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tsiguy96
07-01-2009, 09:49 PM
im very interested to watch this guy play in preseason, jsut to see if he has enough in him to invest a few years making him into a QB or not. hes got the size of a prototypical NFL QB, and i think that combined with him being very smart got him drafted, not really anything he did on the football field. anyone think hell ever become a starter?

Archer81
07-01-2009, 10:24 PM
Taken in the 6th round...just like another Tom B...championship...


:Broncos:

SoCalBronco
07-01-2009, 10:25 PM
He's got some physical tools. He's still a major project, but its always nice to get a young prospect onto the roster who has some things the coaches can work with over time.

FireFly
07-02-2009, 12:27 AM
The odds are staked hard against him.

I liked the pick but its also the one that I least expect to pay dividends.

BroncoMan4ever
07-02-2009, 01:54 AM
it would not shock me if he became a good starting QB. he has intelligence, size, and raw talent. it just depends on how well he takes to coaching.

24champ
07-02-2009, 02:22 AM
He's got a long ways to go.

That being said, he does have just about everything you can ask for in a QB. I believe it was Woody Paige who said Bradenstater was the best looking QB in OTA's.

Baba Booey
07-02-2009, 02:27 AM
Size, smarts, and passable physical tools.

He's all yours, McDaniels.

watermock
07-02-2009, 02:32 AM
He'll be the reason we don't draft a real QB in '10. (besides the fact we spent our other 1st on Smith).

He's a possibe NFL starter. possible.

Like Bigfoot.

Baba Booey
07-02-2009, 02:35 AM
He'll be the reason we don't draft a real QB in '10. (besides the fact we spent our other 1st on Smith).

That's what I'm afraid of. Good chance McCoy will be around for our second.

atomicbloke
07-02-2009, 02:47 AM
At least Tom Brady had a very proven track record at Michigan... at least people were noticing him and he showed some flashes....

Can't say the same about Tom Brandstater.... how many people (fans, sports writer, coaches) had even heard of this guy during his college career?

BroncoBuff
07-02-2009, 02:54 AM
Two words for you: Chad Friehauf

watermock
07-02-2009, 04:56 AM
Hey, he was on the index card right with Quinn and Bruton.

Back Off!

Broncoman13
07-02-2009, 07:11 AM
I know so little about him that I couldn't guess as to whether he could become a starter eventually. I will say this, if he has the potential, we have the perfect coaching staff to bring it out.

I think a lot of people are going to be quite happy with how McD and his staff coach the players on the field and in the film room. These newbies are about to start paying dividends... unfortunately, they'll also be handicapped as they're paying for their offseason mistakes too.

supermanhr9
07-02-2009, 07:13 AM
It'll be inetresting. I think it will all depend on how this season goes. If Orton does horrible, guarantee we go aggresively after some QB,,,, Maybe Tebow?lol I would love to be on the mane after we drafted him, it would be hilarious.

watermock
07-02-2009, 07:24 AM
Tebow is a great COLLEGE QB.

TonyR
07-02-2009, 07:29 AM
He'll be the reason we don't draft a real QB in '10.

I fully understand your point, but one thing you need to consider is that the failure rate of 1st round QB's is ridiculously high.

Look at 2002: David Carr, Joey Harrington, Patrick Ramsey.
How about 2003: Byron Leftwich, Kyle Boller, Rex Grossman.
2004? J.P. Losman.
2005? Ladies and gentlemen, give it up for Alex Smith!
2006 brings us Vince Young and Matt Leinhart.
It might be too early to give up on them, but what are your thoughts on JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn in 2007?
Going back a little further, 1999 was a banner year with Tim Couch, Akili Smith, and Cade McNown.
Remember Ryan Leaf in 1998?
How about Jim Druckenmiller in 1997?
Now I'm cherry picking, but how about that can't miss prospect Heath Shuler in 1994?

Do you get my point?

watermock
07-02-2009, 07:57 AM
the '10 class is exceptionally rich. And with McGenius, we'll pick the right one, umm, if we had both picks.

In fact, the whoile draft is better next year. Billichick trded down and got a loaded draft in '10.

2KBack
07-02-2009, 07:58 AM
At least Tom Brady had a very proven track record at Michigan... at least people were noticing him and he showed some flashes....

Can't say the same about Tom Brandstater.... how many people (fans, sports writer, coaches) had even heard of this guy during his college career?

doesn't mean a thing really. Fresno state in the late aughts versus Michigan in the lat 90's. Who do think is going to show more "flashes?"

