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SpiritGuy
04-11-2009, 08:54 AM
What’s going on, everybody?

It’s been a while since I’ve last updated, and plenty has happened since then. Most importantly, we’re back in the locker room for offseason conditioning and I couldn’t be happier.

Coach Tuten has got us going, working hard, but as far as I’m concerned it’s fun. He has taken a little different approach this offseason — it seems like a lot of the stuff is a little more football oriented. He’s got us doing just enough to get guys pumped, but not enough to kill you.

Right now I can tell you the attitude in the locker room is definitely excited. We’ve got some changing faces and changing packages, and we’ve got some new coaches we can really get behind. The direction they’re taking us is a direction that I feel will be very successful. We have the pieces, now we’re ready to put the puzzle together and make things happen this season.

One of those pieces is Andra Davis — he’s a natural leader. He’s ready to motivate guys and he’s right there working as hard as anybody. He’s a vocal linebacker and a vocal leader — traits that we can definitely use in the locker room and on the field. The same can be said about Brian Dawkins at the safety position. It seems like that secondary will be pretty tough this season.

Now I know plenty of you want me to address the recent trade. First of all there were a lot of new changes anyway — over 50 percent of the locker room is made up of new guys. It’s kind of a weird feeling, because guys knew what was going on but at the same time we’re just trying to get better and focus on offseason training. It really wasn’t as much of a distraction in the locker room as it was maybe in the media and on TV. That just kind of shows the maturity that guys have in there — people weren’t talking about it much, we were just getting to work.

I’ve met Kyle Orton, and he’s a cool guy. There’s a lot of changes in the locker room and he’s a part of that. He has come on board and is already working hard, so we’re happy to have him.

But the good thing is when it comes down to it, it’s all about playing football, and we’re getting closer to doing that. We’ve got mini camps coming up next weekend, so I’m ready to get things rolling. Just being around the guys in the locker room has me excited for the season. We’ve got a lot of talent right now, and we’ve got some coaches that I know will put us in the right places and right situations to play our best football.

We’ve just got to take it one step at a time, and next weekend is the first step.

found here (http://blog.denverbroncos.com/dumervil/back-to-work-2/)

MrPeepers
04-11-2009, 09:41 AM
cool thanks for the post.

OABB
04-11-2009, 09:54 AM
Tuten is doing football related drills?!?!

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 10:00 AM
The Broncos site and player blogs might not be subject to the new content rules ... but remember it's basically just three paragraphs and a link I think.

From the day Josh and Nolan had their first meeting with Dumervil, I've been feeling pretty certain they've got him pencilled in at one of the OLB spots ... I wonder which.

Gcver2ver3
04-11-2009, 10:09 AM
look for Doom to have a big 2009...

worm
04-11-2009, 10:49 AM
Awesome to hear his thoughts on the leadership of Davis.

Him and Dawkins might not be the answer...but they can be nice bridge players.

So much rests on the draft this year. They need to find a player that can become the player DJ should have been. The face of the D. A vocal enforcer that will eventually lead by example from the DL or LB position.

Who in this draft can be that...because that player is not currently on this roster.

bronco_diesel
04-11-2009, 11:04 AM
Tuten is doing football related drills?!?!

sounds like his drills are designed to be more football related. i like this.
i also like that it sounds like he is doing enough but not too much.

i often felt that the strength and conditioning may have needed to be retooled here in denver. hope this works out!

Drek
04-11-2009, 11:07 AM
Awesome to hear his thoughts on the leadership of Davis.

Him and Dawkins might not be the answer...but they can be nice bridge players.

So much rests on the draft this year. They need to find a player that can become the player DJ should have been. The face of the D. A vocal enforcer that will eventually lead by example from the DL or LB position.

Who in this draft can be that...because that player is not currently on this roster.

This notion here doesn't work.

We can't go back to the days of Al Wilson carrying the defense, telling the entire front seven how to basically do their jobs and being the guy who holds everyone accountable.

That only ends in the disastrous results we've seen when said team leader has to move on.

This team needs to build a culture of accountability and tough play, from every player.

That is where Dawkins, Davis, and the like are most important. They can come in and not only provide a bridge in the starting lineup on the field, but also immediately give a veteran presence that younger players can learn from and be held accountable to. Given a few years of that and the entire culture of the locker room will be not unlike the Pats, Ravens, and Steelers, where every guy who is on the roster is expected to put the team first and foremost. Not just one guy trying to police a whole squad.

HEAV
04-11-2009, 11:12 AM
It really wasn’t as much of a distraction in the locker room as it was maybe in the media and on TV.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 11:12 AM
You're right, Drek ... but this year don't be surprised if the 3-4 vet and leader Davis isn't pointing everyone and their brother to the right spot.

Popps
04-11-2009, 11:18 AM
Right now I can tell you the attitude in the locker room is definitely excited. We’ve got some changing faces and changing packages, and we’ve got some new coaches we can really get behind. The direction they’re taking us is a direction that I feel will be very successful. We have the pieces, now we’re ready to put the puzzle together and make things happen this season.

Doesn't this idiot know they're going to be total failures for the rest of their careers?

Must not be reading this board, I guess.

Weird. I was sure this was going to "tear the locker room apart."

Gcver2ver3
04-11-2009, 11:33 AM
Right now I can tell you the attitude in the locker room is definitely excited. We’ve got some changing faces and changing packages, and we’ve got some new coaches we can really get behind. The direction they’re taking us is a direction that I feel will be very successful. We have the pieces, now we’re ready to put the puzzle together and make things happen this season.

Doesn't this idiot know they're going to be total failures for the rest of their careers?

Must not be reading this board, I guess.

Weird. I was sure this was going to "tear the locker room apart."

...:~ohyah!:

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 12:17 PM
No matter what anyone thinks about McDaniels, everything I've read and everyone I've talked to that's met him really buys into what he's doing from a coaching stand point.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 12:24 PM
No matter what anyone thinks about McDaniels, everything I've read and everyone I've talked to that's met him really buys into what he's doing from a coaching stand point.
And what do you expect them to say? Nobody ever says otherwise in these situartions, Khan ...

Every statistic and all the history says Josh will be gone by 2012. That's just realistic. All the pro-Josh guys on this board are quite short-sighted. Shanahan's amazing longevity has lulled guys to sleep about the realities of NFL coaching tenures ....

