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Bronco Rob
07-30-2009, 02:42 PM
Let's clear the air.

Brandon Marshall will stay in Denver.

At least this year.

Now, with that being said, let's focus on Kyle Orton, the man traded from the Bears to the Broncos for Jay Cutler.

With all the Cutler talk that has been going on, it's time we focus on the other side of the trade and the man who will lead Denver into the playoffs, and put them in contention once again to win the AFC West.

Before people begin to list Orton's NFL statistics with the Chicago Bears, let's address them.

2005 (Rookie Year): 51.6 percent completion, 1,869 yards, 9 touchdowns, and 13 interceptions. He started 15 games for the Bears, leading them to a 10-5 record before he was replaced for former first round draft pick Rex Grossman. Minus a five interception game against the Cincinatti Bengals, a decent rookie season for a fourth round pick out of Purdue.

2006: Chicago decided to sign free agent Brian Griese, demoting Orton to third string. Grossman "led" the team to the Super Bowl, but poor performances both during the regular season and post season, led to him being replaced in 2007 by Griese, and then Orton.


2007: Orton played in the final three games of the season, in his debut he was 22-38 for 184 yards and one interception. He ended the year with 478 yards, 3 touchdowns and 2 interceptions. He improved upon his 51.6 completion percentage to 53.8 percent.

2008: Kyle was named the starter, out right. He started 15 games, completing 58.5 percent of his passes for 2,972 yards 18 touchdowns and 12 interceptions.

These may seem like mediocre numbers at best to many critics and skeptics out there, but the Bears, for the past four years have not only lacked a premiere quarterback, but a starting wide receiver as well; at least when Orton was at the helm.

In 2005, Muhsin Muhammed led the team with 64 receptions for 750 yards and four touchdowns. Behind him was Justin Gage with 31 receptions for 346 yards and two touchdowns. The third leading receiver?

Running back Thomas Jones.

In 2008, rookie running back Matt Forte was the team's leading receiver with 63 receptions for 477 yards and four touchdowns. Tight end Greg Olson was the second leading man with 54 receptions, 574 yards and five touchdowns.

Lastly, was return man-converted-to-wide-receiver, Devin Hester with 51 catches for 565 yards and three touchdowns.

In 2008 for the Broncos, Brandon Marshall had 104 receptions for 1265 yards and 12 touchdowns. Rookie Eddie Royal had 91 catches for 980 yards and five touchdowns.

After him was slot receiver Brandon Stokley with 49 grabs for 528 yards and three touchdowns. Tight end Tony Scheffler rounded out the group with 41 receptions for 645 yards and three touchdowns.

Last time I checked, all four of these men were still in Denver (no matter how hard one wants to get out).

With that being said let us travel back to 2005, when a college senior from Altoona, Iowa was preparing to enter the NFL Draft.

Coming out of Purdue, Orton was one of the nation's best passers.

A preseason All-American, rated the third best quarterback in the nation by Phil Steele, he was considered by The Sporting News to be the preseason Big Ten Offensive Player of the Year, and was touted to be the Most Accurate Passer, have the Strongest Arm, and be "Coolest in the Clutch" in the Big Ten by Lindy's Sports.

In his final game as a quarterback, Orton threw for 522 yards, tying a record held by a former Boilermaker QB, Drew Brees. Needless to say, Orton was in good company. He ended his career with 9,337 yards, with 63 touchdown passes and 28 interceptions.

Every scout praised Orton for his accuracy:

"does not make many mistakes with the ball, and is accurate in most areas.."-Len Pasquarelli

"...can fit the ball into some tight spots in coverage. Shows excellent touch and accuracy when throwing vertically..."-ESPN Draft Tracker

Yet, they all criticized him for the same thing as well, slow delivery and his lack of experience in a pro-style offense:

"Elongated delivery is a big concern. He needs to improve his mechanics by getting the ball up and quickening his delivery...is he a bit of a system quarterback?"-Draft Tracker

"Played in a quarterback-friendly offense, often works out from the shotgun, and lacks top-shelf arm strength. Has an elongated throwing motion, and throws sidearm way too often..."-Len Pasquarelli

As Aaron Rodgers can attest, when scouts begin to knock your throwing motion, your stock falls.

