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View Full Version : Should we start to worry now?


DarkHorse
08-30-2009, 09:24 PM
Week 3 over, probably won't see much of the starters in Week 4 so that being said:


Have we shown enough of our game to either worry or perhaps be content with what we have?


I'm not going to lie - i'm a bit worried. Quite a bit. Offense looks good except for.....the.....qb.

Taco John
08-30-2009, 09:29 PM
Week 3 over, probably won't see much of the starters in Week 4 so that being said:


Have we shown enough of our game to either worry or perhaps be content with what we have?


I'm not going to lie - i'm a bit worried. Quite a bit. Offense looks good except for.....the.....qb.


In this division, I'm not sure why we should be worried until sometime in October. We have just as good a shot at winning this division as any of our rivals - including the overrated Chargers.

KevinJames
08-30-2009, 09:37 PM
^Exactly

and with that showing from our first team defense I am stoked!

bronco militia
08-30-2009, 09:37 PM
I'm very concerend...this team is not ready for the regualr season and seems to be getting worse every week

JMO

Cmac821
08-30-2009, 09:37 PM
I wondering the same thing

Punisher
08-30-2009, 09:38 PM
I stopped worrying a long time ago,it is what it is now.

If we stink we stink ill just deal with it

BMarsh615
08-30-2009, 09:39 PM
I think McDaniels has only been using a very small portion of the playbook. He has called pretty much the same plays over and over throughout the preseason. I bet he saving the real thing for the regular season.

lostknight
08-30-2009, 09:40 PM
Yes. It makes sense to be worried. I have been since the moment I heard the Goodman's were fired.

go_broncos
08-30-2009, 09:40 PM
I am very concerned about our offense..They are not generating any points

NASurfer
08-30-2009, 09:43 PM
Week 3 over, probably won't see much of the starters in Week 4 so that being said:


Have we shown enough of our game to either worry or perhaps be content with what we have?


I'm not going to lie - i'm a bit worried. Quite a bit. Offense looks good except for.....the.....qb.
I was actually optimistic for a bit, smacking against some Charger fans on a rival board.

Fact is, Shanahan left behind a really bad team with a good QB. We traded away what good we had and traded the first round pick we could have had as a consolation prize for a bad season.

I think McDaniels brings some good to the team. But it's still a bad team that made horrible FO decisions this year. I don't even know about 6 wins.

Kid A
08-30-2009, 09:44 PM
With any team that is rebuilding/introducing new systems on both sides of the ball the real time to start worrying will come in the second half of the season. If things still look way out of sync and we aren't seeing progress/reasons for optimism down the homestretch then I might worry.

Regardless of how the season begins, though, I'll probably reserve most my judgment until I get a feel for whether we have a chance to be good next year.

Sure a fast, impressive start would be great, but I'll more than settle for a competitive closing that gives us a good foundation to build a real winner in the next couple seasons.

Ambiguous
08-30-2009, 09:50 PM
I am very concerned about our offense..They are not generating any points

I'm conerned all around... The offense looks stagnant; the D is playing with added intensity but still cannot generate a turnover to save their life.

At this point I'm pretty sure their going to suck. It's going to be a painful season, hopefully I'm wrong.

SonOfLe-loLang
08-30-2009, 09:53 PM
With any team that is rebuilding/introducing new systems on both sides of the ball the real time to start worrying will come in the second half of the season. If things still look way out of sync and we aren't seeing progress/reasons for optimism down the homestretch then I might worry.

Regardless of how the season begins, though, I'll probably reserve most my judgment until I get a feel for whether we have a chance to be good next year.

Sure a fast, impressive start would be great, but I'll more than settle for a competitive closing that gives us a good foundation to build a real winner in the next couple seasons.

Exactly. Anyone expecting a contender out of the gate is going to be disappointed. ANyone calling for anyone's head out of the gate will just be stupid. Its going to take a little bit of time for this thing to get on track. I'll reserve judgment. There are some positives and negatives to be taken from this preseason for sure.

tsiguy96
08-30-2009, 09:54 PM
I stopped worrying a long time ago,it is what it is now.

If we stink we stink ill just deal with it

2nd.

lex
08-30-2009, 09:56 PM
Go Gators!

DBroncos4life
08-30-2009, 09:57 PM
I'm still worried that McD might have been over hyped when it comes to running a O. The Pats haven't missed a beat without him and are moving and scoring at will just like they used too. I'm not sure what McD has planned that he doesn't want to show in preseason.

Taco John
08-30-2009, 09:58 PM
Fact is, Shanahan left behind a really bad team with a good QB.


That's not a fact at all. Shanahan left us in a great situation - the hottest young offense in the NFL with a rising star, an offensive line that is young and productive, and one of the best young receiving outfits in the game. The defense needed help, but to address that, Shanahan had worked the team into a position where we had a lot to work with in the draft, and more salary cap room than we've had in a decade.

Shanahan didn't leave this team in a bad situation at all.

TheDave
08-30-2009, 09:59 PM
I've been worried a long time, and I haven't seen nearly enough to change my mind.

SonOfLe-loLang
08-30-2009, 10:00 PM
That's not a fact at all. Shanahan left us in a great situation - the hottest young offense in the NFL with a rising star, an offensive line that is young and productive, and one of the best young receiving outfits in the game. The defense needed help, but to address that, Shanahan had worked the team into a position where we had a lot to work with in the draft, and more salary cap room than we've had in a decade.

Shanahan didn't leave this team in a bad situation at all.

Agreed, which is why it baffles me that people think we are going to be 3-13. By the sounds of the naysayers on this board, you'd think we got beat 50-3 today. When the starters left the game, it was 17-10. And one of their 7 came on a special teams play (it happens).

listopencil
08-30-2009, 10:02 PM
That's not a fact at all. Shanahan left us in a great situation - the hottest young offense in the NFL with a rising star, an offensive line that is young and productive, and one of the best young receiving outfits in the game. The defense needed help, but to address that, Shanahan had worked the team into a position where we had a lot to work with in the draft, and more salary cap room than we've had in a decade.

Shanahan didn't leave this team in a bad situation at all.

True in a sense, TJ. Shanny left great things on the O side of the ball and any coach worth a **** should have been able to take it and run with it. But would this be the year they finally put some serious emphasis on the D? And would we have Mike Nolan as the DC if Shanny was still here?

bpc
08-30-2009, 10:03 PM
I'm still worried that McD might have been over hyped when it comes to running a O. The Pats haven't missed a beat without him and are moving and scoring at will just like they used too. I'm not sure what McD has planned that he doesn't want to show in preseason.

