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Hercules Rockefeller
11-22-2009, 09:24 PM
4-6, for all intents and purposes they don't have much of a shot of making the playoffs at this point, however winning out and going 10-6 could obviously do it.

Where they're picking starts to matter once they've been mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, and the first step comes next week.

Weeks 12: Chicago (4-6) @ Minnesota (9-1)

A Vikings win next week eliminates the Bears from any shot at winning the NFC North.

Current WC standings:

Philly 6-4
GB 6-4
NYG 6-4
Atlanta 5-5
San Fran 4-6
Carolina 4-6
Chicago 4-6

Bears are 2-5 in the conference (ouch!) and have lost head-to-heads with 4 of the 6 teams ahead of them (Philly, GB, Atlanta, and San Fran).

The pick stands at #11-14 right now.

NFLBRONCO
11-22-2009, 09:39 PM
How many games do you think Bears can win?

Finger Roll
11-22-2009, 09:41 PM
6 or 7

Popps
11-22-2009, 09:42 PM
11-14 is friggin perfect.

Just out of the mega-price-tag range, but high enough to get an impact player.

~Crash~
11-22-2009, 09:44 PM
11-14 is friggin perfect.

Just out of the mega-price-tag range, but high enough to get an impact player.

No perfect would be 2 1st round picks .

Hercules Rockefeller
11-22-2009, 09:56 PM
11-14 is friggin perfect.

Just out of the mega-price-tag range, but high enough to get an impact player.

There is no rookie cap next year (or salary cap), there are going to be more holdouts than usual and the slotting system is going to go to ****.

SoCalBronco
11-22-2009, 10:13 PM
No perfect would be 2 1st round picks .

Agreed

Denver724
11-22-2009, 10:14 PM
No perfect would be 2 1st round picks .

You said it. Al Smith sucks balls.

Xenos
11-22-2009, 10:28 PM
There is no rookie cap next year (or salary cap), there are going to be more holdouts than usual and the slotting system is going to go to ****.
That's in 2011. 2010 is suppose to be uncapped except for the little clause in the CBA that only increases the cap by 30%. So it's not the true uncap year.

Popps
11-22-2009, 10:40 PM
No perfect would be 2 1st round picks .

Maybe. We'll see. A low to low-mid first round pick next year would have just had us taking a player like A. Smith, anyway.

We got the kid a year early, didn't pay much for him and hopefully he'll develop.

SoCalBronco
11-22-2009, 11:15 PM
You said it. Al Smith sucks balls.

He doesn't suck balls, but he's not exactly lighting the world on fire, either. Due consideration should be made for the fact that he's only a rookie, but he hasn't really had much of an impact in any substantial way. I would have liked to have seen some more progress by now, especially given what we gave up for him. While it is true that DEN did not really give up a "Top 5-10 pick" for him as we feared, it seems the probable loss here is a first round pick about in the middle of the round. That's still not a good exchange as compared to an early 2nd. It also seems that this will be a stronger year in terms of 3-4 DL prospects as well, so that is problematic from the standpoint of the lost pick. Overall, so far, it seems like a net loss. If we had two firsts, we could make a move up to get another franchise QB (Locker), or DEN would be able to nab the top interior OL as well as a top DL with the picks, or one of those two plus a mid first QB. It would have been a nice asset to have. Hopefully, Alphonso can turn it up a notch. He DEFINITELY has the ball skills. I've seen it first hand. It's just a matter of avoiding the rookie wall and adapting to the league over time.

