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View Full Version : Wow, how can you not like Alphonso Smith?


DarkHorse
04-29-2009, 05:25 AM
For a little dude he sure does come up to play the run and isn't afraid to tackle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWcP-G4myh0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqEUdRqAxgs&feature=related


Couple that with his ball hawk skills and i'm pretty excited about him

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGC2RyxHMqI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO3C6tOxCtg&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED9C6JWaoPg&feature=related


I'm a fan.

cmhargrove
04-29-2009, 05:36 AM
We will all find out soon enough, but from what i've seen he may very well be the best CB this draft.

We will compare him to D-Will, but I watched Darrent a lot in college, and this kid looks much, much better.

He can play man, and may already be the best zone corner on the team - including Champ. Watch the dude play in open space, he's instinctive and lightning fast. JMFW has absolutely zero chance to beat this kid out. I understand he is lacking Andre Goodman's experience, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Smith take the starting job by about game 4-6.

dbfan21
04-29-2009, 05:40 AM
I am totally on the Smith bandwagon. I love the strategy behind the pick, I like the talent he brings, etc. He is a ballhawk and Champ is the only other ballhawk on the team. In colleage, Smith always found a way to be around the ball and he's quick so QBs are gonna be duped into throwing his way...and Smith will be in position to step in front of the pass for a pick. Plus, he is a high-character person, firmly rooted in family & faith.

Feel free to ride me on this if I am wrong, but I have a good feeling about this guy.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 05:49 AM
Smith arrives at Dove Valley
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f321/jasongorgas/midgetelf-1.jpg

broncofan7
04-29-2009, 05:49 AM
I am totally on the Smith bandwagon. I love the strategy behind the pick, I like the talent he brings, etc. He is a ballhawk and Champ is the only other ballhawk on the team. In colleage, Smith always found a way to be around the ball and he's quick so QBs are gonna be duped into throwing his way...and Smith will be in position to step in front of the pass for a pick. Plus, he is a high-character person, firmly rooted in family & faith.

Feel free to ride me on this if I am wrong, but I have a good feeling about this guy.

I love the player too--very productive and he came off as very well polished in his press conference. But you like trading a probable top 10 1st round pick for the rights to draft him? Not me.....but I am looking forward to Training camp this year with more vigor than in years past.......

longtimer
04-29-2009, 05:50 AM
For a little dude he sure does come up to play the run and isn't afraid to tackle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWcP-G4myh0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqEUdRqAxgs&feature=related


Couple that with his ball hawk skills and i'm pretty excited about him

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGC2RyxHMqI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO3C6tOxCtg&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED9C6JWaoPg&feature=related


I'm a fan.

I'm not
All I see is the other team creating a machup of a 5'9" coner on a 6'3" WR in the back of the endzone for a jump ball for TD after TD. Dude might be able to play but he can't out jump his one physical limitations of his god given hieght when competing with other that are alot bigger.

chickennob2
04-29-2009, 05:50 AM
<table><tbody><tr class="loop-first loop-odd"><td class="col-name">Byrd, Demetrius (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Demetrius-Byrd/7099e63c-bca2-4aee-8006-236f0e1b0973) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-3</td> <td class="col-weight">200</td> <td class="col-bd">06/30/1986</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="00"> R </td> <td class="col-college">Louisiana State</td> </tr><tr class="loop-even"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="12"> 12 </td> <td class="col-name"> Banks, Gary (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Gary-Banks/3c32ed6c-2f55-45ee-8043-1c1985d0299e) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-0</td> <td class="col-weight">193</td> <td class="col-bd">11/04/1981</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="00"> 0 </td> <td class="col-college">Troy</td> </tr><tr class="loop-odd"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="84"> 84 </td> <td class="col-name"> Davis, Buster (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Buster-Davis/1efbcc1e-6a4e-42e1-9e05-180cbe8a6d23) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-1</td> <td class="col-weight">202</td> <td class="col-bd">10/02/1985</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="02"> 2 </td> <td class="col-college">Louisiana State</td> </tr><tr class="loop-even"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="81"> 81 </td> <td class="col-name"> Osgood, Kassim (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Kassim-Osgood/9abeaac2-db5e-45da-8b5e-8f4d1ab1db77) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-5</td> <td class="col-weight">220</td> <td class="col-bd">05/20/1980</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="06"> 6 </td> <td class="col-college">San Diego State</td> </tr><tr class="loop-odd"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="83"> 83 </td> <td class="col-name"> Jackson, Vincent (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Vincent-Jackson/0272d090-9588-4208-b697-543493f29472) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-5</td> <td class="col-weight">230</td> <td class="col-bd">01/14/1983</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="04"> 4 </td> <td class="col-college">Northern Colorado</td> </tr><tr class="loop-even"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="80"> 80 </td> <td class="col-name"> Floyd, Malcom (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Malcom-Floyd/37e79b4c-ec7f-47d2-8bb4-efb33c638e2d) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-5</td> <td class="col-weight">225</td> <td class="col-bd">09/08/1981</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="03"> 3 </td> <td class="col-college">Wyoming</td> </tr><tr class="loop-odd"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="89"> 89 </td> <td class="col-name"> Chambers, Chris (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Chris-Chambers/7970fe6c-a007-4640-91b2-45a5e3f3c762) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">5-11</td> <td class="col-weight">210</td> <td class="col-bd">08/12/1978</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="08"> 8 </td> <td class="col-college">Wisconsin</td> </tr><tr class="loop-even"> <td class="col-jersey" rel="11"> 11 </td> <td class="col-name"> Naanee, Legedu (http://www.chargers.com/team/roster/Legedu-Naanee/427e0da7-1484-45cc-8356-f47bdc657f66) </td> <td class="col-position">WR</td> <td class="col-height">6-2</td> <td class="col-weight">226</td> <td class="col-bd">09/16/1983</td> <td class="col-exp" rel="02"> 2 </td> <td class="col-college">Boise State</td></tr></tbody></table>


I certainly hope we have him covering Chambers. Otherwise, he's giving up at least 3 inches

TheReverend
04-29-2009, 05:51 AM
Vincent Jackson loves this draft pick.

cmhargrove
04-29-2009, 05:56 AM
I'm not
All I see is the other team creating a machup of a 5'9" coner on a 6'3" WR in the back of the endzone for a jump ball for TD after TD. Dude might be able to play but he can't out jump his one physical limitations of his god given hieght when competing with other that are alot bigger.

How many TD's (and catches for that matter) are just "jump balls" lobbed up there by the QB?

A lot of beating someone on a jump ball is about getting them misdirected or out of position more than outright jumping more vertically. You usually win the jump ball when the defender's back is to the play and they are unaware the ball is in the air, or are unable to make up ground on the play.

This kid looks like he can go stride for stride with any of the receivers you have listed. I think your diagnosis of "TD after TD" is just dumb. Why didn't they try that on this kid in college? Probably because he would steal it almost every time - that's why he had over 20 picks...

cmhargrove
04-29-2009, 05:57 AM
Another thing about Smith, I think he gives us the best chance to block FG's that we have had in years. His speed and skills off the edge could be a great thing for our ST unit...

dbfan21
04-29-2009, 05:58 AM
I love the player too--very productive and he came off as very well polished in his press conference. But you like trading a probable top 10 1st round pick for the rights to draft him? Not me.....but I am looking forward to Training camp this year with more vigor than in years past.......

