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DenverBrit
09-18-2009, 09:30 AM
Here's hoping! :thumbsup:

Moreno poised for a breakout
After a rough start to his NFL career, Broncos rookie says he's healthy
By Jeff Legwold

Since Bobby Turner was hired by the Broncos in 1995, he's seen running backs come, seen them go.

Seen them come into the huddle, then go for touchdowns. Seen a league-leading 14 running backs compile a league-leading 95 100-yard rushing games over that span.

When Turner turned on the video of a University of Georgia running back earlier this year, he saw "a person that was a complete package, and that's what we're always looking for," he said.

He saw Knowshon Moreno.

"He could do everything," Turner said. "He can do pass protection, he can block, he can catch, and obviously to be a running back you've got to be able to run the ball."

Still, it's safe to say Moreno has been rudely introduced to life
in an NFL backfield. First there was the contract impasse that kept Moreno out of training camp's early going. Then there were all of three carries in the preseason before a sprained knee put him on the sideline.

Then there was Sunday, when, in his debut, he finished with only 19 yards on eight carries in the season opener at Cincinnati before leaving the game because he took a blow to the side of the helmet as he was forced out of bounds.

"Not that good, not that good at all," Moreno said when asked to critique his first game. "I missed a lot of things. Maybe I was trying to go too fast, trying to do too much. But I'm glad to get that first one under my belt, and we can move on from here. That's how I'm approaching it."

Moreno said he feels "100 percent" this week and that he doesn't believe he ran tentatively against the Bengals because of his preseason knee injury. Moreno missed three preseason games with a sprained medial collateral ligament.

He thinks, if anything, he was impatient and more than a little surprised at how much quicker the game is played in the NFL.

"I just missed a lot of reads, missed a lot of reads," Moreno said. "Making the wrong one, making it go outside instead of inside, things like that. It was my first game back, and I had to shake some of the cobwebs out. I wasn't used to that speed. I guess that counts for being a rookie."

Moreno appeared on third down plenty, a rare spot for a rookie running back playing for Turner. That's because the back in the formation on third down not only has to be functional as a receiver, but be willing and able to block pass rushers who may break free. Scouts consistently listed that as Moreno's strength coming into the draft.

Broncos coach Josh McDan- iels attributed Moreno's difficult day on the Cincinnati riverfront to a more basic issue.

"All the rookies . . . need to understand, this is not college football, and they make a mistake now, they don't get away with it," McDaniels said. "Each one of them saw, whether they made one mistake in the game or five, you make an error, the guys on the other side of the ball are too good. They exploit it, they see it, find it and they make it go for their side. Knowshon is in that group."

This week the Broncos face a Browns run defense that joined a long list of teams who have surrendered a big day to Vikings running back Adrian Peterson. Peterson finished with 180 yards rushing last week, but Minnesota had to be patient and keep pounding away to do it.

Peterson, the gold standard for backs in the league, had 25 yards rushing at halftime against Cleveland.

"I'm going to take it as I get it," Moreno said. "When I'm in, I'm going to try to make the best of those plays, and when I'm not, I'm going to be cheering for who's out there.

"I think I'm at full speed, I'm good."

Jeff Legwold: 303-954-2359 or jlegwold@denverpost.com

Tough go

Broncos rookie running back Knowshon Moreno had a tough debut last week. Here's how some of the best rookie backs fared last season:

Running back, team Att. Yds. Avg. TDs
Steve Slaton, Texans 268 1,282 4.8 9
Matt Forte, Bears 316 1,238 3.9 8
Chris Johnson, Titans 251 1,228 4.9 9
Kevin Smith, Lions 238 976 4.1 8
Jonathan Stewart, Panthers 184 836 4.5 10
Darren McFadden, Raiders 113 499 4.4 4
Tashard Choice, Cowboys 92 472 5.1 2
Ray Rice, Ravens 107 454 4.2 0

TOP BRONCOS ROOKIE SEASONS

Year Player Att. Yds. Avg. TDs
2002 Clinton Portis 273 1,508 5.5 15
2000 Mike Anderson 297 1,487 5.0 15
1999 Olandis Gary 276 1,159 4.2 7
1989 Bobby Humphrey 294 1,151 3.9 7
1995 Terrell Davis 237 1,117 4.7 7

Beantown Bronco
09-18-2009, 09:32 AM
Someone should probably buy him some clearasil then.

Garcia Bronco
09-18-2009, 09:33 AM
I don't have confidence in him to block or hit a hole. Missing pre-season was terrible. Plus he's looking more and more like he can't complete a game. I hope this turns around 2 days from now.

Pick Six
09-18-2009, 09:37 AM
The only time I ever questioned McDaniels is when he took Moreno, with Orakpo still on the board. I'm still waiting for Moreno to end up being the second coming of Terrell Davis. We'll see...:thumbs:

dbfan4life
09-18-2009, 09:42 AM
Buckhalter was the better back last week. I'd rather have Moreno playing a back-up role 10-15 carries per game.

gyldenlove
09-18-2009, 09:49 AM
That Broncos rookie list is pretty formidable, 5 guys in 20 years with over 1100 yards as rookies, that is pretty damn special.

watermock
09-18-2009, 09:50 AM
If Moreno is 100%, I didn't like what I saw. Maybe it was hesitation, maybe not.

It looked to me he still was favoring the pcl injury.

That's awfully high to take a back with 4.6 speed

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 09:51 AM
The only time I ever questioned McDaniels is when he took Moreno, with Orakpo still on the board. I'm still waiting for Moreno to end up being the second coming of Terrell Davis. We'll see...:thumbs:

orakpo hasnt done anything this year either, much like ayers prolly wont. atleast moreno can contribute immediately.

Popcorn Sutton
09-18-2009, 09:55 AM
If Moreno is 100%, I didn't like what I saw. Maybe it was hesitation, maybe not.

It looked to me he still was favoring the pcl injury.

That's awfully high to take a back with 4.6 speed

I guess I'll trust Bobbby Turner's opinion over yours. I hope you don't take offense to that. :ouwknow:

beanerbronco
09-18-2009, 10:01 AM
I just hope Moreno does not get the B word attached to his name any time soon bc we took a lot of promising rookies ahead of him who could have had more of an impact on last week's game.