Remember, Charlie Weis and Romeo Crennel were trumpeted as saviors when they left Belichick. And unlike Josh, those guys had lots of experience ... they experienced losing seasons, and they BUILT that Patriots dynasty. Josh was dropped into the dynasty and has never experienced losing. That, and the Goodman/Cutler problems mean there is every reason to expect he'll fail, and be gone by 2012.

Don't be surprised by 4-6 win seasons, guys. It's a tough league out there.

BroncoMan4ever
04-11-2009, 12:42 PM
The Broncos site and player blogs might not be subject to the new content rules ... but remember it's basically just three paragraphs and a link I think.

From the day Josh and Nolan had their first meeting with Dumervil, I've been feeling pretty certain they've got him pencilled in at one of the OLB spots ... I wonder which.

in Nolan's scheme he has one of the OLBs be simply a rush LB. he won't drop much into coverage, his main duty is just to rush the passer. that is the spot Doom will be in, and Moss will spell him at

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 12:48 PM
And what do you expect them to say? Nobody ever says otherwise in these situartions, Khan ...

.

Exactly right. They know where their bread is buttered. They know who signs the checks. I wouldn't want an all poweful little Caligula or Bowlen breathing down my neck if I played for the team, that's for sure.

No one is going to depart from the party line, now. No one.

Killericon
04-11-2009, 12:57 PM
And what do you expect them to say? Nobody ever says otherwise in these situartions, Khan ...

Every statistic and all the history says Josh will be gone by 2012. That's just realistic. All the pro-Josh guys on this board are quite short-sighted. Shanahan's amazing longevity has lulled guys to sleep about the realities of NFL coaching tenures ....

Remember, Charlie Weis and Romeo Crennel were trumpeted as saviors when they left Belichick. And unlike Josh, those guys had lots of experience ... they experienced losing seasons, and they BUILT that Patriots dynasty. Josh was dropped into the dynasty and has never experienced losing. That, and the Goodman/Cutler problems mean there is every reason to expect he'll fail, and be gone by 2012.

Don't be surprised by 4-6 win seasons, guys. It's a tough league out there.

Man, that's the worst argument ever.

HEAV
04-11-2009, 12:59 PM
And what do you expect them to say? Nobody ever says otherwise in these situartions, Khan ...

Every statistic and all the history says Josh will be gone by 2012. That's just realistic. All the pro-Josh guys on this board are quite short-sighted. Shanahan's amazing longevity has lulled guys to sleep about the realities of NFL coaching tenures ....

Remember, Charlie Weis and Romeo Crennel were trumpeted as saviors when they left Belichick. And unlike Josh, those guys had lots of experience ... they experienced losing seasons, and they BUILT that Patriots dynasty. Josh was dropped into the dynasty and has never experienced losing. That, and the Goodman/Cutler problems mean there is every reason to expect he'll fail, and be gone by 2012.

Don't be surprised by 4-6 win seasons, guys. It's a tough league out there.



Taco jock sniffers unit...again...

I swear you people want the team to fail just for the reason that you will be able to sit on a soap box (The Homer Lame) and type "I was right, I was right..."

So not one player will be on McDaniels side or buy into the concept. Ya right...


Also your comment about Josh not having experienced losing is just dumb. Or have the Patriots won the four (4) supers bowls? Oh ya they haven't, hell they lost a damn Super Bowl! Oh ya that's true McDaniels never had his franchise quarterback injured for the entire year...


For ****ing christ sakes. I really wish you sad Shanny people would let it go and support the team and a whole. Not just sit back and lurk waiting for you hero Taco to tell you when it's time to trash the current coach or quarterback.

Jay's gone, Shanny's gone, but the team remains. Let's all just sit back and watch what happens.

Stop your bull**** of laying seeds of doubt and discontent and just be a fan of the team.

HEAV
04-11-2009, 01:03 PM
Exactly right. They know where their bread is buttered. They know who signs the checks. I wouldn't want an all poweful little Caligula or Bowlen breathing down my neck if I played for the team, that's for sure.

No one is going to depart from the party line, now. No one.


Spealing of Taco Jock sniffers...
Is it me or are Mods the only people allowed to have sigs?

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 01:05 PM
And what do you expect them to say? Nobody ever says otherwise in these situartions, Khan ...

No that's not true at all. You don't often here players say they're excited about a new scheme unless it's genuinely the case. That doesn't mean it will produce results, and some good schemes are not fun for every player, but it does say they're buying in.


Exactly right. They know where their bread is buttered. They know who signs the checks. I wouldn't want an all poweful little Caligula or Bowlen breathing down my neck if I played for the team, that's for sure.

No one is going to depart from the party line, now. No one.
They were saying these comments before the Cutler trade, but if you think no one is genuinely excited about the scheme and they're all doing it out fear, you're wrong. I know that for a fact.

One thing I do agree with you on is there are no sacred cows on the team anymore. Everyone plays and everyone better produce or they're all gone. I like it that way. It's how it should be on a football team.

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 01:06 PM
Stop your bull**** of laying seeds of doubt and discontent and just be a fan of the team.

"You're either with us or against us".

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 01:07 PM
One thing I do agree with you on is there are no sacred cows on the team anymore. Everyone plays and everyone better produce or they're all gone. .

That's right. Including the coach. He better produce. And produce IMMEDIATELY. No excuses and no grace period.

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 01:09 PM
"You're either with us or against us".

I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? You're personally upset at McDaniels and want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Your position is completely emotional. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired. I bet there's even a few fans in Broncos country who are hoping we don't win a Championship with McDaniels. They are mad and want revenge at the expense of success for their favorite team.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 01:11 PM
I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? .

No, I don't think we can ever afford to take that stance. "Us" can never mean just the specific leadership group. It only means the team and what each individual thinks is what's best for the team.

HEAV
04-11-2009, 01:11 PM
That's right. Including the coach. He better produce. And produce IMMEDIATELY. No excuses and no grace period.

So I guess you wont be going to Denver this summer for camp then...or will you be there protesting wearing a Cutler jersey, a Shanny mask and yelling at the top of your lungs that McDaniels is a crook?:yayaya:

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 01:13 PM
So I guess you wont be going to Denver this summer for camp then...or will you be there protesting wearing a Cutler jersey, a Shanny mask and yelling at the top of your lungs that McDaniels is a crook?:yayaya:

I'll be there and I won't be yelling that McDaniels is a crook or a child molestor or anything like that. I'll be there to work. That's the only purpose. I might wear my Cutler jersey on some of the days, though.

