Mandatory and dangerous swine flu vaccine coming

[watermock]

Swine Flu Vaccine Linked to Paralysis
Part II: “It’s the Vaccine, Stupid!”


by F. William Engdahl

.
Global Research, September 8, 2009
- 2009-09-05


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It is not any alleged “Swine Flu” or H1N1 “virus” that is the danger to the lives of our loved ones, our children, our pregnant mothers. We are being literally panicked by WHO, CDC, the US Government and uncritical mass media into demanding what amounts to legalized toxins as a “guard” against a disease so far milder than a common cold.



The few details that have managed to leak out regarding the contents of the fluids that major pharmaceutical companies want to inject into our veins confirm what I have been writing since the first alleged outbreak of Swine Flu in the environs of a factory pig farm in Veracruz Mexico.



The declaration by WHO of Phase 6 “Pandemic Level” global health emergency was a political decision which had no relation to any proven “virus threat.” It had to do at the least with a multibillion dollar injection of hyper-profits into the coffers of a tiny handful of global vaccine giants—GlaxoSmithKline, Roche (Gilead Science Inc), Baxter Labs, Novartis, Sanofi Pasteur and a few elite other drug giants.



More, the current H1N1 fear campaign from WHO, the German Robert Koch Institute, the US Government’s CDC, appears on serious examination to have to do not with safeguarding the public health, but rather with a long-term agenda of political control of populations through deliberate means of making them ill, weak, partly paralyzed or otherwise too weak to focus on the increasingly obvious social crisis facing us all, the global breakdown of the dollar system. Why else would allegedly responsible governments from the United States to the Federal Republic of Germany, from Britain to France, embrace such a manifest health hoax?



The simplest research of a high school pupil using official WHO and other government sources, can demonstrate this. If you doubt this, just commission your school age children to demonstrate, using only official sources, published on the internet, that there is no sound, public health reason to declare any special measures, let alone to authorize “fast track” rollout of new vaccines, untested, for mass injection in the population. Tell them that the students who make the best case from only official sources, will get the top honors in the course.



UK report of neurological damage from vaccine

According to a confidential warning letter written on July 29, 2009, a copy of which was leaked to the British newspaper, Daily Mail, the UK Government’s Health Protection Agency head of Immunization Department, Prof. Elizabeth Miller, warned British neurologists that the swine flu vaccine, which was briefly used in a mass vaccination program in 1976 in the USA until it was abruptly withdrawn because of dangerous side effects, is linked to Guillain-Barre Syndrome (GBS), a potentially deadly and nerve crippling of the central nervous system. Guillain-Barre Syndrome attacks the lining of the nerves, causing paralysis and inability to breathe, and can be fatal. It can cause paralysis of the breathing muscles that can cause death by suffocation.

The warning letter of Prof. Miller states, “The vaccines used to combat an expected swine influenza pandemic in 1976 were shown to be associated with GBS and were withdrawn from use." The US Government was forced in the 1976 Swine Flu scandal to pay out millions of dollars in damages to victims of GBS who had received the vaccine.

The UK Government plans to inject 13 million British citizens beginning October with virtually untested H1N1 vaccines. The British Neurological Surveillance Unit (BNSU), part of the British Association of Neurologists, has been asked to monitor closely any cases of GBS as the vaccine is rolled out. One senior neurologist told the press off-record, “I would not have the swine flu jab because of the GBS risk.”

Miller’s letter was reportedly sent to 600 British neurologists on July 29, a sign that there is concern at the highest levels that the vaccine itself could cause serious complications. The letter notes, referring to the similar swine flu vaccination process in the USA in 1976 that “more people died from the vaccination than from swine flu; some 500 cases of GBS were found; vaccines may have increased risk of GBS by 800%; the US vaccine was withdrawn after just ten weeks when Government scientists confirmed the link with GBS; the US Government then was forced to pay tens of millions of dollars to those affected. They monitored that within days, symptoms of GBS were reported among those who had been immunised and 25 people died from respiratory failure after severe paralysis. One in 80,000 people came down with the condition. In contrast, just one person died of swine flu.

Notably, the Obama Administration has issued a special ruling exempting the vaccine makers from all liability from the vaccines. Most alarming in this context is the fact that the new vaccine has not been sufficiently tested and that the effects, especially on children, are unknown. Yet small children and pregnant mothers are the first priority to be vaccinated under WHO recommendations.



However, as leading European epidemiologists confirm privately, the effects of the so-called H1N1 Influenza A or “Swine Flu” are to date extremely mild, comparable to a common cold and disappear in a few days with bed rest. The deaths, as CDC and other health agencies have had to admit, all took place in patients with previous severe respiratory problems or other severe illness, and have in no known case been definitively linked to Swine Flu. The deaths were what epidemiologists term “opportunistic” that is “coincidental” not causal.



GBS however, which is believed linked to adjuvants present in the new vaccines, can cause paralysis and death. One woman, Hilary Wilkinson, was stricken with GBS and had to be fed through a drip while needing a tracheotomy just to breathe. It took her three months in the hospital to learn how to walk and talk again. On the topic of the swine flu vaccine, she says today, "It makes me feel wary that the Government is rolling out this vaccine without any clear idea of the GBS risk, if any. I wouldn't wish it on anyone."



An 800% rise in GBS risk

Another letter with a warning about the swine flu vaccine from the Association of British Neurologists, signed by Dr. Rustam Al-Shahi Salman and Professor Patrick Chinnery, says, "Following the 1976 program of vaccination against swine influenza in the US, a retrospective study found a possible eight-fold increase in the incidence of GBS." That is 800% increase after vaccination of 40 million Americans was done on a similar “health emergency” basis before abruptly being withdrawn. The 1976 swine flu mass vaccination campaign was abandoned after hundreds of cases of GBS were diagnosed and 25 died.

An emergency mass vaccination program was backed by President Gerald Ford that year because Center for Disease Control head, Dr. David Sencer, convinced the White House that the swine flu strain was similar to the one responsible for the 1918-19 pandemic, which he claimed had killed half a million Americans and 20 million people worldwide. Sencer was forced to resign in disgrace months later. The current CDC and WHO hysteria campaign over “H1N1 Influenza A Swine Flu” bears ominous similarities to that of 1976.

