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Pony Boy
06-05-2009, 09:27 AM
Looks like Robert Ayers is stepping up and making an impact.

Other Rookies stepping it up.

Other rookies also are climbing the ladder. Running back Knowshon Moreno, the team’s other first-round pick, was behind LaMont Jordan and Correll Buckhalter on Wednesday. Second-round pick Alphonso Smith has been working behind No. 3 cornerback Jack Williams, a 2008 draftee. Another second-round pick, Darcel McBath, is working with the starters in some packages but is a long way from challenging veterans and starting safeties Brian Dawkins and Renaldo Hill.

http://coloradosportsdesk.com/wp/archives/2009/06/rookie-robert-ayers-getting-time-with-first-team/

Popps
06-05-2009, 09:39 AM
“I’ve been doing pretty good,” he said. “Right now that spot is Elvis’ and we’re battling for it.”

Wow. Well, he sounds confident. I wonder why we wouldn't try to get them both on the field at the same time? (Opposite sides)

Kaylore
06-05-2009, 09:43 AM
All the camps are about is to see how guys respond in different packages with different personnel so the coaching staff can see what works and what doesn't. This is just experimentation at this point and nothing more. The rubber meets the road when the pads comes on in August and then you'll see things really shift around. I really hope Ayers can contribute, and I think he'll have a chance to (our bad defensive line alone will allow this), but I would temper any enthusiasm until we see guys play with contact. Until then I wouldn't read too much into this right now.

BroncoBuff
06-05-2009, 09:47 AM
Relax everybody, they did the same thing with Jarvis couple years ago - stuck him in opposite Dumervil.

The Joker
06-05-2009, 09:47 AM
“I’ve been doing pretty good,” he said. “Right now that spot is Elvis’ and we’re battling for it.”

Wow. Well, he sounds confident. I wonder why we wouldn't try to get them both on the field at the same time? (Opposite sides)

I think that they probably will in obvious passing situations, I thought they'd try Ayers at SOLB opposite Elvis but apparently not for now.

What is the rest of the first team LB corp at the moment, anybody know?

vancejohnson82
06-05-2009, 09:48 AM
please dont compare Ayers to Moss......pretty please

I really hope they don't platoon Jordan and Moreno...I want to see Moreno get about 70% of the carries this year

BroncoBuff
06-05-2009, 09:51 AM
please dont compare Ayers to Moss......pretty please
Good point ... agreed.

Karenin
06-05-2009, 09:53 AM
please dont compare Ayers to Moss......pretty please

I really hope they don't platoon Jordan and Moreno...I want to see Moreno get about 70% of the carries this year

I really hope they do. I'd hope the Broncos aren't stupid enough to overuse Moreno and have him completely break down by the age of 29 like LT2.

vancejohnson82
06-05-2009, 09:57 AM
I really hope they do. I'd hope the Broncos aren't stupid enough to overuse Moreno and have him completely break down by the age of 29 like LT2.

I just havent enjoyed our system of plugging in backs the past few years...it makes for inconsistent football and I don't think it gets anyone into a rhythm...Hillis got into good form when we were playing him every down until hte injury...i just don't like the new "chic" system of RBBC

we used a first rounder on the guy for a reason lets use him

alkemical
06-05-2009, 10:07 AM
Looks like Robert Ayers is stepping up and making an impact.

Other Rookies stepping it up.

Other rookies also are climbing the ladder. Running back Knowshon Moreno, the team’s other first-round pick, was behind LaMont Jordan and Correll Buckhalter on Wednesday. Second-round pick Alphonso Smith has been working behind No. 3 cornerback Jack Williams, a 2008 draftee. Another second-round pick, Darcel McBath, is working with the starters in some packages but is a long way from challenging veterans and starting safeties Brian Dawkins and Renaldo Hill.

http://coloradosportsdesk.com/wp/archives/2009/06/rookie-robert-ayers-getting-time-with-first-team/



Isn't Elvis out for "personal" reasons?

gyldenlove
06-05-2009, 10:27 AM
Isn't Elvis out for "personal" reasons?

He came back on Wednesday I thought.

montrose
06-05-2009, 10:29 AM
I'd prefer if Elvis isn't a starter and saved for 3rd downs. He won't wear down that way and I imagine his production will go up with the decreased reps. How about a 3rd down 4-man DL (which Nolan used in SF) of Doom and Moss at DE with Reid and Ayers at DT?