HEAV
04-11-2009, 01:14 PM
I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? You're personally upset at McDaniels and want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Your position is completely emotional. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired. I bet there's even a few fans in Broncos country who are hoping we don't win a Championship with McDaniels. They are mad and want revenge at the expense of success for their favorite team.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems
TJ
Socal
Lex

Just a few that are on the list...:giggle:

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 01:19 PM
[You personally] want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired.

I don't know anybody who goes that far ... names?


That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.

I think denial of reality is an emotional problem. And the reality/likelihood is Josh will be gone by 2012. Doesn't mean I want that to happen, but the Cutler/Goodman problems have Josh's fingerprints all over them, and those guys were two of the best Bronco football people.

PLUS, Josh's only experience is after being dropped into a dynasty (a dynasty that cheated, and again, that cheating scandal had Josh's fingerprints on it). Charlie Weis and Romeo Crennel each had tons of experience, and they actually BUILT the Pats dynasty. But despite sky-high expectations, they both crashed and burned. ???



I wanna be optimistic, hell I AM optimistic. But that optimism does go against reality here.

footstepsfrom#27
04-11-2009, 01:21 PM
"You're either with us or against us".
With ya... ;D

footstepsfrom#27
04-11-2009, 01:28 PM
I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? You're personally upset at McDaniels and want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Your position is completely emotional. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired. I bet there's even a few fans in Broncos country who are hoping we don't win a Championship with McDaniels. They are mad and want revenge at the expense of success for their favorite team.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.
You're so right...emotional problems are definitely evident when people take an alternative viewpoint on the local football team.

Good call... ::)

DenverBrit
04-11-2009, 01:42 PM
That's right. Including the coach. He better produce. And produce IMMEDIATELY. No excuses and no grace period.

Why not??
Even with Shanny here, everyone knew the Broncos were two years away from building a competitive Defense.

You really need to let go of your hatred, you're rapidly becoming the Mane's new Wolf, who also bored everyone to tears with his non stop whining and repetitive b*tching about Shanny.

Let it go.

gyldenlove
04-11-2009, 01:44 PM
I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? You're personally upset at McDaniels and want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Your position is completely emotional. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired. I bet there's even a few fans in Broncos country who are hoping we don't win a Championship with McDaniels. They are mad and want revenge at the expense of success for their favorite team.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.

So you say that no matter what the team does, the fans should always cheer and accept it?

So when fans walked out during the San Diego embarrassment that was wrong, they should have cheered to the bitter end and be happy for the privilidge?

As a fan of the Denver Broncos, I want the team to succeed and I want the team to maximize their probability of success. If the team does something that I feel reduces the probability of success or something that doesn't increase the probability as much as another move could have I will disagree with it. I may be wrong later on, and if I am then I will be happy since the team did in fact have success.

On the other hand, you have people who will tow the party line and say hallelujah no matter what the team does. These are the people who will always blame the ex-Broncos. If we had done nothing this year at all, kept Shanahan, not trade Cutler, not signed free agents. A lot of the people who know say that Mcdaniels and Orton will bring glory to Denver would have blamed whoever retired, injuries and bad luck for our 8 losses because in no way could the people who are still with the team be responsible.

I hope I am wrong, I really do, but the way I see it we messed up. We reduced the probability of winning games both in the short term and the long term with some of the moves we have made this year.

gyldenlove
04-11-2009, 01:46 PM
Why not??
Even with Shanny here, everyone knew the Broncos were two years away from building a competitive Defense.

You really need to let go of your hatred, you're rapidly becoming the Mane's new Wolf, who also bored everyone to tears with his non stop whining and repetitive b*tching about Shanny.

Let it go.

Because everybody is accountable. That is the philosophy.

tsiguy96
04-11-2009, 01:47 PM
So you say that no matter what the team does, the fans should always cheer and accept it?

So when fans walked out during the San Diego embarrassment that was wrong, they should have cheered to the bitter end and be happy for the privilidge?

As a fan of the Denver Broncos, I want the team to succeed and I want the team to maximize their probability of success. If the team does something that I feel reduces the probability of success or something that doesn't increase the probability as much as another move could have I will disagree with it. I may be wrong later on, and if I am then I will be happy since the team did in fact have success.

On the other hand, you have people who will tow the party line and say hallelujah no matter what the team does. These are the people who will always blame the ex-Broncos. If we had done nothing this year at all, kept Shanahan, not trade Cutler, not signed free agents. A lot of the people who know say that Mcdaniels and Orton will bring glory to Denver would have blamed whoever retired, injuries and bad luck for our 8 losses because in no way could the people who are still with the team be responsible.

I hope I am wrong, I really do, but the way I see it we messed up. We reduced the probability of winning games both in the short term and the long term with some of the moves we have made this year.

no, what we are saying is instead of bitching that the team is GOING to suck, why not wait until they actually produce to see waht happens. if they suck after this year and dont look competitive at all, then start bitching. if they win 10 games, then you dont have to eat a dick later either because you were dead wrong. cheer the team on and HOPE they do good is better then crying for the next 5 months til the games start and then finding out whether or not they will be good. logical huh?

DenverBrit
04-11-2009, 01:49 PM
Because everybody is accountable. That is the philosophy.

Accountable is good, irrational demands.....not so much.

Popps
04-11-2009, 01:51 PM
"You're either with us or against us".

Joke if you want, have you ever played football, SoCal?

If you have, you'd know that "with us or against us" is pretty much standard locker room operating procedure. That's basically the attitude winning teams have. You can't get 53 guys to go out and lay (sometimes literally) their lives on the line by playing democracy and pandering to the slightest emotional whim and feeling of every guy with a tender ass.



This isn't book club. It's football.

Cito Pelon
04-11-2009, 02:06 PM
Awesome to hear his thoughts on the leadership of Davis.

Him and Dawkins might not be the answer...but they can be nice bridge players.

So much rests on the draft this year. They need to find a player that can become the player DJ should have been. The face of the D. A vocal enforcer that will eventually lead by example from the DL or LB position.

Who in this draft can be that...because that player is not currently on this roster.

Hey, Elvis is a stud, he can make things happen, and he's vocal. I've been on the Elvis bandwagon from day one, and apparently he's caught the new staff's radar also. Elvis is a pretty good player, I think they're trying to find a way to fit him in. Dude has a knack for getting to the QB.

Popps
04-11-2009, 02:09 PM
Hey, Elvis is a stud, he can make things happen, and he's vocal. I've been on the Elvis bandwagon from day one, and apparently he's caught the new staff's radar also. Elvis is a pretty good player, I think they're trying to find a way to fit him in. Dude has a knack for getting to the QB.

