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View Full Version : broncos moves easy to question - clayton.


kamakazi_kal
06-01-2009, 10:27 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=4220784

"If Orton doesn't start after the Broncos gave up Cutler to get him, that's the first major demerit. Mike Shanahan was fired because of his decisions as a general manager, not his play calling. I'm still looking for the feeling that they have a plan."


but ahh .... we got orton ....stupid clayton. (cherrypicking at it's finest) :egbgb:

SoDak Bronco
06-01-2009, 10:31 AM
off-season sucks even for tales from the crypt clayton

BMarsh615
06-01-2009, 10:34 AM
Yeah, we traded Cutler straight up for Kyle Orton.:rofl:

I hope Clayton and Mort both get canned once Schefter takes over.

SouthStndJunkie
06-01-2009, 10:36 AM
Yeah, we traded Cutler straight up for Kyle Orton.:rofl:

I hope Clayton and Mort both get canned once Schefter takes over.

No....but his point is valid.

We passed up on better trade offers for Cutler because McDaniels wanted Kyle Orton.

BMarsh615
06-01-2009, 10:39 AM
No....but his point is valid.

We passed up on better trade offers for Cutler because McDaniels wanted Kyle Orton.

I don't know that we got offered something better. McDaniels said he wanted 2 first round picks. We pretty much chose Kyle Orton over Jason Campbell, Kellen Clemens, and whoever Tampa Bay had.

SonOfLe-loLang
06-01-2009, 10:40 AM
He definitely has a point, but this assumes that the Broncos were always hellbent on trading Cutler, which I dont think is the case. I sincerely believe Cutler would still be a bronco if he just called Bowlen back. To say that they don't have a plan is still a little dramatic.

SonOfLe-loLang
06-01-2009, 10:41 AM
I don't know that we got offered something better. McDaniels said he wanted 2 first round picks. We pretty much chose Kyle Orton over Jason Campbell, Kellen Clemens, and whoever Tampa Bay had.

Yeah, but the washington offer was better in that they were higher picks.

Beantown Bronco
06-01-2009, 10:43 AM
Yeah, but the washington offer was better in that they were higher picks.

Just means they would've paid more money for the same players most likely.

SoDak Bronco
06-01-2009, 10:50 AM
We are talking about May Mini-Camp..It doesn't mean Simms is going to win the job, Clayton is a dbag.

BroncoInSkinland
06-01-2009, 10:52 AM
He definitely has a point, but this assumes that the Broncos were always hellbent on trading Cutler, which I dont think is the case. I sincerely believe Cutler would still be a bronco if he just called Bowlen back. To say that they don't have a plan is still a little dramatic.

I agree, I think McDaniels definately has a plan. The number of FA RB's combined with the Moreno pick, and retaining Turner and Dennison lead me to believe not only does he want to employ the ZBS, but he wants to make it the focus of the offense, or at least a very important part.

The FA signings plus drafting heavy at both S and CB indicates he (or by proxy Nolan through him) believe that the backfield was a major part of the defenses problem last year, and that they intended to right that part of the ship first on the defensive side.

At QB he may not have his finalized plan, but with two ball control game managers fighting for the position he at the very least has an idea of what he wants, if not the final solution. (edited addition: Looking at other QB's he was rumored to be interested in, Campbell, Quinn, Cassle, it quickly becomes obvious he is looking for a ball protection QB, not a gunslinger - probably one of the major stumbling blocks in the Cutler situation. He definately has a plan, maybe not executed exactly as he wanted, but it is there.)

High character FA's, draftees, and UDFA's indicate attitude is more important to him than raw physical ability at least at this phase.

Bringing in players familiar with the scheme at NE indicate he will be incorporating some of that system as well, and that he has an organized thought process on how to implement this quickly and efficiently.

To say that McDaniels doesn't have a plan is ludicrous. To not agree with some (or many) elements of that plan is a different story.

dbfan21
06-01-2009, 11:03 AM
Just means they would've paid more money for the same players most likely.

Excellent point there.

The bottom line is that, to the average fan, Clayton makes the Broncos look stupid. Straight-up trade (Cutler for Orton) as opposed of getting two firsts and a third in addition to the QB swap.

