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Bronco Yoda
07-01-2009, 01:59 AM
Anyone here home school or was home schooled growing up?

Thoughts, opinions, stories, advise...

We're going to explore this with our 2nd grader this year.

OBF1
07-01-2009, 02:38 AM
Do either of the parents have their teaching credentials? If not I would be against it.

UberBroncoMan
07-01-2009, 02:47 AM
Anyone here home school or was home schooled growing up?

Thoughts, opinions, stories, advise...

We're going to explore this with our 2nd grader this year.

I was due to being in a military family... but it was off and on... 3 of my 4 HS years were at a Catholic HS (1 was home schooled)... about 4 of my elementary years were home schooled.

I'd have to say that what you put in is what you get out. If you pull it off well odds are you're going to have a kid who's beyond his/her counterpart at the same age.

There is ONE major issue with it... and it is a major issue.

Socialization.

I still regret missing out on making friends etc due to home schooling. Missing that year of High School ****ing sucked.

I've ended up good though. Ended up graduating from college Summa Cum Laude, and I've never once had a bump with the law.

If you do chose home schooling, I'd highly suggest getting your kid involved in a lot of extracurricular activities such as sports etc.

I'm aware of some home schooled people who have done stupid **** once they were released into "the wild" so to speak and it ****ed up their lives or at least made it much harder.

Sometimes people will do stupid stuff to make up for the socialization they missed out on... drugs, sex, partying over studying etc.

Anyway, every person is different and in my view it's completely on the parents as to how their child will end up.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
07-01-2009, 06:26 AM
Eep.

Well, it can works, but as Uber says, you've got to socialize those kids. And that means more than just socializing them at church and that sort of thing.

When they leave the nest, they're going to have to know how to interact with people that are not the same, ideologically, as they are. Socializing them with other religions, races, people with diverse interests, is SO important, or they'll be lost when they head to college.

smalltowngrll
07-01-2009, 07:32 AM
I did it for 6 years with my daughter. Loved it...but there are some things that I think are essential to know and do if you choose to do this. The great thing about home schooling is that you teach the child and you don't move on until they understand the subject. You typically can school for 4 hours a day 4 days a week because you cut out all the crap that typical teachers have to deal with when they have 30 kids to deal with. Also, you can take the 'education' wherever you go. To the parks, into nature, heading out to the wildlife, museums, etc.

I homeschooled through the 6th grade and then she went to public middle school and high school. She made the transition just fine.

1. Research curriculums. Don't skimp on purchasing all of the curriculum material and prepare yourself ahead of time. Make sure you understand the curriculum before you begin to teach it. Know your limits and hire a tutor if you don't understand. When you purchase the curriculum, make sure you purchase the teacher books as well. Make lesson plans, etc.
2. Get plugged in with a home school group in your area. This does a couple of things. It gives you support in all of the challenges you will face and there are often times daily or every other day social activities for the children to participate in. This is key!
3. As they get older, still assign homework and teach them to be responsible. If there are consequences for not doing homework, follow through with that just as if they were in school.
4. Make it enjoyable and not a chore. Make the classroom outdoors one day. Take a field trip to the museum. Add on to the curriculum in as many different ways as you can.
5. I recommend getting them involved in one or two sports like little league, soccer, etc. This is important for building the 'team' mentality. They might miss out on some of this with being home schooled, so they can pick that up in extra sports. Also, as they get older, know what the laws state. Your child has the right to participate in middle and high school sports in your school district even if they don't go to that school. You can enroll them in the sports as long as you pay the typical fee that other students pay.

Hope this helps. Shoot me a message if you have any questions!

Grumps
07-01-2009, 07:41 AM
Homeschooling is great. There has been a lot of progress made to help the parents out too. Especially on the socialization front. There are a lot of programs out there to get homeschooled kids involved in to interact with other kids. Where I live there are also parents that will pool their resources and help one another out. Our church runs a lot of these programs and gets parents together to help each other out.

Garcia Bronco
07-01-2009, 07:45 AM
Socialization.


This.

OTOH I went to a private school for high school. An all male Military Academy and there are some issues with socialization, but I am generally better educated than most people. If you have the ability to home school your kids several days and week, but get them to some level of public place once a week that's a good balance. Bottom line your kids will most likely be better educated and get better boards and most likely get into better schools with less financial burden at the risk of not having a bunch of friends that will mostly likely not be in their lives later on anyway.

Education will open doors. Friends do to, but one can depend on their education more.

dbfan21
07-01-2009, 08:15 AM
Eep.

Well, it can works, but as Uber says, you've got to socialize those kids. And that means more than just socializing them at church and that sort of thing.

When they leave the nest, they're going to have to know how to interact with people that are not the same, ideologically, as they are. Socializing them with other religions, races, people with diverse interests, is SO important, or they'll be lost when they head to college.

QFT. The high school aged kids that I have come in contact with over the last 7-8 years are very introverted or just social retards. They have a hard time acclimating to the rest of their peers and, as a reault, get shunned or ignored. It's very sad to witness.

Like Uber & Moose said, a wide variety of social outlets is key to the development of their interpersonal skills. Good luck!

fdf
07-01-2009, 08:22 AM
Anyone here home school or was home schooled growing up?

Thoughts, opinions, stories, advise...

We're going to explore this with our 2nd grader this year.

We homeschool. It's great. One of the best decisions we ever made.

1. You get to spend so much more time with your kids;

2. They get a really good education;

3. It's a whole lot easier to do than you would think.

4. You will largely end up homeschooling your kids anyway, even if they go to public school. They come home with at least 1 and closer to 2 hours of homework a night in public school. The tear-inducing stinky stuff usually comes home for the parents to deal with and the teachers seem to keep the fun stuff. When you homeschool, you finish up in 3-4 hours a day and you get to do a lot of the fun stuff with your kid (by third or fourth grade, a lot of that time is self directed study, monitored by the parent).

5. Your kid has some time during the day to be a kid when school is over. By the time they finish homework, public school kids are almost ready for bed.

You'll hear a lot of people giving you blah blah about "socialization." Folks who talk about homeschool socialization really have no idea what they are talking about.

At least here in CO, homeschooling is so common, there are group museum-trips, nature-hikes, picnics, ski-trips, visits to recycling plants, swimming-trips, visits to police and fire stations, etc etc etc and much more scheduled for every day of the week all year round for homeschoolers. You could stuff the kids to the gills with high-quality social activities if you want to. It's up to you and your kids to take advantage of it. But the ability to hang with other kids in a variety of settings is not a problem for homeschoolers.

There are a few differences I have observed in social skills development as between homeschoolers and public schoolers.

* For one, homeschoolers are not as adept at pecking-order stuff in late grade school and middle school as public school kids. So their skin isn't as thick when it comes to peer group taunting as public school kids. That can be a little hard for them. Maybe a small advantage for public school, although you could argue that both ways.

* Another is, public school kids tend to associate very strongly with their exact age group. Homeschool kids tend to pick friends over a much wider range of age groups. My boy, for example, is 9. His best friends range from 7 to 12. That is pretty typical for the homeschoolers we know. Not sure whether this is better or worse. It just is. But it's a very distinct difference.

* Finally, the homeschoolers I observe have, on average, much better social skills in dealing with adults than do public schoolers. Advantage, homeschool.

So all in all, there are some minor advantages and disadvantages to each in terms of developing social skills. I suspect those will have evened themselves out for 98% of students by the time they are 21.

You might want to consider COVA, if you are a Colorado resident. It's an online charter school. They pay you $40 a month to attend per student. You have access to a certified teacher to get you through rough spots. They have a really rigorous curriculum. Just to give you an example, I have a fourth grader who can discuss the Reformation and the Renaissance and how humanism influenced art and philosophy. The only reason he learned it is the curriculum made it fun. Heck, I have learned a lot teaching it.

