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View Full Version : 4 reason why the Cutler trade might be the best nfl trade ever


Elway777
11-13-2009, 08:16 AM
Reason 1. Ryan Mallett : Compares to Tom Brady or John Elway

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5F527AhpS8

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=2F7944EB62B90B60&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&v=OrCZv24dR4c

Reason 2. Sam Bradford : Compares to Phillip Rivers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w-gL0PSvNk&feature=fvst


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztPkDsOlGzU

Jake Locker; Compares to Right handed Steve Young

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9a_MHlO3xo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMfiq9CXss8

Jimmy Clausen : Compares to Joe Montana
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRgGpMhNb4E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHuwPPRC6H4

All 4 of these guys have a good shot to lead Broncos to back to back superbowl wins. Culter was not even able to lead Broncos to playoffs.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
11-13-2009, 08:21 AM
I like Clausen the most. Big arm, not afraid to stand in the pocket, but does have some mobility. I just think he'll be gone by the time we pick.

Of course, the Bears are so god awful they may not win another game this year... which might sneak us into the top 5.

Denver724
11-13-2009, 08:25 AM
I think Bears will finish 6-10 and have a pick between 6-10. We can get one of those QB's, but I don't see any way McD drafts one.

Traveler
11-13-2009, 08:25 AM
If Cutler's game pattern holds true to form, don't be surprised if they unexpectedly win against Philly.

rbackfactory80
11-13-2009, 08:26 AM
7-9 8-8 at best. I say we get 14 or so.

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 08:30 AM
i say we use our first pick for a CB or Safety, while there is still time for Dawkins and Champ to mentor them. Im still giving Orton a little time. If he gets worse by the end of the year, then I will change my mind to QB.

cousinal11
11-13-2009, 08:30 AM
I'll take Locker.

gtown
11-13-2009, 08:33 AM
Ryan Mallett. He is a little rough, but he has a big time arm, has elevated the play of Arkansas in the SEC, and is just a gamer. I would take Clausen before him, but Clausen is a consensus top-five pick. The only way we could get that is if Jay decides to have more five INT games.

Rohirrim
11-13-2009, 08:35 AM
Hell, by the end of this season the NFL might give Josh Coach of the Year honors just for the Cutler trade. ;)

Rohirrim
11-13-2009, 08:36 AM
Ryan Mallett. He is a little rough, but he has a big time arm, has elevated the play of Arkansas in the SEC, and is just a gamer. I would take Clausen before him, but Clausen is a consensus top-five pick. The only way we could get that is if Jay decides to have more five INT games.

Clausen? We just got rid of Cutler. Why trade one sniveling punk for another? ;D

oubronco
11-13-2009, 08:37 AM
I think Bears will finish 6-10 and have a pick between 6-10. We can get one of those QB's, but I don't see any way McD drafts one.

Your probably right

elsid13
11-13-2009, 08:38 AM
Mallent doesn't come close to be compared to Elway or Brady. He is Drew Bledsoe with better arm and less accuracy.

Drek
11-13-2009, 08:39 AM
i say we use our first pick for a CB or Safety, while there is still time for Dawkins and Champ to mentor them. Im still giving Orton a little time. If he gets worse by the end of the year, then I will change my mind to QB.
That is why we drafted Alphonso Smith, Darcel McBath, and David Bruton along with retaining Josh Barrett.

I think we'll go after another CB, but it'll be a 3rd to 5th rounder that we hope develops into a solid nickel/#2 type, while Alphonso Smith will be called on to develop into a #1.

McBath is already seeing more time on the field, and when healthy Josh Barrett is our TE coverage specialist already. The future of our secondary was installed directly behind the present.

gtown
11-13-2009, 08:42 AM
Clausen? We just got rid of Cutler. Why trade one sniveling punk for another? ;D

True, Clausen is a douche. Hell, he just looks like one. But the guy has made chicken salad with chicken **** at ND this year. He has a great arm, stands in the pocket with his eyes downfield, and has been pretty accurate this year (TD to INT ratio). Plus, Clausen has Charlie Weis backing him, giving him a leg up on the offense. But he is gone in the top five. Most draft sites have him gone in the top three.

dbfan21
11-13-2009, 09:09 AM
That is why we drafted Alphonso Smith, Darcel McBath, and David Bruton along with retaining Josh Barrett.

I think we'll go after another CB, but it'll be a 3rd to 5th rounder that we hope develops into a solid nickel/#2 type, while Alphonso Smith will be called on to develop into a #1.

McBath is already seeing more time on the field, and when healthy Josh Barrett is our TE coverage specialist already. The future of our secondary was installed directly behind the present.

Man, you stole my thoughts when I read the same post. We are poised for grooming our future DBs. We may pick up a middle round guy at CB, but I can see our focus this offseason squarely on DL, LB and OL...possibly QB, but it all depends on how the season shakes out for Orton.

Popps
11-13-2009, 09:15 AM
Rocket arm!

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 09:16 AM
That is why we drafted Alphonso Smith, Darcel McBath, and David Bruton along with retaining Josh Barrett.

I think we'll go after another CB, but it'll be a 3rd to 5th rounder that we hope develops into a solid nickel/#2 type, while Alphonso Smith will be called on to develop into a #1.

McBath is already seeing more time on the field, and when healthy Josh Barrett is our TE coverage specialist already. The future of our secondary was installed directly behind the present.


Good point, hopefully McBath can pan out. I guess I should give them more time. Cant get to greedy and hope for a stud like Ed Reed or Palomalu out of the first round. They could just as likely be a bust in the 1st round.

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 09:17 AM
Man, you stole my thoughts when I read the same post. We are poised for grooming our future DBs. We may pick up a middle round guy at CB, but I can see our focus this offseason squarely on DL, LB and OL...possibly QB, but it all depends on how the season shakes out for Orton.