What he didn't talk about is how we have upgraded our running game, improved upon our TE and WR situation, added veteran leadership and talent on the defensive side of the ball...but most of all, brought in high-character, hard-working football players to compete for a roster spot.

I am starting to sip the McDaniels Kool Aid some because I like the intensity and pace he sets in practice, the importance he places on finding quality guys and his mindset on "Team First"...as opposed to "Me First".

SonOfLe-loLang
06-01-2009, 11:06 AM
Just means they would've paid more money for the same players most likely.

Good point...the first round picks probably would have been the same.

SouthStndJunkie
06-01-2009, 11:30 AM
Just means they would've paid more money for the same players most likely.

The point is that Kyle Orton was the player that sealed the deal and separated itself from the others.

If Washington would have had Kyle Orton and offered the same deal, then Denver would have accepted that deal.

Denver would have liked to have picked back to back at 12 and 13 (the Skins pick).

You act as if Denver turned down the Redskins because their draft picks were too high.

Hercules Rockefeller
06-01-2009, 11:34 AM
No....but his point is valid.

We passed up on better trade offers for Cutler because McDaniels wanted Kyle Orton.

and what were those offers exactly?

The only other team that the Post said had 2 1sts on the table was the Skins, and they along with the Jets and Bucs could offer nothing more than draft choices. Cleveland was in it, but they backed out because they didn't want to deal with Cutler's perceived pouty nature and it's never been reported (AFAIK) what their offer was exactly.

McDaniels wanted either Orton or Quinn.

Beantown Bronco
06-01-2009, 11:35 AM
You act as if Denver turned down the Redskins because their draft picks were too high.

Nope. I think you're misinterpreting my post or taking it out of context.

I'm not saying that they wouldn't have possibly preferred securing the higher picks before the draft. I'm saying that, most likely, they still would've probably picked the same guys at 12 and 13 that they would've at 12 and 18. If you read the post draft quotes again, then it is a logical conclusion to make.....unless you thing McDaniels is a liar. According to him, they got "the guys they had targeted" all along.

BroncoInSkinland
06-01-2009, 11:40 AM
and what were those offers exactly?

The only other team that the Post said had 2 1sts on the table was the Skins, and they along with the Jets and Bucs could offer nothing more than draft choices. Cleveland was in it, but they backed out because they didn't want to deal with Cutler's perceived pouty nature and it's never been reported (AFAIK) what their offer was exactly.

McDaniels wanted either Orton or Quinn.

Unsubstantiated rumors of Quinn, Shaun Rogers, and a single first round pick for Cutler plagued the Browns board I am registered on. Nothing at all solid behind that though, and other rumors (with us giving a pick in addition to Cutler for Quinn and Rogers) were there as well, just none as frequent.

DenverBrit
06-01-2009, 11:41 AM
Clayton not like Broncos offseason.


http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j74/kasey_11/mekon.jpg

TheReverend
06-01-2009, 11:42 AM
Nope. I think you're misinterpreting my post or taking it out of context.

I'm not saying that they wouldn't have possibly preferred securing the higher picks before the draft. I'm saying that, most likely, they still would've probably picked the same guys at 12 and 13 that they would've at 12 and 18. If you read the post draft quotes again, then it is a logical conclusion to make.....unless you thing McDaniels is a liar. According to him, they got "the guys they had targeted" all along.

It's interesting, but I'm not sure it flies. Cleveland showed you could move down the draft board all day in this past weak draft class. 13 to 17 or 18 gives Denver another late 2nd/early 3rd in which case, you have ammo to move up in the 2nd for Smith without blowing next years pick, or you just use that extra pick on Quinn.

Dudeskey
06-01-2009, 11:43 AM
Another prognosticator ejaculating prematurely? Imagine my shock...™

lostknight
06-01-2009, 12:16 PM
Dar Fuhrer must not be questioned. He has a plan, and only he can guide the Broncos to the Superbowl.

Until McDaniels's wins games, he is what he is - a rookie head coach that has made many many decisions that make everyone in the league scratch their head wondering WTF the Broncos are doing.

