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JCMElway
11-14-2009, 09:47 AM
How solid is Orton's footing with McD? Is he the QOTF, or is he a placeholder for someone from the QB rich 2010 draft?

Jimmy Clausen, ND -- Top 5 pick
Jake Locker, Washington -- Top 15 pick
Sam Bradford, OU -- Top 20
Tim Tebow -- Top 20
Ryan Malllet -- Late first/2nd
Jevan Snead -- 2nd round

Or Terrance Cody, the DT we've wanted for a long time, may be available for us. Thoughts?

strafen
11-14-2009, 09:55 AM
I would go for Terrence Cody. We need him more than we need a new QB...
I think we need to give Brandstater a legitimate shot to compete for the starting job next season.
Drafting a new QB will take yet another 2 years to develop.
Our defense can only be good for so long, and with the way free agency goes sometimes, we can't afford to take a hit at our players on defense in the next 2-3 years while we try to develop QB's...
That's just my opinion, your mileage may vary...

BroncoSojia
11-14-2009, 09:58 AM
I hope that we take a QB.

Orton is a decent player, but he's not a QB that will lead you to a SB.

Plus he's a Free Agent after this year.


With how the bears are playing and Bradford's injury, I don't we will have to trade up to get him.

SouthStndJunkie
11-14-2009, 10:11 AM
Here is my take on our QB situation going forward:

Orton is not the long-term answer. He is a stop gap QB until McDaniels finds his protege.

Not sure what McDaniels thinks in regards to Tom Brandstater and his future as a potential starter.

Knowing McDaniels, he is going to think he can draft a QB in Rounds 3-7 and turn him into a solid/good starting QB in the NFL without having to spend a 1st or a 2nd rounder on one....and McDaniels is capable of picking out a gem to tutor and groom in the later rounds.

A lot depends on what Orton does from here on out this year. If he takes a steaming dump on us, he will not be back as a starter for sure.

If he plays some decent football, I could see McDaniels drafting a prospect or signing/trading for a younger prospect already in the league and letting Orton battle it out for the job in 2010.

I have no proof, but get the feeling that McDaniels is starting to see Orton's ceiling and is realizing he is not his QB of the future. I could see Orton coming back as the backup QB....and I would have no problem with that.

So basically....I could see Orton back for another year as the starter....but ideally McDaniels would like to find a replacement in the near future.

SouthStndJunkie
11-14-2009, 10:14 AM
I think when Ryan Malllet does enter the draft, he will be a top five pick overall....possibly the #1 overall pick.

I think he plays another year at Arkansas before declaring.

Ray Finkle
11-14-2009, 10:15 AM
draft the best available OG, DL, or Secondary and call it a day.

Jason in LA
11-14-2009, 10:17 AM
Orton is a place holder. I'd like to see them take a QB, but if there is a better player, I'd say go after that player. First round QBs are a big risk, and a lot of QBs taken in later rounds do great. So I wouldn't sell the farm just to get rid of Orton, but I hope that there is a plan for the future for that position.

CEH
11-14-2009, 10:24 AM
I intriqued with Jevan Snead. 1st round talent that should be around
in the 2nd. Not a great % completion at Ole Miss and throws alot of INTs but bottomline Can he be coached up.

Durango
11-14-2009, 10:32 AM
Orton is functional. Maybe better than functional with good coaching and top level talent around him. No, he can't make opposing defenses defend the whole field, but he's a smart guy with limitations. There have been a lot of very good QB's with limitations. Big arms guarantee you nothing, ask the Raiders. The guy has made some mistakes these last two games, but he's also made quite a few excellent plays up to this point in the season.

Unless some ridiculously good QB talent is just sitting there whenever Denver makes it's first selection, I honestly believe McDaniels absolutely must address the defensive line, and that's assuming there will be a D-lineman there worth taking. I just don't buy into the idea that QB is a first priority in 2010.

HAT
11-14-2009, 10:37 AM
Orton is functional. Maybe better than functional with good coaching and top level talent around him. No, he can't make opposing defenses defend the whole field, but he's a smart guy with limitations. There have been a lot of very good QB's with limitations. Big arms guarantee you nothing, ask the Raiders. The guy has made some mistakes these last two games, but he's also made quite a few excellent plays up to this point in the season.

Unless some ridiculously good QB talent is just sitting there whenever Denver makes it's first selection, I honestly believe McDaniels absolutely must address the defensive line, and that's assuming there will be a D-lineman there worth taking. I just don't buy into the idea that QB is a first priority in 2010.