Probably because McDaniels offense is simply very good and Brady, Moss and Welker are great.

Taco John
08-30-2009, 10:08 PM
True in a sense, TJ. Shanny left great things on the O side of the ball and any coach worth a **** should have been able to take it and run with it. But would this be the year they finally put some serious emphasis on the D? And would we have Mike Nolan as the DC if Shanny was still here?


Where else would we have put our emphasis? We only had one other need on offense: a running back. I personally believe we'd have drafted Moreno in the first and then focused almost exclusively on defense.

And that's not mentioning Free Agents.

No, Nolan wouldn't have been our DC. But I suspect Nolan is going to struggle just as much in his first year of implementing a new system without the players to do it as Slowick did - so that's a wash as far as I'm concerned.

In any case, I am not worried right now. I think that in this division, it's anybody's game just like it was last year. There's no reason to panic right now. Panic if we lose to the Chiefs and/or Raiders.

Broncos4tw
08-30-2009, 10:12 PM
We had a team that had issues in the redzone, but was red-hot on offense for getting yards. We had a VW bug (the old version) on Defense, and a Jaguar on Offense. So what did McD do? He traded in the Jaguar for a Lexus. And upgraded our VW Bug to a Saturn. Why? Who knows. I think his own ego and his lack of knowing anything but the NE offense both had a part to play in it.

The theory that we can win without money players is stupidity in the extreme, and I'm amazed that some supposedly knowledgable fans actually agree with this mindset. No Cutler means a boring, screen-passing, Griese-like game. If we get rid of Marshall, we have one real threat on the receiving team, so just double him up, and we become super stagnant and predictable.

I guess what amazes me the most are fans unequivaquibly supporting McD and this magical "system' although he STILL hasn't won a single damn game wearing a Bronco hat. Why in the hell are people so high on this guy? It's really baffling.

NFLBRONCO
08-30-2009, 10:12 PM
This team is BAD in many spots and it made it even worse no Cutler No BM. I don't understand the worry fans have here we have alot of growing pains and rebuilding to do. This shouldn't shock anyone too much change not enough talent crappy QB equals ugly. Just sit back and enjoy the progress over the season let's hope FO are great a rebuilding.

listopencil
08-30-2009, 10:17 PM
Where else would we have put our emphasis? We only had one other need on offense: a running back. I personally believe we'd have drafted Moreno in the first and then focused almost exclusively on defense.

And that's not mentioning Free Agents.

No, Nolan wouldn't have been our DC. But I suspect Nolan is going to struggle just as much in his first year of implementing a new system without the players to do it as Slowick did - so that's a wash as far as I'm concerned.

In any case, I am not worried right now. I think that in this division, it's anybody's game just like it was last year. There's no reason to panic right now. Panic if we lose to the Chiefs and/or Raiders.



That would have been fine if it happened, but I really don't have any faith in this organization's commitment to the D. And I think that goes from Bowlen on down. How many times have we had a new DC implementing a new system now?

yerner
08-30-2009, 10:19 PM
I don't see a very good football team. Sure its preseason, but no winning at least one is not a good sign. I think the bears would have stomped the broncos if this had been a regular season game. I'm baffled by peoples optimism when there are no wins.

lex
08-30-2009, 10:25 PM
Probably because McDaniels offense is simply very good and Brady, Moss and Welker are great.

Its not just Brady, Moss and Welker. McDaniels has shown flashes of being a good play caller. But youre right in questioning the system that he is a slave to. Our old system was just as good and probably better than the new one in most respects.

When Shanahan came to Denver he had a resume that included coaching at Oklahoma during the wishbone days, being the OC at UF during their time as SEC champs in the mid 80s (they gave Miami their only loss in 83 when Miami was the NCs), to his time in Denver as OC, to his time in SF as OC. Shanahan had such a broad background that he wasnt so rigidly bound by one system. The WCO was a system of organization as much as it was play design by the time Shanahan was there.

Think about it, if Shanahan was so rigidly bound as Josh seems to be, there would have not likely been zone blocking, which we all know has been massively successful.

cutthemdown
08-30-2009, 10:28 PM
well I'm not worried but I just never expected Broncos to get a 3-4 going, switch offenses, qbs, HC, D-coord all in one yr and smell like a rose.

We need Moreno to be a playmaker, and of course we need Marshall.

The offense IMO looks like it could be effecient, but without Moreno and Marshall being playmakers in the offense the big plays just won't be there. Royal can't do it alone.

cutthemdown
08-30-2009, 10:30 PM
actually Shannahan last yr started adopting much of what patriots were doing. I saw Broncos run 2 back sets, no back sets, 1 back sets, 2 TE, 1 TE, lots of motion, its a lot like what shanny liked to do. Mix it up and keep defenses guessing.

I agree that we did an over abundance of screens, but the oline needs work on executing that play and that could be why they kept calling it. Obviously Mcdaniels knows you can't do that all game and win. People need to realize it was a preseason game. I thought defense showed some signs of being better.

Orange_Beard
08-30-2009, 10:32 PM
Start?

Taco John
08-30-2009, 10:37 PM
That would have been fine if it happened, but I really don't have any faith in this organization's commitment to the D. And I think that goes from Bowlen on down. How many times have we had a new DC implementing a new system now?


I hear that. You and I were both on the Coyer bandwagon, so we probably agree on a lot more with regards to this topic than we disagree. That firing was a huge mistake.

DBroncos4life
08-30-2009, 10:38 PM
What I don't get if preseason is just practice and here to see the abilities or lack of abilities in each player why are we not throwing the ball down field. I doubt this is the full system but **** man I want to see if Orton can attack down field.

TheDave
08-30-2009, 10:39 PM
Like it or not guys the QB position is our biggest weakneses... Name a team in the last 10 years that has done anything when a QB is playing like Orton.


The fact is, he's a marginal Qb that is struggleing... We will see if he can pull his head out, but I doubt it.

Taco John
08-30-2009, 10:42 PM
Like it or not guys the QB position is one of if not our biggest weakneses... Name a team in the last 10 years that has done anything when a QB is struggleing like Orton.



The Denver Broncos were looking like world beaters that year when Plummer retired, but was still starting for the team. If we can get that kind of production from our defense this year, lookout moon.

TheDave
08-30-2009, 10:45 PM
The Denver Broncos were looking like world beaters that year when Plummer retired, but was still starting for the team. If we can get that kind of production from our defense this year, lookout moon.

I swear to god, I NEVER thought I was say this... BUT...

I wish Jake Plummer was our starting QB!

bpc
08-30-2009, 10:46 PM
I think right now, if Denver wants to win week 1, we need Carson Palmer to call in sick.

