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BroncoInferno
10-22-2009, 09:59 AM
To be fair Rev, Orton had a better defense last year than Cutler is working with this year. With Urlacher out that defense has taken a hit.

Not true. This seasons Bears D has been slightly bettter than in 2008. They are allowing 306.2 yards and 19.8 points per game. Last season they allowed 334.7 yards and 21.9 points per game.

TonyR
10-22-2009, 10:01 AM
How does he have the same cast? Half the starting defense is already injured.

Their D is currently 13th in ypg and 15 in ppg. That's actually better than last year's 21st and 16th. So you'll need a different excuse. And "half" is a bit of an exaggeration, no?


(Inferno beat me to it above...)

oubronco
10-22-2009, 10:04 AM
To be fair Rev, Orton had a better defense last year than Cutler is working with this year. With Urlacher out that defense has taken a hit.

But its not the defense that has lost their two games. Its Cutler's red zone turnovers. Despite them, they have been in the games, but those red zone turnovers cost his team points.

I suppose Forte's 2 fumbles inside the 5 yd line were Cutler's fault too right

You do realise a team is made up of more than 1 guy don't you?

jhns
10-22-2009, 10:05 AM
Dude I have no idea what the **** you are talking about

Good, looks like we are in the same position.

baja
10-22-2009, 10:06 AM
Anybody want to take a stab at what j. h. n. s. is an acronym for?

Greybeard
10-22-2009, 10:07 AM
To be fair Rev, Orton had a better defense last year than Cutler is working with this year. With Urlacher out that defense has taken a hit.

But its not the defense that has lost their two games. Its Cutler's red zone turnovers. Despite them, they have been in the games, but those red zone turnovers cost his team points.

Chicago's pass defense was #30 in the league last year.

They blew at least three games for Orton.

-----

jhns
10-22-2009, 10:08 AM
Their D is currently 13th in ypg and 15 in ppg. That's actually better than last year's 21st and 16th. So you'll need a different excuse. And "half" is a bit of an exaggeration, no?


(Inferno beat me to it above...)

Ok, now learn the NFL. Look at turnovers and scoring defense/special teams. You are telling me they are as good as last year? Btw, those rankings are ortons and the offenses fault. They were very good per drive. They just saw the most drives in the league because the offense went 3 and out so often. Why do you think they were so desperate to do something about the offense?

TailgateNut
10-22-2009, 10:08 AM
Anybody want to take a stab at what j. h. n. s. is an acronym for?

Just Havin No Sense

jhns
10-22-2009, 10:12 AM
BB has a higher IQ than the other two combined and squared.

Then there is this guy. Yet again, only showing up in an attempt to insult people. Never does he talk football here or even try to. According to the troll mafia, this is a good poster. Maybe I will just start posting like him and the troll mafia will think I am a good poster.

You are all a bunch of dumb dumb heads!

Is that better?

Greybeard
10-22-2009, 10:15 AM
Ok, now learn the NFL. Look at turnovers and scoring defense/special teams. You are telling me they are as good as last year? Btw, those rankings are ortons and the offenses fault. They were very good per drive. They just saw the most drives in the league because the offense went 3 and out so often. Why do you think they were so desperate to do something about the offense?

So they went after the QB, when their O-line and WRs were so putrid. Right.

So they jettisoned the QB for one they thought was all-world.

The results speak for themselves . . .

-----

TailgateNut
10-22-2009, 10:18 AM
So they went after the QB, when their O-line and WRs were so putrid. Right.

So they jettisoned the QB for one they thought was all-world.

The results speak for themselves . . .

-----

I wonder what Lovie is thinking about his trade now.

I know who's laughing all the way to the Bank.:wiggle:

jhns
10-22-2009, 10:21 AM
So they went after the QB, when their O-line and WRs were so putrid. Right.

So they jettisoned the QB for one they thought was all-world.

The results speak for themselves . . .