^5

No need to draft a QB for a few years.....Wait until 2012 and try to position yourself for Luck or Barkley.

Rabb
11-14-2009, 10:45 AM
I seriously think they worry about the line (either side) followed by BPA

I seriously think Tom B is being groomed

errand
11-14-2009, 10:46 AM
If Kyle Orton continues to play at his current pace, he'll put up some solid if not spectacular numbers (3500 yards 18 TD's only 8 INT's)...and more importantly, we should be back in the playoffs after a 3 year absence. But that's not good enough for you is it....he has to win the whole enchilada to get even a chance to start in Denver.

For the life of me I cannot understand the mentality of posters on here. Guys like Craig Morton, Jake Plummer, and Kyle Orton who aren't flashy but generally win games are often maligned on here...and yet clowns like Brian Griese, and Jay Cutler who fold under pressure and throw INT's at the worst possible time, and couldn't lead a starving mob to an all you-can-eat buffet are lauded and praised as being great QB's who just didn't have any support from their team mates.

Kyle Orton will be our QB until someone else proves they can obtain a better grasp of the offense, make more plays, and win more games.

Br0nc0Buster
11-14-2009, 10:47 AM
Take the best available player
If that player plays qb, then so be it

Drafting for need early on minimizes the benefit you get out of the draft

I am comfortable with Orton being the starter next year if we dont get a qb in the offseason

Jason in LA
11-14-2009, 10:49 AM
If Kyle Orton continues to play at his current pace, he'll put up some solid if not spectacular numbers (3500 yards 18 TD's only 8 INT's)...and more importantly, we should be back in the playoffs after a 3 year absence. But that's not good enough for you is it....he has to win the whole enchilada to get even a chance to start in Denver.

For the life of me I cannot understand the mentality of posters on here. Guys like Craig Morton, Jake Plummer, and Kyle Orton who aren't flashy but generally win games are often maligned on here...and yet clowns like Brian Griese, and Jay Cutler who fold under pressure and throw INT's at the worst possible time, and couldn't lead a starving mob to an all you-can-eat buffet are lauded and praised as being great QB's who just didn't have any support from their team mates.

Kyle Orton will be our QB until someone else proves they can obtain a better grasp of the offense, make more plays, and win more games.

The goal isn't to make the playoffs. The goal is to win the Super Bowl. Sure, making the playoffs is the first step, but if they aren't Super Bowl contenders then changes need to be made so that they can get to that level.

errand
11-14-2009, 10:51 AM
I have no proof, but get the feeling that McDaniels is starting to see Orton's ceiling and is realizing he is not his QB of the future..

I'm seeing things like this being said numerous times....to which I have to ask....

Who ever said that McDaniels believed Orton was the "QB of the future"?

Perhaps McDaniels saw Orton as the best option to run his offense until the QBOTF could be found?

Having said that if Orton continues to help this team win games, and puts up solid to very good numbers, why would he lose his job to some unknown, unproven player?

errand
11-14-2009, 10:55 AM
The goal isn't to make the playoffs. The goal is to win the Super Bowl. Sure, making the playoffs is the first step, but if they aren't Super Bowl contenders then changes need to be made so that they can get to that level.

Well you said it yourself...making then playoffs is the first step. No team ever won the SB without making the playoffs first.

So let's take Orton outta the situation, can you honestly say that this team is ready to win the Super Bowl as is? You don't think our OL needs some work? What about special teams? What about our DL?

Are you saying that this team is just one piece of the puzzle away from winning it all?

And again...if Orton puts up solid numbers, what makes you think that he'd be the reason we didn't win it all?

strafen
11-14-2009, 10:59 AM
Orton is an incredible inept QB. No freakin' way!!!

HAT
11-14-2009, 11:06 AM
Orton is an incredible inept QB. No freakin' way!!!

Orton=Winner. BOOSH!

Bronx33
11-14-2009, 11:13 AM
orton is a decent backup i repeat ( backup) get a young QB and move on to the promiseland!

LonghornBronco
11-14-2009, 11:14 AM
I think there is a number of good safties in the draft I would like us to get a little younger in the secondary.

Inkana7
11-14-2009, 11:22 AM
If a QB that McDaniels likes falls to us, take him. If not, don't.

baja
11-14-2009, 11:27 AM
draft the best available OG, DL, or Secondary and call it a day.

This!