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 08:32 AM
I wouldnt do it

Iv heard of some kids learning some strange stuff while being homeschooled

SouthStndJunkie
07-01-2009, 09:14 AM
There is ONE major issue with it... and it is a major issue.

Socialization.


I agree 100%.

To me, the negative about home schooling is not the education, it is the lack of social skills and experiences.

I am sure it works for some. If I was raising kids in a really bad neighborhood or something like that, it would be an option.

Popps
07-01-2009, 09:18 AM
We send our son to private school, and haven't decided on what we'll do for our daughter yet. (3)

But, I will say, I'm visiting family in the midwest right now and just spent yesterday with my cousins kids (12/10) and was blown away at what great kids they were. They're both home schooled, which I always had some reservation about. But, they just seem like such bright, adjusted kids. Their parents are smart and extremely involved, so either way.. that helps, of course.

But, their level of maturity seemed better developed in some ways, but they were definitely still kids. They also got along with each other surprisingly well for kids who are together so much. They're highly active in their home school group, and we even ran into a couple of kids from their group while we were out.

I certainly understand the socialization concern, and share it, to a point. But, I really wonder if what you gain by having the kids in a school setting (particularly a public school) really offsets what you lose from a hands-on and educational standpoint.

I've been fairly murky on the issue in the past, but living in California where we have **** public schools and a cheap private school costs 25K a year... I'm not ruling it out for the first few years of our daughter's education.

Pseudofool
07-01-2009, 09:44 AM
I would be careful of measuring success based on how well kids get along with adults or how book learned they are. The primary goal of our public education system has always been one of socialization. The actual knowledge that one needs to get into a good university is embarrassingly low, and even at middle of the road universities capable students find it easy to overcome bad education.

What kids can not overcome is inability to socialize with peers; it takes nuance to learn the nonverbal cues of your own generation and that's something parents just can't teach. The cruel realities that kids may face in public schools more closely mirror the cruel realities found in the real world then the ones parents could generate at home. It's a difficult process to learn how to make and keep friends, and it's a difficult process to learn how to deal with people who don't like you and who you don't like but whom you must still deal with. (I also don't think organized sports teaches socialization in the same way a public or even private school would).

tsiguy96
07-01-2009, 09:48 AM
do not do it, your kids will be weird when they grow up. any benefit they get from additional learning is killed because they dont have any people skills. do you want weird kids?

BigPlayShay
07-01-2009, 09:48 AM
Well, unless you are pushing your kid to pursue a future in competitive spelling I would stick with the public school system.

fdf
07-01-2009, 09:53 AM
I wouldnt do it

Iv heard of some kids learning some strange stuff while being homeschooled

LOL. Let me give you some public school examples of strange stuff.

1. I learned, when I was in public school, that "duck and cover" was the correct response to a nuclear attack on our city. We even practiced it.

2. In high school history, my foreign exchange student learned that "the Spanish American war is an example of American paranoia about communism." My host-son was dubious and asked me. I pointed out that the Spanish American war was in 1898 and there were NO communist countries in the world until 1917 and that the war had absolutely nothing to do with communism. He made the mistake of asking about the date discrepancy in class. The teacher yelled at him.

3. Did you know that in High School English in CO, triple run-on-sentences are regarded as good-quality writing?

I regard all three of those things as really strange stuff that I know has been taught in public school in CO.

So the real question is, if you homeschooled, would YOU teach YOUR kids "strange stuff?" There is no homeschool genie that reaches out and makes you teach strange stuff to your kids. Nor is there a magic public school genie that makes public school teachers avoid strange stuff.

When you choose public schools for your kids, you pick the public school version of "strange stuff" for them.

Popps
07-01-2009, 09:58 AM
I would be careful of measuring success based on how well kids get along with adults or how book learned they are. The primary goal of our public education system has always been one of socialization. The actual knowledge that one needs to get into a good university is embarrassingly low, and even at middle of the road universities capable students find it easy to overcome bad education.

What kids can not overcome is inability to socialize with peers; it takes nuance to learn the nonverbal cues of your own generation and that's something parents just can't teach. The cruel realities that kids may face in public schools more closely mirror the cruel realities found in the real world then the ones parents could generate at home. It's a difficult process to learn how to make and keep friends, and it's a difficult process to learn how to deal with people who don't like you and who you don't like but whom you must still deal with. (I also don't think organized sports teaches socialization in the same way a public or even private school would).



Yea, I'd agree with a lot of this in principle. I just think the trade-off might be worth it in some cases. I also believe that a fairly well adjusted kid is going to do fine in either setting.

Personally, after leaving high school... I never found college or the workplace to be much like it. High school was its own entity. I enjoyed my experience, but it was more the sports, activities and being a musician that I liked. Sitting in class didn't really teach me any social skills, personally.
I learned most of those by getting out on my own and socializing, most of which I did with people outside of my high school due to where I lived, music, etc.

I used to be 100% on-board with the notion that home-schooling would socially injure kids. But, after being around some... and hearing more and more stories, I'm no longer convinced that's the case.

There are probably equal trade-offs for both scenarios.

Popps
07-01-2009, 10:04 AM
That said, if I WOULD consider home-schooling, it would likely be for the younger years, and then probably a private school for jr. high and high school.

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 10:07 AM
Here is my version of home schooling....from something that happened last night:

So my 3 year old boy is watching Ice Age......sucking the middle and ring fingers in his left hand (does this when he gets tired) and playing with his balls with his right hand. Mrs. Bean says to me...."are you going to talk to him about that?" I turn to my boy and tell him, "son, if you're going to play with your balls, at least have the common decency to cover yourself with your blanket first." He proceeded to go up to his room and return to the living room with his blankie, cover himself and go about his business. Mission accomplished.

Pseudofool
07-01-2009, 10:11 AM
I used to be 100% on-board with the notion that home-schooling would socially injure kids. But, after being around some... and hearing more and more stories, I'm no longer convinced that's the case.
You're right, that of course they're going to be success cases here, and many kids who would benefit from it, or have a natural social aptitude that wouldn't be hurt by homeschooling. But again, where you see a well adjusted kid, his/her peers might see a total square that the kid won't be able to shake until adulthood. Then again, total squares might have a perfectly fulfilling adultlife.

broncofan2438
07-01-2009, 10:32 AM
Homeschooling sucks....dont do it. For me, I had a friend that had the choice of doing homeschool or public. He chose public and his sister decided to do homeschooling. You are keeping your kid from interacting with others and learning to deal with ups and downs of life. The real world is interacting with people, not keeping them behind closed doors

fdf
07-01-2009, 10:34 AM
do not do it, your kids will be weird when they grow up. any benefit they get from additional learning is killed because they dont have any people skills. do you want weird kids?

Such nonsense. If you lock your kid in a closet, of couse it messes them up. If you rarely let them play with other kids, it messes them up. But I know a ton of homeschoolers. The problem we all have is limiting the social schedule so it doesn't gobble up our whole life.

There are up to 3 million kids homeschooled in America and it's still growing very rapidly. There are a lot of us. It's a whole different world about which a lot of misinformation is circulated--I suspect by the folks who lose money each time a kid leaves the public school system (that's the way public school finance works almost everywhere). But it's emphatically not a world with limited social opportunities. In fact, we own an old Suburban so we can lug around 6 or 7 kids (many not ours).

I would wager that the percent of public school kids who drool socially is about the same or greater than the percent of home school kids. I went to public school and, frankly, I was and still am somewhat of a social dork. My youngest brother went to the same schools and was and always has been a cool guy, very adept. Public school was a minor contributing factor in both cases, imho. I'm just a dork and I'm pretty sure I was born a dork.

DenverBroncosJM
07-01-2009, 10:41 AM
Does home schooling cause social retardation like watching Ghostbusters? If so I would say dont do it.

fdf
07-01-2009, 10:45 AM
Yea, I'd agree with a lot of this in principle. I just think the trade-off might be worth it in some cases. I also believe that a fairly well adjusted kid is going to do fine in either setting. . .