-----

The results? After 5 games we are saying they failed in the trade that effects the next 10+ years? Hmmm, again with that intelligent conversation thing. You butthurt crybabies aren't capable of one. You then get mad that I post dumb stuff? I don't get it.

oubronco
10-22-2009, 10:24 AM
The results? After 5 games we are saying they failed in the trade that effects the next 10+ years? Hmmm, again with that intelligent conversation thing. You butthurt crybabies aren't capable of one. You then get mad that I post dumb stuff? I don't get it.

Please go away

Greybeard
10-22-2009, 10:34 AM
The results? After 5 games we are saying they failed in the trade that effects the next 10+ years? Hmmm, again with that intelligent conversation thing. You butthurt crybabies aren't capable of one. You then get mad that I post dumb stuff? I don't get it.

Hmmm . . . ?

When did I get mad? ??? I never said anything about your posting to this point.

I'm not comparing the quarterbacks. I am comparing the respective quarterbacks'
situations. Orton has an O-line, receivers, RBs, and defense, all that are among
the best in the league.

Cutler has an O-line and WRs, both among the worst in the league, and a
mediocre defense.

What does that tell you?

That tells me the Bears blew it. For all the money they paid Cutler, they
could have gotten decent players in the O-line and WR positions and in
strategic positions among the defense, and saved all those draft choices
they sent off for Cutler, and they would have had a juggernaut.

Oh yeah . . . and change out the coaching staff, too . . .

-----

jhns
10-22-2009, 10:41 AM
Hmmm . . . ?

When did I get mad? ??? I never said anything about your posting to this point.

I'm not comparing the quarterbacks. I am comparing the respective quarterbacks'
situations. Orton has an O-line, receivers, RBs, and defense, all that are among
the best in the league.

Cutler has an O-line and WRs, both among the worst in the league, and a
mediocre defense.

What does that tell you?

That tells me the Bears blew it. For all the money they paid Cutler, they
could have gotten decent players in the O-line and WR positions and in
strategic positions among the defense, and saved all those draft choices
they sent off for Cutler, and they would have had a juggernaut.

Oh yeah . . . and change out the coaching staff, too . . .

-----

You are right, you weren't part of it. Sorry for the last post. That is actually a good argument. That being said, I still think it is very early to say that. The defense could be a lot better if not for injury. It has still played well with the injuries and kept that team in games. As for the rest of the offense, they may have screwed themselves. That is something we will find out in the future.

This was a trade made for the next 10+ years of Bears football though. Maybe they are confident they can still build around him with lower picks and free agency. If they win a SB or two with Cutler, even 6 years from now, they surely won't think the trade was dumb.

jhns
10-22-2009, 10:44 AM
Please go away

I see why you said that now. I didn't mean to quote you that post, it was supposed to be the post you quoted that I was responding to. I am on my phone and get mixed up sometimes as it is hard to see.

TonyR
10-22-2009, 10:55 AM
Ok, now learn the NFL.

Learn the NFL? Seriously? Look, jhns, no matter how you spin it Chi's D isn't much, if any, worse than last year's at this point. So stop using that as your excuse for the fact that Jay Cutler hasn't propelled them to greatness.

Look, I have no problem with the trade from their standpoint. I understand why they did it and think it makes some sense. At the same time many of us, myself included, knew that there were some very likely problems they were going to encounter. The defense is good but not all that great. Cutler wouldn't have as good of offensive talent around him. The coaching is mediocre at best. And they don't have the draft picks to turn it around quickly. The McD/Bowlen haters and chicken littles wouldn't listen to these arguments. Now you're changing your story and making excuses. The Bears made their bed and you made yours. Now lay in it. Or lie in it. Whichever is correct.

rastaman
10-22-2009, 11:03 AM
I wonder what Lovie is thinking about his trade now.

I know who's laughing all the way to the Bank.:wiggle:

Exactly! Lovee was thinking once they got Cutler, Cutler would be All World. Jay would instantly "will" or make the O Line open running lanes for Ike Forte' so opposing Defenses wouldn't sell out to stop the Bears passing attack.