So he was drafted in the fourth round, and has done nothing, besides get better since he entered the league.

He led the team to a 10-5 record as a rookie, and was wrongly benched.

Then came back in 2008 and led the Bears to a 9-7 record without a number one receiver.

He improved his completion percentage from 2005 by nearly six percent in 2008, and in the last three games of the season Orton completed 71 of 109 passes for 903 yards with five touchdowns, no interceptions and a 106.2 passer rating.

That's a 65.1 completion percentage.

The comparison may be unfair, but it took his predecessor Drew Brees, three years before he cemented his place as a good, if not great quarterback in the NFL.

Is it fair to say that by Orton's eight or ninth year in the league he'll be throwing for 5,000 yards in Denver?

Probably not.

But I think Orton is wrongly perceived by the media, and possibly Broncos's faithful. He is not a conservative, dink and dunk passer. You don't throw for 522 yards by throwing screens, and you don't throw for nearly 10,000 yards in three years by throwing ten yard out patterns.

Orton is a gunslinger, do not underestimate him.

Just give him the weapons he needs, e.g. Marshall, Royal, Stokley, Schleffler.

Denver fans, if you were worried about Kyle Orton, you need not be.

In Illinois we have a theory; when a player leaves a Chicago team, he naturally gets better.

Just sit back and enjoy watching Orton get better Bronco fans.

To encourage thought here's one more statistic:

He's 21-13 as a starter, Cutler was 17-20.





:sunshine:

SouthStndJunkie
07-30-2009, 02:48 PM
<IMG SRC="http://pic16.picturetrail.com/VOL637/2498345/6660043/362881134.jpg" border="0" alt="Image Hosting by PictureTrail.com">

nom nom nom

lex
07-30-2009, 02:51 PM
In the interest of disclosure, its worth pointing out that, in contrast to that piece, which blames the WRs, Muhammad has blamed the QBs by famously being quoted as saying that "Chicago is where wide receivers go to die." So there is a chicken/egg element to this blaming of the WRs.

Since I live here and have watched the Bears as a second team, I will say that I think it has been as much the WRs as the QB. Muhammad has had a lot of drops while playing in Chicago and that quote is more likely trying to deflect blame away from him.

Id say that Bernard Berrian has probably been their most stalwart WR the last five years and that Muhammad is more of a talker who, again, is trying to frame the Chicago situation in a way that will help his pocket book.

Man-Goblin
07-30-2009, 02:54 PM
3.5 k.

GreatBronco16
07-30-2009, 02:54 PM
And here I thought this might be something new. Instead it's the same stuff that's been posted here over and over, just in a different way. Thanks. ;)

broncosteven
07-30-2009, 02:55 PM
Aren't there 20 other threads with the same tired stats in them?

We all know Orton is our guy, he needs to prove it in TC/PS and the regular season.

UberBroncoMan
07-30-2009, 02:59 PM
I honestly still don't grasp why people compare the win/loss ratio between Cutler and Orton.

It may be hard to fathom but games aren't only played by an offense... there is a defense as well, and it just so happens the Bears throughout Orton's tenure with them had a quite solid defense. The Bears getting turnovers and giving Orton a short field... taking pressure off of Orton to win games on his arm etc.

Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton... the end. Trying to twist stats or drink koolaid doesn't change the truth.

All we can hope is that Orton takes his game to the next level with the personnel we're surrounding him with.

lex
07-30-2009, 03:06 PM
I honestly still don't grasp why people compare the win/loss ratio between Cutler and Orton.