IE. REY MALOULOUPKJAFPIJPIJGA

*WARHORSE*
09-18-2009, 10:09 AM
I guess I'll trust Bobbby Turner's opinion over yours. I hope you don't take offense to that. :ouwknow:



Im in agreement.


Just because a guy can run in college doesnt mean it will translate to the NFL.

But with Moreno, it was definitely him trying to hit the hole too fast.

He ran like Tatum Bell sunday........without vision.

Good thing is, Moreno has vision. Great vision.

He didnt wait for his read and then slam the hole, he just went headlong in the direction of the call.

I have no doubt that he will run better each week. Using his vision quickly, making fast decisions, and then getting downhill until he hits the secondary.

Turner will help him.

BlaK-Argentina
09-18-2009, 10:12 AM
Shockingly I'm not surprised that people are worried about him being a bust after ONE game after missing most of training camp and all of the preseason. This is the Mane, you know?

Chris
09-18-2009, 10:22 AM
Shockingly I'm not surprised that people are worried about him being a bust after ONE game after missing most of training camp and all of the preseason. This is the Mane, you know?

I'm just looking at your profile picture.

oubronco
09-18-2009, 10:25 AM
Moreno and the running game will be just fine

dbfan4life
09-18-2009, 10:28 AM
No one called or expressed concern that he is a bust, Blak, just unimpressed with week 1 performance. I think Buckhalter looked better out there. Moreno has a lot to work on from week 1. I don't think there is a real need to push him into action so fast.

Pony Boy
09-18-2009, 10:32 AM
If Moreno is 100%, I didn't like what I saw. Maybe it was hesitation, maybe not.

It looked to me he still was favoring the pcl injury.

That's awfully high to take a back with 4.6 speed

I agree he can't 100% , not running like he did in college. He had that Tutum (cell phone) Bell tiptoe look................

Old Dude
09-18-2009, 10:38 AM
The only time I ever questioned McDaniels is when he took Moreno, with Orakpo still on the board. I'm still waiting for Moreno to end up being the second coming of Terrell Davis. We'll see...:thumbs:

The ironic thing is that the writeup of Orakpo's first NFL game was very similar:

NFL's Speed Catches Up to Orakpo

Although rookie defensive end/strong-side linebacker Brian Orakpo impressed in the preseason, he was not prepared for the speed of play in an NFL season opener, defensive coordinator Greg Blache said.

"He had no issues in coverage. His coverage wasn't the issue," Blache said. "The thing that happened to Brian, and happens to any rookie in that first ballgame, [is] the speed of it is 10 times more than you ever imagined. You play in the preseason, you say, 'I can play in this league.' On Sunday in the opener, the intensity level, the speed, is at a whole different dimension he's never dreamed of before. He's nervous. He's antsy.

"But I thought for a rookie it's good he got it out of the way. He'll play better this week. But at the same time, he wasn't bad last week. He played better before, but in the first ballgame, you know that's going to happen. That's part of his maturity process. That's part of him becoming a great pro. Brian's going to have a great rookie season. He'll be better this week because he's been baptized through the fire."


http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/jason-reid/nfls-speed-catches-up-to-orakp.html

JDB7821
09-18-2009, 10:44 AM
Take this from a UGA fan who has seen most of Knowshon's college games: he is the real deal. I called the Broncos drafting Knowshon midway through the season and I guarantee he will be in the rookie of the year running at the end of the year. You have nothing to worry about with this guy. It's unfortunate that he's gotten hurt a couple of times, but he was an iron man in college. Just wait until you see him take a huge hit and make his patented jump up and get back to the huddle. No worries guys.

beanerbronco
09-18-2009, 10:45 AM
Shockingly I'm not surprised that people are worried about him being a bust after ONE game after missing most of training camp and all of the preseason. This is the Mane, you know?

I did say I hope he doesn't get the B word attached to his name. Meaning I hope ppl dnt call him a bust. But yeh I did google your picture last night lol. She has some nice videos

bronco militia
09-18-2009, 10:51 AM
Someone should probably buy him some clearasil then.

Ha!

BlaK-Argentina
09-18-2009, 11:03 AM
I did say I hope he doesn't get the B word attached to his name. Meaning I hope ppl dnt call him a bust. But yeh I did google your picture last night lol. She has some nice videos

Can't fault you for that! :thanku:

I misread your post because yours was the one that made me post. :P I hope Knowshon has a big game this week.

Popps
09-18-2009, 11:20 AM
That's awfully high to take a back with 4.6 speed

Again, Mock... we've already educated you several times to the importance of running in track shorts as it relates to football.

Most of the elite RBs in the history of the game didn't have elite speed.

It's anyone's guess why you remain obsessed with a guy's 40 yard dash time, particularly when the greatest Bronco RB of all-time only had marginal speed.

Then again, you're the one that campaigned for Justin Fargas and Vernon Davis as franchise-changing players.

Br0nc0Buster
09-18-2009, 11:23 AM
Again, Mock... we've already educated you several times to the importance of running in track shorts as it relates to football.

Most of the elite RBs in the history of the game didn't have elite speed.

It's anyone's guess why you remain obsessed with a guy's 40 yard dash time, particularly when the greatest Bronco RB of all-time only had marginal speed.

Then again, you're the one that campaigned for Justin Fargas and Vernon Davis as franchise-changing players.

It seems he has taken a page from the Al Davis when it comes to drafting

"**** it, lets go with the fastest guy"

rmsanger
09-18-2009, 11:40 AM
I honestly doubt the hype machine that is Moreno.. He'll have a few decent games this season but the impact that many of your are expecting simply will not happen this year.

watermock
09-18-2009, 12:07 PM
Again, Mock... we've already educated you several times to the importance of running in track shorts as it relates to football.

Most of the elite RBs in the history of the game didn't have elite speed.

It's anyone's guess why you remain obsessed with a guy's 40 yard dash time, particularly when the greatest Bronco RB of all-time only had marginal speed.

Then again, you're the one that campaigned for Justin Fargas and Vernon Davis as franchise-changing players.