Gcver2ver3
06-05-2009, 10:39 AM
I really hope they do. I'd hope the Broncos aren't stupid enough to overuse Moreno and have him completely break down by the age of 29 like LT2.

if Moreno has half the career LT had then i'm all for it...over use him...

footstepsfrom#27
06-05-2009, 10:41 AM
I'd prefer if Elvis isn't a starter and saved for 3rd downs. He won't wear down that way and I imagine his production will go up with the decreased reps. How about a 3rd down 4-man DL (which Nolan used in SF) of Doom and Moss at DE with Reid and Ayers at DT?
Elvis is supposedly an OLB now...why would he wear down? He's 260 pounds, plenty big enough for that spot.

azbroncfan
06-05-2009, 11:02 AM
No pads so all this is just trying out different things and means nothing as far as depth chart goes.

Popps
06-05-2009, 11:03 AM
I'd prefer if Elvis isn't a starter and saved for 3rd downs.

I don't think he'll wear down as a LB. The problem was, we had him taking on 320 LB LT's on every play, last season. That was just silly.

I think he's going to be free to run around and use his speed and instincts, now... and yet will still have enough experience taking on blockers that it should really help him.

That said, I think all of our guys will be seeing a decent amount of rotation... but I think Dumervil is a great example of a guy who will be helped immensely with this switch to the 3-4.

montrose
06-05-2009, 12:30 PM
Elvis is supposedly an OLB now...why would he wear down? He's 260 pounds, plenty big enough for that spot.

I don't think he'll wear down as a LB. The problem was, we had him taking on 320 LB LT's on every play, last season. That was just silly.

I think he's going to be free to run around and use his speed and instincts, now... and yet will still have enough experience taking on blockers that it should really help him.

That said, I think all of our guys will be seeing a decent amount of rotation... but I think Dumervil is a great example of a guy who will be helped immensely with this switch to the 3-4.

I dunno guys, I'm just not as optimistic that Elvis will make a great transition to OLB - and at the same time I think he would be near dominant in an exclusive 3rd down pass-rushing role. In studying Elvis, I came to a few conclusions as to why I feel this way:

1) He's a guy who heavily relies on beating blockers off the ball by exploding out of a very "heavy" 3-point stance. By heavy, I mean Elvis puts a great deal of weight on his hand (which could certainly lend credence to the theory that the hand injury effected him last season) and within his first 1-1.5 steps you can tell if he'll win or be beaten on a play. If he comes out of his stance a little slow, stands up too much or even slightly hesitates - it's over. This is the primary reason I'm cautious as to how he'll convert to playing out of a stand up, 2-point stance.

2) When I speak of wearing down, I'm not so much relating to his weight (now). Only Jim Bates and Bob Slowik were dumb enough to march him out there as an everydown DE at his size. In the present sense, I'm concerned more about conditioning for his skill set. The more snaps Elvis plays, like any player, the more fatigued he becomes. Throw in that at OLB he'll be asked to cover more in space and it's not the greatest recipe for a pass rusher who relies so much on burst off the ball.

3) There are few redeemable qualities to playing him on 1st and 2nd downs. He has little experience in coverage and those times haven't been too pretty. Last season, he struggled a great deal keeping outside contain (Moss of all people was our best DE at this). Finally, Elvis isn't the world's greatest tackler, he's not a bad one but certainly not of a good LB's caliber. Now do I think Elvis could get to the point where he respectable in these areas? Sure. But I don't see the point in taking away from a great 3rd down pass-rusher by putting him in extra situations at the chance a team passes on 1st or 2nd down - and even then I've already established my concerns about his ability to rush the passer from a stand-up 2 point stance.

I just think Elvis could be so valuable as a 3rd down rusher that I wouldn't waste his time on 1st and 2nd downs where I wouldn't be surprised if Moss, Ayers or even Boss Bailey couldn't be as (or more) productive. I'd love for Elvis to develop into James Harrison, but I have my doubts. I do think that if used the way he was by Larry Coyer during his rookie season, he can post close to 15 sacks. He's that good of a natural pass rusher if he's fresh.

BroncoMan4ever
06-05-2009, 12:40 PM
“I’ve been doing pretty good,” he said. “Right now that spot is Elvis’ and we’re battling for it.”

Wow. Well, he sounds confident. I wonder why we wouldn't try to get them both on the field at the same time? (Opposite sides)

that's what i thought they were doing. Doom as the rush OLB and Ayers as the strong side OLB. sort of Doom as the Terrell Suggs and Ayers as the Adalius Thomas from the Ravens defense a few seasons ago.

Popps
06-05-2009, 12:44 PM
that's what i thought they were doing. Doom as the rush OLB and Ayers as the strong side OLB. sort of Doom as the Terrell Suggs and Ayers as the Adalius Thomas from the Ravens defense a few seasons ago.