By and large that's true. But what a lot of folks don't know is that homeschooling has a very high percentage of kids who, for one reason or another were having a really difficult time in public school--learning disabilities, disruptive behavior, etc.

As a result the kids were pulled out of public school and homeschooled, either because the parents were getting sick of being called into school to handle behavioral issues or because they saw their kids were falling way behind academically.

I know of several such instances here in Jeffco. They all went thru at least two different elementary schools before they homeschooled. In all of those cases, the kids are doing better both academically and socially (not always great, but a lot better--these kids have problems) in homeschooling.

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 10:51 AM
LOL. Let me give you some public school examples of strange stuff.

1. I learned, when I was in public school, that "duck and cover" was the correct response to a nuclear attack on our city. We even practiced it.

2. In high school history, my foreign exchange student learned that "the Spanish American war is an example of American paranoia about communism." My host-son was dubious and asked me. I pointed out that the Spanish American war was in 1898 and there were NO communist countries in the world until 1917 and that the war had absolutely nothing to do with communism. He made the mistake of asking about the date discrepancy in class. The teacher yelled at him.

3. Did you know that in High School English in CO, triple run-on-sentences are regarded as good-quality writing?

I regard all three of those things as really strange stuff that I know has been taught in public school in CO.

So the real question is, if you homeschooled, would YOU teach YOUR kids "strange stuff?" There is no homeschool genie that reaches out and makes you teach strange stuff to your kids. Nor is there a magic public school genie that makes public school teachers avoid strange stuff.

When you choose public schools for your kids, you pick the public school version of "strange stuff" for them.

I am not sure if parents can be the most objective in subjects they themselves may not be highly knowledgeable in.

I wouldnt trust a parent in some subjects that may be "controversial" to give a child the most objective information to come to their own realizations.

Peoples Champ
07-01-2009, 10:55 AM
i would say no, because part of learning / growing up is interaction with people.

Same with College. A lot of college for me was learning non-educational things. Interacting with people, managing fun time and study time, managing money, intangible things not taught in books. I would say the same goes for homeschooling, you miss out on those intangibles.

Garcia Bronco
07-01-2009, 10:58 AM
i would say no, because part of learning / growing up is interaction with people.

Same with College. A lot of college for me was learning non-educational things. Interacting with people, managing fun time and study time, managing money, intangible things not taught in books. I would say the same goes for homeschooling, you miss out on those intangibles.

You can mitigate social interaction. You'll have a harder time getting the most out of a public school system that holds kids back based on the lower common denominator.

DomCasual
07-01-2009, 10:58 AM
In a million years, I wouldn't home school. It seems like it should be a great idea. Yet, every kid I know who was/is home schooled seems to be a total mess.

So, the question is this. Are they home schooled, and they turn weird? Or, do they get home schooled because they and their family are already weird? The answer is yes.

That said, there have been a few people in this thread that have provided great answers. If you're going to do it, it sounds like you have some great advice.

fdf
07-01-2009, 11:02 AM
This.

If you have the ability to home school your kids several days and week, but get them to some level of public place once a week that's a good balance.

Every homeschool family I know has their kids out playing with other kids way more than once a week.

We homeschool and each day around noon, after school is done, my wife and son head out for errands and playtime. I never know how many kids she's going to come back with. It's usually more than she left with. Some of them end up sleeping over. Others get picked up by their parents as the day goes along. Other days, our boy ends up going home or out with one of the other kids.

It's a whole different way of life. But the notion that it's hard to get homeschoolers out socializing with other kids is just silly. It's the easiest thing in the world.

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 11:04 AM
I am not sure if parents can be the most objective in subjects they themselves may not be highly knowledgeable in.

I wouldnt trust a parent in some subjects that may be "controversial" to give a child the most objective information to come to their own realizations.

Don't kid yourself. Most teachers are parents themselves and none of them are any more "objective" about controversial issues than their students' parents are.

Requiem
07-01-2009, 11:05 AM
My sister home schools all of her kids (for various reasons) and the only big downside I've seen is their ability to interact with others; i.e. the socialization stuff going on. As long as you can find other ways for your kids to get involved with kids their age; it should be fine. I just really worry that my three nephews and nieces will have trouble down the road growing as people because none of them have any, and I mean any friends, outside the family. Truly sad; but otherwise I'm all about home schooling.

Peoples Champ
07-01-2009, 11:29 AM
You can mitigate social interaction. You'll have a harder time getting the most out of a public school system that holds kids back based on the lower common denominator.


Ya, i was just going by my cousin, who was homeschooled her whole life, then at age 16 begged to go to high school.

I guess I shouldnt go by just one example.

fdf
07-01-2009, 11:31 AM
I am not sure if parents can be the most objective in subjects they themselves may not be highly knowledgeable in.

I wouldnt trust a parent in some subjects that may be "controversial" to give a child the most objective information to come to their own realizations.

But how is public school any different? Most public school teachers are taught HOW to teach. A scary large percentage of them are not competent in the subjects they teach. My examples earlier about the run-on-sentences and the Spanish American war is a good example of that. These examples were from high school english and history teachers at Columbine.

I've been writing professionally for several decades. My host-son (an exchange student) asked for advice on an essay. I pointed out to him that his essay started with a bad, triple, run-on-sentence (didn't say "bad"--but it was). He didn't like that so he asked his teacher. She told him the sentence(s) was/were perfectly OK. IMHO, she is not a qualified English teacher. Nor was the History teacher qualified to teach that subject. But they were. (At the same time, I also had to help him with his Chemistry and Math. The particular teachers in those subjects were good at what they did.)

But if you think about it, I have actual knowledge about the competence of four of my host-son's teachers at Columbine. Two of them were not competent in the subject they taught. That's not a real high batting average.

As to controversial subjects, why do you think a public school teacher is any less biased than a parent? Or any less able to keep his or her bias out of the classroom? The History teacher I described in my previous post is a perfect example of a teacher unable to do so. He was just making facts up to fit his preconceptions on controversial subjects.

fdf
07-01-2009, 11:39 AM
I did it for 6 years with my daughter. Loved it...but there are some things that I think are essential to know and do if you choose to do this. The great thing about home schooling is that you teach the child and you don't move on until they understand the subject. You typically can school for 4 hours a day 4 days a week because you cut out all the crap that typical teachers have to deal with when they have 30 kids to deal with. Also, you can take the 'education' wherever you go. To the parks, into nature, heading out to the wildlife, museums, etc.

I homeschooled through the 6th grade and then she went to public middle school and high school. She made the transition just fine.

1. Research curriculums. Don't skimp on purchasing all of the curriculum material and prepare yourself ahead of time. Make sure you understand the curriculum before you begin to teach it. Know your limits and hire a tutor if you don't understand. When you purchase the curriculum, make sure you purchase the teacher books as well. Make lesson plans, etc.
2. Get plugged in with a home school group in your area. This does a couple of things. It gives you support in all of the challenges you will face and there are often times daily or every other day social activities for the children to participate in. This is key!
3. As they get older, still assign homework and teach them to be responsible. If there are consequences for not doing homework, follow through with that just as if they were in school.
4. Make it enjoyable and not a chore. Make the classroom outdoors one day. Take a field trip to the museum. Add on to the curriculum in as many different ways as you can.
5. I recommend getting them involved in one or two sports like little league, soccer, etc. This is important for building the 'team' mentality. They might miss out on some of this with being home schooled, so they can pick that up in extra sports. Also, as they get older, know what the laws state. Your child has the right to participate in middle and high school sports in your school district even if they don't go to that school. You can enroll them in the sports as long as you pay the typical fee that other students pay.

Hope this helps. Shoot me a message if you have any questions!

This is really good advice.

MO OrangeCrush
07-01-2009, 11:43 AM
It is working GREAT for our family at this time. I don't have much more to add to what smalltowngrl and fdf have said . I could not agree more with fdf. Just read those posts. Great points!!

