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colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 03:29 PM
New Chicago Bears quarterback also shows mature professionalism
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funny how two sides of the same coin can be spun so differently, eh? cutler bashers, take a step back and make sure you aren't just eating what the orange hand is feeding you.
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http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-05-haugh-jay-cutler-bears-chapr05,0,7541507.column


David Haugh | On the Bears
April 5, 2009

Type 1 diabetes requires new Bears quarterback Jay Cutler to prick his finger as many as four times during NFL games to check his blood-sugar level.

That has been Cutler's reality since he was diagnosed last April after he inexplicably started feeling run-down and had lost 35 pounds. Cutler feared the worst, wondering if he had cancer.

"The months before the diagnosis were scary," Cutler admitted Friday in the players lounge at Halas Hall. "Part of you wants to know what was wrong, and the other half, maybe it's something you don't want to know about."

David Haugh David Haugh E-mail | Recent columns

Worry subsided after Cutler educated himself about every ingredient he put into his body and now he knows how everything from a sports drink to adrenaline will affect him. A full bottle of Gatorade sitting on the table in front of Cutler helped make his point.

"I can tell you exactly what's going to happen if I drink that," Cutler said.

Cutler cannot be as certain predicting his future success in Chicago, nobody can really, regardless of how much his arrival has restored the buzz to the Bears. But the way Cutler has dealt with his diabetic condition over the past year provides a glimpse how he will approach the unknown challenge before him now.

He will research the players and personalities that soon will surround him, quickly assess how to cope in a new environment and confront whatever he encounters.

Head on.

Whether it's disease or a disappointing teammate, Cutler doesn't cower to confrontation. In three years in the league, that has become as obvious about Cutler as his rocket right arm.

When Broncos wide receiver Brandon Marshall injured himself in another off-the-field incident last year, Cutler offered support but publicly told Marshall, "You're going to have to prove yourself this time."

He is the guy who didn't shy away from saying Chargers quarterback Philip Rivers "isn't my favorite guy" after their trash-talking incident at the end of a 2007 game. He told Sporting News last fall that his arm was stronger than John Elway's "hands down."

Cutler has been known to wear his emotions on the sleeves of his No. 6 jersey on Sundays, such as the time against Kansas City when he threw two interceptions in the first four snaps after he lost his composure.

"He knows how to get all of his guys up," said Bears offensive tackle Chris Williams, who played with Cutler at Vanderbilt. "He doesn't overreact. But if someone needs to be yelled at to get it going, that's what he will do."

It creates a compelling dynamic on the Bears. For the first time in the 11 years Olin Kreutz has been in town, the player behind center is a bigger star than the center. Kreutz polices everything from locker-room code to sideline demeanor but never has had a quarterback with Cutler's combination of skill and swagger lead a huddle. And lead Cutler will.

If an impressive first day at Halas Hall proved anything, it was how natural a leader Cutler is, and Bears players will have to adjust to him more than he will to them.

This isn't an experiment, guys. This is a culture change.

It was good Friday that Cutler displayed professionalism in thanking Broncos owner Pat Bowlen during the first 30 seconds of his news conference. He also wisely accepted responsibility for his part in mishandling the mishaps that led to the trade, saying, "I think both sides would probably do a few things differently." He agreed with Elway, who called the saga sad.

The soberness and respect with which Cutler spoke about the Broncos organization didn't square with the perception of a petulant brat demanding a trade.

"The Broncos organization was putting a spin on it to make Jay look bad," Jack Cutler, Jay's father, said in a phone interview. "It's hard to read and hear people cut down your son and call him a big baby when it's distorted."

The only thing childlike about Cutler's first day as a Bear was the optimism.

He went out of his way to praise members the Bears receiving corps by name, struck a balance between self-confidence and self-deprecation and projected himself with the pizazz of an athlete who one day could own Chicago.

"When [coach Lovie Smith] called me he was like, 'We got you [and] we had to give up a little bit,' " Cutler said. "I was like, 'What's a little bit?' He told me [two first-round picks, a third-rounder and Kyle Orton] and I was like, that sounds like a lot to me. That tells me they have a lot of faith in me, they believe in me and I'm not going to let them down."

To Cutler's left during the news conference Smith sat for 10 minutes before speaking. Perhaps rendered speechless by the reality of a Bears head coach sitting next to a potential franchise quarterback, Smith's smile said it all.

Hotrod
04-06-2009, 03:32 PM
who???

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 03:35 PM
who???

fair answer :ouwknow:

Popps
04-06-2009, 03:43 PM
http://canuckjihad.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/crybaby.png?w=300&h=425

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 03:46 PM
McDaniels and Cassel

Kaylore
04-06-2009, 03:46 PM
Here's what I say to Cutler
http://southernwatch.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/kid-middle-finger.jpg

eddie mac
04-06-2009, 03:47 PM
4 Pricks a game. That just about sums Cutler up x 4. Get over yourself Beefie or go join a Bears fansite.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 03:47 PM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 03:49 PM
4 Pricks a game. That just about sums Cutler up x 4. Get over yourself Beefie or go join a Bears fansite.

I can't just yet. I will try to drop it once the draft takes place. I think my major problem, above all else, is that I really enjoy watching good QB play. I like all of you got spoiled watching Elway throw across his body better than most could throw with both feet planted, and I saw that again here with Cutler. I liked having the wildcard with the cannon arm that was capable of taking over games. I don't want to watch mediocre game management, I want to see the guy with the quick feet and the rifle shrug off a lineman and zip the ball 65 yards down the field to a streaking Royal.

:drown:

c_lazy_r
04-06-2009, 03:50 PM
Here's what I say to Cutler
http://southernwatch.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/kid-middle-finger.jpg


that was ****ing perfect...

halfcreek
04-06-2009, 03:51 PM
http://canuckjihad.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/crybaby.png?w=300&h=425

Jayby

Cito Pelon
04-06-2009, 04:08 PM
Sweet Baby Jay. Puts the pizzaz in Chicago.

Kaylore
04-06-2009, 04:10 PM
Here's a glimpse of Cutler's gritty, competitive nature when his boss calls on the phone:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_zBjohwbyBM8/SG67E2R-y3I/AAAAAAAAAYI/l-NORRG6F-E/s400/Cohen-playing-hide-%27n-seek.jpg

Here's Jay Cutler with the gritt to ask his father to bring his playbook in for him.

http://dadthing.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/ace-crying-426x320.jpg

USMCBladerunner
04-06-2009, 04:10 PM
Colonel...i'm not a McDaniels apologist, but I do think that Cutler forced his way out of town on this one...hearing his father as the mouthpiece only solidifies this to me...

The Broncos are prepared to produce the phone records of Bowlen attemping contact...not the coach, not the GM, the owner of the team...yet Cutler plays the victim

I don't expect the Chicago media to rip the kid apart...that would serve no purpose... same same with Denver the Kyle Orton, who, miraculously has become a much better QB on the Mane now that he's a Bronco...but the whole leadership thing just doesn't ring true when contrasted against comments from Champ and John Lynch and others...his management of diabetes is seemingly a positive thing, though his ability you tell you "exactly what drinking that will do to me" is as true for Jack Daniels and beer as it is for Gatorade and that's not a positive thing...

At this point, spinning Cutler as a mentally tough, team first leader of men, is as foolish as painting him as a marginal QB talent who can't throw the deep ball accurately and will never learn to progress beyond one read.

Both sides are trying to, but it isnt' so. He's a special physical talent who has demonstrated a lack of leadership, maturity, judgement, and even honesty. Time will tell if his flaws are fatal or even permanent, but he isn't the QB or the person we all thought he might be.

Circle Orange
04-06-2009, 04:16 PM
Spin, spin, spin...

ya ain't lived with the guy yet, Chicago. Nothing's on the line, and talk is cheap.

BTW, this is a make or break year for Lovie and crew. Just sayin'.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 04:27 PM
Colonel...i'm not a McDaniels apologist, but I do think that Cutler forced his way out of town on this one...hearing his father as the mouthpiece only solidifies this to me...

The Broncos are prepared to produce the phone records of Bowlen attemping contact...not the coach, not the GM, the owner of the team...yet Cutler plays the victim

I don't expect the Chicago media to rip the kid apart...that would serve no purpose... same same with Denver the Kyle Orton, who, miraculously has become a much better QB on the Mane now that he's a Bronco...but the whole leadership thing just doesn't ring true when contrasted against comments from Champ and John Lynch and others...his management of diabetes is seemingly a positive thing, though his ability you tell you "exactly what drinking that will do to me" is as true for Jack Daniels and beer as it is for Gatorade and that's not a positive thing...

At this point, spinning Cutler as a mentally tough, team first leader of men, is as foolish as painting him as a marginal QB talent who can't throw the deep ball accurately and will never learn to progress beyond one read.

Both sides are trying to, but it isnt' so. He's a special physical talent who has demonstrated a lack of leadership, maturity, judgement, and even honesty. Time will tell if his flaws are fatal or even permanent, but he isn't the QB or the person we all thought he might be.

Really the only point I was trying to make with this article is that there is an awful lot of spin coming out from all angles, and perhaps the company line about Cutler being a 'baby' isn't the most honest of assessments, and just might be a tad biased.

Pony Boy
04-06-2009, 04:29 PM
According to the Canadian Diabetes Association (CDA), erectile dysfunction (ED) is common for men who have diabetes. Often, it's the first symptom that men may notice and the one that leads them to the doctor in the first place. Good Luck Jay:yayaya:

521 1N5
04-06-2009, 04:30 PM
So daddy says he's not a baby??