Williams
11-14-2009, 11:31 AM
I vote we wait to see how the rest of the season/postseason plays out.

baja
11-14-2009, 11:31 AM
I would like to see TJ make 'Public Poll" the default option that way if someone feels on the rare occasion that a poll needs to be a private poll they can select it otherwise public would be automatically selected. I believe under the current default most private polls are selected by omission.

ward63
11-14-2009, 11:32 AM
I'm on the OG or DL bandwagon, unless it's Mallett. With the DL, Brandon Graham is perfect for a 3-4

Rabb
11-14-2009, 11:35 AM
orton is a decent backup i repeat ( backup) get a young QB and move on to the promiseland!

this is so silly

if they started a rookie next season, the chances of them succeeding goes down quite a bit

everyone seems to think Ryan's and Flacco's grow on trees and they don't

imagine if we had a rookie in this season, we wouldn't be 6-2, I am fairly confident in that

e-mac
11-14-2009, 12:20 PM
resign Orton, draft a couple guards/centers win superbowl

strafen
11-14-2009, 12:22 PM
resign Orton, draft a couple guards/centers win superbowlNot with Orton, man. The guy flat out sucks!

Bronx33
11-14-2009, 12:34 PM
this is so silly

if they started a rookie next season, the chances of them succeeding goes down quite a bit

everyone seems to think Ryan's and Flacco's grow on trees and they don't

imagine if we had a rookie in this season, we wouldn't be 6-2, I am fairly confident in that


I never said it was that easy nor even emplied that but i say pick something from the tree and see what happens thats what the ravens did as did the patriots as did other teams its a crap shoot anyways. I also never said start a rookie next season i was saying get a QB and get started meaning standing on the sidelines and learning having orton and simms for the future doesn't look like much of a future too me.

It does seem like you want a good record every year and not making the playoffs or even a legit run at a superbowl vs maybe having a poor record and a few subpar seasons to build a offense that can go the distance. Shytty rental QBs will not get anything done for the future IMO and as far as going 6-2 this year it's a suprise to everybody that they did this well so lets see how we finish before we call this year a complete success. What is silly is thinking orton is going the distance he IMO is holding this offense back but i will put some of the blame on MCD fact is this team still needs a QB.

Arkie
11-14-2009, 12:35 PM
I'm a big fan of Mallet, but I also like the proven professional winner Orton who for some reason has a winning record every year. Grossman, Griese, and Cutler lose with the same teams.

Endy
11-14-2009, 12:36 PM
6 months ago I thought McDaniels was an idiot. I voted for going with whoever Coach McDaniels wants because he's the coach of the Denver Broncos and I'm a douchebag on a message board.

Broncos4tw
11-14-2009, 01:13 PM
Name more than 3 QBs who were at a talent level of Orton or less that won a SB. Serviceable doesn't win world championship. Franchise QBs by and large, and the winners of SBs. Who cares if we get into the playoffs repeatedly, only to lose when our QB has need to carry the team on his shoulders to win a game or two? That assures us what? Oh yea.. crappier draft picks for years.

Replace him as soon as possible imo, but NOT if it means waiting a bit could have gotten us something better. We are rebuilding, we have other spots on the team that can use bolstering as well.

HOWEVER... for whatever reason, we've decided to put a bunch of rather old guys on our team. So, if we wait too long, we'll be in the same boat with other key positions.

Guess we'll see how it all plays out. But unless our o-line and RBs getting moving, there is no way we'd have a chance at a SB, or even more than a one-and-done in the playoffs. Orton is not a playmaker. He is a game manager, that's it.

BlaK-Argentina
11-14-2009, 01:15 PM
Not with Orton, man. The guy flat out sucks!

God shut the hell up about it already. He does not SUCK. He's a good QB and if we're going to build a complete team he's the right guy until someone else is READY to become a starter and play better than Kyle. McD is not dumb, he'll stick with Orton until he knows for sure that someone else can do better. Right now that guy is not on the Broncos roster IMO.

If you think a rookie is going to come in and win the SB you have no idea. And if it's not a rookie, then who?

Mogulseeker
11-14-2009, 01:22 PM
Keep Orton at QB. He's an above-average QB, and a good QB in this system.

Start to strech the field a little bit with the playbook.

Draft an OG with what might be a top 10 pick from the Bears.

oubronco
11-14-2009, 01:27 PM
Keep Orton at QB. He's an above-average QB, and a good QB in this system.

Start to strech the field a little bit with the playbook.

Draft an OG with what might be a top 10 pick from the Bears.