Ya good points, Maybe if we draft a QB it will even make Orton play better knowing a stud is coming to replace him.

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 09:18 AM
may be best trade since Hershall Walker

backup qb
11-13-2009, 09:33 AM
may be best trade since Hershall Walker


How about the Pats gettin Moss for a 4th rounder(I think) or the vikes getting Jared Allen? Those are two pretty good ones.

ColoradoBuff
11-13-2009, 09:47 AM
i'd take any of them but maybe Locker.

HILife
11-13-2009, 09:53 AM
I think Bears will finish 6-10 and have a pick between 6-10. We can get one of those QB's, but I don't see any way McD drafts one.

That would be great if the Bears go 6-10, but your right, as much as I would like it I don't think McD will pick a QB.

rastaman
11-13-2009, 10:00 AM
That would be great if the Bears go 6-10, but your right, as much as I would like it I don't think McD will pick a QB.

Well one thing is for sure, Orton, Bradstater, and Simms are not the long term answer. Its been a little painful watching Orton QB this team. Orton is exceptable win Denver is winning but pretty painful to watch when we lose.

McD must have someting up his sleeve btwn 2010 and 2011 to address the QB position.

McDman
11-13-2009, 10:00 AM
Ryan Mallett. He is a little rough, but he has a big time arm, has elevated the play of Arkansas in the SEC, and is just a gamer. I would take Clausen before him, but Clausen is a consensus top-five pick. The only way we could get that is if Jay decides to have more five INT games.

Have we learned nothing by relying on a big arm? Mallett is not very good at all. He is not agile and has no accuracy. All he is, is a big time arm.

bpc
11-13-2009, 10:01 AM
Bottom line, we need to inject some young talent into the QB position. We're lacking a playmaker back there right now. I respect parts of Orton's game but the last two weekends have shown a light on his flaws. Expect the better teams to key in and exploit his wobbly passes.

gtown
11-13-2009, 10:04 AM
Looking at the Bears record, they will finish no worse than 6-10. That puts us around pick 10, and possibly higher depending on how things shake out. It will most definitely be top 15 though.

jhns
11-13-2009, 10:10 AM
It will take a lot for it to even be the best trade in Broncos history. We did trade for Elway after all. Other than that, it is looking like a good trade. I would love to get a top 10 pick and let McDaniels have his choice of QBs. I also hope he takes one if that is the case.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-13-2009, 10:12 AM
Until the picks have actually been made and the players have a couple years to develop, this isn't even close to the best trade in Broncos history, let alone the NFL.

Elway, Zimmerman, and Bailey all currently rate above the Cutler trade in Broncos history.

oubronco
11-13-2009, 10:12 AM
It will take a lot for it to even be the best trade in Broncos history. We did trade for Elway after all. Other than that, it is looking like a good trade. I would love to get a top 10 pick and let McDaniels have his choice of QBs. I also hope he takes one if that is the case.

what with the quality of Long snappers coming out this year

jhns
11-13-2009, 10:17 AM
what with the quality of Long snappers coming out this year

What? Are you saying our only needs are QB and long snapper? I'm not sure I get it.

oubronco
11-13-2009, 10:18 AM
What? Are you saying our only needs are QB and long snapper? I'm not sure I get it.

it was a joke sorry it went over your head

Steve Prefontaine
11-13-2009, 10:21 AM
True, Clausen is a douche. Hell, he just looks like one. But the guy has made chicken salad with chicken **** at ND this year. He has a great arm, stands in the pocket with his eyes downfield, and has been pretty accurate this year (TD to INT ratio). Plus, Clausen has Charlie Weis backing him, giving him a leg up on the offense. But he is gone in the top five. Most draft sites have him gone in the top three.

I think everyone is picturing the Clausen that came to Notre Dame with the spiked hair and **** eating grin plastered on his face.

The Clausen that came to Notre Dame is not the same guy that will be leaving. He has improved an amazing amount as a player and leader (and hopefully as a person) over the last 3 years. I think he was humbled by getting his a$$ beat the first 2 years.

Go and watch some tape of him while he was playing with turf toe ealier this year. I thought it was pretty f-ing impressive how he gutted it out and played pretty well with the injury. I think it would be great for him to land in Denver under McDaniels.

Smiling Assassin27
11-13-2009, 10:22 AM
I like Clausen the most. Big arm, not afraid to stand in the pocket, but does have some mobility. I just think he'll be gone by the time we pick.

Of course, the Bears are so god awful they may not win another game this year... which might sneak us into the top 5.

Mallett is the most intriguing to me. I've watched him from his senior year in HS and, while lacking mobility, is accurate and can toss it all day long. My main worry--not sure why this is--is that he's Ryan Leaf. I have visions of Mallett in the bronco locker room screaming, 'Don't talk to me, alright?!!'

Bradford is the least attractive to me. Damaged and hasn't exactly had to battle much adversity outside of two games this year and an injury that we've yet to see how he heals physically and mentally.

Clausen's the wild card. He's dealt with getting his head kicked in and he doesn't play scared. He's a good enough decision maker and seems to slide/operate in the pocket well--elusive and can keep a play alive reasonably well. He's got exposure to the Patriot offense already, in a sense, so he may be the farthest ahead on the learning curve. But if he shows up for his first day of training camp in a limo, I'm dispatching Spider to Dove Valley for a swift throat punching.

jhns
11-13-2009, 10:24 AM
it was a joke sorry it went over your head

You could use some work on your material.

FantomForce
11-13-2009, 10:24 AM
i'll take locker.

hell yeah!8')

oubronco
11-13-2009, 10:25 AM
You could use some work on your material.

you as well

Beantown Bronco
11-13-2009, 10:25 AM
You could use some work on your material.