To be fair on one QB can make a team a SB contender or champion. The Bears will make every effort to surround Cutler with the core intangibles and players to put the team over the top.

baja
10-22-2009, 11:07 AM
Learn the NFL? Seriously? Look, jhns, no matter how you spin it Chi's D isn't much, if any, worse than last year's at this point. So stop using that as your excuse for the fact that Jay Cutler hasn't propelled them to greatness.

Look, I have no problem with the trade from their standpoint. I understand why they did it and think it makes some sense. At the same time many of us, myself included, knew that there were some very likely problems they were going to encounter. The defense is good but not all that great. Cutler wouldn't have as good of offensive talent around him. The coaching is mediocre at best. And they don't have the draft picks to turn it around quickly. The McD/Bowlen haters and chicken littles wouldn't listen to these arguments. Now you're changing your story and making excuses. The Bears made their bed and you made yours. Now lay in it. Or lie in it. Whichever is correct.

It's like when Bowlen said, "I guess Jay is the man around here" and you could see it pained him to say that, enough to trade his ass soon as he got value. There is no strong coaching leadership in Chicago to reign in Cutler. You can see his mechanics are getting worse with each passing week. In short Jay Cutler is not headed in an upward direction right now.

Now ask that same question about Orton, which direction is Kyle headed?

jhns
10-22-2009, 11:12 AM
Learn the NFL? Seriously? Look, jhns, no matter how you spin it Chi's D isn't much, if any, worse than last year's at this point. So stop using that as your excuse for the fact that Jay Cutler hasn't propelled them to greatness.

Look, I have no problem with the trade from their standpoint. I understand why they did it and think it makes some sense. At the same time many of us, myself included, knew that there were some very likely problems they were going to encounter. The defense is good but not all that great. Cutler wouldn't have as good of offensive talent around him. The coaching is mediocre at best. And they don't have the draft picks to turn it around quickly. The McD/Bowlen haters and chicken littles wouldn't listen to these arguments. Now you're changing your story and making excuses. The Bears made their bed and you made yours. Now lay in it. Or lie in it. Whichever is correct.

I state facts. They aren't excuses. They have played 5 games. Their defense has a ton of injuries and to key players. It isn't the same defense as last year no matter how much you guys say it is. It isn't an excuse, I said earlier in this thread that they still need to win more than last year. I just pointed out that they aren't working with exactly the same team other than QB, which is what others are saying. Their defense isn't as good though so far. Again, look at turnovers and scoring defense. Those two alone will give you a much better picture to work with. You know how you guys keep claiming turnovers are everything? That goes for defense also.

Who says Cutler won't make them much better? Because he had one real bad game that also happens to be his first ever on that team? Again, the only argument I had in this thread is that both teams are happy with the trade right now. You want proof? Look at the contract they just gave Cutler. I don't think our side needs explained.

If you don't agree with that, fine. Argue against that though. The troll mafia would rather pretend I said orton sucks, we are worse, cutler is god, and we are better with god. That is why I have pretty much just been making fun of people in this thread. I figure it is fun to troll the troll mafia. I don't know what you mean with me changing my argument because I haven't said anything serious since the troll mafia showed up.

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:16 AM
What you see as anti - Jay is more a case of calling it like it is (From most of us) hell even the more realistic Bears fans are saying the same things the bulk of us.
No they're not ... I have no idea where you get that. I was on there for about 30-45 minutes right after the Falcons loss, and nobody was bagging on Jay even 1 percent like you are.

And I posted earlier that the Jay-hating here is entirely understandable, I have no problem with it. This is a Broncos fan site after all, and Jay asked to be traded ... so it makes sense.


Dude your arguing partner is broncofan 7 & Jfeeble, that should tell you something.
Like I said, it's not a popularity contest, seems like you missed that point. But if you want a popularity contest, fine. On this site my opinion loses 10-1. Off this site my opinion wins 50-1. So I guess I'm more popular than you after all. ;D

I have no problem with your opinion, baja, none at all. It's you attacking my/our opinion ... I hope you can admit that you are on offense, and we are on defense. So what does that tell you? It should tell you that you're offended/threatened by our opinions. If you were not, you wouldn't be so engaged. You've been following me all over this site every time I'm here lately, poking me over and over. You've posted I'm "on the fence" about a dozen times the last three days alone. I have no idea what that even means ???