Of course I think a better example is Matt Cassel, who didn't even get to play in college really and was turned into a servicible, even solid, starter.

TonyR
07-02-2009, 08:03 AM
the '10 class is exceptionally rich.

Perhaps. But if 5 QB's are taken in the first round next year it's probably a safe bet that at least 3 of them will bust. Do you think any of the '10 prospects are "sure things"?

Lev Vyvanse
07-02-2009, 08:12 AM
Of course I think a better example is Matt Cassel,


Tom Brandstater was a three year starter and had to play with four different offensive coordinators.

bowtown
07-02-2009, 08:19 AM
He is the future.

cmhargrove
07-02-2009, 08:20 AM
Tom Brandstater was a three year starter and had to play with four different offensive coordinators.

And.... Didn't he finish college in three years and started working on his graduate degree? He's a smart kid and there is really no pressure on him this year, or probably next year. That's a great thing for his development.

Put your money on him to compete by 2010, but will have a much better shot by 2011.

Lev Vyvanse
07-02-2009, 08:27 AM
And.... Didn't he finish college in three years and started working on his graduate degree? He's a smart kid and there is really no pressure on him this year, or probably next year. That's a great thing for his development.

Put your money on him to compete by 2010, but will have a much better shot by 2011.
I think hes got a Masters degree in psychology.

HILife
07-02-2009, 08:31 AM
He is the future.

All Hail Tom Brandstater!!!

coachmastermind
07-02-2009, 08:36 AM
He'll be the 1999 Brian Griese, Kyle Orton you are Bubby Brister.

Dukes
07-02-2009, 08:42 AM
Two words for you: Chad Friehauf

Wasn't he only in camp because he was the home town kid?

Hamrob
07-02-2009, 08:51 AM
He's got alot of the tools:

Size
Intelligence
Good arm
Physicality
Mobility

However, there are a couple of things that seem to be either inate or essential amongst quality NFL QB's:

Sixth Sense
Playmaking Ability
Durability
Nerves of steel

When you really think about it...having the physical and mental ability to play the position are qualities of all QB's who make the Pros...those who stick and play well...always seem to have that extra something or another.

We'll have to see what moxy Brandstrater has before we can predict his future.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2009, 10:57 AM
Wasn't he only in camp because he was the home town kid?

Yeah he was .... I was just thinking same size, same "smart kid" tag. Brandstater is a better prospect though.

BroncoMan4ever
07-02-2009, 11:53 AM
the '10 class is exceptionally rich. And with McGenius, we'll pick the right one, umm, if we had both picks.

In fact, the whoile draft is better next year. Billichick trded down and got a loaded draft in '10.

you can do that and stockpile for the future when your current team is stacked with talent from the 1st player all the way to the 53rd player on the roster.

McDaniels is in a situation where half of last seasons roster had to go. he had to rebuild an entire team. how would he do that if he were trading picks for future picks? he knows most of the fan base is calling for him to win now, because of the Jay situation, and he had to do what was necessary to load up with talent to give the team the best opportunity to win immediately.

Atlas
07-02-2009, 11:58 AM
he was an interception machine in college. If you can't take care of the ball at that level you are in major trouble in the NFL.

I remember Marino said his rookie year in training camp shul came running on the field and yelled at him for not throwing the ball during a scrimmage. Marino said he was waiting for the WR tio get open, Shula yelled, "He was open!" and that's the difference between college and pro.

You make bad decisions at the collegiate level they pretty much will follow you to the NFL.

broncosteven
07-02-2009, 11:59 AM
What ever happened to the kid from the School of Mines a couple years ago?

PS guy, maybe emergency QB.

Atlas
07-02-2009, 12:00 PM
he knows most of the fan base is calling for him to win now, because of the Jay situation, and he had to do what was necessary to load up with talent to give the team the best opportunity to win immediately.

So the best opportunity for him to win now is by getting rid of Cutler and Marshall? Strange concept.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2009, 12:04 PM
What ever happened to the kid from the School of Mines a couple years ago?

PS guy, maybe emergency QB.

Seriously?

broncosteven
07-02-2009, 12:57 PM
Seriously?

What was his name? Parsons, Barnfirestarter = out of NFL once PS eligiblity ends.

TheReverend
07-02-2009, 01:04 PM
What was his name? Parsons, Barnfirestarter = out of NFL once PS eligiblity ends.