I get what you're saying, but here's my thinking...it's a probable top 10 pick. Who knows what this year will bring? We could be 5-11 or 11-5, which the latter would have us picking in the mid-20s. The point is that I like the aggressiveness of the FO and McD. They had this guy ranked as the top CB in the draft and they found a way to get him. Smith may turn out to be a bust because nothing in life is 100%, but a top 10 pick next year could be a complete bust too. The FO is trying to make us great as fast as possible. And if we can have a guy learn under Champ for an extra season, then that can only help this football team.

Also, I am just as excited about camp as you. Sure it's disappointing that Cutler is gone, but what's done is done and all we can do is look forward...and I am really looking forward to seeing what type of team we field in 2009.

Beantown Bronco
04-29-2009, 06:14 AM
JMFW has absolutely zero chance to beat this kid out.

People have been killed for saying less.

barryr
04-29-2009, 06:33 AM
Smith was more highly rated than Darrent Williams ever was.

Jack Williams lost playing time to Josh Bell, an undrafted free agent who was picked up after being cut from another team.

Strangely, with Bly at 5'10, there didn't seem so many worried of his height covering tall receivers.

There are many 5'9 CB's in the NFL, starting even, so if it's such a big worry around the NFL, someone forgot to tell them.

DenverBrit
04-29-2009, 06:36 AM
Smith was more highly rated than Darrent Williams ever was.

Jack Williams lost playing time to Josh Bell, an undrafted free agent who was picked up after being cut from another team.

Strangely, with Bly at 5'10, there didn't seem so many worried of his height covering tall receivers.

There are many 5'9 CB's in the NFL, starting even, so if it's such a big worry around the NFL, someone forgot to tell them.

McDaniels didn't draft Bly. ;)

chickennob2
04-29-2009, 06:41 AM
On the height issue, the 2009 Pro Bowl corners, including guys who didn't play and their injury replacements:

Al Harris 6-1
Charles Woodson 6-1
Antoine Winfield 5-9
Asante Samuel 5-10
Ronde Barber 5-10

Nnamdi Asomugha 6-2
Cortland Finnegan 5-10
Darrelle Revis 5-11


So one pro bowl corner was Smith's height, 3 more were one inch taller. Hmm, maybe it won't be so big of an issue.

Lolad
04-29-2009, 06:53 AM
We will all find out soon enough, but from what i've seen he may very well be the best CB this draft.

We will compare him to D-Will, but I watched Darrent a lot in college, and this kid looks much, much better.

He can play man, and may already be the best zone corner on the team - including Champ. Watch the dude play in open space, he's instinctive and lightning fast. JMFW has absolutely zero chance to beat this kid out. I understand he is lacking Andre Goodman's experience, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Smith take the starting job by about game 4-6.

did you seriously just say this rookie is better then champ bailey? :rofl:

Grover
04-29-2009, 06:53 AM
Alphonso needs to learn to run with more passion after all those interceptions. He's letting Wide Receivers arm tackle him!

longtimer
04-29-2009, 06:59 AM
How many TD's (and catches for that matter) are just "jump balls" lobbed up there by the QB?

A lot of beating someone on a jump ball is about getting them misdirected or out of position more than outright jumping more vertically. You usually win the jump ball when the defender's back is to the play and they are unaware the ball is in the air, or are unable to make up ground on the play.

This kid looks like he can go stride for stride with any of the receivers you have listed. I think your diagnosis of "TD after TD" is just dumb. Why didn't they try that on this kid in college? Probably because he would steal it almost every time - that's why he had over 20 picks...

Let start with the fade route to the corner where the ball is thrown high and the WR goes up and gets it at the highest piont. If a QB has a mismatch in size with a CB then he puts the ball were it is the most advantage for the ofense.
You win a jump ball by being able to jump higher than the corner back and if the CB is a lot shorter and can not jump as high you do not need any misdirection just strong hands to be able to hold onto the ball WR on his way down from the highest piont were the CB can not reach. The CB only option is to try to stripe the ball from the WR to prevent the WR from having controll of the ball and making a completion.
The reason he had over 20 pick accordiong to Mayock is he gambles and was able to step in front of the passes. The other reason is it was against college competition and the speed of the game is much slower than what is on the NFL level. He did not face NFL caliber QB and WR on ever play.

barryr
04-29-2009, 07:03 AM
McDaniels didn't draft Bly. ;)

Good one, and true :approve:

chiefforlife
04-29-2009, 07:04 AM
He reminds me of Brandon Flowers who turned out to be a great rookie for us. Smith looks like a very good player.

~Crash~
04-29-2009, 07:05 AM
what the **** does like got to do with it ?

The Joker
04-29-2009, 07:05 AM
On the height issue, the 2009 Pro Bowl corners, including guys who didn't play and their injury replacements:

Al Harris 6-1
Charles Woodson 6-1
Antoine Winfield 5-9
Asante Samuel 5-10
Ronde Barber 5-10

Nnamdi Asomugha 6-2
Cortland Finnegan 5-10
Darrelle Revis 5-11


So one pro bowl corner was Smith's height, 3 more were one inch taller. Hmm, maybe it won't be so big of an issue.

Gee, ya think?

It's the way the forum seems to have gone though, sadly.

There's the pro-McDaniels people and the anti-McDaniels people. And each group will look to either praise or criticise every single move the team makes at any opportunity they can, depending on their own particular agenda.

Luckily there's still some posters out there who have kept some objectivity, but sadly they're a minority at the moment.

Pat Bowlen
04-29-2009, 07:06 AM
I love the player too--very productive and he came off as very well polished in his press conference. But you like trading a probable top 10 1st round pick for the rights to draft him? Not me.....
Relax. The player we are going to turn Alphonso into by this time next year would be drafted in the top ten anyway.

barryr
04-29-2009, 07:06 AM
He reminds me of Brandon Flowers who turned out to be a great rookie for us. Smith looks like a very good player.

And Flowers is 5'9. Hmm.

chiefforlife
04-29-2009, 07:09 AM
And Flowers is 5'9. Hmm.

He plays much bigger and so does Smith. Great pick up for McD.

~Crash~
04-29-2009, 07:10 AM
getting a QB has to do with it .or say winning 5 games and picking at say #25 has to do with it .

~Crash~
04-29-2009, 07:13 AM
Smith arrives at Dove Valley
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f321/jasongorgas/midgetelf-1.jpg

Even though I am not really pissed at the pick , the player. it looks like he was put on a stretcher machine and grew a few inches.

lex
04-29-2009, 07:19 AM
We will all find out soon enough, but from what i've seen he may very well be the best CB this draft.

We will compare him to D-Will, but I watched Darrent a lot in college, and this kid looks much, much better.

He can play man, and may already be the best zone corner on the team - including Champ. Watch the dude play in open space, he's instinctive and lightning fast. JMFW has absolutely zero chance to beat this kid out. I understand he is lacking Andre Goodman's experience, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Smith take the starting job by about game 4-6.

