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View Full Version : Krieger: Cuts could signal break from past


Cool Breeze
09-05-2009, 07:04 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_13273941

Let's see. We know Josh McDaniels and Mike Shanahan evaluated quarterback Jay Cutler somewhat differently.

We know they evaluated tight end Tony Scheffler differently, at least initially, because McDaniels had him on the trading block awhile back. And only one of them seems to have wide receiver Brandon Marshall on his Christmas card list.

But what about the rest of Shanahan's recent draft picks? Do the Broncos' new coach and his predecessor differ on a few individual players, or is McDaniels trying to clear out Shanahan's players and start over with his own as quickly as possible?

The best measuring stick on that may be Shanahan's 2007 draft class. Three of the four players he selected were defensive linemen. All three are on the bubble today as McDaniels gets the roster down to 53 players.

A little more than eight months after the end of his 14-year reign at Dove Valley, Shanahan's imprint on his former team already had been reduced in a big way. Surprisingly, McDaniels has exhibited more problems with Shanahan's 2006 draft class, which was considered very strong, than the 2007 class, which is considered pretty weak.

Jarvis Moss, Shanahan's top pick in '07, is on the bubble, as are Tim Crowder, the second-round pick that year, and Marcus Thomas, the fourth-round pick.

I wouldn't put it past McDaniels to cut them all, but my guess is the lack of alternatives will leave him with two of them on his roster for the time being. Still, the one I have him cutting would be quite an indictment on its own.

Moss was not just a first-round draft pick. Shanahan wanted him badly enough to trade up four spots, surrendering another pick in the process. In two years as a defensive end in a 4-3 scheme, Moss made no impact.

McDaniels moved him to outside linebacker, where he struggled. He was so discouraged at one point that he walked out of training camp for a couple of days. He made a few plays in the final preseason game, but they were against Arizona's scrubs and may not be enough to save him.

Fully aware of the risks involved in trying to predict anything McDaniels does, here's a guess at his final roster and cuts, some of which the club announced Friday:

Quarterbacks (3): Kyle Orton, Chris Simms and Tom Brandstater.

So long to Ingle Martin.

Running backs (4): Knowshon Moreno, Correll Buckhalter, Peyton Hillis and Darius Walker. So long to LaMont Jordan and the other Marcus Thomas.

Wide receivers (7): Brandon Marshall, Eddie Royal, Brandon Stokley, Jabar Gaffney, Brandon Lloyd, Kenny McKinley and a pickup from the waiver wire.

So long to Chad Jackson, Nate Swift and Matt Willis, although Swift could be a practice-squad guy.

Tight ends (3): Daniel Graham, Tony Scheffler and Richard Quinn.

So long to Marquez Branson, another potential practice-squad guy.

Offensive line (9): Ryan Clady, Ben Hamilton, Casey Wiegmann, Chris Kuper, Ryan Harris, Russ Hochstein, Seth Olsen, Tyler Polumbus and Brandon Gorin.

So long to Kory Lichtensteiger, Clint Oldenburg and Mitch Erickson, another possible practice-squad guy. A long goodbye to the injured Matt McChesney.

Defensive line (6): Kenny Peterson, Ronald Fields, Le Kevin Smith, Chris Baker, Nic Clemons and Thomas.

So long to Matthias Askew, Carlton Powell, Ryan McBean and Everette Pedescleaux.

Linebackers (9): Elvis Dumervil, D.J. Williams, Andra Davis, Mario Haggan, Robert Ayers, Darrell Reid, Wesley Woodyard, Spencer Larsen and Crowder.

So long to Moss, Braxton Kelley and Lee Robinson, another practice-squad candidate.

Defensive backs (9): Champ Bailey, Andre Goodman, Renaldo Hill, Brian Dawkins, Darcel McBath, David Bruton, Alphonso Smith, Jack Williams and Antwain Spann.

So long to Josh Barrett, Vernon Fox, Joshua Bell, Tony Carter, D.J. Johnson and Rashod Moulton. Carter could be a practice-squad guy if he clears waivers.

Specialists (3): Matt Prater (place-kicker), Brett Kern (punter) and Lonie Paxton (long snapper).

I have the waiver wire providing one member of the Broncos' final roster, at wide receiver, but it could provide more. The club has so little starting NFL experience along the defensive front, it's possible other clubs will waive linemen who are better than what the Broncos have. In that case, McDaniels might make additional cuts to add players cut by other teams.

But watch those three defensive picks from the '07 draft. Their fate should tell us just how eager McDaniels is to wipe away his predecessor's footprints.

Borks147
09-05-2009, 07:21 AM
Barrett stays, especially with the increase focused on special teams.

Wait, who the hell is Antwain Spann?

gtown
09-05-2009, 07:32 AM
He has McBean getting cut? The guy started every single game of the preseason...

MABroncoFan
09-05-2009, 07:38 AM
Barrett stays, especially with the increase focused on special teams.

Wait, who the hell is Antwain Spann?

Defensive back. He was with the Patriots last year.

Broncoman13
09-05-2009, 08:00 AM
Moss will make it over Crowder (or should anyhow) and I'm probably one of the biggest Crowder supporters on the Mane.

footstepsfrom#27
09-05-2009, 08:03 AM
Seven WR's and 5 CB's? Thomas and not McBean? Seems doubtful.

Cmac821
09-05-2009, 08:07 AM
I thought Barret was good? Wish there was a LB in FA that good replace Davis, he just to slow

Chris
09-05-2009, 08:17 AM
Spann played well in the Cardinals game. Granted, I didn't get to watch the first half when he wasn't playing against scrubs.

Popcorn Sutton
09-05-2009, 08:20 AM
I thought McBean was starting?