Oh okay I'm sold.

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 04:31 PM
http://www.mattwardman.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/kiss-my-ass-10.jpg

rastaman
04-06-2009, 04:34 PM
Tst...Tst...Tst you Cutler haters are so frustrated with yourselves you just can't stop crying that Cutler really left ya!

Oh well Orton will be a piss poor stop gap while Bowlen and McDaniels desperately search in vain for Cutlers replacement.

Don't worry McDaniels will bring that Belichick SB magic to Denver in 6 to 8 years.

rastaman
04-06-2009, 04:35 PM
Here's a glimpse of Cutler's gritty, competitive nature when his boss calls on the phone:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_zBjohwbyBM8/SG67E2R-y3I/AAAAAAAAAYI/l-NORRG6F-E/s400/Cohen-playing-hide-%27n-seek.jpg

Here's Jay Cutler with the gritt to ask his father to bring his playbook in for him.

http://dadthing.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/ace-crying-426x320.jpg

Perfect examples of the Cutler haters....wouldn't you say?

Tombstone RJ
04-06-2009, 04:37 PM
According to the Canadian Diabetes Association (CDA), erectile dysfunction (ED) is common for men who have diabetes. Often, it's the first symptom that men may notice and the one that leads them to the doctor in the first place. Good Luck Jay:yayaya:

weak

DomCasual
04-06-2009, 04:37 PM
Cutler has diabetes? ???

I hadn't heard.

Pony Boy
04-06-2009, 04:38 PM
Tst...Tst...Tst you Cutler haters are so frustrated with yourselves you just can't stop crying that Cutler really left ya!

Oh well Orton will be a piss poor stop gap while Bowlen and McDaniels desperately search in vain for Cutlers replacement.

Don't worry McDaniels will bring that Belichick SB magic to Denver in 6 to 8 years.

Stop it Jay! You don't have to post here any more you live in Chicago now.

rastaman
04-06-2009, 04:39 PM
Stop it Jay! You don't have to post here any more you live in Chicago now.

Stop it Pony Boy....you can't have your cake and eat it too!!!:sunshine:

Tombstone RJ
04-06-2009, 04:39 PM
New Chicago Bears quarterback also shows mature professionalism
--------------------------------------------------
funny how two sides of the same coin can be spun so differently, eh? cutler bashers, take a step back and make sure you aren't just eating what the orange hand is feeding you.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-05-haugh-jay-cutler-bears-chapr05,0,7541507.column


David Haugh | On the Bears
April 5, 2009

Type 1 diabetes requires new Bears quarterback Jay Cutler to prick his finger as many as four times during NFL games to check his blood-sugar level.

That has been Cutler's reality since he was diagnosed last April after he inexplicably started feeling run-down and had lost 35 pounds. Cutler feared the worst, wondering if he had cancer.

"The months before the diagnosis were scary," Cutler admitted Friday in the players lounge at Halas Hall. "Part of you wants to know what was wrong, and the other half, maybe it's something you don't want to know about."

David Haugh David Haugh E-mail | Recent columns

Worry subsided after Cutler educated himself about every ingredient he put into his body and now he knows how everything from a sports drink to adrenaline will affect him. A full bottle of Gatorade sitting on the table in front of Cutler helped make his point.

"I can tell you exactly what's going to happen if I drink that," Cutler said.

Cutler cannot be as certain predicting his future success in Chicago, nobody can really, regardless of how much his arrival has restored the buzz to the Bears. But the way Cutler has dealt with his diabetic condition over the past year provides a glimpse how he will approach the unknown challenge before him now.

He will research the players and personalities that soon will surround him, quickly assess how to cope in a new environment and confront whatever he encounters.

Head on.

Whether it's disease or a disappointing teammate, Cutler doesn't cower to confrontation. In three years in the league, that has become as obvious about Cutler as his rocket right arm.

When Broncos wide receiver Brandon Marshall injured himself in another off-the-field incident last year, Cutler offered support but publicly told Marshall, "You're going to have to prove yourself this time."

He is the guy who didn't shy away from saying Chargers quarterback Philip Rivers "isn't my favorite guy" after their trash-talking incident at the end of a 2007 game. He told Sporting News last fall that his arm was stronger than John Elway's "hands down."

Cutler has been known to wear his emotions on the sleeves of his No. 6 jersey on Sundays, such as the time against Kansas City when he threw two interceptions in the first four snaps after he lost his composure.

"He knows how to get all of his guys up," said Bears offensive tackle Chris Williams, who played with Cutler at Vanderbilt. "He doesn't overreact. But if someone needs to be yelled at to get it going, that's what he will do."

It creates a compelling dynamic on the Bears. For the first time in the 11 years Olin Kreutz has been in town, the player behind center is a bigger star than the center. Kreutz polices everything from locker-room code to sideline demeanor but never has had a quarterback with Cutler's combination of skill and swagger lead a huddle. And lead Cutler will.

If an impressive first day at Halas Hall proved anything, it was how natural a leader Cutler is, and Bears players will have to adjust to him more than he will to them.

This isn't an experiment, guys. This is a culture change.

It was good Friday that Cutler displayed professionalism in thanking Broncos owner Pat Bowlen during the first 30 seconds of his news conference. He also wisely accepted responsibility for his part in mishandling the mishaps that led to the trade, saying, "I think both sides would probably do a few things differently." He agreed with Elway, who called the saga sad.

The soberness and respect with which Cutler spoke about the Broncos organization didn't square with the perception of a petulant brat demanding a trade.

"The Broncos organization was putting a spin on it to make Jay look bad," Jack Cutler, Jay's father, said in a phone interview. "It's hard to read and hear people cut down your son and call him a big baby when it's distorted."

The only thing childlike about Cutler's first day as a Bear was the optimism.

He went out of his way to praise members the Bears receiving corps by name, struck a balance between self-confidence and self-deprecation and projected himself with the pizazz of an athlete who one day could own Chicago.

"When [coach Lovie Smith] called me he was like, 'We got you [and] we had to give up a little bit,' " Cutler said. "I was like, 'What's a little bit?' He told me [two first-round picks, a third-rounder and Kyle Orton] and I was like, that sounds like a lot to me. That tells me they have a lot of faith in me, they believe in me and I'm not going to let them down."

To Cutler's left during the news conference Smith sat for 10 minutes before speaking. Perhaps rendered speechless by the reality of a Bears head coach sitting next to a potential franchise quarterback, Smith's smile said it all.

I'm happy for Jay. Hopefully he's leaned something about communication and perception. He's a good guy and I think many Broncos fans are gonna give him a bunch of underserved crap over this whole crap storm.

I wish him the best and I hope he wins alot of games in Chicago.

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 04:40 PM
This article was written by Angelo and sent in to the Chicago Tribune for publication.

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 04:42 PM
This is so painful.

This is about how I felt after a Super Bowl loss ... :nono:

Muddled
04-06-2009, 04:45 PM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

so f...... what

rastaman
04-06-2009, 04:46 PM
So daddy says he's not a baby??

Oh okay I'm sold.

Blood is thicker than fan loyalty.:~ohyah!: Its only natural for a parent to support their children.

Point is, Elway would do the same for his son "Jack Elway" who is a college QB at Arizona. If Jack Elway ever gets in a dispute with an NFL team (should he make it in the NFL).....you can bet John Elway will side with son.

Hell even Elway's father sided with Elway when he refused to be drafted by the Colts back in 83!!! I'd imagine Elway was called the same names Cutler is currently being called.:thumbs:

Popps
04-06-2009, 04:47 PM
Jayby

To be fair, that little guy already has a better haircut.

Pony Boy
04-06-2009, 04:50 PM
Stop it Pony Boy....you can't have your cake and eat it too!!!:sunshine:

Unfortunately, I'm in the same boat with Jay, can't eat cake! Got to watch the blood sugar. It sucks, I don't wish it on anyone. Have a good evening, I got to go eat a salad.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 04:58 PM
I'm happy for Jay. Hopefully he's leaned something about communication and perception. He's a good guy and I think many Broncos fans are gonna give him a bunch of underserved crap over this whole crap storm.

I wish him the best and I hope he wins alot of games in Chicago.

that's a fair, level headed assessment.

Boobs McGee
04-06-2009, 04:59 PM
Here's a glimpse of Cutler's gritty, competitive nature when his boss calls on the phone:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_zBjohwbyBM8/SG67E2R-y3I/AAAAAAAAAYI/l-NORRG6F-E/s400/Cohen-playing-hide-%27n-seek.jpg

Here's Jay Cutler with the gritt to ask his father to bring his playbook in for him.

http://dadthing.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/ace-crying-426x320.jpg

aaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahhaah ah!


ahem.


hahahaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahhaha
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

I seriously have tears rolling down my cheeks, because as I was reading the article those are the first two images that came to my head after the "gritty" comments.

wow that was funny.

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 05:00 PM
Hell even Elway's father sided with Elway when he refused to be drafted by the Colts back in 83!!! I'd imagine Elway was called the same names Cutler is currently being called.:thumbs:

Damn right .... and Jay is further along now and has done more than Elway did at this point. Jay could become everything John was. I guess we'll see.

Boobs McGee
04-06-2009, 05:06 PM
beef, I will agree with you to a certain point about qb play. I too, love everything he was doing right...the amazing throws, ability to take over games, and let me add this: whenever he'd get out in front and throw some nasty blocks (****ing awesome). But I started getting more frustrated with his inability to check down, forcing throws, game management. For all of the excitement and talent he showed, I'll be glad to have a less fireworks oriented qb for a while that brings more consistency.