Right now the matchups breakdown as:

QB - Adv. Cincy
HB - Adv. Cincy
WR - Adv. Cincy
OL - Adv. Denver
DL - Adv. Cincy
LB - Adv. Cincy
DB - Adv. Denver
Homefield - Adv. Cincy.

We're looking at starting the season 0-1 in honest reality.

crawdad
08-30-2009, 10:50 PM
Come on guys, this is pre-season! Like TJ said, if we lose to the Raiders or Chiefs then I will worry.

NASurfer
08-30-2009, 10:55 PM
That's not a fact at all. Shanahan left us in a great situation - the hottest young offense in the NFL with a rising star, an offensive line that is young and productive, and one of the best young receiving outfits in the game. The defense needed help, but to address that, Shanahan had worked the team into a position where we had a lot to work with in the draft, and more salary cap room than we've had in a decade.

Shanahan didn't leave this team in a bad situation at all.
Depends on how you want to look at it. This was a team that frequently had it's QB bailing them out last year. And he's been traded away. I hope I'm wrong but it was a colossal mistake to trade away next year's first when you had a team that had been previously been carried by it's QB... and not having that player anymore. What kind of management is that?

So we've basically gambled on having a good season with a rookie head coach, new systems on both sides of the ball and a journeymen QB. I can't blame Seattle fans for being giddy about what to do with their likely high pick.

We'll see how Orton takes advantage of this "wealth of talent" around him (which it's looking like no Marshall). I honestly don't think this supporting cast is going to be THAT special this year. We made at least 2 big blunders this offseason.

Dr. Broncenstein
08-30-2009, 10:58 PM
I swear to god, I NEVER thought I was say this... BUT...

I wish Jake Plummer was our starting QB!

Yeah... it was sure hard to deal with winning.

Cito Pelon
08-30-2009, 10:59 PM
There's reasons to be worried, there's reasons to be heartened.

The gang-tackling by the D is reason to be heartened. Dawkins' play is reason to be heartened. Brandstater obviously has some NFL skills. The ST play is looking pretty good overall. Elvis is the same badass passrusher he's always been. Now, we just need some rookies to step up.

TheDave
08-30-2009, 11:01 PM
Yeah... it was sure hard to deal with winning.

and I hoped to improve our QB position in almost every one of those wins...

Pick Six
08-30-2009, 11:04 PM
This is a rebuilding season, IMO. It will take some time to get all the pieces in place...

lex
08-30-2009, 11:07 PM
There's reasons to be worried, there's reasons to be heartened.

The gang-tackling by the D is reason to be heartened. Dawkins' play is reason to be heartened. Brandstater obviously has some NFL skills. The ST play is looking pretty good overall. Elvis is the same badass passrusher he's always been. Now, we just need some rookies to step up.

I didnt really like the tackling. There were a lot of guys launching themselves at the ballcarrier but without brining them down.

SonOfLe-loLang
08-31-2009, 12:14 AM
I think right now, if Denver wants to win week 1, we need Carson Palmer to call in sick.

Right now the matchups breakdown as:

QB - Adv. Cincy
HB - Adv. Cincy
WR - Adv. Cincy
OL - Adv. Denver
DL - Adv. Cincy
LB - Adv. Cincy
DB - Adv. Denver
Homefield - Adv. Cincy.

We're looking at starting the season 0-1 in honest reality.

Very scientific of you. Last time i checked, football was a bit more complicated than that. And i wouldnt even agree with some of those statements. By the way, since you are going off preseason play. Your precious cincinnati bengals got their asses handed to them by....the st louis rams.

Popps
08-31-2009, 12:55 AM
Week 3 over, probably won't see much of the starters in Week 4 so that being said:

Have we shown enough of our game to either worry or perhaps be content with what we have?

I'm not going to lie - i'm a bit worried. Quite a bit. Offense looks good except for.....the.....qb.

I think you worry if you thought this was a playoff team out of the gate. I couldn't have imagined that we'd have 60% roster turnover, two new coordinators, a new coaching staff and fresh systems on both sides of the ball... and would be playoff-ready in week one.

To me, the time to worry is in week 10, if we're not seeing improvement on a week-to-week basis.

Rebuilding isn't easy, folks. You have to gut these times out as a fan and give the staff a chance to let things play out. If we're going backwards in weeks 12-16 like the past few seasons, then you should certainly start to wonder if we're going in the right direction.

Personally, I think we're a little further along on defense than I thought we'd be.... and about where I thought we'd be on offense. (Perhaps a bit behind in the running game, but Moreno would help.)

Orton is still getting comfortable in the system, we're without Marshall... and we're still getting the playbook down. Our starters haven't played a full game yet.

How many pre-seasons have you been worried, and then things looked good... or were you stoked, and things started ****ty.

You just can't tell from this. Give it some time.

cutthemdown
08-31-2009, 01:21 AM
how often did you see Bailey get bailed out by a safety making a big hit last yr? Never really for any of the CBS. If they got beat, they got beat, no safety was ever there to help.

Dawkins will help us this yr that much was obvious. He knows hot to get there in time and then make the big hit.

We force at least 10 extra 3rd down stops this yr because of Dawkins big hits.

Bronco LB52
08-31-2009, 01:26 AM
Its not just Brady, Moss and Welker. McDaniels has shown flashes of being a good play caller. But youre right in questioning the system that he is a slave to. Our old system was just as good and probably better than the new one in most respects.

When Shanahan came to Denver he had a resume that included coaching at Oklahoma during the wishbone days, being the OC at UF during their time as SEC champs in the mid 80s (they gave Miami their only loss in 83 when Miami was the NCs), to his time in Denver as OC, to his time in SF as OC. Shanahan had such a broad background that he wasnt so rigidly bound by one system. The WCO was a system of organization as much as it was play design by the time Shanahan was there.

Think about it, if Shanahan was so rigidly bound as Josh seems to be, there would have not likely been zone blocking, which we all know has been massively successful.

Shanahan also had experience with the Run N Shoot. He learned it at Northern Arizona and installed it at Minnesota when he served as their offensive coordinator.

bombquixote
08-31-2009, 01:38 AM
This is a rebuilding season, IMO. It will take some time to get all the pieces in place...

This team won't be fully rebuilt until we have a QB. Because right now, we don't have one.

joe9999
08-31-2009, 08:11 AM
That's not a fact at all. Shanahan left us in a great situation - the hottest young offense in the NFL with a rising star, an offensive line that is young and productive, and one of the best young receiving outfits in the game. The defense needed help, but to address that, Shanahan had worked the team into a position where we had a lot to work with in the draft, and more salary cap room than we've had in a decade.