Quite honestly, he's better than DWill. I see people wanting to make the comparison because both are short but I think if you compare his body of work in college, Smith's is better...and it should be considering where the two were drafted.

I also see the Dre Bly comparison being made. I actually think Smith is better than Bly coming out of college too. Bly also had a boatload of INTs in college but he doesnt tackle like Smith. Smith can actually return and block punts. Also, he seems to be less risky than Bly, though time will tell on that one.

I really like the guy. I just hate the fact that we gave up next years first for him. I would have preferred moving up with our 2 3rds and our 2nd. I think we could have maybe waited it out on McBath and Quinn after trading up for Smith. I think the FO really botched how they went about moving up to get Smith...and it certainly should have been the lower of our two firsts next year if any. It was just very novice the way they went about it. Extremely wasteful.

Gcver2ver3
04-29-2009, 07:28 AM
I'm not
All I see is the other team creating a machup of a 5'9" coner on a 6'3" WR in the back of the endzone for a jump ball for TD after TD. Dude might be able to play but he can't out jump his one physical limitations of his god given hieght when competing with other that are alot bigger.

people get too caught up in his height...

first off...Smith has insane leaping ability so he can reach the same point or higher as most other CBs...

and also, we see corners of ALL heights get out jumped by the bigger WRs in the endzone...that's a common occurrence no matter who you have at corner...Goodman would be outjumped just as easily as well...

look for Smith to be a real threat as opening day starter...

Mogulseeker
04-29-2009, 07:29 AM
Wow, how can you not like Alphonso Smith?

We had a 1st round pick that could possibly be anywhere on the board from a top-five pick to a bottom-five pick, and we traded it for second-round value.

Dagmar
04-29-2009, 07:35 AM
We had a 1st round pick that could possibly be anywhere on the board from a top-five pick to a bottom-five pick, and we traded it for second-round value.

In the wek leading up to the draft everyone on this board, EVERYONE was talking about how a top 5 pick was bad because of the money you have to pay a rookie. Now everyone is bemoaning losing one!

It won't be a top 5 pick anyway though.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 07:38 AM
Gee, ya think?

It's the way the forum seems to have gone though, sadly.

There's the pro-McDaniels people and the anti-McDaniels people. And each group will look to either praise or criticise every single move the team makes at any opportunity they can, depending on their own particular agenda.

Luckily there's still some posters out there who have kept some objectivity, but sadly they're a minority at the moment.

No doubt the "objective" posters are the ones who agree with you. Ha!

Believe it or not, there are some people (like me) who aren't in any "camp" whatsoever, except the Broncos camp. They just have a healthy respect for reality and are skeptical. I was with Mac through the whole Cutler affair. I don't agree at all with this draft. I'm okay with the Moreno/Ayers picks, but I rate the rest of it a disaster. I think people painting Smith as the second coming of Champ, or even of DW, are mistaken, and I would much rather have that #1 pick next year. Very much.

lex
04-29-2009, 07:38 AM
people get too caught up in his height...

first off...Smith has insane leaping ability so he can reach the same point or higher as most other CBs...

and also, we see corners of ALL heights get out jumped by the bigger WRs in the endzone...that's a common occurrence no matter who you have at corner...Goodman would be outjumped just as easily as well...

look for Smith to be a real threat as opening day starter...

A lot of the getting outjumped is timing the jump which, in some cases, goes back to instincts. If you can read the play and have a sense of whats going on, you can better time your jump.

Mogulseeker
04-29-2009, 07:41 AM
In the wek leading up to the draft everyone on this board, EVERYONE was talking about how a top 5 pick was bad because of the money you have to pay a rookie. Now everyone is bemoaning losing one!

It won't be a top 5 pick anyway though.

I said in another thread that I think 11-5 is feasable.

It's a high risk / high reward game McDaniels is playing right now.

Beantown Bronco
04-29-2009, 07:47 AM
Believe it or not, there are some people (like me) who aren't in any "camp" whatsoever, except the Broncos camp. They just have a healthy respect for reality and are skeptical.

It's pretty obvious that asking some here to distinguish between negativitiy or skepticism and realism is obviously asking way too much.

lex
04-29-2009, 07:49 AM
It's pretty obvious that asking some here to distinguish between negativitiy or skepticism and realism is obviously asking way too much.

And fortunately we have you to be a beacon of truth.

Beantown Bronco
04-29-2009, 07:54 AM
And fortunately we have you to be a beacon of truth.

Nah, The Truth is busy smacking around the Bulls right now.

Conklin
04-29-2009, 07:57 AM
Smith arrives at Dove Valley
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f321/jasongorgas/midgetelf-1.jpg

somebody let him outta that box so he can breathe

The Joker
04-29-2009, 08:01 AM
No doubt the "objective" posters are the ones who agree with you. Ha!

Believe it or not, there are some people (like me) who aren't in any "camp" whatsoever, except the Broncos camp. They just have a healthy respect for reality and are skeptical. I was with Mac through the whole Cutler affair. I don't agree at all with this draft. I'm okay with the Moreno/Ayers picks, but I rate the rest of it a disaster. I think people painting Smith as the second coming of Champ, or even of DW, are mistaken, and I would much rather have that #1 pick next year. Very much.

For the record I'm still more or less on the fence when it comes to McDaniels. Like some of what he's done, not too keen on other things.

I never said that you or anyone in particular was of the blindly preaching your own agenda disposition, just that there are quite a lot of those people on the forum at the minute.

As regards the Smith pick, I just don't see why everyone is so bent out of shape about the whole thing. I was a bit miffed at first, but it makes sense when you think about it.

Cornerback was a year or two away from becoming a dire need, if they see one they like why not pounce on him now rather than waiting and hoping another guy they like as much comes along next year?

At the end of the day, we won't know the value we lost/gained on the Smith pick until the 2010 season. If he plays to the level you'd expect a first round rookie corner to in 2010, we'll have gotten fair value.

Even if we end up with a Top 10 pick, if Smith can be a good cornerback for us then I don't see the problem.

The following is a list of corners taken in the Top 10 since the turn of the century.

Pacman Jones, Carlos Rogers, Antrel Rolle, DeAngelo Hall, Dunta Robinson, Terrence Newman and Quentin Jammer.

It's hardly anything to get excited about.

lex
04-29-2009, 08:17 AM
Nah, The Truth is busy smacking around the Bulls right now.

No youre the beacon of truth and your self-righteous spiel proves that.

Tombstone RJ
04-29-2009, 08:18 AM
On the height issue, the 2009 Pro Bowl corners, including guys who didn't play and their injury replacements:

Al Harris 6-1
Charles Woodson 6-1
Antoine Winfield 5-9
Asante Samuel 5-10
Ronde Barber 5-10

Nnamdi Asomugha 6-2
Cortland Finnegan 5-10
Darrelle Revis 5-11


So one pro bowl corner was Smith's height, 3 more were one inch taller. Hmm, maybe it won't be so big of an issue.