Even Lonnie Paxton thought it was hilarious.

Lidderer
11-13-2009, 10:26 AM
please take Locker, I eagerly await returning to this board with a rooting interest, though of course the downside to that selection would be you all having to suffer through me for another 3-5 years.

razorwire77
11-13-2009, 11:15 AM
Lots of football to be played, but the stars may be lining up for us to snag a QB.

Unless the Bears lose out, Clausen will be long gone before we pick.

However, if they finish 7-9/8-8 we'd have a shot to draft a kid, and groom him for a year or two under Orton.

RMT
11-13-2009, 11:19 AM
what about Brandstater? perhaps our future QB is already on the roster. i would like to see the Broncos flip picks in the 1st round and trade down AND pick up ANOTHER future 1st round pick. Get an extra 1st round pick for trading down and stockpile picks perhaps.

cmhargrove
11-13-2009, 11:29 AM
I'm all for a top notch QB, and McD would probably be happy to groom an A+ prospect over the next 8-10 years if one was available.

However, i'm not writing off Brandstater so soon. He's one of those guys that will benefit immensely from "learning the system" a year or two. Remember, he finished his undergrad degree in three years and was working on his masters when we got him. He must be decently smart and motivated. A year of lifting weights in an NFL program could easily develop a 6'5" 235lb quarterback with good mobility. That ain't too shabby.

Keep building the Oline and Dline with first rounders. The run game needs more beef, and you can never have enough stud D-linemen. I still think we could find a stronger presence at SOLB by next year also. Haggan is a good team player, but we could possibly find a beast in the first round.

TonyR
11-13-2009, 11:50 AM
lex's favorite journalist chimes in on Cutler today in his "sports hate" column.

I have Jay Cutler, and I have Jay Cutler a second time, because man, is it fun to sports-hate Jay Cutler.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmonsnflpicks/091113

BroncoBuff
11-13-2009, 11:51 AM
7-9 8-8 at best. I say we get 14 or so.

That's about right.

Boss Man
11-13-2009, 11:59 AM
im not gonna lie. your comparisons are terrible, but you are right about there being a wealth of talent.

BroncoBuff
11-13-2009, 12:01 PM
Elway, Zimmerman, and Bailey all currently rate above the Cutler trade in Broncos history.
Yeah, the Elway trade will never be beaten.

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 12:10 PM
How about the Pats gettin Moss for a 4th rounder(I think) or the vikes getting Jared Allen? Those are two pretty good ones.

those are good ones

OBF1
11-13-2009, 12:10 PM
Bottom line, we need to inject some young talent into the QB position. We're lacking a playmaker back there right now. I respect parts of Orton's game but the last two weekends have shown a light on his flaws. Expect the better teams to key in and exploit his wobbly passes.

A playmaker like cutler ;D

WolfpackGuy
11-13-2009, 12:13 PM
Yeah, the Elway trade will never be beaten.

Elway for Mark Herrmann, Chris Hinton, and the pick that became Ron Solt.

Yes, please!

lex
11-13-2009, 12:15 PM
Mallent doesn't come close to be compared to Elway or Brady. He is Drew Bledsoe with better arm and less accuracy.

Not really. Bledsoe had a big arm. Still, its a valid comparison.

Play2win
11-13-2009, 12:32 PM
Mount Cody, and then a big, physical mauler of a Left Guard in the second.

lex
11-13-2009, 12:38 PM
For it to be "the best trade ever" wouldnt we need to get something out of it? When I say something, I mean more than what Smith has delivered so far this year.

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 01:00 PM
For it to be "the best trade ever" wouldnt we need to get something out of it? When I say something, I mean more than what Smith has delivered so far this year.


uhh we are 6-2, so we did get something out of it. Regardless of Orton being the long term answer, or even his last 2 games.......he still lead 2 game winning drives against good Dallas and NE teams (NE 2 best defense in NFL in PPG).

Without that, we might be 4-4, #2 in the division, and in the verge of missing the playoffs yet again. Instead, we are 6-2, maybe 7-2, and looking like a team that can be in the playoffs.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-13-2009, 01:06 PM
For it to be "the best trade ever" wouldnt we need to get something out of it? When I say something, I mean more than what Smith has delivered so far this year.

Yeah, especially since Denver didn't use a Chicago pick to acquire Smith.

lex
11-13-2009, 01:43 PM
Yeah, especially since Denver didn't use a Chicago pick to acquire Smith.

Did McDaniels not say, "we still have the other 1st" when he discussed giving them the Denver pick and not the Chicago pick?

lex
11-13-2009, 01:46 PM
uhh we are 6-2, so we did get something out of it. Regardless of Orton being the long term answer, or even his last 2 games.......he still lead 2 game winning drives against good Dallas and NE teams (NE 2 best defense in NFL in PPG).

Without that, we might be 4-4, #2 in the division, and in the verge of missing the playoffs yet again. Instead, we are 6-2, maybe 7-2, and looking like a team that can be in the playoffs.

Just Orton for Cutler doesnt make it anywhere close to the Elway trade. Youd really need for draft picks to deliver for it to enter the discussion.

MOCRUSH
11-13-2009, 02:08 PM
True, Clausen is a douche. Hell, he just looks like one. But the guy has made chicken salad with chicken **** at ND this year. He has a great arm, stands in the pocket with his eyes downfield, and has been pretty accurate this year (TD to INT ratio). Plus, Clausen has Charlie Weis backing him, giving him a leg up on the offense. But he is gone in the top five. Most draft sites have him gone in the top three.

Losing to Navy, (for the second time in three years), at home is most assuredly not making chicken salad with chicken ***** at ND. Not too many NFL teams running 5'9" 190# linebackers out there.

