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nickademus
04-30-2009, 07:43 AM
For thoes of you who are still bent that we moved up to take him at the end of the second I can tell you for a fact that had he not been selected by us he would have been the first pick in the third round. As it happened the Jets had planned to take Quinn or Green and they were upset because TE was a greater need than RB and they have concerns about shonn green's knees.

Drek
04-30-2009, 07:47 AM
Sources are wonderful things.

Not that I doubt it, but a source makes such a post much more impactful.

RocBronc
04-30-2009, 07:47 AM
How do you know this for a fact??? Source please...

rugbythug
04-30-2009, 07:48 AM
Light Rail

~Crash~
04-30-2009, 07:52 AM
With a name like nickademus you doubt him ?

Gcver2ver3
04-30-2009, 08:09 AM
For thoes of you who are still bent that we moved up to take him at the end of the second I can tell you for a fact that had he not been selected by us he would have been the first pick in the third round. As it happened the Jets had planned to take Quinn or Green and they were upset because TE was a greater need than RB and they have concerns about shonn green's knees.

this makes sense to me...

because as i've read numerous times, behind pettigrew, Quinn was the best blocking TE available...so if you really want him and you don't feel there are a lot of impact players left on the board anyway, then why take a chance on him sliding?...

people point out that Quinn is a blocking TE and not known as a receiving TE so he wasn't worth a late 2nd round pick...but Pettigrew is the almost the same type TE (zero TD catches in his senior year) and he went in the 1st round...

supermanhr9
04-30-2009, 08:16 AM
Sure why not,,, still we now have not one, two or 3 but 4 damn TE's on the roster, maybe even a 5th I don't know about? Start cutting or trading, man I don't like scheffler, I hope he's the first to go, send his injury proned ass to chicago too

PRBronco
04-30-2009, 08:20 AM
this makes sense to me...

because as i've read numerous times, behind pettigrew, Quinn was the best blocking TE available...so if you really want him and you don't feel there are a lot of impact players left on the board anyway, then why take a chance on him sliding?...

people point out that Quinn is a blocking TE and not known as a receiving TE so he wasn't worth a late 2nd round pick...but Pettigrew is the same type TE (zero TD catches in his college career) and he went in the 1st round...

Haha I know, that hasn't been adding up for me at all. But yeah, I'd love to know where the OP heard this.

2KBack
04-30-2009, 08:22 AM
I personally don't care where he was picked, but I do like the idea of essentially having a 7 man oline to run the ball behind.

Broncoman13
04-30-2009, 08:23 AM
this makes sense to me...

because as i've read numerous times, behind pettigrew, Quinn was the best blocking TE available...so if you really want him and you don't feel there are a lot of impact players left on the board anyway, then why take a chance on him sliding?...

people point out that Quinn is a blocking TE and not known as a receiving TE so he wasn't worth a late 2nd round pick...but Pettigrew is the same type TE (zero TD catches in his college career) and he went in the 1st round...

Pettigrew
9TDs
112catches

Where
you
getting
your
CRAP???

dbfan21
04-30-2009, 08:25 AM
With DG and Quinn on either side of the OTs, it should bode very well for Moreno (or any other RB we have on the final roster) to have some excellent holes to run through!

Gcver2ver3
04-30-2009, 08:38 AM
Pettigrew
9TDs
112catches

Where
you
getting
your
CRAP???

sheez i guess i was wrong...

i swore i saw that on the NFLN...

my bad then...

Gcver2ver3
04-30-2009, 08:45 AM
Pettigrew
9TDs
112catches

Where
you
getting
your
CRAP???

okay i just double checked...

it was his Senior year that he had zero TD grabs...

so i'll edit my post...he had zero TD catches in his Senior year...

Broncoman13
04-30-2009, 08:52 AM
No
worries.

Still
had
a
fair
amount
of
catches.

Broncoman13
04-30-2009, 08:53 AM
Don't
get
me
wrong.

I
like
the
Quinn
pick.

He's
good
for
the
downfield
_locking.

Gcver2ver3
04-30-2009, 09:04 AM
No
worries.

Still
had
a
fair
amount
of
catches.

true, Quinn only had like 12 catches last year i think...but i think you know what i mean...:afro:

SouthStndJunkie
04-30-2009, 09:13 AM
true, Quinn only had like 12 catches last year i think...but i think you know what i mean...:afro:

Quinn had 12 catches for his entire career.

tsiguy96
04-30-2009, 09:21 AM
I personally don't care where he was picked, but I do like the idea of essentially having a 7 man oline to run the ball behind.

people ignore this, i would gladly give up MORE then what we did if it allows us to POUND the football into the end zone. i want teams to know when and how we are gonna run the ball and for us to still be able to. now we will be able to do that...in the RED ZONE

how sick is that?

Broncoman13
04-30-2009, 09:22 AM
true, Quinn only had like 12 catches last year i think...but i think you know what i mean...:afro:

you're all kinds of backwards today with your stats! 12 career catches for Q.