Just for example... My son just had his 6th birthday. His invitation list included kids ranging in age from 16 to 3. (It was an outdoor event that was suitable for that diversity.) It included family, and friends.

[QUOTE=smalltowngrll;2460645]
2. Get plugged in with a home school group in your area. This does a couple of things. It gives you support in all of the challenges you will face and there are often times daily or every other day social activities for the children to participate in. This is key!

[QUOTE=fdf;2460665]We homeschool. It's great. One of the best decisions we ever made. ..... 4. You will largely end up homeschooling your kids anyway, even if they go to public school. They come home with at least 1 and closer to 2 hours of homework a night in public school. .....You could stuff the kids to the gills with high-quality social activities if you want to.

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 11:45 AM
But how is public school any different? Most public school teachers are taught HOW to teach. A scary large percentage of them are not competent in the subjects they teach. My examples earlier about the run-on-sentences and the Spanish American war is a good example of that. These examples were from high school english and history teachers at Columbine.

I've been writing professionally for several decades. My host-son (an exchange student) asked for advice on an essay. I pointed out to him that his essay started with a bad, triple, run-on-sentence (didn't say "bad"--but it was). He didn't like that so he asked his teacher. She told him the sentence(s) was/were perfectly OK. IMHO, she is not a qualified English teacher. Nor was the History teacher qualified to teach that subject. But they were. (At the same time, I also had to help him with his Chemistry and Math. The particular teachers in those subjects were good at what they did.)

But if you think about it, I have actual knowledge about the competence of four of my host-son's teachers at Columbine. Two of them were not competent in the subject they taught. That's not a real high batting average.

As to controversial subjects, why do you think a public school teacher is any less biased than a parent? Or any less able to keep his or her bias out of the classroom? The History teacher I described in my previous post is a perfect example of a teacher unable to do so. He was just making facts up to fit his preconceptions on controversial subjects.

I do think the public schools need work, but it is good you have the knowledge to help your host-son
The problem is when parents dont really have the education in the subject, but still try to skew a child's learning to favor their way of thinking.

Children at young ages are gullibe, there is a reason for this.
So it is important to teach them correctly, but some parents can skew information to favor their particular points of view.

If you go to school you see different points of view, and for the most part you learn from people who are considered knowledgable in the field.

If you are homeschooled, you only see one point of view.

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 11:48 AM
Don't kid yourself. Most teachers are parents themselves and none of them are any more "objective" about controversial issues than their students' parents are.

When you are homeschooled, the parents teachings are all you got

At least there are different points of view to consider when interacting with other teachers and students.

MO OrangeCrush
07-01-2009, 11:52 AM
When you are homeschooled, the parents teachings are all you got

At least there are different points of view to consider when interacting with other teachers and students.


In our group of homeschoolers there are other points of view. I also believe that when the time comes, I will bring up subjects and teach my children that 'other people believe ... such and such'.

Just like I teach him that even though mommy is a BIG TIME Broncos fan, he can choose his own team (as long as it is not the Raiders :)) ) There are a wide range of favorite teams in the family.

snowspot66
07-01-2009, 11:53 AM
I was never home schooled myself but my girlfriend and I have met numerous kids who were and they all had one big thing in common.

They were pretty off.

Homeschooling can destroy chances at having well adjusted adult lives. What you should really be looking for is not opinions of the parents. Parents who home school always love it citing how close they are to their kids and all that **** but ultimately that may not be what's best for the kid but instead what's best for the parent.

Look for forums and opinions from kids who were home schooled. They'll give you the straight truth. Be prepared for some very negative opinions. If you do it wrong you can really **** up the kid.

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 11:55 AM
When you are homeschooled, the parents teachings are all you got

At least there are different points of view to consider when interacting with other teachers and students.

I can see the problem if we are talking high school and college level education, but if we're talking early education like K-Grade 5 (as we seem to be doing here), then there really only is "one right answer" for 99% of the stuff being taught. There isn't really a lot of room for different viewpoints and interpretation of what is being taught. We're not analyzing Plato and Aristotle here. We're doing everything from learning to read and write to very basic math, science, geography and history. There really isn't any debate going on in classrooms at this age.

MO OrangeCrush
07-01-2009, 12:01 PM
I was never home schooled myself but my girlfriend and I have met numerous kids who were and they all had one big thing in common.

They were pretty off.

Homeschooling can destroy chances at having well adjusted adult lives. What you should really be looking for is not opinions of the parents. Parents who home school always love it citing how close they are to their kids and all that **** but ultimately that may not be what's best for the kid but instead what's best for the parent.

Look for forums and opinions from kids who were home schooled. They'll give you the straight truth. Be prepared for some very negative opinions. If you do it wrong you can really **** up the kid.


I spent time asking some of the College professors in our town. I have also spoke to several Freshmen that have been homeschooled. The majority of the feedback I have received was positive. I can also say that two of my cousins are being 'homeschooled'. They NEED to be in public school, because their parents are not involved and they are getting NO education or socialization. From my experience that is not the norm. If it were I would totally agree with the arguments above.
I do live in a smaller community with LOTS of homeschool activities. As mentioned before. We have to limit and decide what activities to be involved in. Those activities range from deep (almost extreme) bible and outreach activities to skating and swimming lessons.

fdf
07-01-2009, 12:19 PM
I do think the public schools need work, but it is good you have the knowledge to help your host-son
The problem is when parents dont really have the education in the subject, but still try to skew a child's learning to favor their way of thinking.

Children at young ages are gullibe, there is a reason for this.
So it is important to teach them correctly, but some parents can skew information to favor their particular points of view.

If you go to school you see different points of view, and for the most part you learn from people who are considered knowledgable in the field.

If you are homeschooled, you only see one point of view.

It seems to me though that you are implicitly comparing homeschooling to something that does not exist--that is, a public school system where almost all of the teachers are competent in their subjects and present points of view that they disagree with. I don't see that in our public schools at all.

This is less a problem in math and hard sciences. Reality constrains the teachers to some extent. So it's harder, not impossible, to just make stuff up.

So how does it make a difference if a public school teacher biases the curriculum or if a parent does it? There is one difference: Seems to me you get a more genuinely diverse society with homeschooling--different points of view get taught to different kids--and those points of view reflect the society at large. OTOH, public school would more tend to produce groupthink because all the kids are getting the same bias.

tsiguy96
07-01-2009, 12:22 PM
It seems to me though that you are implicitly comparing homeschooling to something that does not exist--that is, a public school system where almost all of the teachers are competent in their subjects and present points of view that they disagree with. I don't see that in our public schools at all.

This is less a problem in math and hard sciences. Reality constrains the teachers to some extent. So it's harder, not impossible, to just make stuff up.

So how does it make a difference if a public school teacher biases the curriculum or if a parent does it? There is one difference: Seems to me you get a more genuinely diverse society with homeschooling--different points of view get taught to different kids--and those points of view reflect the society at large. OTOH, public school would more tend to produce groupthink because all the kids are getting the same bias.

what you are doing now is justifying why someone should home school. you actually say that people who are home schooled are more socially ready for society just proves that no one can say anything to you that will affect your opinion.

fdf
07-01-2009, 12:32 PM
I spent time asking some of the College professors in our town. I have also spoke to several Freshmen that have been homeschooled. The majority of the feedback I have received was positive. I can also say that two of my cousins are being 'homeschooled'. They NEED to be in public school, because their parents are not involved and they are getting NO education or socialization. From my experience that is not the norm. If it were I would totally agree with the arguments above.
I do live in a smaller community with LOTS of homeschool activities. As mentioned before. We have to limit and decide what activities to be involved in. Those activities range from deep (almost extreme) bible and outreach activities to skating and swimming lessons.

If the parents aren't going to put in the time, the kids may be better off in public school. But the kids are still going to have problems in public school for exactly the same reason--that is, the parents still won't be disposed to put in the time.