It may be hard to fathom but games aren't only played by an offense... there is a defense as well, and it just so happens the Bears throughout Orton's tenure with them had a quite solid defense. The Bears getting turnovers and giving Orton a short field... taking pressure off of Orton to win games on his arm etc.

Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton... the end. Trying to twist stats or drink koolaid doesn't change the truth.

All we can hope is that Orton takes his game to the next level with the personnel we're surrounding him with.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/chi/2005.htm

To bolster what youre saying, check out 2005. Check out the defenses overall rankings and the teams overall passing rankings. Yet, the TEAM went 10-5 with Orton as a starter.

Having said that, Orton actually did a good job. The vast majority of the time he was smart enough to play within himself. But its still blatantly obvious the Bears won in spite of not having a capable QB.

Bronco X
07-30-2009, 03:14 PM
Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton... the end.

No, it's not the end. It goes both ways. Orton had the better defense and won't anymore, but Cutler had much better offensive talent around him and won't anymore, which played a substantial part in his having superior numbers, something the Cutler lovers always refuse to acknowledge. Last year the Broncos O was LOADED. Great offensive line. Great receivers and tight ends. Didn't have that great RB, but Orton has all the things Cutler had and he may have that great RB as well.

Cutler is more talented no doubt, but Orton may be a better manager which with superior talent around him could be better for the team... we'll see. Bottom line is I think both the Broncos and Bears will essentially be fairly similar to how they were last season... good offense bad defense for the Broncos, good defense bad offense for the Bears. Contrary to popular belief especially in Chicago Cutler can't turn water into wine, and bad receivers and O-linemen into good ones.

BMarsh615
07-30-2009, 03:15 PM
Can you please post the link?

broncofan2438
07-30-2009, 03:17 PM
And here I thought this might be something new. Instead it's the same stuff that's been posted here over and over, just in a different way. Thanks. ;)

Yup, more ways to make us Bronco fans think Orton is our hero!

lex
07-30-2009, 03:18 PM
No, it's not the end. It goes both ways. Orton had the better defense and won't anymore, but Cutler had much better offensive talent around him and won't anymore, which played a substantial part in his having superior numbers, something the Cutler lovers always refuse to acknowledge. Last year the Broncos O was LOADED. Great offensive line. Great receivers and tight ends. Didn't have that great RB, but Orton has all the things Cutler had and he may have that great RB as well.

Cutler is more talented no doubt, but Orton may be a better manager which with superior talent around him could be better for the team... we'll see. Bottom line is I think both the Broncos and Bears will essentially be fairly similar to how they were last season... good offense bad defense for the Broncos, good defense bad offense for the Bears. Contrary to popular belief especially in Chicago Cutler can't turn water into wine, and bad receivers and O-linemen into good ones.

You make solid points but its also fair to say that Cutler impacted how much success the team had. His armstrength alone forces the defense to defend more of the field. We saw that in 2006 when Plummer was replaced with Cutler. We saw it open up the running game more. Cutlers skill set should have no less of an impact in Chicago even though the WRs around him may not be as good.

Rabb
07-30-2009, 03:19 PM
I honestly still don't grasp why people compare the win/loss ratio between Cutler and Orton.

It may be hard to fathom but games aren't only played by an offense... there is a defense as well, and it just so happens the Bears throughout Orton's tenure with them had a quite solid defense. The Bears getting turnovers and giving Orton a short field... taking pressure off of Orton to win games on his arm etc.

Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton... the end. Trying to twist stats or drink koolaid doesn't change the truth.

All we can hope is that Orton takes his game to the next level with the personnel we're surrounding him with.

you just contradicted your own argument

if you cannot judge a team by the offense only, conversely you cannot do it by defense either so "Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton" is false by your own standard

cannot have it both ways, if their O sucks and their D is great and our D sucks and our O is great then it looks to me like by your standard as a team that they are equal

lex
07-30-2009, 03:23 PM
you just contradicted your own argument

if you cannot judge a team by the offense only, conversely you cannot do it by defense either so "Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton" is false by your own standard

cannot have it both ways, if their O sucks and their D is great and our D sucks and our O is great then it looks to me like by your standard as a team that they are equal

He's saying there is a tradeoff, genious.