Pseudofool
06-01-2009, 12:28 PM
If Simms comes in and plays much better than anyone expected, how is that a strike against McD? The assumption is that it's Orton's bad play that leads to Simms starting. When clearly it would be Simms good play that would lead to him starting.

Clayton has a vested interest in McD not working out for the Broncos, as this has been his meme all offseason--he'll ride it out until the Broncos wins shut him up.

SouthStndJunkie
06-01-2009, 12:30 PM
and what were those offers exactly?

The only other team that the Post said had 2 1sts on the table was the Skins, and they along with the Jets and Bucs could offer nothing more than draft choices. Cleveland was in it, but they backed out because they didn't want to deal with Cutler's perceived pouty nature and it's never been reported (AFAIK) what their offer was exactly.

McDaniels wanted either Orton or Quinn.

I don't know the specifics....I know the Skins offer was on par with Chicago's.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/04/05/trade/index.html

The key to the trade was Kyle Orton. Laugh if you want, but it's the absolute truth. McDaniels looked hard at tape of the available quarterbacks from teams that made serious offers, players like Orton, Washington's Jason Campbell and Tampa Bay's Luke McCown. Every one of those teams was in the ballpark with an offer of at least two first-round draft picks and a quarterback.

But as the deal went down, McDaniels, who watched every offensive snap of more than 10 Bears games with Orton playing, got more and more impressed with Orton's arm, his decision-making and his ability to extend plays when the pocket broke down. You can think and I can think it's crazy he didn't like Campbell -- who got Washington off to a 6-2 start last year -- more than he liked Orton, but it's the unvarnished truth. McDaniels thinks he can win with Orton.

SouthStndJunkie
06-01-2009, 12:34 PM
Nope. I think you're misinterpreting my post or taking it out of context.

I'm not saying that they wouldn't have possibly preferred securing the higher picks before the draft. I'm saying that, most likely, they still would've probably picked the same guys at 12 and 13 that they would've at 12 and 18. If you read the post draft quotes again, then it is a logical conclusion to make.....unless you thing McDaniels is a liar. According to him, they got "the guys they had targeted" all along.

Coaches/GMs usually do not admit they did not get a guy they had targeted in the draft.

They want you to think they are brilliant and everything went according to their plan.

Hercules Rockefeller
06-01-2009, 01:13 PM
Unsubstantiated rumors of Quinn, Shaun Rogers, and a single first round pick for Cutler plagued the Browns board I am registered on. Nothing at all solid behind that though, and other rumors (with us giving a pick in addition to Cutler for Quinn and Rogers) were there as well, just none as frequent.

I could care less what rumors a message board came up with, I'm talking about real reported rumors.

Their "rumors" lose any credibility when they think Rogers and Quinn would require Cutler +.

Hercules Rockefeller
06-01-2009, 01:16 PM
I don't know the specifics....I know the Skins offer was on par with Chicago's.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/04/05/trade/index.html

The key to the trade was Kyle Orton. Laugh if you want, but it's the absolute truth. McDaniels looked hard at tape of the available quarterbacks from teams that made serious offers, players like Orton, Washington's Jason Campbell and Tampa Bay's Luke McCown. Every one of those teams was in the ballpark with an offer of at least two first-round draft picks and a quarterback.

But as the deal went down, McDaniels, who watched every offensive snap of more than 10 Bears games with Orton playing, got more and more impressed with Orton's arm, his decision-making and his ability to extend plays when the pocket broke down. You can think and I can think it's crazy he didn't like Campbell -- who got Washington off to a 6-2 start last year -- more than he liked Orton, but it's the unvarnished truth. McDaniels thinks he can win with Orton.