Broncoman13
09-05-2009, 08:49 AM
Seven WR's and 5 CB's? Thomas and not McBean? Seems doubtful.

Seven WRs b/c Marshall is a huge ? and Gaff is out for a bit with his thumb.

I think it will be:

Royal
Marshall
Stokley
Gaffney
McKinley
Lloyd
Chad Jackson

When Marshall comes back and Gaffney is healthy and good to go we will likely go down to 6.

Cito Pelon
09-05-2009, 09:19 AM
I don't get into the numbers game too much, but I'm thinking that's not a bad 53, and the PS has some possibly good players also. There's some good young players on the roster, obviously some of the rookies have to step up and play well this year to top .500.

MABroncoFan
09-05-2009, 09:21 AM
Seven WRs b/c Marshall is a huge ? and Gaff is out for a bit with his thumb.

I think it will be:

Royal
Marshall
Stokley
Gaffney
McKinley
Lloyd
Chad Jackson

When Marshall comes back and Gaffney is healthy and good to go we will likely go down to 6.

Unless it was a WR that is familiar with McD's offense with NE, I can't see a waiver wire WR taking Jackson or Lloyd's spot if there is a 7th WR kept.

I'd be surprised if McBean is cut. Not only since he's started all preseason, but also due to our lack of depth there to begin with since Smith is injured.

I'd also say Barrett over Spann as a 9th DB.

Popps
09-05-2009, 11:31 AM
I thought McBean was starting?

Well, I'm confused on this whole thing. I thought Thomas was playing earlier in pre-season, but not with the starters. Now I hear that he's been injured since training camp?

Then, this speculation that McBean will be cut? If McBean had any chance of being cut, why was he running with the first team the whole pre-season?


I was just assuming Thomas was the one in danger. Maybe I'm off base. But, we haven't really seen much of him and McBean has looked very solid.

TonyR
09-05-2009, 11:52 AM
Then, this speculation that McBean will be cut?

From Klis today, although even if true this doesn't necessarily mean McBean wouldn't make the team.

Providing he passes his physical today, veteran defensive end Vonnie Holliday will be added to the Denver Broncos’ roster.

The 6-foot-5, 288-pound Holliday was a solid defensive tackle for the Green Bay Packers from 1998-2002 before moving on to Kansas City and the Miami Dolphins.

He has since converted to the 5-technique defensive end position in the 3-4 defensive alignment. Holliday, 33, had worked out for the Broncos during the free-agent period in March. He recently became a priority with newly acquired DE Le Kevin Smith suffering a knee injury.

Holliday would likely immediately compete with Ryan McBean for the starting 5-technique position.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2009/09/05/broncos-expect-to-add-vonnie-holliday/

BroncoMan4ever
09-05-2009, 11:52 AM
i hate these articles claiming McDaniels is just dumping all former Shanahan picks. is it his fault that outside of Harris the 07 draft was garbage?

Lomax
09-05-2009, 06:40 PM
I was just thinking about this today. The reality is, Mike had some really, really awful defensive picks in drafts. Even the '08 draft, which is heralded as being one of the best Broncos drafts in recent history, yielded only a 2nd string CB (Williams) and a Special Teamer (Barrett). Most of the defensive picks since the '06 draft have been busts.

The only thing worse than Mike's defensive drafts have been his defensive FA acquisitions. The issue isn't so much that we didn't get guys who could fit the system. We clearly didn't get many guys who fit ANY system.

Between those two, no DC in the league could put together a quality team.

The issue with our defenses has been the talent. We haven't drafted a defensive Pro-Bowler since Al Wilson. Clearly, we're moving in the right direction solely by cleaning house of most of Mike's defensive picks.

listopencil
09-05-2009, 06:44 PM
i hate these articles claiming McDaniels is just dumping all former Shanahan picks. is it his fault that outside of Harris the 07 draft was garbage?

It's hack reporting. We've had some miserable drafts and the team is cleaning up the mess, but this guy has to inject some drama into it and pretend that it's all about McD's ego. He's manufacturing news.

rastaman
09-05-2009, 07:10 PM
From Klis today, although even if true this doesn't necessarily mean McBean wouldn't make the team.

Providing he passes his physical today, veteran defensive end Vonnie Holliday will be added to the Denver Broncos’ roster.

The 6-foot-5, 288-pound Holliday was a solid defensive tackle for the Green Bay Packers from 1998-2002 before moving on to Kansas City and the Miami Dolphins.

He has since converted to the 5-technique defensive end position in the 3-4 defensive alignment. Holliday, 33, had worked out for the Broncos during the free-agent period in March. He recently became a priority with newly acquired DE Le Kevin Smith suffering a knee injury.

Holliday would likely immediately compete with Ryan McBean for the starting 5-technique position.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2009/09/05/broncos-expect-to-add-vonnie-holliday/

Yawn!.........Holiday is washed up.

rastaman
09-05-2009, 07:12 PM
It's hack reporting. We've had some miserable drafts and the team is cleaning up the mess, but this guy has to inject some drama into it and pretend that it's all about McD's ego. He's manufacturing news.

Can't wait to start judging McDainel's draft picks.....Ayers, Moreno, and Smith----they're on the clock.

Check back with us next January 2010.

BroncoMan4ever
09-06-2009, 01:18 AM
Can't wait to start judging McDainel's draft picks.....Ayers, Moreno, and Smith----they're on the clock.

Check back with us next January 2010.

Shanahan's turds got at least 3 years. so before the 2012 season we will see how we did with the draft.

~Crash~
09-06-2009, 02:00 AM
to all the one we loved before....now put a catchy tune in the back ground...