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View Full Version : USA vs. Mexico : The greatest rivalry??


ludo21
08-12-2009, 10:59 AM
This has been discussed already, but is it the best rivalry?

Also, who is willing and going to watch this on Telemundo today?

azbroncfan
08-12-2009, 11:01 AM
It's such a big rivalry and event it isn't even on TV is it?

Smiling Assassin27
08-12-2009, 11:02 AM
0-22-1 at the opponent's home does not a rivalry make.

Irish Stout
08-12-2009, 11:04 AM
Dude how can this be the biggest rivalry when nobody knows what you are talking about??? Is this an immigration issue? Why will it be on telemundo?

bronco militia
08-12-2009, 11:04 AM
0-22-1 at the opponent's home does not a rivalry make.

lol Ha!

McDman
08-12-2009, 11:05 AM
We've owned Mexico as of late, excluding the Gold cup, that was our jv team.

It's a huge rivalry.

ludo21
08-12-2009, 11:08 AM
Nobody in the world wins in Azteca stadium. That means nothing here.

The fact it is not on tv is a great point. Americans in general do not like soccer, but if it was on a major network I guarantee it would have some huge ratings.

Dudeskey
08-12-2009, 11:08 AM
Dude how can this be the biggest rivalry when nobody knows what you are talking about??? Is this an immigration issue? Why will it be on telemundo?

Maybe because its a qualifier, and because its Soccer. Not as relevant as say on Telemundo.

Liquid Courage
08-12-2009, 11:18 AM
This has been discussed already, but is it the best rivalry?

Also, who is willing and going to watch this on Telemundo today?

it is the greatest rivalry in the CONCACAF and maybe for folks from Mexico, but isn't the greatest rivalry in North America (impossible when one of the teams involved considers this their 5-10th most popular sport) and isn't even close to the greatest rivalry in soccer => Arg v Brazil, Eng v Germ, Rangers v Celtic, Barca v Real, Inter v Juve v Inter are all greater by an exponent or two.

i mean really, how can it even be considered a rivalry in N.A. when the US doesn't even find value to broadcast it in English . . . do you know what would happen if they failed to broadcast Arg v Brazil in Portuguese in Rio or Spanish in Buenos Aires!

cousinal11
08-12-2009, 11:19 AM
:spit:

bronco militia
08-12-2009, 11:22 AM
I bet more SoCal residents care more about USC vs. UCLA


yawn....

TheReverend
08-12-2009, 11:29 AM
http://i27.tinypic.com/155sy83.gif

azbroncfan
08-12-2009, 11:29 AM
Beach volleyball and eating competitions mean more to the US than fairy euro soccer. They can at least get on TV.

McDman
08-12-2009, 11:29 AM
The reason it is not on tv is because the Mexican channel that has the rights to the game tried to charge a ridiculous amount to buy it, I think Mexico is looking for a way to stick it to Americans. ESPN declined and now it's not going to be on regular cable.

If you have Comcast or any other provider that has Telemundo you can watch it in Spanish or if you have a satelite you can watch it on Mun2 in English. It's channel 203 on Direct tv.

PRBronco
08-12-2009, 11:36 AM
Dude how can this be the biggest rivalry when nobody knows what you are talking about??? Is this an immigration issue? Why will it be on telemundo?

I assumed this was a thread about the Alamo.

missingnumber7
08-12-2009, 12:09 PM
I would rather watch a Preseason NFL game between the Lions and the Raiders

Kaylore
08-12-2009, 12:10 PM
http://i27.tinypic.com/155sy83.gif

This.

Hotrod
08-12-2009, 12:12 PM
Is this about soccer?

bronco militia
08-12-2009, 12:13 PM
Is this about soccer?

FUTBOL...get it right, gringo

Ha!

McDman
08-12-2009, 12:45 PM
Beach volleyball and eating competitions mean more to the US than fairy euro soccer. They can at least get on TV.

Unfortunately this is the popular opinion among many Americans. A lot of people refuse to watch and learn about the game and see how exciting it really can be. Instead they remain ignorant and make ridiculous comments such as this about the game.

I used to dislike soccer as well, but if you watch it with an open mind it is a great sport, although it's no Bronco football!

ESPN tried to get it for their broadcast, but the Mexicans high balled us with the price tag. So it's not like no one wanted to air it in the US. Get your facts straight before you make claims.

cousinal11
08-12-2009, 12:47 PM
Unfortunately this is the popular opinion among many Americans. A lot of people refuse to watch and learn about the game and see how exciting it really can be. Instead they remain ignorant and make ridiculous comments such as this about the game.

I used to dislike soccer as well, but if you watch it with an open mind it is a great sport, although it's no Bronco football!

ESPN tried to get it for their broadcast, but the Mexicans high balled us with the price tag. So it's not like no one wanted to air it in the US. Get your facts straight before you make claims.


This doesn't suprise me as ESPN airs quite a bit of "dook" basketball, which is very similar to soccer.

Lots of flopping.

McDman
08-12-2009, 12:58 PM
This doesn't suprise me as ESPN airs quite a bit of "dook" basketball, which is very similar to soccer.

Lots of flopping.

One thing you'll notice is that in American soccer flopping isn't nearly as prevalent. We play a more physical style, which actually hurts us in international competitions because we tend to get a lot of cards.

One thing that bothers me about soccer is the ridiculous flopping, but it is part of the game. It can set up some good opportunities to attack the goal.

azbroncfan
08-12-2009, 01:00 PM
Unfortunately this is the popular opinion among many Americans. A lot of people refuse to watch and learn about the game and see how exciting it really can be. Instead they remain ignorant and make ridiculous comments such as this about the game.

I used to dislike soccer as well, but if you watch it with an open mind it is a great sport, although it's no Bronco football!

ESPN tried to get it for their broadcast, but the Mexicans high balled us with the price tag. So it's not like no one wanted to air it in the US. Get your facts straight before you make claims.

It's hard to like a sport where the refs calls have such a huge impact on the game since penalty kicks are converted at a high percentage. BTW the score of the game was 1-0. It's been tried and tried here and it just doesn't take. I personally don't like the game and never have watching or playing. It's such a big sport that ESPN realizes it's not worth paying for. Don't give me the greatest rivalry crap when you can't even watch it on TV.