Actually Singleterry love Vernon, his HC just couldn't reach him. BTW, that's Mike Nolan.

Considering where Fargas was taken, he's been a pretty good back with good ypc and relatively healthy, at least he has speed.

I'm not obsessed with a 40 time.

I seriosly doubt many have been taken that high that slow.

When he shows some burst at the NFL level, we'll all know, but to him say he's 100%, it sure didn't l;ook like it last week.

Good runners can be found in the 2nd round up to UFA's.

See Mike Bell's numbers last week? STFU.

Garcia Bronco
09-18-2009, 12:09 PM
If Moreno is 100%, I didn't like what I saw. Maybe it was hesitation, maybe not.

It looked to me he still was favoring the pcl injury.

That's awfully high to take a back with 4.6 speed

His vison and block aren't there yet.

Garcia Bronco
09-18-2009, 12:09 PM
i just hope moreno does not get the b word attached to his name any time soon bc we took a lot of promising rookies ahead of him who could have had more of an impact on last week's game.

Ie. Rey malouloupkjafpijpijga

bs

watermock
09-18-2009, 12:11 PM
It seems he has taken a page from the Al Davis when it comes to drafting

"**** it, lets go with the fastest guy"

Where was AP taken again?
7th I think, maybe we could of traded up a little.

Would of better than Moss right? STFU

fdf
09-18-2009, 12:33 PM
I don't think Legwold has much data to base "breakout" on. Hope it happens. But we just haven't seen enuf of Moreno to get anywhere close to terms like breakout.

Br0nc0Buster
09-18-2009, 12:37 PM
Where was AP taken again?
7th I think, maybe we could of traded up a little.

Would of better than Moss right? STFU

Ok.....

How does this relate to Knowshon?

watermock
09-18-2009, 12:51 PM
If Knowshon is 100% and that slow, I don't care if he can block and catch. Hillis can do that, and honestly, looks faster to me, or at least AS fast.

Add in the fact that SF DOMINATED AZ week 1, our only preseason win.

BTW, Moreno was our 1st pick of three, err, 2 firdst rounders.

A first round RB should come out of the gate better than this, stating he's 100% is worrysome..

Georgia got it's clock cleaned alot last year.

Popps
09-18-2009, 12:56 PM
A first round RB should come out of the gate better than this, stating he's 100% is worrysome..


You go ahead and panic after one game, Mock.

Good strategy.

Br0nc0Buster
09-18-2009, 01:20 PM
If Knowshon is 100% and that slow, I don't care if he can block and catch. Hillis can do that, and honestly, looks faster to me, or at least AS fast.

Add in the fact that SF DOMINATED AZ week 1, our only preseason win.

BTW, Moreno was our 1st pick of three, err, 2 firdst rounders.

A first round RB should come out of the gate better than this, stating he's 100% is worrysome..

Georgia got it's clock cleaned alot last year.

Well he is still a rookie trying to get used to the game
He missed some of TC and pretty much all of preseason
Plus even though he may say he is 100%, it is tough to know for sure

He was very good at Georgia despite not being known as a burner
Ill give him a few games before getting too down on him

Peterson is a freak, he shouldnt be used as a barometer for RBs because he is a very special player

watermock
09-18-2009, 02:06 PM
I know all that.

BTW, when have I ever trashed Moreno?

He's certainly no AP, but perhaps he was there, but Shanny needed D right?

All I said is for 100%, he looks slow.

Maybe he said that to placate Beavis, who know with this team.

He allready admitted it, the NFL speed suprised him, and he's from the SEC.

In fact, I don't hate any Bronco other than the one in my avy.

LongDongJohnson
09-18-2009, 02:20 PM
yep.
knowshon is a bust

DenverBrit
09-18-2009, 02:43 PM
Yep, McPoopyPants should have traded up and taken AD.....oh, wait....never mind. ;D

DenverBrit
09-18-2009, 02:46 PM
I know all that.

BTW, when have I ever trashed Moreno?

He's certainly no AP, but perhaps he was there, but Shanny needed D right?

All I said is for 100%, he looks slow.

Maybe he said that to placate Beavis, who know with this team.

He allready admitted it, the NFL speed suprised him, and he's from the SEC.

In fact, I don't hate any Bronco other than the one in my avy.

Just like every other Rookie after their first NFL games.

SonOfLe-loLang
09-18-2009, 02:54 PM
I can't believe any of this is being discussed. The guy has less than 20 carries in the NFL. Plus, I thought he looked pretty quick out there. The game will slow for him, vision will come. Td and Portis didn't slam out of the gate either

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 02:56 PM
anyone else notice mock has a little vendetta against moreno personally? if theres a moreno thread, hes here telling us aout his 4.6 speed or how he wasnt worth a top 10 pick. prettttttty crazy.

BlaK-Argentina
09-18-2009, 03:03 PM
I can't believe any of this is being discussed. The guy has less than 20 carries in the NFL. Plus, I thought he looked pretty quick out there. The game will slow for him, vision will come. Td and Portis didn't slam out of the gate either

It's pretty funny actually. Next will be Royal is not the same player in this system because he only caught a couple of balls last week.

The Mane: :clown:

watermock
09-18-2009, 03:13 PM
I can't believe any of this is being discussed. The guy has less than 20 carries in the NFL. Plus, I thought he looked pretty quick out there. The game will slow for him, vision will come. Td and Portis didn't slam out of the gate either

Actually, both did.

The real issue is if this is his 100%, he's going to be a 3ypc guy.

Beavis want's his line blocking, get used to it.

Better get rid of Hamilton then.


Plus, I thought he looked pretty quick out there.

Wow.

I saw a guy that I wondered why he was out there with a healthy Hillis. If he wasn't still injured, he was slow.

Of course, the blocking scheme has changed more than people think too.

watermock
09-18-2009, 03:25 PM
I can't believe you think TD and Portis came out of the gate slow.

TD made a ST tackle or might not of even made the roster.

Portis was a SECOND. That's why he wanted more money, like BM as a 4th.

God, buy a vowel.

Considering we had ZERO BACKS other than Hillis on IR coming back, I would of drafted 2 RB's, considering their lifeline is 5 years.