BroncoMan4ever
07-30-2009, 03:30 PM
another thing no one see when they look at Cutler is that technically he has not improved or grown as a player at all.

last season he threw for a ton of yards but no one factors in that he chucked the ball 616 times. his yards per pass has remained the same his entire career, TDs per attempt have remained nearly the same, INTs per attempt remained almost the same. the only thing that has gone up is his yards and that is only because he threw so much.

at least Orton improves from year to year, Cutler can't say that. and in Chicago with no weapons a bad line and bad offensive coaches, there is a strong chance he is as developed as a QB as he will ever be

521 1N5
07-30-2009, 03:34 PM
And here I thought this might be something new. Instead it's the same stuff that's been posted here over and over, just in a different way. Thanks. ;)

I have an idea...Let's start another Cutler thread!!!

lex
07-30-2009, 03:41 PM
another thing no one see when they look at Cutler is that technically he has not improved or grown as a player at all.

last season he threw for a ton of yards but no one factors in that he chucked the ball 616 times. his yards per pass has remained the same his entire career, TDs per attempt have remained nearly the same, INTs per attempt remained almost the same. the only thing that has gone up is his yards and that is only because he threw so much.

at least Orton improves from year to year, Cutler can't say that. and in Chicago with no weapons a bad line and bad offensive coaches, there is a strong chance he is as developed as a QB as he will ever be

Check out our leading rusher the past two years. A healthy running game can improve the yards per pass. That stat just underscores what has been observed about being too pass happy.

Rigs11
07-30-2009, 03:46 PM
I honestly still don't grasp why people compare the win/loss ratio between Cutler and Orton.

It may be hard to fathom but games aren't only played by an offense... there is a defense as well, and it just so happens the Bears throughout Orton's tenure with them had a quite solid defense. The Bears getting turnovers and giving Orton a short field... taking pressure off of Orton to win games on his arm etc.

Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton... the end. Trying to twist stats or drink koolaid doesn't change the truth.

All we can hope is that Orton takes his game to the next level with the personnel we're surrounding him with.

Umm yeah and that's what the article was about,how crappy an offense Orton had.Cutler will be running for his life this year.

footstepsfrom#27
07-30-2009, 03:49 PM
::)

elsid13
07-30-2009, 03:54 PM
What scare me is the the fact that Orton in WCO never hit 60% of his passes. That a problem no matter who he is throwing to.

broncosteven
07-30-2009, 03:55 PM
Umm yeah and that's what the article was about,how crappy an offense Orton had.Cutler will be running for his life this year.

They upgraded their line, plus unlike Orton Cutler can run.

RMT
07-30-2009, 03:59 PM
I honestly still don't grasp why people compare the win/loss ratio between Cutler and Orton.

It may be hard to fathom but games aren't only played by an offense... there is a defense as well, and it just so happens the Bears throughout Orton's tenure with them had a quite solid defense. The Bears getting turnovers and giving Orton a short field... taking pressure off of Orton to win games on his arm etc.

Cutler has and will have superior talent when compared to Orton... the end. Trying to twist stats or drink koolaid doesn't change the truth.

All we can hope is that Orton takes his game to the next level with the personnel we're surrounding him with.

the Bears had a "solid defense" with Orton there? 2006, ranked #5; 2007, ranked #26; and 2008, ranked #21 ... aside from 2006, the bears' defense was in the bottom half of the league.

lex
07-30-2009, 04:06 PM
the Bears had a "solid defense" with Orton there? 2006, ranked #5; 2007, ranked #26; and 2008, ranked #21 ... aside from 2006, the bears' defense was in the bottom half of the league.