According to the British Dr Tom Jefferson, co-ordinator of the vaccines section of the influential Cochrane Collaboration, an independent British group that reviews drug research, says, “New vaccines never behave in the way you expect them to. It may be that there is a link to GBS, which is certainly not something I would wish on anybody. But it could end up being anything because one of the additives in one of the vaccines is a substance called squalene, and none of the studies we’ve extracted have any research on it at all.” Squalene, a naturally occurring enzyme, could potentially cause so-far-undiscovered side effects.



In other words, what we have with the new versions of H1N1 “swine flu” vaccine is an untested, potentially dangerous cocktail of chemicals and viral fragments that could plausibly be linked to a devastating neurological condition, or worse.



The doctors and scientists are warning about the possibility of dangerous neurological side effects precisely because the government is failing to do so. Governments and pharmaceutical companies don't want people to know about risks associated with the vaccine, so they don't talk about them. Nor do they reveal the rather startling fact that the vaccine has never been tested on children or expectant mothers even though those are the two primary groups being targeted for the vaccine.



Vaccines are the bedrock of the pharmaceutical industry's profit centers. Through vaccines, the drug companies can ensure generations of future profits from diseases that have been identified in numerous studies as triggered or worsened by vaccines, including Alzheimer's, cancer, autism, Parkinson's disease, and others.

British Conservative Party Health Parliament Spokesman, Mike Penning has stated, “The last thing we want is secret letters handed around experts within the NHS. Our job is to make sure that the public knows what’s going on. Why is the Government not being open about this? It’s also very worrying if doctors, who will be administering the vaccine, aren’t being warned.”


F. William Engdahl is a frequent contributor to Global Research. Global Research Articles by F. William Engdahl

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[barryr]

There are many studies out there showing that taking vaccines of any kind are leading to health problems to people. And even animals.

[kappys]

Sigh.

The same could be said of virtually every flu vaccine every year. Yes the '76 vaccine was a bad player, but...

People die of flu every year. People develop post-flu encephalitis every year leading to permanent brain damage. People die of measles, babies die of pertussis. these vaccines aren't being developed against diseases that don't do anything - they are and have been developed against diseases that can kill or cripple you.

It is about risk management. What are the risks of the disease versus the risks of the vaccine. After that it is time to make an informed decision. Vaccines are a huge part of the reason that our life expectancy isn't what is was like at the turn of the century.

[kappys]

There are many studies out there showing that taking vaccines of any kind are leading to health problems to people. And even animals.

What studies? Anything credible or just the same parade of nonsense sponsored by Jenny Mccarthy and Co?

[Beantown Bronco]

We are being literally panicked by WHO, CDC, the US Government and uncritical mass media into demanding what amounts to legalized toxins as a “guard” against a disease so far milder than a common cold.

People in their 20s and 30s have died of the swine flu. Nobody in their prime years is dying from the common cold.

[Rohirrim]

People need to go back less than a hundred years ago when the flu swept over the world and killed 20 million people, including my grandfather's 16 year old sister.

[SPfloppy]

Maybe it's just me and and my attck of common sense but I somehow doubt that a government as vast with the amount of responisbility as ours would force a vaccine on it's population unless it were in fact safe. Today we have such a high level of scientific researsch that we can predict disease in infants before they ever pop out of the womb. So again I really do not believe that our gov would force vaccine on it's population if it would lead to a larger medical issue

[Smiling Assassin27]

Maybe it's just me and and my attck of common sense but I somehow doubt that a government as vast with the amount of responisbility as ours would force a vaccine on it's population unless it were in fact safe. Today we have such a high level of scientific researsch that we can predict disease in infants before they ever pop out of the womb. So again I really do not believe that our gov would force vaccine on it's population if it would lead to a larger medical issue

This seems a bit naive. Our government is driven by political motivations in MANY cases, especially one in which the drug companies have a financial stake. Science (in its complete and politically unaltered form) is often secondary to economic, environmental, political, and ideological factors, leaving the American public short on knowledge and even shorter on options, particularly when things like this are made mandatory.

Given the shortcuts, ideological slantings, and method by which our government now passes and enacts 'laws', Americans are right to question the stream of information that emanates from it with regard to whether mandatory vaccination is justified, let alone effective while limiting side effects. Combine a healthy negative presumption with the number of credible sources that assert that many vaccines are either ineffective, worthless or just downright unhealthy and I'm still waiting for a legitimate and credible argument for flu vaccinations, let alone mandatory ones.

[alkemical]

http://robertscourt.blogspot.com/2009/08/vaccines-are-far-more-deadly-than-swine.html

Dr. Mae-Wan Ho and Prof. Joe Cummins
Global Research
August 21, 2009
The vaccines are far more deadly than the swine flu. Mass vaccinations is a recipe for disaster Dr. Mae-Wan Ho and Prof. Joe Cummins
This report has been submitted to Sir Liam Donaldson, Chief Medical Officer of the UK, and to the US Food and Drugs Administration


Why are children the first to get experimental swine flu vaccines?
A swine flu outbreak occurred in Mexico and the United States in April 2009 and spread rapidly around the world by human-to human transmission. The new type A H1N1 influenza virus is unlike any that had been previously isolated [1, 2], judging from the first data released in May.

[kappys]

Combine a healthy negative presumption with the number of credible sources that assert that many vaccines are either ineffective, worthless or just downright unhealthy and I'm still waiting for a legitimate and credible argument for flu vaccinations, let alone mandatory ones.

What credible sources?

this has approached the level of the WTC collapse conspiracy. A bunch of reports on websites with little to no real hard evidence presented in medical journals that really goes on to show adverse effects from vaccines other than some isolated incidents(notably the '76 flu vaccine) and case reports of bad outcomes possibly related to a vaccine.

[barryr]

Vaccines always have side-effects. It doesn't take a PHD to know this. The FDA has recommended drugs and the like over the years that they had to admit years later, were not good. This is no different. Swine flu is nothing different than any other flu. The hype it gets doesn't change that.

[Smiling Assassin27]

What credible sources?

this has approached the level of the WTC collapse conspiracy. A bunch of reports on websites with little to no real hard evidence presented in medical journals that really goes on to show adverse effects from vaccines other than some isolated incidents(notably the '76 flu vaccine) and case reports of bad outcomes possibly related to a vaccine.