Hotrod
08-12-2009, 01:33 PM
Ok just watched some ESpin on the subject. We have only scored 1 goal in that stadium in like 30 games......did I hear that correct.........LMMFAO

McDman
08-12-2009, 01:39 PM
It's hard to like a sport where the refs calls have such a huge impact on the game since penalty kicks are converted at a high percentage. BTW the score of the game was 1-0. It's been tried and tried here and it just doesn't take. I personally don't like the game and never have watching or playing. It's such a big sport that ESPN realizes it's not worth paying for. Don't give me the greatest rivalry crap when you can't even watch it on TV.

Nowhere did I ever say it was the biggest rivalry, it's not. Go back and read my posts I never said that, I said it is a huge rivalry. It wasn't worth paying for with the price that Mexico was demanding.

Also there not many PKs taken. Refs try not to call many fouls in the box.

azbroncfan
08-12-2009, 01:42 PM
Nowhere did I ever say it was the biggest rivalry, it's not. Go back and read my posts I never said that, I said it is a huge rivalry. It wasn't worth paying for with the price that Mexico was demanding.

Also there not many PKs taken. Refs try not to call many fouls in the box.

I didn't specify you said greatest rivalry I was just going off thread title. Each to their own and I'm not a soccer guy along with 80 percent of the other people that voted. It's big but not that big that you can't even get to watch it.

McDman
08-12-2009, 01:49 PM
You can watch it. A lot of cable packages have Telemundo who is airing it. Also Mun2 is airing it in English.

ludo21
08-12-2009, 01:52 PM
Dish Network is airing Mun2 to everyone who doesnt have it for the game today.

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 02:13 PM
GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllll llllllllll

Hotrod
08-12-2009, 02:14 PM
wait someone scored? I thought they had to play atleast 3 hours of run kick run kick before anyone scored???

Natedog24
08-12-2009, 02:15 PM
Goooooooooooo usa!!!!!!

Los Broncos
08-12-2009, 02:16 PM
I would watch some of it but I'm at work.

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 02:17 PM
I only like this game because of the dickhead attitude of the Mexicans every year. Like them Chanting "OSAMA OSAMA!" last year in the Under 23 game when they were winning. **** like that. **** you Mexico.

ludo21
08-12-2009, 02:19 PM
Im still curious why Altidore isnt starting, very odd.

Natedog24
08-12-2009, 02:21 PM
Im still curious why Altidore isnt starting, very odd.

Yeah I guess Bradley doesn't feel his conditioning is good enough for Azteca. Should be a whale of a 2nd half sub though...

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 02:22 PM
Our guys are battling through the smog pretty well it looks like.

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 02:22 PM
****

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 02:27 PM
Wow Donovan is getting brutalized

Natedog24
08-12-2009, 02:32 PM
Damn this isn't looking good

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 02:36 PM
This is like a PAC-10 football game with USC vs whoever.

The refs will decide it... Yay.

Natedog24
08-12-2009, 02:37 PM
Finally a free kick for the US

Natedog24
08-12-2009, 02:49 PM
3rd fing yellow card for the US, the entire backline will be carded before this game is over...

CoopDawg
08-12-2009, 03:42 PM
This is a great rivalry, despite the lack of success at Azteca for the USA. The popularity of soccer in the US seems to be a largely generational divide. Americans under the age of 30 are much more likely to have played soccer throughout their youth and have a strong understanding of the game itself.

crush17
08-12-2009, 04:03 PM
weak.

Doggcow
08-12-2009, 04:08 PM
The calls were pretty favorable for Mexico.

I love how they talk about it being a hard place to play with the smog. Noone's going to be a ****ing retard and train in that kind of **** smog just to prepare to play in your piece of **** country.

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 04:50 PM
I bet more SoCal residents care more about USC vs. UCLA


yawn....

I guarantee that there alot of folks watching todays game in SoCal. Not only that, but SoCal is a big soccer community for both American and Latin American immigrant youth. In SoCal, soccer is very popular.

Did you realize that there is a heavy Mexican contingent there?

Those folks couldnt give a squat about USC/UCLA (and nobody else outside of those schools should either...horrible game).

Mexico/US in soccer is easily the most contentious, most heated, most sternly contested rivalry that any American team is involved in. There's not even any competition. The pride of nations of people is on the line. No other American sport can claim half of the characteristics that this rivalry can. American players literally go down there and play in an unsafe environment. Not like Philly where people throw snowballs packed with batteries on some rare occasions.

This rivalry draws a full stadium wherever it is played. Well over 100,000 attended today.

loborugger
08-12-2009, 05:31 PM
I guarantee that there alot of folks watching todays game in SoCal. Not only that, but SoCal is a big soccer community for both American and Latin American immigrant youth. In SoCal, soccer is very popular.

Did you realize that there is a heavy Mexican contingent there?

Those folks couldnt give a squat about USC/UCLA (and nobody else outside of those schools should either...horrible game).

Mexico/US in soccer is easily the most contentious, most heated, most sternly contested rivalry that any American team is involved in. There's not even any competition. The pride of nations of people is on the line. No other American sport can claim half of the characteristics that this rivalry can. American players literally go down there and play in an unsafe environment. Not like Philly where people throw snowballs packed with batteries on some rare occasions.

This rivalry draws a full stadium wherever it is played. Well over 100,000 attended today.

Nice fact. However an honest assessment would demonstrate that no matter where it is played, 90 percent of the fans are supporting Mexico and the US faces hostile crowds even in the US. Blow it up as you like, but its not important. Period.

Borks147
08-12-2009, 05:41 PM
The calls were pretty favorable for Mexico.

I love how they talk about it being a hard place to play with the smog. Noone's going to be a ****ing retard and train in that kind of **** smog just to prepare to play in your piece of **** country.

I don't care what your stance against Mexico is, but you don't insult my country like that. To ignore with you, sir.

DHallblows
08-12-2009, 06:02 PM
I don't care what your stance against Mexico is, but you don't insult my country like that. To ignore with you, sir.