Broncoman13
04-30-2009, 09:31 AM
And I don't doubt the Jets interest in Quinn either. They have a receiving option in Keller so it makes sense. I also know that Pettigrew was very high on our board. As in probably the third rated offensive prospect! I was hearing some rumors predraft that had him as the 18 pick for us. Had Moreno gone off the board prior to 12, it would most likely have been Ayers at 12 and Pettigrew at 18. Glad we got Moreno instead!

barryr
04-30-2009, 09:32 AM
I think having him with help in goal line situations and since this team has had so much troubles over the years scoring TD's once in the red zone, having him and Graham blocking at the same time will help run the ball mroe effectively in short yardage situations.

Broncoman13
04-30-2009, 09:36 AM
people ignore this, i would gladly give up MORE then what we did if it allows us to POUND the football into the end zone. i want teams to know when and how we are gonna run the ball and for us to still be able to. now we will be able to do that...in the RED ZONE

how sick is that?

He will help in the redzone to pound the ball in, but the biggest gain is his agility in blocking. McD likes to run a variety of screens. A TE lined up as a slot receiver or an HBack can get out with his quickness and use that agility to block downfield.

socalorado
04-30-2009, 09:40 AM
Whats wrong with Shonn Greene's knees?

Gcver2ver3
04-30-2009, 09:45 AM
you're all kinds of backwards today with your stats! 12 career catches for Q.

does it really change the point?...

he's not known as a receiving threat...

so that actually supports my point more...

gyldenlove
04-30-2009, 09:46 AM
Whats wrong with Shonn Greene's knees?

They are on backwards, he never faces the way he walks.

nickademus
04-30-2009, 09:46 AM
Many of you guys are asking for sources. I have a family member who is a scout for the jets and he just got home from the draft. He generally doesnt give me a whole lot of info unless its after the fact. but he always has some interesting stories. One of the things he told me about the way Billicheck and Mangini selected players was based on a personality exam he said it was remarkably good at identifying the type of players they were after. Some of you may call BS and thats cool I just thought it was interesting that we were not the only team interested in Quinn this high.

nickademus
04-30-2009, 09:49 AM
Whats wrong with Shonn Greene's knees?

The jets team doctors gave him a 5-8 year window and red flagged him unless it was late in the second or later. Basically what I was told was they didnt expect him to really durable and as a bigger between the tackles type runner he would eventually break down. it wasnt something that was wrong that required surgery or rehab just the condition his knees were in.

socalorado
04-30-2009, 09:50 AM
Many of you guys are asking for sources. I have a family member who is a scout for the jets and he just got home from the draft. He generally doesnt give me a whole lot of info unless its after the fact. but he always has some interesting stories. One of the things he told me about the way Billicheck and Mangini selected players was based on a personality exam he said it was remarkably good at identifying the type of players they were after. Some of you may call BS and thats cool I just thought it was interesting that we were not the only team interested in Quinn this high.

I think its time for you to be put down for a nap.

socalorado
04-30-2009, 09:51 AM
The jets team doctors gave him a 5-8 year window and red flagged him unless it was late in the second or later. Basically what I was told was they didnt expect him to really durable and as a bigger between the tackles type runner he would eventually break down. it wasnt something that was wrong that required surgery or rehab just the condition his knees were in.

Can i get a link on this.

nickademus
04-30-2009, 09:58 AM
You want a link for a conversation I had? Since I am sure that the jets are in the habit of transcribing these asessments and posting them on a website I could link to I will get right on it. Dude if you dont want to believe me I could really care less.

outdoor_miner
04-30-2009, 10:19 AM
Can i get a link on this.

LOL

socalorado
04-30-2009, 10:19 AM
You want a link for a conversation I had? Since I am sure that the jets are in the habit of transcribing these asessments and posting them on a website I could link to I will get right on it. Dude if you dont want to believe me I could really care less.

Oh its not a matter of believing you, or calling BS, i just want to understand that the Jets moved up in the draft for a player that they felt had a injury issue, and they were so concerned about it that they moved up in the draft to take him.
I just wanna make sure that those are the facts according to the Jets FO.
I also wanna make sure that the injury issue was specifc to his history of knee problems, and their ability to hold up.

nickademus
04-30-2009, 10:23 AM
Well buddy take it for what its worth I was told the medical staff wouldnt pass him unless it was late second or later. I didnt know of any knee problems with him from what I read in the last few months but they must have found something.

socalorado
04-30-2009, 10:28 AM
Well buddy take it for what its worth I was told the medical staff wouldnt pass him unless it was late second or later. I didnt know of any knee problems with him from what I read in the last few months but they must have found something.

Could you find out specifically what the Jets medical staff found?

nickademus
04-30-2009, 10:39 AM
I could ask but my source is a scout and I dont know how specific he will be.

socalorado
04-30-2009, 10:44 AM
I could ask but my source is a scout and I dont know how specific he will be.

You know scouts tend to be pretty specific when explaining the injury of a player, and their misgivings about that injury.
Especially a player that the scouts team moved up in the draft to pick.

worm
04-30-2009, 10:52 AM
You know scouts tend to be pretty specific when explaining the injury of a player, and their misgivings about that injury.
Especially a player that the scouts team moved up in the draft to pick.