Former Chief Vaccine Control Officer at FDA, Dr. J Anthony Morris, for one. Former Surgeon Generals, JAMA, FDA for others. Mind you, many of these statements are based upon empirical data from previous large scale vaccinations in the US and abroad. In 2000, the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons called for an end to mandatory vaccinations in this country. Not a single 'no' vote.

Look, I'm not saying that vaccinations are evil. I'm not even saying that they're wholly ineffective. I'm saying that the evidence does not exist to create a mandatory vaccination ordinance for this or any other disease, that's all. If you want to get vaccinated, that's fine. Forcing me and others to vaccinate ourselves has not been justified, particularly for this specific disease.

[alkemical]

What credible sources?

this has approached the level of the WTC collapse conspiracy. A bunch of reports on websites with little to no real hard evidence presented in medical journals that really goes on to show adverse effects from vaccines other than some isolated incidents(notably the '76 flu vaccine) and case reports of bad outcomes possibly related to a vaccine.

from my link:

References

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2. Garten RJ, Davis CT,Tussell CA et al. Antigenic and genetic charaatcteristics of swine-origin 2009 A (H1N1) influenza viruses circulating in humans. Science 2009, 325, 197-201.
3. Virologist to make his case for lab origin of swine flu”, Peter Duveen, Opednews.com, 4 July 2009, http://www.opednews.com/articles/Virologist-to-make-his-cas-by-Peter-Duveen-090630-103.html
4. Is swine flu a biological weapon?”, Paul Joseph Watson, PrisonPlanet.com 27 April 2009, http://www.prisonplanet.com/is-swine-flu-a-biological-weapon.htm
5. CDC confirms ties to virus first discovered in U.S. pig factories” Michael Greger, 3 May 2009, http://www.hsus.org/farm/news/ournews/swine_flu_virus_origin_1998_042909.html
6. “Swine flu vaccine should not be given to children in schools”, Barbara Loe Fisher, National Vaccine Information Center, 22 July 2009, http://www.nvic.org/NVIC-Vaccine-News/July-2009/Swine-Flu-Vaccine-Should-Not-Be-Given-to-Children.aspx
7. “Now legal immunity for swine flu vaccine makers” F, William Engdahl, Global Research 20 July 2009, http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=14453
8. Swine flu pandemic now ‘unstoppable’: WHO official”, Agence France-Presse 13 July 2009, Calgary Herald, http://www.calgaryherald.com/Swine+pandemic+unstoppable+official/1788693/story.html
9. What are the dangers of mandatory swine flu vaccination? Dr. Mercola, June 2009, http://blogs.mercola.com/sites/vitalvotes/archive/2009/07/15/What-are-the-Dangers-of-MandatoryMandatory-Swine-Flu-Vaccination.aspx
10. Ho MW. How to stop bir flu instead of the vaccine-antiviral model. Science in Society 35. 40-42, 2007.
11. Jefferson T, Rivett A, Harnden A, DiPietrantoni C, and Demicheli V. Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy children (Review). Cochrane Database Systematic Review 23 April 2009, http://mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochrane/clsysrev/articles/CD004879/pdf_fs.html
12. Szilagyi PG, Fairbrother G, Griffin MR et al. Influenza vaccine effectiveness among children 6 to 59 months of age during 2 influenza seasons: a case-cohort study. Arch Pediatr Adolesc Med 2008, 162, 943-51. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18838647
13. Christy C, Aligne C, Auinger P, Pulcino T and Weitzman M. Effectiveness of influenza vaccine for the prevention of asthma exacerbations. Arch. Dis Child 2004, 89, 734-5, http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=15269071
14. Flu vaccination may triple risk for flu-related hospitalization in children with asthma, 25 May 2009, http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/703235
15. Petrovsky N, Heinzel S, Honda Y, Lyons AB. New-age vaccine adjuvants, friend or foe? BioPharm International 2 August 2007, http://biopharminternational.findpharma.com/biopharm/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=444996&sk=&date=&pageID=5
16. “Update: 1-Baxter can take no more H1N1 flu vaccine orders”, Bill Berkerto, 16 July 2009, Reuters. http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsnews/idINN1644290820090716?rpc=33
17. H1N1 ‘swine flu’ vaccine, postnote, May 2009, number 331, http://www.parliament.uk/documents/upload/postpn331.pdf
18. Avian Influenza (Bird Flu) CDC, 18 November 2005, http://www.cdc.gov/flu/avian/gen-info/flu-viruses.htm
19. Olsen B, Munster VJ, Wallensten A, Waldenstrom J, Osterhaus ADME and Fouchier RAM. Global patterns of influenza A virus in wild birds. Science 2006, 312, 384-8.
20. Hood E. Environews Innovations 2006 Environmental Health Perpectives 114,A108-111.
21. Kistner,O,Tauer,C, Barrett,N. Mundt,W. Method for Producing Viral Vaccines 2009 Patent application US2009/0060950A1
22. Ehrlich HJ, Müller M, Oh HM, Tambyah PA, Joukhadar C, Montomoli E, Fisher D, Berezuk G, Fritsch S, Löw-Baselli A, Vartian N, Bobrovsky R, Pavlova BG, Pöllabauer EM, Kistner O, Barrett PN; Baxter H5N1 Pandemic Influenza Vaccine Clinical Study Team. A clinical trial of a whole-virus H5N1 vaccine derived from cell culture. N Engl J Med. 2008 Jun 12;358(24):2573-84.
23. Ketel.W,Dekker,C,Mink,C,Campbell,J,Edwards,K,Patel ,S,Ho,D,Talbot,H,Guo,K,Noah,D,Hill,H.Safety and immunogenicity of inactivated, Vero cell culture-derived whole virus influenza A/H5N1 vaccine given alone or with aluminum hydroxide adjuvant in healthy adults Vaccine 2009 in press doi:10.1016/j.vaccine.2009.03.015
24. “Bird flu mix-up could have spelled disaster”, NewScientist 6 March 2009, http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20126983.400
25. Kenney RT and Edelman R. Survey of human-use adjuvants. Expert Review of Vaccines April 2003; 2(2):167-88, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12899569?ordinalpos=5&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsP anel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum
26. “Vaccines may be linked to Gulf War Syndrome”, Chiroweb.com, June 12, 2000, http://www.chiroweb.com/mpacms/dc/article.php?id=31730
27. “Homeless people die after bird flu vaccine trial in Poland”, Mathew Day, Telegraph, 2 July 2008, http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/poland/2235676/Homeless-people-die-after-bird-flu-vaccine-trial-in-Poland.html
28. “Homeless people die after trials of bird-flu vaccine”, 10 July 2008, Pharmaceutical Portal for Poland, http://www.pharmapoland.com/next.php?id=62409
29. “Polish industry not dented by deaths”, Emma Dorey, Entrepreneur, 21 July 2008, http://www.entrepreneur.com/tradejournals/article/181991358.html
30. Pandermrix = European Public Assessment Report [EMEA] 27 September 2009, http://www.emea.europa.eu/humandocs/Humans/EPAR/pandemrix/pandemrix.htm
31. Vaccine adjuvant system technology background information. GlaxoSmithKline, accessed 25 July 2009, http://www.gsk.com/media/flu/flu-adjuvant.pdf
32. Collin N, de Radiguès X, Kieny MP; the World Health Organization H1N1 Vaccine Task Force.New influenza A(H1N1) vaccine: How ready are we for large-scale production? Vaccine. 2009 Jun 26 in press doi:10.1016/j.vaccine.2009.06.034
33. 1976 swine flu outbreak, Wikipedia, 22 July 2009, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1976_swine_flu_outbreak
34. Haber P, Sejvar J, Mikaeloff Y and DeStefano F. Vaccine and Guilaain-Barre syndrome. Drug Saf 2009, 32, 309-23.
35. 2009 flu pandemic in the United States”, Wikipdeia, 22 July 2009, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_flu_pandemic_in_the_United_States
36. 2009 flu pandemic, Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_flu_pandemic
37. “Swine flu website overwhelmed by demand as new cases double in a week”, Owen Bowcott and Severin Carrell, The Guardian, 23 July 2009, http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/23/swine-flu-website-overwhelmed
38. “Swine flu: medical chief orders NHS to prepare for 65 000 deaths – with a toll of as many as 350 a day”, Daniel Martin, The Daily Mail, 17 July 2009, T, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1200012/Swine-flu-Every-child-16-vaccinated–when.html
39. “Glaxo to limit tests of flu vaccine, citing urgency”, Jason Gale and Trista Kelley, Bloomberg Press, 22 July 2009, http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601102&sid=apkg_4J.PCEw