If I bother you that much, maybe put me on ignore or just avoid me?

TailgateNut
10-22-2009, 11:33 AM
Plus Kyle has a much MUCH better defense here than Jay did. How can you keep saying "O-line and WRs, O-line and WRs", while completely forgetting that in his two full years here, Jay had the worst defense in the league (2 years combined)? Or losing 35 pounds and sleeping 12 hours a day in the '07 season? Those two factors are far more impactful on results than o-line and WRs.

For a month now I've been saying Orton is better for Josh than Jay would have been ... no way Cutler does any better this year than Kyle has, no way no way. And I'm pretty much willing to say we won the trade (I count Alphonso as the 2nd first-rounder). So why can't the "opposition" here just admit Jay is a stud? A somewhat immature stud for whom the sky is the limit? Seems like an easy call to me ....

What's with the "Stud" reference. Is he breeding material?

Spider
10-22-2009, 11:34 AM
Yeah, that whole one man team argument again. It is a good one, ill give you that....

not really that argument , cause Grossman screwed the pooch .........

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:35 AM
What's with the "Stud" reference. Is he breeding material?

LOL ... doubting that. Your friend's daughter confirmed what I've thought all along, he's far from a lady's man.

In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if someday we all learn something interesting about Jay (I like him anyway though ;D)

TonyR
10-22-2009, 11:36 AM
Your friend's daughter confirmed what I've thought all along, he's far from a lady's man. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if someday we all learn something interesting about Jay.

No fair not sharing whatever you know with everyone!

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:37 AM
No fair not sharing whatever you know with everyone!

I know NOTHING!

Wouldn't be a bit surprised, though.

TailgateNut
10-22-2009, 11:37 AM
LOL ... doubting that. Your friend's daughter confirmed what I've thought all along, he's far from a lady's man. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if someday we all learn something interesting about Jay.

I like him anyway though.

She didn't imply that he was "of the other persuasion", she just said he was a big jerk and acted like his (and I quote) **** didn't stink.

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:38 AM
She didn't imply that he was "of the other persuasion", she just said he was a big jerk and acted like his (and I quote) **** didn't stink.
Okay, fair enough. I'm not surprised at that, either :~ohyah!:


But that possibility puts a whole new spin on the term, "he plays on the other team" ROFL!

TailgateNut
10-22-2009, 11:41 AM
Okay, fair enough. I'm not surprised at that, either :~ohyah!:

...and it couldn't have been because of her looks. She's a FINE young intelligent woman. Maybe he has a problem associating with intelligent people. :wiggle:

Miss I.
10-22-2009, 11:42 AM
LOL ... doubting that. Your friend's daughter confirmed what I've thought all along, he's far from a lady's man.

In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if someday we all learn something interesting about Jay (I like him anyway though ;D)

The only way we would learn that is after he's retired. The NFL is a fairly hostile work environment for that. It's not just a "Dont' Ask Don't Tell," it's a "Even hint at it, and we will end you." I read about how badly it goes for professional athletes, particularly in the NFL to be able to be open about.

And to be fair, if ya'll thought Elway played for the "Raiders," you don't think you wouldn't hold it against him, perhaps even more so then him playing for Oakland itself. Just saying, the NFL is not known for that kind of tolerance. It can tolerate a dog murderer, wife beaters, drug addicts, gamblers, but not the last one.

baja
10-22-2009, 11:45 AM
No they're not ... I have no idea where you get that. I was on there for about 30-45 minutes right after the Falcons loss, and nobody was bagging on Jay even 1 percent like you are.

And I posted earlier that the Jay-hating here is entirely understandable, I have no problem with it. This is a Broncos fan site after all, and Jay asked to be traded ... so it makes sense.