Dude can flat out PLAY! He's a guy I'd love the Broncos to have because he tackles too. If Smith is like Winfield, I'm happier than a pig in schit.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-29-2009, 08:19 AM
I'm not
All I see is the other team creating a machup of a 5'9" coner on a 6'3" WR in the back of the endzone for a jump ball for TD after TD. Dude might be able to play but he can't out jump his one physical limitations of his god given hieght when competing with other that are alot bigger.

You act like he's the first short corner ever in the NFL. Tell Antoine Winfield that he always gets beat by jump balls

outdoor_miner
04-29-2009, 08:22 AM
For the record I'm still more or less on the fence when it comes to McDaniels. Like some of what he's done, not too keen on other things.

I never said that you or anyone in particular was of the blindly preaching your own agenda disposition, just that there are quite a lot of those people on the forum at the minute.

As regards the Smith pick, I just don't see why everyone is so bent out of shape about the whole thing. I was a bit miffed at first, but it makes sense when you think about it.

Cornerback was a year or two away from becoming a dire need, if they see one they like why not pounce on him now rather than waiting and hoping another guy they like as much comes along next year?

At the end of the day, we won't know the value we lost/gained on the Smith pick until the 2010 season. If he plays to the level you'd expect a first round rookie corner to in 2010, we'll have gotten fair value.

Even if we end up with a Top 10 pick, if Smith can be a good cornerback for us then I don't see the problem.

The following is a list of corners taken in the Top 10 since the turn of the century.

Pacman Jones, Carlos Rogers, Antrel Rolle, DeAngelo Hall, Dunta Robinson, Terrence Newman and Quentin Jammer.

It's hardly anything to get excited about.

Good post. In my opinion, if Smith plays like a First Rounder, then the trade was worth it. He doesn't have to be a Super Star. I think he needs to be a starter by 2010 and play at a high level throughout his contract. People forget the number of first round draft picks that bust...

MileHighMagic
04-29-2009, 08:34 AM
Lenny Walls was 6'4

Height isn't everything.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 08:43 AM
For the record I'm still more or less on the fence when it comes to McDaniels. Like some of what he's done, not too keen on other things.

I never said that you or anyone in particular was of the blindly preaching your own agenda disposition, just that there are quite a lot of those people on the forum at the minute.

As regards the Smith pick, I just don't see why everyone is so bent out of shape about the whole thing. I was a bit miffed at first, but it makes sense when you think about it.

Cornerback was a year or two away from becoming a dire need, if they see one they like why not pounce on him now rather than waiting and hoping another guy they like as much comes along next year?

At the end of the day, we won't know the value we lost/gained on the Smith pick until the 2010 season. If he plays to the level you'd expect a first round rookie corner to in 2010, we'll have gotten fair value.

Even if we end up with a Top 10 pick, if Smith can be a good cornerback for us then I don't see the problem.

The following is a list of corners taken in the Top 10 since the turn of the century.

Pacman Jones, Carlos Rogers, Antrel Rolle, DeAngelo Hall, Dunta Robinson, Terrence Newman and Quentin Jammer.

It's hardly anything to get excited about.

In all honesty to the board, I do have an agenda. I really wanted Mount Cody on the Broncos next year. There. I said it. When Mac used that #1 pick to take Smith, I said to myself, "Well, there goes Cody." So. There's my bias, right out in the open. Smith better be damn good, because Cody is a monster.

TheDave
04-29-2009, 08:44 AM
Like many others have said...

I have no problem wih Alphonso Smith the player. I have a big problem with giving up our #1 next year for it.

If we make the playoffs and this pick is somewhere in the mid 20's then I will be more than happy to bump this and take down some crow (assuming Smith shows he can play in this league). On the other hand if we go 4-12 and and Seattle is sitting @ #4 with (insert franchise QB name here) on the board then I'm going to come uncorked.

I think thats how a lot of us feel about it.

Meck77
04-29-2009, 08:49 AM
What is the guys vertical jump? If he's the athlete they say he is the guy can probably jump 40 plus inches. My point is the kid can probably make up the 3-5 inches he's playing against very easily.

DrFate
04-29-2009, 08:59 AM
Obviously the brass wanted to get DBs that could generate turnovers, which this team has sucked at for ages. And I like that approach.

But again, there is a high risk this was a bad trade. If season 1 of the McDaniels regime is a 5 win campaign, and we lose out on a HOF-type QB/LB/DT/whatever, there may not be a season 2.

HILife
04-29-2009, 09:26 AM
I can't understand this teams love with short DB. Darrent Williams (R.I.P.), Dre Bly, Jack MF Williams and now Alphonso Smith? I like the pick I just don't like how they gave up so much for a nickle/possible limited starting corner.

HILife
04-29-2009, 09:28 AM
Obviously the brass wanted to get DBs that could generate turnovers, which this team has sucked at for ages. And I like that approach.

But again, there is a high risk this was a bad trade. If season 1 of the McDaniels regime is a 5 win campaign, and we lose out on a HOF-type QB/LB/DT/whatever, there may not be a season 2.

Everyone is in such a hurry to get rid of McDaniels. Mark my words, unless McDaniels makes a pass at Pat Bowlen there will be a season 2.

lex
04-29-2009, 09:31 AM
Everyone is in such a hurry to get rid of McDaniels. Mark my words, unless McDaniels makes a pass at Pat Bowlen there will be a season 2.


It seems like youre suggesting that Bowlen is behind him so he will be back. But depending on how it goes with the fanbase, Bowlen may have no choice.

HILife
04-29-2009, 09:42 AM
It seems like youre suggesting that Bowlen is behind him so he will be back. But depending on how it goes with the fanbase, Bowlen may have no choice.

I'm not really saying Bowlen is behind him. I'm more trying to say it would be silly to get rid of a coach after just one year. It doesn't allow for any consistence. I'm expecting a bad year with a new coach. If Denver gets to .500 I'll be more then happy with that. In year 2 I'm looking for playoffs. Year 3 or 4 should be considered a Superbowl contender.

lex
04-29-2009, 09:49 AM
I'm not really saying Bowlen is behind him. I'm more trying to say it would be silly to get rid of a coach after just one year. It doesn't allow for any consistence. I'm expecting a bad year with a new coach. If Denver gets to .500 I'll be more then happy with that. In year 2 I'm looking for playoffs. Year 3 or 4 should be considered a Superbowl contender.

He has caused too much turmoil to expect people to be patient. The Josh McDaniels article that was posted made reference to the fanbase and team execs being nervous the Josh McDaniels tenure might blow up in their face.

Paladin
04-29-2009, 10:03 AM
In all honesty to the board, I do have an agenda. I really wanted Mount Cody on the Broncos next year. There. I said it. When Mac used that #1 pick to take Smith, I said to myself, "Well, there goes Cody." So. There's my bias, right out in the open. Smith better be damn good, because Cody is a monster.

How do you know that the Broncos won't get him, anyway? You don't.

Further, the guy is big. I'll take your word for it. But the argument against most picks apply to him as well: He sure is great against college players, isn't he?

Maybe you project too much for him?

Relax.

mr007
04-29-2009, 10:05 AM
Like many others have said...

I have no problem wih Alphonso Smith the player. I have a big problem with giving up our #1 next year for it.