[Bob]

Sigh.

The same could be said of virtually every flu vaccine every year. Yes the '76 vaccine was a bad player, but...

People die of flu every year. People develop post-flu encephalitis every year leading to permanent brain damage. People die of measles, babies die of pertussis. these vaccines aren't being developed against diseases that don't do anything - they are and have been developed against diseases that can kill or cripple you.

It is about risk management. What are the risks of the disease versus the risks of the vaccine. After that it is time to make an informed decision. Vaccines are a huge part of the reason that our life expectancy isn't what is was like at the turn of the century.

Cost vs. Bennefit -- in my mind heavily weighs on getting the vacine this year. There is truth to the notion, that when rushed vacines, may not be as safe as usual, but I will take that chance.

[Bob]

Vaccines always have side-effects. It doesn't take a PHD to know this. The FDA has recommended drugs and the like over the years that they had to admit years later, were not good. This is no different. Swine flu is nothing different than any other flu. The hype it gets doesn't change that.

There might be some differences. The current swine flu has not mutated (and hopefully never will) and so far is not as dangerous as the typical flu, which results in 36,000 death in the US every year. But where it might become worse is that this in a new virus that has eliments of Swine and avian flu combined in it -- anytime you add a "new" virus to the mix of a population previously not exposed to it recently (geneticly speaking) the population is not as resistant to it.

In 1917 there were few Avian few deaths, while in 1918 there were over 50 million -- the difference is that it mutated to spread easier.

When Native Americans were exposed to small pox -- millions died, as geneticly their bodies were not as well prepaired for the disease. In 1492 there were several million of the Tan'no tribe, that first greeted Columbus, by 1507 there were 60,000, and by 1531 there was 600 left. Yes war, and slavery were issues, but the vast majority died from "new" disease.

[Bronco Yoda]

Here's something to think about. Every year Aprox. 30,000 people die from the flue. They are saying that the H1N1 may kill nearly 100,000 this season alone.

This is going to be a nasty flue season.

[Rohirrim]

In our conspiracy rich world (thank you, internetz) the intent of everybody, especially any kind of organization, is suspicious. No, these medical researchers of all these health organizations are not working hard to cure diseases and save lives, they are carrying out some weird Dr. Moreau experiments in order to create some kind of mutant, slave race. ;D

[Bob]

Here's something to think about. Every year Aprox. 30,000 people die from the flue. They are saying that the H1N1 may kill nearly 100,000 this season alone.

This is going to be a nasty flue season.

The high end estimate was 90,000.

[Smiling Assassin27]

In our conspiracy rich world (thank you, internetz) the intent of everybody, especially any kind of organization, is suspicious. No, these medical researchers of all these health organizations are not working hard to cure diseases and save lives, they are carrying out some weird Dr. Moreau experiments in order to create some kind of mutant, slave race. ;D

I blame it all on Oswald...and Brian Griese.

[kappys]

Former Chief Vaccine Control Officer at FDA, Dr. J Anthony Morris, for one. Former Surgeon Generals, JAMA, FDA for others. Mind you, many of these statements are based upon empirical data from previous large scale vaccinations in the US and abroad. In 2000, the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons called for an end to mandatory vaccinations in this country. Not a single 'no' vote.

Look, I'm not saying that vaccinations are evil. I'm not even saying that they're wholly ineffective. I'm saying that the evidence does not exist to create a mandatory vaccination ordinance for this or any other disease, that's all. If you want to get vaccinated, that's fine. Forcing me and others to vaccinate ourselves has not been justified, particularly for this specific disease.