Popps
11-22-2009, 11:24 PM
He doesn't suck balls, but he's not exactly lighting the world on fire, either. Due consideration should be made for the fact that he's only a rookie, but he hasn't really had much of an impact in any substantial way. I would have liked to have seen some more progress by now, especially given what we gave up for him. While it is true that DEN did not really give up a "Top 5-10 pick" for him as we feared, it seems the probable loss here is a first round pick about in the middle of the round. That's still not a good exchange as compared to an early 2nd. It also seems that this will be a stronger year in terms of 3-4 DL prospects as well, so that is problematic from the standpoint of the lost pick. Overall, so far, it seems like a net loss. If we had two firsts, we could make a move up to get another franchise QB (Locker), or DEN would be able to nab the top interior OL as well as a top DL with the picks, or one of those two plus a mid first QB. It would have been a nice asset to have. Hopefully, Alphonso can turn it up a notch. He DEFINITELY has the ball skills. I've seen it first hand. It's just a matter of avoiding the rookie wall and adapting to the league over time.

I'd say that's all pretty fair. I'm disappointed that he's not active. It's a bummer.

But, I'm also going to hold out judgment. I think McD expects a lot from guys, and after a 6-0 start, perhaps his mindset began to change from one of rebuilding, to... "****, we'd better make something out of this start."
Maybe that's led to some of the younger guys losing time.

I hope they can claw their way back, though. Obviously, they're our future.

bpc
11-23-2009, 01:50 AM
A. Smith has been a huge disappointment.

That will be further exhibited when the Bears pick and our previous 1st rounder, now Seattle's, will be very close to one another in a draft MUCH deeper than last year's.

We traded a 1st this year for a 2nd last year, to draft a small, slow CB who has good ball skills. In the process, Ty Law and his one good leg was signed away from his couch mid-season and has taken all of Smith's reps.

So basically he's improving by chilling on the bench. Excellent.

I fear we're going to be regretting this trade for awhile. Hell, that trade may have cost us landing two studs this April like Joe Haden and Rolondo McClain. Those are cornerstones that are not easily replaced.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-23-2009, 08:44 AM
Agreed

Of course you do, and then in April you'd advocate trading down about 8 times to accumlate picks. Then you'd want them to do a shotgun approach, and if that didn't pan out, you'll be here in 2-3 years whining about how bad the draft was because for some odd reason, they didn't net any Pro Bowlers with all the picks they had in the 4th and 5th rounds while other teams who stayed put where the talent is, are pleased with their drafts.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-23-2009, 08:46 AM
How many games do you think Bears can win?

@Minny
StL
Green Bay
@Baltimore
Minny
@Detroit

4 more losses would be nice.

baja
11-23-2009, 08:49 AM
@Minny
StL
Green Bay
@Baltimore
Minny
@Detroit

4 more losses would be nice.

I see 4 clear losses and 2 clear wins

Crushaholic
11-23-2009, 08:50 AM
@Minny
StL
Green Bay
@Baltimore
Minny
@Detroit

4 more losses would be nice.

A sweep by the Vikings, and losses to Green Bay and Baltimore are CERTAINLY possible...

Hercules Rockefeller
11-23-2009, 08:54 AM
I see 4 clear losses and 2 clear wins

I think the last game against Detroit might be a little closer than people expect. Bears will be out of it at that point, you'll have to wonder what their motivation is going to be after all the hype and promise they had coming into the season. On the flip side, Detroit's been playing for pride and just attempting to get better as the season progresses since they've known all along they weren't playing in the postseason.

baja
11-23-2009, 08:55 AM
A sweep by the Vikings, and losses to Green Bay and Baltimore are CERTAINLY possible...

That would make 6 & 10 good enough for a top 12 pick I would think.

Denver724
11-23-2009, 09:05 AM
A. Smith has been a huge disappointment.

That will be further exhibited when the Bears pick and our previous 1st rounder, now Seattle's, will be very close to one another in a draft MUCH deeper than last year's.

We traded a 1st this year for a 2nd last year, to draft a small, slow CB who has good ball skills. In the process, Ty Law and his one good leg was signed away from his couch mid-season and has taken all of Smith's reps.

So basically he's improving by chilling on the bench. Excellent.

I fear we're going to be regretting this trade for awhile. Hell, that trade may have cost us landing two studs this April like Joe Haden and Rolondo McClain. Those are cornerstones that are not easily replaced.