No one wanted Campbell and McCown blows. Denver didn't, and the Skins couldn't find anyone they could flip him to for a draft pick either. So no, the Skins offer was not on par with the Bears. King didn't seem to realize that when he wrote this way back when, Denver wasn't the only team that didn't want him.

kamakazi_kal
06-01-2009, 01:17 PM
I could care less what rumors a message board came up with, I'm talking about real reported rumors.

wait ...... what?

lex
06-01-2009, 01:18 PM
I agree, I think McDaniels definately has a plan. The number of FA RB's combined with the Moreno pick, and retaining Turner and Dennison lead me to believe not only does he want to employ the ZBS, but he wants to make it the focus of the offense, or at least a very important part.
The FA signings plus drafting heavy at both S and CB indicates he (or by proxy Nolan through him) believe that the backfield was a major part of the defenses problem last year, and that they intended to right that part of the ship first on the defensive side.

At QB he may not have his finalized plan, but with two ball control game managers fighting for the position he at the very least has an idea of what he wants, if not the final solution. (edited addition: Looking at other QB's he was rumored to be interested in, Campbell, Quinn, Cassle, it quickly becomes obvious he is looking for a ball protection QB, not a gunslinger - probably one of the major stumbling blocks in the Cutler situation. He definately has a plan, maybe not executed exactly as he wanted, but it is there.)

High character FA's, draftees, and UDFA's indicate attitude is more important to him than raw physical ability at least at this phase.

Bringing in players familiar with the scheme at NE indicate he will be incorporating some of that system as well, and that he has an organized thought process on how to implement this quickly and efficiently.

To say that McDaniels doesn't have a plan is ludicrous. To not agree with some (or many) elements of that plan is a different story.

This is my hope and one of the few strands of hope that I hold on to. And I really hope its not that mickey mouse SG stuff either.

Hercules Rockefeller
06-01-2009, 01:19 PM
wait ...... what?

Real reported rumors, like ESPN that reported that the Lions had offered the 1st overall, or the Post saying that the Jets, Skins, and Bucs could only offer picks because they didn't have a QB wanted.

Not this message board bull**** that people take as rumors when people are speculating and throwing crap up agains the wall.

lex
06-01-2009, 01:24 PM
Real reported rumors, like ESPN that reported that the Lions had offered the 1st overall, or the Post saying that the Jets, Skins, and Bucs could only offer picks because they didn't have a QB wanted.

Not this message board bull**** that people take as rumors when people are speculating and throwing crap up agains the wall.

Actually, a better example was when E!SPN reported that Denver traded up to #10 to draft Patrick Willis on the friday morning before that years draft. They reported that as fact.

Kaylore
06-01-2009, 01:25 PM
I love the idea that from a snippet taken from some reporters that Orton and Simms are in "fierce competition" for the starting spot. Let me tell you right now that Orton will be the guy. This reminds me of when BVP was the second QB all through the mini camps and the first week of training camp the first year Cutler was drafted. There were CSU homers who really thought it was a tough competition and that BVP was making Cutler earn it.

Natedogg
06-01-2009, 01:28 PM
http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/6757/cgiiw4.png
http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/watchdog/blog/john_clayton.jpg

Br0nc0Buster
06-01-2009, 01:40 PM
http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/6757/cgiiw4.png
http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/watchdog/blog/john_clayton.jpg

Actually did you ever watch Tales from the Crypt?
That is who he looks like

gyldenlove
06-01-2009, 01:41 PM
I love the idea that from a snippet taken from some reporters that Orton and Simms are in "fierce competition" for the starting spot. Let me tell you right now that Orton will be the guy. This reminds me of when BVP was the second QB all through the mini camps and the first week of training camp the first year Cutler was drafted. There were CSU homers who really thought it was a tough competition and that BVP was making Cutler earn it.

I haven't agreed a lot with you lately, but I think you are spot on here. Both Simms and Orton are learning the offense and learning to play with their supporting cast so it makes sense to prepare both players. Orton is clearly better fit to play than Simms is, if for not other reason than the fact that he HAS played in the last 3 years, when it comes time for going to game speed that will mean a lot.

Gcver2ver3
06-01-2009, 01:55 PM
I love the idea that from a snippet taken from some reporters that Orton and Simms are in "fierce competition" for the starting spot. Let me tell you right now that Orton will be the guy. This reminds me of when BVP was the second QB all through the mini camps and the first week of training camp the first year Cutler was drafted. There were CSU homers who really thought it was a tough competition and that BVP was making Cutler earn it.


someone who gets it...