So unless it is a very unusual public school, kids there with uninvolved parents will come out with a lousy education and randomly effective/ineffective social skills. Pretty much the same as homeschoolers who face that unfortunate situation. How that cuts in any particular situation is probably pretty individual. It sucks for the kids either way.

fdf
07-01-2009, 12:49 PM
what you are doing now is justifying why someone should home school. you actually say that people who are home schooled are more socially ready for society just proves that no one can say anything to you that will affect your opinion.

Actually, I said it's about a wash, socially. In summary, what I said was that in some ways, homeschoolers do better socially, in other ways public schoolers do better. In other ways, it's just different, but I have no idea whether it's better or worse. Read my first post on the thread for my experiences on that subject.

Educationally, it's not even close. The online charter school we use had to develop a special curriculum for kids that transfer from public school to our school after 6th grade. The public school kids are, on average, about 2 years behind the kids in our school and they spend their first two years catching up.

But you're right in one sense. I'm passionate on the subject and you aren't likely to change my mind. I've seen public schooling and homeschooling up close in a lot of families over the years. I've had kids in both types of schooling. It would take a lot more than a few homeschool horror stories (which exist) to change my mind because I've seen it work so well for so many kids with my own eyes.

So, should I believe you or my "lyin' eyes?" :)

mr007
07-01-2009, 01:03 PM
For the average person, I'd have to be on the NO side for homeschooling.

There's a lot of things in play here.

1.) If you are not very dedicated to being a teacher in your home, your child will not get adequate teaching from you as a parent.

2.) Unless you are very open-minded, you will bring your biases into pretty much every curriculum. At least if your child has teachers, they are subject to many biases and can make interpretations of those biases based on what they think, instead of getting a specific logic ingrained in their head by you as a parent. Many times, the consistent implantation of a biased logic is what causes the many issues we have in society. If you are taught a certain way and forced to believe nothing else it may be very hard to rectify at a later age (discrimination, prejudices, etc). There are checks and balances in most schools that should prevent a certain amount of this by teachers.

3.) Most parents really aren't qualified to be teachers. Regardless of how much you know about many subjects, the effect is in the delivery of the subject. While this may not apply in your situation, it is something to take into consideration if you do not have a teaching degree. It is very easy to teach morals to a child, it may be more difficult to teach them specific subject matter.

4.) Not being in a public system is a detriment to their social growth. - Yes, there are methods for getting around this by keeping your child or children around many other kids for various activities. If you are capable of enabling social interaction on a <b>very</b> consistent basis, this may not apply to you. Growing socially plays a major role in a persons development. The more people a child is around, the more they will learn and be open to thoughts and ideas. I have seen too many people that are completely secluded or sheltered from life and it's a shame because they could have developed into a much greater person in the proper social atmosphere.

5.) You shouldn't do it for selfish reasons. I think many parents may want to "spend more time" with their kids. The truth is this time you find valuable may be detrimental to the growth of your child. If you are doing something like this to fill some void that is in your life, you are doing it for the wrong reasons. Every parent should look deep inside themselves and make sure that the idea behind homeschooling does not have selfish attributes.

My 2 cents. Naturally, there are situations in which home schooling may actually be good. I personally find that those situations are likely few and far between.

fdf
07-01-2009, 01:24 PM
Just like I teach him that even though mommy is a BIG TIME Broncos fan, he can choose his own team (as long as it is not the Raiders :)) ) There are a wide range of favorite teams in the family.

I can be objective about many subjects. But I would never take homeschool objectivity THAT far :)

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 02:21 PM
It seems to me though that you are implicitly comparing homeschooling to something that does not exist--that is, a public school system where almost all of the teachers are competent in their subjects and present points of view that they disagree with. I don't see that in our public schools at all.

This is less a problem in math and hard sciences. Reality constrains the teachers to some extent. So it's harder, not impossible, to just make stuff up.

So how does it make a difference if a public school teacher biases the curriculum or if a parent does it? There is one difference: Seems to me you get a more genuinely diverse society with homeschooling--different points of view get taught to different kids--and those points of view reflect the society at large. OTOH, public school would more tend to produce groupthink because all the kids are getting the same bias.

Look, a child will not have the same teacher for their entire school career.
They will have different teachers every year, and when they get into Jr. High and so on they have different teachers for different subjects.

You may have complaints about teachers, but generally a teacher in a specific field is gonna know more about their subject than just the average person.

And its not just about teaching different points of view, its about teaching correct points of view. For some things, there is only one correct explanation, but that doesnt mean that people still wont debate it.

If little Susy grows up believing X about Y because that is what her parents taught her when actually her belief doesnt match the current accepted explanation of Y, then she is going to have a narrowminded and ignorant understanding of Y

And my whole point is this kind of stuff is more likely to happen in isolation where her knowledge is controlled by the parent

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 02:28 PM
I can see the problem if we are talking high school and college level education, but if we're talking early education like K-Grade 5 (as we seem to be doing here), then there really only is "one right answer" for 99% of the stuff being taught. There isn't really a lot of room for different viewpoints and interpretation of what is being taught. We're not analyzing Plato and Aristotle here. We're doing everything from learning to read and write to very basic math, science, geography and history. There really isn't any debate going on in classrooms at this age.

I would agree that I think gradeschool stuff is pretty black and white, and you are correct my objections would prolly gear more toward jr high and on classes.

But that still doesnt mean this cant happen early on, have you read any of the science discussions for example on this message board?

There are some people on this place alone I would not trust to teach my child about even basic biology or physics.

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 02:30 PM
w. For some things, there is only one correct explanation, but that doesnt mean that people still wont debate it.

If that's not the definition of "waste of time", I don't know what is. This certainly helps support the argument of the poster above who mentioned that home schooling can accomplish in four days (with fewer hours each day) what most public schools take 5 days to cover.

Br0nc0Buster
07-01-2009, 02:46 PM
If that's not the definition of "waste of time", I don't know what is. This certainly helps support the argument of the poster above who mentioned that home schooling can accomplish in four days (with fewer hours each day) what most public schools take 5 days to cover.

You're misrepresenting what I said(or what I meant)

I am not saying schools do that.

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 02:54 PM
You're misrepresenting what I said(or what I meant)

I am not saying schools do that.

Then what exactly are you saying here, because I don't see how I could misrepresent it. It's pretty clear:

For some things, there is only one correct explanation, but that doesnt mean that people still wont debate it.

JJJ
07-01-2009, 03:02 PM
Give these kids a real childhood with real memories and real friends. Missing out on all crap that goes on in school is basically missing out on life itself. I feel sad for anyone who got homeschooled. Wouldn't trade the wedgies and the noogies and the fights for nothing.

My neice homeschooled and seems to spend every waking moment with her face in a book even in the presence of guests. No social graces at all. She is quite comfortable in her own little world and has little empathy for anyone else.

For me homeschooling is a selfish act on the part of parents. Seriously what kid in their right mind wants to hang out with their parents all day long? You can only end up one way after such an experience and it ain't normal.

Can the freaking USA just back to the basics, normal shiat? Kids go to school, parents stay married, government stays the hell out of health care and private industry, everyone drives big trucks and cars. For god's sake what the hell is going on over there?

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 03:07 PM
For me homeschooling is a selfish act on the part of parents.

99% of stay at home parents can't wait until their kids are old enough to go to school so they don't have to deal with them all day, every day. If someone wants to go out of their way to deny themselves that opportunity of personal time where they could be doing other things for themselves all day, I'm not sure "selfish" is the word I'd come up with.

JJJ
07-01-2009, 03:21 PM
99% of stay at home parents can't wait until their kids are old enough to go to school so they don't have to deal with them all day, every day. If someone wants to go out of their way to deny themselves that opportunity of personal time where they could be doing other things for themselves all day, I'm not sure "selfish" is the word I'd come up with.

Ok. how about "icky" then. Sorry it is kind of like kissing your sister. It just shouldn't be done.