I could not have said it any better myself. We will regret this trade based on the talent available next year. Although, McD may have something up his sleeve (letting Marshall go for a #1, etc.). Moves like this would not surprise me at all.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-23-2009, 09:13 AM
That would make 6 & 10 good enough for a top 12 pick I would think.

The last 5 years, 6-10 has netted:

'09
9th pick (GB was the only 6-10 last year)

'08
None in the '07 regular season, would have been the 8th pick if there had been one

'07
7-9

'06
11-14

'05
8-12

Traveler
11-23-2009, 09:20 AM
Where does the pick we gave to Seattle shake out at this point?

Rohirrim
11-23-2009, 09:28 AM
Who knows, we might get within reach of Suh.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-23-2009, 09:29 AM
Where does the pick we gave to Seattle shake out at this point?

18-24 are where the 6-4 teams are at this point, ties are broke based on SOS (not doing the playoff tiebreakers at this point) and there's will be pretty good. I'm guessing closer to 24 than to 18.

NFLBRONCO
11-23-2009, 09:41 AM
Can we hope for 5-11

Crushaholic
11-23-2009, 09:58 AM
Can we hope for 5-11

We CAN hope for 5-11, but I don't see the Bears losing to the Rams or the Lions...

Circle Orange
11-23-2009, 09:19 PM
6 or 7

bottoming out at 7-9. Enjoy Chicago, Cutler. :clown:

NFLBRONCO
11-23-2009, 10:45 PM
We CAN hope for 5-11, but I don't see the Bears losing to the Rams or the Lions...

I agree really but, I think the Lions can beat them if they play good and its at least in Det.

Cito Pelon
11-23-2009, 10:54 PM
A. Smith has been a huge disappointment.

That will be further exhibited when the Bears pick and our previous 1st rounder, now Seattle's, will be very close to one another in a draft MUCH deeper than last year's.

We traded a 1st this year for a 2nd last year, to draft a small, slow CB who has good ball skills. In the process, Ty Law and his one good leg was signed away from his couch mid-season and has taken all of Smith's reps.

So basically he's improving by chilling on the bench. Excellent.

I fear we're going to be regretting this trade for awhile. Hell, that trade may have cost us landing two studs this April like Joe Haden and Rolondo McClain. Those are cornerstones that are not easily replaced.

Ah, STFU for the time being. You can come back next September and kick me in the nuts, but for the time being STFU.

Popps
11-23-2009, 11:04 PM
A. Smith has been a huge disappointment.

That will be further exhibited when the Bears pick and our previous 1st rounder, now Seattle's, will be very close to one another in a draft MUCH deeper than last year's.

We traded a 1st this year for a 2nd last year, to draft a small, slow CB who has good ball skills. In the process, Ty Law and his one good leg was signed away from his couch mid-season and has taken all of Smith's reps.

So basically he's improving by chilling on the bench. Excellent.

I fear we're going to be regretting this trade for awhile. Hell, that trade may have cost us landing two studs this April like Joe Haden and Rolondo McClain. Those are cornerstones that are not easily replaced.


I love how your story keeps changing, Chris.

First we were doomed because we lost Cutler. Then, that sort of went away. (I wonder why.)

Now you're moving on to nonsense like this.

Yea, we'll be "regretting" losing a few later first round draft slots for YEARS.
ROFL!

We're still on the hook for salaries of guys like Javon Walker, Travis Henry and Boss Bailey, but losing a few draft slots is really going to bring the franchise to its knees.

But, after such a wildly successful decade of front office management by our staff over the last decade, I can see why you have such rigid standards.

9 years of awful drafts. Over a decade with so few impact free agents you can count them on one hand.

But, suddenly you've got rigid standards, huh? So rigid that you're willing to write off Smith midway through his first season.

Very logical, man. No standards for a decade... and now absolutely irrational, illogical standards after 10 games.

Keep up the great work!

Gort
11-24-2009, 03:56 AM
We CAN hope for 5-11, but I don't see the Bears losing to the Rams or the Lions...