WTF Beavis want's to change the blocking scheme is beyond me.

Dagmar
09-18-2009, 03:54 PM
I can't believe you think TD and Portis came out of the gate slow.

TD made a ST tackle or might not of even made the roster.

Portis was a SECOND. That's why he wanted more money, like BM as a 4th.

God, buy a vowel.

Considering we had ZERO BACKS other than Hillis on IR coming back, I would of drafted 2 RB's, considering their lifeline is 5 years.

WTF Beavis want's to change the blocking scheme is beyond me.

Could someone please pick apart this complete retard's nonsense?

But...http://api.ning.com/files/TAQisU8LBDTC4tC2heaDQOeZS-Rrz2YNGCp-ALFZ1sJzULMurkS8G5BTohOglWuUPCEePfSXGLMBkHkrH2gmH7 CuAYuO65-A/arguingontheinternet.jpg

watermock
09-18-2009, 04:05 PM
Try picking apart TD's and Portis 1st years first.
BTW, neither were taken anywhere near 11.

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 04:08 PM
Try picking apart TD's and Portis 1st years first.
BTW, neither were taken anywhere near 11.

oooook someone take the LSD away from this man. we picked 12 retard.

watermock
09-18-2009, 04:13 PM
Are you anal?

Oh, sorry 12.

Wow.

We got our 100 off the index card, right?

Such a miracle every pick we worked out huh!

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 04:15 PM
Are you anal?

Oh, sorry 12.

Wow.

We got our 100 off the index card, right?

http://www.essexherald.com/Crystal%20ball%202.jpg

crystal ball says yes.

listopencil
09-18-2009, 04:17 PM
Here's hoping! :thumbsup:



"I just missed a lot of reads, missed a lot of reads," Moreno said. "Making the wrong one, making it go outside instead of inside, things like that. It was my first game back, and I had to shake some of the cobwebs out. I wasn't used to that speed. I guess that counts for being a rookie."



Sounds good. This tells me that they went over film with him (obviously) and that he is taking well to the coaching. I like it when a rookie, or any player on my team, comes out and talks about where he made mistakes and about how he plans to correct them.

listopencil
09-18-2009, 04:27 PM
I saw a guy that I wondered why he was out there with a healthy Hillis. If he wasn't still injured, he was slow.

Of course, the blocking scheme has changed more than people think too.

No doubt. Bring back the ZBS. We have RB's that can shine with it and a line built to run it.


I'd say Moreno has he speed and fluidity to make plays, Hillis has the toughness, the heart and the smarts. I want Hillis over Moreno too. I think he's the better back. At least right now if nothing else. But neither one of them looked all that hot against Cincy last week. They both showed some flashes of their respective strengths but we barely had any plays where the whole Offense worked simultaneously. ****, often they looked like they were running several different plays at the same time.

watermock
09-18-2009, 04:35 PM
Yeah, the line didn't look like what we are used to. At all.

Remember when they were a thing of beauty?

Coming off the snap, everyone aware and in synch.

They looked sloppy and slow off the snap.

Sorry.

watermock
09-18-2009, 04:41 PM
I'm not bashing Moreno, altho I think he went too high.

You want to see some explosion as a rookie.

Hopethe PCL is still bothering him, but again, why put him in there with Hillis if he's still hurt?

BlaK-Argentina
09-18-2009, 05:09 PM
I think Mock posts at BroncosForums too:

I said before the season started that Moreno would be a No-Show, and that the kid was overrated.

So far I've been right on the button.

last week against the Bungles he had an atrocious

8 attempts for 19 yards, and a woeful 2.4 yards per carry.

Sad this is, this wasn't even that great of a defense. going to really suck when he goes up against the better big name defenses in the league.

way to waste a draft pick on this schmuck, McDummy.

baja
09-18-2009, 05:13 PM
I think Mock posts at BroncosForums too:

I said before the season started that Moreno would be a No-Show, and that the kid was overrated.

So far I've been right on the button.

last week against the Bungles he had an atrocious

8 attempts for 19 yards, and a woeful 2.4 yards per carry.

Sad this is, this wasn't even that great of a defense. going to really suck when he goes up against the better big name defenses in the league.

way to waste a draft pick on this schmuck, McDummy.

So many crystal balls on this forum where do you guys buy them?

Popps
09-18-2009, 05:13 PM
I think Mock posts at BroncosForums too:

I said before the season started that Moreno would be a No-Show, and that the kid was overrated.

So far I've been right on the button.

last week against the Bungles he had an atrocious

8 attempts for 19 yards, and a woeful 2.4 yards per carry.

Sad this is, this wasn't even that great of a defense. going to really suck when he goes up against the better big name defenses in the league.

way to waste a draft pick on this schmuck, McDummy.

Hilarious!

Awesome.

BlaK-Argentina
09-18-2009, 05:16 PM
So many crystal balls on this forum where do you guys buy them?

Just to be clear, I got that from BroncosForums. I think that place is worse than this one.

Popps
09-18-2009, 05:35 PM
Just to be clear, I got that from BroncosForums. I think that place is worse than this one.

Hilarious. It's obviously Mock. You can tell how desperately he wants Moreno to fail.

watermock
09-18-2009, 05:46 PM
Hilarious. It's obviously Mock. You can tell how desperately he wants Moreno to fail.

your such an idiot.

Moreno isn't 100%. Any idiot could see that.

If he is, he's nowhere near an 11 or 12 or 24 pick.

I'm sure your feathers will be preened to the fullest should we go 3-0.

Popps
09-18-2009, 05:49 PM
your such an idiot.


:rofl:


Moreno isn't 100%. Any idiot could see that.

If he is, he's nowhere near an 11 or 12 or 24 pick..

Sure, I mean... why would you need more than one game to determine that?
You're the guy that cried for two years about not drafting Fargas and Vernon Davis.

How dare any of us question your ability to call someone a bust after one pro game.

watermock
09-18-2009, 05:59 PM
Keep feeding it.

baja
09-18-2009, 06:03 PM
Keep feeding it.