I think he was a poor fit as a starting 4-3 DE. I think he's a potentially great fit as a 3-4 OLB, even if it's situational. I love the idea of him having a little space to work with.

Again, Elvis/Thomas/Powell. Those three guys could really be huge boosts if the new system allows them to flourish.

Cito Pelon
04-11-2009, 02:09 PM
This notion here doesn't work.

We can't go back to the days of Al Wilson carrying the defense, telling the entire front seven how to basically do their jobs and being the guy who holds everyone accountable.

That only ends in the disastrous results we've seen when said team leader has to move on.

This team needs to build a culture of accountability and tough play, from every player.

That is where Dawkins, Davis, and the like are most important. They can come in and not only provide a bridge in the starting lineup on the field, but also immediately give a veteran presence that younger players can learn from and be held accountable to. Given a few years of that and the entire culture of the locker room will be not unlike the Pats, Ravens, and Steelers, where every guy who is on the roster is expected to put the team first and foremost. Not just one guy trying to police a whole squad.

It sure would be nice to see the Denver defense be fearsome again. Been a long, long, long time since we've seen that.

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 02:19 PM
You're so right...emotional problems are definitely evident when people take an alternative viewpoint on the local football team.

Good call... ::)

Yeah that's what I said! Oh no I didn't.

I think regardless of what you think of any player, coach, GM or owner, you should want the team to do well. If you want the coach of your supposed favorite team to fail so he'll get fired, there's something wrong with you. I never wanted any Bronco to fail or any coach to fail. I wanted them to do well and succeed. I think declaring McDaniels a bad coach before he's even had training camp is retarded.

I think a lot of people, and I'd bet SoCalBronco is one of them, wouldn't mind seeing the Broncos suck the next two years if it meant McDaniels would be fired. I think a lot of people want to see McDaniels get fired just for trading Cutler and now are secretly hoping the team will suck so they can see McDaniels get his. It's crazy, but they are emotionally connected to the franchise (and aren't we all?) and feel personally wounded by the Cutler trade.

And just read this thread. "McDanies is a cheater!""If he doesn't produce immediately he should be canned!"

It's full of anger and rage and a lot of it is irrational.

gyldenlove
04-11-2009, 02:22 PM
no, what we are saying is instead of b****ing that the team is GOING to suck, why not wait until they actually produce to see waht happens. if they suck after this year and dont look competitive at all, then start b****ing. if they win 10 games, then you dont have to bend me over a rock later either because you were dead wrong. cheer the team on and HOPE they do good is better then crying for the next 5 months til the games start and then finding out whether or not they will be good. logical huh?

Well, that goes the other way too. Why say that Mcdaniels will be a good coach and that Orton can succeed in his system? Just wait until they do and then we will see how it goes.

Why would I blindly follow something I think is stupid? I will cheer for the team when they play and I will hope they win, but until opening night I have nothing to cheer for, I think they can manage to get through OTAs without the encouragement.

I didn't agree that my country should have gone to war in Iraq, but when they did I still supported the troops who went and I hoped they had success and came back unharmed. I don't have to be happy with the decisions they make, that doesn't affect how I want the team to do, it just means I think they could have done other things that would have been better.

Cito Pelon
04-11-2009, 02:22 PM
I think he was a poor fit as a starting 4-3 DE. I think he's a potentially great fit as a 3-4 OLB, even if it's situational. I love the idea of him having a little space to work with.

Again, Elvis/Thomas/Powell. Those three guys could really be huge boosts if the new system allows them to flourish.

Elvis was dynamite on the left side DE working against the RT his first two years. He ate RT's alive. The staff moved him to the RDE and he couldn't match up as well on the LT's. Poor coaching. Elvis is a guy that puts pressure on the QB, bigtime pressure, the staff has to use him properly. Hopefully the new staff uses him properly.

gyldenlove
04-11-2009, 02:24 PM
Yeah that's what I said! Oh no I didn't.

I think regardless of what you think of any player, coach, GM or owner, you should want the team to do well. If you want the coach of your supposed favorite team to fail so he'll get fired, there's something wrong with you. I never wanted any Bronco to fail or any coach to fail. I wanted them to do well and succeed. I think declaring McDaniels a bad coach before he's even had training camp is retarded.

I think a lot of people, and I'd bet SoCalBronco is one of them, wouldn't mind seeing the Broncos suck the next two years if it meant McDaniels would be fired. I think a lot of people want to see McDaniels get fired just for trading Cutler and now are secretly hoping the team will suck so they can see McDaniels get his. It's crazy, but they are emotionally connected to the franchise (and aren't we all?) and feel personally wounded by the Cutler trade.

And just read this thread. "McDanies is a cheater!""If he doesn't produce immediately he should be canned!"

It's full of anger and rage and a lot of it is irrational.

What is declaring Mcdaniels a good coach then? Fact is that he hasn't been a head coach a day in his life before he got here, so if it is retarded to call him a bad coach it is equally retarded to call him a good coach.

tsiguy96
04-11-2009, 02:26 PM
Well, that goes the other way too. Why say that Mcdaniels will be a good coach and that Orton can succeed in his system? Just wait until they do and then we will see how it goes.

Why would I blindly follow something I think is stupid? I will cheer for the team when they play and I will hope they win, but until opening night I have nothing to cheer for, I think they can manage to get through OTAs without the encouragement.

I didn't agree that my country should have gone to war in Iraq, but when they did I still supported the troops who went and I hoped they had success and came back unharmed. I don't have to be happy with the decisions they make, that doesn't affect how I want the team to do, it just means I think they could have done other things that would have been better.

but you dont know they could have done other things and been better until you actually see the results. if we draft 2 pro bowlers with our first 2 picks you wont be whining about how bad they will be. you dont know, i dont know and thus im not gonna sit here and say they are going to fail. i will hope for them both to succeed and i think they have a pretty good chance to, but thats not gauranteed either, so im doing what reasonable, logical people are doing: sitting back and waiting to see how the team looks.

Popps
04-11-2009, 02:28 PM
Elvis was dynamite on the left side DE working against the RT his first two years. He ate RT's alive. The staff moved him to the RDE and he couldn't match up as well on the LT's. Poor coaching. Elvis is a guy that puts pressure on the QB, bigtime pressure, the staff has to use him properly. Hopefully the new staff uses him properly.

Good point... he was more effective on the other side. I still don't like him having to engage on every play. But, maybe he could play SSOLB?