Preston Parsons

Tombstone RJ
07-02-2009, 01:13 PM
The odds are staked hard against him.

I liked the pick but its also the one that I least expect to pay dividends.

:yayaya:

Sorry, I just find this sentence funny as all getout!

BroncoMan4ever
07-02-2009, 03:26 PM
So the best opportunity for him to win now is by getting rid of Cutler and Marshall? Strange concept.

Bowlen was the one who had enough of Jay's bull****. and Marshall is the one who requested a trade so he can get more money.

neither of those are McDaniels fault. but because they happened while he was our new coach, most idiotic fans who don't think, are pissed at him about things out of his control and he is basically on the hot seat with most fans already because of that.

TheReverend
07-02-2009, 03:28 PM
Bowlen was the one who had enough of Jay's bull****. and Marshall is the one who requested a trade so he can get more money.

neither of those are McDaniels fault. but because they happened while he was our new coach, most idiotic fans who don't think, are pissed at him about things out of his control and he is basically on the hot seat with most fans already because of that.

Nice rationalization dude. Point blank: The Cutler fiasco was created by him.

Now, MAYBE Bowlen did END it (or maybe he just took responsibility to take heat off his rookie coach, which is extremely likely), but McDaniels definitely started it.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2009, 03:55 PM
What was his name? Parsons, Barnfirestarter = out of NFL once PS eligiblity ends.

I said "seriously?" because we discussed him in the 3 posts right above yours ::)

Atlas
07-02-2009, 06:27 PM
Bowlen was the one who had enough of Jay's bull****. and Marshall is the one who requested a trade so he can get more money.

neither of those are McDaniels fault. but because they happened while he was our new coach, most idiotic fans who don't think, are pissed at him about things out of his control and he is basically on the hot seat with most fans already because of that.

McDaniels wanted to get rid of Cutler the first moment he walked in the door. He could have brought the situation under control anytime he wanted too, but instead he offered ultimatums and "take it or leave its". Cutler left it and I don't blame him. He is in a much better situation now.

When the owner does stupid things, when the coach does stupid things I don't have to sit here and wave pompoms, so go ahead and be a sheep, buy your Orton Jersey, buy your tickets to watch a 4-12 team.

I'll jump on board when Bowlen proves me wrong or has to hire a new coach. My feeling is about week 10 when the Broncos are 2-8 there are going to be many more people looking at it from my perspective than yours. And if they are 8-2 well, than I was wrong and I hope that I am.

I look at myself as a shareholder in a corporation and they are doing some risky, dangerous things I don't agree with. I'm not selling my stock, but I'm not buying anymore either.

TonyR
07-02-2009, 07:18 PM
...buy your tickets to watch a 4-12 team.

...when the Broncos are 2-8...

So my superlative math skills tell me you're suggesting we'll be 2-4 down the stretch. Which you should find all too familiar since that's the same stellar play we've experienced in the last 3 years of the Shanahan era!

footstepsfrom#27
07-02-2009, 07:25 PM
He's probably the last guy on the roster I care about right now.

Br0nc0Buster
07-02-2009, 07:35 PM
Nice rationalization dude. Point blank: The Cutler fiasco was created by him.

Now, MAYBE Bowlen did END it (or maybe he just took responsibility to take heat off his rookie coach, which is extremely likely), but McDaniels definitely started it.

Cutler completely overreacted.
If I call someone stupid and they pull out a knife and come at me, are they the victim because "I started it"

Even if we say Jay was rightly upset to be mad at McDaniels over trade RUMORS, McDaniels attempted to fix the situation while Jay cut off contact with coaches, teammates, and the owner.

Pat is the one who made the call, not Josh

Jay is main reason Jay is no longer in Denver, then Pat, lastly Josh

hambone13
07-02-2009, 07:57 PM
Cutler completely overreacted.
If I call someone stupid and they pull out a knife and come at me, are they the victim because "I started it"

Even if we say Jay was rightly upset to be mad at McDaniels over trade RUMORS, McDaniels attempted to fix the situation while Jay cut off contact with coaches, teammates, and the owner.