And I also agree, the whole "spin from different angles" aspect of it all is quite amazing in the journalism world.

theAPAOps5
04-06-2009, 05:12 PM
Boy he has them fooled.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 05:19 PM
beef, I will agree with you to a certain point about qb play. I too, love everything he was doing right...the amazing throws, ability to take over games, and let me add this: whenever he'd get out in front and throw some nasty blocks (****ing awesome). But I started getting more frustrated with his inability to check down, forcing throws, game management. For all of the excitement and talent he showed, I'll be glad to have a less fireworks oriented qb for a while that brings more consistency.

And I also agree, the whole "spin from different angles" aspect of it all is quite amazing in the journalism world.

Oh man. The blocks he was willing to throw downfield. A true thing of beauty, and thanks for reminding me.

You are totally correct and on target in your criticism of his play of course, especially the forcing of throws that were unnecessary. His unwillingness to drop the ball off to a back or the TE underneath instead of going for the big play. All valid and frustrating, but somewhat understandable coming from a 24/25 year old kid with an ego the size of the moon.

I just hold the belief that he was going to put it all together, and that it would be something to behold when he finally did.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-06-2009, 05:20 PM
Damn right .... and Jay is further along now and has done more than Elway did at this point. Jay could become everything John was. I guess we'll see.

Jay did more than Elway has done 4 years into their careers? if im not mistaken, John had the broncos in the super bowl his 4th year. Jay had the broncos.....8-8

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 05:21 PM
Jay did more than Elway has done 4 years into their careers? if im not mistaken, John had the broncos in the super bowl his 4th year. Jay had the broncos.....8-8

jay was only here 3 seasons..

rastaman
04-06-2009, 05:21 PM
beef, I will agree with you to a certain point about qb play. I too, love everything he was doing right...the amazing throws, ability to take over games, and let me add this: whenever he'd get out in front and throw some nasty blocks (****ing awesome). But I started getting more frustrated with his inability to check down, forcing throws, game management. For all of the excitement and talent he showed, I'll be glad to have a less fireworks oriented qb for a while that brings more consistency.

And I also agree, the whole "spin from different angles" aspect of it all is quite amazing in the journalism world.

The ability to check down and stop forcing throws and his game management would have improved as he got older, perhaps in his 4th to 6th year. Its called maturity! I guess now we fans have got to watch Cutler mature and come into his a Chicago Bear!

Hopefully 4 to 6 years from now, Bowlen and McDaniels will find another Franchise QB we Bronco Faithful fans justly deserve!!

Northman
04-06-2009, 05:24 PM
I'm happy for Jay. Hopefully he's leaned something about communication and perception. He's a good guy and I think many Broncos fans are gonna give him a bunch of underserved crap over this whole crap storm.

I wish him the best and I hope he wins alot of games in Chicago.


I hope he gets hammered, and not in a good way.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-06-2009, 05:24 PM
jay was only here 3 seasons..

whoops

SonOfLe-loLang
04-06-2009, 05:24 PM
jay was only here 3 seasons..

ok, well Elway had his team 11-5 in 85:)

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 05:25 PM
whoops

^5 haha

snowspot66
04-06-2009, 05:26 PM
Damn right .... and Jay is further along now and has done more than Elway did at this point. Jay could become everything John was. I guess we'll see.

John wasn't in a contract situation already being paid and refusing to answer phone calls.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 05:26 PM
ok, well Elway had his team 11-5 in 85:)

I was going to make an analogy to having a cell phone booth jockey filling in for RB on the 85 team, but then drew a blank at what could be considered similar

maybe a guy from a colecovision booth at the mall

Northman
04-06-2009, 05:27 PM
jay was only here 3 seasons..

And he was 17-20.

Elway was 27-13 with a playoff appearance.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-06-2009, 05:28 PM
I was going to make an analogy to having a cell phone booth jockey filling in for RB on the 85 team, but then drew a blank at what could be considered similar

maybe a guy from a colecovision booth at the mall

i enjoyed the colecovision.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 05:28 PM
And he was 17-20.

Elway was 27-13 with a playoff appearance.

team game broseph. Who's a better QB, Doug Williams or Dan Marino?

Northman
04-06-2009, 05:29 PM
team game broseph. Who's a better QB, Doug Williams or Dan Marino?


Elway had some bad teams or did you just ignore that aspect to help your arguement?

jsco70
04-06-2009, 05:31 PM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

If memory serves correctly, didn't Cutler throw a red zone INT in the pro bowl? Perhaps those who need to should sit back and give the new QB and coach a shot. At least if you're truly a fan and I know we all are.

I'm as big a Bronco fan as anyone...been that way for 30 plus years. I have watched on TV or in person every game since probably 1980. I've seen it all from Super Bowl 12, Red Miller getting fired, Reeves hired and fired, the Elway trade, all the come from behind wins, the embarrasing losses, the Reeves-Elway rift, the good drafts, bad drafts, free agents coming and going, Super Bowl wins, TD's ACL, Griese vs. Bubby, Plummer vs Griese, Shanahan and his decade of success, failure and mediocrity, and now, finally the Cutler "era" coming to an end.

With all that in mind, I keep it in perspective. At the end of the day, none of this directly affects us. It's a kids game played by grown men for money. I ask all Broncos fans to give the new team a shot and quit arguing about something that only Josh, Pat, Jay and Bus know what really happened. As they say...nothing more to see here...move along.

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 05:33 PM
Elway had some bad teams or did you just ignore that aspect to help your arguement?

he did, but the teams of the mid 80's were not terrible in any aspect of the game. the 08 broncos could not play defense or special teams, and RB was a black hole.

Broncos of 85 had players up and down the defense, plus a trustworthy kicker in Karlis (prater was a disaster 2nd half of last year)

cutthemdown
04-06-2009, 05:33 PM
I like how media tries to make him having diabetes a good thing. The second I heard he had that disease I was like uh oh. You can bet that in certain games he won't feel as good as other times.

IMO the push to get a big contract sooner then later was because Bus Cook and Cutler feel the same thing. Waiting until he's 27-28 may be too late. If any setbacks occur between now and then as it concerns his horrible disease of diabetes would make team pause to give him a long term deal.

Cutler better throw for at least 3500 yrds, 20 plus tds or Bears may make him go another yr before a new deal.

Northman
04-06-2009, 05:36 PM
he did, but the teams of the mid 80's were not terrible in any aspect of the game. the 08 broncos could not play defense or special teams, and RB was a black hole.

Broncos of 85 had players up and down the defense, plus a trustworthy kicker in Karlis (prater was a disaster 2nd half of last year)


Bad defense is bad defense. And those teams also faced injury bugs and i know during one particular season Karlis missed back to back game winning FG's by hitting the goal post on either side. Sorry G, that just wont fly for me.

mikeauran
04-06-2009, 05:38 PM
After his first 3 seasons in the league, Elway's stats were:

664 of 1244 (53%) for 8152 yards, 47 TD's, 52 Int's. The highest rating he had on a season was 76.8. It was also the only season he had thrown more TD's than Int's to that point as well at 18 and 15.

Cutler after 3 seasons:

762 of 1220 (62%) for 9024 yards, 54 TD's, 37 Ints. His lowest rating is better than Elways best.

Elways didn't throw as many TD's in a season as Cutler did this year until his 11th pro season. That was incidentally only the 2nd time he broke the 80 rating barrier in his career at 92.8 on the season. He only had 1 season in his first 10 years where he had as high of a TD to Int differential as Cutler has this season with 7. There were a number of years in his career where he threw more Int's than TD's.

The Broncos allowed 448 points this season, 2nd worst in the NFL. The myth that Elway was winning with no one around him is ridiculous. His teams did worse with defenses that weren't even as bad as what Cutler had to deal with this year. In 1984 when they went to the playoffs they had the best defense in the AFC and lost their 1st game. In 1987 when they went to the Superbowl they had the 3rd best defense in the AFC allowing 288 points. The defense allowed 352 points the next year, they went 8-8 and missed the playoffs. In 1989 when they again went to the Superbowl they had the best defense in the NFL by a good margin and allowed 226 points. The following year they allowed 374, went 5-11 and were in dead last. In 1994 they allowed 396 points and went 7-9. In 1995 they allowed 345 and went 8-8. Whenever the defense was even slightly below average under Elway, they typically lost.

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 05:43 PM
ok, well Elway had his team 11-5 in 85:)

In fact Elway was 13-3 in 1984, his first full season as a starter.

But unlike Jay, he had and excellent defense and running game.


I was talking better than Elway at this stage JUST AS A QUARTERBACK:
After his first 3 seasons in the league, Elway's stats were:

664 of 1244 (53%) for 8152 yards, 47 TD's, 52 Int's. The highest rating he had on a season was 76.8. It was also the only season he had thrown more TD's than Int's to that point as well at 18 and 15.

Cutler after 3 seasons:

762 of 1220 (62%) for 9024 yards, 54 TD's, 37 Ints.

Cutler's lowest rating is better than Elways best.


This is what I meant ... and of course I was right again.

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 05:49 PM
After his first 3 seasons in the league, Elway's stats were:

664 of 1244 (53%) for 8152 yards, 47 TD's, 52 Int's. The highest rating he had on a season was 76.8. It was also the only season he had thrown more TD's than Int's to that point as well at 18 and 15.