Do you have a source for this statement? I need to verify it.

Please list the number of scouts that know. Additionally, did you do any analysis yourself prior to making this claim?

Dude, this is a message board. take the comments for what it is...a person on the light rail talking about a conversation he had with a buddy. True or not really doesn't matter that much...does it?

socalorado
04-30-2009, 11:07 AM
Do you have a source for this statement? I need to verify it.

Please list the number of scouts that know. Additionally, did you do any analysis yourself prior to making this claim?

Dude, this is a message board. take the comments for what it is...a person on the light rail talking about a conversation he had with a buddy. True or not really doesn't matter that much...does it?

Sure it matters. He posted it, so it matters according to him, or he would not have posted half the info. Now, he just needs to go get the rest of the info, that way we all know exactly what hes claiming.
And according to him, who's word we are supposed to be taking, this info isnt from the light rail, its from a credible source. A scout.

The validity of the info matters very much.
Heres a place where the validity of the info posted there doesnt matter.
http://forums.denverbroncos.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1


Here at the OM, we members make every effort to NOT allow the OM to become the above posted site.

worm
04-30-2009, 11:23 AM
Here at the OM, we members make every effort to NOT allow the OM to become the above posted site.

I am glad we hold ourselves to a higher standard here on the Mane.

I don't know how I could forget something that obvious.

socalorado
04-30-2009, 11:57 AM
I am glad we hold ourselves to a higher standard here on the Mane.
I don't know how I could forget something that obvious.
And knowing is half the battle.
http://screenrant.com/images/gijoe.jpg

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 02:30 PM
The pick sucked. It might also be the reason the Saints are reportedly possibly sniffing around our RB's now...probably Hillis...since an extra TE means you don't use a FB.

I expect many more attempts to justify it.

bowtown
04-30-2009, 02:46 PM
Sure it matters. He posted it, so it matters according to him, or he would not have posted half the info. Now, he just needs to go get the rest of the info, that way we all know exactly what hes claiming.
And according to him, who's word we are supposed to be taking, this info isnt from the light rail, its from a credible source. A scout.

The validity of the info matters very much.
Heres a place where the validity of the info posted there doesnt matter.
http://forums.denverbroncos.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1


Here at the OM, we members make every effort to NOT allow the OM to become the above posted site.

So you are the one who killed Wabbit. Thanks a lot. :oyvey: Heaven forbid you would want all the info you could get, even if it's from an unnamed source. So it doesn't have a link, take it with a grain of salt, but unless the guy is obviously and blatantly lying like Bob does every day of his life, what do you care? You probably wouldn't want to quote it under oath, and it's not really too much good in a factual argument but it's interesting info none the less.

Christ, people are so whiny around here lately.

DBroncos4life
04-30-2009, 03:04 PM
I doubt we need to trade up for him.

barryr
04-30-2009, 03:38 PM
The Jets lost Chris Baker, who was a good blocking TE and a guy that Shanahan supposedly had interest in a couple years ago. So I could see the Jets with interest in Quinn. Whether they would have taken him in the 3rd round, who knows.

Old Dude
04-30-2009, 03:40 PM
I don't know about personality tests, but the book on Quinn's character is pretty good:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/563214

....

[I]Football Sense: ... He learns and retains plays well and will not have problems dealing with the mental aspect of the game.

Character: Quinn is a mature athlete who comes from a supportive family and shows very good responsibility. He is a good student who is compliant and says the right things. He is well-respected by his teammates and coaches, honoring with being one of the team captains for the 2008 season.

Competitiveness: Quinn is very tough and aggressive as a blocker. ... He's the type of guy that will stick his nose in the pile and one that will not hesitate to get very physical with his opponent.

Work Habits: Quinn is one of the team's hardest workers. He is not the type that needs stroking by the coaching staff in order to perform and has no problems with hard coaching. He responds well to criticism and will do whatever it takes to improve his play. He worked hard to rehabilitate from his 2006 fractured shoulder blade and is the type that will play until the whistle.

ZONA
04-30-2009, 03:51 PM
Evaluating TE's can be very different then evaluating different positions. Alot of it is based on what you look for your TE to do. The fact is, blocking isn't really considered a stat as much as catching a ball or getting a touch down. That's why you see the pass catching TE's rated ahead of Quinn. Pettigrew ranked higher then everybody because he was good at both catching and blocking. Quin could essentially be rated right behind Pettigrew and before the others if what you wanted him to do was be more of a blocking TE rather then a pass catching TE.

And Pettigrew is NOT considered a better blocker then Quinn. He was rated higher because he blocks well AND catches well. On all the coverage I watched, a few guys said Quinn was the BEST blocking TE in the draft.

And for what it's worth, watching Quinn in the combine, he looked like he had decent hands to me. It wasn't like the guy was dropping everything that came his way. He showed good catching form, using his hands to secure the ball, etc..

ZONA
04-30-2009, 04:00 PM
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2009/profiles/richard-quinn?id=71443#profiles-tabs:players-analysis

On the top right is some video footage of Quinn at the combine. You can see he does well catching the ball. Had good form, uses his hands, looks the ball in, good at over the shoulder down field catches. I mean, what do you want? Just because he wasn't thrown to alot in college doesn't mean the guy can't catch. I think his value was totally underrated in the draft.