I think as a starting point it is important to differentiate vaccines that have been wildly effective - polio, mumps/measles/rubella, pertussis, etc. from those that in recent years have been promoted against diseases that usually don't have the devastating consquences of the above diseases - hepatitis B and flu being the primary ones.

Unfortunately both groups of vaccines have come under substantial attack. I am most familiar with the literature surrounding adjuvants and thimerasol(mercury) in vaccines which were the original targets trumped by some of the anti-vaccine nuts but for which no credible evidence of harm exists - and good studies exist to show that no harm has been demonstrated. Nevertheless anti-vaccine groups have turned towards other targets or evidence of increased incidences of a variety of autoimmune diseases(to be expected after vaccines) which are also far easier to diagnose and test for today than in previous decades.

Little attention is given to the devastating consquences of the former diseases - in particular polio, measles(with post measles encephalitis), and pertussis(which has made a comeback recently and resulted in the deaths of a number of infants). This needs to be noted in any serious vaccine discussion

However with regards to hepatitis B and flu vaccines I do agree there are legitamate areas for concern. The AAPS as far as I knew opposed only mandatory vaccines for hep B and flu but not others, perhaps they have changed their opinion. To my knolwedge Fr. Morris was mostly opposed to flu vaccination - not to others though perhaps he has raised concerns about those as well. JAMA is a jounral of course and has published articles pro and con regarding vaccinations though to be perfectly honest I think JAMA in recent years is falling out of favor with many in the medical establishment and no longer bears the status it once did. However I am not aware of a consensus opinion of JAMA editors regarding this subject.

With regards to AmesJ - I appreciate the links though only 1 linked to original human research focused heavily on complications(another linked to an effectiveness study from the New England Journal). Another great link is to the Cochrane collaboration - a medical review sites that publishes metanalysis on a broad range of subjects and is generally very well regarded in the medical establishment. They found a clear benefit to preventing flu using a live vaccine - actually finding better results with the nasal vaccine as compared with the injected vaccine; but no benefit to the inactivated vaccine used in young children. In addition there is (not suprinsingly) no benefit in preventing flu-like illnesses caused by other virus strains (which is why so many people are convinced the either got the flu from the vaccine or that the vaccine was ineffective despite never getting testing for the cause of their illness). The Cochrane article did not draw any conclusions about safety.

I also have legitamate concerns about a mandatory flu vaccine. Unfortunately I think there are those in the anti-vaccine camps that misrepresent concerns regarding flu(primarily) and hepatitis(secondarily) vaccines and generalize to all vaccinations. Certainly monitoring is needed and changes need to be made periodically(as in the conversion from live polio vaccine to inactivated). Mandatory vaccinations also get into issues of personal liberties which are difficult to balance against societal imperatives.

With regards to vaccine producers immunity and the profits from making a vaccine - well as anyone can attest I am always quite suspicious of corporations including in this endeavor. They will most certainly present data in the best light regarding any new vaccine. I think an injury fund for proven vaccine reactions would be of the best value in mitigating fear of legal liability for manufacturers while provided for just compensation of injured victims. Proving a strong link between sporadic disease occurences and your flu vaccine can be quite difficult.

Ultimately, however, I think the possbility and a danger of mass flu pandemic outweighs the risks associated with these vaccines - though dangers quite clearly exist. Based on a risk/benefit analysis I support vaccination at this time and feel the best existing evidence favors this route as well.

[watermock]

by Barbara Loe Fisher

On April 26, a national public health emergency was declared by officials in the U.S. Departments of Health and Homeland Security. 1,2 We were told it was necessary to declare a national emergency because people were getting sick from a new swine flu virus that began in Mexico and might cause a deadly influenza pandemic.

So far, the vast majority of people who get sick with swine flu have symptoms that are no worse than the regular flu and recover completely. 3,4,5, 6

Three Week Testing of Swine Flu Vaccines
The declaration of a national public health emergency last spring set a chain of events in motion: some schools were closed, 7 some people were quarantined 8, 9 and drug companies were given billons of tax dollars to create experimental swine flu vaccines. 10 These new vaccines are being fast tracked by the FDA. We are being told they will only be tested for a few weeks on a few hundred children and adults 11 before being given to children in schools in October.

Liability Protection for Vaccine Injuries & Deaths
Under federal legislation passed by Congress since 2001, an Emergency Use Authorization (EUA) 12,13,14 allows drug companies, health officials and anyone who gives experimental vaccines to Americans during a declared public health emergency, to be protected from liability if people get hurt.

Safety and Informed Consent At Risk in Schools
The National Vaccine Information Center has been a vaccine safety watchdog since 1982. We are questioning the need to turn schools into medical clinics this fall where swine flu vaccines being rushed to market will be given to children first. We are calling on the Obama Administration and state Governors to provide solid evidence to parents that it is necessary to give children experimental swine flu vaccines in schools.

Are the states prepared to obey vaccine safety provisions in the 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act,15 which include:

1. Giving parents written information about vaccine benefits and risks before children are vaccinated; 16

2. Keeping a record of which vaccines the children get, including the manufacturer’s name and lot number;

3. Recording which vaccines were given in the child’s medical record;

4. Recording serious health problems that develop after vaccination in the child’s medical record and immediately making a report to the federal Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) 17

Will States Compensate Vaccine Injured Children?
And there are more questions that need to be answered: Are the states prepared to provide financial compensation to children harmed by swine flu vaccines given in schools? Are parents going to be given complete, truthful information about swine flu vaccine risks and have the right to say “YES” or “NO” before their children are lined up and vaccinated in the school setting?

Vaccines are pharmaceutical products that carry a risk of injury or death and those risks are greater for some than others. 1 in 6 children in America is learning disabled18. 1 in 9 has asthma 1 in 150 develops autism. 1 in 450 has diabetes and millions more suffer with allergies and autoimmune disorders. Will the swine flu vaccine be safe for them?

Although it is a good idea for health officials to prepare for a worst case scenario and stockpile vaccines, it is a bad idea to turn schools into medical clinics and basically test experimental swine flu vaccines on children first. Especially when nobody has any liability. That has the potential to hurt children instead of keeping them well.