Have you seen Orton throw the ball farther than 10 yds? It's not pretty

Bronco Bob
11-14-2009, 01:33 PM
Name more than 3 QBs who were at a talent level of Orton or less that won a SB.

Terry Bradshaw
Jim Plunkett
Jeff Hostetler
Doug Williams
Mark Rypien
Brad Johnson
Trent Dilfer

strafen
11-14-2009, 01:49 PM
God shut the hell up about it already. He does not SUCK. He's a good QB and if we're going to build a complete team he's the right guy until someone else is READY to become a starter and play better than Kyle. McD is not dumb, he'll stick with Orton until he knows for sure that someone else can do better. Right now that guy is not on the Broncos roster IMO.

If you think a rookie is going to come in and win the SB you have no idea. And if it's not a rookie, then who?Tell me what have YOU seen in Orton to say he's the right man for the job?
You're kiddin' right?
Have you seen how the guy moves around the pocket?
Don't worry, neither has anybody else.

You need somebody with fire and passion to play QB. Simms would ignite this pathetic offense led by Orton.
Brandstater would be a gamble worth taking...

fontaine
11-14-2009, 01:50 PM
Have you seen Orton throw the ball farther than 10 yds? It's not pretty

It's posts like these that make me believe even if we had Peyton Manning in here people would still complain.

Orton has thrown plenty of intermediate passes when the line was protecting him and did so with plenty of zip and accuracy.

Kyle's future with this team is going to be determined over his 2nd half performance. I believe we'll be good enough to get into the playoffs so what happens there goes a long way towards making up everyone's minds.

One thing though, McDaniels doesn't strike me as a "settle for 2nd best" type of guy.

Everything he did in the offseason from being aggressive in the draft and going after A Smith to allowing Cutler to go loose shows me that he's not shy about going after players he wants and no matter how well Orton plays in the 2nd half, IF McD thinks there's a future great available in the draft then he'll go for it.

strafen
11-14-2009, 01:52 PM
Name more than 3 QBs who were at a talent level of Orton or less that won a SB. Serviceable doesn't win world championship. Franchise QBs by and large, and the winners of SBs. Who cares if we get into the playoffs repeatedly, only to lose when our QB has need to carry the team on his shoulders to win a game or two? That assures us what? Oh yea.. crappier draft picks for years.

Replace him as soon as possible imo, but NOT if it means waiting a bit could have gotten us something better. We are rebuilding, we have other spots on the team that can use bolstering as well.

HOWEVER... for whatever reason, we've decided to put a bunch of rather old guys on our team. So, if we wait too long, we'll be in the same boat with other key positions.

Guess we'll see how it all plays out. But unless our o-line and RBs getting moving, there is no way we'd have a chance at a SB, or even more than a one-and-done in the playoffs. Orton is not a playmaker. He is a game manager, that's it.Nice post!

Hercules Rockefeller
11-14-2009, 01:53 PM
McDaniels gave up 2 picks, including 1 this year to get Brandstater. TB also looked decent in his limited time in the preseason. JM is not going to move in a different direction at QB so quickly. Brandstater will get his chance first/eventually, and if that doesn't work out, then they'll go for a new QB.

strafen
11-14-2009, 01:58 PM
McDaniels gave up 2 picks, including 1 this year to get Brandstater. TB also looked decent in his limited time in the preseason. JM is not going to move in a different direction at QB so quickly. Brandstater will get his chance first/eventually, and if that doesn't work out, then they'll go for a new QB.And I think that's the smart approach that anybody would take.
I agree, before we go for yet another QB, let's not forget we already have 3,
two of which we haven't seen what we've got in them yet.
Brandstater didn't do anything in preseason to hurt his future considerations to bid for the job...

oubronco
11-14-2009, 02:02 PM
It's posts like these that make me believe even if we had Peyton Manning in here people would still complain.

Orton has thrown plenty of intermediate passes when the line was protecting him and did so with plenty of zip and accuracy.

Kyle's future with this team is going to be determined over his 2nd half performance. I believe we'll be good enough to get into the playoffs so what happens there goes a long way towards making up everyone's minds.

One thing though, McDaniels doesn't strike me as a "settle for 2nd best" type of guy.

Everything he did in the offseason from being aggressive in the draft and going after A Smith to allowing Cutler to go loose shows me that he's not shy about going after players he wants and no matter how well Orton plays in the 2nd half, IF McD thinks there's a future great available in the draft then he'll go for it.