Orton threw no passes in 2006.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/chi/2006.htm

He had 3 starts in 2007. They were 2-1. He completed 54% of his passes.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/chi/2007.htm

But why dont you include 2005? The Bears had a defense that was 1 and 2 in Pts and Yards and went 10-5 with Orton starting as a rookie. So 2005 and 2008 are whats most relevant. In 2008, the defense wasnt great but it was still better than Denvers. And Chicago had a better running game last year than Denver.

BroncoMan4ever
07-30-2009, 04:09 PM
Check out our leading rusher the past two years. A healthy running game can improve the yards per pass. That stat just underscores what has been observed about being too pass happy.

does a lack of a running game excuse the supid mistakes he continued to make his 3rd season that he was making his rookie years?

he has not grown or matured as a player. he has not improved at all.

and frankly i don't care anymore because his bitch ass is gone.

lex
07-30-2009, 04:11 PM
does a lack of a running game excuse the supid mistakes he continued to make his 3rd season that he was making his rookie years?

he has not grown or matured as a player. he has not improved at all.

and frankly i don't care anymore because his b**** ass is gone.

No. He locked onto Marshall entirely too much. But I wouldnt go as far as saying he's as bad as his rookie year.

Its amazing. I voiced a strong objection to Shanahan's approach to drafting running backs and people acted like I was from Neptune. One of the reasons was that it would take pressure off Cutler and put less emphasis on decision making (because an effective running game opens up the passing game). Instead, we took the approach that we were going to be all about throwing the ball. It might have worked but the injuries at RB (which ties back to the approach to acquiring RBs) came back to haung Shanahan big time...almost as much as retaining Slowik.

fl_playa101
07-30-2009, 04:15 PM
I like this thread :)

GreatBronco16
07-30-2009, 04:37 PM
I have an idea...Let's start another Cutler thread!!!

Well why the hell not. Every single one of them will hit over 2 pages easy.

kamakazi_kal
07-30-2009, 04:39 PM
:sunshine:

whatever ..... orton is a byproduct of a very good defense, superior special teams and a stellar running game.

We know how good our recievers and line are ..... if he fails it's his own fault.

kamakazi_kal
07-30-2009, 04:43 PM
the Bears had a "solid defense" with Orton there? 2006, ranked #5; 2007, ranked #26; and 2008, ranked #21 ... aside from 2006, the bears' defense was in the bottom half of the league.

man look at the takeaways, defensive scoring and TD by special teams

those are the money numbers.

Punisher
07-30-2009, 04:54 PM
Well Number 54 never called Orton a Pussy :)

I mean who will call Orton a pussy when they seen him drink shots of gasoline.

Spider
07-30-2009, 04:54 PM
Bull**** , first off , Da Bears wr's get manhandled on the LOS like a 16 year old virgin in a Mississippi trailer park , no come back to the ball , piss poor route running , sloppy oline play .....And Orton did well with that **** ......

TonyR
07-30-2009, 04:56 PM
What scare me is the the fact that Orton in WCO never hit 60% of his passes.

Chicago runs a WCO?

Punisher
07-30-2009, 04:58 PM
Last week of ****in' vaca bros, time to turn it up a notch! If you see a naked bearded drunk running around LoDo, buy me a shot or 2. BOOSH!

http://twitter.com/KingNeckbeard

elsid13
07-30-2009, 05:03 PM
Chicago runs a WCO?

yes they do. That why Cutler stated that the terminology and game plans are very similar to Shanahan system and that Turner is letting him bring stuff that Shanahan used here to the game plan.

snowspot66
07-30-2009, 05:09 PM
I think it would be more fair to say Chicago tries to run a WCO.

BroncoMan4ever
07-30-2009, 05:18 PM
Well Number 54 never called Orton a p***Y :)

I mean who will call Orton a p***Y when they seen him drink shots of gasoline.