Elway777
11-13-2009, 02:27 PM
I had a flash forward and the Broncos will get the 12 pick in the draft and will draft Ryan Mallett . Mallett will then lead the Broncos to 2 staight super bowls wins before the end of the world in 2012. Cutler will also set the recond for most interception for the next 3 years.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-13-2009, 02:27 PM
Did McDaniels not say, "we still have the other 1st" when he discussed giving them the Denver pick and not the Chicago pick?

So now we're just incorporating that trade into the Cutler trade just because you feel like it?

Denver's still owns Chicago's 1st, as much as you and Mock want to pretend that Smith is a part of the Cutler trade, he wasn't.

baja
11-13-2009, 02:31 PM
Where are all the outraged posters screaming for Josh's head for making the stupid rookie mistake of trading our pick instead of Chicago's to Seattle.

Ambiguous
11-13-2009, 02:36 PM
Where are all the outraged posters screaming for Josh's head for making the stupid rookie mistake of trading our pick instead of Chicago's to Seattle.

One right here, happily eating crow. :wave:

Rother8
11-13-2009, 02:39 PM
Clausen? We just got rid of Cutler. Why trade one sniveling punk for another? ;D

EXACTLY........plus the dude plays army, navy, air force, coast guard, marines and popcorn state every year to bump his pussy little stats up. bitch.

ZONA
11-13-2009, 02:52 PM
Well one thing is for sure, Orton, Bradstater, and Simms are not the long term answer.

WTF are you talking about? You've seen Tom play in a few preseason games (and he looked very good at times) and you sir are ready to announce you don't think he has the possibility of being a good player in this league? Nothing personal here dude but you are an idiot if you believe that.

Tom B is going to get his chance in Denver I believe. He's just not being thrown to the wolves like some other rookie QB's. It's not always the best thing. I think McD will probably draft another rookie QB this year to compete but I doubt he's going to be a high pick.

Peoples Champ
11-13-2009, 02:55 PM
Just Orton for Cutler doesnt make it anywhere close to the Elway trade. Youd really need for draft picks to deliver for it to enter the discussion.


Right, Im sorry, I failed to mention the draft picks. I meant my argument with the draft picks. The picks were great, and we were supposed to have a sympothy QB thrown in there. Turns out he has us at 6-2 and on the verge of making the playoffs.


I meant to say, we did get something out of it. A ton of draft picks and a QB that has us at 6-2. I just dont automatically expect the rookies to have an immediate impact on the team. A very small percentage of rookies do have a huge impact right away.

Popps
11-13-2009, 03:17 PM
Poor Lex. This all just didn't work out for him.

mhgaffney
11-13-2009, 05:02 PM
The best thing that could happen now would be for Brandstater to get a shot as the starter -- this season -- and proceed to make plays and win games.

It would be great not to HAVE to pick a QB in round one next April.

Bronco Yoda
11-13-2009, 05:52 PM
If we could get up by three scores this week or sometime this season, I'd like to see what Brandstater could do. We know what Simms can do. I doubt we'd do that... but I'd like to see it.

Dedhed
11-13-2009, 05:59 PM
im not gonna lie. your comparisons are terrible, but you are right about there being a wealth of talent.

I was going to say the same thing. How can someone compare to both Elway and Brady? That's like saying something is similar to black and white.

watermock
11-13-2009, 06:03 PM
IMO, (standing like the 1 legged knight at this point),is offering Cutler an extention with 3 years left in his deal.

He displayed even worse body language after the latest pickfest. I mean, we could of picked Leinart.

We did cash out well, depite the fact I'm not all that enamoured with the Smith trade, we look to get a good pick out of Chicago next year now.

Unfortunately, I think McD may have the same philosophy as Shanny when it comes to RBs for QBs. i.e. the silk purse theorem. Plus TB showed some skills, and was rated higher before his senior year, he tends to throw high, not good in the NFL, and not real quck on his feet due to his height. But we have the rest of the year to decide on Neckbeard.

I don't know muh about Locker, I've been getting mostly sec/big 12/iowa games, And while Tebow has huge intanibles, he won't be a rushing threat in the NFL. He'll get killed and he's too slow.
Colt McCoy will probably be there. As good a leader as Tebow*almost,noone is Tebow) and such. Anyone, seems like a character gut, and much quicker delivery


Sam Bradford? Forget his shouilder, he gets the sh#t for brains award for not comming out last year. 100 million $ mistake.

watermock
11-13-2009, 06:08 PM
Originally Posted by gtown
Ryan Mallett. He is a little rough, but he has a big time arm, has elevated the play of Arkansas in the SEC, and is just a gamer. I would take Clausen before him, but Clausen is a consensus top-five pick. The only way we could get that is if Jay decides to have more five INT games.

Clausen sucks, but he fits our system.

I can hear the jeers. Mallett Head, Mallett head. Spare me.

watermock
11-13-2009, 06:45 PM
So now we're just incorporating that trade into the Cutler trade just because you feel like it?

Denver's still owns Chicago's 1st, as much as you and Mock want to pretend that Smith is a part of the Cutler trade, he wasn't.

Your to say we would of traded our only 2010 first for Smith then. That would be even dumber than the trade itself.

It sure woul of been nice to have 2 firsts in a deeper draft to get a QB and a d player.

I don't think we are even going to draft a QB, at least high. I think we let Orton search the market and come back with tail between his legs. But who knows, there's 2 months left to decide.

BMarsh615
11-13-2009, 06:53 PM
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/ik-LNTMYn50&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ik-LNTMYn50&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Andrew Luck

Too bad he is a freshman he would be perfect for McDaniels. :(

watermock
11-13-2009, 06:56 PM
Where are all the outraged posters screaming for Josh's head for making the stupid rookie mistake of trading our pick instead of Chicago's to Seattle.