HEAV
04-11-2009, 02:32 PM
What is declaring Mcdaniels a good coach then? Fact is that he hasn't been a head coach a day in his life before he got here, so if it is retarded to call him a bad coach it is equally retarded to call him a good coach.


He's been a solid (if not great) offensive cordinator (which last time I checked was a coach).

Now no one is laying claims that he's a great head coach (yet) but at the same time he's not a Bad head coach (yet) either.

He's just a head coach right now.

People need to stop having little easter egg coded posts and threads laying the ground work of trashing the guy as a failure before he has even coach this team in one game...let alone one practice!

Too many wanna-be coaching ****ing hacks on this board.


P.S.

Not sure if its a joke, if so it's gone on way too long, but who the hell is Steve Larsen? Spencer

Cito Pelon
04-11-2009, 02:35 PM
Exactly right. They know where their bread is buttered. They know who signs the checks. I wouldn't want an all poweful little Caligula or Bowlen breathing down my neck if I played for the team, that's for sure.

No one is going to depart from the party line, now. No one.

Oh boy, I can see the negativity coming. The team hasn't even drafted a player, but they're gonna be crap, eh? Not even in camp yet.

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 02:36 PM
Oh boy, I can see the negativity coming. The team hasn't even drafted a player, but they're gonna be crap, eh? Not even in camp yet.

What does my post have to do with their drafting? We'll see what the draft brings. This is a different issue. Its whether some (or more) of the players have incentive to misrepresent their feelings if they do in fact have different feelings.

HEAV
04-11-2009, 02:37 PM
Oh boy, I can see the negativity coming. The team hasn't even drafted a player, but they're gonna be crap, eh? Not even in camp yet.

Ya can't wait to read Socal's report from camp this year. "He sucks, everyone sucks! I miss the sound of Shanny's voice and the good looks of Cutler..."

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 02:39 PM
Ya can't wait to read Socal's report from camp this year. "He sucks, everyone sucks! I miss the sound of Shanny's voice and the good looks of Cutler..."

Yeah...cause that's what I'd report. Uhh

footstepsfrom#27
04-11-2009, 02:43 PM
If you want the coach of your supposed favorite team to fail so he'll get fired, there's something wrong with you.
I missed this I guess...who said they wanted the team to fail?
I think declaring McDaniels a bad coach before he's even had training camp is retarded.
What's really retarded is telling fans they have to swallow every decision as a great one even if it looks moronic. People have criticized his early moves...not sure I've heard anyone say whether he's going to fail as a coach or not. I've questioned his decision making abiiity and his leadership based on his decisions. He might very well be a great coach...but at this point he's got no skins on the wall and nothing to judge him by except what we see happening no. And yes...he DOES deserve criticism as does any other coach...for trades and other off season moves. He's certainly not imune from that just because he's got no head coaching experience.
I think a lot of people, and I'd bet SoCalBronco is one of them, wouldn't mind seeing the Broncos suck the next two years if it meant McDaniels would be fired. I think a lot of people want to see McDaniels get fired just for trading Cutler and now are secretly hoping the team will suck so they can see McDaniels get his.
The only coach I ever hoped would fail was Reeves because he proved over time he'd never win the Super Bowl in Denver and we were wasting Elway's talents. That proved to be the correct viewpoint. Has a single person on this board said they want the team to fail for little hoodie? If so...who?
It's crazy, but they are emotionally connected to the franchise (and aren't we all?) and feel personally wounded by the Cutler trade.
This might be hard to understand...but I'm not emotionally connected to this team. I'm emotionally connected to my wife and kids. This is a GAME...a fun one for sure...but it's still a GAME. If the Broncos folded tomorrow and moved to Boise I'd be bummed but I'd quickly recover and move on.
And just read this thread. "McDanies is a cheater!""If he doesn't produce immediately he should be canned!"

It's full of anger and rage and a lot of it is irrational.
Oh please...nobody can gage "rage" on a text driven internet forum. Besides...it's entirely possible he is a cheater. He was Belicheat's right hand right? Maybe he was in the dark...maybe not. Frankly I could care less about that but in my view he's done stupid stuff and a lot of others agree. Saying that makes us hoping they'll fail is ridiculous. Shanny did stupid stuff too. Lots of us said so. Were we cheering them to win? Of course we were. That doesn't keep us from voicing an opinion.

Cito Pelon
04-11-2009, 02:48 PM
I don't know anybody who goes that far ... names?




I think denial of reality is an emotional problem. And the reality/likelihood is Josh will be gone by 2012. Doesn't mean I want that to happen, but the Cutler/Goodman problems have Josh's fingerprints all over them, and those guys were two of the best Bronco football people.

PLUS, Josh's only experience is after being dropped into a dynasty (a dynasty that cheated, and again, that cheating scandal had Josh's fingerprints on it). Charlie Weis and Romeo Crennel each had tons of experience, and they actually BUILT the Pats dynasty. But despite sky-high expectations, they both crashed and burned. ???



I wanna be optimistic, hell I AM optimistic. But that optimism does go against reality here.

Buff, you really would like to see Josh fail, eh? Just to prove your point. C'mon, admit it.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 02:49 PM
I think regardless of what you think of any player, coach, GM or owner, you should want the team to do well. If you want the coach of your supposed favorite team to fail so he'll get fired, there's something wrong with you.

Fine, but again ... like footsteps said, I don't see anybody doing this. Names?


I think declaring McDaniels a bad coach before he's even had training camp is retarded.

Totally agree (although the word "retarded" is flamethrowing).

But my complaint is Josh has pretty-well shown himself a poor front office guy. He wrested control (or at least control fell to him), when Goodman was fired and Xanders' GM powers, as promised by Bowlen, failed to materialize.

He is the 2nd-youngest head coach in NFL history, just by a couple months. He has enough on his plate coaching out on the field, rather than sticking his inexperienced nose upstairs in front office business. He never made a trade and never dealt with an agent before the Cassel stuff, and we saw how that turned out.


And just read this thread. "McDanies is a cheater!""If he doesn't produce immediately he should be canned!"

It's full of anger and rage and a lot of it is irrational.

It IS irrational to be a Broncos fan and hope Josh fails.

But it is NOT irrational to call McDaniels a cheater.

Josh IS a cheater, according to Commissioner Roger Goodell and the National Football League. Sure, the commish fined Belichick personally, but Josh simply MUST HAVE KNOWN what was going on. HE CALLED THE PLAYS, and if you're stealing opponents' defensive signals, the play-caller's gotta know, or else what's the point? It takes some deductive reasoning from the facts - and admittedly Josh only called plays the last year or two of that scandal - but I think Goodell's penalties make clear there were very serious violations.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 02:50 PM
Buff, you really would like to see Josh fail, eh? Just to prove your point. C'mon, admit it.