If we make the playoffs and this pick is somewhere in the mid 20's then I will be more than happy to bump this and take down some crow (assuming Smith shows he can play in this league). On the other hand if we go 4-12 and and Seattle is sitting @ #4 with (insert franchise QB name here) on the board then I'm going to come uncorked.

I think thats how a lot of us feel about it.

This is spot on. None of us are really in any position to make judgement on the current decisions of the FO. I'm definitely skeptical of the way things went down and I personally think we could have done things better/differently, but I'm not a scout or in the position to evaluate players, so I'll take the wait and see approach.

Like Dave said, if the picks we seemingly gave up too much to get don't turn out, and it results in ruining the value we received for Cutler, I'm going to be seriously pissed off.

HILife
04-29-2009, 10:08 AM
He has caused too much turmoil to expect people to be patient. The Josh McDaniels article that was posted made reference to the fanbase and team execs being nervous the Josh McDaniels tenure might blow up in their face.

point well taken. We will have to take a wait and see attuditude.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 10:40 AM
How do you know that the Broncos won't get him, anyway? You don't.

Further, the guy is big. I'll take your word for it. But the argument against most picks apply to him as well: He sure is great against college players, isn't he?

Maybe you project too much for him?

Relax.

No reason to get upset. Just a simple observation. Say after me, "Serenity now." ;D

Broncomutt
04-29-2009, 10:43 AM
I am excited about the possibilities Smith brings.

His height is a concern though. I seriously doubt he will ever lead the league in rebounds.

Drek
04-29-2009, 10:47 AM
What is the guys vertical jump? If he's the athlete they say he is the guy can probably jump 40 plus inches. My point is the kid can probably make up the 3-5 inches he's playing against very easily.
34.5" if I recall.

His physical measurables are nearly identical to Bly's, typically just slightly better.

fdf
04-29-2009, 11:14 AM
If we make the playoffs and this pick is somewhere in the mid 20's then I will be more than happy to bump this and take down some crow (assuming Smith shows he can play in this league). On the other hand if we go 4-12 and and Seattle is sitting @ #4 with (insert franchise QB name here) on the board then I'm going to come uncorked.


But that's a 20/20 hindsight approach. The pick is not a high first round pick or a low first round yet. It is a "somewhere in the first round" pick. So it has the value of a mid-round first round pick next year, NOW. Then, as I understand it, the teams regard a first next year as equivalent to a second this year in value.

So what we traded has an expected value NOW of a mid-second round pick. We got a mid second round pick and used it for Smith. If management is right, we got a guy who should have gone in the first round. That sounds like good value, if they did their homework on Smith right.

But to evaluate the value of the trade NOW, based on what we can't know until next year, doesn't make any sense.

It's like fans who, AFTER TD was tearing up the league, went thru their teams draft that year and said, "Our McCoach was stupid. He should have picked TD in the 1st round, ahead of Denver, instead of [fill in the name of a first round bust from that draft]." But if the league had known before the draft that TD was one of the great RB's of all time, everyone would have drafted him in the first.

fdf
04-29-2009, 11:26 AM
I'm not really saying Bowlen is behind him. I'm more trying to say it would be silly to get rid of a coach after just one year. It doesn't allow for any consistence. I'm expecting a bad year with a new coach. If Denver gets to .500 I'll be more then happy with that. In year 2 I'm looking for playoffs. Year 3 or 4 should be considered a Superbowl contender.

A rare, sensible post. Thanks.

Personally, I think your timeline is a little quick--I suspect there may be an additional year in there--the D was awfully bad and declining last year. But the analysis is spot on. Part of this team's problems came from constant rotation of Defensive coaches. You don't fix that in one year. We tried to do that already. Maybe it takes two to get the D going the right direction.

Inkana7
04-29-2009, 11:34 AM
It seems like youre suggesting that Bowlen is behind him so he will be back. But depending on how it goes with the fanbase, Bowlen may have no choice.

Believe it or not, you are not a representation of the Denver Broncos fan base as a whole, lex.

TheDave
04-29-2009, 11:35 AM
But that's a 20/20 hindsight approach. The pick is not a high first round pick or a low first round yet. It is a "somewhere in the first round" pick. So it has the value of a mid-round first round pick next year, NOW. Then, as I understand it, the teams regard a first next year as equivalent to a second this year in value.

So what we traded has an expected value NOW of a mid-second round pick. We got a mid second round pick and used it for Smith. If management is right, we got a guy who should have gone in the first round. That sounds like good value, if they did their homework on Smith right.

But to evaluate the value of the trade NOW, based on what we can't know until next year, doesn't make any sense.

It's like fans who, AFTER TD was tearing up the league, went thru their teams draft that year and said, "Our McCoach was stupid. He should have picked TD in the 1st round, ahead of Denver, instead of [fill in the name of a first round bust from that draft]." But if the league had known before the draft that TD was one of the great RB's of all time, everyone would have drafted him in the first.

Whatever... This was a roll of the dice.

If Smith is a player and this pick is in the middle to end of the 1st round, I won't care much about it.

If it turns out to be Sam Bradford (or some other franchise type player) then it was a stupid move.

Right now between our record last season, or defensive deficiencies, the fact that we are learning new schemes on both sides of the ball, we lost a pro-bowl QB, and this brutal schedule... the odds say this pick will be a high one.

The coach put his nuts on the table with this move... he's either going to look like a genius or an idiot.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 11:36 AM
But that's a 20/20 hindsight approach. The pick is not a high first round pick or a low first round yet. It is a "somewhere in the first round" pick. So it has the value of a mid-round first round pick next year, NOW. Then, as I understand it, the teams regard a first next year as equivalent to a second this year in value.

So what we traded has an expected value NOW of a mid-second round pick. We got a mid second round pick and used it for Smith. If management is right, we got a guy who should have gone in the first round. That sounds like good value, if they did their homework on Smith right.

But to evaluate the value of the trade NOW, based on what we can't know until next year, doesn't make any sense.

It's like fans who, AFTER TD was tearing up the league, went thru their teams draft that year and said, "Our McCoach was stupid. He should have picked TD in the 1st round, ahead of Denver, instead of [fill in the name of a first round bust from that draft]." But if the league had known before the draft that TD was one of the great RB's of all time, everyone would have drafted him in the first.

I would agree, if human beings were unable to delay gratification or plan ahead. I'm sure if I offered my dog the choice between one biscuit now, or no biscuit now, but three later, he would just give me a stupid look and beg for whatever he could get now. To him, "later" doesn't exist. Not so for us humans.

You can rate the value of these picks however you want. The truth is that two firsts equal the ability to trade up. That's just a fact. We already know that next year's draft will be much stronger than this one. We also know that whatever the Broncos do this year, it is not going to complete the job of building up a defense that is a smoking ruin. No doubt it will take a few drafts. Maybe Mac feels that he won't be around long if he doesn't make immediate, bold moves, and screw the future. Perhaps he's right.

Next April, when we're sitting there watching the Seahawks making a top ten selection (I hope not, but let's just say), I doubt that any Broncos fans are going to be saying, "Well, it's okay 'cause it's really only worth a mid-second round pick." Ha!