You'll have to loan me your crystal ball. None our pickks have been lighting it up, the major change is the revamped D.

We had ever opportunity to win at least 1 these last 2 games, or we could be 5-3 very easily.

errand
11-13-2009, 08:21 PM
Where are all the outraged posters screaming for Josh's head for making the stupid rookie mistake of trading our pick instead of Chicago's to Seattle.

That says alot of what McDaniels thought of the players he had here in Denver. He knew that the Bears would lose more games than the Broncos.

Betting against McDaniels is akin to going up against Taylor Swift in any music awards show this season

Archer81
11-13-2009, 08:43 PM
EXACTLY........plus the dude plays army, navy, air force, coast guard, marines and popcorn state every year to bump his p***Y little stats up. b****.


ND plays Navy, Army and AF, but also play USC, among others. Not like he personally decides who he plays. The point is when he plays these teams he plays well. Considering the Weiss influences on McDaniels, it would be an easier transition for Clausen simply because he did play in the offense, where the reads are similar. But its November...can we wait for this season to finish before we start projecting about who we may or may not draft?

:Broncos:

Archer81
11-13-2009, 08:47 PM
You'll have to loan me your crystal ball. None our pickks have been lighting it up, the major change is the revamped D.

We had ever opportunity to win at least 1 these last 2 games, or we could be 5-3 very easily.


Much like the previous 2 drafts...our first rounders are contributing...or do you need every 1st round pick to be a Ryan Clady? Ayres is starting to flash the reason he was selected 18th, and Moreno still leads all rookie rushers.

Never seen so many people nitpicking a 6-2 team because they dont like the coach and were personally offended by his draft selections...get over it and enjoy the season.

****.

:Broncos:

watermock
11-13-2009, 09:01 PM
That says alot of what McDaniels thought of the players he had here in Denver. He knew that the Bears would lose more games than the Broncos.

No.

Everbody knew we had a horrific defense.

Actually Seattle ASKED for Denvers pick.

Also, our entire D sucked for 5 players. Champ (paid 15 million), DJ, Peterson, Thomas and "Smith?"

mattob14
11-13-2009, 10:15 PM
I don't see any way McD drafts a top-10 QB. He'll give Brandstater a shot before picking a QB that high.

Where we could benefit though, is if one of the top QB's is sitting there with that Bears pick and Denver has a chance to trade down. I know the return hasn't been as good on 1st round picks in recent years, but that goes out the window when there's a franchise QB involved. If Denver is sitting in that 8-10 range and only one of Locker/Clausen/Bradford is available, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see McD move back into the mid-1st, draft one of McClain/Wootton/Cody/Spikes, and pick up another 2nd or picks in 2011.

lex
11-13-2009, 10:24 PM
So now we're just incorporating that trade into the Cutler trade just because you feel like it?

Denver's still owns Chicago's 1st, as much as you and Mock want to pretend that Smith is a part of the Cutler trade, he wasn't.

The Bears pick didnt affect that trade? LOL.

BroncoMan4ever
11-14-2009, 01:23 AM
I like Clausen the most. Big arm, not afraid to stand in the pocket, but does have some mobility. I just think he'll be gone by the time we pick.

Of course, the Bears are so god awful they may not win another game this year... which might sneak us into the top 5.

in any other draft, Clausen is gone top 5. but with Sneed, McCoy, Bradford, Locker and maybe even Tebow(for teams who see him as a 1st round QB) he may well be available to us, even later in the 1st round.

also, i am all but certain that if the Bears net us a top 10 pick, we are going to trade back and pick up extra picks

BroncoMan4ever
11-14-2009, 01:27 AM
I don't see any way McD drafts a top-10 QB. He'll give Brandstater a shot before picking a QB that high.

Where we could benefit though, is if one of the top QB's is sitting there with that Bears pick and Denver has a chance to trade down. I know the return hasn't been as good on 1st round picks in recent years, but that goes out the window when there's a franchise QB involved. If Denver is sitting in that 8-10 range and only one of Locker/Clausen/Bradford is available, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see McD move back into the mid-1st, draft one of McClain/Wootton/Cody/Spikes, and pick up another 2nd or picks in 2011.

why are so many so sure that Brandstater is going to ever be anything more than a backup?

look at the facts. Brandstater is almost as old as Orton and is still a rookie. he is raw, and will need at least another 2 years before he can do anything decent for us. Brandstater was brought in to be nothing more than a backup that sits on the bench for years and only steps in, in case a sitatuation arises where he is needed. he was brought in to be the Matt Cassel here. sit on the bench, know the system and step in in case of emergency.

mattob14
11-14-2009, 09:56 AM
why are so many so sure that Brandstater is going to ever be anything more than a backup?

look at the facts. Brandstater is almost as old as Orton and is still a rookie. he is raw, and will need at least another 2 years before he can do anything decent for us. Brandstater was brought in to be nothing more than a backup that sits on the bench for years and only steps in, in case a sitatuation arises where he is needed. he was brought in to be the Matt Cassel here. sit on the bench, know the system and step in in case of emergency.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting anything out of Brandstater down the line. My opinion is based on McD's track record with QB's. He's had success with Brady and Cassell, late rounders who aren't exactly the typical gunslingers you find in the top-10 picks of the draft. And after coming to Denver, he wanted to bring in Cassell rather than stick with Cutler. I really believe he feels that he can be successful with mid-rounders who, in some cases, may actually be better system fits than some of the top picks. With the depth of this year's QB class, I wouldn't be surprised to see a QB taken anywhere from the late-2nd through the end of the draft, though.