NVIC Oct. 2-4 Conference Addresses Vaccine Risks
This Oct. 2-4, 2009 in Washington, D.C., parents concerned about the lack of vaccine safety and informed consent protections in the vaccination system will gather with doctors, scientists, bioethicists, legal experts, journalists, and consumer advocates at the Fourth International Public Conference on Vaccination to talk about the science, policy, law and ethics of vaccination.

Register now

– Special Early Bird registration ends on July 31.

Click here for more information about swine flu, swine flu vaccines, public health laws that govern you and you family, and how you can be better prepared to make well informed decisions during the declared national public health emergency.

Endnotes:

1 U.S. Department of Homeland Security. Press Briefing on Swine Influenza with Dept. of Homeland Security, Centers for Disease Control and White House. April 26, 2009.

2 U.S. Department of Health & Human Services. Determination That A Public Health Emergency Exists. April 26, 2009.

3 Gale J. Bloomberg News. Swine Flu May Be Less Lethal Than Earlier Estimated, Study Says. July 6, 2009.

4 Schmid RE. The Seattle Times. Study: New flu inefficient in attacking people. July 2, 2009.

5 Centers for Disease Control. FluView. 2008-2009 Influenza Season Week 27 Ending July 11, 2009.

6 Food and Drug Administration, Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research, Office of Vaccine Research and Review. Regulatory Considerations Regarding the Use of Novel Influenza A (H1N1) Virus Vaccines. July 23, 2009.

7 US Department of Education. H1N1 Flu & U.S. Schools: Answers to Frequently Asked Questions. May 5, 2009.

8 NBC. Marine Tests Positive for Swine Flu. April 29, 2009.

9 CBS. DHS Sets Guidelines for Possible Swine Flu Quarantines. April 28, 2009.

10 The Independent. Obama earmarks emergency funding to fight swine flu. July 16, 2009.

11 Food and Drug Administration, Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research, Office of Vaccine Research and Review. Regulatory Considerations Regarding the Use of Novel Influenza A (H1N1) Virus Vaccines. July 23, 2009.

12 Project Bioshield Act of 2004 (PL 108-276)

13 The Pandemic and All Hazards Preparedness Act of 2006 (PL 109-417).

14 Nightingale SL, Prasher JM, Simonson S. Emergency Use Authorization (EUA) to Enable Use of Needed Products in Civilian and Military Emergencies, United States. Emerging Infectious Diseases Vo. 13, No.7: July 2007.

15 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 (PL99-660)

16 CDC. Fact Sheet for Vaccine Information Statements.

17 MedAlerts. Online Access to the U.S. VAERS Database.

18 Fisher BL. Vaccine Safety Research Priorities: Engaging the Public. National Vaccine Advisory Committee. April 11, 2008.


http://www.nvic.org/NVIC-Vaccine-News/July-2009/Swine-Flu-Vaccine-Should-Not-Be-Given-to-Children.aspx

[Garcia Bronco]

HEY

to say any drug is safe it would require a longitudinal study lasting at least 20 years. No one knows the long term effects of this vaccine. They can guess. But they don't know for sure.

[gunns]

HEY

to say any drug is safe it would require a longitudinal study lasting at least 20 years. No one knows the long term effects of this vaccine. They can guess. But they don't know for sure.

True. You need to educate yourself on these vaccines. I vaccinated all of my children except the last two after reading up on the impurities of some of the vaccines commonly given to our children back then. Don't know if related but they were my two healthiest children. I never get the flu shot, all my coworkers and friends do. They are the ones that generally get sick during the winter season. They have rationalizations for it, but it seems pretty obvious that it isn't working. I have diabetes and have heard it will be one of the first groups after children and pregnant women. I'm not sure if I'll get it.

[baja]

Cost vs. Bennefit -- in my mind heavily weighs on getting the vacine this year. There is truth to the notion, that when rushed vacines, may not be as safe as usual, but I will take that chance.

Good bye Bob;

he Chip is at the Tip of the Needle

By Dr Ryke Geerd Hamer (New GermanMedicine)
Yesterday, 27 August 2009, I was giving an introductory talk about
German New Medicine (GNM) near Vienna, Austria. My wife was with me
and about 40 listeners. At the end as part of the discussion the swine
flu was mentioned and a lady got up and declared the following:

A friend of hers works for a pharmaceutical company in Vienna and told
her that the swine flu injection needles indeed contain nano particles
in their very tip, which cannot be detected with the naked eye but
are clearly visible with as little as a 12 times magnifying microscope
like children’s toy microscopes. The staff of the pharmaceuticalC2
company was advised that these nano particles work in the human body
like a motherboard in the computer and lots of data can be stored on
it, which will make cash cards obsolete. This measure was also
intended to do an accurate census and to protect babies, as many
mothers would simply “discard” their newborn, without knowledge of the
authorities.

This lady further disclosed that she was working in the medical field.
She had asked a lawyer who came to her as a patient, how it was
possible to avoid being chipped. He told her that he was aware of the
planned chipping of the population; in fact most upper class members
of society were aware of this plan. For this year no forced
vaccinations were planned but to rather encourage people through the
media to volunteer for the jab.

In case too few would come forward, forced vaccination was planned for
next year. Exempt from those were certain professional groups like the
police, medical personal, politicians etc. Being a lawyer, he knew
ways for himself to avoid the jab, but for the majority of the
population there was no escape.

Interview with Dr Gert Hamer (GNM) by Helmut Pilhar (Engineer) ,
Wednesday, 26. August 2009

Hamer: Within a few days our worst fears were indeed superseded by
0Athis cruel reality.

Pilhar: Geerd, are you talking about the $1000 fine and 30 day arrest
threats for refusal to take the vaccination in the US?
http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-in-jail-
for-refusing-the-swine-flu-vaccine-in-massachusetts

Hamer: Yes, but the objectors (death chip opposers are traitors) are
not going to be put into normal prisons but in especially prepared
concentration camps of which hundreds have been prepared all over the
country http://info.kopp-verlag.de/news/amerikanische-
konzentrationslager-fertig-und-einsatzbereit.html
. And you can leave those only by getting chipped. And once you are
outside it is open season through the death chip. By chance these
people are then going to drop dead like flies after their release.

Pilhar: Are you talking about the beginning of the great population cull?