NO!

Jay Cutler going to the Playoffs and to Pro Bowls will prove my point.

That, plus the likelihood that, from the 3 picks we got, we'll get:

1 impact player
1 contributor
1 fail

That's the overwhelming lieklihood based on history and statistics, even if we had an experienced group calling the draft shots. And it's overwhelmingly not enough in return for Jay Cutler.

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 02:51 PM
Um Footsteps, there are numerous posts on here where people like McSkillet, Colonelbeef and others have declared that he will fail as a head coach and be off the team in two seasons. And I'd bet if we could settle this with a poll because even more would feel that way.

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 02:55 PM
Um Footsteps, there are numerous posts on here where people like McSkillet, Colonelbeef and others have declared that he will fail as a head coach and be off the team in two seasons. And I'd bet if we could settle this with a poll because even more would feel that way.

Good idea, but make the poll PUBLIC if you wanna prove your point ... otherwise pro-Josh guys can vote fail.

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 02:58 PM
Good idea, but make the poll PUBLIC if you wanna prove your point ... otherwise pro-Josh guys can vote fail.

Why would they vote fail? And I don't want to turn this into a witch hunt. They have a right to feel that way and I don't want to turn this into mob thing.

SoCalBronco
04-11-2009, 02:59 PM
Um Footsteps, there are numerous posts on here where people like McSkillet, Colonelbeef and others have declared that he will fail as a head coach and be off the team in two seasons. And I'd bet if we could settle this with a poll because even more would feel that way.

So? Those are predictions. What does that prove? How does that prove that people WANT the team to lose for two years? There are ALOT of people here that want him fired (including myself), but I don't think anyone wants the team to lose for two years straight just to ensure that it happens. He'll probably take care of the losing by himself, he doesnt need people praying for it to happen and no one is, anyway.

Nobody is sitting here saying or feeling "oh yes, this is going to be awesome, I hope we go 3-13 two years in a row just so I can feel like I was right". You're TOTALLY off on that. Frankly, I'm disappointed that you would believe that. I DO hope he gets fired and I do think he will fail and I think he's already proven he isn't the right choice, but I'm not sitting here "praying for losses" just to "show I'm right". That's pretty weak for a guy of your caliber.

Kaylore
04-11-2009, 03:04 PM
So? Those are predictions. What does that prove? How does that prove that people WANT the team to lose for two years? There are ALOT of people here that want him fired (including myself), but I don't think anyone wants the team to lose for two years straight just to ensure that it happens. He'll probably take care of the losing by himself, he doesnt need people praying for it to happen and no one is, anyway.

Nobody is sitting here saying or feeling "oh yes, this is going to be awesome, I hope we go 3-13 two years in a row just so I can feel like I was right". You're TOTALLY off on that. Frankly, I'm disappointed that you would believe that. I DO hope he gets fired and I do think he will fail and I think he's already proven he isn't the right choice, but I'm not sitting here "praying for losses" just to "show I'm right". That's pretty weak for a guy of your caliber.

Well I'm glad you don't feel that way, but a lot of other people do. Certainly they're in the minority, but they've called the radio stations here and I've read posts that said as much. Go look at the poll I just posted. The options are all in favor of "wanting to win" but the posts speak to something else. Some even said the decision was a hard one. That means there is that much negative sentiment out there.

Broncos_OTM
04-11-2009, 03:21 PM
I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? You're personally upset at McDaniels and want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Your position is completely emotional. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired. I bet there's even a few fans in Broncos country who are hoping we don't win a Championship with McDaniels. They are mad and want revenge at the expense of success for their favorite team.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.

I defiently aggree dude. good stuff.

footstepsfrom#27
04-11-2009, 03:25 PM
Um Footsteps, there are numerous posts on here where people like McSkillet, Colonelbeef and others have declared that he will fail as a head coach and be off the team in two seasons. And I'd bet if we could settle this with a poll because even more would feel that way.
29-2 so far...95% opposed to that idea...does this settle it then?

baja
04-11-2009, 03:48 PM
Right now I can tell you the attitude in the locker room is definitely excited. We’ve got some changing faces and changing packages, and we’ve got some new coaches we can really get behind. The direction they’re taking us is a direction that I feel will be very successful. We have the pieces, now we’re ready to put the puzzle together and make things happen this season.

Doesn't this idiot know they're going to be total failures for the rest of their careers?

Must not be reading this board, I guess.

Weird. I was sure this was going to "tear the locker room apart."

and we’ve got some new coaches we can really get behind. The direction they’re taking us is a direction that I feel will be very successful.

Sweet!

Cito Pelon
04-11-2009, 04:02 PM
What does my post have to do with their drafting? We'll see what the draft brings. This is a different issue. Its whether some (or more) of the players have incentive to misrepresent their feelings if they do in fact have different feelings.

Exactly right. They know where their bread is buttered. They know who signs the checks. I wouldn't want an all poweful little Caligula or Bowlen breathing down my neck if I played for the team, that's for sure.

No one is going to depart from the party line, now. No one..

Seems like that statement of yours would apply to draftees also.

You're getting very bitter. Relax.

Rohirrim
04-11-2009, 04:06 PM
Nice to hear a voice that is excited about the changes and looking to the future. Judging by this board, you'd have thought we were the new Lions. Go Doom! :thumbs:

Archer81
04-11-2009, 04:07 PM
The Broncos site and player blogs might not be subject to the new content rules ... but remember it's basically just three paragraphs and a link I think.

From the day Josh and Nolan had their first meeting with Dumervil, I've been feeling pretty certain they've got him pencilled in at one of the OLB spots ... I wonder which.


Probably weakside. Should be cool to watch.

:Broncos:

DB Doom
04-11-2009, 04:09 PM
I think in football you can afford to take that stance. What else could you be for? You're personally upset at McDaniels and want the Broncos to fail so McDaniels will get fired. Your position is completely emotional. Some of you on here are so far off the deep end you'll be pissed if we start winning games because it will reduce the chance McDaniels get fired. I bet there's even a few fans in Broncos country who are hoping we don't win a Championship with McDaniels. They are mad and want revenge at the expense of success for their favorite team.

That's not a fan to me. That's someone who's got emotional problems.

preach brotha
^5

NYBronco
04-11-2009, 04:14 PM
Great article considering Doom could have taken the no comment role. But he seems to have some priviledged insight on the direction the defense is headed and wanted to share it with Bronco fans.

gyldenlove
04-11-2009, 04:18 PM
Accountable is good, irrational demands.....not so much.