TonyR
11-14-2009, 10:00 AM
Betting against McDaniels is akin to going up against Taylor Swift in any music awards show this season

I'd like to get up against Taylor Swift...

mattob14
11-14-2009, 10:00 AM
in any other draft, Clausen is gone top 5. but with Sneed, McCoy, Bradford, Locker and maybe even Tebow(for teams who see him as a 1st round QB) he may well be available to us, even later in the 1st round.

also, i am all but certain that if the Bears net us a top 10 pick, we are going to trade back and pick up extra picks

Exactly, and this is what I was mentioning as well. There's still a lack of depth and overall talent in the defensive front-7 and the OL. The Broncos really need to pick up a couple of additional picks in the 2nd-4th rounds if they want to address all of their needs.

Hamrob
11-14-2009, 10:07 AM
O.K. everyone thinks Cutler sucks. Who the heck did we get for Cutler?

Orton - He's terrible!
Ayers - Sure haven't seen it yet
Smith - 5'9" scrub...reason we got Law
Moreno - Looks like a slow version of Reggie Bush to me
Quinn - Has he even played yet?

Look, the bottom line. I don't see how anyone can say whether we got the better side of this trade. The Bears got cutler and Knox...we got some of that scrub list above.

Anyone who thinks this was such lopsided trade is snorting it!

TonyR
11-14-2009, 10:10 AM
Who the heck did we get for Cutler?
Orton - He's terrible!
Ayers - Sure haven't seen it yet
Smith - 5'9" scrub...reason we got Law
Moreno - Looks like a slow version of Reggie Bush to me
Quinn - Has he even played yet?


So you've already determined how Ayers, Smith, Moreno, and Quinn are going to turn out? Seriously? Not to mention the fact that Chicago had to commit big $ to Cutler. I think your perspective is more than a little myopic.

Hamrob
11-14-2009, 10:15 AM
So you've already determined how Ayers, Smith, Moreno, and Quinn are going to turn out? Seriously? Not to mention the fact that Chicago had to commit big $ to Cutler. I think your perspective is more than a little myopic.Thanks, you just made my point for me.

I haven't determined how those guys are going to turn out yet, because none of us know yet. (Although signs so far haven't been all that positive)

Therefore, who can say that we got such a great deal in this trade? Nobody.

mattob14
11-14-2009, 10:28 AM
O.K. everyone thinks Cutler sucks. Who the heck did we get for Cutler?

Orton - He's terrible!
Ayers - Sure haven't seen it yet
Smith - 5'9" scrub...reason we got Law
Moreno - Looks like a slow version of Reggie Bush to me
Quinn - Has he even played yet?

Look, the bottom line. I don't see how anyone can say whether we got the better side of this trade. The Bears got cutler and Knox...we got some of that scrub list above.

Anyone who thinks this was such lopsided trade is snorting it!

Why are you even including Smith and Moreno in this list? And leaving out the 2010 Chicago pick? The trade boils down to Cutler/Knox for Orton/Ayers/top-15 pick/1 of the picks moved for Quinn.

Even assuming Quinn is a complete bust (and I'm far from saying that's the case), I'd rather have Orton/Ayers/1st than Knox and Cutler with that ridiculous contract. Certainly not the best trade ever in the NFL, but it's a deal that I'd make again without hesitation.

barryr
11-14-2009, 11:07 AM
Why do people assume drafting a QB in the 1st round guarantees something? There have been more QB busts drafted in the 1st round than just about any position.

Heck, Colt McCoy I view as a better QB prospect than Bradford anyway.

Locker has all of the QB measurable one would want.

Is Clausen a much better QB propect than Brady Quinn was coming out of that same school?

I'd be surprised if Mallett is ready to the play in the NFL anytime soon, if ever.

Hercules Rockefeller
11-14-2009, 01:49 PM
The Bears pick didnt affect that trade? LOL.

Do the Broncos still have the Bears pick?

It's a simple yes or no question.

Should I see if the Denver Post will do an online poll for you so you'll have your answer? We all know that's how you based your HC coaching preference, they wanted Spags so obviously that was the right choice. How's he doing again BTW?

It really is hilarious to watch you spin and do whatever you can to try to support your prior positions at this point.

BroncoBuff
11-14-2009, 03:39 PM
Do the Broncos still have the Bears pick?

It's a simple yes or no question.

Should I see if the Denver Post will do an online poll for you so you'll have your answer? We all know that's how you based your HC coaching preference, they wanted Spags so obviously that was the right choice. How's he doing again BTW?

It really is hilarious to watch you spin and do whatever you can to try to support your prior positions at this point.

You're right, strictly speaking. But without that extra pick, no way we trade like tha. Plus we didn't know (still don't know) where the picks will fall.

BroncoBuff
11-14-2009, 03:46 PM
Why do people assume drafting a QB in the 1st round guarantees something? There have been more QB busts drafted in the 1st round than just about any position.

Maybe more ... from yesterday's paper here:


Danny O'Neil
NFL | Predicting quarterback success resembles a coin toss
The future of Hasselbeck has become one of the biggest questions facing the Seahawks.

By Danny O'Neil
Seattle Times NFL reporter
The first half of Seattle's cautionary tale about NFL quarterbacks took place Sunday at Qwest Field when Detroit's shaggy-haired rookie with a shotgun for an arm showed how far he has to go to become an adequate passer.

The second half of the story comes Sunday when the Seahawks travel to Arizona to face the division-leading Cardinals and Kurt Warner. He is 4 years older than Seattle's Matt Hasselbeck and he has been cut loose by two NFL teams only to end up in Arizona, where he piloted his team to the Super Bowl last season, the third time he has played on the sport's biggest stage.

Matthew Stafford and Warner are the bookends of the quarterback debate, the youngster who is not quite ready and the veteran who is not yet done. They are the landmarks Seattle should take note of as the future of Hasselbeck becomes one of the biggest questions facing the franchise.