Cutler after 3 seasons:

762 of 1220 (62%) for 9024 yards, 54 TD's, 37 Ints. His lowest rating is better than Elways best.

Elways didn't throw as many TD's in a season as Cutler did this year until his 11th pro season. That was incidentally only the 2nd time he broke the 80 rating barrier in his career at 92.8 on the season. He only had 1 season in his first 10 years where he had as high of a TD to Int differential as Cutler has this season with 7. There were a number of years in his career where he threw more Int's than TD's.

The Broncos allowed 448 points this season, 2nd worst in the NFL. The myth that Elway was winning with no one around him is ridiculous. His teams did worse with defenses that weren't even as bad as what Cutler had to deal with this year. In 1984 when they went to the playoffs they had the best defense in the AFC and lost their 1st game. In 1987 when they went to the Superbowl they had the 3rd best defense in the AFC allowing 288 points. The defense allowed 352 points the next year, they went 8-8 and missed the playoffs. In 1989 when they again went to the Superbowl they had the best defense in the NFL by a good margin and allowed 226 points. The following year they allowed 374, went 5-11 and were in dead last. In 1994 they allowed 396 points and went 7-9. In 1995 they allowed 345 and went 8-8. Whenever the defense was even slightly below average under Elway, they typically lost.

Excellent argument for doing what it takes to build a top flight defense.

TonyR
04-06-2009, 05:50 PM
I was talking better than Elway at this stage JUST AS A QUARTERBACK:

This is what I meant ... and of course I was right again.

That's a rather amateur hour post from somebody from whom I expect better, although you've been off the mark quite a bit during this whole debacle. It's not all about stats. It's about winning, leading, and getting it done in crunch time and down the stretch of a season. Elway excelled in these areas, even as an undisciplined youngster playing in a system that was far from what would've been best for him. Jay? Not so much.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-06-2009, 05:52 PM
In fact Elway was 13-3 in 1984, his first full season as a starter.

But unlike Jay, he had and excellent defense and running game.


I was talking better than Elway at this stage JUST AS A QUARTERBACK:



This is what I meant ... and of course I was right again.

You'll notice most QB stats this generation are wildly inflated from the past. So much has changed about the game to make it a passer league since.

telluride
04-06-2009, 05:55 PM
I like how media tries to make him having diabetes a good thing. The second I heard he had that disease I was like uh oh. You can bet that in certain games he won't feel as good as other times.

IMO the push to get a big contract sooner then later was because Bus Cook and Cutler feel the same thing. Waiting until he's 27-28 may be too late. If any setbacks occur between now and then as it concerns his horrible disease of diabetes would make team pause to give him a long term deal.

Cutler better throw for at least 3500 yrds, 20 plus tds or Bears may make him go another yr before a new deal.

I mentioned this in another thread, but it's amazing how much the diabetes gets glossed over. The reality is, Cutler is a Type-1 diabetic who likes to party. That immaturity cost the Broncos a game or two last season, and thus the playoffs.

Agree with your prediction: Cutler's health is going to get worse. He'll have a short-than-normal career.

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 05:58 PM
You'll notice most QB stats this generation are wildly inflated from the past. So much has changed about the game to make it a passer league since.

God, that's a fact. Could you imagine the great CBs of the 80s trying to play their game today? The field would be covered in flags.

cutthemdown
04-06-2009, 06:01 PM
In fact Elway was 13-3 in 1984, his first full season as a starter.

But unlike Jay, he had and excellent defense and running game.


I was talking better than Elway at this stage JUST AS A QUARTERBACK:



This is what I meant ... and of course I was right again.

Really hard to compare stats from 2 different eras. Remember how the Raiders used to beat up on Elway. The hit him after every throw, out of bounds, in the head, on the ground, whatever. CBS could get away with way more contact and the NFL had not yet begun it's quest to protect QBS.

Cutler, Brady, all these new QBs don't know what it was like in early 80's. It was tough to be a QB back then, you had to be tough or you wouldn't survive.

lazarus4444
04-06-2009, 06:04 PM
After his first 3 seasons in the league, Elway's stats were:

664 of 1244 (53%) for 8152 yards, 47 TD's, 52 Int's. The highest rating he had on a season was 76.8. It was also the only season he had thrown more TD's than Int's to that point as well at 18 and 15.

Cutler after 3 seasons:

762 of 1220 (62%) for 9024 yards, 54 TD's, 37 Ints. His lowest rating is better than Elways best.

Elways didn't throw as many TD's in a season as Cutler did this year until his 11th pro season. That was incidentally only the 2nd time he broke the 80 rating barrier in his career at 92.8 on the season. He only had 1 season in his first 10 years where he had as high of a TD to Int differential as Cutler has this season with 7. There were a number of years in his career where he threw more Int's than TD's.

The Broncos allowed 448 points this season, 2nd worst in the NFL. The myth that Elway was winning with no one around him is ridiculous. His teams did worse with defenses that weren't even as bad as what Cutler had to deal with this year. In 1984 when they went to the playoffs they had the best defense in the AFC and lost their 1st game. In 1987 when they went to the Superbowl they had the 3rd best defense in the AFC allowing 288 points. The defense allowed 352 points the next year, they went 8-8 and missed the playoffs. In 1989 when they again went to the Superbowl they had the best defense in the NFL by a good margin and allowed 226 points. The following year they allowed 374, went 5-11 and were in dead last. In 1994 they allowed 396 points and went 7-9. In 1995 they allowed 345 and went 8-8. Whenever the defense was even slightly below average under Elway, they typically lost.


You know, stats are all nice and everything but the only stats that matter are wins and Elway was verrrrrry very good at winning. Elway was a winner, period. Cutler doesn't have the mental aptitude to be a winner. Can he grow into a winner? Maybe.

Does Cutler have talent? Definitely. But people compare stats to Elway all the time and Elway usually comes out the loser in stat comparisons, except when it comes to wins. Only Favre has more wins than Elway and i think favre played longer than Elway did.

Wins is why Elway is in the HOF. Wins is why everybody loved (Still love) him. Wins is something Jay is woefully short of. Not criticizing Cutler, just stating fact. We'll see how it all turns out when Jay retires. I got a feeling the trade will be called in the Broncos favor.

Laz

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 06:10 PM
You guys are hilarious .... ANY excuse not to acknowledge Jay's stats are significantly ahead of John's at this stage in their careers ... "it's different eras" ... "the cornerback styles were different" ... "the Raiders were meanies to John" ... "Elway had more wins" ... "stats are inflated now" ... "the TEAM had better records" ... "the league didn't protect the QBs yet." OH BROTHER! :~ohyah!:

Scoreboard guys.

Numbers are numbers.



But again, we really gotta stop all this argument about Cutler. Cutler is gone. I think we will all regret it bitterly, while Popps and Rohirrim think "don't say we didn't warn you, Bears" (quote from Popps).

We'll see.

For now though, the draft is in less than three weeks.

baja
04-06-2009, 06:18 PM
After his first 3 seasons in the league, Elway's stats were:

664 of 1244 (53%) for 8152 yards, 47 TD's, 52 Int's. The highest rating he had on a season was 76.8. It was also the only season he had thrown more TD's than Int's to that point as well at 18 and 15.

Cutler after 3 seasons:

762 of 1220 (62%) for 9024 yards, 54 TD's, 37 Ints. His lowest rating is better than Elways best.

Elways didn't throw as many TD's in a season as Cutler did this year until his 11th pro season. That was incidentally only the 2nd time he broke the 80 rating barrier in his career at 92.8 on the season. He only had 1 season in his first 10 years where he had as high of a TD to Int differential as Cutler has this season with 7. There were a number of years in his career where he threw more Int's than TD's.

The Broncos allowed 448 points this season, 2nd worst in the NFL. The myth that Elway was winning with no one around him is ridiculous. His teams did worse with defenses that weren't even as bad as what Cutler had to deal with this year. In 1984 when they went to the playoffs they had the best defense in the AFC and lost their 1st game. In 1987 when they went to the Superbowl they had the 3rd best defense in the AFC allowing 288 points. The defense allowed 352 points the next year, they went 8-8 and missed the playoffs. In 1989 when they again went to the Superbowl they had the best defense in the NFL by a good margin and allowed 226 points. The following year they allowed 374, went 5-11 and were in dead last. In 1994 they allowed 396 points and went 7-9. In 1995 they allowed 345 and went 8-8. Whenever the defense was even slightly below average under Elway, they typically lost.

So your saying Elway sucked??? ;D

snowspot66
04-06-2009, 06:25 PM
Pulling up stats from 1983 and comparing them today is the same thing as taking the Bible out and saying "Yep! This is all 100% relevant to my life right now." The NFL of then and of today are two completely different games. Average QB's break 3,000 yards without breaking a sweat and if they don't make 3,500 they are under performing.

Jay has done very well for a young QB but he's going to hit a ton of road blocks in Chicago. They gave up two top draft picks for him when their defense needs new bodies and they haven't had any WR's in years. He will not perform to the level that he did here and probably never will again in his career unless Chicago miraculously starts drafting well (their record for the past two decades indicate the odds of this are small).

Cutler had the rarest of opportunities here. Two Pro Bowl quality tackles in the first couple years of their career, two excellent starting recievers and decent depth, and an offensive minded coach that built the offense we spent the last year copying. He went and gave it all up. If Cutler was going to be a great QB it was going to be here in Denver. Now he'll have to struggle to be a good QB because Chicago will never put together a line like we had last year. You don't put lines like that together. They come together through a ****load of luck and when somebody does put one together they pay the money to keep it.