So if a player fails he should also get a few more years to prove he has it?

If a player who plays gets benched, then why should a head coach who coaches bad get any more chances?

Fact is that unless Mcdaniels runs the team into the ground he will get at least 2 years almost no matter what. You won't see the same extended to a player unless he is a first round pick. If Andra Davies sucks this year he will be gone, as will Dawkins, hell Winborn didn't even have to suck he just had to be in Nolans dog house. Very few players can lose a game on their own, that is no problem for a head coach, he can lose many games all on his own, yet he will get a lot more leeway than any player.

baja
04-11-2009, 04:18 PM
That's right. Including the coach. He better produce. And produce IMMEDIATELY. No excuses and no grace period.


Illogical Will Robertson, ILLOGICAL!

So keep repeating your mantra but you are the only one here that is not willing to give him a season. This makes you look like a completely amateurish fan.

It's like someone like Majick stole your account password.

NYBronco
04-11-2009, 04:27 PM
So if a player fails he should also get a few more years to prove he has it?

If a player who plays gets benched, then why should a head coach who coaches bad get any more chances?

Fact is that unless Mcdaniels runs the team into the ground he will get at least 2 years almost no matter what. You won't see the same extended to a player unless he is a first round pick. If Andra Davies sucks this year he will be gone, as will Dawkins, hell Winborn didn't even have to suck he just had to be in Nolans dog house. Very few players can lose a game on their own, that is no problem for a head coach, he can lose many games all on his own, yet he will get a lot more leeway than any player.

Shanahan and his defensive head coach are recent and very good examples.

Popps
04-11-2009, 04:33 PM
Good idea, but make the poll PUBLIC if you wanna prove your point ... otherwise pro-Josh guys can vote fail.

Wow, weird language, Buff.

Josh is our coach, right? You'd think we'd all want him to succeed. "Pro-josh" implies that you don't, I guess.

Weird.

It's also weird that people keep singling you out as a guy who they think wants the team to fail, huh?

BroncoBuff
04-11-2009, 04:44 PM
Wow, weird language, Buff.

Josh is our coach, right? You'd think we'd all want him to succeed. "Pro-josh" implies that you don't, I guess.

Weird.

It's also weird that people keep singling you out as a guy who they think wants the team to fail, huh?

You haven't been reading that much yet today .. first, you're wrong, they're "singling out" others, not me. Khan at least singled out a couple ... only you have accused me of this, Flamey.

And "pro-Josh" is light years from implying you wish him to fail ... "pro-Josh" refers to the Cutler situation only.



HEY FLAMEY! I gotta quiz for you: "Who does BroncoBuff think is more at fault for this fiasco, Jay or Josh?"

(HINT: I've posted which I think numerous times these past few weeks).

DenverBrit
04-11-2009, 05:00 PM
So if a player fails he should also get a few more years to prove he has it?

If a player who plays gets benched, then why should a head coach who coaches bad get any more chances?

Fact is that unless Mcdaniels runs the team into the ground he will get at least 2 years almost no matter what. You won't see the same extended to a player unless he is a first round pick. If Andra Davies sucks this year he will be gone, as will Dawkins, hell Winborn didn't even have to suck he just had to be in Nolans dog house. Very few players can lose a game on their own, that is no problem for a head coach, he can lose many games all on his own, yet he will get a lot more leeway than any player.

You seem to have gone off on a tangent.
Go back and look at the original post I was responding to.

baja
04-11-2009, 05:12 PM
Elvis was dynamite on the left side DE working against the RT his first two years. He ate RT's alive. The staff moved him to the RDE and he couldn't match up as well on the LT's. Poor coaching. Elvis is a guy that puts pressure on the QB, big time pressure, the staff has to use him properly. Hopefully the new staff uses him properly.

Good point I been thinking we might have better players than we ever thought. They were held back by unimaginative coaches. I'm thinking this team is going to shock alot of people and I will enjoy reminding some of the cliff jumpers here.

worm
04-11-2009, 05:15 PM
I think declaring McDaniels a bad coach before he's even had training camp is retarded.



if Shanny was evaluated on just what he did on the field....he would still be the coach here.

Ultimately he was judged (and subsequently fired) on his front office failures in hiring, not firing, drafting and FA signings. Josh will be judged the same way.

It doesn't start with his first game or with his first training camp. He is being held accountable right now. That is as much the job as it was for Mike. It might also be his undoing as well.

I think it is retarded to think that the clock suddenly starts for evaluating Josh as a head coach when he steps on the field for a game or for TC.

Rohirrim
04-11-2009, 05:16 PM
Good point I been thinking we might have better players than we ever thought. They were held back by unimaginative coaches. I'm thinking this team is going to shock alot of people and I will enjoy reminding some of the cliff jumpers here.

So, when it comes to the world, we're doomed, but when it comes to the team, we're okay? ;)

gyldenlove
04-11-2009, 05:17 PM
You seem to have gone off on a tangent.
Go back and look at the original post I was responding to.

One thing I do agree with you on is there are no sacred cows on the team anymore. Everyone plays and everyone better produce or they're all gone. I like it that way. It's how it should be on a football team.

I included the quote that started the reply to a reply to replay etc.

No sacred cows, you produce or you are gone, that is what the original post was about.

That is accountability and that should go for the head coach, the general manager, the equipment people and the whole organization.

If a player gets fired for having a bad year or a bad game, then the coach should also get fired for having a bad year. 8-8, I think we can all agree is not acceptable, and the previous coach got fired for it.

8-8 in 2009 is not acceptable, we hired a new head coach to improve the team, he has made some decisions that he felt he had to make. If those decisions do not lead us to something better than 8-8, then they were bad decisions and that is failure and clearly in a system of accountability, failure gets you fired. If his decisions and his abilities lead us to more wins than losses, then he has succeeded and he gets to keep his job and continue the proces.

It is worth noting that Mcdaniels was not brought in save the club or to build it up, he was brought in to translate the considerable offensive talent we have into wins and success. If we were a team like the Lions, then you would of course have more patience because you realize that the team doesn't have the players to win a lot of games, but with Shanahan the offense clearly demonstrated that they could win a number of games, so it shouldn't take much tweaking and improvement on other units for this club to become very succesful, and I think I speak for most people here when I say that the expectation was playoffs when they announced Mcdaniels as a head coach.