Beantown Bronco
07-01-2009, 03:22 PM
Ok. how about "icky" then. Sorry it is kind of like kissing your sister. It just shouldn't be done.

You've never met my sister.

JJJ
07-01-2009, 03:35 PM
You've never met my sister.

:rofl:

Popps
07-01-2009, 03:49 PM
Give these kids a real childhood with real memories and real friends.

Again, our kid is in private school... but I just spent all day with some home school kids yesterday (summer) and their education sounds MUCH more enriching than my traditional school education ever was. Tons of social interaction and much more creative learning applications.

Wouldn't trade the wedgies and the noogies and the fights for nothing.

I wouldn't argue with that, completely... but it's not as if being home schooled means kids don't have friends. Most of them are extremely social, in what I'm seeing. Very active.


My neice homeschooled and seems to spend every waking moment with her face in a book even in the presence of guests.

How old is your niece?

Again, our son is in (regular) school... he's an honor roll student, and is polite as you generally find a 14 year old. That said, his head is also buried in either a book, or his computer or his iPod 24/7. We have to regularly tell him to interact with us. That's just the way most kids are.


For me homeschooling is a selfish act on the part of parents.

Just the opposite.

As pointed out above, I can't imagine the work that would go into it. Only deep concern for a child's well being leads to that sort of thing, imo.



Can the freaking USA just back to the basics, normal shiat? Kids go to school, parents stay married, government stays the hell out of health care and private industry, everyone drives big trucks and cars. For god's sake what the hell is going on over there?

Wouldn't totally argue with that.

But, if you lived in California like we do... you get an idea why some people consider alternate means of education. Schools out in LA are something like 70% latino, and most English learners. That doesn't lend well to American born kids getting fair attention and proper pacing for education when half of the class of 50 kids doesn't understand basic English.


Again, I will probably use traditional private schooling for the remainder of both of my kid's education. But, I also wouldn't be so quick to turn my nose up at parents who care enough to try something other than accepting the norm, particularly when the norm has gotten consistently worse, year after year.

NFLBRONCO
07-01-2009, 04:15 PM
The thing with public school is your with your peers doing the same things at the same time helps with social part. Home Schooling is neat but, its more like adult life where it could be days or weeks before you see anyone socially. If by chance your shy or reserved person it will be twice as difficult in workforce to come out of your shell because of being sheltered of homeschooling.

Dean
07-01-2009, 04:26 PM
There IMO is no definitive answer. Some students have home schooled and have been successful in both their academic and social lives. . .many haven't.

It requires much more than just loving your child to "school them" though that factor is of unquestionable of benefit.

I began teaching in 1971. I have encountered well over a hundred home schooled teenagers. They enter the public school system in order to have a laboratory experience in order to "graduate" (in Wyoming, they are required to meet the state graduation standards or they can only receive a GED). I teach chemistry and physics at the high school level and teach a chem class for a nearby community college.

The acedemic abilities of these students vary greatly but the majority lag behind in science education. They are adequate to advanced in rote memory tasks. However, to propose a hypothesis and perform a valid lab test to prove or disprove that hypothesis is foreign to the majority of them.

As has been stated multiple times in previous posts, most don't mesh socially with their peers. Of those that I have encountered, there have been only a handful that successfully, socially interact with their peers. As a teacher, I try to get them into cooperative education groupings where they can contribute and interact but it isn't largely successful. I wish I had the answer to integrate these kids. After a BS, MS, and over 60 graduate hours in physical sciences, teaching methods, and reaching the hard to teach child I still have no sure fire answer.

I have been blessed with four children of my own. I considered home schooling them and decided against it. Base on how all four "turned out". At least for them, I made the best choice.

JJJ
07-01-2009, 04:29 PM
How old is your niece?

Just started college. Smart girl, honor student. Love her to death but having an interesting conversation that goes beyond a few sentences is tough and quite a bit of work. My wife has basically given up. She was the only one of neices and nephews who were homeschooled and she only homeschooled about 5 or 6 years but I swear you can see the difference. Her two brothers weren't and they are just so much more engaged.

A lot depends on the quality of the teacher of course. But who wants the same teacher every year?

If you want smart, boring, self-centered kids go for home schooling.

Popps
07-01-2009, 05:32 PM
How old is your niece?

If you want smart, boring, self-centered kids go for home schooling.

Again, I think you may be able to apply that to your experience, but not that of many other people.

davidtkd
07-01-2009, 06:10 PM
With homeschooling socialization, I would assume that you get to pick and choose who your child will interact with. That is not the case in public school (to a certain extent) and it definitely is not the case in the real world. I would prefer that my children are able to interact with a wide variety of people not always of their choosing.

smalltowngrll
07-01-2009, 09:47 PM
Homeschooling is not for every one and you cannot categorize everyone who does it or has been homeschooled in the same category.

The missing out on the socializing aspect is easily overcome by so many other activities. Most on this site who are so against it have only 'heard' things. Homeschooling is definitely a time committment on the parents part and it is very important to make sure you get your children involved. But, they don't need to be involved in a 'classroom' setting with other children. It can happen in so many ways.

Most of those against it use examples of high school children...or their own experiences from high school. The original poster is talking about his 2nd grader. Homeschooling through elementary school is MUCH different than through high school.

There are examples after many examples of kids who were homeschooled who fit in well with the world. The only reason we pick on the negative examples is because they 'stand out'. I can name many examples that 'stand out' for those that went to public school and private school.

To the OP, again, way your decision heavily. There's some great info in this thread, but I'd also research heavily with home school groups as well. Some great information.

Oh, and one more piece of information. Find out what the laws are in your state. Some states require that you have your child tested each year like the public school children are tested. And if they don't, you still have the right to have your child tested with the standardized testing through the public school system. It's interesting. Most home schooled children test one or two grades ahead.

NFLBRONCO
07-01-2009, 10:30 PM
I can tell you some of my best memories came from elementry school. At those ages most everyone likes each other the same. I have no regrets public school even though I do think I would have gotten alot more out of the schoolwork in home school environment like study skills focus.

BigPlayShay
07-01-2009, 10:38 PM
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Peoples Champ
07-02-2009, 07:36 AM
With homeschooling socialization, I would assume that you get to pick and choose who your child will interact with. That is not the case in public school (to a certain extent) and it definitely is not the case in the real world. I would prefer that my children are able to interact with a wide variety of people not always of their choosing.


Thats a good point , i never thought about it that way

Bronco Yoda
07-02-2009, 12:01 PM
Thanks everyone for all your input and emails. You guys and gals are the best.

I just checked in for a min. I'm running in and out the door. I'm taking the afternoon off and taking the kids swimming :). It's all about priorities. I'll check in later.

cutthemdown
07-02-2009, 02:49 PM
I think there is a lot to be learned at school that can't be taught at home. You know how to stand up to bullies, how to get comfortable around girls, how to work in groups or as a team etc.

Bronx33
07-02-2009, 03:01 PM
Well you won't know the direct results of your home schooling until it's too late and is it fair to force of make these decisions for your kid ( that's up to you) and it might come back to bite you in the ass what if you're not a competent teacher.

Bronco Yoda
09-06-2009, 02:34 AM
Well, things are going great with the Homeschooling for 2nd grade. We've managed to undo this summer most of the damage done by last years public school system. I still can't believe the meathods they teach nowdays. Freewriting with no regard to spelling (when they're just learning to spell) and unsupervised 'corners' to supposedly learn math and writing. Todays public school system is a joke.

I challenge every parent out there to spend a couple days observing your childs classroom and you'll see what I'm talking about.

We ordered the books that her school uses in order to make sure she gets what the lame school system would attempt to teach as a bare min....and then we purchased other material to advace her in every subject as well. I'm very impressed with the wifes curriculum plan and learning schedule. If only our teachers were this organized and committed.


My 2nd grader is now getting 3 times the learning, with a better teacher, more learning field trips, all in half the time and actually has more time to play with both her 'homeschool friends' and regular school neighbor friends.