Malcontent
04-30-2009, 04:12 PM
What if Quinn can actually catch too?...I mean 12 catches is comedy, but maybe their offense doesnt throw to the TE back in NCarolina? We may have gotten a pretty good thing here..

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 04:13 PM
On the top right is some video footage of Quinn at the combine. You can see he does well catching the ball. Had good form, uses his hands, looks the ball in, good at over the shoulder down field catches. I mean, what do you want? Just because he wasn't thrown to alot in college doesn't mean the guy can't catch. I think his value was totally underrated in the draft.
There's a huge difference between catching balls at the combine and doing in with NFL linebackers bearing down on you. They all look great in shorts.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 04:18 PM
A lot of scouts think Quinn can catch the ball also. Broncos IMO have a mean 2 TE set with Graham and Quinn. You could even go 3 TE, line up Quinn in the backfield and have Scheff on field also. That would give a lot of versatility to the redzone package.

Marshall as only WR, Quinn or Hillis blocking for Moreno out of backfield, with Graham on the weakside, Scheffler on the strongside or vice versa.

Since Hillis, Moreno, Scheffler, Marshall all have good hands you can run or pass but still retain a lot of power and physical play needed to pound it into the endzone from 5-6 yrds out etc.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 04:21 PM
There's a huge difference between catching balls at the combine and doing in with NFL linebackers bearing down on you. They all look great in shorts.

Well I think a lot of it has to do with how college team used him. The main reason you see no names like Terrel Davis become NFL stars wasn't because they weren't good in college, it's because for whatever reason the team failed to showcase them, or player was hurt, or coach was ridged in his thinking and never gave player a good shot at showing his skills.

Some TE just not part of passing game in college and instead are used to block. Doesn't mean they can't catch though.

Your statement they all look great in shorts is interesting because a lot of people been bagging on Smith for not running faster at combine, but game tape he looks plenty fast.

What is is we care about again, combine times, or football players, sometimes this place confuses me and seems really fickle.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 04:23 PM
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2009/profiles/richard-quinn?id=71443#profiles-tabs:players-analysis

On the top right is some video footage of Quinn at the combine. You can see he does well catching the ball. Had good form, uses his hands, looks the ball in, good at over the shoulder down field catches. I mean, what do you want? Just because he wasn't thrown to alot in college doesn't mean the guy can't catch. I think his value was totally underrated in the draft.

He caught ball with hands and snatched them pretty well out of the air. He looks pretty fast for a big guy and I like how he moves around.

Watch the 2 best players from the draft end up being Quinn and Smith. Now wouldn't that be a hoot?

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 04:26 PM
What if Quinn can actually catch too?...I mean 12 catches is comedy, but maybe their offense doesnt throw to the TE back in NCarolina? We may have gotten a pretty good thing here..
The good news is he doubled his season high with 8 catches last year.

The bad news is he doubled his season high with 8 catches last year.

lazarus4444
04-30-2009, 04:29 PM
Oh no, a hard nosed, smart, tough, grounded player with leadership ability? What will we ever do? That pick SUCKED!

/end sarcasm

Carmelo15
04-30-2009, 04:31 PM
Butch Davis admitted to drastically underutilized Richard Quinn in his offense. I think he knows a little bit about tight ends. Bubba Franks. Jeremy Shockey. Kellen Winslow.

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 04:33 PM
Some TE just not part of passing game in college and instead are used to block. Doesn't mean they can't catch though.
Maybe...but most coaches will utilize their talent to their strengths. UNC didn't throw to the TE much...maybe because they didn't have any TE's they thought were pass receivers. All we know for sure right now about him is that he's a good blocker. Graham didn't get used in this offense and he was the Mackey Award winner in college. How much do you think this guys will get used in this offense? I think it's a foregone conclusion that Scheffler is gone...and if we're using a 2 TE offense that means Hillis might be less than usefull here as well.

Sodak
04-30-2009, 04:41 PM
Do they use a two TE set in the spread?

Anyone? If so, Graham and Quinn would be sick.

I never would watch NE unless we were playing them.

ZONA
04-30-2009, 04:56 PM
you have too look good in shorts before you can look good on the field. I'm not saying Quinn will be a great pass catching TE. All I said was based on his form at the combine, nothing stands out to me that would prevent him from being able to catch some passes for us. Okay, so he may not be Shannon Sharp or Tony Gonzalez but why couldn't he turn out to be a great blocker and better then average pass catcher, like Crumpler. It's the same old story that was going around about Graham. He's no good at catching passes was the word but I never recalled the guy dropping many passes while in a Broncos uniform. He just doesn't get alot of balls passed to him. Doesn't mean he isn't at least average or slightly above average at catching. If this guy can block like a stud and catch the ball at least decent, that's what we want.

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 05:04 PM
Butch Davis admitted to drastically underutilized Richard Quinn in his offense. I think he knows a little bit about tight ends. Bubba Franks. Jeremy Shockey. Kellen Winslow.
Link?