TheDave
04-29-2009, 11:37 AM
34.5" if I recall.

His physical measurables are nearly identical to Bly's, typically just slightly better.

If his vertical is only 34" were ****ed...

EDIT: just looked it up... it is... were ****ed.

MVP-06
04-29-2009, 11:40 AM
I recall a certain 6'4" Bronco DB who sucked balls.

I'll take a 5'9" gamer who can cover over him or any other DB that has height.

The kid seems to have "it". Always around the ball and in the right spot at the right time. Ty law made a good living doing that same thing

cutthemdown
04-29-2009, 11:46 AM
If his vertical is only 34" were ****ed...

Are you kidding? he had a 10'9 broad jump that wowed people at combine. Also a low 4.34 short shuttle which shows he has great short area quickness and turns hips well.

Also 34 is almost 3 feet of the ground. That puts his head almost 9 feet from ground. With his instincts and body control I'd say he can jump with most WR.

Also Jenkins vertical was 33 and his broad jump 10'4.

Lolad
04-29-2009, 11:49 AM
I don't think any body minds the pick. Its what we gave up + the fact that we still don't have a pass rush. Unless our Dline players from last year flip a switch and start generating one.

TheDave
04-29-2009, 11:53 AM
Are you kidding? he had a 10'9 broad jump that wowed people at combine. Also a low 4.34 short shuttle which shows he has great short area quickness and turns hips well.

Also 34 is almost 3 feet of the ground. That puts his head almost 9 feet from ground. With his instincts and body control I'd say he can jump with most WR.

Also Jenkins vertical was 33 and his broad jump 10'4.

What ever you say boss... I get real nervous when an undersized DB has below average vertical.

Hopefully he just ****ed up that test 'cause a 34" vert is pathetic.

Los Broncos
04-29-2009, 12:01 PM
Smith arrives at Dove Valley
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f321/jasongorgas/midgetelf-1.jpg

ROFL!

TonyR
04-29-2009, 12:02 PM
He has caused too much turmoil to expect people to be patient.

If by "people" you mean Pat Bowlen then yes. He's the only "people" who really has a vote. And since Bowlen is the one who pulled the trigger on Shanahan, and there are indications that he also pulled the trigger on Cutler at the end of that saga, I think he fully supports his current head coach. The fact that some crybaby fans don't at this point doesn't really matter at the end of the day.

Caligula
04-29-2009, 12:05 PM
Many had him as the third best corner in the Draft..... so why would some say he was a 'first round pick'..... I've heard some evaluations state "he was a sure first round pick if he was just 2" taller." Great. If I was 5 inches taller, muscled, had a big arm, and had talent... I would be a 1st round talent too.

The point is, he's NOT 2" taller. He's not extraordinarily fast, and to me he's the SAME player we have in Jack Williams.

I'm sure he's a great guy, and a fine football player. But if we just finish the season 8-8, and have a top 12 pick again...we paid TOOOOO much for him. Especially when we know that our DL is going, again, to have the same problems as before.

Trading Cutler was MORONIC. But the ONE thing that attempted to take some of that away was knowing we had another season with 2 first round picks in it. This year was the FIRST time in Bronco history to have 2 first round picks, and we would have had TWO of those in a row. If just HALF of those first round picks were taken on DL, it would have been AWESOME. Now... having a low mid 1st and a small cb just doesn't have the same punch, no matter how well Smith plays.

We've had GOOD corners the last 5 years... how well has that helped our pass rush? Smith isn't another Bailey

Caligula
04-29-2009, 12:07 PM
He better be DAMNED good. Because he will ALWAYS be attached as a 1st round pick. If that pick is a top-10 like I expect it to be next year, then he's a TOP 10 player in the draft. He better be DAMNED good because he can't play NT worth a crap.

The Joker
04-29-2009, 12:21 PM
In all honesty to the board, I do have an agenda. I really wanted Mount Cody on the Broncos next year. There. I said it. When Mac used that #1 pick to take Smith, I said to myself, "Well, there goes Cody." So. There's my bias, right out in the open. Smith better be damn good, because Cody is a monster.

This is fair enough, it's something that definitely crossed my mind as well when I realised we'd lost the pick.

Still, I'll still hold out hope on that front.

Next year's DT class is absolutely ridiculous, which should result in some guys falling and Cody could easily be there when we pick. I'd bet Chicago's pick will end up being in the 15-25 range.

Gerald McCoy will surely be the first of them off the board, and Cody and then Suh are surefire first round picks on top of that. Then guys like Lawrence Marsh and Marvin Austin could pass Cody if they put up the numbers this year that they're capable of.

Jarvis Jenkins and Boo Robinson are also very good NT prospects should we miss out on Cody, so all wouldn't be lost.

Obviously though, Cody is the dream and if he is there when the Seahawks use our pick and Alphonso Smith is looking like a bust, then it'll be a very valid arguement.

cutthemdown
04-29-2009, 12:23 PM
Wasn't he like the all time conference leader in interceptions? Did Jack Williams do that? Besides Jack Williams played like mary when he got his chance. If this kid plays like Jack mutha crappy Williams then yes I will be pissed we traded a first for him.

outdoor_miner
04-29-2009, 12:31 PM
Right now between our record last season, or defensive deficiencies, the fact that we are learning new schemes on both sides of the ball, we lost a pro-bowl QB, and this brutal schedule... the odds say this pick will be a high one.

The coach put his nuts on the table with this move... he's either going to look like a genius or an idiot.

I would consider myself a McDaniels "supporter" (in the sense that I am optimistic about our future with him), but I agree with you here. In my opinion, everything he has said and done this offseason indicates that they are planning to win right now. They are not "rebuilding". He has repeatedly set the "win now" expectation and now needs to deliver on it. He signed a bunch of older veterans to shore up the defense instead of signing younger guys with "potential". In fact, he basically recruited those guys on the concept that Denver is a contender (pretty much why Dawkins came). He tinkered with an offense that many considered to be the top young offense in the league, and then didn't hesitate to blow it up entirely once Cutler went AWOL. He took the assets acquired from the Cutler trade and immediately turned them around for players that would contribute this year. He took away our "trade up" potential for next year, leaving us with what will likely be a mid first round pick in 2010. He "moved up" multiple times in the draft, never once trading for future picks. Every interview indicates that the team expects to win now. I, for one, will be very disappointed if we do not make a serious playoff push this year, and expect even more the following year.

And this is something I really like about him. He has set the expectations very high, and has not made a single move that indicates he will deflect blame if things go wrong this year. I hate coaches that are afraid... The guys that punt when they're down by 14 in the fourth quarter. The guys who throw their players and assistant coaches under the bus when things go wrong. There is no question who will be to blame if we struggle. It will be Josh McDaniels, and all indications are that he wants it this way. It would have been so much easier for him to sit on next years two first rounders. If the Broncos were to struggle this year, he could point to those and say "We lost Jay, but we've got some ammo to fix things." He could have drafted D-Line and said, "We did everything we can do to fix it, but it's going to take time" Those would have been much easier and less open to criticism, but he has chosen a path that has put him in everyone's cross-hairs, including the fans and media.