Orton may not have the athletic ability of Cutler, but he will earn his teammates respect, and they will like playing for him.

every article i read about former players and Chicago fans, talks about how much they will miss Orton, and that we got a good QB as basically a throw-in on the Cutler trade. I have yet to really see anyone say anything good about Jay in Chicago.

lex
07-30-2009, 05:23 PM
Orton may not have the athletic ability of Cutler, but he will earn his teammates respect, and they will like playing for him.

every article i read about former players and Chicago fans, talks about how much they will miss Orton, and that we got a good QB as basically a throw-in on the Cutler trade. I have yet to really see anyone say anything good about Jay in Chicago.

The players play for money, not the QB. But I think they might enjoy playing with him.

NUB
07-30-2009, 05:32 PM
1,000 yards --> mid-season injury --> 500 yards --> retires after the season due to liver failure.

NUB
07-30-2009, 05:34 PM
Oh yeah and the 21-13 as a starter.

Here's another, I might even write an entire article about it:

Trent Dilfer has 1 Superbowl.

Dan Marino has 0. Hell, even Tarkenton has 0.

Trent Dilfer > Dan Marion, Fran Tarkenton.

Punisher
07-30-2009, 05:50 PM
1,000 yards --> mid-season injury --> 500 yards --> retires after the season due to liver failure.

:rofl:

Bronco Rob
07-31-2009, 06:31 PM
whatever ..... orton is a byproduct of a very good defense, superior special teams and a stellar running game.

We know how good our recievers and line are ..... if he fails it's his own fault.


:curtsey:

underrated29
07-31-2009, 07:34 PM
Lol at the people who think cutler is going to suck this year or run for his life.



as for thread topic. Orton is going to do well for us. We have everything in place for him to succeed. WR,OL, Sick ass RB to be a relieve and keep the safties out of the box,TE and the most potent offensive scheme known to man.

If Orton tanks, then we really will know that he sucks because most qbs should succeed in our system.

rastaman
07-31-2009, 07:46 PM
<IMG SRC="http://pic16.picturetrail.com/VOL637/2498345/6660043/362881134.jpg" border="0" alt="Image Hosting by PictureTrail.com">

nom nom nom

I always new Orton had "Sugar In His Britches". Urlicker was probably jealous and upset the Bears traded the Switch Hitting Orton. ROFL!

rastaman
07-31-2009, 07:51 PM
Lol at the people who think cutler is going to suck this year or run for his life.



as for thread topic. Orton is going to do well for us. We have everything in place for him to succeed. WR,OL, Sick ass RB to be a relieve and keep the safties out of the box,TE and the most potent offensive scheme known to man.

If Orton tanks, then we really will know that he sucks because most qbs should succeed in our system.

There's more pressure on Orton to succeed and have a break out season in 2009......or he will start his journey as a backup journeyman QB.

I wonder if Orton ever called Cutler and thanked him for the great opportunity he now finds himself in. Anyway, Orton can always return back to the Bears as backup or third stringer.LOL

lazarus4444
07-31-2009, 08:01 PM
I guess we'll find out this season eh? I think he will do well and if he doesn't then **** him and we can find somebody else.

colonelbeef
07-31-2009, 08:27 PM
I guess we'll find out this season eh? I think he will do well and if he doesn't then **** him and we can find somebody else.

You mean a new coach and front office, right?

If Orton fails, McDaniels does as well.

Postscript- I think Orton will do well enough to keep his job as least for this season.

BroncoMan4ever
07-31-2009, 08:32 PM
Lol at the people who think cutler is going to suck this year or run for his life.



as for thread topic. Orton is going to do well for us. We have everything in place for him to succeed. WR,OL, Sick ass RB to be a relieve and keep the safties out of the box,TE and the most potent offensive scheme known to man.

If Orton tanks, then we really will know that he sucks because most qbs should succeed in our system.

look at it from a purely talent basis. Cutler has incredible athletic ability, but it is going to be hard to show it when he is running for his life because Chicago's porous line can't protect him for long enough to allow him to find an open man. and when he finds an open man, more than likely the lack of talent in the receiver position isn't going to be able to hold on to the ball, when he has the necessary protection.

and before some Cutler nut swinger says what about Hester, Olsen or Forte, i have this to say.