Shanahan didn't leave this team in a bad situation at all.

Thanks Taco for taking the time to post this and keep this forum from degenerating.

Rashomon
08-31-2009, 08:27 AM
By the way, since you are going off preseason play. Your precious cincinnati bengals got their asses handed to them by....the st louis rams.

Well, Denver needs to hope Palmer doesn't play in their game either. It just reminds you, once again, how important the QB is.

RaiderH8r
08-31-2009, 08:42 AM
Like it or not guys the QB position is our biggest weakneses... Name a team in the last 10 years that has done anything when a QB is playing like Orton.


The fact is, he's a marginal Qb that is struggleing... We will see if he can pull his head out, but I doubt it.

Trent Dilfer's Ravens.

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 08:43 AM
That's not a fact at all. Shanahan left us in a great situation - the hottest young offense in the NFL with a rising star, an offensive line that is young and productive, and one of the best young receiving outfits in the game. The defense needed help, but to address that, Shanahan had worked the team into a position where we had a lot to work with in the draft, and more salary cap room than we've had in a decade.

Shanahan didn't leave this team in a bad situation at all.

Except he left us with a defense that was HISTORICALLY bad and getting worse. We were churning threw coordinators like a buzz saw. His ability to evaluate and draft players on defense was horrendous with Crowder and Moss being the latest examples.

And while he left us with talent on offense, he also left us with a culture of selfishness and personal gains type attitudes.

And he left us with a 24 - 24 record, a poor record at home over the past 5 seasons, and a team that consistently underperformed in November and December.

Let's be fair.

TheDave
08-31-2009, 08:44 AM
Trent Dilfer's Ravens.

I think were about to see what happens when trent dilfer has a 20-25th ranked defense...

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 08:45 AM
I wouldn't say worry so much as accept. It is what it is at this point. We are going to struggle this year, but hopefully with the pain comes the opportunity to improve.

DrFate
08-31-2009, 08:46 AM
What's to worry about?

If you are a member of the Kool Aid brigade, you see a team capable of a playoff push.

If you aren't, you see a team struggling to win 6 games.

I don't think anything we've seen over the last 3 faux games is going to change anyone's opinion - and it shouldn't. It's pre-season.

RaiderH8r
08-31-2009, 08:47 AM
Except he left us with a defense that was HISTORICALLY bad and getting worse. We were churning threw coordinators like a buzz saw. His ability to evaluate and draft players on defense was horrendous with Crowder and Moss being the latest examples.

And while he left us with talent on offense, he also left us with a culture of selfishness and personal gains type attitudes.

And he left us with a 24 - 24 records, a poor record at home, and a team that consistently underperformed in November and December.

Let's be fair.

After Lil' Hoodied gets done dismantling this franchise 24-24 will seem like a dream.

Shanny rebuilt the team AND kept it competitive. Not many coaches can do that. Sure he whiffed on a number of FA signings but the bottom line is that when he left this team had an offense to be envied, plenty of cap room, and plenty of picks to address defensive issues. The stage was set for the final year or two of tinkering before the SB window opened wide before us.

Jason in LA
08-31-2009, 08:48 AM
Wait, there are people around here who haven't started to worry? I went into panic mode months ago. ;D

Beantown Bronco
08-31-2009, 08:51 AM
I think were about to see what happens when trent dilfer has a 20-25th ranked defense...

Seriously. I just looked back at the numbers they had that season. That defense gave up, on average, only 10 pts per game in the games Dilfer was the QB. He still managed to lose two of those games.....one of them when the defense only gave up 9 pts. Man, they were sick.

Garcia Bronco
08-31-2009, 08:53 AM
I'm very concerend...this team is not ready for the regualr season and seems to be getting worse every week

JMO

I am seeing the samething. It even looked like there was some improvement between the 1st ans 2nd game, but the 3rd game was a huge drop off.

Rohirrim
08-31-2009, 08:54 AM
Except he left us with a defense that was HISTORICALLY bad and getting worse. We were churning threw coordinators like a buzz saw. His ability to evaluate and draft players on defense was horrendous with Crowder and Moss being the latest examples.

And while he left us with talent on offense, he also left us with a culture of selfishness and personal gains type attitudes.

And he left us with a 24 - 24 record, a poor record at home over the past 5 seasons, and a team that consistently underperformed in November and December.

Let's be fair.

Not to mention had a penchant for running out of gas in the fourth quarter. I really don't see how anybody can defend Shanahan after the loss to the Raiders and then the asswhooping by the Chargers. No coach keeps his job after that kind of dismal performance. Lombardi wouldn't have kept his job after that bull****. Plus, watch the film of the San Diego ass kicking. Half the team is yucking it up on the sidelines. Shanahan had completely lost control.

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 08:58 AM
After Lil' Hoodied gets done dismantling this franchise 24-24 will seem like a dream.

Shanny rebuilt the team AND kept it competitive. Not many coaches can do that. Sure he whiffed on a number of FA signings but the bottom line is that when he left this team had an offense to be envied, plenty of cap room, and plenty of picks to address defensive issues. The stage was set for the final year or two of tinkering before the SB window opened wide before us.

I'm not gonna defend McDaniels because I simply have no grounds to other than to say he wowed Pat Bowlen. Pat Bowlen has been a bit of a mystery this offseason in the Cutler and Marshall sagas, but he's been a hell of an owner. And if you want to disagree with that, kindly go join another board.

That said, I don't buy the BS about Shanahan. I love the man for what he brought to this franchise. But his time here had run its course. Plain and simple. You could give Shanahan a 100M in cap room and 10 first round picks and I don't see any reason why that would lead me to believe he was going to fix our defense. He couldn't even settle on a scheme or a coach for the defense. How can you acquire players around that? Here are a few scenarios to consider:

1) Al Wilson plays admirably through his rookie deal while playing at a Pro Bowl level and Denver never extends him. The draft comes around and they are worried he'll leave via FA. So what do they do? They draft Terry Pierce with a second round pick. Where is Terry Pierce today? Then they give Al the deal he wants anyway.

2) Then they make nearly the exact same blunder a few years later with Ian Gold. They let him get away for one season, use a draft pick on DJ Williams and give Gold a FA contract the next year anyway! And that forces DJ to play 4 positions in his first 4 years in the league.

3) Daryl Gardner.

4) Shanahan brings in Jim Bates. They completely retool the personnel on defense to run his system, including trading Gerrard Warren and drafting Jarvis Moss. Gerrard Warren was not a player to get nostalgic about, but he was a solid NFL starter -- better than almost anything we had after he left. Jarvis Moss never had a chance.