Huh...overreact much here? Iggy is for consistent trolls and douche bags not someone that hurt your feewlings once...

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 06:16 PM
Nice fact. However an honest assessment would demonstrate that no matter where it is played, 90 percent of the fans are supporting Mexico and the US faces hostile crowds even in the US. Blow it up as you like, but its not important. Period.

I would say that its about 75-35 in favor of Mexico. However, when the game is played here for qualifying purposes, US Soccer moves the game to places that are not typically populated by large numbers of Mexicans, and US fans will sell out a 30k stadium on their own.

The point that you made does not dampen the intensity of the rivalry at all. In fact, I would say that it intensifies it even more. It also makes what our US boys are doing in dominating Mexico over the past 10-15 years even more impressive. They are battling against a monster every time they play....and still they win a high % of the games.

Get over it, guy.

This is the most intense, most significant rivalry in the country right now (especially in qualifying for the World Cup), and it will only grow bigger and more intense over the rest of your life.

You can either kick and scream against it, or you can grow a sense of national pride about yourself and join the rest of us who know that this sport is how the US represent themselves in sport around the world. They dont care anything about American Football, baseball, or basketball (although this is growing), but to them...soccer is the only thing. More significant than every olympic event in history combined.

THIS is the sport that matters.

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 06:21 PM
I don't care what your stance against Mexico is, but you don't insult my country like that. To ignore with you, sir.


If Mexico was worth two craps, all of the poor who are treated like dogs there wouldnt be flocking here to live 8 to an apartment and to work like slaves. Your country sucks. (please put me on ignore) Its astounding that anyone would feel any sense of pride about that place other than the fact that there are some good people there. Everyone knows that the worst of the worst seem to show up for these matches. These people are pissing in bags and hurling them at American fans in the stadium.

cutler_to_marshall
08-12-2009, 06:21 PM
oh man that one really hurt. I think I even got a nosebleed watching our boys struggle in those elements. What I dont understand is why the USA is not content keeping possession when they have a lead. It seems they are careless with the ball transitioning from the back third of the field forward. This leads to constant panic defending mode.

Kaylore
08-12-2009, 06:21 PM
This is the most intense, most significant rivalry in the country right now (especially in qualifying for the World Cup), and it will only grow bigger and more intense over the rest of your life.


LOLHilarious!Ha!ROFL!:bs:

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 06:24 PM
oh man that one really hurt. I think I even got a nosebleed watching our boys struggle in those elements. What I dont understand is why the USA is not content keeping possession when they have a lead. It seems they are careless with the ball transitioning from the back third of the field forward. This leads to constant panic defending mode.


Bradley went to the defensive shell after Davies' goal...not smart. He needs to can that stuff quickly. Its not smart at all to allow your opponent to constantly generate chances. These are professionals. They'll score.

Im afraid that the result against Spain will only hurt the US in the end because Bradley thinks that these guys can do that every time out...the result against Spain was against all odds.

cutler_to_marshall
08-12-2009, 06:31 PM
yeah i liken it to playing prevent defense... its just a bad idea and you really take the game out of your own hands. It does seem he is trying to clone the Spain game over and over again, but I think we would all like to see the US take it to the opponent.

Landon, Dempsey, Davies (what blistering speed !) can all do damage, let them at it !

DHallblows
08-12-2009, 07:45 PM
You can argue significant, but not intense...

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 08:44 PM
yeah i liken it to playing prevent defense... its just a bad idea and you really take the game out of your own hands. It does seem he is trying to clone the Spain game over and over again, but I think we would all like to see the US take it to the opponent.

Landon, Dempsey, Davies (what blistering speed !) can all do damage, let them at it !

Davies is a stud. I'm convinced that he's our best forward. Atidore can take that title from him before the next World Cup, but as of today, Davies is top dog.

Davies has a low center of gravity and immense core strength. You have to foul him to get him off the ball. He's also a little bull of a guy...he'll fight for the ball until it moves on to the next player. His finish today was excellent. Nice ball through by Donovan and then Davies did what a dependable striker does...he beat the keeper. I'm lovin' Davies right now. He played pretty well in his first game at Sochaux as well. He didnt score when he came on as a sub, but he showed some real quality.

uk bronco
08-12-2009, 09:06 PM
not even close to being a rivalry. Living in a city (Glasgow) where half hates the other half makes you appreciate rivalry USA Mexico is a small tiff watch Rangers Celtic in a few weels and really see a rivalry that beats anything North America or the World has

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 09:46 PM
not even close to being a rivalry. Living in a city (Glasgow) where half hates the other half makes you appreciate rivalry USA Mexico is a small tiff watch Rangers Celtic in a few weels and really see a rivalry that beats anything North America or the World has

Ha!

I believe that the question was in regards to what can be found in the United States. Nnyah!

If we consider the world, I think that you have to look at Boca/River.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 09:55 PM
Ha!

I believe that the question was in regards to what can be found in the United States. Nnyah!

If we consider the world, I think that you have to look at Boca/River.

Boca River is the rivalry to end all rivalries. There is quite nothing like that in any sport, anywhere in the world.

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 10:07 PM
Boca River is the rivalry to end all rivalries. There is quite nothing like that in any sport, anywhere in the world.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktxwzR6ei-s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgPSZiSDofc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQjeJ2oe30k

azbroncfan
08-12-2009, 10:42 PM
I would say that its about 75-35 in favor of Mexico. However, when the game is played here for qualifying purposes, US Soccer moves the game to places that are not typically populated by large numbers of Mexicans, and US fans will sell out a 30k stadium on their own.

The point that you made does not dampen the intensity of the rivalry at all. In fact, I would say that it intensifies it even more. It also makes what our US boys are doing in dominating Mexico over the past 10-15 years even more impressive. They are battling against a monster every time they play....and still they win a high % of the games.

Get over it, guy.

This is the most intense, most significant rivalry in the country right now (especially in qualifying for the World Cup), and it will only grow bigger and more intense over the rest of your life.