No only can you milk a hamster but you do all right milking a thread too.

yerner
09-18-2009, 06:04 PM
I actually thought Moreno looked decent. If he is indeed healthy they just need to stop dicking around and start handing the guy the ball. Enough of this situational carries stuff.

broncogary
09-18-2009, 06:07 PM
Again, Mock... we've already educated you several times to the importance of running in track shorts as it relates to football.

Most of the elite RBs in the history of the game didn't have elite speed.

It's anyone's guess why you remain obsessed with a guy's 40 yard dash time, particularly when the greatest Bronco RB of all-time only had marginal speed.

Then again, you're the one that campaigned for Justin Fargas and Vernon Davis as franchise-changing players.

Speaking of education, how about when I educated you about 25 carries per game backs?

Oh, by the way, I think Moreno will be better than T. Davis.

baja
09-18-2009, 06:09 PM
Speaking of education, how about when I educated you about 25 carries per game backs?

<b>Oh, by the way, I think Moreno will be better than T. Davis.

Now there is a ballsy prediction. I sure hope you are right.

watermock
09-18-2009, 06:09 PM
That's Beavis milking Orton.

baja
09-18-2009, 06:10 PM
Just how do you milk a hamster anyway???

Popps
09-18-2009, 06:12 PM
Speaking of education, how about when I educated you about 25 carries per game backs?


Yea, if that ever happened... it would be an interesting story for the folks here.

broncogary
09-18-2009, 06:13 PM
Yea, if that ever happened... it would be an interesting story for the folks here.

Popps: Clinton Portis is not a 25 carry per game back.

broncogary: At this point in time, no back has ever averaged 25 carries per game.

Remember? :wave:

watermock
09-18-2009, 06:15 PM
Speaking of education, how about when I educated you about 25 carries per game backs?

Oh, by the way, I think Moreno will be better than T. Davis.

wow.

We had like 19 caries total last week despite leading the whole game.

watermock
09-18-2009, 06:17 PM
Denver Rushing
CAR YDS AVG TD LG
C. Buckhalter 8 46 5.8 0 14
K. Moreno 8 19 2.4 0 8
L. Jordan 2 5 2.5 0 4
K. Orton 1 3 3.0 0 3
P. Hillis 1 2 2.0 0 2
Team 20 75 3.8 0 14

Popps
09-18-2009, 06:38 PM
Popps: Clinton Portis is not a 25 carry per game back.

broncogary: At this point in time, no back has ever averaged 25 carries per game.

Remember? :wave:

20-25 carries is a bench-mark for a workhorse running back. In the modern NFL, that may be changing, but historically... that's what it's been.

I hope there's a point here, because this is really dull.

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 06:39 PM
you guys should be happy we got moreno, the chargers NEED him right now. LT out, sproles not a 20 touch back, no one else behind them.

baja
09-18-2009, 06:42 PM
you guys should be happy we got moreno, the chargers NEED him right now. LT out, sproles not a 20 touch back, no one else behind them.

I bet more than one draft room let up a collective "Oh Shiit, damn,damn, damn!!!!" when we drafted Moreno

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 06:50 PM
I bet more than one draft room let up a collective "Oh Shiit, damn,damn, damn!!!!" when we drafted Moreno

i dunno if youre joking or not, but it does make sense. we had almost no connection to him, no one thought wed take a RB and i bet several teams hoped he would fall a bit so they could move for him or they thought hed fall to them, which he didnt. im sure we ruined a few draft boards, or atleast made some people scramble.

baja
09-18-2009, 06:57 PM
i dunno if youre joking or not, but it does make sense. we had almost no connection to him, no one thought wed take a RB and i bet several teams hoped he would fall a bit so they could move for him or they thought hed fall to them, which he didnt. im sure we ruined a few draft boards, or atleast made some people scramble.

Historically when a really good player has no teams talking about him it's because they covet him and hope he lasts to their draft position and no I'm not kidding.

broncogary
09-18-2009, 07:05 PM
20-25 carries is a bench-mark for a workhorse running back. In the modern NFL, that may be changing, but historically... that's what it's been.

I hope there's a point here, because this is really dull.

Hey, look. I've become a big fan (minion) since the draft this year of your posts.

In the past, your claim wasn't 20-25 carries, it was 25 carries per game, when no back to that time, before Ricky Williams, that year, did it.

Expecting the guy to exceed every NFL back to that time to be considered a workhorse back was going a little bit overboard.

Since the draft this year, I have agreed with almost every post you have made.

TonyR
09-18-2009, 07:05 PM
I'm sure your feathers will be preened to the fullest should we go 3-0.

Why would you suggest 3-0 as even a remote possibility as doomed as we are? Or is your steely resolve wavering?

baja
09-18-2009, 07:09 PM
Why would you suggest 3-0 as even a remote possibility as doomed as we are? Or is your steely resolve wavering?

There is going to be much backing into being supporters of this regime over the next few weeks, some of them will be very creative and clever. I can hardly wait.

Steve Sewell
09-18-2009, 07:44 PM
ITT: A retarded poster.

watermock
09-18-2009, 08:38 PM
Why would you suggest 3-0 as even a remote possibility as doomed as we are? Or is your steely resolve wavering?

We are favored at home by 3 points.
We have Mangina, another disiple of Hoodie.

Forget the fluke, it's in the books.

BTW, that means Cleveland would be favored by 3 if the game were on the road.

mhgaffney
09-18-2009, 08:59 PM
You could see that Moreno was trying to hit a home run -- every time he touched the ball.

In the pre season game he was injured when he threw himself into the pile.

He just needs to relax and have fun. It will happen.

errand
09-18-2009, 09:13 PM
Shockingly I'm not surprised that people are worried about him being a bust after ONE game after missing most of training camp and all of the preseason. This is the Mane, you know?

Exactly, we got clowns on here ready to chuck the season before it's even played. McDaniels was the worst coach ever they proclaimed before he won his coaching debut. Orton sucks despite outplaying the guy they pine for while winning yet another NFL start.

I can't understand why all these geniuses haven't ever made it into coaching:rofl:

watermock
09-18-2009, 10:40 PM
Yep, rack another 1 up for Kyle.

We don't need no freaking redzone!