5) We played most of last season with STREET FAs at safety because Shanahan continued to ignore that position when it was very obviously one of the weakest in overall talent for several years.

Obviously it wasn't all bad with Shanahan. But it was getting old and there was zero reason for optimism on the defensive side of the ball.

Sure it would be nice if we could have just fired Shanahan the GM and kept Shanahan the coach, but it doesn't work that way. He wanted both and had a contract that allowed him the control.

rastaman
08-31-2009, 09:02 AM
Week 3 over, probably won't see much of the starters in Week 4 so that being said:


Have we shown enough of our game to either worry or perhaps be content with what we have?


I'm not going to lie - i'm a bit worried. Quite a bit. Offense looks good except for.....the.....qb.

McDaniels rookie year as HC is looking more and more like a 3-6 win season. It is what--what it is.

I've already started looking forward to Bowlen (if he can remember) to replace McDaniel's within 3 years. So I'm already looking at who the new HC will be for the Denver Broncos.

Welcome to the era of mediocrity! It happened to the 49ers, StL Rams, the Cowboys, etc. When your leadership and ownership makes CHANGES because they CAN! You simply openly up PANDORA'S BOX.

PREPARE FOR THE WORST........HOPE FOR THE BEST!

ARE WE THE DETROIT BRONCOS OR THE OAKLAND BRONCOS, OR THE KC BRONCOS......ONLY TIME WILL TELL.:thumbs:

rastaman
08-31-2009, 09:10 AM
I wouldn't say worry so much as accept. It is what it is at this point. We are going to struggle this year, but hopefully with the pain comes the opportunity to improve.

Should we struggle this season......the Pile On's will commence immediately! The only way McD see's a different environment is to WIN.

Li'l Hoodie knows he has a OC spot left vacant for him in NE.....he ain't got no worries!LOL

lex
08-31-2009, 09:13 AM
Except he left us with a defense that was HISTORICALLY bad and getting worse. We were churning threw coordinators like a buzz saw. His ability to evaluate and draft players on defense was horrendous with Crowder and Moss being the latest examples.

And while he left us with talent on offense, he also left us with a culture of selfishness and personal gains type attitudes.

And he left us with a 24 - 24 record, a poor record at home over the past 5 seasons, and a team that consistently underperformed in November and December.

Let's be fair.

24-24 while almost completely turning over the roster isnt bad at all. The team was trending upwards last year in spite of the defense and would have improved just by virtue of having so much young talent getting more experience. The team McDaniels inherited was good enough to win 10 games, especially once you bring in Nolan. Everything else has been a problem of their own making.

bowtown
08-31-2009, 09:17 AM
McDaniels rookie year as HC is looking more and more like a 3-6 win season. It is what--what it is.

I've already started looking forward to Bowlen (if he can remember) to replace McDaniel's within 3 years. So I'm already looking at who the new HC will be for the Denver Broncos.
Welcome to the era of mediocrity! It happened to the 49ers, StL Rams, the Cowboys, etc. When your leadership and ownership makes CHANGES because they CAN! You simply openly up PANDORA'S BOX.

PREPARE FOR THE WORST........HOPE FOR THE BEST!

ARE WE THE DETROIT BRONCOS OR THE OAKLAND BRONCOS, OR THE KC BRONCOS......ONLY TIME WILL TELL.:thumbs:

http://www.getprice.com.au/images/uploadimg/203/350__1_contradiction-ck-edp.jpg

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 09:30 AM
24-24 while almost completely turning over the roster isnt bad at all.
And who was responsible for all the roster churn? It was his mantra that we were always "one or two players away" that led to constant short-sighted decision making and roster churn. You can't have Mike Shanahan the Coach without Mike Shanahan the GM. It's not fantasy land!

The team was trending upwards last year in spite of the defense and would have improved just by virtue of having so much young talent getting more experience. The team McDaniels inherited was good enough to win 10 games, especially once you bring in Nolan. Everything else has been a problem of their own making.

How do you figure? Would the schedule have been easier if Shanahan stayed on this year? Weren't we the first team to lose a 3 game lead in a division with 3 games to go? Don't we all know we actually LOST that first game to San Diego because of a Cutler mistake? Didn't we lose to both the Chiefs and the Raiders last year? Weren't we a very pedestrian 4 - 4 at home last year, with awful losses to Jacksonville, Oakland, and Buffalo? Do you know Shanahan would have brought in Mike Nolan? Isn't it true we've only 1 playoff game in the last 10 years? How many division title have we won in the last decade?

Wake up and smell what your shoveling man. It was time to move on.

Cito Pelon
08-31-2009, 09:58 AM
Wait, there are people around here who haven't started to worry? I went into panic mode months ago. ;D

Well, you should have mentioned it instead of popping off now. :D

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 10:02 AM
In this division, I'm not sure why we should be worried until sometime in October. We have just as good a shot at winning this division as any of our rivals - including the overrated Chargers.

you're nuts. SD is coming out of the AFC--they will play GB or NO in the Superbowl........

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 10:05 AM
And who was responsible for all the roster churn? It was his mantra that we were always "one or two players away" that led to constant short-sighted decision making and roster churn. You can't have Mike Shanahan the Coach without Mike Shanahan the GM. It's not fantasy land!



How do you figure? Would the schedule have been easier if Shanahan stayed on this year? Weren't we the first team to lose a 3 game lead in a division with 3 games to go? Don't we all know we actually LOST that first game to San Diego because of a Cutler mistake? Didn't we lose to both the Chiefs and the Raiders last year? Weren't we a very pedestrian 4 - 4 at home last year, with awful losses to Jacksonville, Oakland, and Buffalo? Do you know Shanahan would have brought in Mike Nolan? Isn't it true we've only 1 playoff game in the last 10 years? How many division title have we won in the last decade?

Wake up and smell what your shoveling man. It was time to move on.

...to a defensive minded coach who is fond of the west coast offense--ala Steve Spagnuolo..Bowlen **** the bed on this one..........

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 10:08 AM
Trent Dilfer's Ravens.

We are further from having a defense like that than we are an offense like the late 90's broncos.........

jhns
08-31-2009, 10:10 AM
it was time to worry the second our front office was listening/trying to trade for cassel. A qb half as good and twice as expensive as the one we had. I don't care if he was just listening, that was just dumb. I have worried since then and a lot of my fears are becoming reality.

I understand people thinking we needed change. What I don't get is people thinking that any and all change is good. It doesn't make sense.