Hester is no better than a number 3 receiver masquerading as a number 1 receiver because there are no other options. his only threat is as a deep threat, but Cutler even though he can chuck it 70 yards downfield, isn't very accurate on deep balls, and Hester isn't good enough to adjust to poorly thrown passes.

Olsen is a legit threat, as is Forte, but checkdowns are things Cutler struggles with. Why go for the guaranteed 6-8 yards options when I can go for the guy covered by 3 DB's 30 yards down the field? is how Cutler thinks. he hasn't yet grasped the concept of taking what a defense gives you, he always is looking for the deep pass or his favorite target.


Orton on the other hand, he wins, learns from mistakes, doesn't have the ego telling him he can thread a pass through 3 defenders, is a great teammate, strong leader, and his teammates like to play for him.

Orton doesn't have the athletic ability of Jay, but when he has protection, he makes good reads, finds the open man, can analyze and read defenses well, and has a good enough arm that he can make all the necessary throws.

Some may not see it, but by losing Cutler's attitude, ego and poor decision making we actually are going to have better play out of the QB position with Orton leading the team.

BroncoMan4ever
07-31-2009, 08:48 PM
No. He locked onto Marshall entirely too much. But I wouldnt go as far as saying he's as bad as his rookie year.

Its amazing. I voiced a strong objection to Shanahan's approach to drafting running backs and people acted like I was from Neptune. One of the reasons was that it would take pressure off Cutler and put less emphasis on decision making (because an effective running game opens up the passing game). Instead, we took the approach that we were going to be all about throwing the ball. It might have worked but the injuries at RB (which ties back to the approach to acquiring RBs) came back to haung Shanahan big time...almost as much as retaining Slowik.

i am with you on Mike's ego being in the way of him spending a high pick on getting a good RB in Denver as being a problem and a major reason in why we were in poor running situations the last few years.

however, in weeks 11-14, the weeks where Hillis was our major rushing threat, and rushed for a combined 305 yards and 5 TDs, Cutler had a game with his worst passer rating of the season, threw 3 INTs to only 5 TDs over that span, which is roughly the same average of TDs to INTs he had for the full season.

point i am making, legit rushing threat or not, he still makes as many of the same stupid mistakes he made with no rushing threat as he did with a good rushing threat.

underrated29
07-31-2009, 10:46 PM
So i understand you are a cutler hater, thats fine.

But are you a football hater too? (serious question, not being a dyck)

Do you follow other teams very much or just broncos?


I can tell you the bears will not have a porous line this upcomming year. I actually think they will have one of the better lines in the league.

Pace is old and past his prime, health is a concern, but he is still orlando pace and still one of the top LT in the league. The have one of the best LG in the game and they get back williams this year. Remeber, Chris is just like Ryan Harris was for us last year.

They lost chris for the year, his rookie year. Same for harris. Both are first rd talents. That is a HUGE piece for them. I dont know the names of their other guys, but they arent half bad.

REmember our Oline blew before last year. We shored up the LT, and got our RT back and boom. Our line is pimp.


Look for the same to happen with the bears. Not nearly on the same level as ours, i really doubt that would happen. But top 10-top-15. Somewhere in there i think is reasonable.

And a solid run game keeps the S, from stacking the box.



I wouldnt say Jay struggles with dump offs and check downs. I think he struggles with the fact of taking what the D gives him. In CHI that should change.

Bob's your Information Minister
07-31-2009, 10:50 PM
2005 (Rookie Year): 51.6 percent completion, 1,869 yards, 9 touchdowns, and 13 interceptions. He started 15 games for the Bears, leading them to a 10-5 record before he was replaced for former first round draft pick Rex Grossman. Minus a five interception game against the Cincinatti Bengals, a decent rookie season for a fourth round pick out of Purdue.