Drek
04-30-2009, 05:09 PM
Do they use a two TE set in the spread?

Anyone? If so, Graham and Quinn would be sick.

I never would watch NE unless we were playing them.

Yes, a lot of two and three TE sets.

We'll probably see a mix of Scheffler and Quinn with Graham as the primary starter.

I'm expecting that when Scheffler is on the field they won't be afraid to have him option out into the slot quite a bit and not only target him in the passing game but also play off the perception of a pass play that would give opposing defenses to run a toss or screen to that side with Scheffler taking the lead blocker role on an LB or DB.

With Quinn it'll be a lot of two in line TEs and probably have a lot of power running going on behind it.

We'll go three TE in short yardage situations quite a bit I'm betting, but I also wouldn't be surprised if Scheffler's versatility allows them to line up with three TEs anywhere on the field and let Scheff option out wide and run it like a two TE set with Marshall and Scheffler as the WRs.

Quinn gives the offense a lot of versatility in how they can game plan from week to week. It introduces a significant power wrinkle to our offense that was actually pretty finesse last year.

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 05:10 PM
you have too look good in shorts before you can look good on the field. I'm not saying Quinn will be a great pass catching TE. All I said was based on his form at the combine, nothing stands out to me that would prevent him from being able to catch some passes for us. Okay, so he may not be Shannon Sharp or Tony Gonzalez but why couldn't he turn out to be a great blocker and better then average pass catcher, like Crumpler. It's the same old story that was going around about Graham. He's no good at catching passes was the word but I never recalled the guy dropping many passes while in a Broncos uniform. He just doesn't get alot of balls passed to him. Doesn't mean he isn't at least average or slightly above average at catching. If this guy can block like a stud and catch the ball at least decent, that's what we want.
Please don't compare this guy to Graham. He won the Mackey Award in college and caught plenty of passes to jutify it AND he's the best blocking TE in the NFL.

This argument is like suggesting that a running back who carried the ball 14 times in college over 4 years might be a pretty good runner but just wasn't utilized for some reason. Is it possible? Yeah...so are lots of improbable things. If you're going to say that the need for a blocking TE is so critical because we have to have 2 of those guys in this offense I can listen to that but trying to make Quinn into a receiving threat based on an argument of not knowing if he can or not...ain't workng.

ZONA
04-30-2009, 06:50 PM
Please don't compare this guy to Graham. He won the Mackey Award in college and caught plenty of passes to jutify it AND he's the best blocking TE in the NFL.

This argument is like suggesting that a running back who carried the ball 14 times in college over 4 years might be a pretty good runner but just wasn't utilized for some reason. Is it possible? Yeah...so are lots of improbable things. If you're going to say that the need for a blocking TE is so critical because we have to have 2 of those guys in this offense I can listen to that but trying to make Quinn into a receiving threat based on an argument of not knowing if he can or not...ain't workng.

I don't see anywhere in my post where I said Quinn is like Graham or that they are similar players. I said, basically, the situation is similar. When Graham was being signed here, alot of people were saying he doesn't catch well. Who cares what award he won in college. He wasn't catching alot of balls at NE and those things were being said about him. Now, the same things are being said of Quinn. If you want to put on the tunnel vision glasses and look at that like I'm comparing the two that's on you.

And your stupid scenario about a college runner not getting any carries is ridiculous. If that's the best scenario you can come up with try again. Now if you said a back wasn't used much in the passing game, okay. But to suggest a RUNNING back isn't used much to RUN the ball, how lame.

outdoor_miner
04-30-2009, 08:10 PM
But to suggest a RUNNING back isn't used much to RUN the ball, how lame.

Well - in all honesty, we have a shining example of that on our team. One Peyton Hillis!!! He's a running back that no one knew could run... :strong:

ton80
04-30-2009, 08:51 PM
Link?

Mayock talked about this before the draft. I can vouch for the comment.

Kaylore
04-30-2009, 09:04 PM
Mayock talked about this before the draft. I can vouch for the comment.

This will be good. I want to see Footsteps squirm out of this one...

nickademus
04-30-2009, 09:08 PM
I talked to my guy and what he told me was that green had an Injury in 2006 that cost him most of the season and while he had come back from that injury at his size the wear and tear would limit his shelf life in the nfl.

BigPlayShay
04-30-2009, 09:23 PM
Link?

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles/nfl_draft/20090417_NFL_Network_s_Mayock_s_rundown_on_draft_s _tight_ends__offensive_linemen.html

SLEEPER

Richard Quinn, North Carolina

Height, weight: 6-4, 264

40-yard dash: 4.85

Projected round: 3-4

Mayock: "In this day and age of spread offenses in college, there are no in-line blockers. And this kid's the best blocking tight end in the draft. He had just 5-6 catches as a senior. Nobody knows how good his hands are. But they're much better than people think. [North Carolina coach] Butch Davis told me the biggest disservice he did to any kid last year was not throwing the ball more to Quinn. But he had three NFL-style wideouts on the outside. This kid could go as high as the third round because of his blocking ability. He's a 4.8-4.85 kid that will catch the football."

