess could give him more carries.

db56
11-24-2009, 01:15 PM
I can't blame that fumble on KM. He was protecting it properly. It was just a feak hit by his own lineman. IMO it was a TD also.

however...

Maybe....just maybe.... Scheffler & Hillis shouldn't be sitting on the sideline when we're inside the 10 yard line.

...Just a crazy thought there.

exactly.. I enjoy the shotgun offense as much as the next guy, but the red zone is reserved for running the ball with a big back(Hillis) and the play action pass, throwing to the TE(Sheffler) maybe....