Pat is the one who made the call, not Josh

Jay is main reason Jay is no longer in Denver, then Pat, lastly Josh

Yawn....who was the adult and who was the child.....that's all any of bright people who blame McD for this are saying. No doubt JC has character related stuff to work on..such as patience and humility.

maher_tyler
07-02-2009, 07:58 PM
Cutler completely overreacted.
If I call someone stupid and they pull out a knife and come at me, are they the victim because "I started it"

Even if we say Jay was rightly upset to be mad at McDaniels over trade RUMORS, McDaniels attempted to fix the situation while Jay cut off contact with coaches, teammates, and the owner.

Pat is the one who made the call, not Josh

Jay is main reason Jay is no longer in Denver, then Pat, lastly Josh

All Mcd said was..."anyone can be traded" and it just snowballed from there..Jay WAY over reacted

TheReverend
07-02-2009, 08:00 PM
Reminder:

This is a Brandstater thread.

Br0nc0Buster
07-02-2009, 08:16 PM
Yawn....who was the adult and who was the child.....that's all any of bright people who blame McD for this are saying. No doubt JC has character related stuff to work on..such as patience and humility.

considering half of the people who are against McDaniels refer to him as names like "McStallin" and "McJerkface" I am not sure if "bright" is the word I would associate with McD bashing

Br0nc0Buster
07-02-2009, 08:18 PM
anywho, I liked the pick

He is big, has a strong arm, is intelligent.

If Josh's system works as well as he thinks it will, in a couple years Tom could be a starter for us or at the very least a very capable backup

maher_tyler
07-02-2009, 09:01 PM
Reminder:

This is a Brandstater thread.

What did you think was going to happen?

maher_tyler
07-02-2009, 09:04 PM
anywho, I liked the pick

He is big, has a strong arm, is intelligent.

If Josh's system works as well as he thinks it will, in a couple years Tom could be a starter for us or at the very least a very capable backup

Even being a servicable back up would be a win situation for us...we can only hope he developes into a starter. I had never heard of him until we drafted him, never watched him play etc so i can't really judge him. I don't want much collage ball other than the big games.

strafen
07-02-2009, 10:11 PM
You may already have seen his highlight video
For a guy who is 6'-5" tall, he moves well around the pocket, has a nice velocity on his throws, and knows when to run...
Also, this guy is the type of QB that fits McDaniels style and one he rather develop from the ground up, than try to correct bad habits on an already established QB like Orotn, Simms, or even Cutler
So, this guy I would expect to be our starter next year...

Brandstater highlight video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1p-QWy3NAc)

ZONA
07-02-2009, 10:20 PM
Geezus, it seems every post today, no matter what the original material is about, is turned into a pissing contest about Cutler and McD. I'll give it to you guys though, you are frickin persistant.



Brandstater is a project IMO. I don't expect we will hear much about him this season. He will be in the background just learning and improving. It's never a bad thing to have that guy on your team. Who knows, that guy just might pan out in a few years.

Hogan11
07-02-2009, 11:12 PM
The next Bradlee Van Pelt

Florida_Bronco
07-03-2009, 10:18 AM
The next Bradlee Van Pelt

I don't quite see the comparison. Bradlee was mainly an option type quarterback in college with very poor mechanics and short to boot. Brandstater is tall, pretty solid mechanics and not the running type like Bradlee was.

Overall, I really like the pick. McDaniel's is a QB guru and Brandstater has plenty of tools to be molded into an impressive player. I wouldn't be surprised to see him as a starter in 2011.

elsid13
07-03-2009, 10:30 AM
I don't quite see the comparison. Bradlee was mainly an option type quarterback in college with very poor mechanics and short to boot. Brandstater is tall, pretty solid mechanics and not the running type like Bradlee was.

Overall, I really like the pick. McDaniel's is a QB guru and Brandstater has plenty of tools to be molded into an impressive player. I wouldn't be surprised to see him as a starter in 2011.

I think you are overestimate his talent. Brandstar was decent college prospect but nothing special. It more likely that Brandstar is out of the NFL then starting in 2011.

The QB of the Broncos is not on the roster yet.

Florida_Bronco
07-03-2009, 10:49 AM
I think you are overestimate his talent. Brandstar was decent college prospect but nothing special. It more likely that Brandstar is out of the NFL then starting in 2011.

The QB of the Broncos is not on the roster yet.

Physically, Brandstater has all the tools to start in the NFL. I'd say he's easily got better physical tools than both Brady and Cassel when they came into the league, and we saw what McD did with them.

elsid13
07-03-2009, 11:05 AM
Physically, Brandstater has all the tools to start in the NFL. I'd say he's easily got better physical tools than both Brady and Cassel when they came into the league, and we saw what McD did with them.