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 09:53 PM
I don't see anywhere in my post where I said Quinn is like Graham or that they are similar players. I said, basically, the situation is similar.
No I''m afraid that's not what you said. Here's what you said:
It's the same old story that was going around about Graham.
Not similar..."the same" story as the one people said about Graham. And as I said before...their background performance was not the same. One labored in obscurity with 12 career catches...one won the Mackey as college footballs best TE. So no...people were not saying the same things about Graham when he came into the NFL. Graham caught 106 passes at CU so it's not fair to suggest based on Graham's success in the NFL that "the same story" was being said. Some people might have questioned his hands since he got to the NFL based on how seldom he saw the ball in NE but the difference between catching 106 and 12...ought to tell you something.
When Graham was being signed here, alot of people were saying he doesn't catch well. Who cares what award he won in college. He wasn't catching alot of balls at NE and those things were being said about him. Now, the same things are being said of Quinn. If you want to put on the tunnel vision glasses and look at that like I'm comparing the two that's on you.
The difference you're failing to grasp is that Graham HAS caught passes in the NFL and this guy hasn't. If he was arriving here as a guy with good college numbers but questions about his hands instead of a guy who didn't catch a single pass his first two seasons, I'd see a better correlation.
And your stupid scenario about a college runner not getting any carries is ridiculous. If that's the best scenario you can come up with try again. Now if you said a back wasn't used much in the passing game, okay. But to suggest a RUNNING back isn't used much to RUN the ball, how lame.
Running backs don't block? Catches vs carries...why are you making a distinction? The pont is this guy basically been an offensive tackle who caught a pass every 4 games. He might be a great blocker but this part of his game is still unknown.

footstepsfrom#27
04-30-2009, 10:04 PM
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles/nfl_draft/20090417_NFL_Network_s_Mayock_s_rundown_on_draft_s _tight_ends__offensive_linemen.html

SLEEPER

Richard Quinn, North Carolina

Height, weight: 6-4, 264

40-yard dash: 4.85

Projected round: 3-4

Mayock: "In this day and age of spread offenses in college, there are no in-line blockers. And this kid's the best blocking tight end in the draft. He had just 5-6 catches as a senior. Nobody knows how good his hands are. But they're much better than people think. [North Carolina coach] Butch Davis told me the biggest disservice he did to any kid last year was not throwing the ball more to Quinn. But he had three NFL-style wideouts on the outside. This kid could go as high as the third round because of his blocking ability. He's a 4.8-4.85 kid that will catch the football."
So here's my question...if Davis truly means this and it's not just pre-draft BS meant to hype him up and help his draft stock, then why didn't he actually change his use for the guy while he had him? What...he recognizes this all along but still keeps from using him? Mayock also says "nobody knows how good his hands are"...the same thing I'm also saying. Dwayne Carswell seems like a better comparison to me than the Graham one. Carswell was a big guy who could block and he even made the pro bowl one year with 49 catches but he was not a talented TE who was missused in Denver and he didn't cost a 2nd round pick either. He sitll had a decent career just not one I'd have spent a high draft choice on.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 10:49 PM
So here's my question...if Davis truly means this and it's not just pre-draft BS meant to hype him up and help his draft stock, then why didn't he actually change his use for the guy while he had him? What...he recognizes this all along but still keeps from using him? Mayock also says "nobody knows how good his hands are"...the same thing I'm also saying. Dwayne Carswell seems like a better comparison to me than the Graham one. Carswell was a big guy who could block and he even made the pro bowl one year with 49 catches but he was not a talented TE who was missused in Denver and he didn't cost a 2nd round pick either. He sitll had a decent career just not one I'd have spent a high draft choice on.

I think Broncos just really targeted specific players they really liked. They probably would have loved to just sit in the 3rd or 4th round and get quinn. More then likely the felt he would be gone and they would then be left picking a player they didn't really like that much.

Seems like Mcdaniels really likes all the players he got. Let's just sit back and see how they play. No reason to make a player feel we don't want them around. You think they don't read these sites? They are college players excited about going to NFL I bet the do searches to see what Bronco fans think. I know I would be curious as to what fans were thinking if I was a pro.

I prefer just to feel excited for them. If they stink then I will start calling them scrubs. Until they suit up though who knows.

I know you well enough footsteps that is Quinn starts putting people on there asses and RBS are waltzing for first downs and TDS, you won't care where we drafted him. None of us will.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 10:49 PM
Also footsteps I agree drills dont mean everything, but that TE Quinn looked a lot faster then Carswell ever dreamed of being.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 10:50 PM
wow 4.85 at almost 270 pounds. Is it just me or is that pretty scary?

Popps
04-30-2009, 10:53 PM
People love the running game, but aren't always so crazy about doing what it takes to make it work. This isn't a sexy pick, but if it pans out, we're going to be able to gash people with the 2-TE set, and it's only going to help protect the QB.

To me, this is a guy we'll all be thrilled to have around in a year or so. It just doesn't get anyone that pumped up on draft day. Trading up for him was a non-****ing issue. We didn't give up much, and apparently we got a player we were highly targeting.