I'm guessing the players appreciate this. I get the feeling the Broncos are well setup for an "Us" vs. "Them" mentality next year. This is something the Patriots have thrived on as well. Remember all the vomit inducing "We get no respect" crap they were spewing the last few years? It's nauseating from the outside, but it can galvanize a team. I think we've got that potential next year with all the haterade from the local and national media these last few months.

Of course, there is the potential that he is like "Ryan The Temp" from The Office... He rose from obscurity to become VP of Sales, and then crashes and burns in a flameout of epic proportions. I can definitely see that as a possibility, as well. Either way, this will be an interesting two years. We should know all we need to know by then.

:pimp:

cutthemdown
04-29-2009, 12:35 PM
What ever you say boss... I get real nervous when an undersized DB has below average vertical.

Hopefully he just ****ed up that test 'cause a 34" vert is pathetic.

It isn't as good as you would hope but sometimes a guy just isn't good at a drill. His broad jump tells me he has hops.

Also jumping on the football field, and jumping in a drill are 2 different things.

The kid is a ball hawk, is the all time interception leader in his conference, I'd say he has a chance to be really good despite a vertical that is pedestrian. Just wait and watch him play, Boss Bailey had one of the best vertical jumps the combine ever saw, but he stinks as a player.

Football more about instincts and playing physical then it is about speed and jumping really high.

Paladin
04-29-2009, 12:39 PM
What ever you say boss... I get real nervous when an undersized DB has below average vertical.

Hopefully he just ****ed up that test 'cause a 34" vert is pathetic.

Pathetic? Can you jump that high? Show dated pics if you can......

TheDave
04-29-2009, 12:43 PM
Pathetic? Can you jump that high? Show dated pics if you can......

Actually, at his age... yes I could.

I was a pretty good high jumper in HS. ;D

jesus... I'm sounding like Al Bundy

cutthemdown
04-29-2009, 12:46 PM
Actually when jumping for a ball it has more to do with timing and agility then how high you can leap. It's about instincts and body control. IMO Smith has that. If he times his jumps right he has enough hops to make plays.

Besides Broncos IMO are going to have some safety's back there to help out. Goodman and Smith will get more help then Dre Bly got last yr that is for sure 100%

DarkHorse
04-29-2009, 12:58 PM
I have yet to see a combine drill play out exactly as it would on the field.

Cannot take into account adrenaline, for one.

TheDave
04-29-2009, 01:00 PM
Hey I hope all you guys are right... hell I hope he turns out to be Darrel Green.

I doubt it, but I'll be happy if I'm wrong.

UberBroncoMan
04-29-2009, 01:03 PM
34.5" if I recall.

His physical measurables are nearly identical to Bly's, typically just slightly better.

Actually he's a little below Bly. They're basically identical in everything including 40 time, however Smith is 1 inch shorter and had a longer shuttle time. On a side note it's actually Bly's record in the ACC that Smith broke by 1 INT. However that's because they counted Bowl game stats and they didn't do that during Bly's time (or at least that's what Bly says).

As The Dave said though, I wouldn't mind this kid turning into Darrell Green. The odds of that type of success on any draft pick each year is ridiculously low though. It would be nice to strike long term gold on two-three of our pickups this year.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 01:26 PM
Yeah, but can he keep up with Darrius "The Flash" Bey? ;D

longtimer
04-29-2009, 01:27 PM
Like many others have said...

I have no problem wih Alphonso Smith the player. I have a big problem with giving up our #1 next year for it.

If we make the playoffs and this pick is somewhere in the mid 20's then I will be more than happy to bump this and take down some crow (assuming Smith shows he can play in this league). On the other hand if we go 4-12 and and Seattle is sitting @ #4 with (insert franchise QB name here) on the board then I'm going to come uncorked.

I think thats how a lot of us feel about it.

Amen to that!!!
The other issue I have is who else was on the board when we pick smith. any CB really SUCK when the front seven can not get pressure on the QB. Champ looked AVERAGE at times last year with out a pass rush.

Requiem
04-29-2009, 01:33 PM
He also gets after the quarterback getting sacks, blocks punts, etc. He was rated very highly by many teams and was our #1 cornerback according to Xanders. I'm glad we got him. He is a baller.

longtimer
04-29-2009, 01:33 PM
You act like he's the first short corner ever in the NFL. Tell Antoine Winfield that he always gets beat by jump balls

When I watch football games it seems like the short CB gets abused by bigger WR with jump balls. I wish I could find out how many TD or Receptions Shorter CB give up to Biger WR. It could just be a perception thing.

There are 64 starting CB in the leauge how many of them are under 5'10"?

longtimer
04-29-2009, 01:44 PM
What is the guys vertical jump? If he's the athlete they say he is the guy can probably jump 40 plus inches. My point is the kid can probably make up the 3-5 inches he's playing against very easily.

That would depend on the WR he competing agianst it the WR can jum the the same distants then the WR wins. The other aspect of this is the proportion of the body. Smaller CB will have arm length in porprotion to there bady size in other words the biger you are the longer your arm are going to be normally.
So if he's giving up 3-5 inches he's going to have to be able to jump 5 to 10 " higher just to make up the hieght difference.

Drek
04-29-2009, 01:53 PM
Actually he's a little below Bly. They're basically identical in everything including 40 time, however Smith is 1 inch shorter and had a longer shuttle time. On a side note it's actually Bly's record in the ACC that Smith broke by 1 INT. However that's because they counted Bowl game stats and they didn't do that during Bly's time (or at least that's what Bly says).

As The Dave said though, I wouldn't mind this kid turning into Darrell Green. The odds of that type of success on any draft pick each year is ridiculously low though. It would be nice to strike long term gold on two-three of our pickups this year.
His 40 and 3-cone where a hair better than Bly's, while Bly had a small edge in the 20 yard shuttle.

They're really nearly identical players, except Smith has shown himself to be a bit more physical and a more willing tackler as an incoming rookie.

And there is no way that's a bad thing. I'm sorry, I know people here have some crazy bias against Dre Bly but the guy was an elite corner in this league for a respectable chunk of time. Its not his fault he spent the last three years in a busted cover 2 that played away from his strengths, not too them, and then two years on a defense with no legitimate safety help, no pass rush, and that placed him opposite Champ Bailey while still asking him to help out in the running game more than he ever had before in his career.

Br0nc0Buster
04-29-2009, 01:55 PM
Actually he's a little below Bly. They're basically identical in everything including 40 time, however Smith is 1 inch shorter and had a longer shuttle time. On a side note it's actually Bly's record in the ACC that Smith broke by 1 INT. However that's because they counted Bowl game stats and they didn't do that during Bly's time (or at least that's what Bly says).

As The Dave said though, I wouldn't mind this kid turning into Darrell Green. The odds of that type of success on any draft pick each year is ridiculously low though. It would be nice to strike long term gold on two-three of our pickups this year.

He isnt going to be a Darell Green, McDaniels is looking for his next Ty Law/Asante Samuel.