Rohirrim
04-11-2009, 05:23 PM
I included the quote that started the reply to a reply to replay etc.

No sacred cows, you produce or you are gone, that is what the original post was about.

That is accountability and that should go for the head coach, the general manager, the equipment people and the whole organization.

If a player gets fired for having a bad year or a bad game, then the coach should also get fired for having a bad year. 8-8, I think we can all agree is not acceptable, and the previous coach got fired for it.

8-8 in 2009 is not acceptable, we hired a new head coach to improve the team, he has made some decisions that he felt he had to make. If those decisions do not lead us to something better than 8-8, then they were bad decisions and that is failure and clearly in a system of accountability, failure gets you fired. If his decisions and his abilities lead us to more wins than losses, then he has succeeded and he gets to keep his job and continue the proces.

It is worth noting that Mcdaniels was not brought in save the club or to build it up, he was brought in to translate the considerable offensive talent we have into wins and success. If we were a team like the Lions, then you would of course have more patience because you realize that the team doesn't have the players to win a lot of games, but with Shanahan the offense clearly demonstrated that they could win a number of games, so it shouldn't take much tweaking and improvement on other units for this club to become very succesful, and I think I speak for most people here when I say that the expectation was playoffs when they announced Mcdaniels as a head coach.

No, Shanahan did not get fired for one 8 and 8 season. He didn't even get fired for the previous 7 and 9 season. He got fired because he could not build a defense, hired the worst possible Dcoordinator he could find, and said he was sticking with him, even after three of the most dismal performances in NFL history out of one team. It was ten years of stagnation that got Mike fired. Fortunately, the drama queens on this board are not in charge. Bowlen will give McD a few years to put his ideas in place. Then, we'll see if they work. Sounds like the players are on board. I haven't heard any of them weeping over the loss of Mopey. That says something right there. People who are suffering from severe Macphobia should get some medication for the next few seasons. I suggest Zoloft. :wiggle:

DenverBrit
04-11-2009, 05:42 PM
I included the quote that started the reply to a reply to replay etc.

No sacred cows, you produce or you are gone, that is what the original post was about.

That is accountability and that should go for the head coach, the general manager, the equipment people and the whole organization.

If a player gets fired for having a bad year or a bad game, then the coach should also get fired for having a bad year. 8-8, I think we can all agree is not acceptable, and the previous coach got fired for it.

8-8 in 2009 is not acceptable, we hired a new head coach to improve the team, he has made some decisions that he felt he had to make. If those decisions do not lead us to something better than 8-8, then they were bad decisions and that is failure and clearly in a system of accountability, failure gets you fired. If his decisions and his abilities lead us to more wins than losses, then he has succeeded and he gets to keep his job and continue the proces.

It is worth noting that Mcdaniels was not brought in save the club or to build it up, he was brought in to translate the considerable offensive talent we have into wins and success. If we were a team like the Lions, then you would of course have more patience because you realize that the team doesn't have the players to win a lot of games, but with Shanahan the offense clearly demonstrated that they could win a number of games, so it shouldn't take much tweaking and improvement on other units for this club to become very succesful, and I think I speak for most people here when I say that the expectation was playoffs when they announced Mcdaniels as a head coach.

I was responding to:

That's right. Including the coach. He better produce. And produce IMMEDIATELY. No excuses and no grace period.

Not the previous post or any other.
It was a response to a repetitive theme of bashing the coach and demanding performance NOW.
Nothing more.

But you raise some valid issues.
Remember, by any standard, the Defense and special teams (2/3rds of the team) have been allowed to rot the last two years...and really for some time prior.
That's why Shanny was fired. McDaniels should be expected to make strides, but demanding he do it immediately just because one third of the team is in good shape is unrealistic.
He has brought in the best collection of defensive staff in......well more than a decade, so he has made a move in the right direction.
But the team has won just one playoff game in a decade. You don't turn all that around in one season......usually.
If it happens, then we have one hell of a coach on our hands.
That would disappoint some here.

chex
04-11-2009, 05:46 PM
And what do you expect them to say? Nobody ever says otherwise in these situartions, Khan ...

Every statistic and all the history says Josh will be gone by 2012. That's just realistic. All the pro-Josh guys on this board are quite short-sighted. Shanahan's amazing longevity has lulled guys to sleep about the realities of NFL coaching tenures ....

Remember, Charlie Weis and Romeo Crennel were trumpeted as saviors when they left Belichick. And unlike Josh, those guys had lots of experience ... they experienced losing seasons, and they BUILT that Patriots dynasty. Josh was dropped into the dynasty and has never experienced losing. That, and the Goodman/Cutler problems mean there is every reason to expect he'll fail, and be gone by 2012.

Don't be surprised by 4-6 win seasons, guys. It's a tough league out there.


So then what you're basically saying is that we should only believe when someone on here posts second hand rumors that the locker room is divided. If a player comes out and says the team is excited, we should just disregard it as a player being politically correct, whereas even a hint of dissention only solidifes the point that this team is headed for certain destruction.

Rohirrim
04-11-2009, 05:50 PM
So then what you're basically saying is that we should only believe when someone on here posts second hand rumors that the locker room is divided. If a player comes out and says the team is excited, we should just disregard it as a player being politically correct, whereas even a hint of dissention only solidifes the point that this team is headed for certain destruction.

I think he's got it! :thumbsup:

chex
04-11-2009, 05:52 PM
Frankly, I'm disappointed that you would believe that. I DO hope he gets fired and I do think he will fail and I think he's already proven he isn't the right choice, but I'm not sitting here "praying for losses" just to "show I'm right". That's pretty weak for a guy of your caliber.

So you hope McDaniels gets fired, but you say you won't be rooting against him? How many coaches get fired after successful seasons? Can't imagine a coach getting let go after a 10 win season or so, so if you're openly rooting for McDaniels to get fired, you're openly rooting for him, and ultimately the team, to fail. Maybe he can sign Ashley Lelie to make you love him.

baja
04-11-2009, 05:58 PM
So, when it comes to the world, we're doomed, but when it comes to the team, we're okay? ;)

In football, like in life changing from one way of doing things to a completely different way of doing things is often very painful and the most painful for those that cling to the old ways.

BTW I never have believed "we are doomed" as you say just that we are going to go through some very challenging times and my takes on the WPR forum were about pointing out what is coming , why that is and some thoughts about what to do about it on a personal level.

PS You'll notice I don't post there (WPR) much any more and that's because I said my piece and those that have eyes to see will get the message and those that don't will continue with the killing of the messenger.