Cutler has a loss to the Lions on his resume already. it could happen again. :)

fontaine
11-24-2009, 04:03 AM
:strong:
But, after such a wildly successful decade of front office management by our staff over the last decade, I can see why you have such rigid standards.

9 years of awful drafts. Over a decade with so few impact free agents you can count them on one hand.

But, suddenly you've got rigid standards, huh? So rigid that you're willing to write off Smith midway through his first season.

Very logical, man. No standards for a decade... and now absolutely irrational, illogical standards after 10 games.

Keep up the great work!

No kidding. Willie Middlebrooks, Deltha O'Neil, Paymah, Foxworth, LeSeur etc etc there wasn't a DB that we drafted high that didn't bust.

Not to mention Maurice Clarett, other DL that just disapeared from camp (Eason?), and picks that are stilling busting to this day like Jarvis Moss, and WRs that were afraid to compete like Lelie.

The way I see it the current FO is already miles ahead of the previous one purely based on the fact that they got anything out of Ty Law.

Not to mention the biggest kick in the balls when Rodney Harrison was dying to play in Denver years ago and Shanahan completely ignored him.

gtown
11-24-2009, 07:42 AM
:strong:

No kidding. Willie Middlebrooks, Deltha O'Neil, Paymah, Foxworth, LeSeur etc etc there wasn't a DB that we drafted high that didn't bust.

Not to mention Maurice Clarett, other DL that just disapeared from camp (Eason?), and picks that are stilling busting to this day like Jarvis Moss, and WRs that were afraid to compete like Lelie.

The way I see it the current FO is already miles ahead of the previous one purely based on the fact that they got anything out of Ty Law.

Not to mention the biggest kick in the balls when Rodney Harrison was dying to play in Denver years ago and Shanahan completely ignored him.

I can't believe how bad our drafts were earlier this decade. What a mess. Besides DJ, who else was an impact player from those years? Shanny was in way over his head.

The acquisitions we have brought in this year have almost all been impact. Dawkins, Holliday, Goodman, Hill, etc etc. Even the recent acquisitions of Berger and Law have looked better in practice than on paper initially.

I think the Bears finish 6-10 or 7-9. That's a sweet spot. Not a top ten pick, but high enough to get an impact player.

BroncoDoug
11-24-2009, 08:14 AM
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=346961

here is a pretty good site that can keep track of the draft picks...

Rohirrim
11-24-2009, 08:16 AM
Damn, we're looking at #10 right now? That's definitely Mount Cody territory. ;D

BroncoDoug
11-24-2009, 08:20 AM
Damn, we're looking at #10 right now? That's definitely Mount Cody territory. ;D

well 10-14, this doesn't account the tie breakers quite yet...

elsid13
11-24-2009, 08:25 AM
I love how your story keeps changing, Chris.

First we were doomed because we lost Cutler. Then, that sort of went away. (I wonder why.)

Now you're moving on to nonsense like this.

Yea, we'll be "regretting" losing a few later first round draft slots for YEARS.
ROFL!

We're still on the hook for salaries of guys like Javon Walker, Travis Henry and Boss Bailey, but losing a few draft slots is really going to bring the franchise to its knees.

But, after such a wildly successful decade of front office management by our staff over the last decade, I can see why you have such rigid standards.

9 years of awful drafts. Over a decade with so few impact free agents you can count them on one hand.

But, suddenly you've got rigid standards, huh? So rigid that you're willing to write off Smith midway through his first season.

Very logical, man. No standards for a decade... and now absolutely irrational, illogical standards after 10 games.

Keep up the great work!

The biggest salary cap hits are Bly and Cutler both McDaniels moves. The cap was in good shape before those moves.

NFLBRONCO
11-24-2009, 09:24 AM
Do you think Bowlen will open his wallet this offseason? What about Champ $$$ wise do we keep him past this year or not?

colonelbeef
11-24-2009, 10:19 AM
The biggest salary cap hits are Bly and Cutler both McDaniels moves. The cap was in good shape before those moves.