SoDak Bronco
06-01-2009, 01:59 PM
http://idolator.com/assets/resources/2008/05/tales%20from%20the%20crypt.jpg

With Inside the Huddle..I'm John Clayton

BroncoInSkinland
06-01-2009, 03:07 PM
Real reported rumors, like ESPN that reported that the Lions had offered the 1st overall, or the Post saying that the Jets, Skins, and Bucs could only offer picks because they didn't have a QB wanted.

Not this message board bull**** that people take as rumors when people are speculating and throwing crap up agains the wall.

That is precisely why i said unsubstantiated. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough for you.

DBroncos4life
06-01-2009, 03:11 PM
http://idolator.com/assets/resources/2008/05/tales%20from%20the%20crypt.jpg

With Inside the Huddle..I'm John Clayton

even dead the Crypt Keeper grows more hair then John.

Hercules Rockefeller
06-01-2009, 03:26 PM
That is precisely why i said unsubstantiated. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough for you.

You were clear, my point is that people making **** up on a message board is not an unsubstantiated rumor. It's people making **** up.

BroncoInSkinland
06-01-2009, 03:34 PM
You were clear, my point is that people making **** up on a message board is not an unsubstantiated rumor. It's people making **** up.

There were some Local Cleveland papers speculating as well, I could track it down if you want, but not really worth it, still no ESPiN or other "reliable" sources. It was a little deeper than people making **** up though, that is why I brought it up.

NYBronco
06-01-2009, 06:26 PM
Denver's an easy target right now with all the drama in the organization after missing the playoffs with only needing one win in the last three games. Until McDaniels starts putting his players on the field and performing under his system all these nonbelievers will easily speak their minds.

I believe McDaniels has a plan and it will show itself sooner then most expect.

Hamrob
06-01-2009, 06:35 PM
I'd say that Clayton's take is fair. You don't become a new head coach, trade the franchize QB, ignore the biggest weakness (Dline) and think you're not going to be questioned.

It's up to Mcdaniels to show everyone that he really did have a plan and that he knows how to coach up a winner. Until that happens...he will be criticized. At least Clayton left it at saying he's pestimistic.

Rock Chalk
06-01-2009, 06:59 PM
I'd say that Clayton's take is fair. You don't become a new head coach, trade the franchize QB, ignore the biggest weakness (Dline) and think you're not going to be questioned.

It's up to Mcdaniels to show everyone that he really did have a plan and that he knows how to coach up a winner. Until that happens...he will be criticized. At least Clayton left it at saying he's pestimistic.

MCDANIELS DID NOT ****ING TRADE CUTLER.

Bowlen did.

You ****ing people are morons.

The Baby didnt answer the phone when BIG DADDY called and BIG DADDY TOLD MCDANIELS TO ****ING TRADE HIM.

MCDANIELS WAS TRYING TO KEEP CUTLER.

****ing idiots.

TonyR
06-01-2009, 07:03 PM
MCDANIELS DID NOT ****ING TRADE CUTLER.

Bowlen did.

You ****ing people are morons.

The Baby didnt answer the phone when BIG DADDY called and BIG DADDY TOLD MCDANIELS TO ****ING TRADE HIM.

MCDANIELS WAS TRYING TO KEEP CUTLER.

****ing idiots.

True. All of it. But you can only lead the horse to water.

Bronx33
06-01-2009, 07:06 PM
MCDANIELS DID NOT ****ING TRADE CUTLER.

Bowlen did.

You ****ing people are morons.

The Baby didnt answer the phone when BIG DADDY called and BIG DADDY TOLD MCDANIELS TO ****ING TRADE HIM.

MCDANIELS WAS TRYING TO KEEP CUTLER.

****ing idiots.


facts are facts...