Anyone who has been hollering that now is the time for Seattle to draft the franchise quarterback for the future is encouraged to take a long look at the way Stafford played for Detroit on Sunday.

Stafford was the first player drafted this year, and he had one of the NFL's strongest arms from the moment he joined the league. After an impressive first period, Stafford needed two quarters to surrender a 17-point lead and he finished Detroit's death spiral with interceptions on the team's final two drives. Cornerback Josh Wilson picked off Stafford's final pass and returned it 61 yards for a touchdown.

"A young quarterback got rattled and he started giving us some nice to-go presents," Wilson said Monday.

The fact Seattle's 5-foot-9 cornerback was looking down his nose at Stafford says about all you need to know about the struggles a rookie quarterback faces.

There are a lot of adjectives that could be hung on Stafford's performance this season. Surprising is not one of them. He is a rookie, after all, and the success of first-year starters such as Joe Flacco and Matt Ryan last season were exceptions, or haven't you been keeping track of the New York Jets' Mark Sanchez? Sanchez has eight interceptions and five touchdown passes in the last five games, the Jets have gone 1-4 and he has gotten more attention for eating a hot dog than devouring defenses.

An NFL team doesn't just go and pull a franchise quarterback off the top shelf of the draft, unwrap him and start winning games. It is more like you pick a passer, wheel up an armored truck to his house and fork over enough money to make him sign and then you hope. You hope he is not like David Carr. Or Tim Couch. Or Ryan Leaf. You get the idea.

For all the scouting and all the coaching a first-round quarterback gets, it is about a 50-50 proposition he will pan out.




http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/dannyoneil/2010245596_oneil11.html?syndication=rss

kdissette
11-14-2009, 05:44 PM
i say if he picks a QB it will be Clausen cuz he is running a NE style offense with Weiss at ND so it only makes sense if you want to bring in a rookie and have an immediate impact

barryr
11-14-2009, 05:52 PM
Dan Lefevour of Central Michigan is someone I'd want the Broncos to look at if looking for a QB.

BroncoMan4ever
11-15-2009, 01:19 AM
Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting anything out of Brandstater down the line. My opinion is based on McD's track record with QB's. He's had success with Brady and Cassell, late rounders who aren't exactly the typical gunslingers you find in the top-10 picks of the draft. And after coming to Denver, he wanted to bring in Cassell rather than stick with Cutler. I really believe he feels that he can be successful with mid-rounders who, in some cases, may actually be better system fits than some of the top picks. With the depth of this year's QB class, I wouldn't be surprised to see a QB taken anywhere from the late-2nd through the end of the draft, though.

i understand that, but McDaniels didn't pick either of those guys. He was instrumental in aiding them in becoming good QBs(in Cassel's case while he was in NE) but he didn't pick them because he thought he could work wonders with them. they were on the team and he worked with them when he moved up the ranks on the offensive side of the ball. With Brandstater, i look at him as a backup guy like NE did with that O'Connell guy a few years ago. they needed a number 3 QB that could maybe push to replace the number 2 guy, and the QB fit the mold of the type of QB the team liked, and he was good value where he was picked.

also, i don't think it has anything to do with mid or late round guys fitting his style of play more. it is about intelligent play, and attitude for McDaniels. he wanted Cassell here, because he knew exactly what he had in Cassel, a guy who knew his system inside and out, and had an attitude and style of play McDaniels liked. Had he seen Cutler as a guy with the intelligence, leadership abilities and attitude of a guy like Brady or Cassel, there would have never been any kind of situation that arose between the 2 and Cutler would still be in Denver.

has nothing to do with where the guy was picked. If McDaniels isn't sure about the QB situation and in next seasons draft, he sees Clausen, Sneed or Locker as guys that have the attitude, intelligence and leadership abilities he likes his QB to have, and one of them is sitting there when we are on the clock, he will pull the trigger on drafting that guy. he won't sit back and say i like this guy, but i would rather wait and get a project guy that i can work with later in the draft, he will take a 1st round QB if he believes that is the missing piece and that that QB will fit his system.

BroncoMan4ever
11-15-2009, 01:23 AM
Dan Lefevour of Central Michigan is someone I'd want the Broncos to look at if looking for a QB.

i would be very happy with that pick. i am a big time Orton supporter, but i really like Lefevour and would have no problem with that pick at all.

BroncoMan4ever
11-15-2009, 01:33 AM
O.K. everyone thinks Cutler sucks. Who the heck did we get for Cutler?

Orton - He's terrible!
Ayers - Sure haven't seen it yet
Smith - 5'9" scrub...reason we got Law
Moreno - Looks like a slow version of Reggie Bush to me
Quinn - Has he even played yet?

Look, the bottom line. I don't see how anyone can say whether we got the better side of this trade. The Bears got cutler and Knox...we got some of that scrub list above.

Anyone who thinks this was such lopsided trade is snorting it!

lets break down this trade

Cutler 14 TDs and 17 INTs on the season, 4-5 record and Knox in exchange for

Orton, not a great QB, but a 6-2 record, 9 TDs to 4 INTs and in the middle of a possible playoff season

Ayers a guy we all knew was a prospect that would take a year or 2 to develop who also every week seems to be becoming a bigger part of our defense and playmaker for us

Quinn a blocking TE we brought in to learn from Graham for a year or 2 and then take over as our new young blocking TE. he has also been used in jumbo packages where we want to be bigger on the line.

and what is looking more and more like a top 12 pick in next years draft.


also, on the topic of Moreno, and Smith, even though they were from picks that had absolutely nothing to do with the Cutler trade

Moreno has suffered a few setbacks, injury, missed time in preseason and Camp, and that added with the fact that our interior line can't open any rushing lanes is hindering him being the impact player he can be. it isn't like all of our RBs are studs having great years and Moreno is just some scrub. our running game just isn't working right now, no matter who is running the ball.