2006: Chicago decided to sign free agent Brian Griese, demoting Orton to third string. Grossman "led" the team to the Super Bowl, but poor performances both during the regular season and post season, led to him being replaced in 2007 by Griese, and then Orton.

THIS ARTICLE IS UTTER BULL**** BECAUSE OF THIS PASSAGE!

It simultaneously praises a 51.6 percent rookie passer for leading a team to the playoffs while backhandedly saying a guy who threw 23 touchdowns "led" them to the SUPER BOWL.

WHAT THE **** **** EVER.

theAPAOps5
07-31-2009, 10:53 PM
Our QB will be 10 times better than the KC QB. The difference is McD not the QB. KC got fooled once again and Blob will be making excuses in no time. Believe it!

Bronco Rob
08-15-2009, 12:22 PM
:thumbs:

WolfpackGuy
08-15-2009, 12:26 PM
KC got fooled once again

Agreed.
I'm glad it was the Cheaps and not the Broncos who gave Cassel $63 million.

Bronco Rob
10-30-2009, 09:52 AM
:sunshine:

OBF1
10-30-2009, 10:21 AM
I forgot how many haters were on this site. Excellent bump.

Paladin
10-30-2009, 12:00 PM
Great fun!

Is the Crow stilll waarm? I think there are several "experts" around here who need another helping. With Hot Red Sauce..........

Rock Chalk
10-30-2009, 12:37 PM
So i understand you are a cutler hater, thats fine.

But are you a football hater too? (serious question, not being a dyck)

Do you follow other teams very much or just broncos?


I can tell you the bears will not have a porous line this upcomming year. I actually think they will have one of the better lines in the league.

Your football knowledge knows no bounds

Pace is old and past his prime, health is a concern, but he is still orlando pace and still one of the top LT in the league. The have one of the best LG in the game and they get back williams this year. Remeber, Chris is just like Ryan Harris was for us last year.

No, he is old and past his prime and no longer a top LT in the league. But awesome call.

They lost chris for the year, his rookie year. Same for harris. Both are first rd talents. That is a HUGE piece for them. I dont know the names of their other guys, but they arent half bad.

REmember our Oline blew before last year. We shored up the LT, and got our RT back and boom. Our line is pimp.

Our line immediately upgraded when Clady and Harris and Weigman came along. No doubt about that.

Look for the same to happen with the bears. Not nearly on the same level as ours, i really doubt that would happen. But top 10-top-15. Somewhere in there i think is reasonable.

And a solid run game keeps the S, from stacking the box.

About that solid run game...you must not have paid attention to last years Chicago team...



I wouldnt say Jay struggles with dump offs and check downs. I think he struggles with the fact of taking what the D gives him. In CHI that should change.

Yeah, another awesome call there :)

Bronco Rob
10-30-2009, 02:06 PM
Great fun!

Is the Crow stilll waarm? I think there are several "experts" around here who need another helping. With Hot Red Sauce..........




:wiggle:

Br0nc0Buster
10-30-2009, 02:19 PM
Our QB will be 10 times better than the KC QB. The difference is McD not the QB. KC got fooled once again and Blob will be making excuses in no time. Believe it!

good call

errand
10-30-2009, 04:19 PM
He's saying there is a tradeoff, genious.

...it's genius, there genius.

lex
10-30-2009, 05:25 PM
...it's genius, there genius.

You should be more worried about the chickens in your front yard, Goober. Shouldn't you be tendin' to your moonshine?

enjolras
10-30-2009, 06:15 PM
My favorite part of these bump threads is when people starting quoting posts from several months ago and start arguing all over again:)

baja
10-30-2009, 06:42 PM
genius is an unfortunate word to misspell

broncosteven
10-30-2009, 06:55 PM
Aren't there 20 other threads with the same tired stats in them?

We all know Orton is our guy, he needs to prove it in TC/PS and the regular season.

And through 6 weeks of the season Orton has proven it, now he just needs to finish what he started the next 10, or should I say 13!