Kyle ****ing Orton is going to savor the opportunity because Jay was too dumb to realize what he had.

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 06:36 PM
Cutler had the rarest of opportunities here. Two Pro Bowl quality tackles in the first couple years of their career.

Don't say that to Cito Pelon ... he'll call you a sophist! :~ohyah!:

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 06:37 PM
You guys are hilarious .... ANY excuse not to acknowledge Jay's stats are significantly ahead of John's at this stage in their careers ... "it's different eras" ... "the cornerback styles were different" ... "the Raiders were meanies to John" ... "Elway had more wins" ... "stats are inflated now" ... "the TEAM had better records" ... "the league didn't protect the QBs yet." OH BROTHER! :~ohyah!:

Scoreboard guys.

Numbers are numbers.



But again, we really gotta stop all this argument about Cutler. Cutler is gone. I think we will all regret it bitterly, while Popps and Rohirrim think "don't say we didn't warn you, Bears" (quote from Popps).

We'll see.

For now though, the draft is in less than three weeks.

You don't know what I think. Cutler is the QB of the Bears. I care about what he does as much as I care about what Tom Brady, Big Ben or friggin Leftwich do, in other words, not at all unless they're playing the Broncos. Unfortunately, I like to come to the OM and talk football, and these are the only threads here.

As far as the differences between eras that you so blithely laugh off to protect the sanctity of your golden boy's memory, the arguments are valid. As Mediator is currently pointing out right now over in the Draft Forum, why use a first round pick on a two-down back from the old school like Beanie Wells when the RB position is being devalued more and more every year? Will we ever see another 2,000 yard back? In this new era of RBs, will be able to reasonably compare Walter Payton to Matt Forte down the road?

colonelbeef
04-06-2009, 06:50 PM
Went back and watched Jay Cutler highlights from last season.

then went back and watched Kyle Orton highlights.

Jay Cutler is twice the QB Orton is. Twice the arm, twice the maneuverability, twice the pocket presence.

Orton's arm is weaker than I thought unfortunately

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 06:57 PM
Went back and watched Jay Cutler highlights from last season.

then went back and watched Kyle Orton highlights.

Jay Cutler is twice the QB Orton is. Twice the arm, twice the maneuverability, twice the pocket presence.

Orton's arm is weaker than I thought unfortunately

*SIGH*

lex
04-06-2009, 06:59 PM
That's a rather amateur hour post from somebody from whom I expect better, although you've been off the mark quite a bit during this whole debacle. It's not all about stats. It's about winning, leading, and getting it done in crunch time and down the stretch of a season. Elway excelled in these areas, even as an undisciplined youngster playing in a system that was far from what would've been best for him. Jay? Not so much.

Hasnt Jay been one of the best at converting for 3rd downs? Also, hasnt he been one of the most productive QBs in the 4th qtr?

lex
04-06-2009, 07:00 PM
Pulling up stats from 1983 and comparing them today is the same thing as taking the Bible out and saying "Yep! This is all 100% relevant to my life right now." The NFL of then and of today are two completely different games. Average QB's break 3,000 yards without breaking a sweat and if they don't make 3,500 they are under performing.

Jay has done very well for a young QB but he's going to hit a ton of road blocks in Chicago. They gave up two top draft picks for him when their defense needs new bodies and they haven't had any WR's in years. He will not perform to the level that he did here and probably never will again in his career unless Chicago miraculously starts drafting well (their record for the past two decades indicate the odds of this are small).

Cutler had the rarest of opportunities here. Two Pro Bowl quality tackles in the first couple years of their career, two excellent starting recievers and decent depth, and an offensive minded coach that built the offense we spent the last year copying. He went and gave it all up. If Cutler was going to be a great QB it was going to be here in Denver. Now he'll have to struggle to be a good QB because Chicago will never put together a line like we had last year. You don't put lines like that together. They come together through a ****load of luck and when somebody does put one together they pay the money to keep it.

Kyle ****ing Orton is going to savor the opportunity because Jay was too dumb to realize what he had.


Please dont let it happen,...please dont let it happen...

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 07:04 PM
Please dont let it happen,...please dont let it happen...

Please don't let what happen? The Broncos start winning and Cutler start losing? Is that how far gone some of you guys have gone?

cutthemdown
04-06-2009, 07:06 PM
the reason we got 2 firsts is because Cutler way better then Orton. But the better player doesnt always score most points.

Kaylore
04-06-2009, 07:09 PM
Cutler is more talented than Orton. He will always be more talented than Orton. That doesn't mean Orton can't be successful or win a championship here. We have a great offensive line. Great receivers and great tight ends. We have a lot of draft picks. We have decent backs. To say that all of the production was Cutler is a slight on guys like Royal. It's a team game and we need people who want to be part of it.

And by the way, saying because a book is old means you can't take anything away from it is the most shallow thing I've ever read. I think any book, especially the classics, should be read more, not dismissed with comments like "this has nothing to do with me and isn't important."

BroncoBuff
04-06-2009, 07:12 PM
As far as the differences between eras that you so blithely laugh off to protect the sanctity of your golden boy's memory, the arguments are valid.

Come on, Roh! I never "laughed off" the point about different eras, of course there's significant differences in eras, although I think there was almost as many passing yards in the 80s as here in the 00s, I dunno (if I'm wrong I'll at least admit it). WHAT I LAUGHED AT was how people come up with ANY excuse to avoid simply saying, "Yeah I guess you're right, Jay's passing stats are significantly better than John's at this point."

It's the "Internet Tough Guy" syndrome ... everybody insists they're always right, no matter what twisted contortions they have to bend into to keep that illusion alive.



Everybody repeat after me! ....

Yeah, I guess you were right about that! ....
Yeah, I guess you were right about that.

Jay's passing stats were significantly better than John's! ...
Jay's passing stats were significantly better than John's

At this point in their careers! ...
At this point in their careers.


Thank you very much.

Rigs11
04-06-2009, 07:12 PM
cutler can't even competitively answer his phone.yeah gritty allright..

RMT
04-06-2009, 07:18 PM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

yeah, and his QB rating was like 29.6.

Rohirrim
04-06-2009, 07:24 PM
Come on, Roh! I never "laughed off" the point about different eras, of course there's significant differences in eras, although I think there was almost as many passing yards in the 80s as here in the 00s, I dunno (if I'm wrong I'll at least admit it). WHAT I LAUGHED AT was how people come up with ANY excuse to avoid simply saying, "Yeah I guess you're right, Jay's passing stats are significantly better than John's at this point."

It's the "Internet Tough Guy" syndrome ... everybody insists they're always right, no matter what twisted contortions they have to bend into to keep that illusion alive.



Everybody repeat after me! ....

Yeah, I guess you were right about that! ....
Yeah, I guess you were right about that.

Jay's passing stats were significantly better than John's! ...
Jay's passing stats were significantly better than John's

At this point in their careers! ...
At this point in their careers.


Thank you very much.

Well, you're the lawyer, but I'm guessing any "reasonable" person would conclude that this statement -

You guys are hilarious .... ANY excuse not to acknowledge Jay's stats are significantly ahead of John's at this stage in their careers ... "it's different eras" ... "the cornerback styles were different" ... "the Raiders were meanies to John" ... "Elway had more wins" ... "stats are inflated now" ... "the TEAM had better records" ... "the league didn't protect the QBs yet." OH BROTHER!

with the little :~ohyah!:

at the end, could justifiably be described as "laughing off."

Anyway, I don't know what you're talking about. I've said many time Jay is better than Orton. Jay has a great arm. Jay has the possibility of ending up a great QB. Maybe Jay has better passing stats than Elway. Does he have better passing stats than Dan Marino? Dan Fouts? Tom Brady? Will he load the Bears on his back, like Elway did with the Broncos, and take them to multiple SBs? The last three games I saw him playing in, I wasn't impressed by his play or his demeanor. And I guess I believe that raising such a circus over such a minor little incident speaks to me of a pissy little character. I don't see "champion" in the guy. I see a great arm.

baja
04-06-2009, 07:47 PM
<b>Ro - I don't see "champion" in the guy. I see a great arm.

I thought that bore repeating</b>

snowspot66
04-06-2009, 07:54 PM
Cutler is more talented than Orton. He will always be more talented than Orton. That doesn't mean Orton can't be successful or win a championship here. We have a great offensive line. Great receivers and great tight ends. We have a lot of draft picks. We have decent backs. To say that all of the production was Cutler is a slight on guys like Royal. It's a team game and we need people who want to be part of it.

And by the way, saying because a book is old means you can't take anything away from it is the most shallow thing I've ever read. I think any book, especially the classics, should be read more, not dismissed with comments like "this has nothing to do with me and isn't important."

I agree.

And way to jump to conclusions. I was making a comparison when somebody started throwing out Elway stats from the early 80's. Stats from 1983 are not going to be as relevant or in the same context as stats from last year for a lot of reasons. I said the Bible because it was the first thing that came to mind. No where did I say it was irrelevant. I merely said that it's not all going to be 100% relevant. You can't sit there and tell me that you read the book of Numbers constantly and it has a profound effect on your daily life. Odds are 99 out of 100 fall asleep after two pages.

That's the only point I was making. It's apples to oranges.

Gort
04-06-2009, 08:34 PM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

we want our QB in the SB, not the pro bowl. remember that future probowls will now be played WITHOUT players from the 2 SB teams.