Smith has been injured and because of that we brought in Law. Smith has looked decent when he is on the field and healthy. Also, Smith was brought in to be a guy who can learn from vets like Bailey, and Goodman to take over as a starter for us in a couple years.

baja
11-15-2009, 06:03 AM
i understand that, but McDaniels didn't pick either of those guys. He was instrumental in aiding them in becoming good QBs(in Cassel's case while he was in NE) but he didn't pick them because he thought he could work wonders with them. they were on the team and he worked with them when he moved up the ranks on the offensive side of the ball. With Brandstater, i look at him as a backup guy like NE did with that O'Connell guy a few years ago. they needed a number 3 QB that could maybe push to replace the number 2 guy, and the QB fit the mold of the type of QB the team liked, and he was good value where he was picked.

also, i don't think it has anything to do with mid or late round guys fitting his style of play more. it is about intelligent play, and attitude for McDaniels. he wanted Cassell here, because he knew exactly what he had in Cassel, a guy who knew his system inside and out, and had an attitude and style of play McDaniels liked. Had he seen Cutler as a guy with the intelligence, leadership abilities and attitude of a guy like Brady or Cassel, there would have never been any kind of situation that arose between the 2 and Cutler would still be in Denver.

has nothing to do with where the guy was picked. If McDaniels isn't sure about the QB situation and in next seasons draft, he sees Clausen, Sneed or Locker as guys that have the attitude, intelligence and leadership abilities he likes his QB to have, and one of them is sitting there when we are on the clock, he will pull the trigger on drafting that guy. he won't sit back and say i like this guy, but i would rather wait and get a project guy that i can work with later in the draft, he will take a 1st round QB if he believes that is the missing piece and that that QB will fit his system.

Correctamundo.

Broncos_OTM
11-15-2009, 08:29 AM
O.K. everyone thinks Cutler sucks. Who the heck did we get for Cutler?

Orton - He's terrible!
Ayers - Sure haven't seen it yet
Smith - 5'9" scrub...reason we got Law
Moreno - Looks like a slow version of Reggie Bush to me
Quinn - Has he even played yet?

Look, the bottom line. I don't see how anyone can say whether we got the better side of this trade. The Bears got cutler and Knox...we got some of that scrub list above.

Anyone who thinks this was such lopsided trade is snorting it!

Dude if anything Moreno is the Anti Bush i dont see the comparison. Reggie bush cannot pick up the blitz wasnt known to do this Moreno was. Bush has blistering speed. Moreno not so much. Moreno runs it up the middle bush cant. Bush can turn the corner moreno cant.

We are going to compare rookies to the way New England uses them... Special Teams. Situational Football. RARELY does players there get starting gigs. The only pick i am not happy right now about is Moreno. But well see how he does next year. After we shore it up in the middle. Logan Mankins come on DOWN.

elsid13
11-15-2009, 08:37 AM
Dan Lefevour of Central Michigan is someone I'd want the Broncos to look at if looking for a QB.

I think Lefevour is great college QB, but I think he going to struggle with lack of arm strength. His throws just takes to long to hit receivers on intermediate routes. It to bad, because the kid is a winner.

Hamrob
11-15-2009, 10:07 AM
Dude if anything Moreno is the Anti Bush i dont see the comparison. Reggie bush cannot pick up the blitz wasnt known to do this Moreno was. Bush has blistering speed. Moreno not so much. Moreno runs it up the middle bush cant. Bush can turn the corner moreno cant.

We are going to compare rookies to the way New England uses them... Special Teams. Situational Football. RARELY does players there get starting gigs. The only pick i am not happy right now about is Moreno. But well see how he does next year. After we shore it up in the middle. Logan Mankins come on DOWN.Fair comments. I say Moreno reminds me of Bush, because he likes to dance too dam much. Instead of just hitting the hole, he's jumping in the air, twisting around, running lateral to the line of scrimmage and trying to be cute. Add to all of that...he's slow. Has the kid hit one run for more than 20yds all year? Yes, he's a rookie, but from what I've seen thus far....he's not your prototype RB. I really wish we would have used that pick on the defense. Personally If I was going to take a RB in round 1, I would have taken Brown later in round one.

Hamrob
11-15-2009, 10:15 AM
Why are you even including Smith and Moreno in this list? And leaving out the 2010 Chicago pick? The trade boils down to Cutler/Knox for Orton/Ayers/top-15 pick/1 of the picks moved for Quinn.

Even assuming Quinn is a complete bust (and I'm far from saying that's the case), I'd rather have Orton/Ayers/1st than Knox and Cutler with that ridiculous contract. Certainly not the best trade ever in the NFL, but it's a deal that I'd make again without hesitation.It doesn't matter if it was our pick or the Bears pick that got traded away. The only reason that we traded our pick is because we had the Bears pick. When you make a trade like this everything gets jumbled up and you can never make an apples to apples comparison.

For the record, I like Ayers and I think he's turn out well.
I don't like Smith at 5'9"...he's a nickle at best and a waste of a #1
I'm concerned about Moreno...I just don't see him being a stud starting NFL RB.
I think we way over spent for Quinn and could have gotten similar value later on in the draft....big time reach
I like McBath...I think he turns out well for us....he's a contributer now.

My whole point on all of this is: It is way too early to say who got the better end of this deal. Cutler could come back next year and lead the Bears to the playoffs and our guys could do nothing at all. Or our guys could all turn out to be starters and help us win playoff games. Or Cutler ends up being Jeff George and all of our guys end up fizzeling out.

Right now, you can't tell anything!