Like I said, it's not a popularity contest, seems like you missed that point. But if you want a popularity contest, fine. On this site my opinion loses 10-1. Off this site my opinion wins 50-1. So I guess I'm more popular than you after all. ;D

I have no problem with your opinion, baja, none at all. It's you attacking my/our opinion ... I hope you can admit that you are on offense, and we are on defense. So what does that tell you? It should tell you that you're offended/threatened by our opinions. If you were not, you wouldn't be so engaged. You've been following me all over this site every time I'm here lately, poking me over and over. You've posted I'm "on the fence" about a dozen times the last three days alone. I have no idea what that even means ???

If I bother you that much, maybe put me on ignore or just avoid me?

I'm just having fun with you but I would have thought that was obvious to you. ;D

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:45 AM
The only way we would learn that is after he's retired. The NFL is a fairly hostile work environment for that. It's not just a "Dont' Ask Don't Tell," it's a "Even hint at it, and we will end you." I read about how badly it goes for professional athletes, particularly in the NFL to be able to be open about.

Yes, no doubt. The pink shoes are about as far as they'll ever go.

TailgateNut
10-22-2009, 11:46 AM
The only way we would learn that is after he's retired. The NFL is a fairly hostile work environment for that. It's not just a "Dont' Ask Don't Tell," it's a "Even hint at it, and we will end you." I read about how badly it goes for professional athletes, particularly in the NFL to be able to be open about.

And to be fair, if ya'll thought Elway played for the "Raiders," you don't think you wouldn't hold it against him, perhaps even more so then him playing for Oakland itself. Just saying, the NFL is not known for that kind of tolerance. It can tolerate a dog murderer, wife beaters, drug addicts, gamblers, but not the last one.

Females would be accepted before "She"males. Just saying.

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:49 AM
I'm just having fun with you but I would have thought that was obvious to you. ;D

Most of the time it seems fun, yeah.

But when I let my guard down, that's when you yank that shiv right up under my ribcage, and I gasp through coughed up blood, "why ... didn't ... I ... see ... this ... coming?" :~ohyah!:

broncosteven
10-22-2009, 01:07 PM
Most of the time it seems fun, yeah.

But when I let my guard down, that's when you yank that shiv right up under my ribcage, and I gasp through coughed up blood, "why ... didn't ... I ... see ... this ... coming?" :~ohyah!:

I agree with this post.

baja
10-22-2009, 01:09 PM
Most of the time it seems fun, yeah.

But when I let my guard down, that's when you yank that shiv right up under my ribcage, and I gasp through coughed up blood, "why ... didn't ... I ... see ... this ... coming?" :~ohyah!:

I known for that but hey I'm workin on it.;D


.


.


.

It's all good Buff, if nothing else remember that.;D

baja
10-22-2009, 01:11 PM
I agree with this post.

And you....

Why don't you get your wuss 'adopt-a-Bronco' out on the field.

Greybeard
10-22-2009, 01:14 PM
And you....

Why don't you get your wuss 'adopt-a-Bronco' out on the field.

Larsen? Wuss?

That's a pretty stupid remark . . .

-----

baja
10-22-2009, 01:16 PM
Larsen? Wuss?

That's a pretty stupid remark . . .

-----

Oh ya where is he than.

Greybeard
10-22-2009, 01:20 PM
Oh ya where is he than.

This was a stupid one, too.

-----

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 01:23 PM
baja is too dry for the room.

Next time baja, insert on of these. Then they'll know you're joking: :wave: :yayaya: ;) :giggle: ;D :~ohyah!: Ha!

baja
10-22-2009, 02:04 PM
This was a stupid one, too.

-----

That settles it I gave ya two chances but you're staying with obtuse.

jhns
10-22-2009, 03:25 PM
So I go to a couple of meetings and you guys just let the thread die? How can I troll a dead thread? I am at like 70 posts in the thread. If it happens to live through tomorrow I can maybe get to 100. Are you all not having fun or what?

broncosteven
10-22-2009, 03:27 PM
Oh ya where is he than.

He hurt his shoulder throwing "Thor's hammer" around in the locker room before a game.