KipCorrington25
09-18-2009, 10:45 PM
Moreno deserves the "B" word at the moment, when you hold out and demand big money then you are going to be expected to deliver, is it fair? maybe not, but don't take the money then and hold out if you can't bow up and get it done.

So far Moreno looks like ****, we'll see... the onus is on him to earn that big paycheck.

baja
09-18-2009, 10:54 PM
Moreno deserves the "B" word at the moment, when you hold out and demand big money then you are going to be expected to deliver, is it fair? maybe not, but don't take the money then and hold out if you can't bow up and get it done.

So far Moreno looks like ****, we'll see... the onus is on him to earn that big paycheck.

1 game = a bust

Some real football genius' in here

KipCorrington25
09-18-2009, 11:03 PM
We'll see, he looked soft as **** last week though.

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 11:14 PM
We'll see, he looked soft as **** last week though.

dude, holy **** hes played a SINGLE GAME and didnt even get that many carries in that game, which he was coming off injury and a shortened TC.

DBroncos4life
09-18-2009, 11:26 PM
dude, holy **** hes played a SINGLE GAME and didnt even get that many carries in that game, which he was coming off injury and a shortened TC.

That is because he got hurt, which the poster said he looked soft. I think he he is FAR from bust but after one game I think one could come out and say he did run soft, but what the **** you will just keep changing the the rules on how people can evaluate players till it suits your needs. You can't comment on how he looks its preseason, you can't comment on him its just one regular season game. I'd bet my life if he came out and ran for over 150 and 2 TDs this week all of the sudden we would have JUST enough game film to call him a stud.

KevinJames
09-18-2009, 11:29 PM
people calling moreno a bust after the first game need to 1 ya selves
lol @ being injury prone gtfo my dudes ready for a big game.

tsiguy96
09-18-2009, 11:31 PM
That is because he got hurt, which the poster said he looked soft. I think he he is FAR from bust but after one game I think one could come out and say he did run soft, but what the **** you will just keep changing the the rules on how people can evaluate players till it suits your needs. You can't comment on how he looks its preseason, you can't comment on him its just one regular season game. I'd bet my life if he came out and ran for over 150 and 2 TDs this week all of the sudden we would have JUST enough game film to call him a stud.

your stupidness oozes with each post you make. you cant call a guy a star or a bust off one game where he only got 8 carries, especially coming off an injury. he even said himself he was making the wrong reads and didnt play well, what else do you want? public execution the next stop? the fact that peole even begin to consider our first round RB a bust after 1 ****ing game is ridiculous. its people like you that whined all summer about mcdaniels not fixing the dline, when in reality the dline is not near as bad as some of you tried to make it out to be, you just wanted something to whine about. now that its not the dline or the pressure on hte QB, its the RB who has a career total of 8 carries and how big of a bust he is.

some of you are truly incredible

DBroncos4life
09-18-2009, 11:48 PM
your stupidness oozes with each post you make. you cant call a guy a star or a bust off one game where he only got 8 carries, especially coming off an injury. he even said himself he was making the wrong reads and didnt play well, what else do you want? public execution the next stop? the fact that peole even begin to consider our first round RB a bust after 1 ****ing game is ridiculous. its people like you that whined all summer about mcdaniels not fixing the dline, when in reality the dline is not near as bad as some of you tried to make it out to be, you just wanted something to whine about. now that its not the dline or the pressure on hte QB, its the RB who has a career total of 8 carries and how big of a bust he is.

some of you are truly incredible

Where did I call him a star or a bust numb nuts? I simply said the poster called him soft because he has been hurt multiple times now since holding out and missing time.

To prove my point why don't you explain what I have put in bold. Its not OK to call someone soft after one game because he has been hurt, but it OK to think the DLine is fine because they looked good one game. That is just my point with you. No one should form an opinion about something if it is negative but it sure as hell is OK to jump to conclusion that the DLine is better then expected after one showing. Its the same ****ing **** with you. Its only OK to form an opinion about something if you agree with it.

ZONA
09-19-2009, 12:27 AM
Mmmm, looking at that game several times, most of his runs there were defenders all over the place, some even in the backfield by the time he got the ball. Not a great game to judge him on. Too many OL penalties and missed blocking assignments in the running game while Moreno was in there.

Popps
09-19-2009, 12:36 AM
T I'd bet my life if he came out and ran for over 150 and 2 TDs this week all of the sudden we would have JUST enough game film to call him a stud.

Wow, sounds like that would upset you, huh?

Keep your fingers crossed. Maybe he'll get injured again.

DBroncos4life
09-19-2009, 12:44 AM
Wow, sounds like that would upset you, huh?

Keep your fingers crossed. Maybe he'll get injured again.

The sad thing is you TRULY believe what you just typed.

watermock
09-19-2009, 12:56 AM
I never called Moreno a bust.

I said he still looked injured and slow.

Now since he has declared himself 100%, he shouldn't, right?

Or is the line so dependent on kuper? Has Hamilton lost his edge due to a changing scheme...?

Want me to pull up our rushing yards?

51 yards.

passing? 227-87=140?

Net yards from the #2 team in yards last year?

191 if you discount the bungle in the jungle to Stokely.

watermock
09-19-2009, 01:06 AM
Red Zone?

0.0

That's Delta House stats.

TomServo
09-19-2009, 01:25 AM
unless its earl cambell, taking a rb in the first round is well pretty stupid. how many SB rings does adrien peterson have again? OJ? barry sanders? walter payton has exactyly ONE, thanks to a defense for the 80's. would TD or elway have any rings if they didnt play together? quarterbacks are more important than running backs.
knowshow may be great but w/out a qb he'll just be chewed up.

watermock
09-19-2009, 01:33 AM
Indeed.

Just because we needed a couple RB's doesn't mean grabbing 3 30ish FA's and then spending a 1st on a good all around but relatively slow back.

He''s not going to get any quicker.

Portis is 7 years in the NFC East and still has better speed, and he's been ridden like a mule. Talk about a warrior. He's about done, yet still has speed.

TomServo
09-19-2009, 01:38 AM
a healthy peyton hillis is the key to this teams success not some #1 hold out.

watermock
09-19-2009, 01:53 AM
Hillis was barely used.