You can either kick and scream against it, or you can grow a sense of national pride about yourself and join the rest of us who know that this sport is how the US represent themselves in sport around the world. They dont care anything about American Football, baseball, or basketball (although this is growing), but to them...soccer is the only thing. More significant than every olympic event in history combined.

THIS is the sport that matters.

US soccer is pretty lame. All of the good athletes here play all the other sports and soccer gets the left over pickings. If it was so big ESPN would of picked up the coverage regardless of the price. Instead they would rather show hotdog eating contests, poker reruns, and NFL training camp news.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 11:20 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktxwzR6ei-s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgPSZiSDofc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQjeJ2oe30k

Wow great vids!

And the celebrations that happen before and after the game have got to be the craziest parties on the planet :thumbs:

JJJ
08-12-2009, 11:25 PM
Wow, training camp has started and there are ridiculous soccer threads showing up in the central discussion. Mods should be ashamed of themselves. This is real football season.

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 11:27 PM
Wow great vids!

And the celebrations that happen before and after the game have got to be the craziest parties on the planet :thumbs:

That's the kind of pressure cooker that develops great footballers.

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 11:28 PM
Wow, training camp has started and there are ridiculous soccer threads showing up in the central discussion. Mods should be ashamed of themselves. This is real football season.

Hilarious!

Grow some fuzz on your kiwis, establish in yourself a spine, and quit your whining.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 11:37 PM
What happened to the Americans today is just freaking unfair.... No team must be made to go through that friggin hell hole...

And that idiot referee Moreno should just jump in to a well and remove himself from the gene pool....

broncocalijohn
08-12-2009, 11:38 PM
Wow, training camp has started and there are ridiculous soccer threads showing up in the central discussion. Mods should be ashamed of themselves. This is real football season.

This is non sport related. But with McSkillet/Drama Llama here, he always tries to push this kid AYSO sport down our throats.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 11:39 PM
Soccer games at 8,000 feet should never be played at 3pm. That is almost criminal insanity.

I would think there are medical reasons that would make such idiotic scheduling illegal.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 11:40 PM
This is non sport related. But with McSkillet/Drama Llama here, he always tries to push this kid AYSO sport down our throats.

I am surprised it took you so long to come here and shower us with your pseudo-patriotic hate rant and self righteousness....

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 11:46 PM
What happened to the Americans today is just freaking unfair.... No team must be made to go through that friggin hell hole...

And that idiot referee Moreno should just jump in to a well and remove himself from the gene pool....

The officiating was terrible. The guy handed out cards to the US team like crazy, and wouldnt call a foul on Mexico for anything.

FIFA needs to get a handle on that stuff. If this game was reffed against Mexico (several late tackles, cleats-in tackles, jersey tugs on breakaways, etc.) like the US were reffed against in the Confederations Cup, there would have been at least one red card on Mexico. When Davies was knocked down in the box early in the game, there would have been a PK and a card.

FIFA needs to set the same standards in CONCACAF as there are in the rest of the world.

epicSocialism4tw
08-12-2009, 11:48 PM
I am surprised it took you so long to come here and shower us with your pseudo-patriotic hate rant and self righteousness....

Ha!

That dude's on ignore for me and has been for a long time. I see he's still drinking heavily. Hilarious!

cutler_to_marshall
08-12-2009, 11:57 PM
Soccer games at 8,000 feet should never be played at 3pm. That is almost criminal insanity.

I would think there are medical reasons that would make such idiotic scheduling illegal.

If mexico wants to schedule games in the blistering heat thats fine, they can come up to our place again in the middle of winter for a game in frigid Columbus OH.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 11:57 PM
Ha!

That dude's on ignore for me and has been for a long time. I see he's still drinking heavily. Hilarious!

He can't come to terms that folks of his ilk are a drying breed. I feel sorry for his kids, who have been taught so much hate, that they will be unable to handle themselves in the changing world.

atomicbloke
08-12-2009, 11:59 PM
If mexico wants to schedule games in the blistering heat thats fine, they can come up to our place again in the middle of winter for a game in frigid Columbus OH.

It's not the heat. It's the combination of heat and high altitude.

There are medical reasons the human body shouldn't be subject to the thin air of 8,000 feet at 3pm.

There are no adverse medical effects on the human body by playing at below freezing temperatures.

cutler_to_marshall
08-13-2009, 12:02 AM
Davies is a stud. I'm convinced that he's our best forward. Atidore can take that title from him before the next World Cup, but as of today, Davies is top dog.

Davies has a low center of gravity and immense core strength. You have to foul him to get him off the ball. He's also a little bull of a guy...he'll fight for the ball until it moves on to the next player. His finish today was excellent. Nice ball through by Donovan and then Davies did what a dependable striker does...he beat the keeper. I'm lovin' Davies right now. He played pretty well in his first game at Sochaux as well. He didnt score when he came on as a sub, but he showed some real quality.

I havent seen much from Altidore in all honesty. He scored that goal against Spain but I feel he really lacks in technique to be a consistent option. His first touches have been atrocious, you would think someone passed him a superball the way it bounces off his feet. Right now if Davies continues his play, he will most definitely unseat Altidore as the primary striker.

I hope we start bringing Torres into the mix as his special set of skills could really make the US attack a force to be reckoned with. And please lets ditch this prevent defense bunker down garbage. If we have such speed, we can use that speed to run back if caught on counterattack. This style of play really neutralizes our own attacking options. After the initial assist, I didnt see much of Landon because the US could never posses the ball consistently.

cutler_to_marshall
08-13-2009, 12:05 AM
It's not the heat. It's the combination of heat and high altitude.

There are medical reasons the human body shouldn't be subject to the thin air of 8,000 feet at 3pm.

There are no adverse medical effects on the human body by playing at below freezing temperatures.

oh wow i did forget the altitude and lets not forget the 100 k + rabbid fans that would love nothing more than to see the whole idea of the USA falter.

I only wish the Americans could show 50 percent of the support the mexicans give their team. However this is also a blessing because it shields the team from constant scrutiny which can allow the coaches to do their jobs under the radar.

atomicbloke
08-13-2009, 12:06 AM
I havent seen much from Altidore in all honesty. He scored that goal against Spain but I feel he really lacks in technique to be a consistent option. His first touches have been atrocious, you would think someone passed him a superball the way it bounces off his feet. Right now if Davies continues his play, he will most definitely unseat Altidore as the primary striker.