Both those are also not the fastest out there, and both are around like 5'9"-5'10"

He wants someone with good instincts and someone with good ball skills

footstepsfrom#27
04-29-2009, 01:55 PM
He's a rookie Dre Bly. Ask another question.

Beantown Bronco
04-29-2009, 02:02 PM
Dre Bly, Ty Law, Asante Samuel

A career on par with any of the above would more than justify the trade up IMO.

Rohirrim
04-29-2009, 02:05 PM
Dre Bly, Ty Law, Asante Samuel

A career on par with any of the above would more than justify the trade up IMO.

I agree. I don't see how anybody can argue this isn't a gamble. If it pays off (like above) Mac has played a winning hand. If not...

HILife
04-29-2009, 02:32 PM
A rare, sensible post. Thanks.

Personally, I think your timeline is a little quick--I suspect there may be an additional year in there--the D was awfully bad and declining last year. But the analysis is spot on. Part of this team's problems came from constant rotation of Defensive coaches. You don't fix that in one year. We tried to do that already. Maybe it takes two to get the D going the right direction.

Thanks for the compliment. The timeline is a little quick, but that's only because I believe he can get it done. I have high hopes for McDaniels and will fully support him. If he turns this team into an Oakland Raider like several seasons then he will lose my support, but until then I'm backing him up.

Elway777
04-29-2009, 02:32 PM
people get too caught up in his height...

first off...Smith has insane leaping ability so he can reach the same point or higher as most other CBs...

and also, we see corners of ALL heights get out jumped by the bigger WRs in the endzone...that's a common occurrence no matter who you have at corner...Goodman would be outjumped just as easily as well...

look for Smith to be a real threat as opening day starter... Actually I thing he has a touble verticle leap. One of the worst of all the corner in draft.

Elway777
04-29-2009, 02:52 PM
Actually I thing he has a touble verticle leap. One of the worst of all the corner in draft. I looked it up Smith had a 34 inch vertical ,which isn't to bad but still only ranked him 25 at the combine for corners.

Inkana7
04-29-2009, 03:52 PM
He's a pahokee player, too. They just produce nothing but ballers down there.

Pony Boy
04-29-2009, 04:23 PM
He is a solid CB and plays under control and when he steps up his timing is great. I don't think anyone has any film on him where his vertical has hurt his game? What's not to love about this kid? I would rather see a player on the field than have a future draft selection sitting on the shelf.

BMarsh615
04-29-2009, 04:42 PM
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Tombstone RJ
04-29-2009, 04:44 PM
Dre Bly, Ty Law, Asante Samuel

A career on par with any of the above would more than justify the trade up IMO.

I'd take Antoine Winfield over any of those guys. Winfield is a ligit 5'9" and I've watched him flat out dominate games.

Winfield is the closest thing to Champ Bailey that I see in the NFL. He does benefit from a good supporting cast in Minnesota, but they are not a dominant defense by any means.

BMarsh615
04-29-2009, 04:49 PM
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:pimp:

NUB
04-29-2009, 09:16 PM
Asomugha has been a shutdown corner these past years...

As for Smith... It's not just his height, but his speed. If he's got coverage skills than he's got 'em, but I can't help but see him getting burned big time by quite a few of the quicker NFL receivers.

Anaximines
04-29-2009, 10:29 PM
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Odysseus
04-29-2009, 11:51 PM
We will all find out soon enough, but from what i've seen he may very well be the best CB this draft.

We will compare him to D-Will, but I watched Darrent a lot in college, and this kid looks much, much better.

He can play man, and may already be the best zone corner on the team - including Champ. Watch the dude play in open space, he's instinctive and lightning fast. JMFW has absolutely zero chance to beat this kid out. I understand he is lacking Andre Goodman's experience, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Smith take the starting job by about game 4-6.

I really hate that we always have to compare players in order to understand them. I think Smith is an aggressive gamer. I am looking forward to seeing him play.

GoBroncos DownUnder
04-30-2009, 12:02 AM
All the whining in here from the "Broncos gonna suck in 09 fans" ... this will probably be my last post on this site.


So now we have a short "ball hawk" corner, and people whine about him getting beat by the opposition's 6-3" receivers ... The way I look at it - this year SOMEONE has to cover Sproles out of the backfield and Welker on the short patterns!
And Smith sure sounds like "someone" to me!



Over and OUT!

Popps
04-30-2009, 12:05 AM
Smith had 21 career interceptions for the Demon Deacons and was just the third player in the past decade to have more than 20 interceptions in college campaign. Another Senior Bowl standout -- NFL Network's Mike Mayock raved about Smith, saying he was "snaring interceptions and smothering receivers all week" in Mobile, Ala.

Odysseus
04-30-2009, 12:32 AM
Smith had 21 career interceptions for the Demon Deacons and was just the third player in the past decade to have more than 20 interceptions in college campaign. Another Senior Bowl standout -- NFL Network's Mike Mayock raved about Smith, saying he was "snaring interceptions and smothering receivers all week" in Mobile, Ala.

This guy has bust written all over him. ;)

DBroncos4life
04-30-2009, 12:49 AM
The player is fine its what we gave up that may end up being hard to swallow.

Doggcow
04-30-2009, 01:34 AM
If a pass is laid in perfectly it doesnt matter if youre 7 foot 11, its comming in at such a steep angle youre ****ed. Ball skills are way more important, and staying with your man, breaking up the play at the point or preventing the pass from good coverage. Im not worried at all.

Rohirrim
04-30-2009, 05:54 AM
Let's see; Being critical and/or skeptical means "whining" and "hating." I got ya. Just wanted to get the code words straight. I guess there are many on here who would prefer this board turn into one giant herd of contented mooers. ;D

fontaine
04-30-2009, 06:06 AM
Let's see; Being critical and/or skeptical means "whining" and "hating." I got ya. Just wanted to get the code words straight. I guess there are many on here who would prefer this board turn into one giant herd of contented mooers. ;D

I like Smith as a player and his track record. But I do think we gave up far too much to get him.

There's no denying that Denver got raped in this deal and there's nothing wrong with saying that looking at the strength and depth of next years's draft. However, I still really like Smith as a player and think he'll be really good in our system if we can get any kind of pass rush going. I'm guessing he's going to be the nickle CB from day one.

Beantown Bronco
04-30-2009, 06:22 AM
All the whining in here from the "Broncos gonna suck in 09 fans" ... this will probably be my last post on this site.


Over and OUT!

:lombardi:

Rohirrim
04-30-2009, 07:24 AM
I like Smith as a player and his track record. But I do think we gave up far too much to get him.

There's no denying that Denver got raped in this deal and there's nothing wrong with saying that looking at the strength and depth of next years's draft. However, I still really like Smith as a player and think he'll be really good in our system if we can get any kind of pass rush going. I'm guessing he's going to be the nickle CB from day one.

Yep. He sounds like he might be a good CB. Also seems like a good character guy with an excellent attitude. The way I look at it is, if I have to choose between even a great CB and an equally good DT, I'll take the DT everytime. It's my basic football philosophy: Everything starts at the lines.

Mogulseeker
05-01-2009, 12:23 PM
Just watched his post draft presser on DB.com.... pretty cocky guy if you ask me. I like that.