If nothing else, you want our staff to have the players they want. They got them. Hopefully this kid will pan out.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 10:56 PM
So here's my question...if Davis truly means this and it's not just pre-draft BS meant to hype him up and help his draft stock, then why didn't he actually change his use for the guy while he had him? What...he recognizes this all along but still keeps from using him? Mayock also says "nobody knows how good his hands are"...the same thing I'm also saying. Dwayne Carswell seems like a better comparison to me than the Graham one. Carswell was a big guy who could block and he even made the pro bowl one year with 49 catches but he was not a talented TE who was missused in Denver and he didn't cost a 2nd round pick either. He sitll had a decent career just not one I'd have spent a high draft choice on.

Also though why even worry about comparing the player to anyone? Once they are all in camp it doesn't matter where they were drafted. All that matters is they become good players.

I understand people feeling that we have to hit on tons of picks or we look foolish for trading Cutler. Really though smart thing to do is just try and build a solid football team. If there is a player in the 2nd round you feel will be a starter and a good football player, you take him. You don't worry about what his name looks like stacked next to Jay Cutler.

Cutler will be a star in Chicago, we lost a star, there is no cure for that and no draft picks that will make how much it sucks go away. You have to understand it will be 2-3 yrs before the sting will be gone. If Broncos can win in that time frame though it will go away. Who knows Orton may do a lot better then you think. He doesn't turn ball over a lot and seems to score in the redzone.

Overanalyzing a draft before they guys get a chance to play seems like just frustration to me Footsteps.

cutthemdown
04-30-2009, 11:00 PM
Also what funny is your moniker. A reference to Atwater one of our favorite players all time and a star of our Superbowl wins.

When we picked him, 15th? first round? something like that right? and then cut mike harden, even Dennis Smith was a tad dismayed. Fans were in an uproar. Point being you just never know how things will work out.

Harden was washed up, Atwater worth the first round pick.

Then of course we have really recent stuff like selecting Harris when he had a bad back, or Royal in 2nd when people though he was a 3rd or 4th round pick.

Tell me this would you trade Eddie Royal for a first round pick? And if so why? isn't getting starters that play well the point of first round picks? It's not about finding Walter Peyton, its about finding good football players, it doesn't matter what round they came in. In fact the lower the better.

Houshyamama
05-01-2009, 12:27 AM
Can i get a link on this.

I have no idea who you are, but I'll bet you're a dbag

mhgaffney
05-01-2009, 03:42 AM
Makes me wonder if Denver will resurrect the old flying wedge.

Saturate one side of the field with more blockers than D players -- and let Moreno run for daylight.

Should be fun to watch.

Drek
05-01-2009, 04:42 AM
So here's my question...if Davis truly means this and it's not just pre-draft BS meant to hype him up and help his draft stock, then why didn't he actually change his use for the guy while he had him? What...he recognizes this all along but still keeps from using him? Mayock also says "nobody knows how good his hands are"...the same thing I'm also saying. Dwayne Carswell seems like a better comparison to me than the Graham one. Carswell was a big guy who could block and he even made the pro bowl one year with 49 catches but he was not a talented TE who was missused in Denver and he didn't cost a 2nd round pick either. He sitll had a decent career just not one I'd have spent a high draft choice on.

For Butch Davis' comments:

Sometimes you got to sacrafice what's in a player's best interest from a numbers standpoint to cover up for a weakness of another player. Graham was basically attached to our right side when Pears was starting there, not because it was best for him but because it was the only way to cover up how much Pears sucked. Also, UNC did produce a first round WR this year, who happens to be a big, physical type of player himself.

I think the Carswell comparison is rather apt though. Quinn is a superior athlete and a better all around player earlier in his career than Carswell, but he shows a similar skill set. That is an important skill set for a team that has struggled in the red zone though and is looking to employ a significant amount more two and three TE sets to improve that.

Carswell is his baseline for production, Graham is his ceiling. Would it have been preferable to get him in the 3rd or so? Sure. But for someone that McDaniels intends to be a building block to a new offensive strategy its worth the overpay.

Broncoman13
05-01-2009, 05:18 AM
So here's my question...if Davis truly means this and it's not just pre-draft BS meant to hype him up and help his draft stock, then why didn't he actually change his use for the guy while he had him? What...he recognizes this all along but still keeps from using him? Mayock also says "nobody knows how good his hands are"...the same thing I'm also saying. Dwayne Carswell seems like a better comparison to me than the Graham one. Carswell was a big guy who could block and he even made the pro bowl one year with 49 catches but he was not a talented TE who was missused in Denver and he didn't cost a 2nd round pick either. He sitll had a decent career just not one I'd have spent a high draft choice on.

Maybe b/c Hakeem Nicks, Foster, and Brandon tate (sorry can't cap 't' for some reason, keyboard still having issues)?

I do think that it is somewhat telling that even after tate went down with the ACL, Q didn't have a large role in the offense.