I hope we start bringing Torres into the mix as his special set of skills could really make the US attack a force to be reckoned with. And please lets ditch this prevent defense bunker down garbage. If we have such speed, we can use that speed to run back if caught on counterattack. This style of play really neutralizes our own attacking options. After the initial assist, I didnt see much of Landon because the US could never posses the ball consistently.

The prevent defense garbage was a hugh tactical blunder. I almost felt that Bob Slowick was masquerading as the American soccer coach today.

atomicbloke
08-13-2009, 12:08 AM
I only wish the Americans could show 50 percent of the support the mexicans give their team.

I hear you buddy.

We have people like broncocalijohn who would probably shoot the American team and all their fans and feel patriotic in the process.

cutler_to_marshall
08-13-2009, 12:18 AM
i used to be in that crowd three years ago that couldnt stomach a soccer game to save my life ! however i watched the 2006 world cup in support of my country and realized what fun it was to watch soccer when the games were meaningful to you.

To all the haters out there: lets support the USA ! You dont have to love soccer but i know most american citizens love this country. And as a naturualized citizen who immigrated here, I can truly appreciate anything that stands to represent America. Many of us watched the olympics and many of us on this male dominated football forum watched events like gymnastics in support of the US. Why cant we do that for soccer ?

atomicbloke
08-13-2009, 12:36 AM
What a terrible day....

Costa Rica had to mail it in today.... and now we are behind Honduras on goal differential....

epicSocialism4tw
08-13-2009, 01:03 AM
i used to be in that crowd three years ago that couldnt stomach a soccer game to save my life ! however i watched the 2006 world cup in support of my country and realized what fun it was to watch soccer when the games were meaningful to you.

To all the haters out there: lets support the USA ! You dont have to love soccer but i know most american citizens love this country. And as a naturualized citizen who immigrated here, I can truly appreciate anything that stands to represent America. Many of us watched the olympics and many of us on this male dominated football forum watched events like gymnastics in support of the US. Why cant we do that for soccer ?

The media are partly to blame. Over time, many of them have built up a resistance. People like the guys who fly into this thread with the same old tired "soccers is fur stoopid gay Uropeens" garbage are the same type that sop up whatever a sportswriter or reporter feeds them.

I'm not sure the all of the reasons why the media are to blame, but I know that many of them would have to put in the work to both understand and appreciate the sport enough to follow the storylines and report on it. For old hat reporters with all of their networking assets in the other sports, this would involve networking with people from other countries regularly as well.

Also, I know that soccer is generally harder to pitch advertising for. You dont have breaks every 3 minutes for 2 minutes of commercials.

epicSocialism4tw
08-13-2009, 01:04 AM
What a terrible day....

Costa Rica had to mail it in today.... and now we are behind Honduras on goal differential....

4-0?

Crazy.

This is the best Honduras team I have seen though.

Doggcow
08-13-2009, 01:09 AM
Where can I buy a Landon Donovan jersey?

Like, for cheap. I don't know any jersey sites that have Soccer jerseys.

epicSocialism4tw
08-13-2009, 01:11 AM
Where can I buy a Landon Donovan jersey?

Like, for cheap. I don't know any jersey sites that have Soccer jerseys.

You probably can buy them here: ussoccer.com

Doggcow
08-13-2009, 01:13 AM
You probably can buy them here: ussoccer.com

Not at wholesale prices though. I don't have the kind of cash to pay for them full price.

epicSocialism4tw
08-13-2009, 01:15 AM
http://cgi.ebay.com/USA-Away-Shirt-with-Donovan-10-Soccer-Jersey-Size-XL_W0QQitemZ280383645527QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_Men_ s_Athletic_Apparel?hash=item41482ae757&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

DHallblows
08-13-2009, 02:15 AM
I just wish this team had 2 ****ing forwards...

Atwater His Ass
08-13-2009, 07:25 AM
The problem wasn't the referee. The problem is that the US team continues to have no identity, no style of play to call their own. We play a physical style and attempt to rely on our superior fitness to out work teams. That's sunday league stuff and won't get it done on the larger stage.

The fact that a guy like Ching even is on the roster, let alone in the starting XI is just beyond reasoning. Starting 2 defensive midfielders in Clark and Bradley? Horrible. Donavon and Dempsey were invisible for the entire game (although I'll give credit to Donavon for his excellent pass on the Davies goal). Davies and Gooch were the only field players on the pitch that looked like they had a ****ing clue.

The midfield was non-existant today on the US side. Feilhaber did ok with the time he was in trying to create plays and spray the ball around, but he can't do it alone. Our organization in the back was good, but you can't take 70 mins of pressure a game and not expect to break down. If it wasn't for Howard having some big time saves, this game could have been a lot uglier.

There will also be no accountability at the higher levels of the team. Fact is, outside of a fluke win against Spain, this team has been nothing but average. Brazil dominated us twice, Cost Rica put the screws to us, and Mexico throughly deserved to win this game.

Bradley is not the man to take us into the World Cup, but the federation doesn't have the balls to get a real international coach in here. The US should be at the point where they can win these games and compete. Qualifiying for the World Cup in CONCACAF is a joke; the Gold Cup is a joke. We will easily make the World Cup, and will again be quickly dismissed during group play because the federation refuses to take the next step and bring in a qualified coach who will demand accountability from the players.

epicSocialism4tw
08-13-2009, 09:59 AM
The problem wasn't the referee. The problem is that the US team continues to have no identity, no style of play to call their own. We play a physical style and attempt to rely on our superior fitness to out work teams. That's sunday league stuff and won't get it done on the larger stage.

The ref was a problem. Not the ultimate problem, but I'll never accept biased officiating as the standard.

The fact that a guy like Ching even is on the roster, let alone in the starting XI is just beyond reasoning. Starting 2 defensive midfielders in Clark and Bradley? Horrible. Donavon and Dempsey were invisible for the entire game (although I'll give credit to Donavon for his excellent pass on the Davies goal). Davies and Gooch were the only field players on the pitch that looked like they had a ****ing clue.