And to think....this whole thing was my 2nd graders idea in the first place. And no she isn't slow or weird. Fact is she was the excel winner for her 1st grade (all classes) last year. I guess she's already learing to make good decisions on her own. I'm just glad we're in a position to do this for her. It certainly isn't easy.

Last Friday daughter and Mom spent the day at a couple art galleries for her field trip.

At first I was skeptical, until I learned about all the teaching material out there. I can't believe all the homeschoolers out there.

IMO, you're at a disadvantage going to the public schools now. It's bottom of the barrel now. Sadly, it's no longer what everyone does.... but rather what those who have no other options do. When did it become like this?

With all the Charter schools, private schools, home schooling as a norm now, public schools are left with the problem kids and underpaid, under qualified, over worked teachers. Not really a recipe for success if you ask me.

I can't believe that we settled for a smaller house so we could move into a good suburb with the best school in the area and still.... we ended up homeschooling.

The school system is broken in this country.

Baba Booey
09-06-2009, 02:43 AM
All the homeschooled kids that came to my high school were weirdos. I went to public school and it didn't hinder my ability to get into a good college or anything. Just saying.

Bronco Yoda
09-06-2009, 02:48 AM
Good for you. I'm happy for you. And I'm sure that no one at your school perhaps thought you were a weirdo? No, you probably were super cool in your own mind... right?

Baba Booey
09-06-2009, 03:05 AM
Good for you. I'm happy for you. And I'm sure that no one at your school perhaps thought you were a weirdo? No, you probably were super cool in your own mind... right?

Sorry, I didn't mean to generalize and come off like a dick. There were obviously some cool people that were homeschooled. The ones that were seemed kind of "magoo" were ones that came in the middle of high school, not the ones that came at the beginning.

Just my opinion and experience, sorry if I seemed like a ****head.

Bronco Yoda
09-06-2009, 03:26 AM
No worries man.

Ahhhh.... to be 21 again and full of piss and vinegar. To be able to drink battery acid and crap nails without the worry of the heartburn or waistline to follow.

Raise hell my friend. I did when I was your age. You probabaly won't have to worry about any of this schooling your kids for some time. But when the time comes.... you'll know what I'm talking about. Gawd I always hated that saying.... now I'm saying it.

misturanderson
09-06-2009, 09:48 AM
Then what exactly are you saying here, because I don't see how I could misrepresent it. It's pretty clear:

For some things, there is only one correct explanation, but that doesnt mean that people still wont debate it.

He's saying that some parents may find a way to teach a subject with only one correct answer in a biased way that doesn't portray the subject correctly. I'm assuming that he's specifically refering to science and history being subjects with only one correct answer that could easily be misrepresented by a bias (religious and political biases being the main culprits). This may still happen in public school, but they won't be taught the same bias throughout their schooling as it would if you only have one teacher/pair of teachers.

TheReverend
09-06-2009, 10:37 AM
I'm planning on pulling my daughter from school and home-schooling her as soon as she grows boobs, if that's any help to your decision.

Bronco Yoda
09-06-2009, 10:41 AM
99% of stay at home parents can't wait until their kids are old enough to go to school so they don't have to deal with them all day, every day. If someone wants to go out of their way to deny themselves that opportunity of personal time where they could be doing other things for themselves all day, I'm not sure "selfish" is the word I'd come up with.

Exactly. It is a huge commitment. Our child actually asked for it because she was tired of the mean kids and the weird actions by so many of the kids. If you ask me, the public school system is now where all the weirdo's are caged up for free daycare.

Don't even get me started with the faculty and system now. There's a reason why these people aren't in the private sector making real money. And when you really come to this realization... it's a little disturing.

Untill last year I would have never thought we'd ever consider homeschooling. That was always for those overly religious types locked away in their compounds wearing smocks and eating hay.

It's frustrating. I want some of my property taxes back!

Hogan11
09-06-2009, 12:59 PM
Home schooling? Well, the kid would be a shoe in for Valedictorian.

Jason in LA
09-06-2009, 08:51 PM
I don't have time to home school my son, and he probably wouldn't want to spend that much time with me anyways. lol

Bronco Yoda
09-08-2009, 05:14 PM
http://www.readinga-z.com/

Here's a good resource for all parents of school age children. This is the same exact material many schools use on a daily basis. A really affordable way to bump up your kids reading level that coincides with the public school's reading levels.

Bronco Yoda
09-09-2009, 10:49 AM
I should have posted this ( http://www.learninga-z.com/ )
instead. This site has ALL the learning programs. We found out the many Public classrooms print out this material directly as their core material (especial the reading books online). But you as a parent can order this as well. Very affordable with free samples to try.

Reading, Vocabulary, Writing, Science, & tutorial.

We haven't tried the Science yet.

gunns
09-10-2009, 07:34 AM
I have friends that some do the home schooling and some do public. My own personal opinion is that public schools suck anymore. And it's not necessarily the teachers, it's what the students are allowed to get away with and then what they are punished for, does not make sense.

As far as home schooled I find those children to be much better behaved, less self centered, and they are capable of communicating with adults much better. They are more well rounded as far as study, achievements, and play time. The one detriment I've noted as others have mentioned is the socialization with others their age. They struggle and I have one friend whose child went off the deep end when let loose into the real world. Experimented with everything. That I blame on the parent. I think there are many advantages to home schooling, but it depends on the parent.

BroncoMatt
09-11-2009, 11:16 PM
I have done homeschooling with my daughter and had her in public school. At this time she is in a well regarded jr high but I am pulling her to go back to the homeschool. As far as the well regarded school she is in I think that really means "mostly white". The school has not met my expectations.

If you are in California check out CAVA. They will give you all the books and even a computer to use. You will be assigned a teacher to oversee your child's progress. Best of all it is completely free.

Anyone wanting more info feel free to pm me or just ask in this thread.

Bronco Yoda
09-14-2009, 09:42 PM
I'm not in California anymore but that's good info for all those who are. I'm hoping we can send her to public Jr. & High School when the time comes. There are things that I don't want her to miss out on (like sports). My two boys as well. We'll see. That's a long way out.

bfoflcommish
09-15-2009, 03:26 PM
ok i have read the responses here and there are great posts for and against in this thread. Now I would like to give my opinion.

Having been a little league baseball coach for many years, all the kids I had to spend the most time with were home schooled. they were very far behind in everything from learning to throw, catch, hit (even run in a few cases), and every single one of them had a hard time fitting in with the other kids. call it acting strange being reserved whatever you want but they did have a hard time socializing. the kids behind in the game play that went to public school still fit in well by socializing and actually knew the basics just needed help putting together.

I don't know why that is. is there a "gym" session in homeschooling? maybe thats it?

Also on a personal note there is a family that lives in our neighborhood that home school...very weird kids! they are respectful, outside getting play time constantly, and genuinely very nice kids, but again they too have a hard time playing outside with other kids other then their siblings. for example the oldest is near our oldest age and he would rather play with the kids in the area that are half his age or even younger.

Again i'm not saying either way is right or wrong just stating my run ins with home schooled kids.

BroncoMatt
09-15-2009, 03:53 PM
ok i have read the responses here and there are great posts for and against in this thread. Now I would like to give my opinion.

Having been a little league baseball coach for many years, all the kids I had to spend the most time with were home schooled. they were very far behind in everything from learning to throw, catch, hit (even run in a few cases), and every single one of them had a hard time fitting in with the other kids. call it acting strange being reserved whatever you want but they did have a hard time socializing. the kids behind in the game play that went to public school still fit in well by socializing and actually knew the basics just needed help putting together.

I don't know why that is. is there a "gym" session in homeschooling? maybe thats it?

Also on a personal note there is a family that lives in our neighborhood that home school...very weird kids! they are respectful, outside getting play time constantly, and genuinely very nice kids, but again they too have a hard time playing outside with other kids other then their siblings. for example the oldest is near our oldest age and he would rather play with the kids in the area that are half his age or even younger.