Hamer: It can only mean that. Otherwise it does not make any sense to
get the military and the police involved, threaten with such draconian
penalties, all just to get the people to participate in a simple
seasonal flu shot campaign. It just does not make any other sense.
Apart from the fact that there cannot even be a vaccination like that.
You vaccinate in October (northern autumn) for the next summer. That
is totally laughable. With Tamiflu you can maybe suppress typical
healing phase symptoms for 2-3 weeks and even that is totally
brainless in the light of GNM.

Pilhar: It is noteworthy that in the US there are literally many
100,000plastic coffins stock piled
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&VideoID=39130476
What for? And apart from that the population has been systematically
stripped of weapons and protective dogs.

Hamer: You can best understand what the intent is by what is NOT
talked about. One may talk about the vaccination, but nobody mentions
the chip implanting by name. That is really strange because the
chipping is the obvious issue in the face of these massive
governmental measures. And that the Hitachi chip works and can be
combined with the death chip we already talked about during the last
interview.
The same can be seen in how my GNM ( German New Medicine) fared. For
28 years one was only allowed to discuss Hamer, the “Unperson”, but
not whether GNM actually works and whether its claims are repeatable,
and can be proven to work, in spite of 30 verified publishe d results.
The same applies to Tamuflu! There are endless discussions about
Tamiflu causing harm but none about the chip. Of course Tamiflu is
harmful, it is a poison. It is also very damaging in the healing
process or in the vagotonic phase of a pregnancy (last trimester). But
the death chip adds a whole new dimension. That this death chip is
going to be used without concern can be seen in the fact that chemo
and morphine have been used without concern in spite of final
mortality rates of 98%, while 98% could have survived with GNM.
Imagine the unscrupulousness of all oncologists, as they are fully
aware that GNM adds up from a scientific perspective and works

Pilhar: It is also very strange that the Americans have created this
Marshall Law, under which critics can be easily removed by the
thousands and millions. And once you have chipped the people they
cannot run away from you anymore.

Hamer: It is obvious that this chip battle has been under preparation
for many years. The idiotic swine flu, that does not even really
exist, was actually the wrong tool: 3 dead pigs and one child, dead
from who knows what, with that they lied and constructed a worldwide
pandemic into existence. But it goes to show what a well organised
world press is able to achieve: They can turn a mole=2 0hill into a
mountain.

Pilhar: It started with the AIDS lie, then followed the BSE lie.
After the 9/11 lie followed the Anthrax lie. Then it was the Bird Flu
lie, now it is the Swine Flu lie. Next year we’ll have the Mice Flu
lie. It all points to the “Endloesung”, the final solution. When
everybody has a chip then that will constitute the complete slavery,
then everybody can be manipulated and assassinated arbitrarily.

Hamer: First they jump on the babies and the pregnant women. They are
first to be treated with chips and Tamiflu. Many of the pregnant women
in their last trimester are going to lose their babies, because
Tamiflu is totally toxic. But also the women themselves can die, as
their bodies are vagotonic during the last trimester. It is a known
fact that during vagotonia one flu shot or one morphine injection can
be deadly.

In the meantime there seems to be some panic in the US. Where in the
world can you flee to, people are asking themselves, where will you
not be forcibly injected with the death chip and have one free moment
away from your enemies?

One has to consider realistically what it would be like to carry this
death chip and know that any day you can simply be switched off by the
Centre in Tel Aviv. =2 0You are completely defenceless against that and
complaining won’t do you any good: “If I only had known...” Therefore
it is really important for the ruling class to keep the people in the
dark about it as long as possible.

Once the slaves have the death chip implanted they are allowed to know
about it. Then they will be like trained poodles. Nobody will dare to
speak up. It will be like among the Masonic brethren. Everybody knows
that the moment he utters a word of dissent, he will be served poison
in the coffee by the always Jewish Grand Master and won’t survive
another day. The whole world is going to be a concentration camp full
of slaves, except for the members of one religious group. To have the
death chip implanted is the potential personal death sentence at any
given time.
How naive do you have to be to demand of Mossad and the CIA to
disclose what their real intentions are, “to table the facts”? The
mouse never believes the cat will come.

In a company with several hundred staff, which produces, or better
fills the injection needles for the chip vaccination, it will only
need one or two “reliable” people to insert the chip at the end. Then
all the other workers can confirm that they knew nothing. This is
ca lled “quality control” and “final check” and appears completely
normal.
Strange is too that every single chip vaccination needle has its own
individual code number, which is added to the ID number. Why else
would the silly “summer flu shot” needle have its own individual
number and why should the passport accompany the supposed flu
vaccination? And why do the Americans not want to let anybody into the
country who does not have a chip?

Pilhar: The „Club of Rome“ declared in the 70s in one of their
publications (possibly in Mankind at the Turning Point ) in effect
that either the birth rate would have to be reduced or the death rate
increased. The Max Planck Institute believes that the world population
must be reduced to 2 billion people. In the US there is the so called
“American Stonehenge”,
http://www.igeawagu.com/news/corruption/1199237261.html a
message engraved in 100 ton granite blocks, that the world population
has to be reduced to 500 million people, to reach an “Era of Reason”.
When you look at the supposed issue of "overpopulation" it is
interesting to note that apparently the State of Texas alone could
feed all 6 billion people. If one piled those 6=2 0billion bodies with
an average weight of 80kg and a volume of 80 liters on top and side by
side of each other in a cube shape, the sides of this cube would be
only 800 meters long. In Austria we could hide such a cube in the next
valley.

I don’t believe in the so called “overpopulation” but rather suppose
that the globalisation fanatics don’t need 6 billion work slaves and
therefore want to reduce the population to one tenth.

Hamer: Helmut, you were right when you said during our last interview
on 13 August 2009: „Once they have accomplished that, they have won.“
Therefore the German New Medicine had to be suppressed, because if
this awareness and knowledge had been common place they could not
have done it. “Lewwer duad üs Slaav!“ Rather dead than slave! (from
Pidder Lueng, by Detler von Liliencron).

Cheers to the GNM, the New Biological Medicine and a world view of
freedom and truth for us all.

Dr. Ryke Geerd Hamer ……………………………………………………………….