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 10:15 AM
it was time to worry the second our front office was listening/trying to trade for cassel. A qb half as good and twice as expensive as the one we had. I don't care if he was just listening, that was just dumb. I have worried since then and a lot of my fears are becoming reality.

I understand people thinking we needed change. What I don't get is people thinking that any and all change is good. It doesn't make sense.

Where we sure as hell DID NOT need a change was at the QB position........and then when we did trade Jay--I was amazed at all of the dolts who actually started speaking as though he wasn't one of the best young QB's in the game! " Jay threw too many Ints, Jay has a double chin--etc.." Talk about spurned school children with an elementary mindset........

gyldenlove
08-31-2009, 10:19 AM
Calm down folks, no reason to worry.

If we lose some games, we lose some games, it is not like we are suddenly going to be the laughing stock of the league or anything, or start finishing behind the Raiders.

We still have the best neckbeard in the league, that is something to be proud of right?

Just because our old QB beat us yesterday at home is no reason to panic, that was just a minor hiccup, we almost won a game last week so things will be fine.



If you can't make sense of this post, it is okay, I can't either.

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 10:20 AM
Calm down folks, no reason to worry.

If we lose some games, we lose some games, it is not like we are suddenly going to be the laughing stock of the league or anything, or start finishing behind the Raiders.

We still have the best neckbeard in the league, that is something to be proud of right?

Just because our old QB beat us yesterday at home is no reason to panic, that was just a minor hiccup, we almost won a game last week so things will be fine.



If you can't make sense of this post, it is okay, I can't either.

I predict Oak gets to 6 wins...and with that--gets 2nd place in our division.

rastaman
08-31-2009, 10:25 AM
Sure it would be nice if we could have just fired Shanahan the GM and kept Shanahan the coach, but it doesn't work that way. He wanted both and had a contract that allowed him the control.

Point is, we don't know if Bowlen gave Shanny that choice! Bowlen is the Owner he could have called a meeting btwn Shanny and himself (hell, included Slowick as well). Here's how the conversation/meeting could have or should have gone.

Bowlen: Mike - Slowick thanks for meeting with me today. "Boy what a roller coaster season", and we really laid an egg during the last 3 weeks of the season.

But Mike, I gotta be up front with you, we must make some changes. Effective immediately I have decided to demote Slowick and relieve you of your GM and DC duties. I want the Goodmans to play a larger role and make the decisions on scouting and drafting personnel.

Mike, I want you to get back to what you do best and thats Coaching the offensive side of the ball. Something wasn't clicking with how our defense was deployed and how the D ultimately performed on the field.

I will commission a search team to go out and find a DC at the college level or at the NFL level to rebuild our defense Our Defense needs an identity and a system something on the plan like the Steelers. I have decided to give the DC that I hire a 6-10 year window to turn our Defense around and with the goal of fielding a top 10 defense every year in the NFL.

Mike, I want you to have an important influence and say on personnel matters and in the draft for defensive players, but I want the GM who I hire to have final say and take the ultimate responsibility for the defensive players we draft. When it comes to assembling offensives schemes, coaching and drafting offensive talent you are one of the best Mike and still want you to have full authority in this area.

Mr. Slowick, I'd like to keep you on in a assist. capacity so as to allow you to learn how to become a successful DC someday.....but right now you're not ready yet to be a DC.

Mike, I know this is quite a shake up and I'm taking away two important responsibilities from you....but I feel its in the best interest of this Franchise. Believe me when I say I can't thank you enough for our two SB victories and keeping this Franchise competive and winning for the last 14 years.

Mike I want you to retire as the Denver Broncos HC. And to show my appreciation and for the continuity of this Franchise and the team, I want to tear up your current contract and sign you to a 10 year deal.

If you don't agree to the new direction and shakeup I have decided to do and you wish to seek employment else where, I understand fully and wish you the best of luck. Take a few weeks to mull it over and lets re-convene in 30 days.

End of Meeting.........Shake hands and Business Hug of Respect takes place.:strong:

Had Bowlen handled the 2009 off season in this fashion....we Bronco fans would not be facing years of uncertainity as we are facing at this moment and in the future. And Shanahan loved coaching in Denver and the Broncos so much Mike would have given up some power for the betterment of this franchise. And who knows it would have been a blessing for Shanny to get back with concentrating on what he does best.....OFFENSIVE MASTERMIND. :strong:

bendog
08-31-2009, 10:26 AM
Den IS the laughing stock of the league after "the trade." Just say mediocrity, baby. But Bowlen got his pic back on the cover of the media guide.

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 10:30 AM
Point is, we don't know if Bowlen gave Shanny that choice! Bowlen is the Owner he could have called a meeting btwn Shanny and himself (hell, included Slowick as well). Here's how the conversation/meeting could have or should have gone.

Bowlen: Mike - Slowick thanks for meeting with me today. "Boy what a roller coaster season", and we really laid an egg during the last 3 weeks of the season.

But Mike, I gotta be up front with you, we must make some changes. Effective immediately I have decided to demote Slowick and relieve you of your GM and DC duties. I want the Goodmans to play a larger role and make the decisions on scouting and drafting personnel.

Mike, I want you to get back to what you do best and thats Coaching the offensive side of the ball. Something wasn't clicking with how our defense was deployed and how the D ultimately performed on the field.

I will commission a search team to go out and find a DC at the college level or at the NFL level to rebuild our defense Our Defense needs an identity and a system something on the plan like the Steelers. I have decided to give the DC that I hire a 6-10 year window to turn our Defense around and with the goal of fielding a top 10 defense every year in the NFL.

Mike, I want you to have an important influence and say on personnel matters and in the draft for defensive players, but I want the GM who I hire to have final say and take the ultimate responsibility for the defensive players we draft. When it comes to assembling offensives schemes, coaching and drafting offensive talent you are one of the best Mike and still want you to have full authority in this area.

Mr. Slowick, I'd like to keep you on in a assist. capacity so as to allow you to learn how to become a successful DC someday.....but right now you're not ready yet to be a DC.

Mike, I know this is quite a shake up and I'm taking away two important responsibilities from you....but I feel its in the best interest of this Franchise. Believe me when I say I can't thank you enough for our two SB victories and keeping this Franchise competive and winning for the last 14 years.

Mike I want you to retire as the Denver Broncos HC. And to show my appreciation and for the continuity of this Franchise and the team, I want to tear up your current contract and sign you to a 10 year deal.

If you don't agree to the new direction and shakeup I have decided to do and you wish to seek employment else where, I understand fully and wish you the best of luck. Take a few weeks to mull it over and lets re-convene in 30 days.