Poops hate facts. He far more enjoys relying on innuendo and slander.

NFLBRONCO
11-24-2009, 10:45 AM
9th or 10th pick would be sweet

rastaman
11-24-2009, 11:01 AM
Meh.....the NFL is a draft is not an exact science and is a crapshoot at best. The only really guarantee is Bowlen is going to be required to spend big bucks to sign his No. 1 draft picks. Whether these number on picks turn out to be immediate impact players, Pro Bowlers, or HOFers is anyones guess.

Seriously folks, think about it. You spend what! two straight days in front of a television screen, watching as Goddel sheepishly announces a player's name every 10-15 minutes.

Its not like the team doesn't already know who its going to draft. Teams do draft coverage throughout the entire year and have multitudes of people on their staffs who are scouts, whose sole job it is, is to scout and rate college players.

Consider this, does a team's first round pick even matter? Can you even name the top 5-15 picks from last year's draft? How many top 5-15 football players ever become stars? The answer is very few. Some Even top 5 picks become mediocre players, others become dropouts, and a select few are super stars.

The Bears could finish the season 4-12 and they're No.1 draft pick which goes to Denver doesn't guarantee instant gold for the Broncos and McDaniels. It only guarantees Bowlen is going to pay big bucks to sign the player. The number 1 pick Denver receives from the Bears next year could also become a bust or never quite live up to all the hype created by the draft.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-24-2009, 11:18 AM
The biggest salary cap hits are Bly and Cutler both McDaniels moves. The cap was in good shape before those moves.

Denver was $40M under the cap when FA started (post-Bly and pre-Cutler). Denver had so much cap room this past offseason, they couldn't have spent it all if they tried.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Denver was/is in great cap shape and of course it's irrelevant now with no cap next year.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-24-2009, 11:20 AM
Poops hate facts. He far more enjoys relying on innuendo and slander.

Next time you give somebody a handy for their "facts," make sure those facts are correct.

elsid13
11-24-2009, 01:30 PM
Denver was $40M under the cap when FA started (post-Bly and pre-Cutler). Denver had so much cap room this past offseason, they couldn't have spent it all if they tried.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Denver was/is in great cap shape and of course it's irrelevant now with no cap next year.

Herc,

You reading the post wrong. Popps was claiming that Shanahan left a lot of dead weight on the cap and that had crippled the team. What I pointed out that major amount of dead money on the cap was from Bly and Cutler, both McDaniels moves.

Paladin
11-24-2009, 02:22 PM
And what I gathered from Herc's comments is that the Broncso are STILL in pretty good cap place, but it wont mean a thing next year with no cap next year.

I think the Broncos will trade the Chicago pick next year.....

NFLBRONCO
11-24-2009, 02:45 PM
And what I gathered from Herc's comments is that the Broncso are STILL in pretty good cap place, but it wont mean a thing next year with no cap next year.

I think the Broncos will trade the Chicago pick next year.....

For a future picks trade down in 2010 draft or a player

colonelbeef
11-24-2009, 02:49 PM
Next time you give somebody a handy for their "facts," make sure those facts are correct.

Next time you tell someone when to give a handy, make sure you understand what was being said in the first place.

BroncoDoug
12-07-2009, 09:55 PM
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=346961

Bronco Yoda
12-07-2009, 10:03 PM
:strong:

No kidding. Willie Middlebrooks, Deltha O'Neil, Paymah, Foxworth, LeSeur etc etc there wasn't a DB that we drafted high that didn't bust.

Not to mention Maurice Clarett, other DL that just disapeared from camp (Eason?), and picks that are stilling busting to this day like Jarvis Moss, and WRs that were afraid to compete like Lelie.

The way I see it the current FO is already miles ahead of the previous one purely based on the fact that they got anything out of Ty Law.

Not to mention the biggest kick in the balls when Rodney Harrison was dying to play in Denver years ago and Shanahan completely ignored him.


No kidding. It got so bad we resorted to trading our RB for a quality DB.