I agree on Clark, but Bradley should be out there. He plays both ends. Ideally, we'll see Jermaine Jones and Bradley in the world cup. Both players play both ends. However, I wouldnt mind seeing Feilhaber and Jones instead. I think that Feilhaber is underrated.


The midfield was non-existant today on the US side. Feilhaber did ok with the time he was in trying to create plays and spray the ball around, but he can't do it alone. Our organization in the back was good, but you can't take 70 mins of pressure a game and not expect to break down. If it wasn't for Howard having some big time saves, this game could have been a lot uglier.

I agree 100%. The bunker in mentality results in disappointments more often than not. The effort and the accomplishment in the Spain match will be really difficult to repeat. The US team finally have the players to maintain posession, and the coaching staff will not use them.


Bradley is not the man to take us into the World Cup, but the federation doesn't have the balls to get a real international coach in here. The US should be at the point where they can win these games and compete. Qualifiying for the World Cup in CONCACAF is a joke; the Gold Cup is a joke. We will easily make the World Cup, and will again be quickly dismissed during group play because the federation refuses to take the next step and bring in a qualified coach who will demand accountability from the players.

I dont think that its "balls" that they dont have...I think that its money.

On the accountability issue...I agree there as well. Damarcus Beasley cost the US a big time game before he was cast aside. You have to see these things before the players hit the field. Its the coaches job. That's why players around the world fight for playing time.

How long has it been since Ching has scored a goal in a significant match? Has he ever? I think he set up a PK against Mexico once. Its time to take an extended look at other players who may be able to perform. Kenny Cooper for example...Cooper scored in his first match in Germany for 1860. We trot Ching out on the field for 90% of the serious fixtures for the Nats. Why not split that with Cooper and try to develop him with the other players?

DHallblows
08-13-2009, 11:28 AM
I know he "retired for international play", but I constantly wonder if anyone has called McBride at all to see if he wants to make another run in 2010.
That's the only "problem" (which in reality is a great thing...) with soccer. Something like that isn't blasted over the press for everyone to hear, it's all in-house. Which just sucks for someone like me that wants his dream to come true/be smashed ROFL!

broncocalijohn
08-13-2009, 11:47 AM
Ha!

That dude's on ignore for me and has been for a long time. I see he's still drinking heavily. Hilarious!

The only heavy drinking going on is from those hooligan soccer fans. Atomic, my side is not digressing. I am speaking for the millions of normal, Americans who dont watch soccer. Now Atomic, why dont you say something about my wife again so you can have a week off right before our first Preseason game? (BTW: i never turned you in on that as a Mod saw it before me). Can someone quote me so McDrama can see it?

broncocalijohn
08-13-2009, 11:50 AM
i used to be in that crowd three years ago that couldnt stomach a soccer game to save my life ! however i watched the 2006 world cup in support of my country and realized what fun it was to watch soccer when the games were meaningful to you.

To all the haters out there: lets support the USA ! You dont have to love soccer but i know most american citizens love this country. And as a naturualized citizen who immigrated here, I can truly appreciate anything that stands to represent America. Many of us watched the olympics and many of us on this male dominated football forum watched events like gymnastics in support of the US. Why cant we do that for soccer ?

I dont like to watch soccer but doesnt mean i want them to lose. Just the thread starter always pops this up to get it going over pro vs anti. There are very few here that care about it. He wouldnt get the hate if he puts it on the Other Sports thread so if someone like me comes in there, I deserve to be ripped on. So in the spirit of the soccer match (for whatever it is worth as i have no idea what they are playing for) go USA! I just hope they dont do any drama and fall down when the opponent sneezes on them.

epicSocialism4tw
08-13-2009, 12:38 PM
I know he "retired for international play", but I constantly wonder if anyone has called McBride at all to see if he wants to make another run in 2010.
That's the only "problem" (which in reality is a great thing...) with soccer. Something like that isn't blasted over the press for everyone to hear, it's all in-house. Which just sucks for someone like me that wants his dream to come true/be smashed ROFL!

McBride came out of retirement and played in the last summer olypics with the U-23's. He has slowed a bit. I dont think that he's up to the speed of international football anymore.

Plus, with the bunker/counterattack style that the US play, the team needs quick strikers up top more than they need big finishers like the great McBride. McBride is solid on a team that can get him the ball. The US team would use him to gather and distribute to the wings.

azbroncfan
08-13-2009, 02:14 PM
Why is this thread on the main board? Every other non football thread is moved so lets do it here.

Atwater His Ass
08-13-2009, 02:38 PM
The ref was a problem. Not the ultimate problem, but I'll never accept biased officiating as the standard.

I'm not trying to say the ref was consistent, but it didn't cost us the game what so ever and was just more of an annoyance than anything.



I agree on Clark, but Bradley should be out there. He plays both ends. Ideally, we'll see Jermaine Jones and Bradley in the world cup. Both players play both ends. However, I wouldnt mind seeing Feilhaber and Jones instead. I think that Feilhaber is underrated.

For the record, I think both Bradley and Clark are good players. But they are both the same kind of player and should never be on the field at the same time. They both had terrible games however.

You know who should have started this match at the AMC? Torres. The guy plays his league ball in Mexico, plays at the Azteca twice a year, and can deal with the atmosphere. He's arguably the most technically gifted player the US has and yet, coach Bradley refuses to use him. He didn't even put him on the Gold Cup roster which would have been perfect for him. Instead, Bradley wasted slots on guys like Heaps, Beckerman, and Pause (among others) who all have ZERO CHANCE to be a part of the World Cup roster. Bradely wasted the Gold Cup opportunity to look at some fringe players that actually have a chance to make the WC roster. He should be fired for that alone imo.

I agree 100%. The bunker in mentality results in disappointments more often than not. The effort and the accomplishment in the Spain match will be really difficult to repeat. The US team finally have the players to maintain posession, and the coaching staff will not use them.