End of Meeting.........Shake hands and Business Hug of Respect takes place.:strong:

Had Bowlen handled the 2009 off season in this fashion....we Bronco fans would not be facing years of uncertainity as we are facing at this moment and in the future. And Shanahan loved coaching in Denver and the Broncos so much Mike would have given up some power for the betterment of this franchise. And who knows it would have been a blessing for Shanny to get back with concentrating on what he does best.....OFFENSIVE MASTERMIND. :strong:

I have a hunch that Bowlen is much too vaginal to have handled it that way and does not do well with confrontation--hence--simply telling Mike that he wanted to go in a different direction was easier for him than was potentially getting into a verbal sparing match with Mike over Slow-wits.......if only he would have hired the EYE-Tal-YON.

Los Broncos
08-31-2009, 10:32 AM
A little worried since the offense kind of sucks thus far.

I'll wait till October - November till a full on panic.

TonyR
08-31-2009, 10:35 AM
If you are a member of the Kool Aid brigade, you see a team capable of a playoff push.

If you aren't, you see a team struggling to win 6 games.


Interesting. I'm often lumped into the "Kool Aid brigade" and yet I see a team struggling to win 6 games. What people need to work on are their expectations and the fact that it isn't all about this year.

rastaman
08-31-2009, 10:38 AM
http://www.getprice.com.au/images/uploadimg/203/350__1_contradiction-ck-edp.jpg

Ummmmmm.....so neanderthal, how long have you been communicating in pictures? :wiggle:

TonyR
08-31-2009, 10:39 AM
24-24 while almost completely turning over the roster isnt bad at all. The team was trending upwards last year...

I can't really bloody you up much more than bloodsunday already did, but just wanted to point out that McD just heavily turned over the roster. And how is losing 3 straight to end a season, including an epic home blowout, "trending upwards"?

lex
08-31-2009, 10:43 AM
I can't really bloody you up much more than bloodsunday already did, but just wanted to point out that McD just heavily turned over the roster. And how is losing 3 straight to end a season, including an epic home blowout, "trending upwards"?

You swing and miss all the time and this is no different. Young teams are inconsistent. One of the things thats learned is to play well every week. Thats part of the maturing I spoke of.

Nice try though. Now go sit down.

TonyR
08-31-2009, 10:48 AM
You swing and miss all the time and this is no different.

By that do you mean I missed your chin but hit you in the eye? Nose?

TonyR
08-31-2009, 10:51 AM
One of the things thats learned is to play well every week.

What would we do on the Mane without brilliant insight like this? That's sig worthy stuff right there, lex. Good stuff. I'm a fan of unintentional comedy.

TheDave
08-31-2009, 10:53 AM
What would we do on the Mane without brilliant insight like this? That's sig worthy stuff right there, lex. Good stuff. I'm a fan of unintentional comedy.

Believe it or not... You and and the others who constantly quote and bitch at lex are much worse that lex.

lex
08-31-2009, 10:53 AM
And who was responsible for all the roster churn? It was his mantra that we were always "one or two players away" that led to constant short-sighted decision making and roster churn. You can't have Mike Shanahan the Coach without Mike Shanahan the GM. It's not fantasy land!

Guys were getting old. Lynch, Nalen, Lepsis, Wilson, and Rod Smith were all players players that had to be replaced in a short period of time. And then there was the realization that Plummer hit his ceiling in 2005. Go look at the roster between 2005 and 2008. It had to be done and to come out of it 24-24 isnt so bad. Understand also that Ive voiced a lot of criticism toward Shanahan but youre reaching here.



How do you figure? Would the schedule have been easier if Shanahan stayed on this year? Weren't we the first team to lose a 3 game lead in a division with 3 games to go? Don't we all know we actually LOST that first game to San Diego because of a Cutler mistake? Didn't we lose to both the Chiefs and the Raiders last year? Weren't we a very pedestrian 4 - 4 at home last year, with awful losses to Jacksonville, Oakland, and Buffalo? Do you know Shanahan would have brought in Mike Nolan? Isn't it true we've only 1 playoff game in the last 10 years? How many division title have we won in the last decade?

As Ive said before. There was a lot of young talent on the roster. One of the issues you find with young talent is consistency. They show flashes. This is not unique to the Broncos. Plus with a year of experience theyre better adjusted to the speed of the game and in some cases they take care of their bodies better. With all the young talent, they could have won 10 games in spite of Slowik, if they won 8 games last year, especially with a healthy Hillis.



In bold

lex
08-31-2009, 10:54 AM
What would we do on the Mane without brilliant insight like this? That's sig worthy stuff right there, lex. Good stuff. I'm a fan of unintentional comedy.

Its the truth. Young guys often show flashes but lack consistency. Its not surprising at all that Denver didnt bring their A game every week. Thats a function of being young.

lex
08-31-2009, 10:56 AM
By that do you mean I missed your chin but hit you in the eye? Nose?

Your stab at paraphrasing Upton Sinclair missed as well.

broncofan7
08-31-2009, 11:00 AM
Interesting. I'm often lumped into the "Kool Aid brigade" and yet I see a team struggling to win 6 games. What people need to work on are their expectations and the fact that it isn't all about this year.

Who gives us the better chance to Win THIS SEASON?

Cutler @ QB
or
Ayers, Fonzie and Orton

gmandret
08-31-2009, 11:09 AM
I haven't posted here in over two years and decided today was a good day to check the waters. Mr. Bowlen thought this was a good idea. Me a fan, I don't think so. I don't totally disagree with loosing Mike, he hadn't adapted in a few years and was getting very complacent on how he did things.

But the McDaniels era has been terrible. Why neither of these so called football people went to talk to Cutler and tell him you're a Bronco deal with it is beyond me. Let him sit on the bench until he came to his senses, at least at some point he'd realize that he's a Bronco. Now we have this mess of a situation which I for one do not see getting better this year. Marshall is a head case (next coming of TO if you ask me) and a QB and a backup that are in the lower half of the ratings for active QB's this team is going to be bad for years!

Also I don't care for how we are now being treated as fans. I want to know about the issues on the team, I want to know the injuries. I'm pretty certain when I see a player limp off the field after having his knee rolled that his been injured below the waist, I'd like more details and know when they will come back. Buo we have now been called on TV New England West guess we should get used to it for the next three years, I don't see Mr. Bowlen giving up on this guy until then, unless of course we go 0-16 which is a possibility!

Yikes.

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 11:20 AM
Guys were getting old. Lynch, Nalen, Lepsis, Wilson, and Rod Smith were all players players that had to be replaced in a short period of time. And then there was the realization that Plummer hit his ceiling in 2005. Go look at the roster between 2005 and 2008. It had to be done and to come out of it 24-24 isnt so bad. Understand also that Ive voiced a lot of criticism toward Shanahan but youre reaching here.