Sorry Popps.

WABronco
09-19-2009, 02:18 AM
Posters cracking on Moreno for his "hold out"...

RETARDVILLE IS ----> THAT WAY

EDIT-lol wow sheer brilliance in here.

TomServo
09-19-2009, 02:19 AM
healthy

TomServo
09-19-2009, 02:24 AM
yah, the history of #1 holdouts is an awesome tale of success?
lemme see, holdout all of camp, dont grasp the playbook, get a small injury that nags the whole season........... retarded

WABronco
09-19-2009, 02:25 AM
Moreno deserves the "B" word at the moment, when you hold out and demand big money then you are going to be expected to deliver, is it fair? maybe not, but don't take the money then and hold out if you can't bow up and get it done.

So far Moreno looks like ****, we'll see... the onus is on him to earn that big paycheck.

Ha!
Ha!

Ha!
Ha!

Ha!
Ha!

Good jokez

WABronco
09-19-2009, 02:28 AM
yah, the history of #1 holdouts is an awesome tale of success?
lemme see, holdout all of camp, dont grasp the playbook, get a small injury that nags the whole season........... retarded

It's not awesome, per se...more of a scintillating tale.

TomServo
09-19-2009, 02:37 AM
remember some posters saying "if only we drafted a #1, they wont get hurt like all our other backs?"
like i said before, unless its earl campbell spending a #1 draft pick on a RB is totally stupid.

Broncos_OTM
09-19-2009, 07:00 AM
remember some posters saying "if only we drafted a #1, they wont get hurt like all our other backs?"
like i said before, unless its earl campbell spending a #1 draft pick on a RB is totally stupid.

dont you think earl is a little old.

baja
09-19-2009, 07:07 AM
That is because he got hurt, which the poster said he looked soft. I think he he is FAR from bust but after one game I think one could come out and say he did run soft, but what the **** you will just keep changing the the rules on how people can evaluate players till it suits your needs. You can't comment on how he looks its preseason, you can't comment on him its just one regular season game. I'd bet my life if he came out and ran for over 150 and 2 TDs this week all of the sudden we would have JUST enough game film to call him a stud.

Commenting on how he looks and calling him a bust are no the same thing don't ya think?

elsid13
09-19-2009, 07:13 AM
remember some posters saying "if only we drafted a #1, they wont get hurt like all our other backs?"
like i said before, unless its earl campbell spending a #1 draft pick on a RB is totally stupid.

I actually agree. You can get just as much production out of back drafted in latter rounds as one draft in the first. Plus it doesn't cost as much. When you factor in the short lifespan of running backs and the NFL move to two back system, why would ever want to draft a RB in the first.

Before anyone ask I would have gone with Glenn Coffee out of Alabama or Davis (Clemson) in last draft and used the 12 pick on Orakpo and followed up with either Mack, V Davis or Maclin

Popps
09-19-2009, 09:50 AM
When you factor in the short lifespan of running backs and the NFL move to two back system, why would ever want to draft a RB in the first.

The same could be said for almost any position. We've had great success with later round OL's, and yet took Clady... after busting with Foster in the first. Our history actually shows a history of success at various places in the draft, at various positions. (Sharpe in the late rounds, Mecklenberg, Rod Smith as an UDFA, etc.)

Contractual issues create as more of an issue than wear and tear. A quality running back isn't going to be used up in 4 years, but he will be demanding a big contract.

Again, like Alphonso Smith... if he pans out to be a quality player, it was a good pick. If he busts, it was a bad pick. Moreno won't be any more or less of a bust if he doesn't pan out than George Foster was.


Teams identify talented players at positions of need and they draft them. We've done so with Moreno after a long run of playing RB-GO-ROUND with marginal, middle and late round RBs.

DBroncos4life
09-19-2009, 10:14 AM
unless its earl cambell, taking a rb in the first round is well pretty stupid. how many SB rings does adrien peterson have again? OJ? barry sanders? walter payton has exactyly ONE, thanks to a defense for the 80's. would TD or elway have any rings if they didnt play together? quarterbacks are more important than running backs.
knowshow may be great but w/out a qb he'll just be chewed up.

LOL, Peterson has been in the NFL how long? What about Faulk, Dunn, Lewis, Bettis, Emmitt Smith, Tony Dorsett, Ottis Anderson, John Riggins, Franco Harris, or Larry Csonka? I'm sure there are others as well.

TheDave
09-19-2009, 10:18 AM
I have had hopes for Knowshon... still do.

But as of right now he doesn't look good. It's obvious this game is too fast for him and he has been knocked out of both games he has played. Hopfully things will slow down as the season progresses.

DBroncos4life
09-19-2009, 10:23 AM
I have had hopes for Knowshon... still do.

But as of right now he doesn't look good. It's obvious this game is too fast for him and he has been knocked out of both games he has played. Hopfully things will slow down as the season progresses.

Careful, you know how touchy fans are when you have doubt TheDave....

TheDave
09-19-2009, 10:29 AM
Careful, you know how touchy fans are when you have doubt TheDave....

This place has become hilarious... Every critique is now derailed by the Superfans and their "OMG!!!!1s!!! it's only 1 game" argument.


Yet they are 100% comfortable telling everyone our defense is now the 85 bears after just 1 game.

Go figure...

DBroncos4life
09-19-2009, 10:33 AM
This place has become hilarious... Every critique is now derailed by the Superfans and their "OMG!!!!1s!!! it's only 1 game" argument.


Yet they are 100% comfortable telling everyone our defense is now the 85 bears after just 1 game.

Go figure...

That's it in a nutshell. I think Moreno will be a great RB, but I am a tad worried about the fact that he has been hurt twice on less then 30 NFL touches. Maybe we need old Dick Vermeil to call him out :)

elsid13
09-19-2009, 10:38 AM
The same could be said for almost any position. We've had great success with later round OL's, and yet took Clady... after busting with Foster in the first. Our history actually shows a history of success at various places in the draft, at various positions. (Sharpe in the late rounds, Mecklenberg, Rod Smith as an UDFA, etc.)