Again i'm not saying either way is right or wrong just stating my run ins with home schooled kids.


My ex homeschooled my kids when they were younger and academically they were better for it. For socialization we met with other homeschoolers and there was church. My kids are generally able to converse with adults better than most kids their age. However, because I was at work I will agree that my children did suffer in the area of athletics. I grew up playing everything I could but unfortunately was not able to have the time to share that with the kids. The homeschool curriculum (sp?) does not generally provide guidance in that respect. Long story short, smart kids, not so coordinated.

Bronco Yoda
09-17-2009, 01:31 AM
update: Went to my first homeschooling park day on Saturday. Then our first P.E. class on Monday. Since the Wife does most of the school work, I get the outdoors, athletic stuff, etc. 'Park day' is a once a week gathering of all homeschoolers in the area at a local park.

It was educational. Let's just say that all homeschoolers are not on the same path... Several of the many different homeschool meathods and curriculums were represented. You had the Eclectic Home Schooling Methoders, Classical, Charlotte Mason /Living Books, Alpha/ Omega/ Computer-Based online, Literature-Based, Notebook Home Schooling Method, Textbook-Based/Traditional School at Home Method, Self-Learning/Independent Study, Unit Study Method, ...etc, etc.

It reminded me of a gathering of clans.

I'd say the majority identify themselves in the Eclectic camp. After much quizing by many groups, the ladies decided that we were Tradition School with Classical online additions. I don't know. I just shrugged and smiled.

The 'unschoolers' crowd was interesting. The were the hippies of the bunch. A little strange but also among the nicest.

The wife enrolled our daughter in competitive gymnastics as the local academy. I'm not sure what the entire costs are. I guess I didn't need that extra kidney anyway...

gobroncos313
09-19-2009, 06:06 PM
QFT. The high school aged kids that I have come in contact with over the last 7-8 years are very introverted or just social retards. They have a hard time acclimating to the rest of their peers and, as a reault, get shunned or ignored. It's very sad to witness.

Like Uber & Moose said, a wide variety of social outlets is key to the development of their interpersonal skills. Good luck!

That is just about as far from the truth as one can get. Over the past 12 years I have worked with thousands of students K-12 from public school, private schools and home schooled. Far and away the best socialised are the home schoolers, yes there are exceptions, but they respect adults, authority, they relate better to students that are younger and older and are just outright more mature. You can check out sociological studies that have been conducted as well and they totally back up what I have noticed.

There is no doubt that homeschooling is the best option for children. Unfortunately most people can't home school for one reason or another. I would say mostly because they are way too materialistic but still there are many that have valid reasons.

Dean
09-20-2009, 10:22 AM
That is just about as far from the truth as one can get. Over the past 12 years I have worked with thousands of students K-12 from public school, private schools and home schooled. Far and away the best socialised are the home schoolers, yes there are exceptions, but they respect adults, authority, they relate better to students that are younger and older and are just outright more mature. You can check out sociological studies that have been conducted as well and they totally back up what I have noticed.

There is no doubt that homeschooling is the best option for children. Unfortunately most people can't home school for one reason or another. I would say mostly because they are way too materialistic but still there are many that have valid reasons.

How different our experiences have been!

I have taught and coached for 38 years. My subject areas are chemistry, physics, and I teach a junior college chemistry as well. Several home schooled students have enroled to pick up a laboratory class before college. With only a few exceptions, it has been disasterous on both the achedemic and social level. Most seem to want to interact but they don't have the social skills to be accepted even when placed in a group of relatively outgoing, nonjudgmental kids. Most have struggled in critical thinking skills but do better with regurgitating canned responses.

As a 30+ year football and track coach, very few have had the tenacity and grit to come out and stay out for either sport. When the contact and conditioning begin I get a note from mom that Johnny or Suzy has one reason or another why they can't do those things. Soon after they just don't come to practice any more.

It's sad. How will they fit in? How will they compete in the workplace?

I have some students that have done very well in the classroom but they are the exception and definitely not the rule.

SouthCarolinaBronco
09-20-2009, 10:32 PM
I was homeschooled. Went to college on an academic scholarship, went to law school afterwards, am now a successful practicing attorney. The idea that homeschooling robs children of socialization tools is faulty, in my opinion (and in my experience).

If you are considering homeschooling, you should probably give it a try. And don't feel any pressure to overteach, as some homeschoolers do. Send me a private message if you would like more input, I can give you some pointers as to what works and what doesn't.

fdf
10-20-2009, 08:09 PM
Well, things are going great with the Homeschooling for 2nd grade. We've managed to undo this summer most of the damage done by last years public school system. I still can't believe the meathods they teach nowdays. Freewriting with no regard to spelling (when they're just learning to spell) and unsupervised 'corners' to supposedly learn math and writing. Todays public school system is a joke.

I challenge every parent out there to spend a couple days observing your childs classroom and you'll see what I'm talking about.

We ordered the books that her school uses in order to make sure she gets what the lame school system would attempt to teach as a bare min....and then we purchased other material to advace her in every subject as well. I'm very impressed with the wifes curriculum plan and learning schedule. If only our teachers were this organized and committed.


My 2nd grader is now getting 3 times the learning, with a better teacher, more learning field trips, all in half the time and actually has more time to play with both her 'homeschool friends' and regular school neighbor friends.


And to think....this whole thing was my 2nd graders idea in the first place. And no she isn't slow or weird. Fact is she was the excel winner for her 1st grade (all classes) last year. I guess she's already learing to make good decisions on her own. I'm just glad we're in a position to do this for her. It certainly isn't easy.

Last Friday daughter and Mom spent the day at a couple art galleries for her field trip.

At first I was skeptical, until I learned about all the teaching material out there. I can't believe all the homeschoolers out there.

IMO, you're at a disadvantage going to the public schools now. It's bottom of the barrel now. Sadly, it's no longer what everyone does.... but rather what those who have no other options do. When did it become like this?

With all the Charter schools, private schools, home schooling as a norm now, public schools are left with the problem kids and underpaid, under qualified, over worked teachers. Not really a recipe for success if you ask me.

I can't believe that we settled for a smaller house so we could move into a good suburb with the best school in the area and still.... we ended up homeschooling.

The school system is broken in this country.

I'm glad to hear things are going well for you guys. We're in 5th grade now and it just keeps getting better.

Our boy has several friends in public school. In the past month or so, he's started mentally adding the hours his buddies spend in class and on homework and then subtracting the amount of time he has to spend and is getting a great big number. So last week, he suggested that an online college might be a great idea. :) I wasn't especially receptive to the idea. But he's now making a list of online colleges.

Who knows, maybe in 13 years, that's how college will be done.

Bronco Yoda
10-20-2009, 09:45 PM
The thing with public school is your with your peers doing the same things at the same time helps with social part. Home Schooling is neat but, its more like adult life where it could be days or weeks before you see anyone socially. If by chance your shy or reserved person it will be twice as difficult in workforce to come out of your shell because of being sheltered of homeschooling.

It's not like homeschoolers live in a cave NFL....lol

For example, our daughter is more active and has more friends now than before. In public school she had PE only ONE DAY A WEEK for 45 min. Now she's in Gymnastics once a week for 2 hours with 20 some other kids. In a P.E. class with around 40 other kids playing different sports for an hour and a half TWICE A WEEK and Swimming on the weekends.

See what I mean... She's getting like 10 times the interaction right here... and it's quality P.E. not the crap the public schools are doing.

And she still hangs out with her Public school friends after school and weekends. Our house is the local kids hangout.

Now I'm not saying all homeschoolers do this much. Fact is I've met some 'homeschoolers' that in my opinion are really even schooling... It's like anything in life, you get out what you put in...

Bronco Yoda
03-17-2010, 03:29 AM
Here's a site that all parents should check out.

Here's one of the sites my wife uses for the kids. The Thematic Units are really good.
http://www.schoolexpress.com