You have to admit the win against Spain was a fluke. Spain easily handles the US in 9 out of 10 matches; they are the best team in the world right now and although it was great to beat them (eventhough in a tournament that means nothing), it was not a sign of US soccer coming of age.

I dont think that its "balls" that they dont have...I think that its money.

No excuse. If you really want to build up soccer in America, you are going to have to give your best effort to get the best product on the field and they aren't doing that. I personally find it pathetic. Bradley seems like a great guy personally, but he has no business being anything more than a stop gap coach. But they are going to let him coach the WC, and I'll guarentee that we will not make it out of the group stage, regardless of our draw.

On the accountability issue...I agree there as well. Damarcus Beasley cost the US a big time game before he was cast aside. You have to see these things before the players hit the field. Its the coaches job. That's why players around the world fight for playing time.

How long has it been since Ching has scored a goal in a significant match? Has he ever? I think he set up a PK against Mexico once. Its time to take an extended look at other players who may be able to perform. Kenny Cooper for example...Cooper scored in his first match in Germany for 1860. We trot Ching out on the field for 90% of the serious fixtures for the Nats. Why not split that with Cooper and try to develop him with the other players?

Beasley has been horrible for a couple years now. Something happened when he went to Scotland, and he's never recovered and I don't think he ever will.

Ching has no business being on the roster. Problem is, neither do guys like Cooper or Casey. Although Davies is excellent and Altidore has potential, there is a HUGE drop off after those 2 guys.

Personally, I'd like to see Cherundolo at RM as he's one of the best crossers on the team and he has the ball skills to play the wing. Put Spector at right back. This would free up Dempsey to play the AMC role (or striker) up top which imo he is much more dangerous in than being cast in a winger role.

It still baffles me how our 2 best players (Dempsey and Donovan) are stuck out on the wings. They need to play a more central role in order to be playmakers for the team. So instead, we throw them out on the wing, start 2 DMC's, and wonder why we can't control the midfield? Hell we can't even get a build up out of the midfield every once in a while, let alone control it. So that being the case, how does Bradley think we have a chance to get the ball out to either wing where are 2 best playmakers are? Being clearly outmatched by Mexico with no chance of a build up, the US just by-passed the midfield the entire match and try to get a quick counter. That's the kind of game you play against the Brazil's, Argentina's, Spain's, etc. when you are truely out classed. We are suppossed to be the best team in CONCACAF, even on the road, that is not the style (if you can even call it that) of game we should be bringing.

A lot of that just comes back to the fact that the US has no soccer identity. We have no style and in most matches the US plays, I'd dare anyone to tell me what kind of soccer they are playing and what are the tactic they are trying to employ? It's usually just a big pile of ****. Then we go and beat up on teams like Grenada, Haiti, and El Salvador and people forget that those games don't matter.

DHallblows
08-13-2009, 05:38 PM
McBride came out of retirement and played in the last summer olypics with the U-23's. He has slowed a bit. I dont think that he's up to the speed of international football anymore.

Plus, with the bunker/counterattack style that the US play, the team needs quick strikers up top more than they need big finishers like the great McBride. McBride is solid on a team that can get him the ball. The US team would use him to gather and distribute to the wings.

Ok, but we both agree that the bunker style we play is bull****, right? So play a real style that plays to our strengths and Brian is a solid Forward. You can't argue that he's worse than all 4 of our current forwards. He EASILY replaces Ching and Casey. Even ignoring his feet, he's just as good with his head PLUS is one hell of a finisher. Then paired with Altidore and Davis.
I personally think he was ok with the youngsters. Sure he'd look slow with a bunch of kids my age, but if ****ing Blanco can start for Mexico, so can his significantly better teammate in McBride. I guess I just personally think McBride is too good to be left out because our "coach" thinks prevent D is acceptable with 70 minutes left in a game...

Atwater His Ass
08-13-2009, 06:42 PM
Ok, but we both agree that the bunker style we play is bull****, right? So play a real style that plays to our strengths and Brian is a solid Forward. You can't argue that he's worse than all 4 of our current forwards. He EASILY replaces Ching and Casey. Even ignoring his feet, he's just as good with his head PLUS is one hell of a finisher. Then paired with Altidore and Davis.
I personally think he was ok with the youngsters. Sure he'd look slow with a bunch of kids my age, but if ****ing Blanco can start for Mexico, so can his significantly better teammate in McBride. I guess I just personally think McBride is too good to be left out because our "coach" thinks prevent D is acceptable with 70 minutes left in a game...

Please explain to me the US "style" of football. Because so far in the history of football in the US, we have yet to develop a style of our own. We historically relied on superior conditiong and athletiscm in an attempt to wear teams down and hope to get goals off the counter attack.

The main problem I have with a coach like Bradley is that the US has the most technically set of skilled players they have ever had. We have players that are getting significant minutes in european league football that matters. But Bradley absolutely refuses to A) get the best players on the pitch and B) develop and impose a specific style of play or any sort of meaningful tactics.

Part A is just unacceptable. There is no excuse.

Part B leads to huge issues when attempting to build, develop, and scout for your team. Without having a defined style of play, you lack having defined roles for players which greatly hinders how you compare one player to another and what sort of attributes you want from any given position on the pitch. So you end up with a very skilled guy like Torres that Bradley won't even use because he doesn't know how. It just boggles my mind how the US federation can be satisfied with a coach like this.

How many youth players is the US missing out on because our scouts don't even know what type of player they want? How as a country can we develop youth players to be successful at the international level when we lack a defined style of play and hence lack any sort of defined skill sets youth coaches should be stressing to these kids?

Wistful thinking of being McBride back is a waste of time. He was a great player for us and had a great career, but he can't play at the international level any longer. It would be an embarassment.

DHallblows
08-13-2009, 09:19 PM
Please explain to me the US "style" of football. Because so far in the history of football in the US, we have yet to develop a style of our own. We historically relied on superior conditiong and athletiscm in an attempt to wear teams down and hope to get goals off the counter attack.

Yeah so we both agree Bradley is a terrible coach and hasn't formed any quality style of play...so we completely agree.

Wistful thinking of being McBride back is a waste of time. He was a great player for us and had a great career, but he can't play at the international level any longer. It would be an embarassment.