His throws are behind or high when he throws past 10yds he can't hit a wr in stride to save his life

SJ Bronco
11-14-2009, 02:03 PM
^5

No need to draft a QB for a few years.....Wait until 2012 and try to position yourself for Luck or Barkley.

this

Mark my words, by the time Luck is ready for the draft, he will be one heck of a QB

BlaK-Argentina
11-14-2009, 02:16 PM
Tell me what have YOU seen in Orton to say he's the right man for the job?
You're kiddin' right?
Have you seen how the guy moves around the pocket?
Don't worry, neither has anybody else.

You need somebody with fire and passion to play QB. Simms would ignite this pathetic offense led by Orton.
Brandstater would be a gamble worth taking...

I have not seen anything from Orton that says he can't throw a good ball or throw deep or even more around a bit. I can remember more than a couple of times he's done all those things succesfully. (and by deep I'm not talking about a 50 yd bomb)

It doesn't matter, if he continues to play like the last two games I want him replaced. If he plays like in weeks 2 to 7 I want him to be the QB. In any case, it doesn't matter what I see or don't see, it's McD who knows more about the three QBs on our roster than we will ever know and he thinks Orton is our best option. I'm fine with that as long as we keep winning and he makes enough plays to get the W. (which he's done when the team was there to help him)

I like the guy but I'm not commited to him. If there's a QB that can do better I want that guy starting, but I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I know more than our coach and say that Orton sucks when it's pretty obvious that he doesn't.

gyldenlove
11-14-2009, 02:18 PM
Terry Bradshaw
Jim Plunkett
Jeff Hostetler
Doug Williams
Mark Rypien
Brad Johnson
Trent Dilfer

Cool, all we need to do is make an all-time great defense or turn back time.

snowspot66
11-14-2009, 02:59 PM
^5

No need to draft a QB for a few years.....Wait until 2012 and try to position yourself for Luck or Barkley.

I agree.

Our biggest weakness on offense is the interior left side. The QB just needs to be good and not **** up. Orton is definitely above average and he doesn't **** up much. Look at what we did with Plummer. The guy could do one thing. Roll out and throw the bootleg passes. We got to the AFCCG with Plummer leading the team and not one single element of our team was dominant.

Let's get our lines in order and the run game back to what we used to be and Orton will probably look like a Pro Bowler sitting back there taking care of the ball and doing his job.

Mogulseeker
11-14-2009, 03:02 PM
Have you seen Orton throw the ball farther than 10 yds? It's not pretty

Orton has a much stronger arm than he gets credit for.

snowspot66
11-14-2009, 03:04 PM
Not with Orton, man. The guy flat out sucks!

Bull****. He's a good solid QB.

You don't ****ing win the Super Bowl because of an all-pro QB. You win it by good defense, a solid run game, and a QB that doesn't **** up and hopefully keeps the offense working efficiently.

That's how the Steelers won theirs, that's how the Pat's won theirs, that's how the Colt's won theirs, and I can go on and on. Those teams had franchise QB's at the helm and the only one that had even decent Super Bowl games was Brady.

The Steelers and Colts won inspite of their QB's. Remember Rothlisberger's stats for his first win? Manning was dragged to his win by Bob Sanders.

oubronco
11-14-2009, 04:53 PM
Bull****. He's a good solid QB.

You don't ****ing win the Super Bowl because of an all-pro QB. You win it by good defense, a solid run game, and a QB that doesn't **** up and hopefully keeps the offense working efficiently.

That's how the Steelers won theirs, that's how the Pat's won theirs, that's how the Colt's won theirs, and I can go on and on. Those teams had franchise QB's at the helm and the only one that had even decent Super Bowl games was Brady.

The Steelers and Colts won inspite of their QB's. Remember Rothlisberger's stats for his first win? Manning was dragged to his win by Bob Sanders.

so you are saying that Orton is as good as Rosenbanger, Brady, and the Manning's come on now

gunns
11-14-2009, 05:34 PM
Here is my take on our QB situation going forward:

Orton is not the long-term answer. He is a stop gap QB until McDaniels finds his protege.

Not sure what McDaniels thinks in regards to Tom Brandstater and his future as a potential starter.

Knowing McDaniels, he is going to think he can draft a QB in Rounds 3-7 and turn him into a solid/good starting QB in the NFL without having to spend a 1st or a 2nd rounder on one....and McDaniels is capable of picking out a gem to tutor and groom in the later rounds.

A lot depends on what Orton does from here on out this year. If he takes a steaming dump on us, he will not be back as a starter for sure.