Odin had to give one of his eyes to a troll in order to drink from the pool of water under the tree of life in order to see the future and heal Larsen. He liked what he saw in regards to the Broncos season, bought a wide brimmed hat to cover his eye and forgot about Larsen while traveling the countryside seeking shelter from humble people leaving gifts to those that offered their food or hearth to him.

You have to be really into Norse myths to get this post.

baja
10-22-2009, 03:39 PM
He hurt his shoulder throwing "Thor's hammer" around in the locker room before a game.

Odin had to give one of his eyes to a troll in order to drink from the pool of water under the tree of life in order to see the future and heal Larsen. He liked what he saw in regards to the Broncos season, bought a wide brimmed hat to cover his eye and forgot about Larsen while traveling the countryside seeking shelter from humble people leaving gifts to those that offered their food or hearth to him.

You have to be really into Norse myths to get this post.


so he'll be activated for the 'Ravens' game than.

fdf
10-22-2009, 05:35 PM
She didn't imply that he was "of the other persuasion", she just said he was a big jerk and acted like his (and I quote) **** didn't stink.

Well. I know someone who saw him in the bathroom in a bar in LoDo and said it didn't stink at all. Some guys have all the luck . . .

Spider
10-22-2009, 05:56 PM
I am going to go eat , when I get back , I want this thread gone ............ Do u people understand me ?

fdf
10-22-2009, 08:19 PM
. . . .Cutler has an O-line and WRs, both among the worst in the league, and a mediocre defense.

What does that tell you?

That tells me the Bears blew it. . . .

It tells me Cutler blew it, too.

I never did understand why he wanted out so badly--and he obviously did. He had an OL that kept his jersey spotless and some really good wides, two good TE's (one blooming into a premier receiving TE) and a new coach committed to fixing the D. Granted RB was thin; but even that was adequate until a bizarre series of injuries.

I suspect there's a completely untold story. Either new management told him that he was going to have to change his QB style a LOT to fit into the new system or he read the play book and didn't like the short passing game or there was a discussion with new management about drinking or something else that really pissed Cutler off. But what do I know?

I hope Chicago and Cutler have a bad year this year. After that, I just don't care except that I'd like to know the real story. I don't like it when there is no good explanation for how things went down.

theAPAOps5
10-22-2009, 08:23 PM
I am going to go eat , when I get back , I want this thread gone ............ Do u people understand me ?

bump

go get me a beer....... :)

Spider
10-22-2009, 08:37 PM
bump

go get me a beer....... :)

thats not the answer I am looking for

Greybeard
10-22-2009, 09:55 PM
I am going to go eat , when I get back , I want this thread gone ............ Do u people understand me ?

You know I like you and all, Spidey, but I respectfully must decline . . .

http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh256/AZDynamics/Goofies/bushfinger.jpg

-----

Steve Sewell
10-22-2009, 10:19 PM
If I use dumb logic, it is because that is what is being used against my argument.


This is one of the most absurd statements I have ever read, and that's saying something.

theAPAOps5
10-22-2009, 10:37 PM
thats not the answer I am looking for

beer NOW! :kiss:

BroncoBuff
10-22-2009, 11:02 PM
I am going to go eat , when I get back , I want this thread gone ............ Do u people understand me ?

That's just funny ... one of the funnier posts I've read in quite awhile Ha!

jhns
10-23-2009, 07:17 AM
This is one of the most absurd statements I have ever read, and that's saying something.

I do shoot for the stars.

Circle Orange
10-24-2009, 08:24 PM
its crazy the phenomenon that happens, orton gets zero credit for winning games, its always everyone else around him, but cutler gets ALL the credit for winning and all the excuses for why he lost, never his fault...

It's called "temporal memory" and they've got a boatload of it in Chicago. Grossman was talented too, but ultimately it didn't work out. Cutler at least is getting the benefit of having all of Chicago's (limited) offensive weapons in the lineup and healthy at the same time.

Course, he's still the king of nowhere. Looks ok 20/20. And really, Chicago's offense still looks the same when you hit the mute button.

lex
10-29-2009, 12:10 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v359/lexlucid/mcdaniels-models-cutler-jersey-300x.jpg