Compared to what we currently do? Good to know...
And as I've stated, even at his age, he's a better forward than at least one of our top 4 current forwards.

Atwater His Ass
08-13-2009, 09:57 PM
Compared to what we currently do? Good to know...
And as I've stated, even at his age, he's a better forward than at least one of our top 4 current forwards.

Somewhat true. Although I think the US could effctively use Dempsey and/or Donovan as forwards/strikers, which considerably deepens that position instantly. But Bradley continues to want to use them as wingers, which imo, is a very bad move. Dempsey in particular is horrible as winger/flanker. He is a natural goal scorer and playmaker and should be centeraly located.

Donovan can play well outside, much better then Dempsey there, but he needs the team to control the midfield and build play through him. Otherwise he just disappears like he did against Mexico.

DHallblows
08-14-2009, 02:11 AM
Somewhat true. Although I think the US could effctively use Dempsey and/or Donovan as forwards/strikers, which considerably deepens that position instantly. But Bradley continues to want to use them as wingers, which imo, is a very bad move. Dempsey in particular is horrible as winger/flanker. He is a natural goal scorer and playmaker and should be centeraly located.

Donovan can play well outside, much better then Dempsey there, but he needs the team to control the midfield and build play through him. Otherwise he just disappears like he did against Mexico.

Hmmm yeah we completely agree then :thumbsup:
But if that happens, then we need quality Midfielders which we also don't have in depth

DivineLegion
08-14-2009, 02:13 AM
We need to work Freddie Adu into the lineup...the Kids an unbelievable talent and has really started to come into his own. That would give us so much more speed and firepower at forward.

Atwater His Ass
08-14-2009, 07:38 AM
Hmmm yeah we completely agree then :thumbsup:
But if that happens, then we need quality Midfielders which we also don't have in depth

We have central midfielders in Bradley, Clark, Feilhaber, Torres, Edu, and eventually Adu. What we are lacking in is quality wing play. I really think Cherundolo could be very effective as a right sided winger. That frees up Dempsey to play a free attacking role in the middle. Again, starting 2 DMC's in Bradley and Clark is a mistake. We need to be starting 1 DMC and 1 AMC.

Also, I haven't given up 100% on Convey either playing as a winger. And just to add, I think Davy Arnaud is one player that deserves a longer look at forward due to his Gold Cup performance. I find him to be miles ahead of guys like Cooper and Casey who I don't think have a chance at the international level.


We need to work Freddie Adu into the lineup...the Kids an unbelievable talent and has really started to come into his own. That would give us so much more speed and firepower at forward.

Adu has not earned his way onto the senior team yet. He had an opportunity at the Gold Cup, but (understandibly) chose to head back to Europe to get ready for his club season.

Adu came off a great Gold Cup in 2007, got the deal with Benefica, but has failed to produce from there. He's still young enough that I really do believe he's learning a lot being in Europe, but the reality is, he needs to start producing there either this season or next, or it's just not going to happen for him.

Until he can get regular minutes at the club level at Benefica (or on loan), he doesn't deserve to be in the lineup.

I'm not sure why you think he's "coming into his own" when he can't get club minutes anywhere last season and failed to show anything in the couple of Gold Cup matches he was given the opportunity to start in.

Adu is also not a forward. He's a playmaking attacking midfielder that uses his technical skill and speed to develop plays for others. He does have a wicked left foot shot and is pretty good taking set pieces.

He's exactly the kind of player that will excel tremendously with talent around him, but he can't do it alone. He would have been worthless in the Mexico game because the US just bypassed the midfield the entire game playing long ball since they couldn't get any posession in the midfield.

Adu is a classic example of a guy that Bradley doesn't know how to use because he can't develop tactics to take advantage of his most skilled players.

DHallblows
08-14-2009, 11:43 AM
We have central midfielders in Bradley, Clark, Feilhaber, Torres, Edu, and eventually Adu. What we are lacking in is quality wing play. I really think Cherundolo could be very effective as a right sided winger. That frees up Dempsey to play a free attacking role in the middle. Again, starting 2 DMC's in Bradley and Clark is a mistake. We need to be starting 1 DMC and 1 AMC.
Apologies, I was calling wingers midfielders, too. We definitely have more depth there, but as you mentioned, our "coach" needs to have 2 different types of Midfielders in the center, rather than 2 of the same.
We're left with unsure players playing F or M regardless. But I agree, it's less shaky in the Midfielders than the Forwards.

Also, I haven't given up 100% on Convey either playing as a winger. And just to add, I think Davy Arnaud is one player that deserves a longer look at forward due to his Gold Cup performance. I find him to be miles ahead of guys like Cooper and Casey who I don't think have a chance at the international level.

Yeah Davy looked good, he's just in the grouping of questionable players that we don't really know whether or not they can play with quality teams that aren't Panama and Haiti

epicSocialism4tw
08-14-2009, 11:49 AM
I dont think that Arnaud is a serious candidate for forward. He doesnt provide anything of strength at the position and is certainly not in the class of Cooper or Casey in regards to goal-scoring ability.

I agree about Dempsey as a center forward. I think that he should be the "distributing" forward and should play around the 18 when we are in the front third. He and Davies could break down some defenses.

Atwater His Ass
08-14-2009, 04:52 PM
I dont think that Arnaud is a serious candidate for forward. He doesnt provide anything of strength at the position and is certainly not in the class of Cooper or Casey in regards to goal-scoring ability.

I agree about Dempsey as a center forward. I think that he should be the "distributing" forward and should play around the 18 when we are in the front third. He and Davies could break down some defenses.

I know you like Cooper and Casey from previous threads, but for the life of me I really can't see why. They are both very good in MLS (and maybe Cooper can prove me wrong by having success in Germany this year), but it just hasn't translated over to the national side and every time either of them is out there, they look completely lost to me and are virtually ineffective.

Arnaud looked a lot more dangerous to me during the Gold Cup. He was able to get in space and put in himself in dangerous positions. I think he could be a good pairing with a guy like Davies that Arnaud can play those dangerous balls to him.