Br0nc0Buster
06-01-2009, 07:43 PM
John Clayton is a moron when it comes to predictions

He picked the Raiders to go to the playoffs last year

OABB
06-01-2009, 07:47 PM
24317

uplink
06-01-2009, 07:48 PM
Well if Clayton didn't like the draft picks I guess he missed the
pledge... the turn... the prestige.... analogy milehighreport post

http://www.milehighreport.com/2009/4/27/855605/mhr-university-special-report-a

cutthemdown
06-01-2009, 08:09 PM
I agree, I think McDaniels definately has a plan. The number of FA RB's combined with the Moreno pick, and retaining Turner and Dennison lead me to believe not only does he want to employ the ZBS, but he wants to make it the focus of the offense, or at least a very important part.

The FA signings plus drafting heavy at both S and CB indicates he (or by proxy Nolan through him) believe that the backfield was a major part of the defenses problem last year, and that they intended to right that part of the ship first on the defensive side.

At QB he may not have his finalized plan, but with two ball control game managers fighting for the position he at the very least has an idea of what he wants, if not the final solution. (edited addition: Looking at other QB's he was rumored to be interested in, Campbell, Quinn, Cassle, it quickly becomes obvious he is looking for a ball protection QB, not a gunslinger - probably one of the major stumbling blocks in the Cutler situation. He definately has a plan, maybe not executed exactly as he wanted, but it is there.)

High character FA's, draftees, and UDFA's indicate attitude is more important to him than raw physical ability at least at this phase.

Bringing in players familiar with the scheme at NE indicate he will be incorporating some of that system as well, and that he has an organized thought process on how to implement this quickly and efficiently.

To say that McDaniels doesn't have a plan is ludicrous. To not agree with some (or many) elements of that plan is a different story.

People forget when we won Superbowls Elway avg about what 250 yrds a game? Maybe even less. Broncos won by controlling the ball by running it down peoples throats. That kept defense fresh and fast and they were able to blitz there way to just enough stops we won a lot of games.

Running the ball, playing some better defense and special teams, could put Denver in a spot to win plenty of games even with an avg qb.

uplink
06-01-2009, 08:36 PM
This guy left acting and got a Ph.D in History (took ~8 years I think) and now he hosts shows on the History Channel.

Dudeskey
06-02-2009, 01:13 AM
http://idolator.com/assets/resources/2008/05/tales%20from%20the%20crypt.jpg

With Inside the Huddle..I'm John Clayton
John Clayton's skin isn't quite there yet... However:
http://sports.espn.go.com/photo/2008/0318/nfl_g_davis_300.jpg

FireFly
06-02-2009, 01:20 AM
To say that he doesn't have a plan is just plain wrong to me.

In fact ,to the contrary every move this offseason seems to be in line with a plan. It might not be a plan that we all endorse, but every move I've seen of note has been an attempt to transition us to a game management ball control offense and a blue collar (hard working) defence.

cutthemdown
06-02-2009, 01:31 AM
Clayton is weak because it donesn't take a genius to pick Broncos for having some trouble. New coach, new qb, new defense, new rb.

He's just jumping on the bandwagon. There have already been like 4-5 analysts report they don't understand Broncos moves.

GreatBronco16
06-02-2009, 02:53 AM
There have already been like 4-5 analysts report they don't understand Broncos moves.


And this is why they are analysts and not the ones making the calls in football operations.

Hulamau
06-02-2009, 07:33 AM
I agree, I think McDaniels definately has a plan. The number of FA RB's combined with the Moreno pick, and retaining Turner and Dennison lead me to believe not only does he want to employ the ZBS, but he wants to make it the focus of the offense, or at least a very important part.

The FA signings plus drafting heavy at both S and CB indicates he (or by proxy Nolan through him) believe that the backfield was a major part of the defenses problem last year, and that they intended to right that part of the ship first on the defensive side.

At QB he may not have his finalized plan, but with two ball control game managers fighting for the position he at the very least has an idea of what he wants, if not the final solution. (edited addition: Looking at other QB's he was rumored to be interested in, Campbell, Quinn, Cassle, it quickly becomes obvious he is looking for a ball protection QB, not a gunslinger - probably one of the major stumbling blocks in the Cutler situation. He definately has a plan, maybe not executed exactly as he wanted, but it is there.)

High character FA's, draftees, and UDFA's indicate attitude is more important to him than raw physical ability at least at this phase.