Contractual issues create as more of an issue than wear and tear. A quality running back isn't going to be used up in 4 years, but he will be demanding a big contract.

Again, like Alphonso Smith... if he pans out to be a quality player, it was a good pick. If he busts, it was a bad pick. Moreno won't be any more or less of a bust if he doesn't pan out than George Foster was.


Teams identify talented players at positions of need and they draft them. We've done so with Moreno after a long run of playing RB-GO-ROUND with marginal, middle and late round RBs.

The average life span for RB in the league is 2 and half years. The average lifespan for every other position is between 4 and 5 years when remove the running back position. There is a major difference

TheDave
09-19-2009, 10:50 AM
That's it in a nutshell. I think Moreno will be a great RB, but I am a tad worried about the fact that he has been hurt twice on less then 30 NFL touches. Maybe we need old Dick Vermeil to call him out :)

Right now everything is moving WAY too fast for him. Stick to giving him the ball on ZBS plays and get him involved in the All Screen Offense.

As for his toughness, I'm less concerned. That hit he took in San Fran could have been catastophic. His leg was planted and he took a helmet right on the side of the knee. The cinci hit was just one of those welcome to the nfl hits that all RB's take.

baja
09-19-2009, 10:56 AM
<b>This place has become hilarious... Every critique is now derailed by the Superfans and their "OMG!!!!1s!!! it's only 1 game" argument.</b>


Yet they are 100% comfortable telling everyone our defense is now the 85 bears after just 1 game.

Go figure...

I see only a small number of posters that do that. I raised the 1 game issue in response to a poster declaring, after seeing Moreno for 16 carries, that he is a bust. Now that is reduclous ;D

TheDave
09-19-2009, 11:03 AM
I see only a small number of posters that do that. I raised the 1 game issue in response to a poster declaring, after seeing Moreno for 16 carries, that he is a bust. Now that is reduclous ;D

About the same number of posters that are extremely negative... Unfortunately the vocal minority often gets all the credit. ;D

baja
09-19-2009, 11:12 AM
About the same number of posters that are extremely negative... Unfortunately the vocal minority often gets all the credit. ;D

Yes but would you agree the number of nay sayers are dwindling as of late?

DenverBrit
09-19-2009, 11:34 AM
Yes but would you agree the number of nay sayers are dwindling as of late?

They'll be back in force soon enough.

BlaK-Argentina
09-19-2009, 12:34 PM
This place has become hilarious... Every critique is now derailed by the Superfans and their "OMG!!!!1s!!! it's only 1 game" argument.


Yet they are 100% comfortable telling everyone our defense is now the 85 bears after just 1 game.

Go figure...

I disagree. BUT, people calling Moreno a bust after one game is incredibly dumb even for some of the people here.

TonyR
09-19-2009, 12:50 PM
...and used the 12 pick on Orakpo...

If we'd have landed Derrick Ward in FA, which we almost did until TB overpaid, we wouldn't have drafted Moreno and perhaps Orakpo would be a Bronco today.

TheDave
09-19-2009, 12:52 PM
Yes but would you agree the number of nay sayers are dwindling as of late?

I think the extremes on both sides have dwindled...

TheDave
09-19-2009, 01:02 PM
I disagree. BUT, people calling Moreno a bust after one game is incredibly dumb even for some of the people here.

Besides Mock who is calling him a bust?

TomServo
09-20-2009, 01:18 AM
so how did TD work out with brian griese at QB?

lex
09-20-2009, 01:31 AM
so how did TD work out with brian griese at QB?

How did Elway make out with Sammy Winder?

elsid13
09-20-2009, 05:38 AM
If we'd have landed Derrick Ward in FA, which we almost did until TB overpaid, we wouldn't have drafted Moreno and perhaps Orakpo would be a Bronco today.

It was reported that Orakpo wasn't on the board for Denver. They wanted Ayers first and foremost out of the defense players.

tsiguy96
09-20-2009, 08:02 AM
It was reported that Orakpo wasn't on the board for Denver. They wanted Ayers first and foremost out of the defense players.

and orakpo has done nothing so far for us to be sad we didnt get him.

Br0nc0Buster
09-20-2009, 08:07 AM
Moreno was durable at Georgia, so I dont think he is gonna suffer lingering injuries all year long

He missed some of TC, then got hurt
I still think he may not quite be in game shape

elsid13
09-20-2009, 08:16 AM
and orakpo has done nothing so far for us to be sad we didnt get him.

You really haven't been paying attention to the rest of the league, have you? Orakpo is starting for the skins and made the transition to SLB very easily and jumping into the DE role on passing downs. Orakpo is very far ahead of Ayers right now in the season.

tsiguy96
09-20-2009, 08:19 AM
You really haven't been paying attention to the rest of the league, have you? Orakpo is starting for the skins and made the transition to SLB very easily and jumping in the DE role on passing downs. Orakpo is very far ahead of Ayers right now in the season.

umm, yea i have, and what has he performed on the field? orakpo had a whopping 2 teackles last game. the fact that we have better options to start right now doesnt mean ayers is a bust. theres a reason you dont judge players after a single game.

elsid13
09-20-2009, 08:24 AM
umm, yea i have, and what has he performed on the field? orakpo had a whopping 2 teackles last game. the fact that we have better options to start right now doesnt mean ayers is a bust. theres a reason you dont judge players after a single game.

No one is calling Ayers a bust, but Orakpo is showing he getting it faster right now. Right now Orakpo is showing flashes that he gets it, Ayers hasn't shown anything.

tsiguy96
09-20-2009, 08:26 AM
No one is calling Ayers a bust, but Orakpo is showing he getting it faster right now. Right now Orakpo is showing flashes that he gets it, Ayers hasn't shown anything.

fair, so why does that mean we should have not drafted moreno and instead drafted orakpo, especially when this coaching staff viewed ayers as favorably as they did?

elsid13
09-20-2009, 08:42 AM
fair, so why does that mean we should have not drafted moreno and instead drafted orakpo, especially when this coaching staff viewed ayers as favorably as they did?

Who knows what this front office would do. I have been luke warm on their drafting strategy so far. Go look back at the posts before when we were discussing why it doesn't make sense to draft a RB in the first.