Ing. Helmut Pilhar ………………………………………………… …………[/size][/quote]

On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:19 AM,
mentalalchemist<mentalalchemist@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> FORMER STATE TROOPER EVENSON WARNS OF ROADBLOCK PLANS
> TO FORCE VACCINES
>
> Kansas State Trooper Greg Evenson telling us that he's been contacted by
> active duty State trooper friends from several states who are all telling
> him of plans to erect roadblocks at key places along interstate highways > to
> force all cars to go single file up to barricades where you will be given > a
> "choice":
>
> be vaccinated on the spot and fitted with a stainless steel wrist bracelet
> containing an RFID chip with your medical history showing you've received
> the vaccine, or be put on a bus and taken to a FEMA Quarantine Camp.

[Rohirrim]

"Death chip?" You believe this, Baja?

[Fedaykin]

If you want to get vaccinated, that's fine. Forcing me and others to vaccinate ourselves has not been justified, particularly for this specific disease.

Are you not familiar with the term "herd immunity" and why it is important?

[baja]

"Death chip?" You believe this, Baja?

Let me put it this way Ro, there ain't no way in hell I'm taking that shot. Death chip or not.

[Rohirrim]

Let me put it this way Ro, there ain't no way in hell I'm taking that shot. Death chip or not.

You better hope they're not putting that chip in Dos Equis. ;D

[baja]

You better hope they're not putting that chip in Dos Equis. ;D


Dos Equis has always had a death chip in every bottle. At least for me....

[Dudeskey]

Vaccines always have side-effects. It doesn't take a PHD to know this. The FDA has recommended drugs and the like over the years that they had to admit years later, were not good. This is no different. Swine flu is nothing different than any other flu. The hype it gets doesn't change that.

A post by barryr that I agree with? Holy **** dude, I need to mark my calendar...™

[watermock]

The urgency to produce massive untested? "vaccine" programs on a mild genetically engineered flu that has milder symptoms than the common cold/flu is certainly odd.

I'm on medicare and assisted living, so I guess I'll be the first to be forced.

I was forced into taking the last flu shot, which was the wrong strain.

In fact, I'd never been really sick 1 day in my life before they checked my BP, it was a series of errors that almost killed me 3 times.

They'll have to hold me down for this poison.

[watermock]

LIFE WITH BIG BROTHER
Next step in H1N1 scare: Microchip implants
Company developing under-the-skin devices to detect 'bio-threats'

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: August 22, 2009
11:50 pm Eastern


By Drew Zahn
© 2009 WorldNetDaily



VeriChip's microchip implant, about the size of a grain of rice

A Florida-based company that boasts selling the world's first and only federally approved radio microchip for implanting in humans is now turning its development branch toward "emergency preparedness," hoping to produce an implant that can automatically detect in its host's bloodstream the presence of swine flu or other viruses deemed a "bio-threat."

VeriChip Corporation currently sells a small, under-the-skin Radio Frequency Identification capsule, or RFID, that patients can opt to have implanted, containing a number computer-linked to their medical records, enabling doctors with a special reader to access the information even if the patient is unconscious or unidentified. The company boasts its microchip, roughly the size of a grain of rice, is the only such implant approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration.

But VeriChip has also turned its attention to other uses for the technology, including microchips that be used to tag and log human remains after a disaster and implants the company hopes will be able to warn if their host is infected with the H1N1 swine flu virus, the H5N1 bird flu virus or other pandemic agents deemed to be a "bio-threat."

VeriChip is working with a Minnesota company, Receptors LLC, to develop the virus-detection technology.

"As we continue to build on our partnership with Receptors, which started with the development of a glucose-sensing RFID implantable microchip, we are moving beyond patient identification to sensors that can detect and identify illnesses and viruses such as influenza," said Scott R. Silverman, chairman of VeriChip, in a statement. "This is an exciting next step for the future of our healthcare division."

(Story continues below)




According to a joint white paper released earlier this year by both companies called "An Integrated Sensor System for the Detection of Bio-Threats from Pandemics to Emerging Diseases to Bio-Terrorism," the research's goal is to transform existing glucose-detection technology into pinpointing viruses instead, then couple it with an "in vivo" – meaning implanted inside a living organism – microchip that can alert others of the virus' presence.

The ultimate goal is to develop an implant that can also diagnose which virus is infecting the host.

VeriChip has also announced earlier this month additional forays into emergency preparedness through its VeriTrace system.

According to a statement, the company sold a VeriTrace system, including 1,000 RFID microchips, to Kentucky's Green River District Health Department "for disaster preparedness and emergency management needs."

The company explains that VeriTrace, a separate system from its virus detection or patient records technology, was created in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, where it was used by the Federal Disaster Mortuary Operational Response Team. The system includes the microchips, a Bluetooth handheld reader, a customized camera that receives both RFID scanned data and GPS data wirelessly and a web-based database for storing information and images captured during emergency response operations.

The microchips are implanted in human remains following a disaster or, according to one report from the Katrina catastrophe, duct-taped to bones, in order to maintain detailed records, particularly in events that result in hundreds or thousands of fatalities.

"This database ensures the precise collection, storage and inventory of all data and images related to remains and the associated evidentiary items," the statement boasts. "This also allows the recreation of an accurate and complete reconstruction of a disaster setting, crime scene or similar setting where recreation is necessary."

Since Hurricane Katrina, the RFID Journal reports, the Georgia Bureau of Investigation, the Hawaii Department of Health, the Florida Emergency Mortuary Operations Response System and the medical examiner's office in the Department of Heath in Erie County, N.Y, have also purchased the system. Earlier this year, VeriChip announced sales to Maryland's Calvert Memorial Hospital and to Mercer and Atlantic counties in New Jersey.

WND contacted VeriChip seeking information on its progress in developing the virus detection technology and other emergency preparedness microchip implants, but received no response.

WND previously has reported on such chips when hospitals used them to identify newborns, VeriChip desired to embed immigrants with the electronic devices, a government health event showcased them and when Wal-Mart used microchips to track customers.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=107588

[Beantown Bronco]

The urgency to produce massive untested? "vaccine" programs on a mild genetically engineered flu that has milder symptoms than the common cold/flu is certainly odd.

Nice to see projectile vomiting and potential death is now considered milder than the sniffles.

[watermock]

10+ deaths in the US so far, most those allready infirm.