If he plays some decent football, I could see McDaniels drafting a prospect or signing/trading for a younger prospect already in the league and letting Orton battle it out for the job in 2010.

I have no proof, but get the feeling that McDaniels is starting to see Orton's ceiling and is realizing he is not his QB of the future. I could see Orton coming back as the backup QB....and I would have no problem with that.

So basically....I could see Orton back for another year as the starter....but ideally McDaniels would like to find a replacement in the near future.

This and take the NT. I have faith in McD in picking the right QB.

The Joker
11-14-2009, 05:35 PM
Orton's a solid QB, get a running game going and he's more than good enough to win playoff games with.

That said, the QB is a massively important position and if McDaniels feels that one of the QB prospects next year has a chance to be truly elite and he's available when we select, then it's hard to not take him.

I like Orton, but he's got a low ceiling IMO. Be nice to have a great QB in Denver again, it's been a decade since we did.

strafen
11-14-2009, 06:01 PM
Bull****. He's a good solid QB.

You don't ****ing win the Super Bowl because of an all-pro QB. You win it by good defense, a solid run game, and a QB that doesn't **** up and hopefully keeps the offense working efficiently.

That's how the Steelers won theirs, that's how the Pat's won theirs, that's how the Colt's won theirs, and I can go on and on. Those teams had franchise QB's at the helm and the only one that had even decent Super Bowl games was Brady.

The Steelers and Colts won inspite of their QB's. Remember Rothlisberger's stats for his first win? Manning was dragged to his win by Bob Sanders.

The difference is, Roethlisberger didn't cripple his running game. Yes, his performance in his first SB was dismal, having thrown for like 125 yards and 2 INT's if I recall correctly.
That being said, there's a no comparison in a team led by big Ben and one led by Orton everything being equal. No comparison!
Orton will kill his own running game, with Ben he won't because opposing defenses will always respect his abilities to scramble and his ability to open up the field with a long pass.
With Orton we're limited in more ways than one. He can't throw on the run, he can't hit receivers in stride, and he can't throw the ball deep with enough success for teams to actually take him seriously.

Our running game is as good if not better talent wise than we were last year. The difference is that our OL is being overwhelmed with more defenders at the point of attack than we can block.
This is due to the fact they want to stop our passing game; the dink and dunk, the bubble screens and short 4-yard passes. Virtually they have shut down a perimeter of 20 yards that our offense is used to operate in.
When that's all your QB can do, the result will be a shrunk field and thus negating our ability to run the ball

Meck77
11-14-2009, 06:10 PM
6-2

There is no dilemma. You guys will be kissing his ass again after the skins game.

JCMElway
11-14-2009, 06:16 PM
6-2

There is no dilemma. You guys will be kissing his ass again after the skins game.

I hope you are right, sir. Nothing would please me more than to have Orton be the man going forward and our QB for the next four or five years. I hope his performances solidify that status.

gyldenlove
11-14-2009, 06:30 PM
Here is a list of starting QBs of good/decent teams, see if you can spot any trends:


AFC West:
Kyle Orton (3rd round)
Philip Rivers (1st round)


AFC South:
Peyton Manning (1st round)
Matt Schaub (2nd round)


AFC North:
Carson Palmer (1st round)
Ben Roethlisberger (1st round)
Joe Flacco (1st round)


AFC East:
Tom Brady (6th round)
Mark Sanchez (1st round)


NFC West:
Kurt Warner (UDFA)


NFC South:
Drew Brees (2nd round)
Matt Ryan (1st round)


NFC North:
Brett Favre (1st round)
Aaron Rodgers (1st round)


NFC East:
Tony Romo (UDFA)
Eli Manning (1st round)
Donovan Mcnabb (1st round)


17 in total and only 6 are not 1st round draft picks, but that is not much of a trend since the number is about the same for the bad teams.

The real trend to note is that almost all of the QBs not drafted in the 1st round are either not playing for their original team anymore (Orton, Brees, Warner and Schaub) or took several years to earn a starting spot (Schaub, Warner and Romo). In fact the odd one out is Tom Brady who was a low round draft pick and became a starter early in his 2nd year.

This tells me one thing, Tom Brandstater will most likely not be ready to start until the 2011 season if he is ever ready. So that means we need a starting QB for the 2010 season at the very least and probably 2011 as well to pressure Brandstater.