Yea, I just thought it was odd that Ayers referred to Dumervil as his "competition" for the job.

Punisher
06-05-2009, 01:03 PM
The Defense is looking pretty good,beside that NT spot.....

vancejohnson82
06-05-2009, 01:14 PM
The Defense is looking pretty good,beside that NT spot.....

with the 3-4 we really don't need a nose tackle :pigsfly:

Punisher
06-05-2009, 01:16 PM
with the 3-4 we really don't need a nose tackle :pigsfly:

Yea but it wouldn't hurt to have a Big NT run stopper...

TheReverend
06-05-2009, 02:28 PM
Really solid post, want to address a couple things quick:

I dunno guys, I'm just not as optimistic that Elvis will make a great transition to OLB - and at the same time I think he would be near dominant in an exclusive 3rd down pass-rushing role. In studying Elvis, I came to a few conclusions as to why I feel this way:

1) He's a guy who heavily relies on beating blockers off the ball by exploding out of a very "heavy" 3-point stance. By heavy, I mean Elvis puts a great deal of weight on his hand (which could certainly lend credence to the theory that the hand injury effected him last season) and within his first 1-1.5 steps you can tell if he'll win or be beaten on a play. If he comes out of his stance a little slow, stands up too much or even slightly hesitates - it's over. This is the primary reason I'm cautious as to how he'll convert to playing out of a stand up, 2-point stance.

Haven't noticed any leaning in the three point, personally. Will definitely take a closer look at that specifically next chance I get. That would explain many, many problems.

2) When I speak of wearing down, I'm not so much relating to his weight (now). Only Jim Bates and Bob Slowik were dumb enough to march him out there as an everydown DE at his size. In the present sense, I'm concerned more about conditioning for his skill set. The more snaps Elvis plays, like any player, the more fatigued he becomes. Throw in that at OLB he'll be asked to cover more in space and it's not the greatest recipe for a pass rusher who relies so much on burst off the ball.

He's a prototypical skill-set for Bates game. Attacking the 9s and rushing the edge every play. C gaps get covered by the OLB taking on the outside shoulder of lead blocker to push the ball carrier further inside to DJ. It's why every MLB in that scheme has inflated numbers.

I'll certainly agree that didn't translate to Slowik's system, or lack thereof.

BroncoMan4ever
06-05-2009, 03:09 PM
The Defense is looking pretty good,beside that NT spot.....

i think Fields is going to surprise some people. i am not saying he is going to play like Wilfork, but i think he will be ok. also, Chris Baker is a dude who is really interesting that i would not be surprised seeing getting a lot of rotational reps by the middle of the season.

i think we are going to actually be ok on the line this year. at the worst we are still upgraded over last season

KipCorrington25
06-05-2009, 06:27 PM
Moss sucks.

BroncoBuff
06-05-2009, 06:36 PM
Damn, montrose ... good stuff.

FireFly
06-05-2009, 07:46 PM
Stupid question, is Crowder still on the team?

~Crash~
06-05-2009, 08:20 PM
Good point ... agreed.

yep I agree moss actually did something in college...ROFL!

Pony Boy
06-05-2009, 08:25 PM
Damn, montrose ... good stuff.

I'll drink to that :thumbs:

Punisher
06-05-2009, 08:29 PM
Stupid question, is Crowder still on the team?

Yea hes still on the roster.

Pat Bowlen
06-05-2009, 08:33 PM
I don't know if it's been officially announced yet, but I have hired Punisher as the official Roster Information Keeper.

Punisher
06-05-2009, 08:40 PM
I don't know if it's been officially announced yet, but I have hired Punisher as the official Roster Information Keeper.

Holy Crap! I GOT A JOB

FireFly
06-05-2009, 08:46 PM
Yea hes still on the roster.

Well, given that he's still on the roster I'd be interested in hearing how he's progressing (if he is). Where he's playing, what team he's running with etc.

I suppose the same applies for Moss. While most have given up on both of them, I'd still like to hear something more definitive about whether our fears have been confirmed or whether the new system fits better.

Punisher
06-05-2009, 08:54 PM
Well, given that he's still on the roster I'd be interested in hearing how he's progressing (if he is). Where he's playing, what team he's running with etc.

I suppose the same applies for Moss. While most have given up on both of them, I'd still like to hear something more definitive about whether our fears have been confirmed or whether the new system fits better.

I'm pretty sure you'll see Moss and Tim.C in rotation with the starting DE/OLBs when the season starts.

montrose
06-05-2009, 08:56 PM
Stupid question, is Crowder still on the team?

He is still on the roster and has been practicing as a OLB/DE Hybrid.