Bringing in players familiar with the scheme at NE indicate he will be incorporating some of that system as well, and that he has an organized thought process on how to implement this quickly and efficiently.

To say that McDaniels doesn't have a plan is ludicrous. To not agree with some (or many) elements of that plan is a different story.

Good post BinSkinville, Clayton is a perfect example of a 'coach' who has gotten stale and stayed too long with his current 'team' ... ESPN. Not to mention he is kissin' cousins with Bus Cook who is either first or second among Clayton's Rolodex sources.

Completely shallow and moronic statement the McD 'chose' Orton in favor of Baby Jay. Typical meaningless Clayton comment trying to dig up and manufacture a 'QB controversy where there isnt any!

fdf
06-02-2009, 10:03 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=4220784

"If Orton doesn't start after the Broncos gave up Cutler to get him, that's the first major demerit. Mike Shanahan was fired because of his decisions as a general manager, not his play calling. I'm still looking for the feeling that they have a plan."


but ahh .... we got orton ....stupid clayton. (cherrypicking at it's finest) :egbgb:

All I care is that it goes to the better of the two. Clayton is completely wrong.

kamakazi_kal
06-03-2009, 07:48 AM
another blurb from clayton ....... I didn't figure it needed it's own thread.

Denver Broncos: Maybe it's me, but I don't buy the idea that Simms is making a serious run at Orton's starting job. This isn't a knock on Simms. It would be more of a knock on coach Josh McDaniels if it happens. Orton was McDaniels' handpicked replacement for Jay Cutler, who is more talented than Orton. If Orton loses his job to a left-handed quarterback, the move would devalue the 2008 growth of the offensive line. Ryan Clady established himself as one of the league's best young left tackles in 2008. If Simms wins the job, Clady would either have to switch positions to protect Simms' blindside or be a less valuable blocker at left tackle. Advantage, Orton.

vancejohnson82
06-03-2009, 07:55 AM
another blurb from clayton ....... I didn't figure it needed it's own thread.

Denver Broncos: Maybe it's me, but I don't buy the idea that Simms is making a serious run at Orton's starting job. This isn't a knock on Simms. It would be more of a knock on coach Josh McDaniels if it happens. Orton was McDaniels' handpicked replacement for Jay Cutler, who is more talented than Orton. If Orton loses his job to a left-handed quarterback, the move would devalue the 2008 growth of the offensive line. Ryan Clady established himself as one of the league's best young left tackles in 2008. If Simms wins the job, Clady would either have to switch positions to protect Simms' blindside or be a less valuable blocker at left tackle. Advantage, Orton.

see, this is where I don't understand what Clayton is talking about

we havent even put on the pads yet and he is saying we have some sort of controversey going on...I believe Orton isnt etched in stone at the #1 QB spot but he certainly has his name written there in permanent marker

Tombstone RJ
06-03-2009, 11:08 AM
another blurb from clayton ....... I didn't figure it needed it's own thread.

Denver Broncos: Maybe it's me, but I don't buy the idea that Simms is making a serious run at Orton's starting job. This isn't a knock on Simms. It would be more of a knock on coach Josh McDaniels if it happens. Orton was McDaniels' handpicked replacement for Jay Cutler, who is more talented than Orton. If Orton loses his job to a left-handed quarterback, the move would devalue the 2008 growth of the offensive line. Ryan Clady established himself as one of the league's best young left tackles in 2008. If Simms wins the job, Clady would either have to switch positions to protect Simms' blindside or be a less valuable blocker at left tackle. Advantage, Orton.

Doesn't this contradict his previous statement:

Brandon, you probably saw that Chris Simms is making a run at Kyle Orton for Denver's starting QB job. If Orton doesn't start after the Broncos gave up Cutler to get him, that's the first major demerit. I've been critical of teams switching to a 3-4 without having a proven nose tackle. The Broncos didn't find one during the offseason. That's a second potential demerit.

Tom A Hawk
06-03-2009, 11:57 AM
No....but his point is valid.

We passed up on better trade offers for Cutler because McDaniels wanted Matt Cassel

fyp