Both Brady and Cassel were far better then Brandstater coming out of college. I'm not saying that he is bad, but he not that special either.

tsiguy96
07-03-2009, 11:05 AM
Both Brady and Cassel were far better then Brandstater coming out of college. I'm not saying that he is bad, but he not that special either.

cassel didnt even play in college, how was he better?

elsid13
07-03-2009, 11:17 AM
cassel didnt even play in college, how was he better?

Cassell was highly recruited HS QB (1999 Super Prep All-American, Prep Star All-American, Tom Lemming Top 100, Super Prep All-Farwest, Tom Lemming All-West,going to USC), and it has been reported that politics not ability is what put him behind Leinart. In addition he sat behind upper classmen Carson Palmer (Heisman QB).

He was physical gifted enough to play WR/TE/QB/ST while also starting as a pitcher at USC (until broke his foot).

Just because he wasn't able to play doesn't mean he wasn't talented.

Florida_Bronco
07-03-2009, 11:38 AM
Cassell was highly recruited HS QB (1999 Super Prep All-American, Prep Star All-American, Tom Lemming Top 100, Super Prep All-Farwest, Tom Lemming All-West,going to USC), and it has been reported that politics not ability is what put him behind Leinart. In addition he sat behind upper classmen Carson Palmer (Heisman QB).

He was physical gifted enough to play WR/TE/QB/ST while also starting as a pitcher at USC (until broke his foot).

Just because he wasn't able to play doesn't mean he wasn't talented.

Those high school achievements really mean nothing at the NFL level. I don't buy the politic thing either, as Leinart was an very good and extremely polished QB in college. I don't see Cassel being able to beat him out back then.

I see Brandstater for exactly what he is. A guy with the physical and mental tools to play the game but needs a year or two of polish to make a run at the starting job. Luckily, we have one of, if not the best QB coach in the game today.

Drek
07-03-2009, 01:04 PM
Those high school achievements really mean nothing at the NFL level. I don't buy the politic thing either, as Leinart was an very good and extremely polished QB in college. I don't see Cassel being able to beat him out back then.

I see Brandstater for exactly what he is. A guy with the physical and mental tools to play the game but needs a year or two of polish to make a run at the starting job. Luckily, we have one of, if not the best QB coach in the game today.

Being #2 on the depth char at USC is a whole lot harder than being #1 at Fresno State.

About 30% of the colleges in this country would (including Fresno State) LOVE to give scholarships to the top walk-ons for USC. Just about 75% of all college football would take their #2 player at nearly any position and immediately lot him in as a starter. They do have far superior athletic talent across the board than the vast majority of other schools. a handful of SEC and Big 12 schools compete in that regard.

And Tom Brady won a national title with Michigan, he wasn't just some scrub no one knew about, everyone just assumed he didn't have the raw athleticism, but he busted his ass, not just in learning the offense and studying film but also in the weight room. He's as good a QB as he is because he added significant strength to his passes for the first five years straight that he was in the league.

Brandstater has the physical measureables but there is little reason to believe the mental makeup is there. I'm not a hater on the guy or anything, maybe McDaniels can take his game to an unexpected level. But if he's on the roster in three years I'd be surprised.

24champ
07-03-2009, 01:59 PM
Brandstater is a laker fan and knows how to pull in girls.
http://media.sparkart.net/fivefourclothing/content/photos/1242675741.71079.52.jpg


http://cdn.sparkart.net/fivefourclothing/content/photos/1242675734.47852.27.jpg

ward63
07-03-2009, 02:29 PM
Give the kid time....but I do wish I could hang out with him after seeing the first one to his left

Tombstone RJ
07-03-2009, 09:30 PM
http://cdn.sparkart.net/fivefourclothing/content/photos/1242675734.47852.27.jpg

Tom loves a good menage a quad.

Hulamau
07-04-2009, 01:08 AM
Cutler completely overreacted.
If I call someone stupid and they pull out a knife and come at me, are they the victim because "I started it"

Even if we say Jay was rightly upset to be mad at McDaniels over trade RUMORS, McDaniels attempted to fix the situation while Jay cut off contact with coaches, teammates, and the owner.

Pat is the one who made the call, not Josh

Jay is main reason Jay is no longer in Denver, then Pat, lastly Josh

Precisely, Jay got his wittle feelings hurt and took his thumb blanket to pout in the corner at his hidy place at home. He didn't want to talk to the mean 'ole Mr. Bowlen!