I think it is obvious that Chris Simms is not that guy, Mcdaniels does a lot of things well, and one of the things he does best is QBs, so if thinks Orton is better than Simms I am willing to bet he is right. So the alternative is either keeping Orton long term/short term, signing a veteran who can keep the team going or drafting someone very high in the hope they will be ready soon and can compete with Brandstater leaving us with a luxury problem of 2 great QBs some day.

strafen
11-14-2009, 06:37 PM
I hope you are right, sir. Nothing would please me more than to have Orton be the man going forward and our QB for the next four or five years. I hope his performances solidify that status.If that's the case, we will certainly be fcked for the next 4-5 years.
If that's the case, we won't be any better now than we were before and much less for the next 4-5 years
This is really sad and sickening. Wishing a lousy QB to lead us in the future. This truly sucks ass!

Pseudofool
11-14-2009, 06:41 PM
This is a real dilemma. Orton is better than advertised, but his ability to make plays when things aren't going well are limited. He has a real and consistent problem with pressure awareness. His mobility is severely limited even when he is outside the pocket, though he's better than I expected. And while his arm seems fine, we have yet to really extend the field, and that might be due to play calling, but the play calling is likely due to Orton's limitations in the deep game. This is a long way of saying Orton isn't ideal. But he's far from bad, as he's smart and pretty accurate and zippy in the short/mid game.

Much depends on how far Bradstater has progressed and what McD thinks of this draft. McD's offense demands a pretty high intelligence and, I'd say, character attributes, and the players with the most skill don't always possess the intagible but necessary elements needed to succeed as this Broncos QB.

If we draft a QB, I think it will say more about what McD thinks of the kid than it will be an inditement of Orton.

JCMElway
11-14-2009, 06:48 PM
If that's the case, we will certainly be fcked for the next 4-5 years.
If that's the case, we won't be any better now than we were before and much less for the next 4-5 years
This is really sad and sickening. Wishing a lousy QB to lead us in the future. This truly sucks ass!

Um, If Orton is around for that period of time, we will not be "f***ed." If he is in a Bronco uni for fourish years, I'm sure we will have playoff appearances and wins. If Orton does not get playoff wins in the next year or two, I'm sure he will not be a Bronco.

What's sad and sickening is your shortsighted, knee jerk opinion.

JCMElway
11-14-2009, 06:50 PM
Great post pseudofool.

SouthStndJunkie
11-14-2009, 07:07 PM
I'm a big fan of Mallet, but I also like the proven professional winner Orton who for some reason has a winning record every year. Grossman, Griese, and Cutler lose with the same teams.

Actually, Grossman had a similar win-loss record as Orton did in Chicago.

Griese only started 6 games in Chicago (3-3)....but is 45-38 as a starter overall.

Florida_Bronco
11-14-2009, 07:33 PM
I think there is a number of good safties in the draft I would like us to get a little younger in the secondary.

Huh?

We drafted 3 rookies this year (Smith, McBath, Bruton) and have a 2nd year player there as well with Barrett.

snowspot66
11-14-2009, 07:56 PM
so you are saying that Orton is as good as Rosenbanger, Brady, and the Manning's come on now

That wooshing sound was you missing the point.

I'm saying that he's good but he doesn't have to be those three guys.

Really, those are THE franchise QB's in this league. That's it right now. There are a bunch of others with a lot of talent. A lot of others more talented than Orton.

But that doesn't matter. Orton is a good solid QB who takes care of the ball.

The point was that to win the Super Bowl that's what you have to do as the QB. Even those franchise QB's did that. Go look at their stat lines. Manning was and is complete **** in the playoffs. Rothlisberger I believe has the lowest game QB rating of any winning Super Bowl QB and I don't think that's a record that will ever be broken.

Stud QB's win games in the regular season. QB's that don't **** up and screw the defense win in the post season.

Like I said, that's how those guys won theirs and it's how Elway won his. Defense and a running game. Orton doesn't have to be anything more than what he is.

If we go chasing the golden goose so be it. If by some bit of unbelievable luck we hit we'll be set for a decade. If we miss were ****ed.

But don't fool yourself. QB is not dragging this offense down right now. Right now our poor blocking is doing the big damage.

bronco610
11-14-2009, 07:57 PM
Did not read the whole thread. Don't have the time but if Brandstster has the mental ability to grasp the game I say we have our QB of the future.

oubronco
11-14-2009, 07:58 PM
Take Cody please please please

snowspot66
11-14-2009, 07:59 PM
The difference is, Roethlisberger didn't cripple his running game. Yes, his performance in his first SB was dismal, having thrown for like 125 yards and 2 INT's if I recall correctly.
That being said, there's a no comparison in a team led by big Ben and one led by Orton everything being equal. No comparison!
Orton will kill his own running game, with Ben he won't because opposing defenses will always respect his abilities to scramble and his ability to open up the field with a long pass.
With Orton we're limited in more ways than one. He can't throw on the run, he can't hit receivers in stride, and he can't throw the ball deep with enough success for teams to actually take him seriously.