Broncoman13
05-01-2009, 05:20 AM
I have no idea who you are, but I'll bet you're a dbag

Well that was a tough one to figure out wasn't it. Anybody that runs off many of the Mane's best should be run off himself. It is sad the way he treats people on the Mane, e.g the way he attacks this thread's author. I don't blame Wabbit for communicating only through PMs and Emails now.

Broncoman13
05-01-2009, 05:30 AM
For Butch Davis' comments:

Sometimes you got to sacrafice what's in a player's best interest from a numbers standpoint to cover up for a weakness of another player. Graham was basically attached to our right side when Pears was starting there, not because it was best for him but because it was the only way to cover up how much Pears sucked. Also, UNC did produce a first round WR this year, who happens to be a big, physical type of player himself.

I think the Carswell comparison is rather apt though. Quinn is a superior athlete and a better all around player earlier in his career than Carswell, but he shows a similar skill set. That is an important skill set for a team that has struggled in the red zone though and is looking to employ a significant amount more two and three TE sets to improve that.

Carswell is his baseline for production, Graham is his ceiling. Would it have been preferable to get him in the 3rd or so? Sure. But for someone that McDaniels intends to be a building block to a new offensive strategy its worth the overpay.

Nice post.

I also think that people should think about the guys that can really get out in front and block. Generally those are the tackles that get drafted in the top 10. Excellent feet and can block down field. We have those guys on the OL but we needed to add more. I like the pick for a few different reasons, but think about this. We now have probably the best blocking team in the NFL. Brandon Marshall is amongst the best blocking WRs in the league already. I think he takes pride in blocking and understands his role in helping his teammates get those extra yards. Eddie Royal sells out every play. DG is phenomenal, whether it's on the line or 25 yards down field. I love how he'll make a block (or maybe even whiff on one) and then go on to the next guy to get a hat on him. Our OL is athletic and amongst the best already. Now we add two guys in Moreno and Quinn who can both block very well. Gotta give McD credit on this one, he is making this team very versatile. With guys like Moreno, Hillis, DG, Q, Marshall, Royal, and a very athletic OL we are primed for some very effective screens. And I still think it's possible Scheff makes his way onto the set. Good speed and he understands how to set up a defense. His ability to make a route look like a drag and extended it downfield is already as good as Shay's. McD will likely see that and realize that Scheff is one of, if not our best downfield threat.

socalorado
05-01-2009, 05:43 AM
Well that was a tough one to figure out wasn't it. Anybody that runs off many of the Mane's best should be run off himself. It is sad the way he treats people on the Mane, e.g the way he attacks this thread's author. I don't blame Wabbit for communicating only through PMs and Emails now.

Can i get a link on this.........dbag?ROFL!

Broncoman13
05-01-2009, 05:59 AM
Sure, try this one... :blowme: or :lickadick: maybe this link will work better... www.you'reatool.com

socalorado
05-01-2009, 06:03 AM
Sure, try this one... :blowme: or :lickadick: maybe this link will work better... www.you'reatool.com

So hostile. And this early in the morning. Someone must pissed in your Cheerios to get your tampon all in a wad.
Its ok, you'll have all day here to cry, b!tch, piss and moan about it to everyone. Ha!

rugbythug
05-01-2009, 06:49 AM
If we stop getting Stoned from the 5 yard line this will be a great pick.

Broncoman13
05-01-2009, 06:51 AM
Has anyone told you thanks for ruining the Mane yet? People are disappearing, they're leaving the Mane b/c of DBs like you. I'll probably get banned for this but at this point it is okay. We're going down hill b/c of people like you anyway... I hear that drano goes really well with just about anything, you should do us all a favor and have a nice cup full. I'll see if I can find you a link... B1tch

gyldenlove
05-01-2009, 06:52 AM
Maybe b/c Hakeem Nicks, Foster, and Brandon tate (sorry can't cap 't' for some reason, keyboard still having issues)?

I do think that it is somewhat telling that even after tate went down with the ACL, Q didn't have a large role in the offense.

He did play part of the year with a cast on his hand making it hard for him to catch anything.

socalorado
05-01-2009, 07:08 AM
Has anyone told you thanks for ruining the Mane yet? People are disappearing, they're leaving the Mane b/c of DBs like you. I'll probably get banned for this but at this point it is okay. We're going down hill b/c of people like you anyway... I hear that drano goes really well with just about anything, you should do us all a favor and have a nice cup full. I'll see if I can find you a link... B1tch

Pick up your ball and go home d-bag.
http://charliek92.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/crying-baby.jpg

Houshyamama
05-01-2009, 10:07 AM
Well that was a tough one to figure out wasn't it. Anybody that runs off many of the Mane's best should be run off himself. It is sad the way he treats people on the Mane, e.g the way he attacks this thread's author. I don't blame Wabbit for communicating only through PMs and Emails now.

Well, its not so much that he's a malicious a$$hole, he's just being annoying. Like that kid in class who constantly needles people and disrupts for attention. I mean, c'mon... the thread author was just passing on something he heard, just let it go!

Broncoman13
05-01-2009, 10:37 AM
He did play part of the year with a cast on his hand making it hard for him to catch anything.

Good point and I didn't know he played in a cast or with a less than 100% hand.