Gort
04-06-2009, 08:39 PM
the reason we got 2 firsts is because Cutler way better then Orton. But the better player doesnt always score most points.

Cutler is better than Dilfer. but Dilfer has a SB ring. that's what matters most.

epicSocialism4tw
04-06-2009, 08:40 PM
Cutler is better than Dilfer. but Dilfer has a SB ring. that's what matters most.

LOL

Yeah...thats because Dilfer was the catalyst for that championship.

Archer81
04-06-2009, 08:52 PM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while


Yeah...because the PROBOWL matters...


:Broncos:

Rigs11
04-06-2009, 08:53 PM
Went back and watched Jay Cutler highlights from last season.

then went back and watched Kyle Orton highlights.

Jay Cutler is twice the QB Orton is. Twice the arm, twice the maneuverability, twice the pocket presence.

Orton's arm is weaker than I thought unfortunately

And Denver has twice the offense that Chicago does. We will see how baby jay does when he is running for his life every play.

Archer81
04-06-2009, 08:55 PM
Cutler wanted out, he got his wish. He can go play in Chicago and do nothing there, for all that matters to us here. We'll see what happens next season.

:Broncos:

Shoemaker
04-06-2009, 09:15 PM
It's the "Internet Tough Guy" syndrome ... everybody insists they're always right.

Everybody repeat after me! ....

Yeah, I guess you were right about that! ....
Yeah, I guess you were right about that.

Jay's passing stats were significantly better than John's! ...
Jay's passing stats were significantly better than John's

At this point in their careers! ...
At this point in their careers.


Thank you very much.

Please tell me you're aware of the hypocrisy here.

Are you trying to say that the rule changes over the past twenty years, most of which have been specifically tailored to making sure the QBs are protected so that they can put up gaudy numbers and stats because those football games are less "boring" doesn't make a notable difference in the fact
that Cutler's stat's are gaudier than Elways were at this point in his career?

I'm not trying to say that Cutler doesn't have physical talent; of course he does. But the fact remains that Elways had a far better record at this point than Cutler does, and unless I'm mistaken the level of talent around Cutler (at least on offense) was equal or superior to that around Elway in his first three years.

You seem to be arguing that we just traded a quarterback that will be better than the Greatest of All Time, and we will be tearing our hair out about it, based solely on his stats and not his win total and intangibles. But it was exactly those intangibles that made Elway the GOAT, and it is the lack of those same intangibles that makes me think we won't miss Cutler as much as you think we will.

Northman
04-07-2009, 04:41 AM
LOL

Yeah...thats because Dilfer was the catalyst for that championship.

He must of done something right. Tony Banks, Scott Mitchell, Elvis Grbac, etc couldnt get it done.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-07-2009, 06:49 AM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/073h6jjcobcEv/610x.jpg

Circle Orange
04-07-2009, 07:06 AM
we want our QB in the SB, not the pro bowl. remember that future probowls will now be played WITHOUT players from the 2 SB teams.

Cripes, I can vote someone in for the probowl under the current system.

The pro bowl is a joke these days. It looks like gloss on the record, but when you see all the guys going that shouldn't go you have to wonder.

Circle Orange
04-07-2009, 07:08 AM
Cutler is more talented than Orton. He will always be more talented than Orton. That doesn't mean Orton can't be successful or win a championship here. We have a great offensive line. Great receivers and great tight ends. We have a lot of draft picks. We have decent backs. To say that all of the production was Cutler is a slight on guys like Royal. It's a team game and we need people who want to be part of it.

And by the way, saying because a book is old means you can't take anything away from it is the most shallow thing I've ever read. I think any book, especially the classics, should be read more, not dismissed with comments like "this has nothing to do with me and isn't important."

In horseracing terms, Orton is a "mudder." Solid and all that, but boring as hell.

Being more talented than Orton in Chicago isn't a ticket for success either, unfortunately. They said the same thing about Grossman before he wore out his welcome. some of it was him, a lot of it is the attitude in Chicago. Jay has NO IDEA what he's stepped into there.

HILife
04-07-2009, 07:16 AM
Can we stop with the Culter Threads? He's no longer on this team anymore. Out of site, out of mind.

colonelbeef
04-07-2009, 07:46 AM
Yeah...because the PROBOWL matters...


:Broncos:

do I need to go back and pull up "Clady got shafted by the pro bowl voters" threads?

It's an acknowledgment of excellence attained during a season by an individual player, therefore it's a decent bellweather of past successes

colonelbeef
04-07-2009, 07:48 AM
Can we stop with the Culter Threads? He's no longer on this team anymore. Out of site, out of mind.

I think it's important to maintain objectivity when assessing the state of affairs of the Broncos organization, and I do not think that the "It's all Jay's fault" horde is being objective at all. The article points out how differently two sides of the same situation can be viewed (skewed) and I think that is important to keep in mind.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-07-2009, 07:52 AM
I think it's important to maintain objectivity when assessing the state of affairs of the Broncos organization, and I do not think that the "It's all Jay's fault" horde is being objective at all. The article points out how differently two sides of the same situation can be viewed (skewed) and I think that is important to keep in mind.

But the "McDouche" contingent is being completely objective, right? Whatever you say, Lt. Chicken!

Reject reality and insert your own, as usual. :yayaya:

colonelbeef
04-07-2009, 08:29 AM
But the "McDouche" contingent is being completely objective, right? Whatever you say, Lt. Chicken!

Reject reality and insert your own, as usual. :yayaya:

no, I think most are being totally subjective from both side of the issue, but then you seem to enjoy making wild assumptions, so this is par for your course

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-07-2009, 08:32 AM
no, I think most are being totally subjective from both side of the issue, but then you seem to enjoy making wild assumptions, so this is par for your course

That's funny. You didn't mention that "both sides" were doing anything at all. Just the "it's all Jay's fault hoard." "I do not think that the "It's all Jay's fault" horde is being objective at all."

maybe you should clarify your positions, so nobody has to make "wild" assumptions that are completely based on what you state.

colonelbeef
04-07-2009, 08:41 AM
That's funny. You didn't mention that "both sides" were doing anything at all. Just the "it's all Jay's fault hoard." "I do not think that the "It's all Jay's fault" horde is being objective at all."

maybe you should clarify your positions, so nobody has to make "wild" assumptions that are completely based on what you state.

I have made many statements to the contrary calling out Cutler and in particular his agent, and alluding to my belief that they tried to use the situation to get more money via an extended contract, but that is not the point of this thread. 80% of the posts on this board are in essence blaming Jay and going overboard in the use of hyperbole and 4th hand rumor. I am simply posting some evidence that perhaps that viewpoint is a bit of the old bull**** being fed from the hand the FO in order to calm the masses and make it okay that we just lost our QB over a soap opera.

Do I really need to hold your hand through all of these posts? Maybe what you need is somebody sitting next to you explaining the greater points, as you do not seem capable of understanding anything other than the most basic of spoonfed rhetoric

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-07-2009, 08:47 AM
I have made many statements to the contrary calling out Cutler and in particular his agent, and alluding to my belief that they tried to use the situation to get more money via an extended contract, but that is not the point of this thread. 80% of the posts on this board are in essence blaming Jay and going overboard in the use of hyperbole and 4th hand rumor. I am simply posting some evidence that perhaps that viewpoint is a bit of the old bull**** being fed from the hand the FO in order to calm the masses and make it okay that we just lost our QB over a soap opera.

Do I really need to hold your hand through all of these posts? Maybe what you need is somebody sitting next to you explaining the greater points, as you do not seem capable of understanding anything other than the most basic of spoonfed rhetoric

And perhaps what you posted is a bit of the old bull**** being fed to Chicago fans to calm their fears that they just received a 25 year old baby to lead their team to an 8-8 record.

No, that couldn't be it. It must be that the "Cutler haters" just don't like it, right?

And you think 80% of the posts are anti-Cutler? I think you should re-evaluate that number. It's not nearly that high.

tell me: is the sky still falling?

Hulamau
04-07-2009, 08:53 AM
[QUOTE=colonelbeef;2373031]New Chicago Bears quarterback also shows mature professionalism
--------------------------------------------------
funny how two sides of the same coin can be spun so differently, eh? cutler bashers, take a step back and make sure you aren't just eating what the orange hand is feeding you.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Time to resume Lurker status CB. Another puff piece he could have copied from any of the Denver Post articles on Jays fighting spirit and all. Heh, hes dealing with his illness. Good thing too, just like millions of other no name Americans.

And his father whining about the Broncos playing the terrible meany's role, Tjesus! While Cry Baby Jay gets to act all contrite and humble for his first press conference. I wonder where Jay inherited his arrogant, selfish sense of entitlement from?? .. could be his father??? Noooooo! :wiggle: But you cant fault Dad for standing up for his son

We all know Jays an excellent talent he may do well there, though Lovey's going to have to really revamp their offense to make him even marginally happy. I'll eat my hat if he has anywhere close to 4500 yard passing this year.

No doubt Jay will be on his best behavior for a bit here and the violins will be playing behind each Chicago Tribune honeymoon piece for a while now, but we've read all this and swallowed the music long ago.

By the way Colonel have you ordered your #6 Bears Jersey yet??

vancejohnson82
04-07-2009, 08:54 AM
I have made many statements to the contrary calling out Cutler and in particular his agent, and alluding to my belief that they tried to use the situation to get more money via an extended contract, but that is not the point of this thread. 80% of the posts on this board are in essence blaming Jay and going overboard in the use of hyperbole and 4th hand rumor. I am simply posting some evidence that perhaps that viewpoint is a bit of the old bull**** being fed from the hand the FO in order to calm the masses and make it okay that we just lost our QB over a soap opera.