McDaniels all but kissed Jay's ass and polished his balls for him in Florida among the national press, but by then, regardless of what Jay thinks was happening in the beginning, the Cutler-Bus had left the station.

And it couldn't possibly be that McD really was excited about working with Cutler as he clearly and earnestly stated when he was hired, and that possibly he got a little wary and started having a few misgivings if Jay was the kind of guy who could really buy into a team first mentality when he requested a trade right after his jerk off partner Bates got shipped out of Dodge ..... and I imagine after getting a full report on Jays party-hardy rep at the bars didn't inspire a lot of confidence as well. Not to mention Cutler's whining at the beginning of the whole show when Shanny got canned,

So, bottomline, McD listens to the trade idea that landed on his desk that would bring his very own trained & raised from the ground up Cassel here PLUS some picks to help the over all team, that every other coach in history would have at least listened too when rebuilding an entire team, but the deal never got sweet enough to even broach it to Pat.

And from just that, Cutler has a hissy fit and eventually snubs Pat even after the Broncos made serious attempts to welcome him back, declare publicly he was "Their Guy" and try repeatably to get him to come to Dove Valley in person to work it out. ... and yet somehow a few of you guys STILL think it was all McDs 'fault'?!? .... Get a grip Dudes!

I would have liked Cutler to have stayed as well with his big arm and loads of possibilities, if he could have really buckled down and bought into the new show and let McD really make a polished QB out of him. But he didn't and chose to be a little b**** and very immature punk.

Fair enough, he is what he is, and now Orton gets the benefit and over time I think the team will do well in any event, but all this crap about McD running Cutler out of town as if Jay was some poor 'victim' in all this is such BS and its amazing really to still hear this crap!

Florida_Bronco
07-04-2009, 01:39 AM
Being #2 on the depth char at USC is a whole lot harder than being #1 at Fresno State.

About 30% of the colleges in this country would (including Fresno State) LOVE to give scholarships to the top walk-ons for USC. Just about 75% of all college football would take their #2 player at nearly any position and immediately lot him in as a starter. They do have far superior athletic talent across the board than the vast majority of other schools. a handful of SEC and Big 12 schools compete in that regard.

And Tom Brady won a national title with Michigan, he wasn't just some scrub no one knew about, everyone just assumed he didn't have the raw athleticism, but he busted his ass, not just in learning the offense and studying film but also in the weight room. He's as good a QB as he is because he added significant strength to his passes for the first five years straight that he was in the league.

Brandstater has the physical measureables but there is little reason to believe the mental makeup is there. I'm not a hater on the guy or anything, maybe McDaniels can take his game to an unexpected level. But if he's on the roster in three years I'd be surprised.

All good points, and I don't really disagree with any of it, but at the same time we all know that Brady and Cassel both credit McDaniels for molding them into the players they currently are, and I think we would agree that Brandstater has better physical tools than them both when they entered the league.

I have faith in McDaniels, especially when it comes to quarterbacks. I think he can turn Brandstater into a good player.

rbackfactory80
07-04-2009, 09:33 AM
McDaniels wanted to get rid of Cutler the first moment he walked in the door. He could have brought the situation under control anytime he wanted too, but instead he offered ultimatums and "take it or leave its". Cutler left it and I don't blame him. He is in a much better situation now.

When the owner does stupid things, when the coach does stupid things I don't have to sit here and wave pompoms, so go ahead and be a sheep, buy your Orton Jersey, buy your tickets to watch a 4-12 team.

I'll jump on board when Bowlen proves me wrong or has to hire a new coach. My feeling is about week 10 when the Broncos are 2-8 there are going to be many more people looking at it from my perspective than yours. And if they are 8-2 well, than I was wrong and I hope that I am.

I look at myself as a shareholder in a corporation and they are doing some risky, dangerous things I don't agree with. I'm not selling my stock, but I'm not buying anymore either.

This is a very fair take and I totally respect it. However if I thought Jay had it, a qb who would without question lead us to a championship, I would feel like you. I just believe he was a guy who could probably lead you to a good record and disappointment when the post season came. Kind of the MO for Shanahan and his teams. Having a Qb with mental toughness is probably the most important attribute as far as finding a guy who will get you there. I don't believe Jay had that and apparently McDaniels didn't either so now all we can do is watch and hope all is well.