Yes guys get old. That's why drafting for backups and development of young players matters. That's also why Shanahan sucked as a GM. You cannot think I am reaching here to say that Shanahan was below average as a GM and that, particularly in his later tenure, made short-sighted decisions. A child of 5 could see that. This was his biggest criticism. No one doubts his ability to coach. It was the rest of the baggage that came with his various roles that wore down. He was never a very good personnel man after the early years of FA. And be careful because a guy like Lynch was old when we signed him. We had to sign him because we had no talent at safety to develop.

Oh and buy the way, if "hitting his ceiling" was 13 - 3, a division title, and a home AFC Championship game, then I hope every Denver QB to come hits that. Even the "wonder boy Cutler" hasn't managed that feat. In fact, he hasn't managed a winning season. I guess that was the same year Larry Coyer hit his ceiling. You know the guy that took the "Browncos" and made a top 10 defense out of them?! What ever happened to him? Oh yeah Shanahan fired him in another short-sighted decision. Larry Coyer did more good stuff with average to below average talent than any D-coordinator we've had in Denver. And he got fired for it.

As Ive said before. There was a lot of young talent on the roster. One of the issues you find with young talent is consistency. They show flashes. This is not unique to the Broncos. Plus with a year of experience theyre better adjusted to the speed of the game and in some cases they take care of their bodies better. With all the young talent, they could have won 10 games in spite of Slowik, if they won 8 games last year, especially with a healthy Hillis.
Except that the schedule is harder, they showed a tendency to blow winnable games to inferior team at home, and that you cannot guarantee players won't get hurt. If you took the same team from last year and added a couple of defensive players, I think you'd still be talking about 8 - 8 based on scheduling.

People seem to forget that this team's offensive "prowess" dropped off tremendously after the first 3 games last year. They struggled to score points after that. They scored 370 points last year, but 114 of that was in the first 3 games. We only managed a meager 19.6 pts per game after that. That would have been good enough for 24th in the league -- just ahead of Jacksonville! And that's some kind of superior offense that could overcome our defensive issues?

I guess you could blame it on injuries, but I saw NE go 11-5 (and get better) after Tom Brady went down! They lost arguably the best QB in the league and still managed to win 11 games. They also managed to score more points than us. Think about that. We want to blame an 8 - 8 season on losing journeyman running backs like Torrain, Pittman, and Selvin Young? Are you serious?!

As to your point about young guys showing "flashes", well that's what happens when your roster gets so bare you have to rely on young guys to play at a Pro Bowl level. How much different would your opinion of Denver be Royal, Hillis, and Clady hadn't all been able to play at such a high level in year 1 (which is highly unusual)? If you build around a system then you can have a compliment of young and veteran guys so when old move out, the young moves in. But when you change your system and strategy ever year, well you end up drafting and signing FA to plug holes.

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 11:31 AM
But the McDaniels era has been terrible. Why neither of these so called football people went to talk to Cutler and tell him you're a Bronco deal with it is beyond me. Let him sit on the bench until he came to his senses, at least at some point he'd realize that he's a Bronco. Now we have this mess of a situation which I for one do not see getting better this year. Marshall is a head case (next coming of TO if you ask me) and a QB and a backup that are in the lower half of the ratings for active QB's this team is going to be bad for years!
This is not a horrible analysis. In fact I agree with most of it. My being supportive of firing Shanahan is not the same thing as endorsing McDaniels. That said, this a MAJOR change. You are replacing the most integral part of the day-to-day operations of the football team because he was not just the coach -- he ran everything! People had to expect it to get a little bumpy.

The Cutler situation is very unfortunate. And while he still has A LOT to prove in this league, it blows my mind that he's not a Bronco. I think Bowlen and McDaniels both screwed that up badly.

The Marshall situation was bound to happen anyway. He's a WR for crying out loud. And if possible, he's more selfish than most of them. He's been a ticking-time bomb since they drafted him. Even today, he's one incident away from being Pacman Jones, Michael Vick, or Plaxico Burress. I have a hard time faulting Bowlen or McDaniels for what's happened with Marshall.

Also I don't care for how we are now being treated as fans. I want to know about the issues on the team, I want to know the injuries. I'm pretty certain when I see a player limp off the field after having his knee rolled that his been injured below the waist, I'd like more details and know when they will come back.
Other than losing Cutler, this is the biggest criticism I have with McDaniels. I don't care about "the hoodie" and some of the other mannerisms that he brings, but being so secretive about injuries is silly. I also don't like how generally stand-off-ish he is with the media when discussing most situations. That said, Shanahan had become Mr. Trite at the end himself. I could predict his responses to questions.

hambone13
08-31-2009, 11:34 AM
In this division, I'm not sure why we should be worried until sometime in October. We have just as good a shot at winning this division as any of our rivals - including the overrated Chargers.

How do you consider the Chargers underrated? If anything all they did last year was underachieve in IMHO...they look pretty damn good despite how painful that is to say....

bloodsunday
08-31-2009, 11:44 AM
How do you consider the Chargers underrated? If anything all they did last year was underachieve in IMHO...they look pretty damn good despite how painful that is to say....

I agree. They took it to Atlanta on Saturday. They know the mistake they made the last few years was starting slow. I fully expect them to take this division by the throat within about the first 6 weeks. Phillip Rivers (*gulp*) looks pretty damn good.

rastaman
08-31-2009, 12:06 PM
What I take away from all this.....is the league and the fans always expect Oakland, KC, a even the Chargers to under achieve and stink up the joint. What will get some getting use to is watching the badly the drop off for Broncos that will take place in the post Shanahan era.

bowtown
08-31-2009, 01:15 PM
What I take away from all this.....is the league and the fans always expect Oakland, KC, a even the Chargers to under achieve and stink up the joint. What will get some getting use to is watching the badly the drop off for Broncos that will take place in the post Shanahan era.

Yep 8-8, and yearly late season collapses are quite the ledge to fall from.

TonyR
08-31-2009, 01:41 PM
Who gives us the better chance to Win THIS SEASON?

Cutler @ QB
or
Ayers, Fonzie and Orton

What part of "it isn't all about this year" did you not understand?

gmandret
08-31-2009, 01:43 PM
What part of "it isn't all about this year" did you not understand?

Um we gave up this year and the next two or three years when we got rid of Cutler. Let's hope we're bad enough this year to get another TOP 3 QB coming out of the draft next spring. Maybe we won't be bad for 10 years just for 5.