Do I really need to hold your hand through all of these posts? Maybe what you need is somebody sitting next to you explaining the greater points, as you do not seem capable of understanding anything other than the most basic of spoonfed rhetoric

Hyperbole? Rhetoric??

Listen dude...I dont know who the hell you think you are and what you're trying to pull here....but I dont like your tone and your fancy smansy wordplay

Hulamau
04-07-2009, 09:02 AM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

Where he stunk it up, I was there watching every painful minute of it and cheering him on.

He'll probably make the Pro Bowl again soon too even if by default with the relative lack of decent NFC QBs.

WyoLaw
04-07-2009, 09:06 AM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

And he was awful in that game.

vancejohnson82
04-07-2009, 09:17 AM
And he was awful in that game.

haha....I lost my shirt on that game

stupid, degenerate....gambling on the Pro Bowl

TonyR
04-07-2009, 10:04 AM
Hasnt Jay been one of the best at converting for 3rd downs? Also, hasnt he been one of the most productive QBs in the 4th qtr?

How did he perform in the final 3 games of last season? We needed 1 win. The Buffalo game, in particular, at home, was very winnable. Do you think John Elway loses that game? Tom Brady? Peyton Manning? Ben Roethlisberger? Phillip Rivers? Something tells me most of those guys would have found a way to get it done.

If you look at the 2008 season Jay basically had 8 very good games and 8 mediocre to poor games. Very inconsistent. Too inconsitent, for that matter. I think 8 below average performances is too many, particularly when you stink it up in the final 3. But of course you're going to blame the running game and defense, and ignore the strong O-line and WR's, so I'm probably wasting my time pointing this out.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-07-2009, 10:12 AM
How did he perform in the final 3 games of last season? We needed 1 win. The Buffalo game, in particular, at home, was very winnable. Do you think John Elway loses that game? Tom Brady? Peyton Manning? Ben Roethlisberger? Phillip Rivers? Something tells me most of those guys would have found a way to get it done.

If you look at the 2008 season Jay basically had 8 very good games and 8 mediocre to poor games. Very inconsistent. Too inconsitent, for that matter. I think 8 below average performances is too many, particularly when you stink it up in the final 3. But of course you're going to blame the running game and defense, and ignore the strong O-line and WR's, so I'm probably wasting my time pointing this out.

But... but...

you're forgetting about his gritty, competitive nature! And that he has to check his blood sugar! LOL

lex
04-07-2009, 10:27 AM
How did he perform in the final 3 games of last season? We needed 1 win. The Buffalo game, in particular, at home, was very winnable. Do you think John Elway loses that game? Tom Brady? Peyton Manning? Ben Roethlisberger? Phillip Rivers? Something tells me most of those guys would have found a way to get it done.

If you look at the 2008 season Jay basically had 8 very good games and 8 mediocre to poor games. Very inconsistent. Too inconsitent, for that matter. I think 8 below average performances is too many, particularly when you stink it up in the final 3. But of course you're going to blame the running game and defense, and ignore the strong O-line and WR's, so I'm probably wasting my time pointing this out.

When during R'bergers time in the league has he ever played on a team with a defense as bad as what ours was last year? Please. First of all, these guys arent boxers. They play a team game. Youre attributing wins solely to QBs. I was referencing statistics that are actually attributable to the QB (3rd down conversion and 4th qtr performance by a QB). I like how youre saying that Slowik and LeBeau are the same. Nice argument.

BroncoBuff
04-07-2009, 10:42 AM
And he was awful in that game.

Yeah ... that's another reason I'm glad he's gone.

If he can't perform well in the Pro Bowl, that reflects badly on the Broncos.

Broncos4tw
04-07-2009, 11:01 AM
Who cares.. he is gone now. I think when their careers are over, Cutler is going to have much greater #'s (and # of wins and probably championships) than Orton. But we got what we got. Hopefully we can make do, but it looks like we are tearing down a team with some solid players, inserting average ones, and saying it's part of a 'system.' I personally don't know a system that favors crappier players, but maybe McD is super mega ultra brilliant, and will make something happen. yea...

Rohirrim
04-07-2009, 11:11 AM
When during R'bergers time in the league has he ever played on a team with a defense as bad as what ours was last year? Please. First of all, these guys arent boxers. They play a team game. Youre attributing wins solely to QBs. I was referencing statistics that are actually attributable to the QB (3rd down conversion and 4th qtr performance by a QB). I like how youre saying that Slowik and LeBeau are the same. Nice argument.

And yet you post a mock in the draft section, telling us it's your best mock yet, that doesn't have the Broncos picking a D player until the 225th pick. WTF?

bombay
04-07-2009, 11:13 AM
When I look at Cutler, gritty doesn't come to mind. And his competitiveness is selective. He seems to relish the role of underdog (Jets, Falcons) and underperform as a favorite (KC, Raiders, Bills). At any rate, I wish him well after next season. Like to see a pretty high pick out of Chicago.

bombay
04-07-2009, 11:30 AM
haha....I lost my shirt on that game

stupid, degenerate....gambling on the Pro Bowl

Uh, yeah.

LOL

You've got only yourself to blame if you bet on the pro bowl.

TonyR
04-07-2009, 02:44 PM
...And his competitiveness is selective. He seems to relish the role of underdog (Jets, Falcons) and underperform as a favorite (KC, Raiders, Bills).

Good point. His games against the Jets and Falcons were two of the more memorable performances of his career. But the unacceptable and inexplicable eggs laid against KC, Oak and Buf offset those. Win one of those games and we're in the playoffs. To play poorly in one of those games I suppose is understandable. But all 3? Yes it's a team game, but Jay is supposed to be the leader of the team and he didn't get it done in those games.

mhgaffney
04-07-2009, 06:50 PM
You super jocks are annoying.

You do not know how to live gracefully

minus your former hero QB

and now you must dis him just to maintain your precious precious comfort zone.

What a pathetic bunch of zeros 000000000000000000000000

Cutler was holding out for more $$$. Just business.

You are the cry babies.

Try growing some balls.

MHG

baja
04-07-2009, 06:59 PM
You super jocks are annoying.

You do not know how to live gracefully

minus your former hero QB

and now you must dis him just to maintain your precious precious comfort zone.

What a pathetic bunch of zeros 000000000000000000000000

Cutler was holding out for more $$$. Just business.


You are the cry babies.

Try growing some balls.

MHG


Jay had THREE YEARS left on his contract. What is your idea of "just business"

ak1971
04-07-2009, 07:01 PM
You super jocks are annoying.

You do not know how to live gracefully

minus your former hero QB

and now you must dis him just to maintain your precious precious comfort zone.

What a pathetic bunch of zeros 000000000000000000000000

Cutler was holding out for more $$$. Just business.

You are the cry babies.

Try growing some balls.



MHG

Why dont you write a book about it and try to sell it here with constant spam.

broncocalijohn
04-07-2009, 08:56 PM
But... but...

you're forgetting about his gritty, competitive nature! And that he has to check his blood sugar! LOL

You forgot 4 times!

broncocalijohn
04-07-2009, 08:57 PM
Why dont you write a book about it and try to sell it here with constant spam.

If there is a conspiracy on it and he backs it up with opinions and not facts but display as such then yes, the book will be self-published. All he needs to find out is that Zanders is a Jew and he starts it the next day.

DarkHorse30
04-07-2009, 09:37 PM
Perfect examples of the Cutler haters....wouldn't you say?

Cutler acted like a baby......I'd say Denver fans are merely calling it like they are seeing it.

cutthemdown
04-07-2009, 09:44 PM
Why dont you write a book about it and try to sell it here with constant spam.

Cutler when asked what do you tell kids, he responded they won't understand that it is a business. That right there tells me the whole thing was a business decision. Cutler and Cook knew either 2 things would happen, Broncos give Cutler a deal to placate him, new team gives him a deal because they traded a ton of picks for him. Either way new contract.

This was all a business decision based on the fact Broncos were vulnerable, new coach, perfect time to hold gun to their head.

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 07:04 AM
Jay had THREE YEARS left on his contract. What is your idea of "just business"

So teams never cut players with 3 years left on their contracts?

baja
04-08-2009, 07:15 AM
So teams never cut players with 3 years left on their contracts?

Not talking about being cut,my post was in response to this;

Cutler was holding out for more $$$.<b> Just business.

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 07:19 AM
Not talking about being cut,my post was in response to this;

I know. You seemed to have a problem with people wanting to renegotiate with 3 years left on their contracts. That's why I presented the flip side to that argument.

Was I wrong?

colonelbeef
04-08-2009, 07:20 AM
So teams never cut players with 3 years left on their contracts?

Exactly, it's only good business if the club does the maneuvering. If the player does it, he is a whiny crybaby.

Jay is severely underpaid, and he took McDaniels' misstep and ran with it. Bottom line, he will get a new contract sooner than later, and in that regard the move will have worked out for him and worked well.

Circle Orange
04-08-2009, 07:23 AM
Maybe JayBird never liked Denver all that much and found a golden opportunity to go elsewhere. This is why I suspect he was being so 'unreasonable' on purpose.

Just sayin'. 8')

of course, I'll be curious to see how they cherry pick credit/blame for wins vs. losses in Chi-town this season.

baja
04-08-2009, 07:23 AM
I know. You seemed to have a problem with people wanting to renegotiate with 3 years left on their contracts. That's why I presented the flip side to that argument.