Our running game is as good if not better talent wise than we were last year. The difference is that our OL is being overwhelmed with more defenders at the point of attack than we can block.
This is due to the fact they want to stop our passing game; the dink and dunk, the bubble screens and short 4-yard passes. Virtually they have shut down a perimeter of 20 yards that our offense is used to operate in.
When that's all your QB can do, the result will be a shrunk field and thus negating our ability to run the ball

OR

Our running game is being stuffed because of poor blocking and they know they don't have to commit the safeties and cheat the CB's to stop it so they can keep guys in coverage and easily stop the deep ball and easily come up to stop the short stuff.

They don't want to stop our passing game because of Orton. They just want to contain it because they know they can keep it contained in front of them and get off the field because we can't get enough yards running on the early downs to keep the drive going.

oubronco
11-14-2009, 08:00 PM
That wooshing sound was you missing the point.

I'm saying that he's good but he doesn't have to be those three guys.

Really, those are THE franchise QB's in this league. That's it right now. There are a bunch of others with a lot of talent. A lot of others more talented than Orton.

But that doesn't matter. Orton is a good solid QB who takes care of the ball.

The point was that to win the Super Bowl that's what you have to do as the QB. Even those franchise QB's did that. Go look at their stat lines. Manning was and is complete **** in the playoffs. Rothlisberger I believe has the lowest game QB rating of any winning Super Bowl QB and I don't think that's a record that will ever be broken.

Stud QB's win games in the regular season. QB's that don't **** up and screw the defense win in the post season.

Like I said, that's how those guys won theirs and it's how Elway won his. Defense and a running game. Orton doesn't have to be anything more than what he is.

If we go chasing the golden goose so be it. If by some bit of unbelievable luck we hit we'll be set for a decade. If we miss were ****ed.

But don't fool yourself. QB is not dragging this offense down right now. Right now our poor blocking is doing the big damage.

The huge difference is those qb's took over the game when they needed to and were money we have yet to see anything that would indicate that Orton will or can

snowspot66
11-14-2009, 08:01 PM
The huge difference is those qb's took over the game when they needed to and were money we have yet to see anything that would indicate that Orton will or can

Coming back against Dallas and New England (long drives) isn't seeing anything yet?

If we don't fix this run game it doesn't matter who we have at QB.

oubronco
11-14-2009, 08:09 PM
Coming back against Dallas and New England (long drives) isn't seeing anything yet?

If we don't fix this run game it doesn't matter who we have at QB.

the Pats game yes but if Marshall doesn't make an incredible play they lose to Dallas

strafen
11-14-2009, 08:43 PM
Coming back against Dallas and New England (long drives) isn't seeing anything yet?

If we don't fix this run game it doesn't matter who we have at QB.Our running game, or lack thereof is a direct result of not having a passing game.
Everybody in the league knows Orton is not going to beat anybody based on his abilities to pass the ball.
We're near at the bottom of the stats in scoring TD's both rushing and passing. Our offensive numbers are rather anemic to what it should be.
Orton is so mediocre, he makes the rest of our offense look worse than what we really are. Please acknowledge that fact.
There's no two ways about it.
The way Orton has played all year long, as in our first game in cincy and as in our two losses, has been the same.
The reason why nobody was asking to ship his ass out of town on a rail was because we won in Cincy and won 5 straight games after that.
Orton has been more lucky than he's been any good.
It took 2 ST TD's for us to beat SD, it took a miracle play to beat Cincy, and we beat Clev and Oakl because, well, they are what they are, otherwise we would be here talking about being 4-4, but in reality we're fortunate to be 6-2

DarkHorse
11-14-2009, 08:47 PM
McDaniels gave up 2 picks, including 1 this year to get Brandstater. TB also looked decent in his limited time in the preseason. JM is not going to move in a different direction at QB so quickly. Brandstater will get his chance first/eventually, and if that doesn't work out, then they'll go for a new QB.

I'm with this guy.


:thumbs:

bronco610
11-14-2009, 08:49 PM
i'm with this guy.


:thumbs:

+1