Was I wrong?

I didn't say it is fair but teams are very reluctant to give new contracts with three years remaining. Can you give some examples of teams doing that? Wasn't that a big part of why Portis got moved?

Archer81
04-08-2009, 07:32 AM
Jay never seemed to fit in here. When his security blankets were sent packing, he started to throw a tantrum, and got sent away. A true franchise player doesnt act like a hobo simply because of incoming trade talks. He wanted a new deal, from somewhere else. Great talent, little bit of a head case. I wish him well in Chicago and we'll move on from here.

:Broncos:

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 07:35 AM
I didn't say it is fair but teams are very reluctant to give new contracts with three years remaining. Can you give some examples of teams doing that? Wasn't that a big part of why Portis got moved?

Urlacher did it with FOUR years remaining on his.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3499320

TonyR
04-08-2009, 07:37 AM
Jay is severely underpaid...

...he will get a new contract sooner than later, and in that regard the move will have worked out for him and worked well...

How is he "severely" underpaid? The contract was 6 years, $48+ million. You keep focusing on this year's salary number which is irrelevant in the big picture.

As for the new contract, I though you Cutler apologists were running with the statement that came out saying Angelo and Cook declared that they'd wait until after the season to look at the contract? Have you changed your mind, or are just going with whichever argument best fits your agenda?

baja
04-08-2009, 07:41 AM
Urlacher did it with FOUR years remaining on his.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3499320

But you will admit it is rare and teams are very reluctant to do it and the reason why is very obvious it would destroy the cap management and you would have agents lined up at the FO.

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 07:43 AM
I can't speak for anyone else, but once the trade happened I got into an immediate debate with at least one person (Garcia I believe) about the contract. They said Cutler and Bus had no leverage in negotiating a new contract and I guaranteed there would be a new contract in place within a few months.

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 07:46 AM
But you will admit it is rare and teams are very reluctant to do it and the reason why is very obvious it would destroy the cap management and you would have agents lined up at the FO.

Rare? Yes. But that wasn't the debate. The debate was what qualifies as "business."

My only point was this:

A player and/or agent asking for a new contract with several years remaining on an existing one is no less "business" than a team cutting a guy with several years remaining on a contract.

Archer81
04-08-2009, 07:54 AM
Urlacher did it with FOUR years remaining on his.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3499320


You mean the allpro MLB who helped lead the Bears to a superbowl?


:Broncos:

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-08-2009, 07:55 AM
Exactly, it's only good business if the club does the maneuvering. If the player does it, he is a whiny crybaby.

Jay is severely underpaid, and he took McDaniels' misstep and ran with it. Bottom line, he will get a new contract sooner than later, and in that regard the move will have worked out for him and worked well.

Wrong. If he'd walked into Dove Valley and said "I want to renegotiate my contract. I think I've earned it," nobody would have a problem with him. It could have at least been discussed.

He didn't do that. He demanded a trade. That's not "maneuvering." That's "being an A$$HOLE."

baja
04-08-2009, 07:56 AM
Rare? Yes. But that wasn't the debate. The debate was what qualifies as "business."

My only point was this:

A player and/or agent asking for a new contract with several years remaining on an existing one is no less "business" than a team cutting a guy with several years remaining on a contract.

You made your case I concede the point. It is correct to call asking for a new contract just business. Funny part Jay would have got his new contract at the end of the season IMO. I still think the bigger issue in all this is Jay didn't want to play in Josh's system.

gyldenlove
04-08-2009, 08:00 AM
How is he "severely" underpaid? The contract was 6 years, $48+ million. You keep focusing on this year's salary number which is irrelevant in the big picture.

As for the new contract, I though you Cutler apologists were running with the statement that came out saying Angelo and Cook declared that they'd wait until after the season to look at the contract? Have you changed your mind, or are just going with whichever argument best fits your agenda?

That is interesting, because we both know, or should know that he would never have seen the 13 million dollars he was due in the last year because he would have gotten an extension at the time.

A contract in the NFL is only as unbreakable as the team wants it to be. When a player maked 1 million in a year when people playing at his level are making 7 or 8 million the team has no problem. When that same player stands to make 13 million in a year and players at his level are making 7 or 8 million a year then he will either get fired or extend. 48 million over 6 years means about 8 million per year, but take away the 13 million he was due in year 6 which he would never see and it is a 35 million deal over 5 years, that is a million dollars a year he wouldn't see.

baja
04-08-2009, 08:05 AM
Still he never asked for a new contract....

snowspot66
04-08-2009, 08:05 AM
You mean the allpro MLB who helped lead the Bears to a superbowl?

He got a little flak for it too. It wasn't like he asked for one and everybody kissed his ass.

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 08:14 AM
You mean the allpro MLB who helped lead the Bears to a superbowl?


:Broncos:

But he was coming off arguably his worst year as a pro when he did it. And a potentially major injury.

Regardless, I was given no qualifications. I was simply asked to present a case of a person that successfully renegotiated with at least 3 years remaining on a contract. I did it....and was even able to find one on the very team Cutler is now on. Definition of irony IMO.

Beantown Bronco
04-08-2009, 08:19 AM
Funny part Jay would have got his new contract at the end of the season IMO. I still think the bigger issue in all this is Jay didn't want to play in Josh's system.

Agreed on the first sentence.

And the second was probably a factor as well. Combine that with the theory that was floated by someone else here that Bus wanted to use Jay's situation to leverage himself some favor with the Class of 2010 QBs....and there you have it. I think Bus wants all the ammo he can get trying to reel in some new first round QB clients next year, and he might not have been able to do that unless he got a nice, new contract for Jay first. And next Spring would be too late. He needs Jay to sign that new contract in the next few months.....during the 2009 season at the latest. I don't think he was willing to wait until the end of the year, like the Broncos I'm sure would've been ok with.

IMO Jay simply let Bus take over early on and it quickly spiraled out of control. Players too easily forget that the agents work for them, not the other way around.

baja
04-08-2009, 08:24 AM
Beantown - IMO Jay simply let Bus take over early on and it quickly spiraled out of control. Players too easily forget that the agents work for them, not the other way around.

Well I gotta give ya a B I N G O on that. Bus altered Jay's NFL career and I'm not sure Jay wanted the end result.

colonelbeef
04-08-2009, 08:32 AM
Well I gotta give ya a B I N G O on that. Bus altered Jay's NFL career and I'm not sure Jay wanted the end result.

Agree on this. I don;t think Jay wanted to leave at all. In the end he was totally relieved that he ended up on the Bears, his favorite team growing up- but I really think he thought he would end up staying in Denver and wanted as such.

Old No. 7
04-08-2009, 09:07 AM
Tst...Tst...Tst you Cutler haters are so frustrated with yourselves you just can't stop crying that Cutler really left ya!

Oh well Orton will be a piss poor stop gap while Bowlen and McDaniels desperately search in vain for Cutlers replacement.

Don't worry McDaniels will bring that Belichick SB magic to Denver in 6 to 8 years.

ROFL! Yeah he won't.

What I'm really excited about, is when Lovey gets ****-canned, and the Bears hire Shanny as his replacement.

Oh yes! The circle will be complete...LOL

MVP-06
04-08-2009, 10:40 AM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

and he threw a pick to lose the game

colonelbeef
04-08-2009, 01:11 PM
and he threw a pick to lose the game

good call, reading into anything that happened @ the pro bowl.

Popps
11-12-2009, 07:54 PM
4 INTs and screaming at the only receiver that bails him out from being a bench player.

Yep, that's a gritty leader.


But, he threw Royal under the bus last year. Guess Olsen is his victim this year.

MaloCS
11-12-2009, 08:47 PM
I can't just yet. I will try to drop it once the draft takes place. I think my major problem, above all else, is that I really enjoy watching good QB play. I like all of you got spoiled watching Elway throw across his body better than most could throw with both feet planted, and I saw that again here with Cutler. I liked having the wildcard with the cannon arm that was capable of taking over games. I don't want to watch mediocre game management, I want to see the guy with the quick feet and the rifle shrug off a lineman and zip the ball 65 yards down the field to a streaking Royal.

:drown:

Me too. Everything else is boring.

Ambiguous
11-12-2009, 08:57 PM
4 INTs and screaming at the only receiver that bails him out from being a bench player.

Yep, that's a gritty leader.


But, he threw Royal under the bus last year. Guess Olsen is his victim this year.

You really are one spiteful a-hole for bumping this thread, however...

:giggle::giggle::giggle::giggle:

You are completely right! Funny thing is, you were premature. That last pick was a million times worse than the 4 others. What a ****ing disaster that guy is.

bombay
11-12-2009, 09:00 PM
How is he "severely" underpaid? The contract was 6 years, $48+ million. You keep focusing on this year's salary number which is irrelevant in the big picture.

As for the new contract, I though you Cutler apologists were running with the statement that came out saying Angelo and Cook declared that they'd wait until after the season to look at the contract? Have you changed your mind, or are just going with whichever argument best fits your agenda?

He's not paid by the pick.

Popps
11-12-2009, 09:51 PM
That last pick was a million times worse than the 4 others. What a ****ing disaster that guy is.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpost.php?p=2639047&postcount=264

Ha!

Hulamau
11-13-2009, 01:35 AM
and unfortunately, our QB in the pro bowl, something we will not see for quite a while

Where he absolutely stunk up the joint and helped lose the game. I hate to say it, but Rivers deserved to go far more than did Boy Wonder.